Haydn's Haus

[DavidW]

Eigenuser, I rec the Nelson Mass.

[kishnevi]

I don't know. Other than this one disk, they surprisingly stayed away from more Haydn. I haven't a clue what they are up to now, perhaps someone knows. That would be great!

If you're hepped by their Handel,  you'll probably get moshed by their Mozart--they did three or four Mozart CDs about the same time as that Haydn.   Their most recent releases, however, seem to be 19th century oriented, sometimes very late 19th century (Debussy).

I've been trying to expand my listening habits and since I love 20th century music so much (my trio is Bartok, Ravel, and Ligeti  ) I've been listening to more and more "modern" stuff. I've found actually quite a lot that I like, but I realized that I should look back, too. There seems to be an enthusiastic group of Haydn fans on this board so I figure that I should give him a shot. I listened to one of the Haydn "Composer of the Week" podcasts from BBC Radio3 and enjoyed some of the samples of music played there. I don't care much for Mozart, but Haydn seemed much more interesting. His melodies seemed less "straightforward", or at least that was the impression that I got. I also understand that he was considerably experimental in his time. Can anyone here recommend a few of his symphonies or concertos that I might possibly enjoy and/or that would be a good starting place? I'm more interested in larger-scale works than chamber music literature.

well, he wrote more than  a hundred symphonies, and they're all good, so it's hard to pick out one or two to use as introductions.  May as well bite the bullet and get the complete sets!  But for someone in your position, I'd suggest two groups; the so called  'Sturm und Drang"  from his middle period, and the :"London" symphonies for the end of his career.   There's actually loads more--the string quartets, the piano trios, the choral works--but let's not bite off more than you can chew at once.

[EigenUser]

Eigenuser, I rec the Nelson Mass.

Thanks! This was one of the samples played -- from the Kyrie. And the lyrics are the same as Ligeti's!   

well, he wrote more than  a hundred symphonies, and they're all good, so it's hard to pick out one or two to use as introductions.  May as well bite the bullet and get the complete sets!  But for someone in your position, I'd suggest two groups; the so called  'Sturm und Drang"  from his middle period, and the :"London" symphonies for the end of his career.   There's actually loads more--the string quartets, the piano trios, the choral works--but let's not bite off more than you can chew at once.

Thanks! When I was in high school, our orchestra played an easy string orchestra arrangement of the finale from 88. I remember really not liking it until our conductor explained/pointed out some of the compositional techniques of his. I grew to appreciate it after this, but never really listened to it on my own.

[Roberto]

I've been trying to expand my listening habits and since I love 20th century music so much (my trio is Bartok, Ravel, and Ligeti  ) I'm more interested in larger-scale works than chamber music literature.

Bartók is my second favorite composer (and I like Ligeti too).  I would suggest the two last oratorios with the Freiburgers and René Jacobs. I love them and they are truly large-scale.

[Gurn Blanston]

Thanks! This was one of the samples played -- from the Kyrie. And the lyrics are the same as Ligeti's!   

Thanks! When I was in high school, our orchestra played an easy string orchestra arrangement of the finale from 88. I remember really not liking it until our conductor explained/pointed out some of the compositional techniques of his. I grew to appreciate it after this, but never really listened to it on my own.

Hard to know what you might or might not like. As Jeffrey says, the middle period and the late period are good starting places for the symphonies. The difficult part is what ensemble types you might prefer. I only know PI, so if you only like Big Band, this will be useless for you.

We have been discussing this disk lately. It is a perfect introduction to middle period Haydn:



Then, in the late period;


This is a double set with 5 symphonies, 88-92. Very finely played.

I base these recs on the premise you listen to disks. These are both readily available. It's pointless to rec something where you have to fly Air Malaysia to go to a CD shop down a dark alleyway to get the last of the trhee copies made...

But if you stream or download, there are more possibilities.

Let us know how you are getting on with these. Even if you hate them, we won't hurt you here, we are a large umbrella at Da Haus. 

[TheGSMoeller]

Just purchased my 13th (I think  ) recording of the 45th. This time from Koopman and the Amsterdam Baroque Orchestra. Haven't really heard any samples from this recording, but have a good amount from Koopman and the ABO to know it should be a good one. I really find myself charmed by their disc of Haydn's symphonies Nos. 97 and 98, crisp and lively tempos, and nice detail that is presented from the winds, although that disc is on a different label (Challenge).
Oh, and Nos. 44 and 49 are on this one, which I think help round out a great trio of pieces as they are some of the more unique ones from Haydn.

Finally arrived. Started with No.44, which was really good. Great sound from Erato, with a strong wind presence which is important to me. Only partially into No.45, I've noticed the tempos are never rushed, which supports the exemplary clarity the ABO demonstrates. Will stay close to the player for a while, a real winner.

