Author Topic: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)  (Read 29281 times)

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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #40 on: November 14, 2013, 08:28:01 AM »
Epkrapis sounds like a planet from a Star Trek episode . . . .
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Offline edward

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #41 on: November 14, 2013, 06:03:28 PM »
Pace synprr, it's actually Ekphrasis (Continuo II).

I don't think it's a particularly distinctive piece: to my mind there are too many late Berio works which are retreading--in a less focused manner--ground already well covered in Formazione, and this is one of them. Which isn't to deny that it's thoroughly pleasant listening--it just feels minor to me in comparison to, say, Stanze, a late work that emphatically does have fire in its belly.
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Offline Pessoa

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #42 on: November 15, 2013, 01:50:09 AM »
Formazioni is brilliant.

Offline jochanaan

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #43 on: November 15, 2013, 05:58:00 PM »
I confess I haven't heard a lot of Berio's music, and his Sequenza VII for oboe is one of the few pieces for oboe that actually scared me away--as a college student--because of its technical difficulties! :o Now I'd like another look at it...
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Offline amw

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #44 on: November 15, 2013, 06:13:33 PM »
I confess I haven't heard a lot of Berio's music, and his Sequenza VII for oboe is one of the few pieces for oboe that actually scared me away--as a college student--because of its technical difficulties! :o Now I'd like another look at it...

I have a score of Sequenza VII (in scanned form) floating around somewhere, PM me if you want....

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #45 on: April 30, 2014, 08:19:51 AM »
Berio's another one I'm none too happy about! All that vocal writing... brrr. Every now and then he wrote just a perfect AvantGarde work, so anonymously...

Was Berio just a SellOut compared to the more ascetic Italians? Livin' the good life?

This very morning- how do you feel about Berio today? He seems very "Hollywood" to me today, and I don't mean that in any particular way, just somewhat slick and smooth and professional (nothing wrong with that). I want to put him next to Lutoslawski on the CD rack...

Offline CRCulver

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #46 on: September 26, 2014, 12:15:20 PM »
Are there any stories about Berio's time at IRCAM? He was director of the electroacoustic department for a whole 6 years, but he sole piece for live electronics was withdrawn right after its premiere, and IRCAM in general was unable to produce anything substantial for its first several years. Berio was presumably drawing a handsome salary from the French state, and he must have been doing something all that time, even if it was just paper-pushing.

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #47 on: September 29, 2014, 06:17:44 AM »
Are there any stories about Berio's time at IRCAM? He was director of the electroacoustic department for a whole 6 years, but he sole piece for live electronics was withdrawn right after its premiere, and IRCAM in general was unable to produce anything substantial for its first several years. Berio was presumably drawing a handsome salary from the French state, and he must have been doing something all that time, even if it was just paper-pushing.

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #48 on: September 30, 2014, 04:24:04 PM »
Berio's another one I'm none too happy about! All that vocal writing... brrr. Every now and then he wrote just a perfect AvantGarde work, so anonymously...

Was Berio just a SellOut compared to the more ascetic Italians? Livin' the good life?

This very morning- how do you feel about Berio today? He seems very "Hollywood" to me today, and I don't mean that in any particular way, just somewhat slick and smooth and professional (nothing wrong with that). I want to put him next to Lutoslawski on the CD rack...
I've only heard the Sinfonia, which I like quite a bit. Any thoughts?
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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #49 on: January 25, 2015, 10:55:44 AM »
Sad news for fans of Berio and, tangentially, of Mahler as well...

Ward Swingle, founder of the Swingle Singers (and succeeding groups), passed away on January 19, aged 87. For many of us, the sound of The Swingle Singers in Berio's Sinfonia is almost inextricably related to the scherzo of Mahler's Second Symphony...

Obituary from The Guardian: http://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/jan/21/ward-swingle

Here they are in the classic Boulez recording of the Berio piece:

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/NW30g2tPmDA" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/NW30g2tPmDA</a>

Swingle's scatty jazz takes on Bach are soooo "swinging sixties", but actually quite charming:

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/EM6yMDB9wgE" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/EM6yMDB9wgE</a>

RIP
« Last Edit: January 25, 2015, 11:31:12 AM by ritter »
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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003) EH? EH? EH? EH? EEHH??
« Reply #50 on: September 06, 2016, 05:49:12 AM »
I had no idea Berio had so many compositions, that reach back to the '30s. A lot of his '50s titles seem to mimic Maderna, too. Is it all bloop/bleep, or does he do "normal" post-WWII music... I know, silly question...

Anyhow, never really been much into Berio, I have the SQs, 'O King', 'SOLO', a few of the 'Sequenza'... maybe a few trifles here or there... not really into 'Sinfonia', 'Coro', or the other big vocal pieces...

eh?

Offline nathanb

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003) EH? EH? EH? EH? EEHH??
« Reply #51 on: September 06, 2016, 02:28:11 PM »
I had no idea Berio had so many compositions, that reach back to the '30s. A lot of his '50s titles seem to mimic Maderna, too. Is it all bloop/bleep, or does he do "normal" post-WWII music... I know, silly question...

