Author Topic: Mozart operas  (Read 93334 times)

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Harry

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #60 on: September 29, 2007, 03:29:08 AM »
I obey Longears, here is another one!


Mozart.

La Finta Giardiniera.

Il Podesta, Ugo Benelli.
Sandrina, Joanna Kozlowska.
Belfiore, Marek Torzewski.
Arminda, Malvina Major.
Ramiro, Lani Poulson.
Serpetta Elzbieta Szmytka.
Nardo, Russel Smythe.

Orchestre du Theatre Royal de la Monnaie/Sylvain Cambreling.

Recorded live 1989. Licensed from Ricercar.


A lot of stage noise is coming out of my speaker, the live event is very tangible.
But that's okay, I rather like that, and it must be said I enjoyed that element quite a bit, but am convinced one must see it also.
The music is fabulous, the opera long, and the voices did not charm me out of my pants.
That's the gist of it really, not that it is bad, not at all, but it did not convince me keeping it.
Kozlowska has a fine voice, but Belfiore scared the hell out of me with his sharp and deep cutting voice, argghhh.
Refusal bin I am afraid. 
 
« Last Edit: September 29, 2007, 03:40:45 AM by Harry »

longears

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #61 on: September 29, 2007, 03:32:52 AM »
I've not heard most of the recordings in question, but as for the operas themselves so far I'd say your opinions are right on target!

Offline Que

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #62 on: September 29, 2007, 03:34:39 AM »
I obey Longears, here is another one!


Mozart.

La Finta Giardiniera.

Harry, obviously not Mozart's greatest opera.

But for a good recording:



Q

Harry

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #63 on: September 29, 2007, 03:45:04 AM »
Harry, obviously not Mozart's greatest opera.

But for a good recording:



Q

Well yes, Hmmmm, Harnoncourt, the voices he is using.
You advised me well with the Haydn Masses, but I am a tad suspicious of the said meastro.
I like my voices and ego's a bit smaller I am afraid.
Will give it a try however.

Offline Que

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #64 on: September 30, 2007, 11:54:41 PM »
Well yes, Hmmmm, Harnoncourt, the voices he is using.
You advised me well with the Haydn Masses, but I am a tad suspicious of the said meastro.
I like my voices and ego's a bit smaller I am afraid.
Will give it a try however.

Harry, yes you're right - these are "big" voices (Gruberova, Margiono).
Maybe not your cup of tea! :) Am not aware of other good performances, however. :-\

Q

Harry

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #65 on: October 01, 2007, 12:11:57 AM »
Harry, yes you're right - these are "big" voices (Gruberova, Margiono).
Maybe not your cup of tea! :) Am not aware of other good performances, however. :-\

Q

Well then, the search goes on, and on...........
So far all the Mozart operas I have listen too, from the big box, I have thrown away.
Could not suffer the consequences when I would give them away.
After all if I think its trash, or not to my liking what else could I do huh?
:P

Offline Tsaraslondon

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #66 on: October 01, 2007, 02:11:06 AM »
When Alan Blyth did Die Zauberflote in Gramophone's Collection series, he came down in favour of William Christie's version on Erato, so I bought it. But, to be honest, I'm a mite disappointed. I used to have Bohm's DG version, more for Wunderlich's unparalleled Tamino, than anything else. It is commonly agreed that the women on this set (Lear and Peters) rather let it down, but I don't feel the women on the Christie are markedly superior. Mannion is quite good, though not in the class of Te Kanawa, Janowitz, Margaret Price or Popp, and Dessay manages the notes well enough, but without sounding in the least bit angry or dangerous. Blochwitz is a sweet toned Tamino, but no match for Wunderlich in possibly his greatest recorded performance. On the whole I liked the conducting best, though it is a much more lightweight reading than that of Bohm, perhaps more in tune with today's view of the opera.
\"A beautiful voice is not enough.\" Maria Callas

Harry

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #67 on: October 01, 2007, 02:22:51 AM »
When Alan Blyth did Die Zauberflote in Gramophone's Collection series, he came down in favour of William Christie's version on Erato, so I bought it. But, to be honest, I'm a mite disappointed. I used to have Bohm's DG version, more for Wunderlich's unparalleled Tamino, than anything else. It is commonly agreed that the women on this set (Lear and Peters) rather let it down, but I don't feel the women on the Christie are markedly superior. Mannion is quite good, though not in the class of Te Kanawa, Janowitz, Margaret Price or Popp, and Dessay manages the notes well enough, but without sounding in the least bit angry or dangerous. Blochwitz is a sweet toned Tamino, but no match for Wunderlich in possibly his greatest recorded performance. On the whole I liked the conducting best, though it is a much more lightweight reading than that of Bohm, perhaps more in tune with today's view of the opera.

Interesting, thank you, I will check out Christie, sounds more my shoes than yours. :)

Harry

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #68 on: October 01, 2007, 02:52:33 AM »
What about this one. I heard a few samples and like what I hear.

