Author Topic: The Lachenmann Lacuna  (Read 25762 times)

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Offline Mandryka

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #140 on: March 02, 2018, 03:49:01 AM »


A wonderfully performed, amazingly well recorded, live Grido from Arditti here.
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Offline Joaquimhock

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #141 on: June 07, 2018, 08:38:55 PM »
Lachenmann's latest work "My Melodies" for 8 horns and orchestra wioll be live treamed this evening (8 PM CET)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UQSMBE7ybk

I hope someone will save it.
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Offline Joaquimhock

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #142 on: June 08, 2018, 09:42:59 PM »
The concert is here.

It was fun ;-) My melodies is Lachenmann at his best I think. Something as great as Tanzsuite mit Deutschlandlied probably...

He sais that there is no "melodies" of course but that the title has to be understood like "my way".

https://www.br-klassik.de/concert/ausstrahlung-1382388.html
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Offline some guy

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #143 on: June 13, 2018, 06:52:10 AM »
Lovely piece, that. My Melodies.

Thanks for the link!!

He's been so quiet lately. Good to know that he's back to work, again. (We never give artists breaks, do we? Finish one thing? Well, do another then. And another. Don't stop until you die. And, speaking of which, no dying, either.)



Offline Mandryka

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #144 on: June 13, 2018, 07:02:07 AM »
Lovely piece, that. My Melodies.



Yes I agree with you.
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Offline CRCulver

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #145 on: June 13, 2018, 08:42:26 AM »
He's been so quiet lately.

There was that considerable hiatus after Concertini. When I heard that piece, I felt he was drawing too close to the work of the younger composers inspired by him. I wondered if the slowing down of his output was due to a need to search for some direction where, he felt, he was still purely his own voice in what was now a more crowded landscape.

ComposerOfAvantGarde

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #146 on: June 13, 2018, 03:47:02 PM »
I listened to My Melodies recently. Lovely piece that's for sure, with all the lush and hushed orchestral sounds mixed with bursts of blazing orchestral (and horn) colour throughout. I've been reading a series of articles about him and by him in the contemporary music review from a while back, and it's fascinating to read about his very 'historical' approach to composition; he has a real sense of the placement of his music in time, for what audience and the relationship his music has with other cultures and time periods.

Offline vers la flamme

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #147 on: April 11, 2020, 06:40:35 PM »
Bump for a great living composer...

I just purchased the JACK Quartet playing Lachenmann's three string quartets, on the strength of "Gran Torso", a fascinating work. I was looking at the Arditti, but it's tough to find—plus consensus seems to hold the younger JACKs as a higher recommendation. I'm sure one couldn't go wrong either way.

I have heard a few sources describe his music as “instrumental musique concrète”. What does that mean to you? Is it even possible?

Anyway, what are some other interesting works of his? Anyone listening to Lachenmann lately?
« Last Edit: April 11, 2020, 06:46:56 PM by vers la flamme »

Offline Mandryka

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #148 on: April 11, 2020, 11:45:39 PM »
Musique Concrète because some of the music sounds like a collage of noises made with instruments, rather than a structured ensemble of standard instrumental sounds.

I’ve been listening to a quartet, Grido.


One thing about Jack is that they take longer than anyone else for each quartet.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2020, 11:50:30 PM by Mandryka »
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Offline CRCulver

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #149 on: April 12, 2020, 09:45:17 AM »
I have tried to enjoy these Arditti recordings of the string quartets, but I can't help feeling that the visual drama – that these sounds are coming from doing very unusual things to the four string instruments – is an integral part of the works, and we just don't get that on CD.

There are other Lachenmann works which I find more satisfying as purely audio experiences. They offer engaging timbres and interplay even if you cannot see the performers. But in the case of the quartets the sounds alone are just so much empty rustling.

Offline vers la flamme

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #150 on: April 12, 2020, 09:48:08 AM »
There are other Lachenmann works which I find more satisfying as purely audio experiences. They offer engaging timbres and interplay even if you cannot see the performers.

Which others?

But in the case of the quartets the sounds alone are just so much empty rustling.

I wonder if that's true. I suppose I will find out soon enough, but I got a kick out of Gran Torso the one time I listened to it.

Offline CRCulver

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #151 on: April 12, 2020, 10:23:56 AM »
Off the top of my head, as Lachenmann works which I find satisfying home listening I can point to those Lachenmann pieces recorded on ECM (Manfred Eicher was wise to choose pieces accessible to a wide audience), as well as Ausklang, Salut für Caudwell and Concertini.

Offline vers la flamme

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #152 on: April 12, 2020, 10:38:49 AM »
Off the top of my head, as Lachenmann works which I find satisfying home listening I can point to those Lachenmann pieces recorded on ECM (Manfred Eicher was wise to choose pieces accessible to a wide audience), as well as Ausklang, Salut für Caudwell and Concertini.

