Author Topic: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)  (Read 37045 times)

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Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #140 on: January 26, 2015, 12:51:05 PM »
I would go see Salonen in a heartbeat!

I will probably do that myself, also because I've long wanted to hear the CSO rip into this. But Grant Park/Kalmar has the advantage of being free, in a relaxed outdoors atmosphere. Maybe I'll go to both, since it will likely be 2 very different experiences.
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Offline not edward

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #141 on: January 26, 2015, 06:34:53 PM »
Is Harmonielehre becoming standard rep? Grant Park and the CSO are both doing it this year. Respectively, in August (Kalmar) and in October (Salonen). I can't decide whether to go to one or the other or both!
If it is, it's a good choice. I do have some minor reservations about the slow movement, but I don't think Adams has done anything better.
"I don't at all mind actively disliking a piece of contemporary music, but in order to feel happy about it I must consciously understand why I dislike it. Otherwise it remains in my mind as unfinished business."
 -- Aaron Copland, The Pleasures of Music

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #142 on: January 27, 2015, 07:01:05 AM »
If it is, it's a good choice. I do have some minor reservations about the slow movement, but I don't think Adams has done anything better.

Entirely fair evaluation.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #143 on: January 27, 2015, 08:48:38 AM »
I would go see Salonen in a heartbeat!

Ha, I made a mistake. It's actually de Waart conducting, which is not surprising, as he's made a specialty of this piece. Salonen is conducting the Lutoslawski 3rd, which I am also definitely going to.  :)
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #144 on: January 27, 2015, 08:56:37 AM »
Well, I think better yet of de Waart than of Salonen (not that anyone asked ....)
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline North Star

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #145 on: January 27, 2015, 09:11:08 AM »
Well, I think better yet of de Waart than of Salonen (not that anyone asked ....)
I suppse the Edo period means different things in Minnesota and Japan.  8)
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Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #146 on: January 27, 2015, 01:11:35 PM »
Ha, I made a mistake. It's actually de Waart conducting, which is not surprising, as he's made a specialty of this piece. Salonen is conducting the Lutoslawski 3rd, which I am also definitely going to.  :)

Okay, yeah, de Waart is great in Adams. That should be a great performance since, as Karl pointed out, he's made several recording of Adams' music.
"Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art." - Claude Debussy

Offline GioCar

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #147 on: October 05, 2016, 11:46:30 PM »
This morning I listened to Sheherazade.2



hmm... I'm not convinced at all.
The second part (mov. III and IV) went better than the first two movements, but overall I had my thoughts confirmed. The Adams I like most is the earlier one, till let's say the Naive and Sentimental Music.
I always feel as if there is a lack of inspiration starting from his turn-of-the-century works, with very few exceptions (The Dharma at Big Sur and My Father Knew Charles Ives are the only two works I really like from that period).
I've read that Sheherazade.2 (a sort of Sinfonia concertante for Violin and Orchestra)  has received a lot af praise, but in my preferences list it is well below The Dharma.
Has anyone else heard it?

Ken B

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #148 on: October 06, 2016, 12:06:22 AM »
This morning I listened to Sheherazade.2



hmm... I'm not convinced at all.
The second part (mov. III and IV) went better than the first two movements, but overall I had my thoughts confirmed. The Adams I like most is the earlier one, till let's say the Naive and Sentimental Music.
I always feel as if there is a lack of inspiration starting from his turn-of-the-century works, with very few exceptions (The Dharma at Big Sur and My Father Knew Charles Ives are the only two works I really like from that period).
I've read that Sheherazade.2 (a sort of Sinfonia concertante for Violin and Orchestra)  has received a lot af praise, but in my preferences list it is well below The Dharma.
Has anyone else heard it?

I suppose I will at some point, but I am put off by the attempt to bully me into praising it. For what else is all this bullshit about it being "about women standing up to patriarchy in the modern world." How can you boo that you fascist misogynist pig?
My symphony is about the suffering of battered women, and you don't like it?? What's your agenda?

Offline GioCar

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #149 on: October 06, 2016, 12:13:13 AM »
^^^

???

Offline amw

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #150 on: October 06, 2016, 12:49:14 AM »
I suppose I will at some point, but I am put off by the attempt to bully me into praising it. For what else is all this bullshit about it being "about women standing up to patriarchy in the modern world." How can you boo that you fascist misogynist pig?
My symphony is about the suffering of battered women, and you don't like it?? What's your agenda?

Lmao @ that coming from Adams, too, who has somewhat of a, uh, reputation among female musicians for getting a bit too "hands-on".

