J.S. Bach on the Organ

[Marc]

[....]
The last two or three weeks I have listened to a lot of Bach's organ music, with all the separate CD's that I found in my house, and Beekman's 2cd-sampler (also OOP) gives me the impression that his integral should be very good. He's playing on historical Dutch baroque organs. I would describe his playing as a fine combination of joy, spirituality and nobility. And the organs sound really wonderful. It's a real pity that this set is OOP. Hopefully another company is willing to buy the license.

About Chorzempa: this hybrid disc is a reissue of a 1970 quadrophonic Bach/Liszt recording, released by PentaTone. Especially the Bach works profit of a brilliant recording sound (organ of the Grote Kerk in Breda, Netherlands). I almost drowned in it!

Three weeks later: I wouldn't call Beekman virtuosic; and his joy is more of a tranquil, serene and severe joy. In some spectacular pieces, like BWV 565, his playing isn't that appealing though, IMHO. After hearing a lot of organ players in this piece (again), Chorzempa is still the best to my likings. Too bad that a lot of his Bach-discography is OOP.

[prémont]

Three weeks later: I wouldn't call Beekman virtuosic; and his joy is more of a tranquil, serene and severe joy. In some spectacular pieces, like BWV 565, his playing isn't that appealing though, IMHO. After hearing a lot of organ players in this piece (again), Chorzempa is still the best to my likings. Too bad that a lot of his Bach-discography is OOP.

I wonder whom he (Beekman) may be comparable to.

Foccroulle? Lagacé? Fagius? Johannesen?

[Marc]

I wonder whom he (Beekman) may be comparable to.

Ha!
That's what I intended!

Foccroulle? Lagacé? Fagius? Johannesen?

Pfui dich, what a question for a beginner in this discipline (organ listening)! 

Of your list of names I only know Fagius, and I wouldn't compare Beekman to him.
With Beekman, it's especially the calm determination, or determined calmness, that appeals to me.

I would say: maybe one could place him in the Dutch no-nonsense and slightly calvinistic music-making of f.i. Gustav Leonhardt, Bernard Haitink, Hans Vonk?

But definitely not comparable with Ton Koopman, who is far more fast and furious. I must tell you though, that so far it's not easy to tell which musician I do or don't really like when Bach's organ is concerned. In fact, the sound and type of the instrument, combined with the 'space' of the recording is almost as important to me, if not more. Maybe at a later stage I'll be able to name my favourite performers. But, for instance, after listening to Beekman, I don't mind to turn to Koopman of Chorzempa, and vice versa. I guess I'm lucky right now: still enjoying (almost) everyone. I also enjoy to listen to Fagius (BIS/Brilliant Classics), Power Biggs (on the Harvard Flentrop) or the Duruflé family, although the 'Grande Orgue' the latters use (Soissons) is not especially to my likings.

I 'discovered' in the last 2/3 months that I have a few Bach organ-CDs that I'm not particularily fond of. For instance the recording with a.o. the Schübler-Chorale, part of the Naxos cycle, played by Wolfgang Rübsam. I experience his playing as a continuing stop-and-go-penalty, if I'm allowed to use this motorsports term. Rather tiresome, IMHO. From what I've read about him, I believe his Philips recordings were much better.
I also have 2 recordings with Michael Murray, and in his case I'm not really endeared by the instruments, either. Especially the LA First Congregational Church Organ wouldn't be my first choice in Bach. Which means that it's tough to keep on listening and enjoy myself. I know that Murray has played some baroque organs in the Netherlands (f.i. Zwolle), but I don't know these discs (yet?).

After typing all this, I remembered some statements in reviews about Jacques van Oortmerssen, that kinda made me think of Beekman. I searched at the internet for him and found this clip (BWV 530):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jnv8gjbx-0Q

Like Beekman, he's not fast, and rather severe. But Van Oortmerssen is more varying in tempi, a bit like Rübsam, but just a little bit. I would describe Beekman's playing as being more straightforward.
Mind you, I say this only after increasingly listening to Beekman's sampler. I still have to find and do the 'whole bunch'. In fact, I still have to 'learn' almost the entire Bach Organ Catalogue. Combined with all the Walcha's, Alains, Vernets, etc., I think I have plenty to do for the next ten year!

