The Snowshoed Sibelius

Started by Dancing Divertimentian, April 16, 2007, 08:39:57 PM

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Elgarian

#420
Quote from: vandermolen on November 14, 2009, 02:36:17 PM
I have never been much of a fan of Colin Davis's Sibelius symphony recordings (LSO or Boston SO) - finding them largely unengaging and overrated.
Reading this far, I was nodding emphatically. Among all my various box sets (I mean of anything, not just Sibelius), the Davis LSO/RCA set is probably the single biggest dud. So much so that it's almost left me with Davisibeliophobia: I'd cross the road to avoid going near a Colin Davis Sibelius CD. So these comments here ...

QuoteHowever, the CD of tone poems below was an absolute revelation. I bought it very cheaply on Amazon UK (you can find it there for under £4) and I can't stop playing it.  I would go so far as saying that these are top recommendations for all the works featured - wonderfully warm and atmospheric recordings and terrific performances from Davis and the LSO. I shall have to revise my views of this conductor!

... challenged all my prejudices. I read your comments and thought, no, surely not. Then I registered your enthusiasm and thought, but what if? So thanks for this stimulating (albeit unnerving) recommendation.

listener

Does the Decca song set come with texts?    At least the enclosure with the LP set was readable.
"Keep your hand on the throttle and your eye on the rail as you walk through life's pathway."

Tapio Dimitriyevich Shostakovich

Quote from: vandermolen on November 14, 2009, 02:36:17 PMI have never been much of a fan of Colin Davis's Sibelius symphony recordings (LSO or Boston SO) - finding them largely unengaging and overrated. However, the CD of tone poems below was an absolute revelation. I bought it very cheaply on Amazon UK (you can find it there for under £4) and I can't stop playing it.
IIRC he was humming very loud in Finlandia?! Well, it's Colin Davis, so humming is very likely....

vandermolen

Quote from: Elgarian on November 15, 2009, 12:32:11 PM
Reading this far, I was nodding emphatically. Among all my various box sets (I mean of anything, not just Sibelius), the Davis LSO/RCA set is probably the single biggest dud. So much so that it's almost left me with Davisibeliophobia: I'd cross the road to avoid going near a Colin Davis Sibelius CD. So these comments here ...
... challenged all my prejudices. I read your comments and thought, no, surely not. Then I registered your enthusiasm and thought, but what if? So thanks for this stimulating (albeit unnerving) recommendation.

Interesting comments.  The odd thing is that all the record guides etc seem to bubble over with enthusiasm for Davis' Sibelius symphony recordings - I agree with you - I never play them and I can say the same for his much praised recent LSO recording of Walton's First Symphony. But, worth trying those RCA Sibelius tone poems.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Brahmsian

I really don't get all the backlash on Colin Davis (Sibelius).   ???  Ditto for Rattle (everything).

jlaurson

Quote from: Brahmsian on November 17, 2009, 09:38:11 AM
I really don't get all the backlash on Colin Davis (Sibelius).   ???  Ditto for Rattle (everything).

it's cyclical. overratedness is followed by taker-down-mania which is followed by 'daring reassessment' of greatness which is then... etc.
action & re-action... marx overreacted capitalism, ayn rand overreacted to socialism... that sort of thing.  ;)

Wanderer

Quote from: jlaurson on November 17, 2009, 01:00:40 PM
it's cyclical. overratedness is followed by taker-down-mania which is followed by 'daring reassessment' of greatness which is then... etc.
action & re-action... marx overreacted capitalism, ayn rand overreacted to socialism... that sort of thing.  ;)

That's about it. And I'm not really fond of C. Davis' Sibelius, either.  $:)

Sergeant Rock

Quote from: Brahmsian on November 17, 2009, 09:38:11 AM
I really don't get all the backlash on Colin Davis (Sibelius).

When I started to collect recordings, Davis/Boston was one of the few Sibelius cycles available. Perhaps for that reason critics overpraised it. We have so much choice now it's easy to dismiss that old classic set. But forty years on I still like his Boston Third and Seventh. It's hard to fault his Fourth too although there are several other versions I prefer. I've never heard a finer Sixth though. To me it's the definitive version. I also love his RCA/LSO Kullervo. I can't defend that choice (he Brucknerizes the music) but it works for me better than any of the other nine Kullervos I own.

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

Brian

Most of the critics I've read agree that Davis/Boston and Davis/LSO Live are greatly superior to Davis/LSO RCA.

I ordered the Berglund box (EMI) the other day. I've discovered that I prefer my Sibelius to be classically charged, in the sense of being fleet and daring and abrupt rather than expansive. The exception is the finale of Symphony No 5, which I wish would never end ... I still haven't found a recording of this finale that's voluptuous enough for me. The unanimous E flat played by the strings in the last minute and a half seems to me not just to be a triumph against the symphony's own drama and doubts (I feel this is a symphony that doubts itself, until the end - maybe I'm expressing this inaccurately; will have to give it some thought) but an affirmation of tonality itself.

Catison

Quote from: Sergeant Rock on November 18, 2009, 05:12:16 AM
I've never heard a finer Sixth though.

