Mahler Mania, Rebooted

Started by Greta, May 01, 2007, 08:06:38 PM

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Sergeant Rock

#380
Quote from: Greta on May 28, 2008, 03:51:53 PM
Sarge - haven't gotten to hear the 6th yet, but it is the 5th through 7th I am most wild about, and can't WAIT to hear, someday....Mackerras and Boulez still stand as my favorites...

I've heard all the symphonies live, including the Tenth, but I've heard the Sixth live more often than any other. And you know I should have heard Boulez in Berlin last year but didn't notice that concert started at 4 PM instead of at 8 like the rest of the Staatkapelle's Mahler cycle. I napped through the performance, in a hotel room fifteen miles from the Philharmonie.  :'(

Oh, well, the tickets still make good bookmarks....$300 book marks  ;D



My next live Mahler will be in June. Järvi's conducting Britten's arrangement of second movement of the Third: "What the flowers told me" at the Alte Oper in Frankfurt. I'm looking forward to this concert. Besides the Mahler/Britten they're playing Berg's Altenberg-Lieder, five Strauss Lieder (Christine Schäfer) and Brahms Fourth. Later in the month Järvi's conducting Mahler 4 at Kloster Eberbach, an impressive monastery in the Rheingau: wine and Mahler. Perfect.

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

knight66

Sarge, It was July of 1976. We were seemingly cultural ambassadors to the US in its bicentennial year. I had been looking forward to Leinsdorf as a highlight, but it just did not turn out that way. But there were plenty of highlights in other places.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

bhodges

Quote from: knight on May 26, 2008, 02:47:00 AM
Anybody - your first live Mahler? What was it like? What work and performers, and do you remember being devastated by the experience?

Barring a memory lapse, I am 99% sure that my first live Mahler was in 1984, this performance of the Second with Leonard Bernstein and the New York Philharmonic (and from which the Deutsche Grammophon recording was made).  Needless to say, it was quite an overwhelming experience, one that brought tears to the eyes of many of us in the audience. 

--Bruce

Solitary Wanderer

Quote from: Solitary Wanderer on May 28, 2008, 03:59:34 PM
I had three live Mahler concerts last year being; 5,2 & 4.

The performance of #2 was the highlight of the year.

Simply awe inspiring music.

A friend sung in the choir and complained beforehand how she disliked Mahler and that he was too 'Teutonic'. After the performance she told me she'd changed her opinion  :)

Quote from: Auferstehung on May 28, 2008, 04:10:38 PM
What orchestra, choir, and under who?

10/11/2006  #5  NZSO  Susanna Malkki Conductor [First time I've seen a female conductor]

09/03/2007  #2  NZSO + Chapman Tripp Opera Chorus [plus a massed choir of voices] Patricia Wright Soprano & Helen Medlyn Mezzo Soprano James Judd Conductor. Highlight of the year  :)

13/04/07  #4  NZSO  Kiri Te Kanawa Soprano  Lawrence Renes Conductor

'I lingered round them, under that benign sky: watched the moths fluttering among the heath and harebells, listened to the soft wind breathing through the grass, and wondered how any one could ever imagine unquiet slumbers for the sleepers in that quiet earth.' ~ Emily Bronte

Bonehelm

Anyone heard Edo de Waart's Mahler? Apparently he did almost a full cycle with the HKPO since taking over as Musical Director in 2004, but I haven't had the opportunity to hear them.

Sergeant Rock

Quote from: knight on May 29, 2008, 11:24:33 AM
Sarge, It was July of 1976. We were seemingly cultural ambassadors to the US in its bicentennial year. I had been looking forward to Leinsdorf as a highlight, but it just did not turn out that way. But there were plenty of highlights in other places.

Mike

I was definitely not in Ohio in July of '76. That was a hot summer in Europe. The German wine was outstanding...century wine, they call it (a vintage so good it happens only a few times per century). July was the month the future Mrs. Rock and I ruined her parents' garden while they were on holiday. We had more interesting things to do than water the garden ;D

Leinsdorf was a guest conductor often in Cleveland (he'd been the orchestra's music director between Rodzinski and Szell). Poor Leinsdorf...fate was cruel to him. One reason he was given the directorship is because he agreed to work for a bargain price. But shortly after he got the job, he was drafted! He spent most of his Cleveland tenure conducting army bands instead of his orchestra. Once Cleveland (the press, the audience, the patrons, the board) heard Szell conduct Beethoven, Leinsdorf was finished as director.

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

knight66

It was a bit of a dispiriting experience really. He clearly could not organise the forces and I am pretty sure he was not always absolutely with us in the score as he was very erratic in giving us entries and for that matter signaling what he was wanting to the orchestra.

At one point, he said we ought to lead him, not him us....a curious idea, he certainly was not following me. I think the sopranos were the ones he was following.