[Gurn Blanston]

Finally arrived. Started with No.44, which was really good. Great sound from Erato, with a strong wind presence which is important to me. Only partially into No.45, I've noticed the tempos are never rushed, which supports the exemplary clarity the ABO demonstrates. Will stay close to the player for a while, a real winner.

I was pretty sure you would like that, Greg. The #49 on there may be the best of the bunch too. I wish they had done more of the early ones, this is where they shine, IMO. 

[Gurn Blanston]

I know I don't have a lot of companions to listen to Haydn's operas with, so I dug into some background information to give a taste of life in 1770. Check it our if you would, I'd be pleased to discuss.

Just a few of my closest friends were invited!

Thanks for your interest!

[Justin]

Bought this last night - very enjoyable! Now I'm tempted to start collecting the Wiener Philharmonic Trio's discs of Haydn string trios, although they seem a bit spendy and hard to come by.

[asin]B000CAKZJO[/asin]

[chasmaniac]

Now I'm tempted to start collecting the Wiener Philharmonic Trio's discs of Haydn string trios, although they seem a bit spendy and hard to come by.

Hard to come by, but recommended. There are 6 discs in that series on Camerata.

[Gurn Blanston]

Bought this last night - very enjoyable! Now I'm tempted to start collecting the Wiener Philharmonic Trio's discs of Haydn string trios, although they seem a bit spendy and hard to come by.

[asin]B000CAKZJO[/asin]

Hi, Justin. First, get volume 2 of the set you started. I'm dubious they will finish the cycle ( ) but you never know, and it really is fine.

The Vienna Philharmonic Trio is an excellent set too, albeit on modern instruments. They do all but 1 of the certainly authentic and probably authentic works. There has recently been a small surge of recordings made available from Japan. There were a few of them at BRO, worth checking out. Arkiv had them for full price. By that time I only needed 2, so $20 each didn't seem as bad as when I needed all 6 of them.   

As nearly as I can tell, these 8 disks would make up the entirety of the recordings of the string trios. Which sucks because they are fine works, nothing lame or beginnerish about them. Many of them I like better than the bulk of the early quartets, as far as that goes.

[HIPster]

The Linde Consort disc arrived on Saturday and I've had the opportunity to listen to it all the way through several times now.

An absolutely stellar recording! 
[asin]B000025KIE[/asin]

I love that Linde disk. It is all early stuff, like mid to late 1750's, very well played. It's a long way from the London Symphonies, but sometimes that's a good thing.

Thanks Gurn!  Yes, it is a really great disc.  Funny thing is, the seller sent me the older edition: the 'Reflexe' version; in many cases I'd perhaps contact the seller and let them know of my disappointment.  In this case, however, I am just thrilled, as the disc itself was manufactured in Japan (much like the other Linde CD I have, of Bach's Brandenburg Concertos).   

So, now the question is: do I need the BIS set of Divertimenti? 

I note your excellent review of that set on amazon!  Nice.

[Gurn Blanston]

The Linde Consort disc arrived on Saturday and I've had the opportunity to listen to it all the way through several times now.

An absolutely stellar recording! 
[asin]B000025KIE[/asin]

Thanks Gurn!  Yes, it is a really great disc.  Funny thing is, the seller sent me the older edition: the 'Reflexe' version; in many cases I'd perhaps contact the seller and let them know of my disappointment.  In this case, however, I am just thrilled, as the disc itself was manufactured in Japan (much like the other Linde CD I have, of Bach's Brandenburg Concertos).   

So, now the question is: do I need the BIS set of Divertimenti? 

I note your excellent review of that set on amazon!  Nice.

Excellent, delighted you like it. I am very fond of Haydn's early works. Some write about them being similar to Late Baroque works as though it's a bad thing! Lindé is a very fine flautist, is it not so?

[Gurn Blanston]

Thanks Gurn!  Yes, it is a really great disc.  Funny thing is, the seller sent me the older edition: the 'Reflexe' version; in many cases I'd perhaps contact the seller and let them know of my disappointment.  In this case, however, I am just thrilled, as the disc itself was manufactured in Japan (much like the other Linde CD I have, of Bach's Brandenburg Concertos).   

So, now the question is: do I need the BIS set of Divertimenti? 

I note your excellent review of that set on amazon!  Nice.

Oops, stopped at the picture! 

Well, that is an interesting question. This is one really fine box set, and probably the only set available which has all of the authentic works on it and none of the 'attributeds'. As with the works on the Linde disk, they are of a similar style, clearly Haydn developed his 'signature sound' early times. As I mentioned in the last post, I am very keen on the early works. Also though, you would find a fine version of the first violin concerto, and a couple of marches from later on which you would likely not hear otherwise. Small works but nice. It is not just the completist in me that drove me to buy that set, it is the music itself, rarely heard and even more rarely recorded. If I had $60 burning a hole in my pocket, I would spend it on that before getting my third set of Bach cantatas...   

