J.S. Bach on the Organ

Started by premont, April 29, 2007, 02:16:33 PM

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nut-job

Quote from: Coopmv on March 06, 2009, 05:43:20 PM
I have 16 Beethoven cycles, which includes Bernstein with the VPO, Christopher Hogwood and the AAM, Toscanini and the NBC Symphony, Kurt Masur and the Gewandhaus Orchestra and quite a few others.  The last cycle I bought was the Harnoncourt and the European Chamber Orchestra, which is still in cellophane.  I think I will probably add the cycles by Colin Davis, John Eliot Gardiner and Charles Mackerras to my collection later this year.

I don't know how someone would have time to listen to that much Beethoven.

Coopmv

Quote from: nut-job on March 07, 2009, 06:06:19 AM
I don't know how someone would have time to listen to that much Beethoven.


FK also has at least 16 Beethoven cycles.  Perhaps he will have a good answer.  My answer is I can listen to these cycles during my retirement years.  So far, I have listened to these cycles only once (i.e. when I bought them) ...   

I will soon have 7 Complete Bach Organ Works.  I think the same argument  will also apply there ...    ;D

jlaurson

Quote from: nut-job on March 07, 2009, 06:06:19 AM
I don't know how someone would have time to listen to that much Beethoven.


And even if I had the time, why the Colin Davis cycle?  ???   ;)

Coopmv

Quote from: jlaurson on March 07, 2009, 09:16:49 AM
And even if I had the time, why the Colin Davis cycle?  ???   ;)

But why not?  FK thinks it is a decent set and I already have many Colin Davis' recordings ...

Antoine Marchand

This set looks quite good:

Johann Sebastian Bach
Orgelwerke auf Silbermann-Orgeln
Organ Works

Berlin Classics, ADD, 1961-1972
15 CDs

Performers:
Arthur Eger Orgel
Christoph Albrecht Orgel
Erich Piasetzki Orgel
Günter Metz Orgel
Hannes Kästner Orgel
Hans Otto Orgel
Herbert Collum Orgel
Johannes Schäfer Orgel
Johannes-Ernst Köhler Orgel
Robert Köbler Orgel


jlaurson

Quote from: Coopmv on March 07, 2009, 09:19:48 AM
But why not?  FK thinks it is a decent set and I already have many Colin Davis' recordings ...

If you make "Why not" your acquisition standard for recordings, then indeed, "why not".

Quote from: Antoine Marchand on March 07, 2009, 10:02:35 AM
This set looks quite good:

Old fashioned, but all the single issues I have from that set I really like... and the occ. distortions are not too bad.

Coopmv

#286
Quote from: jlaurson on March 07, 2009, 10:09:34 AM
Old fashioned, but all the single issues I have from that set I really like... and the occ. distortions are not too bad.

Please elucidate, what exactly do you mean by old-fashioned?  Are you referring to the sound quality, recording technology or the performance style?

Antoine Marchand

Quote from: Coopmv on March 07, 2009, 10:15:57 AM
Please elucidate, what exactly do you mean by old-fashioned?  Are you referring to the sound quality, recording technology or the performance style?

You can get some personal idea here (I don't agree too much with that description, but in fact they are old recordings):

http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Orgelwerke-auf-Silbermann-Orgeln/hnum/8530011


premont

Quote from: Antoine Marchand on March 07, 2009, 10:02:35 AM
This set looks quite good:

Johann Sebastian Bach
Orgelwerke auf Silbermann-Orgeln
Organ Works

Berlin Classics, ADD, 1961-1972
15 CDs


Oldfashioned is exactly the word I would use to describe the performing style. Rather legato touch, changing registrations et.c. in the way Bach´s organ works also was played in Western Germany during the 1950es-1960es by e.g. Michael Schneider, Heinz Wunderlich and also Karl Richter. The SQ is generally good, and the organs very charming. I wrote about the set earlier in this thread, se reply 11.
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premont

Quote from: jlaurson on March 05, 2009, 01:40:56 AM
P.S. Most (probably 98% or more) of attributions are based solely on stylistic grounds, not "proof".

