J.S. Bach on the Organ

[prémont]

I just wonder if the Documents set is much inferior to the Original Masters incarnation, and if it's sufficiently different performance-wise to the Walcha stereo set?

If you are a Walcha maniac like me, you will want both the mono and the stereo integral. But if you are not, I do not know.

The source material for the Documents set were probably original Archiv LPs, whereas the source material for the DG Originals set was the original tapes. And the DG set is better sounding, but not that much - IMO - that you are not well served by the Documents set, not the least regarding the cost. As I have written elsewhere the Doument set has got a tad of added ambience, (George, you know whom, does not -in principle - like it, but he has not heard the Document set) and it is done tastefully. Ultimately I would prefer to be without it, but on the other hand I do not think it detracts critically from the sound.

[Bulldog]

What if he had recorded the Goldberg variations twice or maybe even three times??

No problem.  One or two discs for the Goldbergs is far different than a complete set of Bach's organ works.

[prémont]

No problem.  One or two discs for the Goldbergs is far different than a complete set of Bach's organ works.

We made the comparison with the WTC above. 4 or 5 CDs pr set.
And your 150++ sets of Goldberg variations equal at least about 35 sets of the WTC

[prémont]

that is not what I am saying..

that particular issue is horrid, the sound is dreadful & unacceptable. might as well spend the extra money on something that is so much better, especially with this music.

Disagree. This is a milestone recording both as to interpretation as to recorded sound for its age. If we should reject this recording because of bad sound, we should also reject all recordings made at least before 1950 for the same reason. But if one owns Walchas stereo set, parts of which on the other hand are badly recorded regarding the years of the recordings, one may not need the mono set.

[prémont]

no no no that cheaply priced issue of the earlier mono is downright unacceptable. avoid.

It is better than its reputation. How much of it have you heard?

[Coopmv]

I just wonder if the Documents set is much inferior to the Original Masters incarnation, and if it's sufficiently different performance-wise to the Walcha stereo set?

I found the Documents set quite enjoyable.  While the sound may not be first rate, it is clear and Walcha articulated the organ works of Bach well IMO.  I also have the Walcha's stereo set on Archive, which I have not played yet.  I also plan on getting the Weinberger's 22-CD set just to get some works that have been left out of the Walcha's sets.  At any rate, I still consider Walcha the best among the organists.  We are talking about someone who was blind most of his adult life when we examine his towering achievement on the organ ...

[prémont]

I found the Documents set quite enjoyable.  While the sound may not be first rate, it is clear and Walcha articulated the organ works of Bach well IMO.  I also have the Walcha's stereo set on Archive, which I have not played yet.  I also plan on getting the Weinberger's 22-CD set just to get some works that have been left out of the Walcha's sets.  At any rate, I still consider Walcha the best among the organists.  We are talking about someone who was blind most of his adult life when we examine his towering achievement on the organ ...

This is precisely what I think too.

[prémont]

i wouldn't have said anything if i hadn't heard much of it.

But you did not answer how much.

[Coopmv]

check out his pupil the blind german organist Holm Vogel...his recordings of the Trio Sonatas are the best I've ever heard and I've heard lots. Perfection. I also love his recording of ClavierUbung iii which is also very great.

If anyone reads up the bio on Helmut Walcha, he has to be impressed with what this man has achieved.  The fact that Walcha was blind for most of his adult life, yet he is ranked right up there with the best organists of the 20th century.  How did he do it?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmut_Walcha

[Coopmv]

check out his pupil the blind german organist Holm Vogel...his recordings of the Trio Sonatas are the best I've ever heard and I've heard lots. Perfection. I also love his recording of ClavierUbung iii which is also very great.

Even better than Marie-Claire Alain?

[Bulldog]

We made the comparison with the WTC above. 4 or 5 CDs pr set.
And your 150++ sets of Goldberg variations equal at least about 35 sets of the WTC

Is there a point you're making here?

[Bulldog]

Disagree. This is a milestone recording both as to interpretation as to recorded sound for its age. If we should reject this recording because of bad sound, we should also reject all recordings made at least before 1950 for the same reason. But if one owns Walchas stereo set, parts of which on the other hand are badly recorded regarding the years of the recordings, one may not need the mono set.

How does the sound on this set compare to the Albert Schweitzer/Bach/Pearl recordings?

[prémont]

Is there a point you're making here?

Yes, your preferences are not a matter of available space, but of preferences.

[prémont]

How does the sound on this set compare to the Albert Schweitzer/Bach/Pearl recordings?

Have not heard the Schweitzer/Pearl releases, only the EMI and Document releases, and the Schweitzer sound on these are rather more dated. But I can not say that Schweitzer does much for me, and I do not acquire expensive recordings for historical reasons exclusively.

[karlhenning]

how much? enough to rid of it without regrets.

Your lack of regret is no signifier in the least for anyone else.

[Bulldog]

Yes, your preferences are not a matter of available space, but of preferences.

Right - available space has nothing to do with it.

[Bulldog]

Have not heard the Schweitzer/Pearl releases, only the EMI and Document releases, and the Schweitzer sound on these are rather more dated. But I can not say that Schweitzer does much for me, and I do not acquire expensive recordings for historical reasons exclusively.

I don't have any problem with Schweitzer's sound, so Walcha should be easy.

[prémont]

they say the blind have a heightened sense of hearing. helps. he's not the only great blind musician though there have been others. for instance, check out Holm Vogel's recordings if you get the chance, you will not be disappointed, great performance (& sound). trust me.

I can agree with this. Vogels playing has got many of the Walcha qualities, first and foremost exquisite transparency of part playing, and in a more informed presentation.

[Coopmv]

Yes.

Goggling on Holm Vogel but I really do not find many interesting entries about him on the first page??

[Marc]

Bach is my favourite composer ....
.... and I only had around 'two handful' of organ discs in da house (Walcha, MC Alain, Power Biggs, Rogg, Rübsam, Preston, Leonhardt & Koopman), whilst Bach is such an important organ composer.
Oops: I almost forgot the 'complete' Fagius!

Still: I rarely listened to them.
Shame on me!

So, after (re)discovering the charm and beauty of the harpsichord during the last two years, I decided to take a closer hearing at that other beautiful keyboard instrument: the organ!

Right now I'm listening to Olivier Vernet, playing a.o. the Trio Sonata in G (BWV 530) and the variations on "O Gott, du frommer Gott" (BWV 767) on the organ of l'Église Sainte-Croix de Montélimar.
I think he is a good Bach interpreter, and I like his choice of registrations. But I do not have a lot of organ-listening experience.
What do other members think of Vernet?

(Post scriptum: also in da house, library CD-stuff of the Dutch organ players Piet Wiersma, Bram Beekman and Wim van Beek, and also of Chorzempa, and I had a great weekend, sitting outside da house in the sun with two large headphones on my big ears. )