Anyhow, never really been much into Berio, I have the SQs, 'O King', 'SOLO', a few of the 'Sequenza'... maybe a few trifles here or there... not really into 'Sinfonia', 'Coro', or the other big vocal pieces...

eh?

Berio is certainly one of the more diverse guys from his era. Sinfonia, Coro, and Sequenzas seem to be the sort of holy trinity of Berio (well, Folk Songs too, but those are only relatively popular because of sheer accessibility). Did you not like the SOLO though? I love that thing! And all the Chemins? Visage? Laborintus II? Voci? Surely you love Points On A Curve To Find... at the very least.

Don't make me question our friendship, snyprrr!

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003) EH? EH? EH? EH? EEHH??
« Reply #52 on: September 06, 2016, 07:30:03 PM »
Berio is certainly one of the more diverse guys from his era. Sinfonia, Coro, and Sequenzas seem to be the sort of holy trinity of Berio (well, Folk Songs too, but those are only relatively popular because of sheer accessibility). Did you not like the SOLO though? I love that thing! I just pulled it out as i was doing the Xenakis thing, and was reminded I have Berio scattered about. I will play it in the car tomorrow. It caused me to Wiki him, and I just got lost in the sheer amount of Opii :laugh: Berio had. By the time I got to SOLO, and the end of the list, I was in research mode. I always try to find a year to start listening, but with Berio, it appears most of what I have is Late Late. SOLO is almost his last work, I will listen in the car tomorrow


And all the Chemins? Visage? Laborintus II? Voci? Surely you love Points On A Curve To Find... at the very least. I'll tell ya... I remembered that old SONY/Boulez disc with the 'Points...' and the 'Corale'(?), the two 'Chemins', and the cello concerto... I remember thinking back then that Berio was an all around "Modern Composer" with that disc, maybe a Concerto Composer? So, anyhow, I took that disc for granted, and, when I purchased it about a decade ago, I HAVE NEVER OPENED IT!! LOL- people on this Forum have ROOMS of unopened CDs and such, I appear to be down to one. Looks like I'll have to crack it open (hey, at least it will make me feel like I bought something,- oh the agony of this disease!!!!!)). I know I'm going to be less caring about the oboe and viola pieces. I do believe I really liked the 'Corale'. Can't wait to remember 'Points...'.

Visage don't recall... Laborintus, was that on the HarmoniaMundi thing?... Voci/ECM haven't heard...


Don't make me question our friendship, snyprrr!

there there :laugh:

Like I said, the sheer number of works was a shock to me. However, I do basically know the Berio that I like, and that can be encapsulated by the Arditti disc of 4 String Quartets. No.1 has that rough serial sound, like Early Maderna and Feldman- I don't know what else I'd like from this era. He and Maderna seem to both have the same titles for their pieces????

No.2, 'Sincronie', from 1964, is more like Xenakisy... KHS type of Pure High Modernism... this is the kind of stuff I could snort all day... and then come down with Feldman? LOL... I don't know what other works here I'd like. Most of the 'Sequenza' seem inconsequential to me- I seem to have most of them on "various" discs scattered all over the house, but I never listen to the Berio when I grab the disc.

The 'Sequenza' for cello is my exception. That thing is a grande monster of a piece, love it. Have Matt Haimovitz.

SQ No.3, 'Notturno' hits the wary berio era for me. Here he seems to write a lot of overlong pieces (just like Rihm has been doing lately??). I DO like 'Notturno', but it doesn't make me want to seek out all his concertos from the era. Someone liked 'Stanze' from this era?

SQ No.4, 'Glossa', also Late Late, is great in my estimation, but, again, it hasn't made me trust other LateLate Berio.



CathyB. I can only handle in very small doses,... I'm not sure I've heard any vocal Berio that I "personally like".

REMEMBER HOW WE DISCUSSED 'APARTMENT HOUSE 1776'? That's how I wish Berio sounded.

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #53 on: September 06, 2016, 07:38:24 PM »
Epkrapis sounds like a planet from a Star Trek episode . . . .

LOL,... excuse me, sir. i meant to be ill!



Can we pinpoint perhaps three works that serves as catalysts for stylistic changes? Early '50s? Early '60s? '70s, '80s? I believe in you Karl,... thank you! ;) ;D

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003) 'Differences'
« Reply #54 on: September 06, 2016, 08:01:20 PM »
Differences (1945) ensemble and tape 15'

Made it to ten minutes (it's late). Well, OK, I just wish Xenakis had wrote this... I'd call this Hard Core '50s Serialism. It's not particularly seductive. Could be Nono or Maderna?? What do I know?

eh,... meh

I just couldn't get it up for this tonight, baby... maybe we can try again in the morning...



This is my problem with Berio, and probably '50s Nono and Maderna as well. Their sooo Hard Core, maaan, I just don't get any pleasure out of them... like I do from Xenakis. All three of them have a ton of works in this era,... too much for me to want to wade through, I already got spooked by the '50s Maderna. I fear Nono,lol!! Post war commie Italians moaning and groaning, bleeping and blooping...brrrrrrrr


nathnb, I'd rather you just spoon feed me the Masterpieces, lol!!

