Please Suggest a CD Set of Tchaikovsky 4, 5, 6

[uffeviking]

Nande ya nen:

 

[FredT]

It ain't for the faint of heart but Mravinsky on DG...electrifying!

[sidoze]

Kondrashin in Japan for 6. No other finale comes close to this one for vehemence and intensity.

[Brian]

Based on hornteacher's original post, looking for a newish digital version - go for Gatti! I recently got all three from eMusic and can't stop listening. Superb accounts, especially of the Capriccio Italien; if you'd like to hear a ten-minute sample of the Symphony No 5, look for my recent "Name That Orchestra" thread and listen to clip #3. A terrific account of the Tchaikovsky, very different to be sure, but very well thought-out and incredibly well-played.

[Renfield]

Assuming you're asking for a modern recording, I can't think of anything more "central" to recommend than either of the Karajan/BPO DG sets of the last three symphonies (from the 60's and the 70's, respectively). The EMI one mentioned above has bad sound (IMO).

If you enjoy a little "lilt" from the orchestra and some extra "spaciousness" of performance, but can tolerate slightly strange sound, I can also recommend his (Karajan's) late recordings with the Vienna Philharmonic, though they're not in one set.

And I also second Bernstein. But definitely, absolutely and categorically not as a "central" recommendation. Only if you appreciate his style.


Apart from those, the "usual suspects" (Pletnev, Mutti, also Jansons) are all game, as well. Not in the same scale as the above, for modern(-ish) recordings of Tchaikovsky's last three symphonies; but very good indeed, in my view.


Edit: Let me clarify that it's the second DG Karajan/BPO set that would qualify as "modern" - the earlier one is "modernish".

[Bonehelm]

Assuming you're asking for a modern recording, I can't think of anything more "central" to recommend than either of the Karajan/BPO DG sets of the last three symphonies (from the 60's and the 70's, respectively). The EMI one mentioned above has bad sound (IMO).

If you enjoy a little "lilt" from the orchestra and some extra "spaciousness" of performance, but can tolerate slightly strange sound, I can also recommend his (Karajan's) late recordings with the Vienna Philharmonic, though they're not in one set.

And I also second Bernstein. But definitely, absolutely and categorically not as a "central" recommendation. Only if you appreciate his style.


Apart from those, the "usual suspects" (Pletnev, Mutti, also Jansons) are all game, as well. Not in the same scale as the above, for modern(-ish) recordings of Tchaikovsky's last three symphonies; but very good indeed, in my view.


Edit: Let me clarify that it's the second DG Karajan/BPO set that would qualify as "modern" - the earlier one is "modernish".

I find Karajan's late DG recordings with the VPO to be reverberant and spacious...more so than his earlier stuff , like the '62 LvB cycle for example.

[Renfield]

I find Karajan's late DG recordings with the VPO to be reverberant and spacious...more so than his earlier stuff , like the '62 LvB cycle for example.

Indeed, so do I. The "strangeness" of the recording I mention has more to do with the general early(ish) "digitalness" of the sound.

All with a pinch of salt, of course: recorded sound quality can be a very relative thing.

[DavidW]

Indeed, so do I. The "strangeness" of the recording I mention has more to do with the general early(ish) "digitalness" of the sound.

All with a pinch of salt, of course: recorded sound quality can be a very relative thing.

It has to do with the mike placement, not "digitalness".

[Renfield]

It has to do with the mike placement, not "digitalness".

Obviously, such a thing as "digitalness" doesn't actually exist. I just used it as a placeholder for "early use of a new technique" - unless it's a coincidence that almost all of Karajan's digital recordings bar the very last ones seem to have a strange sound to them.

But of course, the reason itself that I used a placeholder-term like "digitalness" is that I'm no audio engineer, I can only gauge if I like the end-result, with any sort of accuracy. If it was the microphone placement, so be it.

[M forever]

I would like to hear a clip or two, but not lower than 320kbps, please (if you do mp3, flac would be preferred but is not absolutely necessary).

[Brian]

For the enjoyment of the forum and the perusal of those looking for a CD recommendation, here is a ten-minute clip from the Daniele Gatti recording of Tchaikovsky's Fifth Symphony. The clip covers portions of the first and second movements, and was used in my Name That Orchestra competition last month (so some of you have already heard it). 320kbps (to my knowledge)

[Bunny]

From a quick comparison of the three clips: The sonics on the Gatti are far better than the older recordings -- clearer, more space, complete absence of hiss or any other background noise,  better orchestral balances, etc. 

I cannot judge the performances, I don't have both sets. 

There is a review I read some time ago about the Gatti Tchaik 5th, which states that Gatti has followed (or attempted to follow) the score's original metronome markings which is not the case in any other (previous) recordings.  As I'm not an expert in this field, I leave it for the true cognoscenti to parse this out.  Here's a link to the review by Mark Jordan.

[Bunny]

wouldn't that be a little unfair? judging that the dorati recordings were made in 1965? Plus, i didn't upload these clips so you can go compare them with Gatti, I uploaded them so you all judge the merits of this recording, you know, the sound (taking in account the age), and the interpretation.

I wasn't trying to be fair or unfair.  I merely made a comparison on the basis of sound quality alone because the sound quality of the Mercury recordings was being touted for it's excellence.  I listened to the recordings and I didn't find that the older sound really comes up to the standard of modern recordings.  If one is going to be interested in these recordings, one should understand that they are antique technology that may not hold up to comparison with more modern recordings.  They therefore should be judged more on the merits of the performances.  I am not stating an opinion on the performances because I don't own the recordings and cannot give them the attention needed to make a judgment.

who cares? Since when is the merits of a performance is so heavily depended upon "original tempo"?

