The Super-Duper Cheap Bargains Thread

[Karl Henning]

Copied from the Purchases thread:

Caveats (how dare they...)  :

- Use Google Chrome to do the automatic translation of the site from Czech
- no point in trying to download the complete Zip, it keeps crashing
- download them CD by CD. Even that can take several attempts for each CD.
- The numbering of CD on the webpage doesn't match the numbering of the CD in the box. The webpage supplies a breakdown to let you do the matching.
- the file tagging includes movements names and (some) performers but not all the work names.

Basically it will need a lot of patience and lots of back and forth with the relevant entry on Discogs for a correct re-tagging.

Still...

7 quids each...

worth the hassle...


At the same price :

- All the Sony cheap boxes (thingy conducts thingy and some others)
- Original Jackets sets
- Entremont Piano Concertos
- 3 Bylsma volumes
- Abbado RCA & Sony collection
- LVB SQ Juillard 1964-70
- Malcolm Arnold Conifer box
- Giulini complete Sony Recordings

etc etc...

Sure is super-duper cheap!

[Spotted Horses]

Sure is super-duper cheap!

As I mentioned somewhere on this site, let the buyer beware, at least for FLAC files. I got the giant Reiner box for next to nothing, but it seems pretty clear that the FLAC files are not true bit-for-bit duplicates of what's on the CD. Lossless streaming on Apple Music always (in my experience) sounds utterly identical to a CD rip. The Supraphon.net FLAC files did not sound identical to the Apple Music lossless streaming version. I couldn't say they were objectively worse, but they were not the same.

I'd rather pay a reasonable price and know what I am getting, or rely on streaming.

[DavidW]

I hate to be that guy but it is a much higher probability that you are suffering from a cognitive bias and perceive a difference when none exists than for a major record label to not sell their own lossless files.  It would take more effort and money to prepare duplicates that are worse in quality than what they are directly supplying to Apple, Spotify etc. than to just use the same.

[steve ridgway]

As I mentioned somewhere on this site, let the buyer beware, at least for FLAC files. I got the giant Reiner box for next to nothing, but it seems pretty clear that the FLAC files are not true bit-for-bit duplicates of what's on the CD. Lossless streaming on Apple CD always (in my experience) sounds utterly identical to a CD rip. The Supraphon.net FLAC files did not sound identical to the Apple Music lossless streaming version. I couldn't say they were objectively worse, but they were not the same.

I'd rather pay a reasonable price and know what I am getting, or rely on streaming.

I might buy it at some point, should be worth it to hear a few works I don't know. I'm happy with my Boulez "box". Have you downloaded one of the MP3 files to compare with the FLAC?

[Karl Henning]

As I mentioned somewhere on this site, let the buyer beware, at least for FLAC files. I got the giant Reiner box for next to nothing, but it seems pretty clear that the FLAC files are not true bit-for-bit duplicates of what's on the CD. Lossless streaming on Apple CD always (in my experience) sounds utterly identical to a CD rip. The Supraphon.net FLAC files did not sound identical to the Apple Music lossless streaming version. I couldn't say they were objectively worse, but they were not the same.

I'd rather pay a reasonable price and know what I am getting, or rely on streaming.

Thanks for the word!

[Karl Henning]

the file tagging includes movements names and (some) performers but not all the work names.

I think that in the case of three or four discs, I had to try a second time. The biggest hassle was two cases where the filename path was too long for that file to be unzipped, e.g. "Fritz Reiner - The Complete Chicago Symphony Recordings on RCA - 15-29 - Arthur Rubinstein_Enrique Jorda_Manuel de Falla - III En los Jardines de la Sierra de Cordoba.mp3." (the other was the last mvt of Scheherazade, similarly, TMI larded into the filename: " IV Allegro Molto E Frenetico - Vivo - Allegro Non Troppo E Maestoso - Tempo Come I. Festival At Bagdad - The Sea - The Shipwreck On A Rock Surmounted By A Bronze Warrior - Conclusion.") The solution was relatively easy: downloading each track separately.
So, yes, some more hassle than one's typical album download, but I too found the reward::labor ratio favorable.

[Spotted Horses]

I hate to be that guy but it is a much higher probability that you are suffering from a cognitive bias and perceive a difference when none exists than for a major record label to not sell their own lossless files.  It would take more effort and money to prepare duplicates that are worse in quality than what they are directly supplying to Apple, Spotify etc. than to just use the same.

I am 100% sure it is not cognitive bias, it wasn't a subtle difference. I had to turn the volume knob up another 25% to get the FLAC file from supraphon.net to sound as loud as Apple Music streaming. I've never noticed a volume difference between Apple Music streaming and FLAC files that I've ripped or purchased. I didn't notice any inferiority in the FLAC files, I just noted they are not identical.

I don't know how they produced those FLAC files, but if they are in a jurisdiction in which the recordings are somehow public domain they could have ripped the physical CDs to MP3, then converted to FLAC in software, captured streaming from spotify, etc. As I said, I decided there was no point relying on the because the set streams on Apple Music anyway.

