How many here were participants in Classicalinsites?

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

Another deceased member from CMG was John Brosseau, who called himself jbuck919. He was an organist, probably gay, and a product of Princeton who once proudly informed us that he walked out of a performance of the Sibelius 7th symphony.

I remember him, because he was a person who was in the habit of stating incorrect information as fact and then refusing to revise his views when said information turned out to be wrong. He once said how much he hated "the last movement" of Sibelius 7, whereupon I had to point out that Sibelius 7 was a one-mvt. piece. He also said that Elliott Carter's money came from something called "Carter's Little Liver Pills," which was also flagrantly incorrect.

Stein, on one of the few occasions when I met him, said he had only one criterion for the composers he listened to: they had to be dead. Too bad Robin Williams never met him; they could have made a movie called Dead Composers Society.

[(poco) Sforzando]

I remember him, because he was a person who was in the habit of stating incorrect information as fact and then refusing to revise his views when said information turned out to be wrong. He once said how much he hated "the last movement" of Sibelius 7, whereupon I had to point out that Sibelius 7 was a one-mvt. piece. He also said that Elliott Carter's money came from something called "Carter's Little Liver Pills," which was also flagrantly incorrect.

Yes, Carter was born into money, but his father was a wealthy lace importer.

What you say about Buck is of a piece with my story about Moby Dick. Being a Princetonian, it was inconceivable to him that he could ever be wrong.

[Karl Henning]

I cannot say I feel the slightest regret or sorrow on hearing this news. Corlyss in my opinion was a thoroughly awful person - dogmatic, humorless, vindictive. Rob Antecki on the other hand, is someone I cannot get out of my mind. Only 42. I have no idea if this was due to illness, accident, or even suicide. Poor guy didn't have much musical talent, but he loved music and he was the sweetest young kid you can imagine. He just seemed to me someone who never found his place in the world, and if suicide was the cause I would not feel surprised.

Ralph Stein died in 2012 from complications from diabetes, leaving behind a son named Teddy whom he would bring along to NY Phil concerts and let the kid play video games. Ralph loved organizing lunches, especially dim sum, for many of the CI peeps from New York, and loved conducting walking tours of the city. Before or after concerts, he and I would head to the Tower Records near Lincoln Center where he would just grab, anything or everything (except atonal crap, the immortal phrase Ralph invented), and he was so eager to play his purchases on the drive home that he would rip open the plastic wrappers with his teeth. He never took care of himself, however, and at one dinner he confessed to me he knew he was on borrowed time. He had indefatigable energy except when he suffered a heart attack apparently in 2006 and was hospitalized in Westchester. I drove one Saturday morning about 100 miles from my Long Island home to visit him, and I think he appreciated that. Actually I know he did, and I'm glad I did it.
https://www.classicalmusicguide.com/viewtopic.php?t=41178

Another deceased member from CMG was John Brosseau, who called himself jbuck919. He was an organist, probably gay, and a product of Princeton who once proudly informed us that he walked out of a performance of the Sibelius 7th symphony. I met him only once in person at a dinner in NYC (where no doubt Ralph Stein was present). My only memory of him was that we got into a fight on the boards about the last line in Moby Dick, which I quoted correctly and he said only applied to the movie version. Rather than look up the book himself, JBuck accused me of faulty memory and cognitive decline. I regret I cannot find the thread at CMG, where the only references to Moby Dick are about Jake Heggie's rather lousy opera and Peter Mennin's very strong Concertato.

I had lunch with John here in Boston once. 

[Jo498]

I remember him, because he was a person who was in the habit of stating incorrect information as fact and then refusing to revise his views when said information turned out to be wrong.

A most ridiculous subthread I remember from r.m.c.r was when the Aussie or Kiwi Ray (I think he was still active when Google discontinued usenet) wouldn't budge in the claim that complex numbers weren't *really* numbers...
He was some kind of electrical engineer, I think, so I cut him some slack and tried to explain why they are in fact numbers, not vectors, and real mathematicians (of which were several on this board) of course supported my side, but he remained stubborn.

