Havergal Brian Symphonies ..... where to start ?

[alkan]

For no rational reason I feel a sudden urge to explore the symphonic world of Havergal Brian.    I believe that most, if not all, of his symphonies are recorded on the Naxos label.

Could anyone be so kind as to recommend a CD or two as a good starting point  (with a bit of explanation for the choice) ?

Thanks in advance .....

[Sergeant Rock]

Could anyone be so kind as to recommend a CD or two as a good starting point  (with a bit of explanation for the choice) ?
Thanks in advance .....

Mackerras/Royal Liverpool Symphonies 7 and 31 EMI

Groves/Royal Liverpool Symphonies 8 and 9 EMI

Lenard/ CSR Bratislava Symphony #1 D minor "Gothic" Naxos

Fredman/LPO Symphonies #6 and 16 (due for CD release early next year, I belive) Lyrita


These provide examples of the early, middle and late periods and, except for the Te Deum of the Gothic, don't present any thorny issues or listening difficulties. They are also magnificent performances.

Sarge

[Harry]

And there is the wonderful performance on the Helios label, of the third right, very good that one.

[lukeottevanger]

All of these are great recommendations - forced to pick one it would be the twofer including both the first and the second of the discs mentioned above - no 7, 8, 9 and 31. At the very least 7 and 8 are among any 'best of' Brian list, and the other two are almost as fine, 9 especially. 8 is my favourite Brian symph, as I've said elsewhere many times. IMO one of the finest symphonies of the century, with a form all its own and an incredible  directness.

[alkan]

Thanks to everyone for their recommendations.       I had already put the Helios 3rd symphony in my shopping cart, but I missed the two-fer which looks very interesting.     

[Sergeant Rock]

Thanks to everyone for their recommendations.       I had already put the Helios 3rd symphony in my shopping cart, but I missed the two-fer which looks very interesting.     

Absolutely essential. Go for it.

Sarge

[Hector]

Absolutely essential. Go for it.

Sarge

I'll drink to that

[Montpellier]

The big Gothic Symphony (No 1, formerly No 2) is the place to start if only because it puts Brian's other symphonic work in context.   It's a vast work with some interesting orchestral features like (if I remember rightly) an octet of clarinets including a contrabass).

You may be interested in an article about Brian.

http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/societies/brian.html

Edit: And there's this that gives some idea of the size of the orchestra.  Octet of clarinets?  No, it's 11 clarinets.  6 Oboes (inc bass oboe) + 2 cor anglais.....?   Several choirs?   

I don't think he wrote another like this!   

[alkan]

Thanks for the further replies.

For the Gothic symphony I think there is only the Naxos version available ..... correct ??
Any heard it?     Any comments ?

Thanks

[Sergeant Rock]

Thanks for the further replies.

For the Gothic symphony I think there is only the Naxos version available ..... correct ??
Any heard it?     Any comments ?

Thanks

All we Brian fanatics have heard it. Yes, it's the only one available currently. It's far better than you'd expect from these forces and I'm quite happy with it (although fervently praying that someone like Mackerras will record it someday too). The sound quality is surprisingly good if a bit strident in some parts of the Te Deum. Bottlom line: it's another essential purchase if only to hear that mind-blowing third movement.

Sarge

[alkan]

Thanks Sarge,
I can see that Mr. Brian is going to cost me a bunch ....... 32 symphonies to get through !
Out of curiosity, why is the 3rd mvmt of the Gothic mindblowing?     Is it purely the size of the orchestral army employed, or is there more to it?

By the way,  understand that the composer's agent told him to change his name so that people would take him more seriously.
His real name is Brian Havergal .....     

[vandermolen]

By the way,  understand that the composer's agent told him to change his name so that people would take him more seriously.
His real name is Brian Havergal .....     

I have a friend called Brian Williams who told me that he was going to change his name to "Williams Brian" after I had introduced him to HB's music 

Personally I'd go for Symphony 8 as an entry point into HB's music. Look out for the Lyrita recording of symphonies 6 and 16 due out early next year. That is a great disc.

[Montpellier]

Is it purely the size of the orchestral army employed, or is there more to it?