There is a SACD of Beekman available, by the way, with a selection of Toccata's and other organ works by German composers. The organ is a very special one (Oostkerk, Middelburg): if I'm not mistaken, it's some strange mix between Flemish, Dutch and German organ building of the 18th century.

http://www.amazon.com/Toccata-Johann-Sebastian-Bach/dp/B00008XS1Y

To conclude: some fragments of Beekman's organ playing, combined with other versions of the renaissance song "Est-ce mars". The organ fragments are taken from the disc Alle Registers Open. Not that difficult to translate, I think . But I doubt if that one is still available, too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmgmSH8zUEY

[Coopmv]

Ha!
I also have 2 recordings with Michael Murray, and in his case I'm not really endeared by the instruments, either. Especially the LA First Congregational Church Organ wouldn't be my first choice in Bach. Which means that it's tough to keep on listening and enjoy myself. I know that Murray has played some baroque organs in the Netherlands (f.i. Zwolle), but I don't know these discs (yet?).

I first heard Michael Murray on WNCN or WQXR when I lived in NYC over twenty years ago.  I just never liked his performance.  As such, he joins the list of Sinopoli, Stern and Levine, etc, whose recordings are not included in my collection.

[FideLeo]

I would say: maybe one could place him in the Dutch no-nonsense and slightly calvinistic music-making of f.i. Gustav Leonhardt, Bernard Haitink, Hans Vonk?

"Dutch no-nonsense"? Jacques van Oortmerssen comes to mind.

[Marc]

"Dutch no-nonsense"? Jacques van Oortmerssen comes to mind.

True. I mentioned him a little later, too: "[....] I remembered some statements in reviews about Jacques van Oortmerssen, that kinda made me think of Beekman".
And added a YouTube-link with him playing Bach:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jnv8gjbx-0Q

[FideLeo]

True. I mentioned him a little later, too: "[....] I remembered some statements in reviews about Jacques van Oortmerssen, that kinda made me think of Beekman".
And added a YouTube-link with him playing Bach:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jnv8gjbx-0Q

I thought I was missing something...well I have.   Strange to say, but nowadays I often prefer Bach organ playing that is a bit over-the-top: Lorenzo Ghielmi, Michel Chapuis, Olivier Vernet...for example.

[Marc]

I thought I was missing something...well I have.   Strange to say, but nowadays I often prefer Bach organ playing that is a bit over-the-top: Lorenzo Ghielmi, Michel Chapuis, Olivier Vernet...for example.

And why not? AFAIK, much of Bach's organ oeuvre was composed while he was still rather young. I mean, if the ever-so-popular BWV 565 really is genuine Sebastian .... need I say more?
For instance, I really like Chorzempa in this piece (re-issued on hybrid SACD by PentaTone Classics), and one could consider his interpretation a bit 'wild', too. Another youthful and firm approach (though sounding less virtuosic) of this piece is performed by Stefan Johannes Bleicher on the Holzhey-organ of Weißenau, Germany (built 1784-1787). It's on a Arte Nova bargain that I bought recently.

Until so far, like I've mentioned before, I consider myself rather lucky (and busy ).
Because, when Bach's organ is concerned, I seem to like all various kinds of interpretations. You've mentioned Vernet, and some time ago I also said I liked his recital (I have a copy of it on MiniDisc) on the organ of l'Église Sainte-Croix de Montélimar, which I think is one of his first recordings (late eighties?). Indeed, there's a lot of passion and energy in his playing, as Premont was saying. Since a couple of months, I always have this recording available when I'm travelling towards work.

About the 'Dutch' no-nonsense and calvinistic style of playing: I mentioned the name of Leonhardt, but no doubt he can be a very energetic interpreter, too. In fact, I tend to be rather cautious when strict classifications are concerned. But in some cases it can be very handy to unite musicians into so-called divisions. Just to give other members/readers an idea. On the other hand: these classifications can of course be very subjective .... and therefore even dead-wrong, in the ears of others.

Anyway: enjoy your time listening to a wild and tempestuous Bach!

[Marc]

I wonder whom he (Beekman) may be comparable to.

Foccroulle? Lagacé? Fagius? Johannesen?

Maybe something of an answer: PM sent.