Bizarrely we also then after the Mahler sang Mozart's Ave verum!

76 was when I got married, indeed the year of the drought in England. Our wedding prep was rather erratic. We decided in May to marry in August and I was singing in the US for almost the whole of July.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

J.Z. Herrenberg

Quote from: Sergeant Rock on May 30, 2008, 08:22:10 AM
I was definitely not in Ohio in July of '76. That was a hot summer in Europe. The German wine was outstanding...century wine, they call it (a vintage so good it happens only a few times per century). July was the month the future Mrs. Rock and I ruined her parents' garden while they were on holiday. We had more interesting things to do than water the garden ;D

I remember that summer very well, too. It was the Bayreuth centenary, I was deep into Wagner and I came mentally of age then (15) and had a wonderful tryst, too - with my Muse...

Où sont les neiges d'antan?
Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything. -- Plato

Sergeant Rock

Quote from: knight on May 30, 2008, 08:31:22 AM
76 was when I got married, indeed the year of the drought in England....

Yes, a drought too in Germany...hence the great wine (droughts concentrate the sugar in the grapes: less liquid but of a much higher quality) and hence the withering of her parents' vegetable garden.

Quote from: Jezetha on May 31, 2008, 02:37:45 AM
Où sont les neiges d'antan?

Indeed...where...

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

M forever

My first live Mahler experience may have been with Leinsdorf, too. I do remember I only saw him conduct the BP once in the early 80s, and that was the 1st. But I am not sure if that was the first live Mahler I heard.
Or maybe it was the 1st with Bertini and the BP (I also heard that with him and the WDRSO, but I am sure that was several years later, early 90s or so).
Or maybe the 2nd with Abbado and the ECYO (open air, in the Waldbühne in Berlin which is, well, a large open air location).
Or maybe the 5th with Abbado and the LSO.
Or maybe the 3rd with Mehta and the WP (in Vienna, on a school trip).
Or maybe the 3rd with Levine and the BP.
I am not sure. I do remember these are some of the earliest live Mahler performances I have heard, but I don't recall exactly when and in what order that was, apart from that it was in the early-mid 80s. I have heard so many Mahler performances since then it all blurs together in my memory although I do remember many outstanding individual performances clearly. Just not really exactly when that was.




mn dave

It's interesting, at a brief scan, how many Mahler symphony box sets get five stars, or nearly so, at Amazon. Makes it rather hard to choose though--if you're basing your purchase on Amazon ratings. Which I'm not.  ;D

John Copeland

Yes...I am changing my mind rather dramatically re - Boulez and his Mahler third...and the rest...it might in fact, after all my carping and degrading of it...it might in fact be the best set out there now that I'm giving it a VERY serious ear thanks to M forever. :o

greg

Quote from: mahler10th on June 13, 2008, 06:20:49 AM
Yes...I am changing my mind rather dramatically re - Boulez and his Mahler third...and the rest...it might in fact, after all my carping and degrading of it...it might in fact be the best set out there now that I'm giving it a VERY serious ear thanks to M forever. :o
Ok, now that's M's queue to say that he's glad to have helped. ;)


Amazing how little I post here. I guess it'd help if i had several box sets and could discuss and compare them, right? Or else I'd be talking music theory which few would be interested in...



John Copeland

#393
Quote from: GGGGRRREEG on June 15, 2008, 02:35:39 PM
Ok, now that's M's queue to say that he's glad to have helped. ;)


Amazing how little I post here. I guess it'd help if i had several box sets and could discuss and compare them, right? Or else I'd be talking music theory which few would be interested in...




Last Mahler I saw was couple of months ago, BBC Scottish Symphony Orchestra in Glasgow City Halls doing Mahlers 4rth [EDIT:  See above, it wasn't the fourth which I've been sitting listening to for a few hours, it was the 5th.) under the direction of Robert Spano (of Atlanta SO).  Excellent stuff, especially from the trombones and horns.  A real treat from Spano, who keeps coming back to the BBCSSO for more.
I'm not changing my view that much on Boulez at all any more, checked a few other things out with some of his other recordings.  His third is indeed very good, and so is 9, but there's so much from three or four others that leave a lot to be desired.  I'm happy to have been put right on the third, though, but in the end, I would swap a Boulez Mahler for a Tennstedt or Abbado almost immediately.


M forever

Quote from: mahler10th on June 15, 2008, 04:35:28 PM
Last Mahler I saw was last month, BBC Scottish Symphony Orchestra in Glasgow City Halls doing Mahlers 4rth under the direction of Robert Spano (of Atlanta SO).  Excellent stuff, especially from the trombones and horns.

There are no trombones in Mahler's 4th.

Oops.

