I must have Mahler's Ninth!

Started by Stonemason, December 17, 2007, 05:25:47 PM

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Stonemason

Have just realised the greatness that is Mahler's Ninth. Please recommend me the greatest recording.

not edward

I like CzPO/Ancerl very slightly more than any others I've heard: his account doesn't push the music around, but just lets it speak for itself quite beautifully, yet he doesn't hesitate to let rip where needed in the central movements.

However, there are several others I wouldn't want to do without: WP/Walter is remarkable if with an underpowered finale and 1938 sound; Philharmonia/Klemperer has a remarkable, stoic account of the finale; BP/Barbirolli has an extraordinary tension at times; CSO/Boulez has a heartbreakingly intense reading of the first movement.

I'm probably an atypical listener in that I've never really connected with either Bernstein or Karajan in his work; I still need to hear the highly regarded Maderna and Giulini, amongst others.
"I don't at all mind actively disliking a piece of contemporary music, but in order to feel happy about it I must consciously understand why I dislike it. Otherwise it remains in my mind as unfinished business."
-- Aaron Copland, The Pleasures of Music

MISHUGINA

Ancerl/CzechPO. I bet my CD collection majority of GMGers here would vote for that. Cheaper than majority of 2 CD recordings by Karajan, Bernstein etc. But my personal favorite would be Horenstein/LSO on BBC Legends.

(poco) Sforzando

#3
Quote from: edward on December 17, 2007, 06:03:27 PM
I'm probably an atypical listener in that I've never really connected with either Bernstein or Karajan in his work; I still need to hear the highly regarded Maderna and Giulini, amongst others.

The Maderna BBC is an extraordinarily intense interpretation, one in which each of the four movements seems like a seamless paragraph, and far more committed than the same conductor's rather wayward Mahler 7 on Arkadia. I have heard a number of very good Mahler 9s live and on recording - Walter, Bernstein, Kubelik, Levine; I have never heard a Mahler 9 that matches this one for emotional impact.
"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

Keemun

There are some great Mahler Ninths out there.  :)  My personal favorites are Karajan/BPO (Live) and Ancerl/Czech PO.  I don't have my music collection in front of me, I'll check it tomorrow and see if I left one out.  I haven't heard Bernstein's yet, but I would like to.
Music is the mediator between the spiritual and the sensual life. - Ludwig van Beethoven

PSmith08

Quote from: Sforzando on December 17, 2007, 06:26:25 PM
The Maderna BBC is an extraordinarily intense interpretation, one in which each of the four movements seems like a seamless paragraph, and far more committed than the same conductor's rather wayward Mahler 7 on Arkadia. I have heard a number of very good Mahler 9s live and on recording - Walter, Bernstein, Kubelik, Levine; I have never heard a Mahler 9 that matches this one for emotional impact.

Yes! Maderna's 9th is my preferred interpretation, though I really like Barenboim's new record. Maderna really managed to get to the heart of the score and bring it together in an intelligent - and deeply felt - manner. Being in the hall that night must have been an experience. There is also, if you want a solid and massive account, Klemperer's recording on EMI. It makes the 9th feel like a force of nature.

KevinP

I love Horenstein's and Walter's 1938 versions. Barbirolli did an excellent take in 1964 as well.

Boulez is good but I wasn't as impressed as usual.

lukeottevanger

Another vote for Ancerl. Glad to see so many others with taste here  ;D

vandermolen

I have several fine recordings but my favourite is conducted by Otto Klemperer on EMI.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

bhodges

There are a number already mentioned that I haven't heard (e.g., Klemperer, Barbirolli, Ancerl) but I do confess that I like modern sound for this work.  The two I return to most often are Karajan/Berlin (live) and Chailly/Concertgebouw.  The latter is fairly slow (as with much of his cycle) but Chailly makes it work, and the sound is marvelous.

--Bruce

Keemun

Quote from: bhodges on December 18, 2007, 09:44:53 AM
. . . but I do confess that I like modern sound for this work. 

I have to agree with you there.  Even though Ancerl is mid-1960's, the sound quality is still pretty good.  While Karajan (Live) and Ancerl are both fine performances, Karajan edges out Ancerl in my book because of its superior sound quality.  This is one symphony where I don't really appreciate mono or early stereo recordings.
Music is the mediator between the spiritual and the sensual life. - Ludwig van Beethoven

head-case

Quote from: Keemun on December 18, 2007, 10:57:57 AM
I have to agree with you there.  Even though Ancerl is mid-1960's, the sound quality is still pretty good.  While Karajan (Live) and Ancerl are both fine performances, Karajan edges out Ancerl in my book because of its superior sound quality.  This is one symphony where I don't really appreciate mono or early stereo recordings.
I find Karajan's digital, live recording of the 9th to be less satisfying than his earlier analog, studio recording.  (Plus, the analog one is on DG's 2-fer series and is cheaper.  Supposedly the old Solti/LSO version was amazing, but Decca only seems to be interested to his later (rather crude, IMO) Chicago symphony recording.

