Low Saxon

Started by Florestan, February 05, 2025, 02:45:49 AM

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Florestan

#20
February 11, 2025, 12:21:47 AM
Quote from: Christo on February 11, 2025, 12:06:07 AMDante (you know, one Alighieri; most German composers dedicated pieces 'An Dante') would have answered in Low Saxon:

De opebeu'de fantasie ontbrek 't ier an ve'meung;
Ma a drein mien velangn en mien wille,
Zels as een rad det gelieke beweungn wördt,

De liefde die de zönne en aandere stærn bewög.



Not for nothing did Metastasio (I think he was born in Zutphen) say that Low Saxon is the music itself. Such barbaric sounds as

A l'alta fantasia qui mancò possa;
ma già volgeva il mio disio e 'l velle,
sì come rota ch'igualmente è mossa,

l'amor che move il sole e l'altre stelle.

can't compare with the Hanseatic euphony.

Or maybe he was born in Rome and talking about Italian? I told you, my memory is faulty.  :laugh:
"Great music is that which penetrates the ear with facility and leaves the memory with difficulty. Magical music never leaves the memory." — Thomas Beecham

Christo

#21
February 11, 2025, 01:02:06 AM
Quote from: Florestan on February 10, 2025, 11:26:44 PMLatin is derived from Romanian, not the other way around, the Dacians were the oldest people in Europe, who taught writing to all others, including Greeks and Romans, and they flew helicopters as far as North America. Oh, and of course, the Germans and the Dutch are their descendants, because what else can Deutsch or Duits mean if not Daci (Romanian word for Dacians, pronounced more or less as "Dutch") ?
Sounds all highly probable to me, and things like these are widely shared by similar "patriots" over here (well, sometimes the reverse version, but who cares?) BTW the "Dutch Goethe", Willem Bilderdijk, shared a vision of "helicopters" with -- unknown to him -- Leonardo da Vinci; both looking yet in vain for and engine that could move the propeller. No doubt, the noble Dacians solved it: wind power!  8)
... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

Christo

#22
February 11, 2025, 01:12:26 AM
Quote from: Florestan on February 11, 2025, 12:21:47 AMNot for nothing did Metastasio (I think he was born in Zutphen) say that Low Saxon is the music itself.
Did you know Beethoven was actually born in Zutphen, in 'De Fransche Tuin' in 1772? Thus unlike his early deceased brother with the same name, who was born in Bonn in 1770. As Zutphen did not have a catholic church, young 'second' Ludwig could not be baptised, nor registered (both parents were on tour, no citizens of Zutphen). Regretfully, the theater they were staying at was destroyed (there was on bombardement in 1944, however the larger part of the -- still very beautiful, magnificent church -- town were saved. But just as in Bonn (Ludwig "1770") there is a birth plaquette ("Low Saxon Lodewiek van Beetoom, born here in 1772").

Check for your honourable selves: https://www.npoklassiek.nl/klassiek/funfact/f48595a7-3881-4bb1-bced-b72d18f75dca/werd-beethoven-in-zutphen-geboren  :blank:
... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

ritter

#23
February 11, 2025, 01:57:51 AM
Quote from: Florestan on February 10, 2025, 11:26:44 PM...Latin is derived from Romanian, not the other way around, the Dacians were the oldest people in Europe, who taught writing to all others, including Greeks and Romans, and they flew helicopters as far as North America. Oh, and of course, the Germans and the Dutch are their descendants, because what else can Deutsch or Duits mean if not Daci (Romanian word for Dacians, pronounced more or less as "Dutch") ? I'm not kidding you, these and other in(s)anities are published in books and articles and discussed in "scientific" meetings and congresses. That no scholar in their right mind takes them seriously, let alone engage them, is evidence for them of a big conspiracy to suppress the truth, a conspiracy in which Jews, Freemasons, Soros and other foreigners hostile to poor Romanians are heavily involved.  ;D




Not to mention that they invented the cheap automobile (Dacia)

Reminds me of a lunatic Catalan pesude-historical soceiety, which during the independence craze of some pople in that region some years ago, claimed that Cervantes and Columbus were both Catalan...
 « Et n'oubliez pas que le trombone est à Voltaire ce que l'optimisme est à la percussion. » 

