Bach: Mass in B minor

Started by Don Giovanni, April 18, 2007, 11:30:17 AM

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DarkAngel

Quote from: Antoine Marchand on December 23, 2009, 05:01:46 AM
Go for Kuijken, DA! And, if it is possible, Leonhardt too.

Just one unnecessary prevention: it exists a recording by Kuijken on Urtext Records; it only contains excerpts and it is not recommendable. The good one is on Challenge Classics. :)

Yes I have ordered the "new" Kuijken, have to carefully screen the OVPP versions since I don't care much for the lean sound of Parrott for instance, but this Kuijken sounds much better from samples

Antoine Marchand

#101
Quote from: DarkAngel on December 23, 2009, 05:11:35 AM
Yes I have ordered the "new" Kuijken, have to carefully screen the OVPP versions since I don't care much for the lean sound of Parrott for instance, but this Kuijken sounds much better from samples

Parrott was a big disappointment for me. I love, really love his two sopranos -Kirkby and van Evera-, but that performance don't work at all.  :( 

Coopmv

Quote from: DarkAngel on December 23, 2009, 05:11:35 AM
Yes I have ordered the "new" Kuijken, have to carefully screen the OVPP versions since I don't care much for the lean sound of Parrott for instance, but this Kuijken sounds much better from samples

Parrott's ensemble does have a lean sound and it is not as polished as other English baroque orchestras such as the AAM or English Baroque Soloists.  That may be fine with Henry Purcell's works and does not work with Bach choral works IMO.

DarkAngel

Quote from: Coopmv on December 21, 2009, 03:24:25 PM
I added this set to my Bach collection a few weeks ago.  It is quite good on first listen - all the chances I have had so far ...

Anyone have a clue what this photo on CD cover is supposed to represent in relation to B minor mass?

A glimpse of heaven from the basement............ :)

Coopmv

Quote from: DarkAngel on December 23, 2009, 07:25:09 AM
Anyone have a clue what this photo on CD cover is supposed to represent in relation to B minor mass?

A glimpse of heaven from the basement............ :)

I put this Mass in B CD artwork in the same category as this Brandenburg Concertos ...




Antoine Marchand

#105
Quote from: DarkAngel on December 23, 2009, 07:25:09 AM
Anyone have a clue what this photo on CD cover is supposed to represent in relation to B minor mass?

A glimpse of heaven from the basement............ :)

I have not read the booklet, but I don't see any special relation. The artwork includes some pictures of the Vlierbeek Abbey (an old Benedictine abbey built in 1125) in the city of Leuven, Belgium, and the cover is apparently a detail of one of those pictures. :)

P.S.: Thanks, Wikipedia!  :D

Bulldog

Quote from: Antoine Marchand on December 23, 2009, 06:31:57 AM
Parrott was a big disappointment for me. I love, really love his two sopranos -Kirkby and van Evera-, but that performance don't work at all.  :(

I have to disagree.  Although I don't find Parrott's version as rewarding as Leonhardt's, I think that Parrott directs very well and that his soloists are first-rate.  Overall, I consider Parrott on Gardiner's level in this work.

DarkAngel

Quote from: Bulldog on December 23, 2009, 08:22:18 AM
I have to disagree.  Although I don't find Parrott's version as rewarding as Leonhardt's, I think that Parrott directs very well and that his soloists are first-rate.  Overall, I consider Parrott on Gardiner's level in this work.

Bulldog have you heard the new Kuijken under discussion, from samples seems to have found a more satisfying way to use "one voice per part" compared to early pioneers like Parrott.........

I will know more once the Kuijken arrives, I have owned the Parrott for quite some time

Coop
that Naive Brandenburg cover photo had me scratching my head also, a mystery for sure

bhodges

Quote from: DarkAngel on December 23, 2009, 10:12:07 AM
Coop
that Naive Brandenburg cover photo had me scratching my head also, a mystery for sure

I love that cover!  (Also with no idea what it means...)  If the performance and recording weren't so good I'd be more impatient with the artwork, but I find the photo amusingly inexplicable.

--Bruce 

Coopmv

Quote from: bhodges on December 23, 2009, 10:16:25 AM
I love that cover!  (Also with no idea what it means...)  If the performance and recording weren't so good I'd be more impatient with the artwork, but I find the photo amusingly inexplicable.

--Bruce

I am just intrigued by the CD cover, though I know nothing about the recording itself.  Since I already have some 25 versions of Brandenburg Concertos (including some DVD's) , it is unlikely for me to add another version by an ensemble I know nothing about ...

