Mahler symphonies - help

[MishaK]

Well there's no consensus to be found on great Mahler!  Guess the best approach is to randomly buy recordings until one figures what conductors one likes.

What are you talking about? Sarge and I reached consensus quite nicely. What more do you need? 

[RebLem]

My advice is to get a complete set and move on from there.  I would suggest either the Segerstam, which just blew me away when I heard it recently, or the older, but still excellent sound, Kubelid cycle.  I have 14 complete sets, btw, including all those mentioned here, and these are, IMO, the two best.

[Sergeant Rock]

blumine is a good piece of music, just as long as it's not heard in context of the 1st symphony, but as a stand alone piece, it's wonderful.

If you consider the First programmatically, I think it works very well in context of the complete symphony. First movement the world blossoms into life again. Second movement a late afternoon walk through gorgeous Spring meadows before going to the third movement dance that evening. It works the way the Second's second movement works: as a peaceful interlude.

Sarge

[Sergeant Rock]

What are you talking about? Sarge and I reached consensus quite nicely. What more do you need? 

Exactly. I'm utterly amazed the rest of you aren't running out this very moment to buy our recommendations. My god, we have such infallible and perfect taste it takes my breath away 

Sarge

[knight66]

What I need taken away is my plastic.

Mike

[Harry]

What I need taken away is my plastic.

Mike

Thy will be done.
Urgent call for missus Mike!

[AnthonyAthletic]

and don't forget that there will be new conductors in the future.

Gergiev apparantly is about to embark on the Mahler Canon, I think on Philips not with the LSO Live which would have been much better, live and pricewise 

Not sure what to expect though with Gergiev doing Mahler.  Shostakovich/Prokofiev excellent...so who knows?

[SimonGodders]

What do the Mahlerites think of Haitink's Christmas Concert box set with symphonies 1,2,3,4,5,7,9?

[AnthonyAthletic]

What do the Mahlerites think of Haitink's Christmas Concert box set with symphonies 1,2,3,4,5,7,9?

Very good indeed, the 3rd outstanding from the onset of the snarling drums.  Holds up very well against his Studio set, but I prefer his 5th and 9th Studio to the live Xmas concerts.

Would have been nice to see those concerts live, give me Mahler at Christmas before sprawling New Year Strauss Waltzes anyday of the Season 

I don't think I could sit through another NYD concert, trite shite at its finest...almost as bad and inane as the Last Night of the Prams 

[bhodges]

What do the Mahlerites think of Haitink's Christmas Concert box set with symphonies 1,2,3,4,5,7,9?

I love the set, but then I love live recordings in general.  (And I haven't yet done an "A/B" comparison with Haitink's studio recordings, which I also like.)  And I totally agree with Tony: the people who were at these concerts got an absolutely splendid Christmas Day treat.

--Bruce

[Steve]

What do the Mahlerites think of Haitink's Christmas Concert box set with symphonies 1,2,3,4,5,7,9?

It took quite awhile for me appreciate Haitnik's Mahler recordings, but now that I have, particularily #4 and #5, I would reccomend him easily. I would purhcase without hesitation. 

[SimonGodders]

Thanks for replies, it's being sold cheaply here if anyone is interested:

http://www.kuijperklassiek.nl/

(you need to put Haitink into the search engine and scroll about half way down the page)

[Bunny]

What do the Mahlerites think of Haitink's Christmas Concert box set with symphonies 1,2,3,4,5,7,9?

I haven't heard them but they are supposed to be superior to his studio recordings.

[Haffner]

I'm undecided. Both the Bernstein DG and Sony are mostly great. But if all you ever own are the Herbert Von Karajan performances, you're still doing good.

[Dancing Divertimentian]

I'm undecided. Both the Bernstein DG and Sony are mostly great. But if all you ever own are the Herbert Von Karajan performances, you're still doing good.

It would be nice if there were a clear-cut winner in the Mahler sweepstakes on records. But the body of quality recordings that merit attention is enormous! We are truly blessed with an abundance of choices.

All I can add is that Bernstein's DG is what introduced me to the greatness of Mahler. And despite numerous additions since then Bernstein still thrills.

In fact, I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Bernstein as a quality introduction to these symphonies. Yes, he may be more on the histrionic side but I've never found him so exaggerated that he leaves the 'core' of Mahler's concept behind.

The biggest advancement in the last few years might just be that so many recordings are graced with such peerless recorded sound vs. any perceived 'differences' in performances (I mean, since there's almost a surfeit of worthy performances). The Chailly cycle, in particular, is stunningly recorded, as is the nearly complete Tilson Thomas. The ongoing Fischer cycle is another one graced with SOTA sound. Zander's third I have is also beautifully recorded. As is Bychkov's third on Avie. And there are others.

What this means to me is I'm allowed a more microscopic look inside Mahler's music, which so far has yielded much pleasure. So this might be a consideration for the Mahler newbie.