Have you heard Vanska?  What are your thoughts comparing these two interpretations?
-Brett

Elgarian

Quote from: Brahmsian on November 17, 2009, 09:38:11 AM
I really don't get all the backlash on Colin Davis (Sibelius).

If it's backlash, it's not consciously so in my case. I was drawn to his RCA LSO Sibelius box set by its cheapness, and by the rave reviews and (naively) I expected to find it wonderful. I was dismayed to discover that I had never heard Sibelius sound so lifeless before. I understand his LSO Live Sibelius symphonies are much better, but I'm reluctant to invest further in that direction, particularly now that I have Vanska's recordings of the symphonies to explore.

vandermolen

Quote from: Elgarian on November 18, 2009, 07:20:24 AM
If it's backlash, it's not consciously so in my case. I was drawn to his RCA LSO Sibelius box set by its cheapness, and by the rave reviews and (naively) I expected to find it wonderful. I was dismayed to discover that I had never heard Sibelius sound so lifeless before. I understand his LSO Live Sibelius symphonies are much better, but I'm reluctant to invest further in that direction, particularly now that I have Vanska's recordings of the symphonies to explore.

This goes for me too. I heard Colin Davis do a very good live performance of Vaughan Williams' 6th Symphony and wish that he had recorded it.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Renfield

#432
Quote from: Brahmsian on November 17, 2009, 09:38:11 AM
I really don't get all the backlash on Colin Davis (Sibelius).   ???  Ditto for Rattle (everything).

Re Davis, I've found myself in possession of almost all of his Sibelius recordings, mostly on account of various offers.

And even though I do not compare him to Vänskä at all, given how I'm not a 'there can only be one' (thanks Drasko) kind of listener, I still find time to relish certain aspects of what he does with some of the symphonies, with his Boston 3rd in particular close to being my outright favourite, in purely musical (vs. atmospheric, cultural) terms. The LSO Live 2nd is another standout.

Between his cycles, I think the Boston one is the 'cleanest' and most focused, the LSO Live the most involved, and the RCA possibly the best-played one; IIRC, the 6th in that one was very good, as were indeed some of the tone poems. :)


Re Simon Rattle, I like, and to an extent admire him as a conductor for much of his Birmingham (though not the Sibelius), and most of his Berlin work; in fact, I might say he's the best thing that happened to the BPO since Karajan.

So make what you will of my personal taste, compared to yours!

Benji

Quote from: Renfield on November 18, 2009, 03:36:28 PM
[...] given how I'm not a 'there can only be one' (thanks Drasko) kind of listener [...]

Ah, the Highlander kind!  8)

I have a wee soft spot for Davis RCA cycle mainly because it was a disc of his 3rd and 5th that was my first taste of Sibelius (well, aside from Finlandia on a compliation, so my first taste of real Sibelius). Though i've now, in my mind, superceded that cycle with my favourites Vanska and Blomstedt, I still don't think i've heard a Sibelius 3rd I like more than Davis's. And i'm still really fond of his Nightride, so I imagine i'll keep his boxset for the time being.

Don't get my started on the Boston cycle though. Lordy lordy no, no, no...

Brian

Happy birthday, Jean Sibelius!

Opus106

Quote from: Brian on December 08, 2009, 07:23:30 AM
Happy birthday, Jean Sibelius!

Listening to the 7th! Thanks for letting us know, Brian. :)
Regards,
Navneeth

DavidRoss

Quote from: Brian on December 08, 2009, 07:23:30 AM
Happy birthday, Jean Sibelius!

Ah...that must be why I felt an overwhelming compulsion to hear Tapiola this morning!
(And it was good.)
"Maybe the problem most of you have ... is that you're not listening to Barbirolli." ~Sarge

"The problem with socialism is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

Tapio Dimitriyevich Shostakovich

#437
re: Davis-Cycles: Unfortunately lacking a "Wood Nymph" performance. I'm wondering why nobody performs the Nymph, it's such a powerful orchestral work. To my knowledge and very regrettable, there's still only Vänskä/Lahti and Sato/Kuopio.

Tapio Dimitriyevich Shostakovich

BBC Discovering Music - Sibelius' Tapiola

"Stephen Johnson joins the BBC Philharmonic, conducted by Martyn Brabbins, for a workshop on the great Finnish composer's final orchestral work."

Not sure if I uploaded it. Now I did it, alongside with the web site, as maybe one day it will disappear. Realaudio sucks and BBC is changing to wma. So I decided to download the stream before it disappears, and converted it to mp3 and packed it together with the web page contents. Have fun.

Download - Source

Sergeant Rock

#439
Quote from: Wurstwasser on December 16, 2009, 09:02:22 AM
re: Davis-Cycles: Unfortunately lacking a "Wood Nymph" performance. I'm wondering why nobody performs the Nymph, it's such a powerful orchestral work. To my knowledge and very regrettable, there's still only Vänskä/Lahti and Sato/Kuopio.

The world's best looking conductor, Estonian Anu Tali, has recorded the melodrama version of the Wood Nymph (for narrator, two horns, piano and strings) with the orchestra she and her twin sister founded:






I like it but it's only about half the length of the fully orchestrated tone poem.

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"