[Holden]

We are focusing on Anstendig's foibles, but he was not without insight. He convinced me to listen to Barbirolli's Brahms symphonies, which he praised for their "dolce" approach. It was a revelation for me, since at the time I was captivated by Karajan's forceful, breathless approach and other traditional performance styles. Barbirolli's WPO set remains a favorite, and it changed the way I think about Brahms.

I'm giving these a listen thanks to this post - I wonder how they'll compare to Bruno Walter that I absolutely love. Listening to '4' I can hear some of the 'dolce' that Astendig was talking about.

[Spotted Horses]

He also said that Elliott Carter's money came from something called "Carter's Little Liver Pills," which was also flagrantly incorrect.

He must have confused him with Thomas Beecham, whose family owned a pharmaceutical company, producing "Beecham's Little Pills."

[Spotted Horses]

I cannot say I feel the slightest regret or sorrow on hearing this news. Corlyss in my opinion was a thoroughly awful person - dogmatic, humorless, vindictive.

I wouldn't put it in such strong terms, but Corlyss closed my account on CMG, basically because she didn't like me (she claimed it was because I wasn't active enough).

Remarkable that we have such vivid memories about Anstendig, and not so much about the sensible contributors at CI.

[Florestan]

Remarkable that we have such vivid memories about Anstendig, and not so much about the sensible contributors at CI.

Well, isn't it easier to remember someone eccentric than someone sensible? 

[(poco) Sforzando]

I wouldn't put it in such strong terms, but Corlyss closed my account on CMG, basically because she didn't like me (she claimed it was because I wasn't active enough).

You're just proving my point. I cannot think of a single admirable thing Corlyss ever did or said, and I felt her rabid right-wing political views and her contempt for any opposition disqualified her from being a moderator. (JBuck, who as said above was always a stickler for inaccuracy, said that Corlyss had banned me from CMG. That wasn't true; I resigned voluntarily. But Corlyss engineered things so that I could not possibly return. Such a sweetie.)

[(poco) Sforzando]

Here is Rob Antecki from 2011:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8ZHh5oZx6U

Who knows what happened to him. He seems poised and happy here.

[Florestan]

One thing I noticed over all these years is that the world of classical music aficionados has a large share of eccentrics and weirdos but I can't figure out the causality: were they attracted to classical music because they were already eccentric and weirdo, or it's the classical music itself that turned them into eccentrics and weirdos? What do you guys think?

[Brian]

I don't know, but I have been enjoying this thread and all these strange characters so much!

[(poco) Sforzando]

One thing I noticed over all these years is that the world of classical music aficionados has a large share of eccentrics and weirdos but I can't figure out the causality: were they attracted to classical music because they were already eccentric and weirdo, or it's the classical music itself that turned them into eccentrics and weirdos? What do you guys think?

Chicken-egg thing, methinks. But true of every walk of life, except that they're encouraged by the pseudonymity of the Internet. You wouldn't believe the Shakespeare forums, especially when they start debating the authorship question. But the worst in my opinion are the gender nuts, you know, the ones who think men can become pregnant, that there are hundreds and even thousands of genders, that you have to use "their" pronouns (otherwise you should lose your job or even be thrown in jail), that transwomen are 100% women (except that none of them can define what a woman is), that JK Rowling and others like her are the anti-Christ for believing sex is real and not a matter of some vaguely understood "identity," and that if you express the slightest skepticism towards any of their ingrained beliefs, it's unequivocal proof you're a transphobic bigot. Such fun.

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

I've tried to include a bunch of sensible posters in my previous posts. But yes, the memory may not be as vivid.

Let's try one more memory-dredging exercise:

Van Eyes: A Vancouverite with a somewhat cryptic writing style. Fan of late romantics and moderns. Master of the 2- or 3-word insult, as I recall.

Edward Wright: He was mentioned above, but I'm re-mentioning him because he was one of the original "atonal crappers," and at least for a while, his tastes were remarkably congruent with mine. Was still living in Scotland, later moved to Canada. He's been around here from time to time.

Gregory Kleyn: Usually had something cutting and critical to say. Mainly, he complained that people spent more time making lists than discussing music.