[Marc]

I've finished struggling with getting Beekman 'complete'. Thanks to the Dutch libraries I have managed to make a copy of the missing volumes 2 & 5!
But, because I'm just a hungry greedy man , instead of finally taking some time for a quiet organ listening evening and night, I'm already struggling with completing another 'Dutch' set, too!
It's about recordings of the organist Piet Wiersma, who started a Bach edition in the late nineties. But he died before completing, at the age of 57, right after he finished his recording at the Lohman-organ of the Hervormde Kerk in Eenrum, august 2003.
Eenrum is a village in the north of the Netherlands, in the province (county) of Groningen. Groningen is (relatively speaking) filled with historic organs, which means that a lot of well-known organists like to play there. Wiersma himself was born in this region, and stayed there his entire life. Although he was not a HIP or baroque musician, he was very interested in Bach, and managed to find some sponsors for his cycle Bach in Groningen.
He completed 7 volumes of 2CD-sets, and I'm on the right way! Volumes 2, 4, 5, 6 and 7 are already in da house! Volume 1 & 3 are OOP, according to the selling & sponsoring website (www.groningenorgelland.nl), but thanks (again) to the library, I could make a copy of Volume 3.

But Volume 1 is (almost?) impossible to find. Even the libraries don't seem to have it.
Is there a Dutch organ lover on the board who can help?

Que? .... he asked hesitatingly.

Well, anyway, back to some listening experiences again. Wiersma can be very heavy sometimes, and the one organ sounds better than the other, IMHO. But, f.i., he executes a peace-giving and almost transcendental performance of one of my favourites, the Fantasia und Fuge in c-moll, BWV 537, on the organ of Farmsum. This is a very fine sounding instrument, also made by N.A. Lohman [1829].
Here's a pic:

[prémont]

Of your list of names I only know Fagius, and I wouldn't compare Beekman to him.
With Beekman, it's especially the calm determination, or determined calmness, that appeals to me.

I hear much determination in Fagius´ playing, but it is maybe more strict tham calm.

I would say: maybe one could place him in the Dutch no-nonsense and slightly calvinistic music-making of f.i. Gustav Leonhardt, Bernard Haitink, Hans Vonk?

Do not know Vonk. Haitink makes me think of some search for objectivism, indeed the opposite of Leonhardts subjectivism.

..the Duruflé family, although the 'Grande Orgue' the latters use (Soissons) is not especially to my likings.

Oh yes, this modern organ, designed to be suited for all music, and actually not suited for much, and at least not for early or baroque music. In my ears Maurice Duruflé and his wife are contrary poles as to interpretation. He is reflective and introspective, virtuosity being of secundary importance. She is first and foremost a brilliant performer, a bit superficial, the faster the better. A pity, that she was given the option to perform many of the greatest works (538, 548 e.g.)

I 'discovered' in the last 2/3 months that I have a few Bach organ-CDs that I'm not particularily fond of. For instance the recording with a.o. the Schübler-Chorale, part of the Naxos cycle, played by Wolfgang Rübsam. I experience his playing as a continuing stop-and-go-penalty, if I'm allowed to use this motorsports term. Rather tiresome, IMHO. From what I've read about him, I believe his Philips recordings were much better.

Rübsams Philips recording and Naxos recording are as different as day and night. Indeed I like both, even if agree, that the Philips recording is the most exciting. It is fast, brilliant, sometimes wild in expression, but always well controlled. The organ he uses though is rather uninteresting and middle of the road (a neobaroque Metzler organ). The Naxos recording is partly played upon historical organs, and most of it is extremely deliberate, static, sometimes almost approaching stand-still, and some of his registrations are in my ears a bit romantic, but the more I listen to it, the more I manage to get beneath the granite-like surface and become receptive to his individual artistic message, which I would describe as visions about eternity.

I also have 2 recordings with Michael Murray, and in his case I'm not really endeared by the instruments, either. Especially the LA First Congregational Church Organ wouldn't be my first choice in Bach. Which means that it's tough to keep on listening and enjoy myself. I know that Murray has played some baroque organs in the Netherlands (f.i. Zwolle), but I don't know these discs (yet?).

Murray bores me, whatever the instrument.

Like Beekman, he's not fast, and rather severe. But Van Oortmerssen is more varying in tempi, a bit like Rübsam, but just a little bit. I would describe Beekman's playing as being more straightforward.

In my ears van Oortmerssen is strict, correct, and not much more. And do not possess any bit of Rübsams originality.

[prémont]

It's about recordings of the organist Piet Wiersma, who started a Bach edition in the late nineties. But he died before completing, at the age of 57, right after he finished his recording at the Lohman-organ of the Hervormde Kerk in Eenrum, august 2003.

More to learn, as I never have heard of Piet Wiersma. A sad story, though, reminding of Ewald Kooiman, who recently died in the midst of his third(!) Bach integral.

