Who are the mediocrities of conducting?

[Renfield]

That's probably thanks to Mullova, whom is brilliant, but his Swan Lake etc S*CKED. Sorry, but they really S#CKED.

Howard

I also liked his conducting in it, otherwise I wouldn't have mentioned it: it has a nice "lilt".

[Lethevich]

I was surprised and disappointed by Marriner's complete Schubert symphonies on Philips. Very lack-lustre, except a very good "Unfinished" (the original movements, not the completions). Actually, I haven't yet found a good Schubert cycle. I have Marriner and Bohm.
What a quote!

Sawallisch is wonderful, and I doubt Wand could disappoint either.

[jochanaan]

...Actually, I haven't yet found a good Schubert cycle. I have Marriner and Bohm.

Off-topic reply:  Try either Abbado/Chamber Orchestra of Europe or, if you're adventurous, Harnoncourt/Concertgebouw.

[BachQ]

Norrington.  Marriner.

[greg]

Who are the mediocrities of conducting?

The conductor from Thomas the Tank Engine. The dude can't ever seem to control any of those trains, they always crash and get into trouble!

[vandermolen]

I saw Previn get some praise in a Rach thread recently. But, yeah, that's about it.

I like many Previn recordings. His Shostakovich Symphony 4 and 10 are excellent in my view as are many of his Vaughan Williams recordings. He is my first choice in symphonies 2,3,5 and 8 and his No 9 is very good too. I like Leinsdorf, especially his Prokofiev symphonies 2 and 6. Norman Del Mar conducted the worst performance I have heard of a Vaughan Williams symphony (No 3) but some of his records are very good (Moeran's Sinfonietta and Cello Concerto).  Norrington's Vaughan Williams cycle was a disappointment. Andrew Davis is rather variable but some excellent CDs (Hilding Rosenberg). Marriner's VW is very good I think.

[Bonehelm]

With so much music available on CD, and so many friendly connoisseurs on our fine forum, there's certainly no reason to listen to mediocre conductors; but a few of the names mentioned are worth further exploration, I think. 

I agree that Maazel's Prokofiev R&J & Vienna Sibelius are excellent; I also have and like 2 Wagner orchestral discs he did with Berlin, and a surprisingly good Tchaikovsky 6 on CBS Masterworks a while back.

I can't quite bring myself to totally diss Marriner, as he basically introduced me to Vivaldi and, to a lesser extent, Mozart.  I've since found conductors that I greatly prefer for both composers, but every now and then I still like to revisit the ASMF's Vivaldi.  I also liked his Schubert set a little bit better than eyeresist, though it's certainly not a top choice (I'm currently infatuated with Blomstedt's Schubert cycle, which is available as a cheap MP3 download from Amazon, but that's another thread.)

The one famous conductor who has consistently eluded me is Solti.  I've tried lots of recordings, but the only ones I care for at all are some of his Brahms and Haydn, surprisingly enough.  I actively dislike his Beethoven, Mahler, and Wagner (though I haven't heard his whole Ring) -- to me he sounds loud, aimless, and boring, as if he's trying to generate excitement but can't quite channel it to any musical purpose -- his rhythms don't flow, and he stomps around when he ought to be dancing, so to speak.  Great orchestra, but to me his CSO recordings sound rather like a middle-aged accountant trying vainly to impress by driving a Porsche.  Lots of folks love him, though, so I wouldn't really call him mediocre -- just not my cup of tea.

O god 

[Brian]

The conductor from Thomas the Tank Engine. The dude can't ever seem to control any of those trains, they always crash and get into trouble!

There's a difference between mediocre and bad 

Andrew Davis seems a good choice.

[Dancing Divertimentian]

O god 

Oh God, what?

I don't like Solti, either. To me the guy just mashes on the accelerator and obliterates anything like nuance, color, rhythm, and so forth. If you gotta have go-go-go all the time then Solti's your man. But rest assured you're only getting half the musical story.

To me Solti is so boring I just want to smack him. He made some very fine Mozart opera recordings late in his career but they succeed only because he finally laid off the accelerator. He actually let some nuance creep in! Good for him! More of this and he might have achieved true artistic success.

[Renfield]

Oh God, what?

I don't like Solti, either. To me the guy just mashes on the accelerator and obliterates anything like nuance, color, rhythm, and so forth. If you gotta have go-go-go all the time then Solti's your man. But rest assured you're only getting half the musical story.

To me Solti is so boring I just want to smack him. He made some very fine Mozart opera recordings late in his career but they succeed only because he finally laid off the accelerator. He actually let some nuance creep in! Good for him! More of this and he might have achieved true artistic success.

