The Perfect Ping - The World's Ugliest Music

[some guy]

Beauty in the past has been connected with symmetry and order.

"The past" is a really big place. But let's say that you're right, that pre-20th century thought associated beauty with symmetry and order. Here's a dissenting voice.

"A SWEET disorder in the dress   
Kindles in clothes a wantonness:   
A lawn about the shoulders thrown   
Into a fine distraction:   
An erring lace, which here and there            5
Enthrals the crimson stomacher:   
A cuff neglectful, and thereby   
Ribbands to flow confusedly:   
A winning wave, deserving note,   
In the tempestuous petticoat:     10
A careless shoe-string, in whose tie   
I see a wild civility:   
Do more bewitch me than when art   
Is too precise in every part."

That's from the 17th century.

Better, I think, to fall back on the old Classic/Romantic categories, however creaky, or on the one Schumann favored, Apollonian/Dionysian. These are fairly old categories, both of them. And your "beauty associated with symmetry and order" bidness falls only into the Classic category. Both categories, recall, being old. Equally old. Equally in "the past," that is.

However in the 20th century the idea of music and art in general as being chaotic rather than ordered became accepted by some.

All ages (and probably all generations) have toyed with the notions of order and chaos as applied to the arts.

So as was said what is beautiful or ugly in modern terms is far harder to say.

Beauty and ugliness are the same now as they ever were, terms that point to the relationship between observer and observed. Some things have been found to be beautiful in recent times that would not have been considered beautiful in earlier times. Just give a few paintings from this century or that to see how men's ideas of female beauty have changed over the years.

It is always easy for any individual to say what pleases them and what doesn't. Easy and valid. What's also easy, but quite a bit less valid, is making any of those individual conclusions normative.

[starrynight]

I suppose I am talking in relative terms.  In more modern times the chaotic aspect arguably  has been given more prominence and has gone more consistently to extremes than any time in the more distant past that we know of.

Some things have been found to be beautiful in recent times that would not have been considered beautiful in earlier times.

That was definitely part of what I was thinking.

Beauty and ugliness are the same now as they ever were, terms that point to the relationship between observer and observed.  It is always easy for any individual to say what pleases them and what doesn't. Easy and valid. What's also easy, but quite a bit less valid, is making any of those individual conclusions normative.

I think such things are made normative by what becomes accepted by whatever the culture and time conditions people to think.  Of course some more individual people may be able to rebel at times against such ideas but they would be in a small minority and would still be shaped to an extent by their times anyway.

[Rinaldo]

Well maybe ugly wasn't the right word but this is certainly terrible music, but, then again, pretty much anything by The Residents is going to be bad.

/defense mode on/ Ouch! They've produced tons of mediocre crap (and should've called it quits eons ago) but Residents' highlights (e.g. Commercial Album, Eskimo) are among the best music I've ever encountered. /defense mode off/

[Mirror Image]

/defense mode on/ Ouch! They've produced tons of mediocre crap (and should've called it quits eons ago) but Residents' highlights (e.g. Commercial Album, Eskimo) are among the best music I've ever encountered. /defense mode off/

The Residents are a band of talentless hacks who thought what they were doing was somehow creative and stood for legitimate art music. It doesn't. It's some of the awful shit I've ever heard. Complete and utter nonsense. King Crimson's worst song would be better than anything The Residents could muster up. I don't have any problem with weird bands, but I have a problem with bands that have a bunch of non-musical people banging away on instruments. The only musician who is noteworthy that has ever played with The Residents is Snakefinger, but even with him in the band I still question the music, which sounds like it's played by a bunch of juveniles. Snakefinger's own music was horrible as well, but I know he was a talented guitarist. I just find the avenue he chose to explore music questionable.

If you like them, then that's cool, but I certainly don't share your opinion.

[Rinaldo]

If you like them, then that's cool, but I certainly don't share your opinion.

Yeah, I can see that

(it never fails to amaze me how differently people perceive music.. a lot of times here on GMG, I found your musical taste very compatible with mine – your current avatar included!)

[Mirror Image]

Yeah, I can see that

(it never fails to amaze me how differently people perceive music.. a lot of times here on GMG, I found your musical taste very compatible with mine – your current avatar included!)

Sorry for being harsh about The Residents. My comments turned into a rant. Anyway, it's always interesting to meet people who listen to similar things. The Cocteau Twins are a recent rediscovery for me and I'm blown away by how beautiful their music is. We probably like a lot of the same classical music. The interesting thing is I came to classical later (I'll be 30 in March) and I've only been seriously listening to it for a couple of years. Anyway, do you have all of Cocteau Twins's albums? Any favorites?

[snyprrr]

Sorry for being harsh about The Residents. My comments turned into a rant. Anyway, it's always interesting to meet people who listen to similar things. The Cocteau Twins are a recent rediscovery for me and I'm blown away by how beautiful their music is. We probably like a lot of the same classical music. The interesting thing is I came to classical later (I'll be 30 in March) and I've only been seriously listening to it for a couple of years. Anyway, do you have all of Cocteau Twins's albums? Any favorites?

Blue Bell Knoll is the only song you need.

[Rinaldo]

The interesting thing is I came to classical later (I'll be 30 in March) and I've only been seriously listening to it for a couple of years. Anyway, do you have all of Cocteau Twins's albums? Any favorites?

Same here, even with the age – I'll turn 30 in April!

As for Cocteau Twins albums, don't have them all but I treasure Treasure. One of my favourite records of all time.

[Mirror Image]

Blue Bell Knoll is the only song you need.

That's an amazing song, snyprrr, but there are so many more that are great IMHO.

[Mirror Image]

Same here, even with the age – I'll turn 30 in April!

As for Cocteau Twins albums, don't have them all but I treasure Treasure. One of my favourite records of all time.

We're '82 babies?!? That's awesome.

I like Treasure pretty well, but Victorialand, Blue Bell Knoll, and Head Over Heels are my favorites.

[starrynight]

Blue Bell Knoll is my favourite Cocteau Twins album and I've found the  Duck Stab EP by The Residents interesting in the past.  I don't mind listening to all kinds of music really.

[Mirror Image]

Blue Bell Knoll is my favourite Cocteau Twins album and I've found the  Duck Stab EP by The Residents interesting in the past.  I don't mind listening to all kinds of music really.

Blue Bell Knoll is a gorgeous album and my favorite right now, but I'm finding Heaven or Los Vegas incredibly enjoyable as it's growing on me.

For me, there's two category of music: music I want to listen to and music I don't want to listen to. The Residents fall into the music I don't want to listen to category. I listen to all kinds of music too.

[snyprrr]

I put up the Xenakis piece Zythos on the Xenakis Thread. It's pretty horrible, like this piece. Dorky Ugly

[Ataraxia]

Speaking of the world's ugliest music, I think this qualifies...

The Residents are an acquired taste for sure and you need a prominent absurdist bone.

[Rinaldo]

The Residents are an acquired taste for sure and you need a prominent absurdist bone.

Or stumble upon them when you're 13 and become totally entranced by their melodies & imagery. My story.

[Ataraxia]

Or stumble upon them when you're 13 and become totally entranced by their melodies & imagery. My story.

And it's fun to play them just to freak people out.   

I saw them on the DEMONS DANCE ALONE tour. Wonderful!