Never-the-less I am repeatedly impressed by the great number of competent and engaged Dutch organists, who incessantly make recordings on an artistic level which makes most of them must-have´s for people like me. Releases like the in every respect outstanding Dutch organ box (20CD) which Harry recommended some time ago, and which he helped me to get hold of, would never arise in any other country.

[prémont]

..nowadays I often prefer Bach organ playing that is a bit over-the-top: Lorenzo Ghielmi, Michel Chapuis, Olivier Vernet...for example.

Strange that you mention these three so very different artist in the same breath.

[Bulldog]

Murray bores me, whatever the instrument.

Yes, he can be a total bore, especially in the bigger works such as the Preludes & Fugues/Toccatas etc.  However, he does improve a lot in Bach's chorales.  But overall, he's too heavy and slow.  I bought a couple of his Telarc discs, and that was the end of him for me.

[Coopmv]

Yes, he can be a total bore, especially in the bigger works such as the Preludes & Fugues/Toccatas etc.  However, he does improve a lot in Bach's chorales.  But overall, he's too heavy and slow.  I bought a couple of his Telarc discs, and that was the end of him for me.

Same here.  I never even own a single CD by Michael Murray after I heard one of his CD's off the local classical FM station.

[FideLeo]

Strange that you mention these three so very different artist in the same breath.

To me their performances are all quite more "animated" in comparison to the, mmm, no-nonsense group, hence the bracketing.

[Marc]

More to learn, as I never have heard of Piet Wiersma. A sad story, though, reminding of Ewald Kooiman, who recently died in the midst of his third(!) Bach integral.

I said Wiersma stayed in Groningen his entire life, but I'm not sure if that is true.
From 1983 on, he was organist of the Grote of St. Nicolaaskerk in Monnickendam, province Noord-Holland.
But he kept on teaching in the Groningen environment. His nickname was de lesboer, which is Dutch for 'the lesson farmer'. From what I've read about him, he must have been a very inspiring teacher. I think 'lesboer' is a typical Groningen expression, because Wiersma's home county is still very agrarian.

Listening to Wiersma's Bach in Groningen is something of experiencing a true live recital. Wiersma apparently did not care for the odd mistake here and there. From time to time he touches two keys at the same time, giving the piece an unexpected dissonant side effect. Sometimes he can be rather rough and extravert, but, f.i. in BWV 537, there is also enough room for more introspective playing.

About Kooiman: actually, a library CD is on the way. But it's not a Bach recital, but a disc with mainly compositions of Johann Peter Kellner. He is the suspected author of BWV 565, as some scholars suggest.

So, I'm still busy travelling on my organ quest. Maybe I'll turn into some kind of a Lancelot .... and who knows what fair maid is waiting for me!

Let's dream on: entering the Oude Kerk in Delft, and listening to Scarlett Johansson (dressed as Griet from the movie Girl with a pearl earring) playing Bach on the organ.

[Que]

t's about recordings of the organist Piet Wiersma, who started a Bach edition in the late nineties. But he died before completing, at the age of 57, right after he finished his recording at the Lohman-organ of the Hervormde Kerk in Eenrum, august 2003.

He completed 7 volumes of 2CD-sets, and I'm on the right way! Volumes 2, 4, 5, 6 and 7 are already in da house! Volume 1 & 3 are OOP, according to the selling & sponsoring website (www.groningenorgelland.nl), but thanks (again) to the library, I could make a copy of Volume 3.

But Volume 1 is (almost?) impossible to find. Even the libraries don't seem to have it.
Is there a Dutch organ lover on the board who can help?

Que? .... he asked hesitatingly.

Nope, I'm sorry that I have to dissapoint you. 
Bach's organ works are relatively new to me - I'm still scratching the surface of the more generally availble recordings.

Q

[FideLeo]

Let's dream on: entering the Oude Kerk in Delft, and listening to Scarlett Johansson (dressed as Griet from the movie Girl with a pearl earring) playing Bach on the organ.

That sounds interesting considering none of the organists you have since mentioned in this thread is female.  Me, I want Colin Firth in the organ loft

[Marc]

Let's dream on: entering the Oude Kerk in Delft, and listening to Scarlett Johansson (dressed as Griet from the movie Girl with a pearl earring) playing Bach on the organ.

That sounds interesting considering none of the organists you have since mentioned in this thread is female. 

That's why I call it a dream. 0:)

Me, I want Colin Firth in the organ loft

Not bad, really.
He's so endearing in Love actually!
And who's assisting him with registrating?
Hugh Grant?

Errrr, enough romantic blabbering. This is supposed to be a baroque thread.