J.S. Bach on the Organ

[Bulldog]

Now can we get a distinction between "A must", "Excellent", "Two Thumbs Up", and "Essential"?
Did you leave all the Marie-Claire Alains out for a reason? Ditto her student, whatshammacallhim... the one with the silly font on the box. Stockmeier, Knud...
(I assume that you do actually have every available cycle... am I wrong?)

Yes, you're wrong.  I'm not familiar with Stockmeier or Knud.  Concerning Alain, I only have an Art of Fugue on Erato that I don't like much.

Distinctions?  "A must" and "essential" beat "excellent" and "two thumbs up" by a large margin. 

[Clever Hans]

Which are the best issues from Hanssler?

I thank ye.

[Marc]

Which are the best issues from Hanssler?

Well, personally I like Wolfgang Zerer and Bine Katrine Bryndorf. But my 'knowledge' of this series is limited.

[Marc]

Now can we get a distinction between "A must", "Excellent", "Two Thumbs Up", and "Essential"?

Why not?
Three stars, five stars, a perfect 10, average, rosettes, et cetera. Lots of 'distinguished' music magazines know their disctinctions, too.
And check out all those different emoticons one can choose from on this board!

Confession: I also have a weak spot for 'lists', even though most of them are just quick fun.

Did you leave all the Marie-Claire Alains out for a reason? Ditto her student, whatshammacallhim... the one with the silly font on the box. Stockmeier, Knud...

Whatshammacallhim must be Olivier Vernet.
And Knud .... Knud Vad.

Anyway, mr. Laurson, your contribution has awoken me again!

Here's a snobbish personal list (beware!), based on about a year of very alternating listening (and reading caused by personal historical interest): sometimes just one disc, sometimes many discs.

Essential (which doesn't necessarily mean 'personal fave'):
Albert Schweitzer (although I personally only know his famous BWV 565), Helmut Walcha, Walter Kraft, Karl Richter, Edward Power Biggs, Lionel Rogg, Peter Hurford, Marie-Claire Alain, Gustav Leonhardt, Wolfgang Rübsam, Daniel Chorzempa, Ton Koopman, Ewald Kooiman, Bram Beekman, Georgie Ritchie, Gerhard Weinberger.

Personal faves, yet not entirely essential :
Wolfgang Stockmeier, Hans Fagius, Bernard Foccroulle, Harald Vogel, Olivier Vernet, Wolfgang Zerer.

Interesting and worthwhile IMO:
Peter Sykes, Gillian Weir, Joan Lippincott, Christopher Herrick, Olivier Latry, Bine Katrine Bryndorf, André Isoir, Esther Sialm, Werner Jacob, Hans Ole Thers, Thiemo Janssen, Knud Vad, Heinz Balli, Hans Otto, René Saorgin, Masaaki Suzuki, Stanislas Deriemaeker.

Very chauvinistic picks:
Wim van Beek (excellent!!), Leo van Doeselaar (excellent!!), Piet Wiersma (excellent!!), Sietze de Vries, Piet Kee, Cor Ardesch, Stef Tuinstra, Leonore Lub, Janny de Vries, Jan Hage, Cor van Wageningen.
Some of them (like Van Doeselaar and Kee) have recorded for international recording companies, but the lot of them is only available on small Dutch labels, which means in most cases that they're very difficult to get.

Not very interesting (IMHO):
Kevin Bowyer (though his integral is also very 'complete'), Jean Guillou, Ivan Sokol, Simon Preston, Michel Chapuis, Herbert Tachezi, Hans Vollenweider, Michael Murray, Virgil Fox, Miklós Spányi, the Duruflé's.

Apologies to all the artists I forgot!
But I certainly hope to expand my listening experiences in the forthcoming years!
(For instance: some Italians, like Alessio Corti.)

[Que]

Whom do you enjoy for Buxtehude, Que?

The complete series by Jean-Charles Ablitzer (Harmonic Records). See HERE and samples HERE. Haven't tried Koopman yet but intend to!

Q

[Clever Hans]

This is all very helpful.

Thanks, Que, for the Ablitzer resource.

[Clever Hans]

I really like the Foccroulle samples. I also admire Weinberger's straight approach. The Alain on youtube is impressive, particularly the video of her playing BWV 540.

Decisions, decisions.

[Marc]

I really like the Foccroulle samples. I also admire Weinberger's straight approach. The Alain on youtube is impressive, particularly the video of her playing BWV 540.

Decisions, decisions.

I wish you luck.

Of course, you may also decide NOT to go for an integral, but to pick some good & interesting single discs first.

About the MC Alain integral(s): she never recorded the Neumeister Chorales, unlike Foccroulle and Weinberger.

[Marc]

Not mentioned in recent previous posts: Jacques van Oortmerssen, who started an integral for the Vanguard label in 1994. Now in license by Challenge Classics, he is continuing his cycle, recently releasing Volume 9.
Strict, no nonsense HIP playing, maybe too 'cold' for some listeners, but after some more listening his playing might grow in one's appreciation. At least that has happened to me.

[Clever Hans]

I wish you luck.

Of course, you may also decide NOT to go for an integral, but to pick some good & interesting single discs first.

About the MC Alain integral(s): she never recorded the Neumeister Chorales, unlike Foccroulle and Weinberger.

Yes, that's good advice. I do like integrals, though, to see how a given personality expresses across a body of work.