Liberal white dudebros pretending to be The Most Progressive is something that increasingly annoys me. Oh look! You have a Black Lives Matter sticker on your car! You posted an article about feminism on your facebook wall!! You describe yourself as "cisgendered" and "body positive" on your OKCupid profile!!! Yes of course I'll fuck you, I looooove white knights~

(Sorry. That was a rant. I study at a university in a moderately large, socially liberal city. I'll get over it soon.)

While I'm here, can anyone recommend a recording of Adams's original Violin Concerto (the one from 1995)? I did hear it once some years ago and didn't find it convincing as a work, but stuff I've read recently has made me want to hear it again just out of curiosity.

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #151 on: October 06, 2016, 03:41:42 AM »
I suppose I will at some point, but I am put off by the attempt to bully me into praising it. For what else is all this bullshit about it being "about women standing up to patriarchy in the modern world." How can you boo that you fascist misogynist pig?
My symphony is about the suffering of battered women, and you don't like it?? What's your agenda?

All the money for new music is for work that can be used for activism! (<— hyperbole)

I suppse the Edo period means different things in Minnesota and Japan.  8)

Karlo, I am sorry that I missed your jest, back when you made it!
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #152 on: October 06, 2016, 05:43:30 AM »
This morning I listened to Sheherazade.2



hmm... I'm not convinced at all.
The second part (mov. III and IV) went better than the first two movements, but overall I had my thoughts confirmed. The Adams I like most is the earlier one, till let's say the Naive and Sentimental Music.
I always feel as if there is a lack of inspiration starting from his turn-of-the-century works, with very few exceptions (The Dharma at Big Sur and My Father Knew Charles Ives are the only two works I really like from that period).
I've read that Sheherazade.2 (a sort of Sinfonia concertante for Violin and Orchestra)  has received a lot af praise, but in my preferences list it is well below The Dharma.
Has anyone else heard it?

Doesn't surprise me that someone doesn't like the work. I haven't heard it myself, so I'll reserve judgement of course, but I think Adams is one of the most thoroughly disappointing composers working today who seems to get heaps of praise put upon him for no other reason but to somehow make it seem that contemporary classical music should be listener-friendly and accessible to an audience without actually listening to the work. I may be making a broad assumption here, but it seems to me the media loves Adams more than the actual listeners do.
"Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art." - Claude Debussy

Ken B

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #153 on: October 06, 2016, 06:12:37 AM »
I may be making a broad assumption here, but it seems to me the media loves Adams more than the actual listeners do.

More than this former fan, disappointed by his past 20 years of stuff, that's for sure. I think part of the reason the media loves him is precisely this "I do it for the victims" bullshit.

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #154 on: October 06, 2016, 06:20:07 AM »
More than this former fan, disappointed by his past 20 years of stuff, that's for sure. I think part of the reason the media loves him is precisely this "I do it for the victims" bullshit.

Harmonium, Shaker Loops, and Harmonielehre are the best things Adams has done IMHO. You can keep the rest.
"Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art." - Claude Debussy

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #155 on: October 06, 2016, 06:25:13 AM »
More than this former fan, disappointed by his past 20 years of stuff, that's for sure. I think part of the reason the media loves him is precisely this "I do it for the victims" bullshit.

It's a damned shrewd move.  No worrying about the vagaries of inspiration;  open up a newspaper!
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #156 on: October 06, 2016, 06:34:35 AM »
It's a damned shrewd move.  No worrying about the vagaries of inspiration;  open up a newspaper!

Spot-on! That does feel like where Adams gets his ideas from. Next thing you know, he'll be writing about the Kardashians or the Hiltons of the world. :-\
"Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art." - Claude Debussy

Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #157 on: October 06, 2016, 07:04:35 AM »
The Adams I like most is the earlier one, till let's say the Naive and Sentimental Music.
I always feel as if there is a lack of inspiration starting from his turn-of-the-century works, with very few exceptions (

Me too. I haven't heard much of the post-2000 stuff, but judging from most responses I read, I shouldn't bother.

The in-yer-face social liberalism and "relevance" is the sort of thing you put in the foreground when your inspiration has faded.
formerly VELIMIR (before that, Spitvalve)

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Ken B

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #158 on: October 06, 2016, 07:47:35 AM »
File under lost Rockefeller Foundation grant opportunities:

Out in the Sun -- Instead of In the Shade of Intersectional Othering and Privilege (Dedicated to the Children)

Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #159 on: October 06, 2016, 07:59:12 AM »
File under lost Rockefeller Foundation grant opportunities:

Out in the Sun -- Instead of In the Shade of Intersectional Othering and Privilege (Dedicated to the Children)

At some point, Adams will be accused of "cultural appropriation," and we'll all have a good laugh.
formerly VELIMIR (before that, Spitvalve)

"Who knows not strict counterpoint, lives and dies an ignoramus" - CPE Bach