Last Movie You Watched

[milk]

I don't think it would be appropriate these days to make it seem as if rapists cannot be charming.

Well, I'm not sure about that but I do think that while the wife is somewhat of a villain from every angle (save the one we can discount: her own), the bandit is just doing what a bandit does. On second thought, she is doing what women do: manipulate men (with tears you can never trust)! It's Mifune who is charming (and even gets laughs?). The bandit doesn't receive less compassion than the wife from the woodcutter.

[Cato]

Duvall has been something of a quiet marvel all his career, I think, Dave . . . "Miniature" from The Twilight Zone, True Grit, M*A*S*H, To Kill a Mockingbird, Apocalypse Now, The Godfather . . . .

Seconded. I would also add The Apostle, and the episode " The Chameleon " from The Outer Limits .

Respectfully,

LKB

Amen!  0:)

Not to be forgotten: Lonesome Dove!   0:)

[Ken B]

Sorry but relativism is NOT the theme of Rashomon. Not at all. It is a popular misreading of the film but need not be so. Rashomon is presented as moral realism. The woodcutter leave nus out stealing the dagger for obvious reasons. But why did he not testify accurately as to the other events? Not because of faulty memory or because the film looks to relativize his version of events. It's because of shame: the theme that runs through the film.
I would say that those misunderstanding this haven't understood the point of Rashomon, which is moral.
Critiquing Rashomon for its rape-sensibility doesn't mean it's not a great film for other reasons. Furthermore, analyzing the male gaze of it isn't politically correct, it's just the opposite. No art is immune from critique and every work is open to interpretation and reinterpretation.

This is stupid. I said nothing about relativism. I said memories. And memories do differ, honestly,  all the time. 

[TheGSMoeller]

The Rider: Written and Directed by Chloé Zhao

Easily the best film of 2018 I've seen so far...

[milk]

This is stupid. I said nothing about relativism. I said memories. And memories do differ, honestly,  all the time.

But that's not the problem in Roshomon at all. The characters know what happened. They lie out of shame and honor. And as I was pointing out earlier, the rape victim is one of the villains. The MEN decide compassion is the way to go.

[Madiel]

But that's not the problem in Roshomon at all. The characters know what happened.

And you know this, how?

Science has demonstrated repeatedly that people's memories of even very recent events are often faulty. Declaring that every character subjectively knows the same things might accord with your understanding of how the world works, but it doesn't accord with any objective assessment of how subjective memory works.

Please note, I'm not being definitive about this, but I have a problem with you being definitive about it. To me it's an open question in the film (from what I remember of it) how much of the unreliability of narrators is deliberate and how much it is accidental.

I note that courts in real life have to deal with this all the time. I've certainly seen a number of judgements where a judge concludes that a witness is both truthful and unreliable. I can remember being involved in at least one tribunal case where the tribunal member (my boss) reached that kind of conclusion: that a witness was sincere but shouldn't be trusted except where the testimony could be verified by another witness.

I also note that Wikipedia indicates the actors couldn't work out "what happened". They kept asking Kurosawa and he refused to tell them "the truth". So a reading that asserts that the characters know differs from the experience of the people who actually portrayed those characters.

[Karl Henning]

Seconded. I would also add The Apostle, and the episode " The Chameleon " from The Outer Limits .

Respectfully,

LKB

By gum, you're right, David.  And you remind me that I really do need to finish my survey of The Outer Limits . . . .


(I have, in fact, watched "The Chameleon," but it was . . . too long ago.  And I see on imdb.com that he was in three episodes, counting a two-parter as two.)

[milk]

And you know this, how?

Science has demonstrated repeatedly that people's memories of even very recent events are often faulty. Declaring that every character subjectively knows the same things might accord with your understanding of how the world works, but it doesn't accord with any objective assessment of how subjective memory works.

Please note, I'm not being definitive about this, but I have a problem with you being definitive about it. To me it's an open question in the film (from what I remember of it) how much of the unreliability of narrators is deliberate and how much it is accidental.

I note that courts in real life have to deal with this all the time. I've certainly seen a number of judgements where a judge concludes that a witness is both truthful and unreliable. I can remember being involved in at least one tribunal case where the tribunal member (my boss) reached that kind of conclusion: that a witness was sincere but shouldn't be trusted except where the testimony could be verified by another witness.

I also note that Wikipedia indicates the actors couldn't work out "what happened". They kept asking Kurosawa and he refused to tell them "the truth". So a reading that asserts that the characters know differs from the experience of the people who actually portrayed those characters.

