What are you currently reading?

Started by facehugger, April 07, 2007, 12:36:10 AM

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Ken B

Quote from: Florestan on October 12, 2019, 02:38:59 PM
No, I don't. You sorely missed my point.

Is Hamlet true? Or Don Quijote? Or Norwich's Byzantine history?

In other words you have already accounted for them not being true but being fictional. Well and good. But *as assertions of fact* they are vastly more ridiculous than anything Gibbon gets wrong. That you personally have a way of dealing with their untruth doesn't make them less untrue.

Florestan

#9461
Quote from: Ken B on October 12, 2019, 02:50:19 PM
In other words you have already accounted for them not being true but being fictional.

No, I haven't.

I'm greatly puzzled by your not being able to distinguish between fictional and allegorical.


QuoteBut *as assertions of fact* they are vastly more ridiculous than anything Gibbon gets wrong.

Really ?Let's see.

The Bible (abridged): God created the world and everything that's in it in seven days.

In order to assess the merits of this proposition, which was not originally written in English, one has to know the original Hebrew meanings of the words therein. I don't. Do you?

Gibbon (in plain English, abridged): Christianity is the main culprit for the decadence of the Roman Empire.

If this is so, how come that those decadent Christians were able to restore, preserve and defend the most populous and civilized areas of their empire --- which, btw, they never called anything else than Roman; Byzantine is a malicious, ideologically motivated confection --- for almost a millenium after the Western areas fell prey to Germanic barbarians?

Every kind of music is good, except the boring kind. — Rossini

Ken B

You view it as allegory Andrei, but not everyone has over time. And as a factual guide to world it is ... deficient

Florestan

Quote from: Ken B on October 12, 2019, 03:45:24 PM
You view it as allegory Andrei, but not everyone has over time. And as a factual guide to world it is ... deficient

Straw men.
Every kind of music is good, except the boring kind. — Rossini

j winter

Thanks to all for the guidance on matters Roman.   :)

My birth sign is Gemini, and my wife smiles because I always tend to go two ways at once, usually serious and silly.  Case in point, the other book I'm reading at the moment, in addition to Gibbon, is this (very highly recommended if you're a fan of the show)....

The man that hath no music in himself,
Nor is not moved with concord of sweet sounds,
Is fit for treasons, stratagems, and spoils.
The motions of his spirit are dull as night,
And his affections dark as Erebus.
Let no such man be trusted.

-- William Shakespeare, The Merchant of Venice

Ken B

The criticism of Gibbon has concentrated on the Byzantium parts, but that is not the reason I have so far only read excerpts (maybe 800 pages). We know so much that was unknown in Gibbon's time, and you cannot get that from Gibbon. You don't learn enough history per minute, and what you learn you cannot really rely on. It's great as drama.

Peter Heather has written some excellent books.

Moonfish

Harold Bloom passed away....    :'(

I liked how he championed the canon and that is of course a whole topic of its own. A thread anybody? I'm grateful for his ideas and guidance navigating the great classics. Of course, his is not the only way to view our global literary heritage, but still an important voice among many others.



NYT: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/14/books/harold-bloom-dead.html

An interesting piece in The Atlantic
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/10/harold-bloom-read-everything/600022/

New Yorker: https://www.newyorker.com/culture/postscript/misreading-harold-bloom
"Every time you spend money you are casting a vote for the kind of world you want...."
Anna Lappé

Ken B

Quote from: Moonfish on October 16, 2019, 01:00:18 PM
Harold Bloom passed away....    :'(

I liked how he championed the canon and that is of course a whole topic of its own. A thread anybody? I'm grateful for his ideas and guidance navigating the great classics. Of course, his is not the only way to view our global literary heritage, but still an important voice among many others.