Bulldog

Quote from: DarkAngel on December 23, 2009, 10:12:07 AM
Bulldog have you heard the new Kuijken under discussion, from samples seems to have found a more satisfying way to use "one voice per part" compared to early pioneers like Parrott.........

I will know more once the Kuijken arrives, I have owned the Parrott for quite some time


No, I haven't heard it yet.  That's my negligence because I subscribe to the Naxos Music Library and the set is available.

KevinP



How about this B-minor Mass cover?

Alas, the trend these days is that an artiful picture is sufficient reason to put it on a classical CD cover.

Zoomable but unpasteable image here:
http://www.amazon.com/Bach-Minor-Musiciens-Du-Louvre/dp/B001JPB9LE/ref=sr_1_30?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1261610632&sr=1-30

DarkAngel

Quote from: KevinP on December 23, 2009, 02:27:24 PM


How about this B-minor Mass cover?

That photo makes "symbolic" sense since it is a stairway ascending upwards (towards heaven or God)
Minkowski version for Naive label includes very deluxe 2 CD hardbound digibook with 100 pages inside........... :)

Bulldog

Quote from: DarkAngel on December 23, 2009, 02:42:23 PM
That photo makes "symbolic" sense since it is a stairway ascending upwards (towards heaven or God)
Minkowski version for Naive label includes very deluxe 2 CD hardbound digibook with 100 pages inside........... :)

A question - how do you know it's ascending?

Antoine Marchand

Quote from: Bulldog on December 23, 2009, 08:22:18 AM
I have to disagree.  Although I don't find Parrott's version as rewarding as Leonhardt's, I think that Parrott directs very well and that his soloists are first-rate.  Overall, I consider Parrott on Gardiner's level in this work.

My impression was rather different, Don. I generally appreciate Parrott and his singers, but here I disliked not just the muffled instrumental part - certainly the sound quality doesn't collaborate - but certain general lack of emotion in the performance. It sounds monotonous, cut-and-dried to me; a competent performance that never catches fire.

jlaurson

Quote from: Bulldog on December 23, 2009, 03:43:41 PM
A question - how do you know it's ascending?

That's a matter of eschatology.

rubio

Quote from: rubio on December 22, 2009, 02:47:30 AM
Is this the 1961 recording?



One more question. Is the above 1961 recording and the below Christmas Oratorio included in the Sacred Masterpieces box set? Or are there other recording dates?



I get a bit confused when I read the Amazon comments. Some write they are the same, some not.

http://www.amazon.com/Bach-Sacred-Masterpieces-Hermann-Prey/dp/B00004SAAW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1262040236&sr=1-1

"One good thing about music, when it hits- you feel no pain" Bob Marley

ccar

#117
Quote from: rubio on December 28, 2009, 01:54:11 PM
One more question. Is the above 1961 recording and the below Christmas Oratorio included in the Sacred Masterpieces box set? Or are there other recording dates?

No. The first you mention is from 1961 and the one included in the box is the Tokyo May 9 1969.

AFAIK there are 5 different (released) versions of Karl Richter's Mass in B minor:

1. Nov 30, 1956 – CD Andromeda

2. Feb, Apr 1961 – CD DG Archiv

3. Apr 17, 1968 – CD Ars Nova

4. May 9, 1969 – CD DG Archiv

5. Sep 12-28, 1969 – DVD DG

 

KevinP

Quote from: ccar on December 28, 2009, 03:38:49 PM
AFAIK there are 5 different (released) versions of Karl Richter's Mass in B minor:
1. Nov 30, 1956 – CD Andromeda

Do you have a link for this one? My favourite conductor of my favourite piece and I had no idea about this version. It's not even listed at bach-cantatas.com.  Is it live?

ccar

#119
Quote from: KevinP on December 28, 2009, 04:55:10 PM
Do you have a link for this one? My favourite conductor of my favourite piece and I had no idea about this version. It's not even listed at bach-cantatas.com.  Is it live?

Yes. Live - Lukaskirsche Munich - 30 Nov 1956

Fahberg, Topper, Lutze, Kelch
Munchener Bach-Chor
Ein Kammerorchester

The sound has some hiss but is quite acceptable for the date. 

http://www.amazon.de/s/ref=nb_ss?__mk_de_DE=%C5M%C5Z%D5%D1&url=search-alias%3Dpopular&field-keywords=mass+richter+andromeda&x=18&y=26