John Copeland

#395
 :-[My apologies, I have been listening to Mahlers fourth for the past two or three hours by different composers (including Boulez, Abbado and Solti) - so I've got crosswired.  Anyway, now edited, it was Mahlers 5th, I'll post the review I made which was previously published on another forum. :P

Here it is, not sure if this thread is the right place for it though.  Originally posted on CMM, minor edits.

Wed March 15th 7.30pm Glasgow City Halls., Scotland
Robert Spano BBC SSO
The Programme: Britten - Serenade for tenor, horn and strings
Mahler - 5th Symphony

The Players for Britten: Andrew Kennedy - Tenor, David Pyatt - Horn

The concert opened with Brittens' Serenade. This was not something I'd heard before, but after hearing it, it is something I WILL get. The Serenade contains 8 pieces, the first and last being played solo horn on natural harmonics. Pyatt, winner of the 1988 Young Musician of the Year, brings in the Serenade with intelligence and balance. Then the Orchestra starts up and Kennedy joins in with the Pastoral. His singing is clear and he stands quite erect throughout the performance, only wobbling his head occasionally, but he's enjoying it - unfortunately enjoying it for him seems to mean staring straight ahead and only sometimes finding enough in the poetic librettos to wobble. Still, he has a fine voice, his singing is beautiful, and all is well. He ends the Sonnet with its namesake, and his voice finishes it more than satisfactorily. The last piece, an offstage horn, is played beautifully and wistfully by Pyatt to end the Serenade. Plenty of applause, but somewhat belated, Spano stood wondering if anyone knew he had finished and near shrugged his shoulders before the clapping started. My hands were sore.

Next, the main event, Mahlers 5th. The Funeral March begins, and Spano looks like he knows where he's going. Elizabeth Layton, leader of the Orchestra, looks like she loves Mahler in a dreamy way, and I near fall in love with her too in a dreamy way.

The timpani are spot on, and Robert Spano gives it hell in the second movement, making sure the Orchestra keep in synch with his expressions and body movements, fleeing from first violins to double bass to absoloutley superb trumpet by Mark O'keefe, with passion from Spanos feet upward. This is quite in order as Mahler marked the movement to be played stormy, with vehemence.

The Scherzo third movement is a real tickler, Spano gives it the earthy folky feel it deserves, and it lives up to its title scherzo (literally 'Joke'), and the triangle is heard!

The famous Adagio fourth movement comes on with the conductor paying attention to the downbeats, and a magnificent weariness is born here, the World is just too much to take in, and the Orchestra under Spano lets us know that. There is scarcely a pause before Spano begins the fifth movement.

Many of the themes come together for the finale, the Adagio being prominent in this performance, and it is here we can hear (where Mahlers learning from Bachs scores) a fine balance of Polophony. There are melodies here not intertwined, but bouncing off each other in a coherent way, meeting and culminating in an expression of optimism and complete joy.

Noteworthy were Mark O'Keefe on trumpet, an absoloutley spellbinding job with no silly vibrato, David Flack (Horns), Simon Johnson and Philip Weldon (great Trombones).

My only problem with the entire performance was the Brass and Woodwind being one or two decibels louder than expected - Spano gave no let up in this and there was a little drowning going on. But then, that may be because of where I was sitting (in the cheap seats, above right of Orchestra) or the Hall acoustics - this was the only major flaw if one can call it that - it is Mahler, and some conductors (Solti et al.,) liked Mahler horns and trumpets etc to be loud as hell. Overall though, it was a superb performance, one I will remember, and Radio 3 rightly have recorded it for broadcast at a later date.

Well done Spano and the BBC SSO.

knight66

Thanks...a nice evocation of the live occasion. I think Spano is underrated. If you want any suggestions for a specific Britten recording, let me know.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

greg

no, i wasn't searching for "mailer mania", thanks anyways  ::)


what does everyone think about this recording?

i got it from the library (different cover) and was pleasantly surprised. I see Bruce likes it.
Nice choices of tempi, balance of orchestration throughout. Everything is pretty crystal clear in the recording, too.

M forever

Overall, the best Mahler 5 I have ever heard on a recording. Great music making and meticulous attention to detail in a very coherent, thought-through concept.

Dancing Divertimentian

Quote from: GGGGRRREEG on June 26, 2008, 07:15:29 PM
what does everyone think about this recording?

i got it from the library (different cover) and was pleasantly surprised. I see Bruce likes it.
Nice choices of tempi, balance of orchestration throughout. Everything is pretty crystal clear in the recording, too.


Fine choice. One of my faves...




Veit Bach-a baker who found his greatest pleasure in a little cittern which he took with him even into the mill and played while the grinding was going on. In this way he had a chance to have the rhythm drilled into him. And this was the beginning of a musical inclination in his descendants. JS Bach