The theme of the movie is not that people have faulty memories or recollections of what happened. It's that they lie about that happened out of shame. This is not a radical reading of Rashomon. I am not saying anyone is stupid for disagreeing with me, by the way. I have a critique of the film that I'm willing to question if anyone is willing or generous enough to take it into consideration. The two responses to me weren't very gracious. Oh well. In my view, which is not eccentric or even original, the stories of the three villains are faulty because they lie to protect their honor and avoid shame. I think this is clear in what Kurosawa is saying: not that it's unclear to them but that they treat each other with such inhumanity. This is underscored by what happens at the end when the woodcutter (priest and other character) discover the baby. The film ends with compassion for the baby as the characters have weighed the gravity of the inhumanity that was recounted. Irrespective of what the actors got out of the script when they were filming, I'm not the only one to think that there is a clear truth to be ascertained by looking at the recollections logically. I believe this was Kurosawa's intention and I'm not alone. The woodcutter has no reason to lie, only to leave out his shameful act of theft. We can deduce what happened by removing the self-serving parts of each recollection which are clearly supposed to be shameful lies - not faulty memories, and considering the woodcutter's second retelling of what he saw. Again, it's a pretty mainstream and logical reading of the film that it's about morality and compassion for the people who have so debased and dishonored themselves (including the women who is raped). This fits with the ending. Im not sure it's really possible to interpret Rashomon as being about faulty memories. I don't see how the film works that way but I'm open to hearing what I've missed and what many if not most critics have missed.
Edit to add: let me also remind people that the final woodcutter's scene presents THE most shameful and realistic view of the sword fight ending in murder. This is the pathetic behavior we're meant to understand and feel sick about. Again, what I'm saying here I think is quite uncontroversial. What seems to be controversial is my cringing over the rape depiction. I find it a fascinating question of exactly why this film could not be made today. I think "political correctness" is the lazy answer.

[Karl Henning]

The theme of the movie is not that people have faulty memories or recollections of what happened. It's that they lie about that happened out of shame. This is not a radical reading of Rashomon. I am not saying anyone is stupid for disagreeing with me, by the way. I have a critique of the film that I'm willing to question if anyone is willing or generous enough to take it into consideration. The two responses to me weren't very gracious.

My response to you was not gracious?

[milk]

My response to you was not gracious?

I thought you could have considered my point more rather than saying that I had just boiled it down to a weak reading. I think the film is fascinating. But don't mind my oversensitivity. I'm sure you meant well.

[NikF]

I thought you could have considered my point more rather than saying that I had just boiled it down to a weak reading. I think the film is fascinating. But don't mind my oversensitivity. I'm sure you meant well.

You okay babe?

[LKB]

Amen!  0:)

Not to be forgotten: Lonesome Dove!   0:)

Indeed! Possibly my favorite performance from Duvall, and l can hardly believe l failed to include it in the earlier post. ( l am heavily distracted this week, on the brink of having a roof over my head once again. My normal life, and the return to composing, is nearly within reach...  )

Also, his work in Open Range showed his abilities in a supporting role. He is solid,  but avoids anything which would detract from Costner's performance, a very admirable effort.

Galloping,

LKB

[aligreto]

The Glass Castle





An engrossing story of the development of a family and in particular the relationship between a father and daughter.

[Karl Henning]

How do you name your child after a cheese?

(Sorry—could not help myself.)

[aligreto]

How do you name your child after a cheese?

(Sorry—could not help myself.)

[SonicMan46]

How do you name your child after a cheese?

After seeing the film Room (her Oscar performance), I was curious about her name which she changed (see quote below from Wiki) - assume she just took the 'ann' out her given first name, which became 'Brie'; now French was her first language -     Dave

Larson was born Brianne Sidonie Desaulniers - Larson spoke French as her first language - as her last name was difficult to pronounce, she adopted the stage name Larson from her Swedish great-grandmother and a doll named Kirsten Larson (Source)

[milk]

You okay babe?

I'm ok my love.

[NikF]

I'm ok my love.

Good stuff.

[Karl Henning]

So says I.

[milk]

Still a great time. I rewatched this and Killing of a Chinese Bookie recently.

I should go back and see Love Streams and Woman Under the Influence but I may need a break first. Ben Gazarra gives an effortlessly powerful performance in Killing. This is really a character study with organized crime as the background. Of course Rowlands is a marvel in Gloria: a goddess of a woman! "Go ahead! I'd love it"..."You sissy!"