Under-the-radar/neglected conductors

Started by lordlance, March 18, 2024, 03:53:46 PM

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pjme

#40
There are –of course- very many conductors who do not had/ or have a "glamorous" career ... Far too many to mention all those men (and women) working for radio stations or lesser known, lesser famous orchestras.
Often however, they were able to tackle unusual repertoire or were expected to conduct premieres.
 
 A few names that I discovered over the years... + a (more or less exemplary) YT sample. I see also that many of them were composers and that, apparently, they  often were motivated  to perform music by fellow countrymen, teachers, friends etc.
History has a way of swallowing talented people and erasing them from public view.


 Antonio de Almeida
 
https://youtu.be/X04B4Hk5sO4?si=Ru-cGiV-S1i7ElED
 Tony Aubin
 
https://youtu.be/V9PVmFz1iZg?si=OAwo4df9CYQBMhSt
 Gilbert Amy
 
https://youtu.be/gcGnR8M6BC4?si=iOHdlgVHESJXCLaL
 Louis Auriacombe
 
https://youtu.be/kY0jeaWlPUg?si=kg7PkrIZJPc3ZHv1
 Marius Constant
 
https://youtu.be/mdURohWzFKQ?si=I5mqJBDZC6BtXhI1
 Roger Désormière
 
https://youtu.be/yvnKCm-LdgE?si=Hs5Ki8rsbx7zw14A
 Jean Fournet,
 
https://youtu.be/XY_VFwyQw34?si=VGFpp7jz6mrER5Ef
 Paul Paray
 
https://youtu.be/HWzLJOPBtvA?si=gVKEgKz9lU2_lSEo
 Yan Pascal Tortelier
 
https://youtu.be/3MefXT08H2M?si=BsgFcY-w6gkscDnq
 Libor Pesek
 
https://youtu.be/-P-WIjFYMmQ?si=D4c958WVpgK6hHn_
 Karel Sejna
 
https://youtu.be/gMadK_QYfmo?si=3FDre6bhUOia0cfn
 Martin Turnovsky
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NX829snwqTE&list=OLAK5uy_kYDgsL0_Db3BtBCGf2xB4R7Vgh1jLf7-g&index=3
 Vladimir Valek
 
https://youtu.be/10F3IxZkoCs?si=6hC8sPCOZPGzpRbR
 André Rieu senior
 
https://youtu.be/hr8bKy8-FdM?si=2Ske3vGO-IA_TW8g
 Ed Spanjaard
 
https://youtu.be/etyXF_gaNaI?si=ncSuHUpSm1WisRes
 Eduard Flipse (his 1954 Mahler 8 drew in large crowds!)
 
https://youtu.be/54I87ct01Zc?si=G4Haxqho93uxHDiO
https://youtu.be/yg60msFgU6o?si=dWyXfe24iKF0h32s
 Hans Vonk
 
https://youtu.be/m2PViWzkYIg?si=T2qBCWs2QVcfxttL
 André Cluytens
 
https://youtu.be/HF6icXsK6xg?si=1UQg91xA1pEE4MoV
 Pierre Bartholomée
 
https://youtu.be/vrPbp_zlTAE?si=F_IzZomMvjYIuSzx
 Désiré Defauw (Chicago + Brussels )
 
https://youtu.be/cfqOU6Q-Eo0?si=fTPCg4ZPRomGhs7p
 Daniel Sternefeld (Brussels)
 
https://youtu.be/feZKDlB7Q-A?si=lTW8E3axG_1W2QGQ
 Antonio Pedrotti (Prague)
 
https://youtu.be/0UP_WYCjSdw?si=zf0AeNa6BhkHqM5U

And from Japan: Hiroshi Wakasugi and Hiroyuki  Iwaki, from Poland: Witold Rowicki....

Florestan

Karl Munchinger, Peter Maag, Sandor Vegh, Claus-Peter Flor, Horst Stein
When I'm creating at the piano, I tend to feel happy; but - the eternal dilemma - how can we be happy amid the unhappiness of others? I'd do everything I could to give everyone a moment of happiness. That's what's at the heart of my music. — Nino Rota

DavidW

On the list from the last two posts Valek's Martinu, and Maag and Vegh's Mozart.

lordlance

Howdy again.

A few things:
1. I suppose Gielen and Beecham are well-served with recordings. Like so many British conductors though Beecham is mostly referred by the British press (and citizens?)
2. I tried a few random Masur performances and his neglect is just unfortunately. Stiff, lacking energy. 
3. I realize that essentially I just don't have any experience with East German conductors. I didn't know that Sanderling recorded Sibelius or was famous for Shostakovich.
4. Lots and lots of recommendations to go through. Thanks folks.
5. @Daverz Is his (I am assuming he made one) stereo remake as good as the mono? I heard the Dorati mono Minnesota Roman Carnival Overture and found it to... not really be worth listening to anymore. The sound is pretty poor for a sonic spectacular like Roman Carnival. It's the same reason listening to historical Wagner feels pointless when the richness of the orchestra is so essential to the music itself unlike perhaps Beethoven. I heard the Ormandy mono Eulenspiegel. I didn't mind it there however.
If you are interested in listening to orchestrations of solo/chamber music, you might be interested in this thread.
Also looking for recommendations on neglected conductors thread.

