Author Topic: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)  (Read 36247 times)

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Reckoner

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #160 on: October 06, 2016, 10:02:48 AM »
I haven't heard much of the post-2000 stuff, but judging from most responses I read, I shouldn't bother.

You should bother.  :)

Dharma is one of the supreme works of recent times - novel, sophisticated and often quite beautiful.

Absolute Jest has the most amazing first movement, expertly intertwining his own trademark rhythmic / melodic mayhem with Beethoven soundbites in a wholly satisfying way.

Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #161 on: October 06, 2016, 10:11:19 AM »
You should bother.  :)

Dharma is one of the supreme works of recent times - novel, sophisticated and often quite beautiful.

Too late, LOL. I had the CD of Dharma but got rid of it.
formerly VELIMIR (before that, Spitvalve)

"Who knows not strict counterpoint, lives and dies an ignoramus" - CPE Bach

Reckoner

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #162 on: October 06, 2016, 11:12:43 AM »
Too late, LOL. I had the CD of Dharma but got rid of it.

Then you need to buy another copy.  ;D

Offline nathanb

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #163 on: October 06, 2016, 12:45:50 PM »
The in-yer-face social liberalism and "relevance" is the sort of thing you put in the foreground when your inspiration has faded.

You speak important truths, my friend. I never thought J. C. was relatively high on the list of contemporary talents to begin with, but he was high enough to fall quite a bit, I guess.

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #164 on: October 06, 2016, 01:18:55 PM »
There's having talent.  And there's having a name.  The correlation is imperfect.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #165 on: October 06, 2016, 01:35:13 PM »
There's having talent.  And there's having a name.  The correlation is imperfect.

There's also having talent, using it to make a name, and then coasting on the name your talent made, regardless of whether you still have it or not.
formerly VELIMIR (before that, Spitvalve)

"Who knows not strict counterpoint, lives and dies an ignoramus" - CPE Bach

Offline not edward

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #166 on: October 06, 2016, 01:54:11 PM »
One of the funnier things Adams has done is the mysterious transition from juvenile mockery of Elliott Carter to (not unequivocally, which is absolutely fine) praising him and conducting the Variations for Orchestra almost as soon as Carter died and (perhaps) a vacancy for the "elder statesman" role arose.

Every now and then I hear something post-1990 from Adams that reminds me he should be a significant figure. But IMO his quality control has been on autopilot for a while now (I actually liked the original version of the Doctor Atomic symphony, but then he cut out most of the interesting material from it).
"I don't at all mind actively disliking a piece of contemporary music, but in order to feel happy about it I must consciously understand why I dislike it. Otherwise it remains in my mind as unfinished business."
 -- Aaron Copland, The Pleasures of Music

Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #167 on: October 06, 2016, 02:04:00 PM »
One of the funnier things Adams has done is the mysterious transition from juvenile mockery of Elliott Carter to (not unequivocally, which is absolutely fine) praising him and conducting the Variations for Orchestra almost as soon as Carter died and (perhaps) a vacancy for the "elder statesman" role arose.

Maybe this is just something composers do, out of a natural sense of competition. Consider all the composers that Boulez trashed in his earlier career, and then would up conducting later on.
formerly VELIMIR (before that, Spitvalve)

"Who knows not strict counterpoint, lives and dies an ignoramus" - CPE Bach

Reckoner

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #168 on: October 06, 2016, 02:13:04 PM »
Is there an aversion to Adams because he's still associated with minimalism?

That stuff is so forty years ago.

Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #169 on: October 06, 2016, 02:27:24 PM »
Is there an aversion to Adams because he's still associated with minimalism?

Not on my part. The stuff of his that I like dates from the period when he was moving away from minimalism, but still sometimes used minimalist procedures (basically, about 1980-2000).
formerly VELIMIR (before that, Spitvalve)

"Who knows not strict counterpoint, lives and dies an ignoramus" - CPE Bach

Ken B

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #170 on: October 06, 2016, 02:50:05 PM »
Is there an aversion to Adams because he's still associated with minimalism?

That stuff is so forty years ago.
Au contraire, as I think is obvious from all the comments about liking only his early stuff.

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #171 on: October 06, 2016, 02:50:49 PM »
Is there an aversion to Adams because he's still associated with minimalism?

That stuff is so forty years ago.

No, my quarrel is purely compositional.

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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline nathanb

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #172 on: October 06, 2016, 04:24:52 PM »
Is there an aversion to Adams because he's still associated with minimalism?

That stuff is so forty years ago.

No?

Reckoner

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #173 on: October 07, 2016, 02:05:23 AM »
lol, that may have sounded strange - it's just that minimalism is and has always been an easy target. A poor presumption on my part.

In any case, I'm not so sure I agree that his recent stuff is necessarily a drop-off compared to earlier works. Certainly he's tried a few things that he hadn't before, like the quartets, the jazz-influenced orchestral works (City Noir / Sax Concerto) and even Dharma.

I'll try and give Sheherezade.2 a spin soon.  8)


Offline amw

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #174 on: October 07, 2016, 04:31:33 AM »
While I'm here, can anyone recommend a recording of Adams's original Violin Concerto (the one from 1995)? I did hear it once some years ago and didn't find it convincing as a work, but stuff I've read recently has made me want to hear it again just out of curiosity.
Ok well since nobody had any recs I just listened to the new one on Signum.

More so than the articles I read, I think knowing more "classic" minimalism (Reich, Glass, etc) at this point is what enabled me to understand the music better: I feel like I get more of the references. It's not a very memorable piece I suppose, but perfectly listenable, and I don't regret my time spent. Performance seems high-quality and advocates for the music fairly well.

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #175 on: October 07, 2016, 04:56:33 AM »
Well, and Reich/Adams/Glass isn't really minimalism, is it? Feldman—now that's minimalism.

All the repeat signs and all the busy-ness, minimalist? Lazyist, maybe  0:)
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline North Star

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #176 on: October 07, 2016, 05:21:41 AM »
All the repeat signs and all the busy-ness, minimalist? Lazyist, maybe  0:)
Well, is it any more accurate to call busyness lazyist?  0:)
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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #177 on: October 07, 2016, 06:10:19 AM »
Well, is it any more accurate to call busyness lazyist?  0:)

8)
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline Archaic Torso of Apollo

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #178 on: October 07, 2016, 07:05:07 AM »
Ok well since nobody had any recs I just listened to the new one on Signum.

Is that the one coupled with the Harris VC? I'm interested in that disc, tho' mainly for the Harris.

I have McDuffie/Eschenbach in the Adams, which indeed sounds perfectly respectable to me, but I have nothing to compare it with.
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Offline amw

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Re: Adams' Apple-Cart (John Coolidge, that is!)
« Reply #179 on: October 07, 2016, 07:08:57 AM »
Yes. I didn't listen to the Harris concerto though.

Am fairly sure McDuffie/Eschenbach is the recording I'd previously heard 300 years ago and found quite boring, but I think the difference was more in me than in the recording.