Robert Simpson(1921-1997)

[snyprrr]

As I suggested once in another forum, for me a Simpson Symphony is like an enormous and brilliantly constructed architectural shell, - but with no life going on inside that one can participate in and respond to.  Walk around a bit and be impressed by the meticulous logic and precision of its engineering, or stand back and feel awe over the spectacle of its scale and grandeur.   But take a position at its center with the whole of oneself open to its force and impact, and prepare to have all your human sensibilities crushed rather than called to, - the weight and hardness and coldness of steel bearing down.  I've used a cosmic analogy (i.e. the architecture of the heavens) with different metaphors to describe my experience on occasion, but the communicated effect is similar.  Simpson's music appeals strongly to "isolated intellect" and "dissociated emotion".  That's what I mean when I call it sterile and alienated.

Exactly!

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

I was especially crushed by the String Quartets.

Oh, that sounds horrible.    Maybe you should sue the Simpson estate for damages. What was it that crushed you?

Always, always be wary of letting 'earth people' listen to 'our' music. If you think it's beautiful, they'll think it's creepy; if you think it's peaceful, they'll think it's despairing; if you hear the cosmos, they hear hell.

Yeah, but sometimes you get some interesting responses. 

[snyprrr]

Oh, that sounds horrible.    Maybe you should sue the Simpson estate for damages. What was it that crushed you?

Yeah, but sometimes you get some interesting responses.

The Penguin Guide's frothing, grail-like prostration in front of RS's SQs is what tricked me. I found all his SQs (minus the Haydn, which I must surely get one day!) to be... unfriendly.


And yes, one does get some interesting responses sometimes... 'words of babes'.

[springrite]

I like his Haydn and the #1 the best so far. But I need to listen more attentively to his other quartets in the coming months, probably using headphones at airport.

[calyptorhynchus]

Re: String Quartets

10 is my absolute favourite, I love 1-3, also 13, 15 and 9, of course). But they're all good.

Love both the String Quintets, the first String Quintet may be my favourite Simpson full stop.

As you why I played the family the SQ 10, it was simply because of the discussion that preceded it, I've also played them the 9th Symphony and other works.

(Recently I got into trouble because I was playing one of the David Matthews Symphonies very loudly and our three cats, previously sleeping peacefully, were observed running away  ).

[Dundonnell]

I have it on the very best authority that Raphael Wallfisch, who commissioned and premiered the Simpson Cello Concerto, is very anxious to record the work.

All that is needed is a record company prepared to undertake such a recording.

[Mirror Image]

I have it on the very best authority that Raphael Wallfisch, who commissioned and premiered the Simpson Cello Concerto, is very anxious to record the work.

All that is needed is a record company prepared to undertake such a recording.

Why doesn't Hyperion record it? Since they released the symphonies and SQs, it is only logical.

[calyptorhynchus]

Re recording of Cello Concerto,

The difficulty might be that they have to find the right work or works to couple it with, they might think that a C20 cello concerto by a composer without a wide following is a risky venture and they might think they need to couple it with a better known piece to sell it.

From the point of view of a Simpsonophile the ideal recording would be the Cello Concerto coupled with the Flute and Piano Concertos (77 minutes total, would fit on one CD).

[Mirror Image]

Re recording of Cello Concerto,

The difficulty might be that they have to find the right work or works to couple it with, they might think that a C20 cello concerto by a composer without a wide following is a risky venture and they might think they need to couple it with a better known piece to sell it.

From the point of view of a Simpsonophile the ideal recording would be the Cello Concerto coupled with the Flute and Piano Concertos (77 minutes total, would fit on one CD).

This hasn't stopped Hyperion before. They released all of the symphony recordings and then they reissued them all in a box set. Hyperion makes plenty of money from their other recordings, they can afford to release a CD of Simpson's concerti.

[Dundonnell]

I wish that I knew why Hyperion did not fulfill their commitment to add the concertos after the releaseof the symphonies. I suspect that the death of Ted Perry, the founder of the company and a fan of Simpson's music, and the uncertain market may have affected the decision. Simon Perry, Ted's son, may not be so keen

A coupling of the Cello, Flute and Piano Concertos might make perfect sense to us but I suspect it might be considered commercially too risky

I am restrained in what it would be appropriate for me to say publicly There MAY be companies who just MIGHT be interested in recording the cello concerto, perhaps coupled with another cello concerto..........BUT there is a huge gap between "interest" and action. And that gap is quite simply- as ever- money. I might be able to play the concerto (hypothetically, of course ), I may want to record it but I have to persuade a record company to put up the cost of, not just paying me, but paying an orchestra and a conductor, hiring a recording venue etc etc. And, at a time of financial difficulties, I have to persuade the company's accountants that there will not be a substantial loss.

There's the rub.............

