You like poetry?

[MishaK]

This above is why I call modern poetry's ambiguity for the sake of obscurity.

There is nothing really obscure about what Milosz is saying there. You could even say that he is blatantly whacking you over the head with the moral of the story. I am just not sure why you are missing that. I thought it was an excellent poem, though perhaps some of his special way with words is lost in translation.

[Josquin des Prez]

wtf???  sounds like one of Borat's creations.

Well, Borat is jewish, which means Saul probably idolizes him.

[Kullervo]

You like poetry?

You might say that.

[EmpNapoleon]

There is nothing really obscure about what Milosz is saying there. You could even say that he is blatantly whacking you over the head with the moral of the story. I am just not sure why you are missing that.

I'm missing the moral of the story because you haven't told me it.  I'm obtuse sometimes, so if you will...

[MishaK]

I'm missing the moral of the story because you haven't told me it.  I'm obtuse sometimes, so if you will...

Milosz lived through the rise of fascism and communism. He is describing the end of the world as happening in the face of utter tranquil normality, bees, fishermen, drunks all going about their usual business. He is describing in a poetic way what Hannah Arendt so memorably called the "banality of evil". That is, the changes in society that cause the greatest destruction rarely, if ever, announce themselves with thunder and lightning. They come as gradual subtle shifts under the cloak of business as usual, banal normality. "No one believes it [the end of the world] is happening now." is the key line. In the face of comfort and normalcy, ordinary people do not take the steps needed to save the world.

[EmpNapoleon]

That is, the changes in society that cause the greatest destruction rarely, if ever, announce themselves with thunder and lightning. They come as gradual subtle shifts under the cloak of business as usual, banal normality.

They come on doves' feet, to quote Nietzsche.  However, instead of translating "evil" in the poem, which doesn't appear in it, can't the end of the world merely mean one's own death.  That would be much clearer.  You helped me understand this poem while talking about communism, fascism, Arendt's "banality of evil," etc.  If you're right, to me, this poem is obscure. 

What about the last stanza, where the old man repeats, "No other end of the world will there be,
No other end of the world will there be."

[Kullervo]

Does no one else love Rilke as much as I do?

[karlhenning]

Dear Officer Krupke, we're begging you please,
'Coz no one wants a Weimaraner crawling with fleas

[Scriptavolant]

Does no one else love Rilke as much as I do?

I love Rilke, "Malte Laurids" is one of my few favorite books, soaked in pure anguish, but I've never read his poetry.

I like Thomas S. Eliot and Edgar A. Poe. Dino Campana is my favorite Italian.

[karlhenning]

I like Thomas S. Eliot and Edgar A. Poe.

What a world of merriment their melody foretells!

[EmpNapoleon]

Does no one else love Rilke as much as I do?

Yes!  The Sonnets and Elegies are great.

I love Rilke, "Malte Laurids" is one of my few favorite books, soaked in pure anguish, but I've never read his poetry.

Yes!  His prose is very nice too.  I'm not sure about his plays.  I haven't read them.

Where's the music in the words?

Rilke's poems feel musical, even in translation!

[MishaK]

They come on doves' feet, to quote Nietzsche.  However, instead of translating "evil" in the poem, which doesn't appear in it, can't the end of the world merely mean one's own death.  That would be much clearer.  You helped me understand this poem while talking about communism, fascism, Arendt's "banality of evil," etc.  If you're right, to me, this poem is obscure. 

What about the last stanza, where the old man repeats, "No other end of the world will there be,
No other end of the world will there be."

Well, each poet has his own idiom and his own cultural context. Trying to understand it is always to a certain extent an exercise in learning a new language - no different really than learning the musical idiom of an unfamiliar composer. The poem references the "end of the world". That is something significantly larger than just one's own death. None of the context of society and nature just going about business as usual would make sense in the context of a personal death. It is rather self-understood that people unrelated to you would go about their own business when you die (not to mention animals). The old man's repetition of the last lines and his characterization as a prophet who is not a prophet, I think, alludes to the knowledge from experience of an older generation that history repeats itself. Cataclysmic events always come on bright sunny days under the cloak of normalcy, not with thunder and lightning. He is not a prophet because he is not active in prophecying the end of the world. Like much of the old generation that should know better, he quietly minds his own business, tending his tomatoes, just like everyone else in society is tending his or her own business and nobody is doing anything to avert the end of the world, even though some know better.

Does no one else love Rilke as much as I do?

I certainly do. My wife and I meant to extend our trip in Italy this past summer to go see Duino castle near Trieste, where Rilke wrote his Dunieser Elegien. But we didn't have the time, unfortunately.

But EmpNapoleon's initial post asked about "contemporary" poets. Granted I bent that rule a bit with Milosz, who died three years ago. The others I listed are very much still alive and kicking, though.

[BorisG]

Of the modernists, Stephen Dunn (USA), Pat Ingoldsby (Ireland), Paul Durcan (Ireland).

[Dr. Dread]

Is there anything online regarding poetry's construction?

Thanks.

[Sergeant Rock]

Is there anything online regarding poetry's construction?

Thanks.

Not exactly sure what you're looking for, but you might start here

Sarge

[Dr. Dread]

Not exactly sure what you're looking for, but you might start here

Sarge

I'm looking for poem instruction. I will start where you say.

[mahler10th]

Now, anyone who is gay, please do not be offended, this haiku I wrote in 1985 is not meant to be homophobic at all, but rather a light hearted reference to a hero of mine who once advised taking your diary on a train because one needs something 'sensational' to read.

HAIKU HOMAGE TO OSCAR WILDE

Oscar Wilde -
POOF!
(d.1900)

The poof being his death, of course, not a jibe, and a reference to his sensational lifestyle.


Haiku
"Often focusing on images from nature, haiku emphasizes simplicity, intensity, and directness of expression."  (www.poets.org)