Yes, Part 2: a huge orchestra with some off-stage performers, a children's choir and a double choir.   "(in summary: 32 wind, 24 on stage brass, 24 off stage brass, 6 timpanists, 18 percussion, 4 keyboards and harps, 82 strings - total orchestra c190 players, plus adult choir of min 500 [assumes largely professionals], children's choir of 100, 4 soloists = c800)"

Part 1: c40 mins. Part 2: c 1 1/4 hours

[BachQ]

I believe that most, if not all, of his symphonies are recorded on the Naxos label.

Is that true?

[johnQpublic]

Stop before you start!

[Sergeant Rock]

Is that true?

Depends on how you read the sentence, I guess. Marco Polo/Naxos is the company that's recorded the most Brian but they haven't completed the symphony cycle (and it's not looking likely that they ever will). They still have 21 symphonies to go and it's been over ten years since their last release! They've done 1, 2, 4, 11, 12, 15, 17, 18, 20, 25 and 32.

EMI recorded 7, 8, 9 and 31. Unicorn recorded 10 and 21. Lyrita 6 and 16. Hyperion 3. CBS 22.

5, 13, 14, 19, 23, 24, 26, 27, 28, 29 and 30 are still awaiting first recordings.

Sarge

[Sergeant Rock]

Out of curiosity, why is the 3rd mvmt of the Gothic mindblowing?

Here's a quote from MacDonald's magnificent three-volume The Symphonies of Havergal Brian which partially explains why it's so mindblowing: he describes here the end of the Vivace third movement (and the end of the symphony's first Part):

"The music heaves like a plain on which great armies are embattled. Side-drum and upper woodwind beat out a manic pounding rhythm against which strings play a tough ostinato. Bassoons and tubas make a bass of the "saurian" theme in altered rhythm, while the rest of the brass have the lions's share of glory in a vast series of canonic entries. Trumpets and cornets ring out proudly above the storm, with a note of victory, a sense of triumph and exultation (which must have been Brian's own as he came to the end of this superb movement). The music soars in boundless confidence; harps, xylophone and organ enter with more ostinati; and suddenly it is the climax of the Part I. Brian flings the music back into the home key of D minor with a cadence of astonishing boldness:



From C major to D minor by way of F sharp, all in three triads: it is the sensational juxtaposition of C and F sharp that is so exhilarating [and shocking, terrifying--Sarge]. Brian has discovered his full powers. He can stride from one end of the tonal universe to the other in a split second: he can make a single cadence bear the dramatic weight of an entire movement. This is the victory of imagination over form.

Back in D minor the music rises to a pinnacle of grandeur before all the instruments hammer home the chord of D, fortissimo, only to be shut out with heart-stopping suddeness. There is a pause, then quietness--a high tremolo in the violins, a soft meditative glow from the bassoons, barely audible timpani to assure us the world is still spinning. Part I of the Gothic ends in a serenely spaced D major triad, adorned with harp arpeggios."


The orchestration too is wild: like the freakish piccolo glissandos that are echoed by....the tuba! And I love the ominous sounding allusion to Schubert's Unfinished.

Sarge

[Sergeant Rock]

By the way,  understand that the composer's agent told him to change his name so that people would take him more seriously.
His real name is Brian Havergal .....     

I was watching a documentary about Kurtag and was amused by the Hungarian natives referring to Bartok and Kurtag as Bartok Bela and Kurtag György    I knew Hungarians put family name first but it was the first time I'd actually heard it spoken that way.

Sarge

[Lethevich]

5, 13, 14, 19, 23, 24, 26, 27, 28, 29 and 30 are still awaiting first recordings.

I have mp3s of (presumably) a live broadcast of #27 with Mackerras and the Philharmonia which I could upload somewhere, if anybody wants. Only 192 bitrate, but that's above radio quality.

[Sergeant Rock]

I have mp3s of (presumably) a live broadcast of #27 with Mackerras and the Philharmonia which I could upload somewhere, if anybody wants. Only 192 bitrate, but that's above radio quality.

I want....I WANT! Please.

Sarge