Thanks. Though I do think a couple of his early recordings are also pretty salvageable, musically.

But with the CSO, "go-go-go all the time", indeed: very well put. Brass, flash and bang.

[Wanderer]

I never felt any special affinity for Solti's interpretations, either. His recordings seem rather mundane to me; mildly interesting at best (Schubert's Ninth) and sometimes disastrous (Elgar's First). He may also have ruined my chances to properly appreciate Elgar's Second Symphony (or the piece is just plain bad that way ). I had the felicitous chance to purchase Sinopoli's version of Elgar's First symphony many years ago while in Prague (at the time, an unknown work by an unknown composer). Some years later, I got the Solti twofer of both symphonies and could not believe my ears as to the hideousness I experienced. Rarely before or after have I had such a negative reaction against a recording.   

[Harry]

I never felt any special affinity for Solti's interpretations, either. His recordings seem rather mundane to me; mildly interesting at best (Schubert's Ninth) and sometimes disastrous (Elgar's First). He may also have ruined my chances to properly appreciate Elgar's Second Symphony (or the piece is just plain bad that way ). I had the felicitous chance to purchase Sinopoli's version of Elgar's First symphony many years ago while in Prague (at the time, an unknown work by an unknown composer). Some years later, I got the Solti twofer of both symphonies and could not believe my ears as to the hideousness I experienced. Rarely before or after have I had such a negative reaction against a recording.   

I am almost afraid to give my impression, (of Solti's conducting, meeting with the wrath of Tasos,) I had and still have with Solti's Elgar, but I think this Decca twofar are the best interpretations I ever heard from Elgar, and some reference should be made to his excellent recordings of the Brahms symphonies also on Decca, which belong firmly to my favourites.
That said, I think his Mahler loud and vulgar, and his Bruckner did nothing for me.
He was a great maestro nevertheless.

[Wanderer]

No wrath forthcoming, Harry, rest assured. 
The damage Solti's inflicted is well past and mended (and said recording's buried in the sunless depths of my collection, unlikely to resurface any time soon).

[Harry]

No wrath forthcoming, Harry, rest assured. 
The damage Solti's inflicted is well past and mended (and said recording's buried in the sunless depths of my collection, unlikely to resurface any time soon).

Maybe you should start a Refusal Bin thread too?

[Renfield]

Maybe you should start a Refusal Bin thread too?

"Wanderer's Sunless Dungeon"

You know, I recall enjoying that Elgar one somewhat, but in an entirely superficial sort of way; like any other instance when I've enjoyed Solti's conducting. But even under that premise, he wasn't a mediocrity: perhaps because of that premise, maybe.

Mediocrities are usually the "mehs", not the "gahs", if you catch my drift.

[greg]

If you gotta have go-go-go all the time then Solti's your man.

No wonder I like his Mahler 7 so much.....

[Anne]

There is a DVD out on the opera Hansel und Gretel conducted by Solti that I think is wonderful.  When the children are sleeping and the angels come to watch over them, the way he conducts that music is so beautiful.

[hautbois]

There is a DVD out on the opera Hansel und Gretel conducted by Solti that I think is wonderful.  When the children are sleeping and the angels come to watch over them, the way he conducts that music is so beautiful.

I have never really heard a lot of Solti to make a comment, but the Hansel und Gretel is one of my most revered albums of all time among everything i have ever heard. It's beautifully made. The VPO really shines here.

Howard

[lukeottevanger]

And who rates Ozawa highly, anyways? 

I like his Gurrelieder.... That's about it, though.

[jochanaan]

I have never really heard a lot of Solti to make a comment, but the Hansel und Gretel is one of my most revered albums of all time among everything i have ever heard. It's beautifully made. The VPO really shines here.

Howard

Hmmm...Maybe they were paying no attention to the man on the podium?

I've heard a lot of Solti; my first Mahler set was the 1970s Solti.  I thought he was a sine qua non--until I started actually studying Mahler's scores. The trouble I have now with Solti is not the intensity he generates--there's no question of that--but the way he extreme-izes every nuance.  He's one conductor who actually DOES overexaggerate to the distortion point; and that's hard to do with Mahler!  (Although if you study Mahler's directions, he insists that many of his nuances should be "unnoticeable.")  On the other hand, I was extremely surprised by his 1975 Eroica with Chicago; broadly paced, especially in the Funeral March, and exquisitely played.  I might call Solti several things--but "mediocre" is not one of them.