Charles Ives

Started by Thom, April 18, 2007, 10:22:51 AM

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Iota

Quote from: Brewski on January 20, 2022, 11:25:46 AM
I actually do like Graham! (And it's fascinating to hear Aimard in the piano role.) She brings the same theatricality that has made her such a success in opera.

Also, a shout-out to Susan Narucki, who is also charming in the ones she chose.

--Bruce

Ah great, yes I found Aimard and Graham had a lot going for them as a duo. Will look out the Narucki too.  :)

Karl Henning

Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

classicalgeek

#522
Quote from: Iota on January 20, 2022, 11:11:16 AM
Thanks, very interesting! I only know the Susan Graham/Aimard disc of Ives' songs, which from what you say you'd probably find too operatic in manner. But I listened to the Jan De Gaetani above and really liked them. I have some exploring to do!

Quote from: Brewski on January 20, 2022, 11:25:46 AM
I actually do like Graham! (And it's fascinating to hear Aimard in the piano role.) She brings the same theatricality that has made her such a success in opera.

Also, a shout-out to Susan Narucki, who is also charming in the ones she chose.

--Bruce

Sounds like I could do a deep dive just into the Ives songs! I did really like DeGaetani but I'll have to sample Graham and Narucki as well.

Iota, it looks like Aimard recorded the 'Concord' Sonata on the disc that also contains the songs with Graham. What do you think of that performance, if you've heard it? I think I've only heard Marc-André Hamelin on Hyperion, and not in many years.

Quote from: Mirror Image on January 19, 2022, 08:14:50 PM
Very nice, classicalgeek. Fulkerson and Shannon are both exceptionally gifted musicians. Yes, do check out their Ives!

I listened to the Second Violin Sonata, and was really impressed! My plan is to listen to the rest of them tomorrow - I think I'm in for a treat.

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 20, 2022, 03:59:47 PM
I've been meaning to watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/v/LEtsFAiPT5w

That looks utterly fascinating!

So much great music, so little time...

Original compositions and orchestrations: https://www.youtube.com/@jmbrannigan

Mirror Image

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 20, 2022, 03:59:47 PM
I've been meaning to watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/v/LEtsFAiPT5w

Great documentary, Karl! I've watched it numerous times (I bought it on DVD years ago).

Iota

Quote from: classicalgeek on January 20, 2022, 05:40:06 PM
Iota, it looks like Aimard recorded the 'Concord' Sonata on the disc that also contains the songs with Graham. What do you think of that performance, if you've heard it? I think I've only heard Marc-André Hamelin on Hyperion, and not in many years.

Yes, it's been a long while but I enjoyed it very much at the time. His cool-headed, analytical but responsive approach works well with it.

bhodges

Quote from: Iota on January 21, 2022, 02:12:35 AM
Yes, it's been a long while but I enjoyed it very much at the time. His cool-headed, analytical but responsive approach works well with it.

Same here. In an ideal world, an A/B comparison with Hamelin would be interesting. The page below lists others that sound worth hearing, e.g., I have never heard John Kirkpatrick, from the 1940s (!!), or others, like Jeremy Denk. Also, on YouTube, there are also quite a few pianists who have recorded one of the three movements -- perhaps a more achievable goal, given the work's extreme difficulty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_Sonata_No._2_(Ives)#Recordings_and_other_uses

--Bruce

Mirror Image

Quote from: classicalgeek on January 20, 2022, 05:40:06 PMIota, it looks like Aimard recorded the 'Concord' Sonata on the disc that also contains the songs with Graham. What do you think of that performance, if you've heard it? I think I've only heard Marc-André Hamelin on Hyperion, and not in many years.

This post wasn't directed to me, but this is my favorite recording of the Concord Sonata:



I have yet to hear anyone top Gilbert Kalish and the Nonesuch audio quality is warm --- just a lovely performance.

Crudblud

Some days I think "General William Booth Enters into Heaven" is the finest song ever written.

classicalgeek

Quote from: Crudblud on January 23, 2022, 12:37:25 PM
Some days I think "General William Booth Enters into Heaven" is the finest song ever written.

I'm aware of it but haven't listened... but I'd like to. Any preferred recordings?