Would you mind to explain, what you mean when you use the word "attribution". Do you mean any work which´s autenticity is not 100% certain?
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premont

Quote from: James on March 05, 2009, 10:43:50 AM
the sound quality of that set is crap, avoid at all costs.

It is rather good for its age BTW. Should we reject all recordings by Cortot, Schnabel, Furtwangler and the like for the same reason??
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premont

Quote from: nut-job on March 05, 2009, 12:55:39 PM
If you only have one why get a second set by the same artist?  Walcha is good, but a bit stodgy and didn't change much over the years.  If you are on a budget, better to pick up a few disks that have your favorite pieces by contrasting artists.  A few installments of the Weinberger set would be a significant contrast to Walcha, for example.

Agreed. Only specially interested listeners need to own more than one Walcha set. For the general listener a contrasting set would be preferable, and the Weinberger set would be a splendid contrast.
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premont

Quote from: Bulldog on March 05, 2009, 03:00:10 PM
If I owned a complete Bach/Walcha set (and I don't), I'd never get another one.

What if he had recorded the Goldberg variations twice or maybe even three times??
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Antoine Marchand

Quote from: premont on March 07, 2009, 11:20:17 AM
Oldfashioned is exactly the word I would use to describe the performing style. Rather legato touch, changing registrations et.c. in the way Bach´s organ works also was played in Western Germany during the 1950es-1960es by e.g. Michael Schneider, Heinz Wunderlich and also Karl Richter. The SQ is generally good, and the organs very charming. I wrote about the set earlier in this thread, se reply 11.

Hi, Premont.

Your opinion is now a little bit more categorical than in the past. Then you described the playing like "a bit old-fashioned", but adding that the "artistic level is variable, but most often very good and never less than acceptable. Recorded sound is better than could be anticipated". 

Anyway, I just have heard some little examples on the web.

karlhenning

Quote from: nut-job on March 06, 2009, 10:51:52 AM
But there is a LOT more to Beethoven than Karajan.

Quoted for truth.

premont

Quote from: Antoine Marchand on March 07, 2009, 11:44:59 AM
Hi, Premont.

Your opinion is now a little bit more categorical than in the past. Then you described the playing like "a bit old-fashioned", but adding that the "artistic level is variable, but most often very good and never less than acceptable. Recorded sound is better than could be anticipated". 

Anyway, I just have heard some little examples on the web.


Well, my opinion is actually unchanged. Writing "a bit" oldfashioned earlier is my usual (national) way of understating things.
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premont

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Antoine Marchand

Quote from: premont on March 07, 2009, 11:58:31 AM
Well, my opinion is actually unchanged. Writing "a bit" oldfashioned earlier is my usual (national) way of understating things.

Sure, but I did read your first post almost like a (strong) recommendation and this isn't so clear in the latter. Probably, just subtle nuances of meaning ;D

premont

Quote from: Antoine Marchand on March 07, 2009, 12:33:10 PM
Sure, but I did read your first post almost like a (strong) recommendation and this isn't so clear in the latter. Probably, just subtle nuances of meaning ;D

A qualified recommendation all the same. The Gottfried Silbermann organs are indeed interesting, and the playing generally reliable, sometimes even very good, but somewhat (maybe the best word) oldfashioned. Not a set for the fanatic HIP-ster, but neither are Walcha, Rogg, Richter and a lot of others.
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rubio

Quote from: premont on March 07, 2009, 11:30:36 AM
It is rather good for its age BTW. Should we reject all recordings by Cortot, Schnabel, Furtwangler and the like for the same reason??

I just wonder if the Documents set is much inferior to the Original Masters incarnation, and if it's sufficiently different performance-wise to the Walcha stereo set?
"One good thing about music, when it hits- you feel no pain" Bob Marley