With respect to the review I cited: The review is not something that I feel competent to discuss in depth.  I had hoped that those more knowledgeable would be able to discuss this dispassionately.  However, discussion of composer's tempo markings and how conductors have used (or not used them) is a very pertinent subject for discussion.  Only look at how Beethoven performance has changed with the re-examination of the composer's markings!  I don't doubt that Tchaikovsky is a composer whose works will also benefit in performance from more careful examination of his tempo markings as well. 

oh, btw, so far only about 3-5 people have downloaded the clips, i will host them up there until friday, which is tomorrow, so download them while you can, they won't be there after tomorrow!

Watch out, more people may get the opportunity to compare the sound quality of those recordings to others. 

[BorisG]

The above mentioned recordings, Karajan's for example, pales in comparison with this one, In terms of THE SOUND, i have yet encountered anything better than Dorati/LSO, but, Mercury Living Presence always had wonderful sound, so, i might upload a clip here or two, to show you guys what i am talking about.

Maybe you would like to reconstruct that run-on sentence?

[Gustav]

Maybe you would like to reconstruct that run-on sentence?

maybe i would also want to write it in Chinese (my first language), but I don't think you know how to read it. 

I apologize for the bad grammar, and punctuation, etc... i am always in a hurry, because i don't have a ton of time in my hands (unlike some of you). I have school, work, sports, etc.... after all that, it seems rather pointless to have perfect grammar on an internet forum populated by people around the world.

but, thank you for pointing out my mistakes though, even though this thread has nothing to do with that, and being irrelevant does reveal the extend of your limited intelligence. Do you have an opinion over the recordings? Anything interesting to say? What did you think of the clips? it took me awhile to upload these clips(they are 320 kbps, i was considering uploading them in APE, but knowing that most of you are probably technology-senile, and probably don't know how to play it, so i opted for mp3 instead) and i get no thanks, but instead, comments like these...   

clips are off, if anyone is interested, PM me, otherwise they are gone.

good day!

[vandermolen]

Mravinsky on DGG is my favourite set.

[BorisG]

maybe i would also want to write it in Chinese (my first language), but I don't think you know how to read it. 

I apologize for the bad grammar, and punctuation, etc... i am always in a hurry, because i don't have a ton of time in my hands (unlike some of you). I have school, work, sports, etc.... after all that, it seems rather pointless to have perfect grammar on an internet forum populated by people around the world.

but, thank you for pointing out my mistakes though, even though this thread has nothing to do with that, and being irrelevant does reveal the extend of your limited intelligence. Do you have an opinion over the recordings? Anything interesting to say? What did you think of the clips? it took me awhile to upload these clips(they are 320 kbps, i was considering uploading them in APE, but knowing that most of you are probably technology-senile, and probably don't know how to play it, so i opted for mp3 instead) and i get no thanks, but instead, comments like these...   

clips are off, if anyone is interested, PM me, otherwise they are gone.

good day!

We all make mistakes, no apologies necessary, except maybe for Bunny. I thought you treated her responses harshly, considering the sound claim you made.

And, sir, you would not understand my Russian.

I must confess there was some flippancy in my remark about your run-on sentence (poor punctuation), because I have grown weary of Mercury Living Presence marketing for sound. The claims made by the label, and the claims made by its listeners are no longer applicable.

I did not need your clips to tell me what I already knew. From my past ownership of these Tchaikovsky recordings, I quickly realized they were not seriously competitive anymore.  I did not care for most of the interpretation, but that is subjective. Sound was much more of an issue.

Good day to you. Happy listening.

[Gustav]

We all make mistakes, no apologies necessary, except maybe for Bunny. I thought you treated her responses harshly, considering the sound claim you made.

You call that harsh? the world I have experienced is at least 1000 times harsher than that, you can't protect her forever.

And, sir, you would not understand my Russian.

I don't, but, I wouldn't think any lower of you or criticize little mistakes you have made here or there. Being irrelevant, and off-topic is not a sign of maturity.

I must confess there was some flippancy in my remark about your run-on sentence (poor punctuation), because I have grown weary of Mercury Living Presence marketing for sound. The claims made by the label, and the claims made by its listeners are no longer applicable.

You might have grown weary of it, but others have just discovered it.... you see, the world is not only about you, I uploaded the clips for EVERYBODY (that includes you btw). What you have grown weary of something is your business. But, don't deprive others from at least have a chance of hearing it. Again, it's not about you, you are not that special btw (nobody is, i might add), okay? are we clear now? 

I did not need your clips to tell me what I already knew. From my past ownership of these recordings, I quickly realized they were not seriously competitive anymore.  I did not care for most of the interpretation, but that is subjective. Sound was much more of an issue.

Again, that's your opinion, and you are entitled to express them, but instead of doing the logical and mature thing of expressing your opinion in the first place. You resorted to a sophomoric response, by bringing up something completely off-topic. If you had said this in the beginning, i might have reserved some tiny respect for your arguments. But, too late, just like you do not care about Mercury Living Presence, I don't really care about what you think either.

So, Happy listening!

[MN Dave]

Did Boris G just write off a WHOLE LABEL??? 

[Brian]

I have grown weary of Mercury Living Presence marketing for sound. The claims made by the label, and the claims made by its listeners are no longer applicable.

I would say that, in this day and age, the MLP sound is "eccentric but exciting". I only have their Suppe/Auber CD, but it seems to me that, although their acoustics in no way rival those we can enjoy today, they are very exciting to listen to! And, of course, Dorati, Paray and others turned in some fabulous performances for them.