Thanks! I'll look into some of those ECM Lachenmann discs.

Offline Mandryka

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #153 on: April 12, 2020, 10:42:45 AM »
I have tried to enjoy these Arditti recordings of the string quartets, but I can't help feeling that the visual drama – that these sounds are coming from doing very unusual things to the four string instruments – is an integral part of the works, and we just don't get that on CD.


I'm sure this is true for Gran Torso, but Grido seems to me a much more interesting work musically -- you don't need the visual drama, and anyway I'm not sure that much is going on in it.

Here's The Gran Torso Show

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/YBhjMg_3HO0" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/YBhjMg_3HO0</a>
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Offline edward

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #154 on: April 12, 2020, 01:24:31 PM »
Agree with the visual side of things. Something like Pression isn't the same as a purely auditory experience (I've been lucky enough to hear quite a bit of Lachenmann live, and his music really is a different beast entirely in live performance.)

Some other pieces I think come off well without the visuals would include Harmonica, Accanto and of course Tanzsuite mit Deutschlandlied: the orchestral pieces do come off pretty well without for the most part.

FWIW, My Melodies is up on the free Berliner Philharmoniker Concert Hall Live right now. it's definitely worth a watch: I'm hoping a commercial recording will follow.
"I don't at all mind actively disliking a piece of contemporary music, but in order to feel happy about it I must consciously understand why I dislike it. Otherwise it remains in my mind as unfinished business."
 -- Aaron Copland, The Pleasures of Music

Offline edward

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #155 on: April 25, 2020, 12:01:30 PM »
Trio Accanto has a new CD ("Other Stories") that contains four short Lachenmann pieces (Sakura-Variationen and its expanded version Sakura mit Berliner Luft, Berliner Kirschbluten and the piano version of Marche Fatale). It may be of interest to Lachenmann completists, or those who want to hear him writing tonal music, but none of them are exactly major works.

I do think the piano version of Marche Fatale works better than the orchestral one--the overt references to the Romantic piano tradition make more sense here--but honestly that's not saying much.

Also on the disc: short pieces by Martin Schuttler, Yu Kawabara, Martin Smolka and a more substantial one by Michael Finnissy. It's available for download now and physical media next month.
"I don't at all mind actively disliking a piece of contemporary music, but in order to feel happy about it I must consciously understand why I dislike it. Otherwise it remains in my mind as unfinished business."
 -- Aaron Copland, The Pleasures of Music

Offline Mandryka

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #156 on: April 25, 2020, 12:19:31 PM »
Berliner Kurschblüten is a piece in two parts. A is a set of variations in a more or less jazzy jolly popular idiom. It’s a very nicely  done parody.  And them there’s part B, which starts about 90 seconds before the end - the piece is 4 minutes all in all. Part B is just one deep chord  repeated, slightly threatening, slightly mystical (think those chords at the end of the Liszt sonata or Beethoven op 109) 


Sakura Variations is also mostly jolly and popular, with occasional glimpses of non standard instrumental sounds and more sophisticated brief connecting passages, including one very disturbing one with something like that repeated chord in Berliner Kurschbluten, about 90 seconds before the end.

Are these things gratuitous? Is seems to be crying out to be meaningful but it’s hard to give it anything but the most glib meaning (the end of the world is nigh sort of thing.) Lachenmann himself talks about transitoriness, I need time to understand it.   

The transition from Berliner Kirschblüten to FFF (by Martin Smolka), which is done attacca on the CD, is unforgettable and worth the price of admission alone.

The thing is now on Qobuz and sounds much better than the Spotify stream.

http://www.trio-accanto.com/more/notes-on-invidiual-pieces/lachenmann-sakura.html
« Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 12:34:52 PM by Mandryka »
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Offline edward

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #157 on: April 25, 2020, 12:36:52 PM »
Are these things gratuitous? Is seems to be crying out to be meaningful but it’s hard to give it anything but the most glib meaning (the end of the world is nigh sort of thing.) Lachenmann himself talks about transitoriness, I need time to understand it.   
My single biggest problem with these pieces is that Bernd Alois Zimmermann did all of this far better--and far more disturbingly--in the 1960s.

I'm not used to Lachenmann-as-pale-imitation-of-his-predecessors.
"I don't at all mind actively disliking a piece of contemporary music, but in order to feel happy about it I must consciously understand why I dislike it. Otherwise it remains in my mind as unfinished business."
 -- Aaron Copland, The Pleasures of Music

Offline Mandryka

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #158 on: June 06, 2020, 07:50:10 AM »


I'm enjoying the pieces here, Got Lost, Streichtrio and Serynade. What else should I listen to? I'm not interested in symphonies or operas, I already know the quartets.
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Offline Mandryka

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Re: The Lachenmann Lacuna
« Reply #159 on: June 19, 2020, 12:11:26 AM »
What’s the essential difference between Got Lost and Tema?
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