Johannes Brahms (1833-1897)

[amw]

Not like I'm an expert or anything but

Kertész/VPO
Jochum/LPO
Kempe/BPO
Walter/NYPO
Walter/CSO (2 + 3 only)
Walter/VPO (3 only)
Fricsay 2 (from the box)
Mackerras/SCO
Thielemann/Dresden
Les Dissonances (4 only)
Bernstein/NYPO (from the box)

I also go back and forth on whether or not to add the Kubelík/BRSO cycle or just to listen to it on streaming occasionally. And the Furtwängler/BPO 1, which is my favourite for that piece, but I still haven't bothered to download.

[Jo498]

I hope I'll get the nerve and leisure to do some comparative listening. The Giulini/Vienna is so slow that I might get rid of it although some seem to love it. I'll probably keep Wand's for nostalgia anyway (it was the first cycle I bought in the late 1980s) and I even have his Chicago 1st in addition to the NDR studio.
I certainly do not feel that I need about 10 or more recordings of those pieces.

[jlaurson]

I hope I'll get the nerve and leisure to do some comparative listening. The Giulini/Vienna is so slow that I might get rid of it although some seem to love it. I'll probably keep Wand's for nostalgia anyway (it was the first cycle I bought in the late 1980s) and I even have his Chicago 1st in addition to the NDR studio.
I certainly do not feel that I need about 10 or more recordings of those pieces.

Heresy! Wand still rocks the heck out of the Brahms Symphonies. Compare that to the Giulini drudge (doesn't matter which set) or the Haitink-pleasantry, and you'll know that you were onto a good; nay: Marvelous thing, right out of the gate! 

Update w/singles:

This probably belongs here more than in the WAYLN thread.

You show me yours, I'll show you mine. 




Abbado, BPh, DG


Berglund, COE, Ondine


Chailly, LGW, Decca


Eschenbach, Houston, Virgin-Erato
★★★(★)


Furtwaengler, WPh & BPh, EMI


Gielen, SWR SO BB&F, Hänssler


Giulini, Philharmonia, EMI-Warner


Haitink, RCO, Decca


Janowski, Pittsburgh, Pentatone
★★★(★)


Levine, WPh, DG


Rattle, BPh, EMI
★★★★★ (Review)


Thielemann, WPh, DG


Wand, NDR, RCA
★★★★★


Wand, NDR live, RCA

Elsewhere I am rather certain that I have a few more -- HvK 70s, Mackerras & Celi.

HvK 60s 2-4

1
Gardiner
Païta
Szell
Thielemann / MPhil
Wand / MPhil
Celi / VSO
Gergiev / LSO

2
Gergiev / LSO
Fricsay

4
Alsop

[Madiel]

Zero.

Still trying to choose a set.

[Drasko]

sets:

Abbado BPO
Rattle BPO
Thielemann SKD
Mravinsky Leningrad Phil
Walter NYPO
Jochum BPO
Giulini VPO

singles:

No.1
Klemperer Berlin State Opera
Mehta VPO
Fischer BFO
Krips VPO
Karajan BPO (live '88)
Markevitch Symphony of the Air
Furtwangler Hamburg NDRSO
Bohm BPO
Jochum ONdF
van Beinum Concertgebouw
Oistrakh Moscow Phil
Toscanini NBCSO ('41)
Stokowski Philadelphia ('36)

No.2
Fischer BFO
Walter ColSO
Monteux LSO
Monteux SFSO ('45)
Furtwangler VPO ('45)
Fricsay VPO
Kondrashin USSRSO
Bohm LSO
Schuricht VPO
Mengelberg Concertgebouw
Klemperer Philh.
Abendroth Hessian RSO

No.3
Krauss VPO
Koussevitzky BSO
Karajan BPO
Karajan VPO
Walter VPO
Walter ColSO
Mengelberg Concergebouw
Monteux BBC Northern SO
Levine VPO
Dohnanyi CO
Bernstein VPO
Furtwangler BPO
Ansermet Bavarian RSO
Bohm VPO ('53)
Kertesz VPO
Klemperer Philh.
Keilberth Hamburg State Philh.

No.4
Kleiber VPO
Furtwangler VPO ('50)
Furtwangler BPO ('42)
Weingartner LSO
De Sabata BPO
Mengelberg Concertgebouw
Koussevitzky BSO
Krips LSO
Markevitch Lamoureux
Markevitch USSRSO
Eliasberg Leningrad Phil.
Kertesz VPO
Wand NDR SO
Bernstein VPO
Fischer-Dieskau CzPO
Celibidache Milan RAI SO
Reiner Royal Philh.