Quote from: Mirror Image on January 21, 2022, 07:20:48 PM
This post wasn't directed to me, but this is my favorite recording of the Concord Sonata:



I have yet to hear anyone top Gilbert Kalish and the Nonesuch audio quality is warm --- just a lovely performance.

Good to know, John! I've added it to my Spotify listening queue. I also found a recording on there by Jeremy Denk, who I've enjoyed in other recordings; it includes the Piano Sonata no. 1 as well.
So much great music, so little time...

Original compositions and orchestrations: https://www.youtube.com/@jmbrannigan

Mirror Image

Quote from: classicalgeek on January 24, 2022, 04:02:44 PMGood to know, John! I've added it to my Spotify listening queue. I also found a recording on there by Jeremy Denk, who I've enjoyed in other recordings; it includes the Piano Sonata no. 1 as well.

I'm sure the Denk is quite good. I haven't heard it, but have heard several others including Aimard, Hamelin and one another, which slips my mind right now.

This one from Thomas Hell looks enticing:


aukhawk

classicalgeek I saw on the listening thread you'd been drawn to listening to Ives conducted by MTT.  You'd think he'd be a natural fit for this music, and indeed he does make a bit of a specialism of performing and recording Ives.


Ives, Symphonies 3 & 4; Michael Tilson Thomas, SFSO

I was very disappointed with this 4th - a more recent recording than the ones on Sony (which I haven't heard) - it just seems lacklustre and, well, tired.  As though he's performed this music a few times too often, there's no edginess left.  Sadly, I get a very similar 'flat' vibe from the recordings by Dudamel.  :(

I find Stokowski, Serebrier and Morlot (who you did reference in the listening thread) much more to my liking in the 4th, and Bernstein (either recording) for the 2nd.

classicalgeek

Quote from: Mirror Image on January 24, 2022, 05:29:13 PM
I'm sure the Denk is quite good. I haven't heard it, but have heard several others including Aimard, Hamelin and one another, which slips my mind right now.

This one from Thomas Hell looks enticing:



I can vouch that Denk (in the First Piano Sonata) and Kalish (in the 'Concord') were excellent. And Hamelin, in the 'Concord', was also great if memory serves me correctly.

Quote from: aukhawk on January 25, 2022, 08:12:07 AM
classicalgeek I saw on the listening thread you'd been drawn to listening to Ives conducted by MTT.  You'd think he'd be a natural fit for this music, and indeed he does make a bit of a specialism of performing and recording Ives.


Ives, Symphonies 3 & 4; Michael Tilson Thomas, SFSO

I was very disappointed with this 4th - a more recent recording than the ones on Sony (which I haven't heard) - it just seems lacklustre and, well, tired.  As though he's performed this music a few times too often, there's no edginess left.  Sadly, I get a very similar 'flat' vibe from the recordings by Dudamel.  :(

I find Stokowski, Serebrier and Morlot (who you did reference in the listening thread) much more to my liking in the 4th, and Bernstein (either recording) for the 2nd.

Sometimes when conductors re-record repertoire, it's an improvement, but just as often, the original was better! I've liked Tilson Thomas's earlier Ives quite a bit, but haven't listened to his San Francisco recordings. Though I did watch his performance of the Holidays Symphony with San Francisco in the the documentary below, and found it quite good. I've heard similar things about Dudamel's Ives, sadly - maybe I'll check it out eventually. I thought Morlot's Fourth was excellent (shout out to the Seattle Symphony, my home town band!) and I'm inclined to explore the other offerings in his almost-cycle. I'll have to check out Stokowski (who's always interesting) and Serebrier in the Fourth as well.

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 20, 2022, 03:59:47 PM
I've been meaning to watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/v/LEtsFAiPT5w

Just watched this - both the biographical info and the background on the Holidays Symphony were, well, 'utterly fascinating'! ;D  Tilson Thomas did a magnificent job as the host!
So much great music, so little time...

Original compositions and orchestrations: https://www.youtube.com/@jmbrannigan

Mirror Image

#532
Quote from: classicalgeek on January 25, 2022, 06:24:37 PMJust watched this - both the biographical info and the background on the Holidays Symphony were, well, 'utterly fascinating'! ;D  Tilson Thomas did a magnificent job as the host!