Any loss in quality due to MP3 is probably irrelevant in 70 year old recordings, but it might make a difference for something which is closer to SOTA.

[DavidW]

That could just be replay gain though.  I've noticed the same thing between Qobuz and Idagio (different volumes on the same recordings) but the SQ is the same once volume adjusted. 

What you could do is measure the dynamic range.  If the same album had different DR #s I would believe it that there is something different about them.

[Spotted Horses]

That could just be replay gain though.  I've noticed the same thing between Qobuz and Idagio (different volumes on the same recordings) but the SQ is the same once volume adjusted.

I admit it is not in anyway definitive, but I've always found Apple Music and Swinsian playback (Mac) to have identical volume through my Schiit ADC.

What you could do is measure the dynamic range.  If the same album had different DR #s I would believe it that there is something different about them.

In theory, yes, but we are talking about a 1955 recording. I think the dynamic range is already very narrow to begin with. If I were really interested enough I would convert the FLACs from supraphon.net and Qobuz (or Presto) to *.wav (uncompressed) and see if the same numbers are there.

In any case, just sharing my experience. I'm not trying to convince anyone not to get the files, especially as the risk in plunking $8 down for a $200 CD set is negligible.

[steve ridgway]

I notice some of the albums in the Fritz Reiner box were newly remastered from the original analogue tapes. Perhaps someone selling downloads or streams already has files in their system from prior releases and has supplied those instead of the new versions.

[Roasted Swan]

I notice some of the albums in the Fritz Reiner box were newly remastered from the original analogue tapes. Perhaps someone selling downloads or streams already has files in their system from prior releases and has supplied those instead of the new versions.

The bottom line - as 'Spotted Horses' fairly points out - is that at the cost of this set - 63 'discs' for under £8 - about 12p each it is hardly a bank-breaking investment.  As it happens I already have many of the classic Reiner discs as SACD's etc so for me the main interest is in the performances by him with the CSO of repertoire I would not otherwise seek out at a standard price.  For those I am not that worried if it is FLAC or a decent bit rate MP3 as long as the sound is pretty good - which so far they most certainly are......

[DavidW]

I notice some of the albums in the Fritz Reiner box were newly remastered from the original analogue tapes. Perhaps someone selling downloads or streams already has files in their system from prior releases and has supplied those instead of the new versions.

This is the tricky part... I find that Qobuz will have literally every different remaster of so many albums.  I end up wasting time trying to figure which sounds the best instead of just listening.  Though I personally would just want only the best one there, I know that can be debatable depending upon on how the remaster is done, so ultimately I appreciate that we have the freedom to choose.

What does grind my gears though is when there is a fresh remaster dumped into digital downloads and streaming but no corresponding cd release or it is just done on blu-ray which I don't listen to.  Ugh.

[Pohjolas Daughter]

This is the tricky part... I find that Qobuz will have literally every different remaster of so many albums.  I end up wasting time trying to figure which sounds the best instead of just listening.  Though I personally would just want only the best one there, I know that can be debatable depending upon on how the remaster is done, so ultimately I appreciate that we have the freedom to choose.

What does grind my gears though is when there is a fresh remaster dumped into digital downloads and streaming but no corresponding cd release or it is just done on blu-ray which I don't listen to.  Ugh.

It sounds very confusing...hard to keep up with.  Are Qobuz and other streaming services very good about listing info re the releases?  From what I understand, at least in the past, there is often little info provided.

PD

[DavidW]

It sounds very confusing...hard to keep up with.  Are Qobuz and other streaming services very good about listing info re the releases?  From what I understand, at least in the past, there is often little info provided.

PD

Exactly!  You answered your question PD.  There is one little trick though, commonly the most recent remaster will be in hd audio.

[Karl Henning]

From Supraphonline: Just over £14 in total for the (troublesome but i'll live) download of 63 CD + 67 CD respectively.

The goofiest thing is how the discs for Gurrelieder and Pelléas et Mélisande. e.g. are out of order.

[DaveF]

Hardly the superest or cheapest of bargains, but I see chandos.net has a 25% off BIS sale, which includes the forthcoming Pettersson edition: https://www.chandos.net/products/catalogue/BI%209062 - £100 at least makes it cheaper than I can see anywhere else.

[Atriod]

Boris Giltburg Beethoven Piano Sonata cycle 17 Euro at JPC: https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/saemtliche-klaviersonaten/hnum/10671864

[Todd]

Chandos has Naxos downloads on sale for ~$3/disc equivalent.  Time to stock up.

[Spotted Horses]

Chandos has Naxos downloads on sale for ~$3/disc equivalent.  Time to stock up.

Maybe a good enough excuse to get the Lloyd-Jones recordings of Bax symphonies.

[steve ridgway]

Chandos has Naxos downloads on sale for ~$3/disc equivalent.  Time to stock up.

It's not easy to browse the whole label. Searching by composer then selecting Naxos works OK.