But despite the somewhat dated sound of Bernstein DG, and the more opaque picture this creates of the music, if pushed I'd probably still give him the nod as the one "go to" set for an introduction to Mahler.

[val]

My preferrences regarding Mahler's Symphonies haven't changed lately:

In the First, Horenstein with the LSO, Walter with Columbia and Kubelik with the BRO.

In the 2nd, Klemperer (Philharmonia) because of his extraordinary first movement, Mehta with the VPO and Walter with the NYP (and the sublime Forrester in the Urlicht).

In the 3rd, Horenstein with the LSO, Charles Adler (KOnzertverein) and Haitink (with the Concertgebow and Forrester).

In the 4th, Szell with Cleveland, Walter with the VPO (and Seefried) and Reiner with Chicago.

In the 5th, Bernstein with the VPO, Solti with Chicago, Barbirolli (New Philharmonia).

In the 6th, Karajan (BPO) and Bernstein (VPO).

In the 7th, Bernstein with the NYP, Rattle with Birmingham (remarkable in the Nachtmusic).

In the 8th, Bernstein (VPO), Solti (Chicago), Kubelik (BRO).

In the 9th, Ancerl (CzPO), Karajan (BPO), Bernstein (BPO).

In the 10th (version D. Cooke), Rattle with Bournemouth. Regarding the only Adagio, Bernstein with the VPO.

[MishaK]

In the 5th,  ... Solti with Chicago ...

Which one? There are two on CD and a third on VHS.

In the 10th (version D. Cooke), Rattle with Bournemouth.

Is that really better than his later excellent effort with the BPO? That reminds me, there is a truly outstanding live performance of the 6th with Rattle and the BPO from one of his earliest guest appearances with the orchestra.

[Steve]

Which one? There are two on CD and a third on VHS.

Is that really better than his later excellent effort with the BPO? That reminds me, there is a truly outstanding live performance of the 6th with Rattle and the BPO from one of his earliest guest appearances with the orchestra.

I wasn't aware of two other Solti renditions of Mahler's 5th. The one I heard sounded drastically inferior to the Bernstein. Perhaps, I have not heard the right one?

[MishaK]

I wasn't aware of two other Solti renditions of Mahler's 5th. The one I heard sounded drastically inferior to the Bernstein. Perhaps, I have not heard the right one?

There is a 1970 analog recording on Decca, which is sonically inadequate, IMHO: congested, glassy sound and climaxes that max out the recording equipment. The performance itself is very virtuosic but never stops to smell the flowers. Vintage high-octane power-Solti. This one is included in Solti's complete Mahler set and was reissued numerous times, incl. as part of the Solti Edition. There is a 1990 digital recording also on Decca (has Solti on a pier on the cover - looks like he's walking on water) which was recorded live and includes applause. I find that one musically the most convincing of the three and it has the best sound. Then there is a 1986 live tour performance taped in Tokyo of which I have a VHS. I'm not sure if it appeared in other formats. I haven't heard it in a while (since I got rid of the VCR and TV), but recall it being well played but not quite wanting to get off the ground in places (jetlag?). The CSO also recorded the same work for DG around 1980, IIRC, in a vivid and compelling studio performance with Abbado. IMHO, the orchestra sounds best, though, on Barenboim's recording which was taped live by the WDR on tour in Cologne in 1997 or so and is available on CD from Teldec and DVD from Euroarts. It is such a richly colorful performance with perfect sectional balancing. Along with Chailly, Barshai and Kubelik one of my favorite Mahler 5ths. Much more convincing than either of Solti's efforts.

[Steve]

There is a 1970 analog recording on Decca, which is sonically inadequate, IMHO: congested, glassy sound and climaxes that max out the recording equipment. The performance itself is very virtuosic but never stops to smell the flowers. Vintage high-octane power-Solti. This one is included in Solti's complete Mahler set and was reissued numerous times, incl. as part of the Solti Edition. There is a 1990 digital recording also on Decca (has Solti on a pier on the cover - looks like he's walking on water) which was recorded live and includes applause. I find that one musically the most convincing of the three and it has the best sound. Then there is a 1986 live tour performance taped in Tokyo of which I have a VHS. I'm not sure if it appeared in other formats. I haven't heard it in a while (since I got rid of the VCR and TV), but recall it being well played but not quite wanting to get off the ground in places (jetlag?). The CSO also recorded the same work for DG around 1980, IIRC, in a vivid and compelling studio performance with Abbado. IMHO, the orchestra sounds best, though, on Barenboim's recording which was taped live by the WDR on tour in Cologne in 1997 or so and is available on CD from Teldec and DVD from Euroarts. It is such a richly colorful performance with perfect sectional balancing. Along with Chailly, Barshai and Kubelik one of my favorite Mahler 5ths. Much more convincing than either of Solti's efforts.

Thanks for the info, I believe I shall look into the 1990 version.