Florestan

#24
February 11, 2025, 01:58:26 AM Last Edit: February 11, 2025, 02:06:03 AM by Florestan
Quote from: Christo on February 10, 2025, 02:48:14 PMRotterdam was destroyed at the beginning of WWII, never rebuilt)

Of all Dutch cities I've visited, the only one I didn't like at all was Rotterdam, what with its ugly modernist architecture and its uninviting (to me at least) atmosphere.
"Great music is that which penetrates the ear with facility and leaves the memory with difficulty. Magical music never leaves the memory." — Thomas Beecham

Florestan

#25
February 11, 2025, 02:04:26 AM
Quote from: ritter on February 11, 2025, 01:57:51 AMNot to mention that they invented the cheap automobile (Dacia)

Good one.  :laugh:

QuoteReminds me of a lunatic Catalan pesude-historical soceiety, which during the independence craze of some pople in that region some years ago, claimed that Cervantes and Columbus were both Catalan...

That's small beer and denotes their provincial thinking. They should have claimed Hannibal, Alexander the Great, Octavian Augustus, Constantine the Great and his mother Helene, Atahualpa and Erwin Rommel.  ;D 
"Great music is that which penetrates the ear with facility and leaves the memory with difficulty. Magical music never leaves the memory." — Thomas Beecham

Florestan

#26
February 11, 2025, 02:11:26 AM
Quote from: Christo on February 11, 2025, 01:02:06 AMBTW the "Dutch Goethe", Willem Bilderdijk, shared a vision of "helicopters" with -- unknown to him -- Leonardo da Vinci; both looking yet in vain for and engine that could move the propeller. No doubt, the noble Dacians solved it: wind power! 

Yeah, they simply hopped in their choppers and farted their way all straight to Canada, back then called Dacia de peste mări și țări (literally, Dacia from over seas and countries, ie far away).  ;D
"Great music is that which penetrates the ear with facility and leaves the memory with difficulty. Magical music never leaves the memory." — Thomas Beecham

Christo

#27
February 24, 2025, 10:04:35 PM
Quote from: Florestan on February 11, 2025, 02:11:26 AMYeah, they simply hopped in their choppers and farted their way all straight to Canada, back then called Dacia de peste mări și țări (literally, Dacia from over seas and countries, ie far away). ;D
We would say: Dacia vañ over 'n bonke visvievr en veule laandn. :blank:
... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

Christo

#28
February 24, 2025, 10:07:24 PM
Quote from: Christo on February 11, 2025, 01:12:26 AMDid you know Beethoven was actually born in Zutphen, in 'De Fransche Tuin' in 1772? Thus unlike his early deceased brother with the same name, who was born in Bonn in 1770. As Zutphen did not have a catholic church, young 'second' Ludwig could not be baptised, nor registered (both parents were on tour, no citizens of Zutphen). Regretfully, the theater they were staying at was destroyed (there was on bombardement in 1944, however the larger part of the -- still very beautiful, magnificent church -- town were saved. But just as in Bonn (Ludwig "1770") there is a birth plaquette ("Low Saxon Lodewiek van Beetoom, born here in 1772").

Check for your honourable selves: https://www.npoklassiek.nl/klassiek/funfact/f48595a7-3881-4bb1-bced-b72d18f75dca/werd-beethoven-in-zutphen-geboren  :blank:
As we say, doa' stoj ra vañ te kiekn, eh?  :)
... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

Christo

#29
March 23, 2025, 10:58:10 PM Last Edit: March 23, 2025, 11:55:23 PM by Christo
BTW "LowER Saxon" is a misnomer, probably caused by the form "Neder" in "Neder-Saksisch". But "neder" = low, "lower" would make "nederer"; in reality in Dutch it is laag/lager and in High German: "niedrig/niedriger". "Neder-Saksisch" thus translates as "Low Saxon", not Lower Saxon. In German: Plattdeutsch or Platt-Deutsch. :)

BTW2: I just learned that the influence of Low Saxon, lingua franca of the North & Baltic Sea regions between 1150 and 1800, on the Nordic languages is even greater than I already knew: some 50 per cent of the vocabulary in Swedish and more than 35 per cent of that in Danish and Norwegian, I read. Can one of our musical Scandinavians confirm this to me in understandable, i.e. Low Saxon words -- to free our choleric-obstinate Vlach just a little from his choleric-Vlach obstinacy? :)


... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948
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