Good. Now go watch the Keeping Scores documentaries on Mahler, Stravinsky and Copland. :) I always wished MTT did one of these documentaries on Debussy since he had always shown an affinity for this composer, especially Le Martyre de saint Sébastien, which he recorded on Sony (w/ the LSO --- outstanding recording!) and talked about the work here:

https://www.youtube.com/v/dDoTE8g4oG4

classicalgeek

Quote from: Mirror Image on January 25, 2022, 06:26:49 PM
Good. Now go watch the Keeping Scores documentaries on Mahler, Stravinsky and Copland. :) I always wished MTT did one of these documentaries on Debussy since he had always shown an affinity for this composer, especially Le Martyre de saint Sébastien, which he recorded on Sony (w/ the LSO --- outstanding recording!) and talked about the work here:

https://www.youtube.com/v/dDoTE8g4oG4

I saw those... and there's one on Shostakovich too! ;D He really has an affinity for this, for making classical music approachable and accessible - he reminds me of Leonard Bernstein in that regard.

I'm aware of his Debussy recordings - but I'm not sure if I've listened to them or not. I've added two (Le Martyre de saint Sébastien, and La boite a joujoux and Jeux) to my Spotify queue!
So much great music, so little time...

Original compositions and orchestrations: https://www.youtube.com/@jmbrannigan

Mirror Image

#534
Quote from: classicalgeek on January 25, 2022, 08:12:00 PM
I saw those... and there's one on Shostakovich too! ;D He really has an affinity for this, for making classical music approachable and accessible - he reminds me of Leonard Bernstein in that regard.

I'm aware of his Debussy recordings - but I'm not sure if I've listened to them or not. I've added two (Le Martyre de saint Sébastien, and La boite a joujoux and Jeux) to my Spotify queue!

Very nice. His recording of Le Martyre de saint Sébastien is the best on record, IMHO. I do need to revisit the Cluytens recording, though, as it's been a few years since I've listened to it.

bhodges

Ives fans, the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra just uploaded a performance of the Symphony No. 2 from 21 January, with conductor Susanna Mälkki. Planning on watching it later, and looks quite promising. Mälkki is one of the most talented conductors working today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vJdc-vJEPk

--Bruce

bhodges

Quote from: Brewski on January 29, 2022, 02:46:20 PM
Ives fans, the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra just uploaded a performance of the Symphony No. 2 from 21 January, with conductor Susanna Mälkki. Planning on watching it later, and looks quite promising. Mälkki is one of the most talented conductors working today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vJdc-vJEPk

--Bruce

Wow, the combination of the piece, the ensemble, and Mälkki turns out to be a great one. Recorded live in the Concertgebouw, with no audience. Highly recommended.

--Bruce

Karl Henning

Quote from: Crudblud on January 23, 2022, 12:37:25 PM
Some days I think "General William Booth Enters into Heaven" is the finest song ever written.

Verily.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Symphonic Addict

The other day I followed the conversation about Ives's violin sonatas. I've had the 2nd movement from the 3rd Sonata in my mind and man, what a f**ing miniature masterpiece! Fiendishly difficult. That cow-boy dance is exhilarating. I especially like from the 2:57 mark on. In that moment it looks like the composer was about to explode of madness!! What a jackass fragment indeed!
Part of the tragedy of the Palestinians is that they have essentially no international support for a good reason: they've no wealth, they've no power, so they've no rights.

Noam Chomsky

Iota

Quote from: Symphonic Addict on January 29, 2022, 05:38:22 PM
The other day I followed the conversation about Ives's violin sonatas. I've had the 2nd movement from the 3rd Sonata in my mind and man, what a f**ing miniature masterpiece! Fiendishly difficult. That cow-boy dance is exhilarating. I especially like from the 2:57 mark on. In that moment it looks like the composer was about to explode of madness!! What a jackass fragment indeed!

My feeling about Ives is that like Schumann his music is often highly personal, a diagram that seems to track the trajectory of his mind. That violin sonata is a case in point where the characteristic Ivesian swirling tapestry of ideas, apart from making a fine, distinctive piece of music, can also feel like a live feed from his brain.