NYT: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/14/books/harold-bloom-dead.html

An interesting piece in The Atlantic
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/10/harold-bloom-read-everything/600022/

New Yorker: https://www.newyorker.com/culture/postscript/misreading-harold-bloom

I liked his attitude: I am not telling anyone what to read or how to read, I am telling them about the books I found worth rereading, and why.

ritter

Just starting this:

[asin]B07TQYSBPQ[/asin]

The bulk of this is unpublished tales--in various states of completion-- written by the 20 year old Proust (at the time of Les plaisirs et les jours), dealing in different ways with the awareness of his homosxuality (which explains to an extent the suppresison of these texts).

SimonNZ

#9469
Was it you who posted the book on Proust  winning the Prix Goncourt? How was that in the end? I've been waiting for it to show up in English but no sign yet.

ritter

Quote from: SimonNZ on October 18, 2019, 01:54:06 AM
Was it you who posted the book on Or just winning the Prix Goncourt? How was that in the end? I've been waiting for it to show up in English but no sign yet.
Indeed, it was me who posted that. It was a pleasure to read. One could have thought that the subject matter wouldn't have warranted its 272 pages, but it went by in a flash. The inside dealings of how the prize is awarded--Léon Daudet (a notorious nationalist and antisemite turned out to be Proust's strongest champion among the jury)--, the machinations of Proust's publishers and of the other strong contender--Roland Dorgèles for his now almost forgotten Les croix de bois (the controversy was mainly about crowning Proust's "escapist" work over Dorgèles's patriotic celebration of war heroes)--, all make for entertaining reading.

SimonNZ

Thanks. I hope it won't be too far away in translation.

Also those Camus / Cesares letters.

Florestan



Ernst Junger - Das Sanduhrbuch (The Hourglass Book)

A charming and erudite book about the history and philosophy of time measurement with special regard to hourglasses.
Every kind of music is good, except the boring kind. — Rossini

Ken B

Quote from: Florestan on October 18, 2019, 03:19:24 AM


Ernst Junger - Das Sanduhrbuch (The Hourglass Book)

A charming and erudite book about the history and philosophy of time measurement with special regard to hourglasses.

I assume you read Storm of Steel. I read something else by a much older EJ too, but cannot remember what.

TD, The Sentence is Death, the latest mystery by Anthony Horowitz. Fun so far.


j winter

Quick break from the Gibbon to revisit some classic sci-fi.  It's probably been 35 years since I last read these... Lazarus Long is such a cantankerous old cuss  ;D



The man that hath no music in himself,
Nor is not moved with concord of sweet sounds,
Is fit for treasons, stratagems, and spoils.
The motions of his spirit are dull as night,
And his affections dark as Erebus.
Let no such man be trusted.

-- William Shakespeare, The Merchant of Venice

Florestan

Quote from: Ken B on October 18, 2019, 05:54:55 AM
I assume you read Storm of Steel.

No, I didn't. I read On The Marble Cliffs and Heliopolis. Both excellent.
Every kind of music is good, except the boring kind. — Rossini

André

Storm of Steel is a powerful first person account of combats and life on the front during WWI. Jünger was wounded 14 times and was the youngest ever recipient of Pour le Mérite, Prussia's highest war distinction. André Gide considered Storm of Steel the best récit de guerre he had read. Much recommended.


j winter

Quote from: André on October 18, 2019, 04:48:07 PM
Storm of Steel is a powerful first person account of combats and life on the front during WWI. Jünger was wounded 14 times and was the youngest ever recipient of Pour le Mérite, Prussia's highest war distinction. André Gide considered Storm of Steel the best récit de guerre he had read. Much recommended.



Seconded, that's an amazing book
The man that hath no music in himself,
Nor is not moved with concord of sweet sounds,
Is fit for treasons, stratagems, and spoils.
The motions of his spirit are dull as night,
And his affections dark as Erebus.
Let no such man be trusted.

-- William Shakespeare, The Merchant of Venice

JBS

It seems to be available from Penguin Classics in a couple of different printings. I vote this as the best cover


The original English translation (1929) is also available.

Hollywood Beach Broadwalk