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #55 on: September 07, 2016, 02:57:43 PM »
Spent the day with Berio, to obviously mixed results.

LIKED:

Laborintus 2: groovy 60s, I seem to do well with recitation...

Bewegung: nice and mysterious

Epipanie (1960): pretty HardCoreSerialist with soprano/orchestra... like 'Erwartung'???

Voci: though it's pretty long

SOLO: trombone concerto, classy, modern... I'd have to call Berio the "dean of AMERICAN Composers". That's what he
            seems like to me, an International SuperStar Composer... he got the closest to being a Rock Star?

[color=red]WASSERKLAVIER: WOOOOOOW- the most beautiful music in the world. This was my highlight
[/color]

DISLIKED:

Most of the Sequenzas just left me chewing my cud.

Epkrapsis: meh... kind of loud and typical anonymous
Eindrucke: again, didn't do anything for me

Serenata: typical 50s Serialist HardCore... meh

5 Variations for Piano: sounding more like Schonberg than Webern

The other small piano pieces

Allelujah 2: quite loudish... I like Xenakis better

Guitar Sequenza: especially can't STAND this piece, though it made Berio famous amongst guitarists
Bassoon Sequenza: soooo long, but good
Oboe Sequenza: eh, it's never done anything for me

Visage: LOL, that's pretty wacky! Not in the mood though.... will come back.... Berio seemed to have a good relationship w RCA

Offline GioCar

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #56 on: October 29, 2017, 09:56:16 AM »

Visage: LOL, that's pretty wacky! Not in the mood though.... will come back.... Berio seemed to have a good relationship w RCA

Quoting Seth Brodsky from Allmusic

The sublime coda to Visage is one of twentieth century music's holy moments

I cannot agree more.

Visage is a masterpiece which frightens at first, but deserves multiple listening. One of the very few electroacoustic pieces of the 50s-60s that really stands the test of time.



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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #57 on: October 29, 2017, 11:23:34 AM »
Quoting Seth Brodsky from Allmusic

The sublime coda to Visage is one of twentieth century music's holy moments

I cannot agree more.

Visage is a masterpiece which frightens at first, but deserves multiple listening. One of the very few electroacoustic pieces of the 50s-60s that really stands the test of time.
Visage is a work I still do not know...After readng this, Gio, it shoots to the top of my wishlist.  :)

But first, I think I'll get this CD that has just been released. Apart from the Maderna transcriptions of antichi maestri, which I find intriguing, it includes (AFAIK--I do not see any other listed on lucianoberio.org) the world premiere recording of Chemins V for guitar and chamber orchestra (an expansion of Sequenza XI).

« Last Edit: October 29, 2017, 11:48:01 PM by ritter »
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Offline GioCar

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #58 on: October 29, 2017, 09:37:36 PM »

But first, I think I'll get this CD that has just been released. Apart from the Maderna ]transcriptions of antichi maestri, wccih I find intriguing, it includes (AFAIK--I do not see any other listed on lucianoberio.org) the world premiere recording of Chemins V for guitar and chamber orchestra (an expansion of Sequenza XI).



Maybe I saw that new release in the NR thread but I didn't pay attention to the Berio.... Thank you Rafael, although I already have the Maderna's Trascrizioni (a CD issued by Amadeus, the Italian magazine) it goes right in my wishlist as well  :)

If you want to get Visage, I believe that the only affordable way today is to get this double CD



which is anyway a treasure trove of various electroacoustic pieces from the second half of last century:
Edgard Varèse - Poème électronique (1958)
György Ligeti - Glissandi (1957)
György Ligeti - Artikulation (1958)
Bruno Maderna - Musica su due dimensioni (1958)
Luciano Berio - Différences (1958–59)   
Luciano Berio - Visage (1961)
Helmut Lachenmann - Szenario (1965)
Jonathan Harvey - Mortuos Plango, Vivos Voco (1980)
Pierre Boulez - Dialogue de l’ombre double (1985)
Brian Ferneyhough - Mnemosyne (1986)

The Harvey is pretty good as well. The Boulez...you know it ad nauseam, don't you?  ;D


PS I've just seen you bought Visage in a different edition I wasn't aware of...well, what about a double?  :laugh:
« Last Edit: October 29, 2017, 09:55:44 PM by GioCar »

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Re: Luciano Berio (1925-2003)
« Reply #59 on: October 30, 2017, 09:44:21 AM »
...although I already have the Maderna's Trascrizioni (a CD issued by Amadeus, the Italian magazine) ...
Oh yes, I've seen that CD listed in many places...



...but also, the tag "attualmente non disponibile" in as many languages as one can imagine.

I do have the Amadeus Berio CD, recorded live in Madrid  (in a concert I could not get tickets for  :( ):



There are some jewels in the Amadeus magazine's back catalog (most of them almost impossible to locate AFAIK). I also have a great CD issued by them of two piano music with the great Bruno Canino and Antonio Ballista...
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