Harry

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #69 on: October 01, 2007, 02:53:31 AM »
And also on this one, I would like comments.

Offline wagnernn

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #70 on: October 08, 2007, 03:30:30 AM »
I'm very scared of some recitatives from Mozart's operas.Beside the beautiful arias ,duets and wonderful melodies,these recitatives interrupt my enjoyments,sometimes they really make me disappointed.How can I "solve" this problem?

Harry

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #71 on: October 08, 2007, 03:33:25 AM »
I'm very scared of some recitatives from Mozart's operas.Beside the beautiful arias ,duets and wonderful melodies,these recitatives interrupt my enjoyments,sometimes they really make me disappointed.How can I "solve" this problem?

That really depends on your emotional framework my friend. :)

And opera experts, I am still waiting for some advice about both operas I posted! $:)

longears

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #72 on: October 08, 2007, 03:36:00 AM »
I'm very scared of some recitatives from Mozart's operas.Beside the beautiful arias ,duets and wonderful melodies,these recitatives interrupt my enjoyments,sometimes they really make me disappointed.How can I "solve" this problem?

How did you "solve" listening to Wagner?

Another way is to listen to recordings without wretched-ititves or to program them out.

Offline Wendell_E

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #73 on: October 08, 2007, 04:36:13 AM »
I'm very scared of some recitatives from Mozart's operas.Beside the beautiful arias ,duets and wonderful melodies,these recitatives interrupt my enjoyments,sometimes they really make me disappointed.How can I "solve" this problem?

It really helps, especially in recitatives, to understand what's being sung.  So my advice is to study Italian.
“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

Offline Anne

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #74 on: October 08, 2007, 06:32:29 AM »
That really depends on your emotional framework my friend. :)

And opera experts, I am still waiting for some advice about both operas I posted! $:)

Harry, I'm not an expert but I have not heard the 2 operas you mention.

Offline Tsaraslondon

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #75 on: October 08, 2007, 06:55:58 AM »
It really helps, especially in recitatives, to understand what's being sung.  So my advice is to study Italian.

Or just follow the recording with the libretto and a translation, which is how I learned a lot of opera. Personally I always wanted to know what was going on.
\"A beautiful voice is not enough.\" Maria Callas

Offline 71 dB

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #76 on: October 09, 2007, 04:39:24 AM »
I'm still amazed by how high esteem Mozart's operas are kept. I have always found the operas to be among the weakest works of Mozart. Last Sunday I saw 2 programs about Rameau including his music. William Christie said Mozart was influenced by Rameau in his opera Idomeneo. I am listening to it now (Brilliant Mozart box). All I can say is this:

Everytime I listen to Rameau's operas I am amazed by how good they are, how wonderful the music really it. Rameau has stunning harmony, orchestration, rhythm, complexity, fluency and melody. He makes complexity entertaining using down-to-earth musical influencies. Everything just seems perfect and 3 hours goes fast.

Everytime I hear Mozart's operas I get bored fast. The music is too simple and uninteresting. It has Mozart's trademark fluency but not much else. I prefer Mozart's earlier operas for stronger baroque influencies and parts of Magic Flute make me even gringe in their's superficial lightness.

Now, I don't say Mozart is a bad opera composer as an absolute fact (I have learned my lesson here). I only say for some reasons I have always found Mozart's operas uninteresting and weaker than many other works by him like piano concertos. That's why I am always amazed to read Mozart is considered one of the greatest opera composers.

I'd be interested to hear your comments about my view and how you do compare Mozart and Rameau (and Händel).
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Offline Florestan

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #77 on: October 09, 2007, 04:43:59 AM »
I'd be interested to hear your comments about my view

Poju, are you masochistic? :)
"Music expresses that which cannot be said and on which it is impossible to be silent." - Victor Hugo

Offline Wendell_E

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #78 on: October 09, 2007, 05:34:40 AM »
I'd be interested to hear your comments about my view and how you do compare Mozart and Rameau (and Händel).

 :'(
“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

Larry Rinkel

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Re: Mozart operas
« Reply #79 on: October 09, 2007, 07:03:30 AM »
I'm very scared of some recitatives from Mozart's operas.Beside the beautiful arias ,duets and wonderful melodies,these recitatives interrupt my enjoyments,sometimes they really make me disappointed.How can I "solve" this problem?

Nothing to be scared about. I'd be more scared if you didn't respond to the beautiful arias, duets, and wonderful melodies.

In general (and to greatly oversimplify), recitatives in Mozart move the story along, while arias, duets, etc., present the characters' reflections or attitudes. Recitatives are of two types - secco (the boring type with just harpsichord and cello), and accompagnato, with orchestra. Secco of course is where you're having a problem. But don't think of it as melody you're not getting. It is basically a heightened or sung form of speech with little musical interest in itself, and is not too different from spoken dialogue. When Mozart composed Clemenza di Tito and was in a rush, he had a pupil write the secco recitatives.