Serialism

[greg]

It's a pretty fine distinction - you'd still have to describe the others as serial music. But after writing two or three works which were 100% strictly serial, Boulez was already exploring ways of extending the idea, admitting controlled improvisation, that sort of thing. There could be all sorts of explanations for this, of course.

Probably he just wanted to have a little fun, throw some new ideas around, stuff like that.

[karlhenning]

Really? I would've thought that'd he'd have written a couple more. Probably, then, Babbitt is the guy who wrote the most totally serialized music.

Still, Greg, these are calculations and operations . . . but the object of the calculations and operations is some stuff;  what is the nature of the stuff, and where does it come from?

[lukeottevanger]

Probably he just wanted to have a little fun, throw some new ideas around, stuff like that.

I think there was a little more to it than that. I don't think Boulez - especially at that time - really comprehended the idea of 'fun' In any case, he never returned to the style of those uncompromising early serial pieces.

[karlhenning]

Miscomprehended it, and somehow mistrusted it, Luke! 

[Maciek]

There is very, very little 'purely mathematical' music such as rappy postulates around, and even then, we have to ask, with Karl 'I still wonder if there is any such thing as "music which is only  based on mathematical calculations" '

That is exactly the picky argument I wanted to use.

[Danny]

Pardon my ignorance, but what are the tonal rows exactly?

[Danny]

Pardon my ignorance, but what are the tonal rows exactly?

As used in serialism. 

[Maciek]

Danny, you talking to yourself again?

[Dancing Divertimentian]

man, you ARE lucky 
if i get a wife that likes serial music, too, that would be so great...  0:)

I truly am blessed!

And she took to it all on her own. No prodding like my attempts with Beethoven, Schubert, Mozart, et al... None of the 'classics' took.

A natural born Lady Weirdears!

[Danny]

Danny, you talking to yourself again?

Yeah.  I googled myself the answer and then repeated it to me.   Over............and over.................and over.

Danny, you said that well........

Danny, why thank you!

[val]

I don't think that I listen to some work because of its serialism ... I listen to the work of a composer. I love Schönberg's string Trio, Webern's Quartet opus 28 and the Cantatas, Boulez "Pli selon Pli" not because they have a serial technique but because they are beautiful.

[Maciek]

Yeah.  I googled myself the answer and then repeated it to me.   Over............and over.................and over.

Danny, you said that well........

Danny, why thank you!

I do that all the time.

(Google for an answer, I mean. )

Well, thanks for sharing some of your inner life with us.

[quintett op.57]

I chose the 2nd answer
I haven't many. Almost Only piano : Boulez, Webern and Schonberg. I bear but it still not a passion, I think I should get Schonberg quartets
I love Schonberg's Verklarte nacht and I think that, for me, a quartet is a better introduction to this music than piano. Simply because I prefer strings.

Is there anything in common between Verklarte Nacht and Schonberg serial works?

[DavidW]

That's a good argument, David (mine was going to be more picky so I decided to withdraw 0:)). But I wonder if a more modern example wouldn't have been better? I've been told (I'm not sure if this is true) that medieval builders (no such thing as an architect in those times) did not really have the maths necessary to calculate all that stuff - they built it all on a mix of intuition and experience (hence also some terrible building disasters). The only ones who had decent mathematics in those times were the Arabs - and they weren't sharing. But maybe that's all made up...?

Well you got me there, I wasn't aware that they didn't have a logical approach to it.  That makes it a good example.  I don't think that composers are mathematicians.  Composers are like those gothic architects-- they have reason for the structures that they build but they are not doing math to construct their elegant art.

[karlhenning]

Excellent, David!

[greg]

I do that all the time.

(Google for an answer, I mean. )

Well, thanks for sharing some of your inner life with us.

now to do a google search about Mr.Osa

[greg]

hm, it wasn't that exciting

[Maciek]

Well, the greg.org that comes up as the first result when googling "greg" is quite interesting...

[karlhenning]

greg.org

You fill me with a nameless fear, Maciek! 

[greg]

Well, the greg.org that comes up as the first result when googling "greg" is quite interesting...