(some of the favorites bolded)

[Dancing Divertimentian]

Heresy! Wand still rocks the heck out of the Brahms Symphonies. Compare that to the Giulini drudge (doesn't matter which set) or the Haitink-pleasantry, and you'll know that you were onto a good; nay: Marvelous thing, right out of the gate! 

Giulini's Vienna cycle can be challenging when it comes to its slowness but I find his 1 and 3 to be total successes. Yes, they're on the slowish side but they steer clear of the dreaded "dirge" effect. Speeds are just this side of acceptable.

It's the inner detail, the "inner life", that makes the interpretations work. And the warmth.

As far as Haitink, as I've mentioned, his Boston cycle is a cut above "pleasant". It's solid, memorable music-making.


 

[Jo498]

I also still like Wand, but I think that for the (more or less) lean and fast approach, Toscanini is more convincing.

Of singles I have

1
probably another Furtwängler
Abendroth
Böhm live orfeo
Horenstein Chesky
Scherchen
Giulini/LA
Levine/Vienna
Wand/Chicago live
Markevitch

2
Busch
Fricsay
Walter Columbia
Kegel

3
Szell Decca
Walter Columbia
Scherchen

4
De Sabata
Markevitch
Kleiber

[Florestan]

My complete sets

Jochum
Furtwangler
Hermann Abendroth
Gardiner
Karajan (too lazy to check which version)
Bernstein
Celibidache

[jlaurson]

From the "Recordings which you are considering thread", because it may be apropos: The different Karajan / Berlin Brahms Symphony Cycles.

Can anyone find the 60s cycle complete? Or the 4th individually?

THIS is the 80s cycle:

Brahms - Symphonies 1-4 HvK / Berlin Phil [1986-88 - digital] DG

Brahms - Symphonies 1-4 HvK / Berlin Phil [1986-88 - digital] DG

THESE are the 70s cycle:

Brahms - Symphonies 1-4 HvK / Berlin Phil [1978] DG

Brahms - Symphonies 1-4 HvK / Berlin Phil [1978] DG

Brahms - Symphonies 1-4 HvK / Berlin Phil [1978] DG

THIS is the MIXED cycle (1-3 = 80s, 4 = 70s):


Brahms - Symphonies 1-4
HvK / Berlin Phil [1978/87-89]
DG


These are the 60s recordings. I read of a complete cycle having been issued on DG, but I don't find it.
DG, on the release of the 2nd and 3rd claims 1959 - 1965. I think it should be 1963/64; the 1959 account of the First is Vienna/Decca (he also recorded the Third in Vienna, in 1960); HvK re-recorded the 1st four years later in Berlin.

Brahms - Symphonies 2 & 3 HvK / Berlin Phil [1963-64] DG

Brahms - Symphony 1 HvK / Berlin Phil [1963-64] DG

Brahms - Symphonies 3 & 4 [import] HvK / Berlin Phil [1963-64] DG

[Jo498]

Does anybody know why the put that particular mix on the twofer with HvK at the window? Is the 1978 4th supposed to be especially good or the early 1980s 4th especially bad?

[Scion7]

Only the Grand Prix du Disque winners from the early 1960's are critically acclaimed for Karajan.  And they are very, very good.

[jlaurson]

Does anybody know why the put that particular mix on the twofer with HvK at the window? Is the 1978 4th supposed to be especially good or the early 1980s 4th especially bad?

This doesn't come from my own experience... but the general tenor was that the 4th was the best in the 70s set and the weakest in the 80s set... his last studio recording with Berlin, I believe... and a little bit Autopilotish. But of course there are as many opinions as there are opinioneers: Some say 60s and 80s are awesome, some say 70s is the best but the sound is boxy... gosh. :-)

[Parsifal]

From the "Recordings which you are considering thread", because it may be apropos: The different Karajan / Berlin Brahms Symphony Cycles.

Can anyone find the 60s cycle complete? Or the 4th individually?

[asin]B00000E3Y5[/asin]

I got this this CD when it first came out, around 1986, then spent decades trying to get this cycle. The first came out as an original, the second and third a bargain price "resonance" with poorly done remastering.

[asin]B000001GBU[/asin]

The repackaged the 70's cycle over and over and over again and neglected the 60's cycle for reasons I cannot guess. Finally I have it in the 60's box.

The other Brahms miracle is that the Barbirolli/WPO cycle was finally released by EMI, after decades of being available only on OOP "Royal Classics" releases.