Paul Covert: One of the more serious contributors. He started a huge thread called "20 Symphonies for the 20th Century" which a lot of people contributed to; it was supposed to form the basis of some big writing project. I don't think that project ever came to fruition, though.

E. Chan: She was a performer (singer?) with one of the major contempo music groups - either Boulez's ensemble in Paris, or Ensemble Modern in Frankfurt (maybe both?). Another good source of inside info.

Carlipops: Another performer with a modernist ensemble, this time in Australia. Real name was Carl Rossman, I think.

Chip: Kind of a goofy guy with a free and loose writing style (i.e. full of errors and odd locutions). One of the resident conservatives. The major controversy of the time was the Clinton/Lewinsky business, and Chip was on Ken Starr's side.

Cat/Nan: Christian fundamentalist cat lady who constantly injected religion into everything and almost never wrote about music.

[Karl Henning]

The plain-sense posters are less apt to etch themselves in memory. I think it's a  Japanese proverb: the nail that sticks out gets hammered down. 

[Jo498]

One thing I noticed over all these years is that the world of classical music aficionados has a large share of eccentrics and weirdos but I can't figure out the causality: were they attracted to classical music because they were already eccentric and weirdo, or it's the classical music itself that turned them into eccentrics and weirdos? What do you guys think?

I think the decisive filter for the select crowd of 1990s or even early 2000s internet message boards was not classical music or excentricity but computer affinity. The intersection of this with the other two characteristics will give you people rather different from the typical concert audiences, many of which are probably mainstream bourgeois types.

I once attended an RL meetup of a hifi/audiophile discussion board and there were definitely more weirdoes there than at the meetups with friends of classical music although this might well be that the weirdest ones didn't show up for the latter or my perception is different because I am part of the second group but not of the first one.

[T. D.]

I think the decisive filter for the select crowd of 1990s or even early 2000s internet message boards was not classical music or excentricity but computer affinity. The intersection of this with the other two characteristics will give you people rather different from the typical concert audiences, many of which are probably mainstream bourgeois types.

I once attended an RL meetup of a hifi/audiophile discussion board and there were definitely more weirdoes there than at the meetups with friends of classical music although this might well be that the weirdest ones didn't show up for the latter or my perception is different because I am part of the second group but not of the first one.

I thought (though Florestan could clarify) that the OP was referring to the general category of "classical music aficionados" rather than "classical music aficionados who post to Internet discussion forums". That is an interesting question. My first instinct would be "yes", but on reflection I doubt it because many genres of music (and other cultural pursuits) seem to feature eccentric superfans.

I think the "who post to Internet discussion forums" condition automatically results in a higher percentage of weirdos, regardless of the underlying group. 

[Brian]

I think the "who post to Internet discussion forums" condition automatically results in a higher percentage of weirdos, regardless of the underlying group. 

There is probably some truth to this. I've met many lovely (and some strange) classical music lovers in real life, and sometimes they're so passionate that I suggest that they join this here forum. They usually say something like "Oh I'm too busy with real life"...and that's how they remind me that I am one of the small percentage of weirdos   

[DavidW]

A most ridiculous subthread I remember from r.m.c.r was when the Aussie or Kiwi Ray (I think he was still active when Google discontinued usenet) wouldn't budge in the claim that complex numbers weren't *really* numbers...
He was some kind of electrical engineer, I think, so I cut him some slack and tried to explain why they are in fact numbers, not vectors, and real mathematicians (of which were several on this board) of course supported my side, but he remained stubborn.

He became so used to phasors that he forgot precalculus!  Actually when I teach phasors in introductory calc-based physics I make the point of illustrating how they are NOT vectors.

It reminds of Electroboom on YT getting into a debate with an MIT physicist because he thought there was never anyway to violate the loop rule because he apparently never learned or understood Faraday's law.

[(poco) Sforzando]

There is probably some truth to this. I've met many lovely (and some strange) classical music lovers in real life, and sometimes they're so passionate that I suggest that they join this here forum. They usually say something like "Oh I'm too busy with real life"...and that's how they remind me that I am one of the small percentage of weirdos   

Yes, but you are not quite as weird as some. Perhaps that is something for you to work on.