[Lilas Pastia]

Into volume I of Vernet's Bach integral ( I have I, II and V). Many works in there I don't know well or that, in all fairness, are memorable from the musical standpoint. But Vernet's touch - and his choice of instruments  - make for captivating listening. Whenever I listen to him, I have the feeling I'm listening to an organ - not an interpreter. Organ lovers will know what I mean. For the others  , let me say that I consider this instrument to be the only one that can compare to the human voice in its range of colours and capacity for expression.

[Marc]

Into volume I of Vernet's Bach integral ( I have I, II and V). Many works in there I don't know well or that, in all fairness, are memorable from the musical standpoint. But Vernet's touch - and his choice of instruments  - make for captivating listening. Whenever I listen to him, I have the feeling I'm listening to an organ - not an interpreter. Organ lovers will know what I mean. For the others  , let me say that I consider this instrument to be the only one that can compare to the human voice in its range of colours and capacity for expression.

I certainly enjoy Olivier Vernet and his Bach cycle. But I don't find him less interpreting than, say, Kooiman, Beekman, Van Oortmerssen, Foccroulle, Weinberger, Alain, ..... (et al?).

About the expression of the organ: yes, I have that tremendous experience, too. Although I admit that the comparison with the human voice didn't come in my mind that fast. To me, it's still more of a 'imitatio instrumenticae'.
In fact, I personally believe that almost every instrument is a sort of an imitation of the human voice. And of all those instruments, the organ is maybe the most expanded imitation of a bunch of other imitations.

As much as I love the instrument called organ, if I had to choose between "Ach bleib bei uns, Herr Jesu Christ" BWV 6 (3rd movement: chorale with soprano voice & violoncello piccolo) or the 'Schübler' organ arrangment BWV 649, I certainly would go for the cantata version.

To me, the human voice still remains the most expressive and moving instrument of them all. But, of course, that's a personal opinion.

[Marc]

Sure, the Duke University Chapel (Chapel Hill, NC) is a large building .... but is it really inevitable to make a decent Flentrop organ sound like it's been recorded in an enormous swimming pool?



Of course it doesn't make me hate neither composer nor performer (the latter in this case: Joan Lippincott) .... but unfortunately the sound of an outta space cistern makes any satisfactionary listening quite impossible, IMO.

Well, the smaller Miller Chapel of the Princeton Theological Seminary delivers a more intimate sound from the Paul Fritts organ there. So, now I can really hear an organ!



Again, I like Joan Lippincott's playing, but during the most shivering pieces of the 'Great Organ Mass' (Kyrie, Gott heiliger Geist BWV 671 & Aus tiefer Not schrei ich zu dir BWV 686) she's not able to dig really deep.
I'd say her approach is rather distant. This works slightly better in the manual chorales and also the Schüblers. All in all, a nice 2-cd to have, but not essential nor mandatory.

[prémont]

Again, I like Joan Lippincott's playing, but during the most shivering pieces of the 'Great Organ Mass' (Kyrie, Gott heiliger Geist BWV 671 & Aus tiefer Not schrei ich zu dir BWV 686) she's not able to dig really deep.

Perhaps.
For interactive communication, one needs at least two persons.

[Marc]

You're very sharp late at night!



So, second (third!) person, do you have a communicative opinion yourself?

[prémont]

You're very sharp late at night!



So, second (third!) person, do you have a communicative opinion yourself?

Sorry, the temptation was to big.

As to Joan Lippincott´s degree of deepness I can not tell. Have not heard her. I have considered acquiring her Triosonatas, Toccatas and Clavierübung III, but the CDs are not easy to find in Europe. You may know a source though?

[Marc]

Sorry, the temptation was to big.

As to Joan Lippincott´s degree of deepness I can not tell. Have not heard her. I have considered acquiring her Triosonatas, Toccatas and Clavierübung III, but the CDs are not easy to find in Europe. You may know a source though?

I ordered both of them via Amazon.de. The name of the shop was Dodax-Online.
But there were only a few left in stock.

On the other hand: you might want to give the Gothic website a try.

http://www.gothic-catalog.com/

I haven't done that myself yet, but my experiences with Raven (another American label) are very good. I ordered three or four issues with them and they were deliverd swiftly, without added import taxes.

[prémont]

On the other hand: you might want to give the Gothic website a try.

http://www.gothic-catalog.com/

I haven't done that myself yet, but my experiences with Raven (another American label) are very good. I ordered three or four issues with them and they were deliverd swiftly, without added import taxes.

Sheer luck, I am sure. This would not happen in the north.

[Marc]

Sheer luck, I am sure. This would not happen in the north.

Yes, and I sure feel lucky about it.
OTOH: these items were sent by the producing label itself, without distributive trading. Could that be the cause of my luck?

[jlaurson]

Yes, and I sure feel lucky about it.
OTOH: these items were sent by the producing label itself, without distributive trading. Could that be the cause of my luck?

Are you talking from the US to the Netherlands?

Customs opens only what they think may contain items of value exceeding "small purchases". This is not EU-harmonized, to my knowledge, but I reckon it is similar among countries. Officially exempted from tax are items of value below somewhere between 20 and 30 Euros (including shipping, insanely)--though there seems an unofficial agreement not to act on items below 40 Euros (excluding shipping). There are also notably greater liberties made during Christmas time.