[Lethevich]

Re recording of Cello Concerto,

The difficulty might be that they have to find the right work or works to couple it with, they might think that a C20 cello concerto by a composer without a wide following is a risky venture and they might think they need to couple it with a better known piece to sell it.

If it's not Hyperion who records it, I would be pretty happy with it being coupled by a new recording of one of his symphonies (which are already proven quantities) - especially in light of Simpson himself believing that the Hyperion recordings could be improved upon.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Alex Ross (of The Rest Is Noise) writes about Simpson and a bit about Brian. "I will have a bit more to say about Simpson in The New Yorker soon", he announces:


http://www.therestisnoise.com/2012/03/simpson-in-america.html

[calyptorhynchus]

Does anyone know if anyone is writing a biography of Simpson, I'd love to read a good biography of him.

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

Alex Ross (of The Rest Is Noise) writes about Simpson

Nice to see he's getting some mainstream attention.

[calyptorhynchus]

Dundonnell has pointed out here that Simpson originally wrote the slow movement of the 4th as an adagio, then changed the tempo to andante, because he felt that... I don't know, the adagio was too long and out of place?

Anyway, I know the 4th quite well, but yesterday I listened to the slow movement on its own. What a beautiful piece, but now, like Dundonnell, I want to hear the adagio version because I think that as an andante it is bit overshadowed by the fast music of the other three movements. Here's a thought, there is a recording from the BBC of Andrew Davies conducting the 4th on Unsung Composers. Can't someone who is very clever with audio software take out the slow movement from this recording and slow it down to adagio (say 75% speed) without altering the pitch, then we could all listen and decide!

ps I have downloaded both the Andrew Davies recordings on UC (4th and 5th) to compare with the Hyperion's Handley recordings. Simpson is said to have disliked these as 'tentative', and preferred Davies recordings. Well if Handley's 5th is tentative I'm not sure I can survive listening to Davies version, they'll find me dead with blood running out of my ears.... Anyway, if I survive I'll report back.

[calyptorhynchus]

It's OK, I survived. The Davies' 5th is an average quality off-the-radio recording from the 1970s. I actually prefer it to the Handley, not because the former sounds tentative to me and Davies is less tentative, but because Davies seems to make much more of the two canone movements (2 & 4 out of 5). It seemed like I was hearing them for the first time, if you know what I mean.

On to the Davies' 4th today!

[calyptorhynchus]

Ok, just listened to Davis' (apologies for calling him Davies earlier) Simpson 4 (undated) from the BBC.

The quality is worse than his BBC No.5 broadcast from 1978, so I'm thinking it might be earlier. In which case might he be playing the first version with the Adagio slow movement? His 3rd movement is about 13' as opposed to Handley's 10' 30" on Hyperion, which is about how long that movement should last if it's adagio not andante.

Anyway, I preferred this recording to Handley's in nearly every way, the first movement was both more playful (in the playful bits), and scary (in the scary bits), the scherzo was more grounded, less manic, but more titanic in its energy and more impressive, the slow movement (regardless of whether it is the andante or adagio version) is slower, and more measured, and the finale is more exultant. In Handley's recording Simpson use of side-drum and piccolo and high fifth harmonics is sometimes made to sound shrill and unbalanced, this recording is much better in that regard (side-drum less foregrounded).

[eyeresist]

Dundonnell has pointed out here that Simpson originally wrote the slow movement of the 4th as an adagio, then changed the tempo to andante, because he felt that... I don't know, the adagio was too long and out of place?

Possibly Simpson was just spooked by a dragging performance, and felt he should ensure the movement was slow but not TOO slow.

Sounds like Andrew Davis is one to check out.

[calyptorhynchus]

Over on the Havergal Brian thread I was talking about how HB's 23rd symphony was a formal joke, it sounds to me like the two outer movements of a symphony, with no slow movement or scherzo (of the traditional four). I then mentioned Simpson's Quartet 12 as the exact opposite:

"Robert Simpson sq no 12 is a long slow movement followed by a long scherzo, it's a complete work of great power, but if you think of it as the middle two movements of a 4 movement sq, like Haydn's last, unfinished sq, the form gains more point. It's hard to imagine how huge and powerful this work would be with the full four movements--inhumanly huge, so these two will suffice."

(Quoting myself, very poor form). Anyway, all this is a prelude to saying I was listening to the Flute Concerto yesterday and I think this is another formal joke. What I hear happening is that the piece starts off quietly, but then things get scary and fast and violent (no surprises), then about a third of the way through the piece settles down to a slower, more peaceful movement and we start thinking "Ha, Simpson is writing a fast-slow-fast structure here" However, the slow movement just doesn't stop, it keeps and gets calmer and more beautiful and this persists right until the end, defeating our expectations.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

[Without wanting to turn this into another HB thread, No. 22 is also in two movements, and so is No. 30...]