[HIPster]

Excellent, delighted you like it. I am very fond of Haydn's early works. Some write about them being similar to Late Baroque works as though it's a bad thing! Lindé is a very fine flautist, is it not so?

Yes, Linde is very fine, both as a flautist and leader.  So stoked that I purchased this one! 

I'm in full agreement with you on Haydn's early works too.  A true selling point for me is that they have that Late Baroque quality to them.   

I think my next Haydn purchase is going to be the Pinnock Concertos disc:
[asin]B0000057DU[/asin]

I've been eyeing this one for quite a while now.

[Gurn Blanston]

Yes, Linde is very fine, both as a flautist and leader.  So stoked that I purchased this one! 

I'm in full agreement with you on Haydn's early works too.  A true selling point for me is that they have that Late Baroque quality to them.   

I think my next Haydn purchase is going to be the Pinnock Concertos disc:

I've been eyeing this one for quite a while now.

I like that Pinnock disk, with just a reservation or two; the oboe concerto is not by Haydn, so a third of the disk is used up by an attribution. That said, it is a fine concerto, no matter who write it. Feder says the manuscript has the name "H.....r" underneath the Haydn which was added later. Also, the putative date of 1800 is pretty risky. He was pretty tied up at the time in other things.

The trumpet concerto is one of my favorite versions. Mark Bennett really plays it well. Keyed trumpet is pretty challenging, as you can hear in other versions!

The harpsichord concerto is also very nicely done. It was probably my favorite until supplanted by Immerseel. I've always liked Pinnock's harpsichord work in Bach, and he doesn't disappoint here.

Anyway, I think this is money well-spent too. You might also be happy with Hogwood's similar disk:

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It has the trumpet concerto too, plus the horn concerto #1 (really nice!) and organ concerto Hob 18:1 in C, Haydn's earliest major concerto (1756). Other than giving you a really nice alternative to the already nice trumpet concerto, it gives you 2 other ones you don't have, both early (1756 & 1762). 

Cheers,

[HIPster]

Thanks Gurn!

Very helpful. 

I have also been looking at Hogwood's too, of course.  Both seem mandatory in this case! 

The Hogwood/Coin is also right up there too for me. . .

[Gurn Blanston]

Thanks Gurn!

Very helpful. 

I have also been looking at Hogwood's too, of course.  Both seem mandatory in this case! 

The Hogwood/Coin is also right up there too for me. . .

Absolutely! I am inordinately fond of that disk. My favorites are both on DHM (Bylsma and Suzuki), but there are so many nice choices out there it is hard to pick just one.

This one here is a nice alternative:

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A tad pricey nowadays but they used to give it away (so to speak). Queyras was a beautiful tone and really plays the heck out of these. Freiburg Baroque is... Freiburg Baroque, which is to say, excellent.

I hate these dilemmas, they play right into my CDCDCD!

[Wakefield]

Some days ago, I discovered this disk of Haydn's arias titled "Ladies First!".

I think the operatic field still remains as the part of Haydn's output less successfully addressed; but when I listened to this disk (through Spotify before ordering), I thought this is the way to follow.

Lisa Larsson is an excellent  singer (great voice and expressiveness) and the Combattimento Consort Amsterdam is really in top form, playing with a sort of superb ferocity.

I don't know the specifics of the instruments involved, but the Combattimento is usually a MI orchestra (sometimes adding some specific PI). IMO, it would be a huge mistake to discard this disk because of this fact (MI, I mean).

[asin]B00FP0LHCU[/asin] 

[Gurn Blanston]

Some days ago, I discovered this disk of Haydn's arias titled "Ladies First!".

I think the operatic field still remains as the part of Haydn's output less successfully addressed; but when I listened to this disk (through Spotify before ordering), I thought this is the way to follow.

Lisa Larsson is an excellent  singer (great voice and expressiveness) and the Combattimento Consort Amsterdam is really in top form, playing with a sort of superb ferocity.

I don't know the specifics of the instruments involved, but the Combattimento is usually a MI orchestra (sometimes adding some specific PI). IMO, it would be a huge mistake to discard this disk because of this fact (MI, I mean).

[asin]B00FP0LHCU[/asin] 

Thanks for the pointer, Gordo! That looks interesting. Even though I have the recital disks by Nuria Rial, Bonitatibus and the Huss 'Opera at Eszterházy' among others like Quasthoff and Augér, I don't know that one can cover the breadth of Haydn's operatic writings in just a few disks! I'll have to put this one on the list.