[NikF]

Piano Concerto in D minor
Symphony No. 4 in E minor
Piano Quartet in G minor, Op. 25
String Sextet No. 1 in B flat major
Piano Trio No.1 in B, Op.8

I was introduced to Brahms by a young German woman. Music was a huge part of her life and the vastness of her enthusiasm for it was exceeded only by the amount of patience she had with me. She was convinced I'd like Brahms and for a couple of years persisted in playing a variety of his work. Then one day she came home with the Curzon/Szell D minor PC. Ah. And then her favourite recording, the Gilels/Jochum, during which there were a few moments where it felt like I had a lump in my throat - and that's not like me at all.
Brahms is my favourite composer now. I find his music very human, which is a quality I believe makes it simply beautiful.

[Sergeant Rock]

Piano Concerto in D minor
Symphony No. 4 in E minor
Piano Quartet in G minor, Op. 25
String Sextet No. 1 in B flat major
Piano Trio No.1 in B, Op.8

I like your list...love your list actually. It's almost my Top 5 Brahms. (I'd substitute the D major Symphony for the Piano Quartet.)

Sarge

[NikF]

I like your list...love your list actually. It's almost my Top 5 Brahms. (I'd substitute the D major Symphony for the Piano Quartet.)

Sarge

Really? That's interesting.
Maybe there's only one of the symphonies on that small list because they were the last to become accessible to me. There was again an element of needing the music spread around various interpretations and performances before I could begin to enjoy them. I try to avoid allusions to photography () but for a long time I had to step way back before I could finally move close enough to see and appreciate the shadow detail. Then eventually taken as a whole they were revealed as so wonderfully, passionately human. Perhaps even inspiring.
Is there a cycle you consider a favourite?

[San Antone]

Piano Concerto in D minor
Symphony No. 4 in E minor
Piano Quartet in G minor, Op. 25
String Sextet No. 1 in B flat major
Piano Trio No.1 in B, Op.8

Aside from Symphony No. 4 you have chosen all early works, arguably before Brahms developed his voice.  Don't get me wrong, those are all very fine works, but late Brahms is on an altogether different level.   He didn't publish his first Symphony (which took 20 years to germinate) until middle age, and his truly greatest works, imo, all came after the German Requiem, Op. 45 - almost half way through his catalog.

[North Star]

Aside from Symphony No. 4 you have chosen all early works, arguably before Brahms developed his voice.  Don't get me wrong, those are all very fine works, but late Brahms is on an altogether different level.   He didn't publish his first Symphony (which took 20 years to germinate) until middle age, and his truly greatest works, imo, all came after the German Requiem, Op. 45 - almost half way through his catalog.

Yes, although Piano Trio No. 1 was extensively revised later, so it's not really a genuinely early work.

If I tried to think of a top 5 Brahms works list, I suspect the late chamber works and would be heavily represented. There are so many works in his corpus that I love that naming just five seems rather difficult.

[NikF]

Aside from Symphony No. 4 you have chosen all early works, arguably before Brahms developed his voice.  Don't get me wrong, those are all very fine works, but late Brahms is on an altogether different level.   He didn't publish his first Symphony (which took 20 years to germinate) until middle age, and his truly greatest works, imo, all came after the German Requiem, Op. 45 - almost half way through his catalog.

When I was making the list there were two other pieces I went back and forth over which would have tilted the scales the other way I love the clarinet sonatas and the Op. 119, but at this stage a big part of it is down to two performances in particular, both of which I considered outstanding in comparison to others. Op. 119 was especially difficult for me because I kept going back to the words of Brahms to Clara "The little piece is exceptionally melancholic and 'to be played very slowly' is not an understatement". But I eventually found what I believed was true to that via the Serkin recording.

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[asin]B000OY6HZE[/asin]

You familiar with them? And do you have any favourites?

[San Antone]

When I was making the list there were two other pieces I went back and forth over which would have tilted the scales the other way I love the clarinet sonatas and the Op. 119, but at this stage a big part of it is down to two performances in particular, both of which I considered outstanding in comparison to others. Op. 119 was especially difficult for me because I kept going back to the words of Brahms to Clara "The little piece is exceptionally melancholic and 'to be played very slowly' is not an understatement". But I eventually found what I believed was true to that via the Serkin recording.

[asin]B000028AXQ[/asin]

[asin]B000OY6HZE[/asin]

You familiar with them? And do you have any favourites?

Oh, yes the clarinet sonatas are, along with the clarinet trios, among my favorite Brahms, but then again, I love pretty much everything he wrote.  Have you heard the clarinet sonatas as viola sonatas?  Same work but scored for viola/piano and offering a new window into these great works.  I like Martin Frost, Karl Leister, David Shifin best but there are others well worth hearing. 

Here lately I've been listening to some of the lesser known choral works, Nanie, Vier Gesänge,  Marienlieder, Gesang der Parzen - but also revisiting some of the more familiar ones: Schicksalslied and the Requiem.