Drasko

Quote from: head-case on December 18, 2007, 11:52:34 AM
Supposedly the old Solti/LSO version was amazing, but Decca only seems to be interested to his later (rather crude, IMO) Chicago symphony recording.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00008LDN6

or

http://www.amazon.de/Mahler-Symphonie-Nr-Georg-Solti/dp/B00008LDN6

MishaK

Quote from: PSmith08 on December 17, 2007, 06:52:53 PM
....though I really like Barenboim's new record.

That's my first choice here, too. It has all the qualities of his amazing 7th. Simply a riveting performance with fine attention to detail, yet always natural evolution of music. And the Staatskapelle plays gorgeously.

PSmith08

Quote from: O Mensch on December 18, 2007, 12:47:22 PM
That's my first choice here, too. It has all the qualities of his amazing 7th. Simply a riveting performance with fine attention to detail, yet always natural evolution of music. And the Staatskapelle plays gorgeously.

Given some live recordings, the Barenboim 7th and 9th, and now the Boulez 8th, I have been really impressed with the Staatskapelle Berlin as a Mahler band. Of course, another recording, relatively recent, is Sinopoli's 1997 version with the Staatskapelle Dresden, out on Profil in the Edition Staatskapelle Dresden (vol. 17). I agree with the reviewer that rated it above that conductor's DGG version.

M forever

You can also hear the Staatskapelle Berlin in Mahler 2 and 5 conducted by Suitner. There is also a video of the 2nd with Boulez. Like in Dresden or Leipzig, the relative isolation during communist times and the fact that there were only 4 music academies in East Germany (Berlin, Leipzig, Weimar, Dresden, plus a few branches of these in other cities) which fed these orchestras, and the fact that the style of teaching there was still very much "oldfashioned" in the sense that these were schools dedicated to training orchestral musicians who were there to learnt a craft, not to find their artistic self or something like that, all these elements led to these orchestras conserving a more traditional style of sound and playing than in the West. So these days in Berlin, you can hear the Berliner Philharmoniker or Deutsches Symphonie Orchester (the former RSO Berlin) with their more "modern" sound, and then just a few minutes East, you can hear the Staatskapelle, Konzerthausorchester (Sanderling's former BSO) or Rundfunk-Sinfonieorchester with their more traditional sound and playing style.

greg

my absolute favorite CD...


i wonder how Bernstein's sounds. I really haven't hardly heard much besides Karajan. What does Bernstein's sound like? Is it slower? I probably wouldn't like it slower, actually...

DarkAngel

#17
1) Ancerl/Supraphon Gold
2) Bernstein/Sony (later DG version is glacially paced)
3) Kubelik/Audite
4) Kondrashin/Melodiya
5) Karajan/DG Live

Other very good M9s that are under the mainstream radar and should be acquired:
Neumann/Leipzig/Berlin Classics
Zender/CPO
Judd/Regis
Maderna/BBC Legends

Barenboim M9 & M7 are very good, best mordern versions I have heard of each but not ready to place them in top 5 elite class of all time greats just yet.

You should also for reference get the 1938 Walter/VPO/EMI 9th which sounds very good for its age, will show you how far these 90 minute modern versions have strayed from M9s played closer to Mahlers own time

PerfectWagnerite

Quote from: DarkAngel on December 18, 2007, 04:42:40 PM

You should also for reference get the 1938 Walter/VPO/EMI which sounds very good for its age, will show you how far these 90 minute modern versions have strayed from M9s played closer to Mahlers own time
AN interesting version, but the playing is atrocious. Any modern day orchestra would be ashamed to have a record with so many balance and intonation problems.

head-case

Quote from: Drasko on December 18, 2007, 12:09:06 PM
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00008LDN6

or

http://www.amazon.de/Mahler-Symphonie-Nr-Georg-Solti/dp/B00008LDN6

Oh dear, you have to be one search virtuous to pull that one out of Amazon.com.  Their listing does not include the word Mahler, Solti, or London Symphony Orchestra, only "Sinfonie 9".  Nice that it is at least available in Europe, I might try my luck with Amazon even they say it is "temporarily out of stock."