Daverz

Quote from: lordlance on March 23, 2024, 01:23:22 PM1. I suppose Gielen and Beecham are well-served with recordings. Like so many British conductors though Beecham is mostly referred by the British press (and citizens?)

Beecham was widely admired, not just in the UK.  He has been both overrated and undertated over the years.  Too much of his stuff is out of print now, though.
 
Quote2. I tried a few random Masur performances and his neglect is just unfortunately. Stiff, lacking energy.

Yes, he could be somewhat kapellmeisterish, so I wouldn't buy that big Masur box.  But he was sometimes inspired, or at least very solid.  I've heard good things about his Shostakovich Symphony No. 13, for example. 

Quote5. @Daverz Is his (I am assuming he made one) stereo remake as good as the mono? =

I assume we're talking about Ormandy's 4 Legends.  The EMI stereo is very much worth hearing, but I don't think it surpassed the earlier mono one.  The analog stereo is still a bit bass-shy.  Compare with the digital sonics Bis gave Jarvi a few years later in his recording. 

lordlance

Quote from: Daverz on March 23, 2024, 01:56:45 PMBeecham was widely admired, not just in the UK.  He has been both overrated and undertated over the years.  Too much of his stuff is out of print now, though.
 
Yes, he could be somewhat kapellmeisterish, so I wouldn't buy that big Masur box.  But he was sometimes inspired, or at least very solid.  I've heard good things about his Shostakovich Symphony No. 13, for example. 

I assume we're talking about Ormandy's 4 Legends.  The EMI stereo is very much worth hearing, but I don't think it surpassed the earlier mono one.  The analog stereo is still a bit bass-shy.  Compare with the digital sonics Bis gave Jarvi a few years later in his recording. 
Yes I meant the Legends suite. The RCA Sony Columbia stuff will all be nicely boxed up in a few years. Is there a complete EMI box? 
If you are interested in listening to orchestrations of solo/chamber music, you might be interested in this thread.
Also looking for recommendations on neglected conductors thread.

Daverz

Quote from: lordlance on March 23, 2024, 03:49:54 PMYes I meant the Legends suite. The RCA Sony Columbia stuff will all be nicely boxed up in a few years. Is there a complete EMI box?

No Warner Ormandy box.  Most of it seems to be available for streaming or download.  In addition to the Sibelius, there was some great Hindemith, a fine Bartok Music for Strings, Percussion & Celesta, and a Strauss Also Sprach Zarathrustra.

lordlance

Any recommendations for Bruckner 4 and 6 specifically from neglected/under-the-radar conductors?
If you are interested in listening to orchestrations of solo/chamber music, you might be interested in this thread.
Also looking for recommendations on neglected conductors thread.

Brian

Quote from: lordlance on March 25, 2024, 09:17:39 AMAny recommendations for Bruckner 4 and 6 specifically from neglected/under-the-radar conductors?
I like the Sixth by Heinz Rögner/Roegner!

lordlance

Quote from: Brian on March 25, 2024, 09:32:18 AMI like the Sixth by Heinz Rögner/Roegner!
Someone mentioned his Bruckner is fast. It's not Poschner fast is it? I am no "spiritual" Bruckner guy but Poschner makes the music underwhelming as heard in 1868-88 First.
If you are interested in listening to orchestrations of solo/chamber music, you might be interested in this thread.
Also looking for recommendations on neglected conductors thread.

Brian

#50
I'm not sure about a direct comparison to Poschner but I do like my Bruckner to be quite fast and punchy so maybe you should ignore my suggestion.  :)

We did a Bruckner Sixth blind listening game a few years ago. Jaap van Zweden's recording on Challenge Classics was the only "dark horse" candidate in the top 4 (which also included Klemperer, Wand, and the winner Celibidache). I quite liked Kent Nagano's version and purchased a copy of Dennis Russell Davies (definitely not the most famous conductor in the bracket) because amw said it was the most strictly true to the score.

Full thread: https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,23157.0.html

EDIT: after rereading the old post in Bruckner's Abbey, amw said that Davies adopts Bruckner's tempo relationships as written, but not the actual metronome markings - he's about 15% slower than requested. amw wrote that the only conductor who followed the dictated (fast) tempi is Marcus Bosch.

Atriod

Andrea Battistoni is my favorite current performing conductor. The only thing I have heard from that I haven't quite cared for is Pictures at an Exhibition (Ravel orchestration).

Daverz

Quote from: lordlance on March 25, 2024, 09:17:39 AMAny recommendations for Bruckner 4 and 6 specifically from neglected/under-the-radar conductors?

There's a Hans Vonk recording of the 4th with St. Louis.

In the "unlikely" rather than neglected category is Kertesz's lovely recording of the 4th.

I mentioned the Leitner recording of the 6th earlier, and Horst Stein has already been mentioned multiple times.  The Stein is highly recommended if you don't have it already.

Jo498

Quote from: lordlance on March 25, 2024, 09:17:39 AMAny recommendations for Bruckner 4 and 6 specifically from neglected/under-the-radar conductors?
Volkmar Andreae although I only know the 4th on Orfeo, there was later a whole? cycle published from radio or live recordings. Historical sound (1950s), though. It's a fast and passionate approach that has mostly vanished from Bruckner interpretation in the last 60 years.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

LKB

Joseph Keilberth conducted the first stereo recording of Wagner's Ring cycle, live at Bayreuth in 1955 iirc. Testament re-released it some years ago.

Mit Flügeln, die ich mir errungen...