Pierre Boulez (1925-2016)

[CRCulver]

I have expressed my view on this subject more often than should have been necessary.  I would hope that you could "get" my point even if you don't agree with it, maybe even acknowledge its validity while still maintaining that, in your judgment, future generations will evolve to share your refined and advanced tastes and agree with you in anointing Boulez as one of the demigods of Western music.

When I say that history has already judged Boulez, I do not say that he will go down as some kind of demigod of Western music. "Classical music", or "art music" or whatever you want to call it is now a very niche thing in Western culture and we can't really expect any composer to really stand for the age like Mozart or Beethoven. But that Boulez has already had a measurable impact on his own little genre, inspiring other composers in that little genre, is true regardless.

[rappy]

However I think Boulez as a composer is greater then Hindemith, but one can argue in favor of Hindemith, that it for him it was about the music only (and not about progressive, and therefore somewhat artificial, musical ideas). To say it in another way: I think composer who had progressive musical ideas are less authentic then composer for who it was about their own music in the first place. Composers like Boulez and Schoenberg can better be regarded as leading figures of movements in music.

For that reason I think Schönberg IS a first-rate composer when you consider the pieces he did NOT write for the sake of presenting new ideas, e.g. Op. 9 (although I really like Op. 25, too).

[DavidRoss]

When I say that history has already judged Boulez, I do not say that he will go down as some kind of demigod of Western music. "Classical music", or "art music" or whatever you want to call it is now a very niche thing in Western culture and we can't really expect any composer to really stand for the age like Mozart or Beethoven. But that Boulez has already had a measurable impact on his own little genre, inspiring other composers in that little genre, is true regardless.

It was not you to whom I addressed that comment.  It does seem to me that there is a significant sect that still worships at the feet of Schoenberg and very much thinks he "stands for the age."  There are even some who believe the same of Stockhausen, incredible though that might be.  This at a time, the 20th Century, characterized by an "anything goes" spirit of the age.

I don't think anyone is claiming that Boulez has not "already had a measurable impact on his own little genre, inspiring other composers in that little genre."  That seems like a fair statement.  Thank you.

[karlhenning]

Crikey! Did you hear that Boulez died yesterday?!

[karlhenning]

Oh, sorry! That was Tom Bosley . . . .

[greg]

You almost gave me a heart attack...

[karlhenning]

You almost gave me a heart attack...

Sorry! My fervent musical imagination inadvertently inverted a rotation of Bosley and the result was Boulez. Mistake any composer might make ; )

[karlhenning]

Hey, here's a weird satellite orbiting Planet Boulez!

[karlhenning]

Boulez Conducts Boulez was one of the first of the Sony reissue boxes I snaffled up . . . but I don't think I listened to Livre pour cordes until this morning.

From the liner notes:

Another seemingly constant work-in-progress is Livre pour cordes (Book for strings), derived from the withdrawn Livre pour quatuor (Book for string quartet) of 1948-49. In 1968 Boulez arranged two movements of this ultra-complex early string quartet for string orchestra (he has since re-worked the material again, combining the two movements into one).

[DavidW]

I have to say that is the stupidest project (the Austin TX affair) that I've heard of.  Destroy Britney Spears not Pierre Boulez.  He is a great conductor and composer whose main fault is that he could never close his mouth.

[karlhenning]

Actually, I see I have two.




It seemed like it was worth the risk because I found them both used for very cheap.

Psst, how is it going? (For the record, I picked up the Sur incises disc cheap, too.)

[karlhenning]

I have to say that is the stupidest project (the Austin TX affair) that I've heard of.  Destroy Britney Spears not Pierre Boulez.  He is a great conductor and composer whose main fault is that he could never close his mouth.

It does look silly, though on the face of it, one isn't quite sure if it is an act of hostility or of homage to Boulez . . . .

[DavidW]

It does look silly, though on the face of it, one isn't quite sure if it is an act of hostility or of homage to Boulez . . . .

I didn't think of it that way!   Good point.

[bhodges]

Believe me, Austin, Texas is hardly "provincial." 

And as far as that "Boulez-destruction project" goes, looking at the website (and it's [sic] 'contribuotrs'), my first reaction was that everyone involved probably adores Boulez, and that this was a rather tongue-in-cheek event.

--Bruce

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

I have to say that I have found Boulez to be not particularly scary or edgy as a composer, despite his avant-garde rep. In fact, the sleek, pretty, passionless impression that his music leaves, while quite pleasant, seldom tempts me to dig deeper. For this reason, the only Boulez disc I've kept is Repons, and I suspect that's mainly because I find the spatial effects quite groovy.

Who was it said that Boulez's music was "pretty monotonous and monotonously pretty"?

[karlhenning]

I have to say that I have found Boulez to be not particularly scary or edgy as a composer, despite his avant-garde rep.

No, indeed! His bullhorn is scarier than his work, and even that, well . . . .

[karlhenning]

Who was it said that Boulez's music was "pretty monotonous and monotonously pretty"?

It was in one of the Stravinsky conversation books, so one isn't sure just how firm the attribution might be ; )

[karlhenning]

Separated at birth?

[MN Dave]

[greg]

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH ALREADY

with this moderator condoned harassment

At the rate you people are going there will be no one left on this site other than a couple of internet "composers"
And unpaid bills for site owners who have alienated all possible music lovers

(The quality of the music is not the only difference between a Pierre Boulez and an internet "composer."
A Boulez can scorn criticism - internet mediocrities suppress it.)

Umm.... wtf?