Franz Schubert

[SonicMan46]

Just finishing listening to the 4th and final disc of this fantastic set I picked up yesterday.  Do not hesitate - buy with confidence.  It is downright amazing!     Particularly out of this world performance of the Grand Duo in C major, D 812 (the frenetic energy of the final movement will just blow you away!) and of the Lebenssturme in A minor, D 947

 

Hey Ray - so many positive reviews of that Brilliant box - just put in an order from Amazon! 

Thanks to all for your comments - the only other recording I had of these works was a single disc added above w/ Lupu -

[Bogey]

Christoph Von Dohnanyi is very well known, yet under-appreciated it seems to me; under-appreciated because the extent to which he is one of our few remaining conductors who is ion a par with legendary conductors from past golden ages (including his predecessor at Cleveland, Georges Szell), is not fully appreciated.

*raises mug of coffee to this comment*

There is furthermore a live recording of Schubert's 5th in the Dohnanyi/Cleveland box set that was released in 2001 by the Musical Arts Association of Severance Hall:

Ah....a 5th!

I think I used to have that cd in my collection Bill.  First rate conductor!

This tandem of Big "D" and Cleveland also recorded my favorite LvB 9th as well David. 

[Bogey]

This one got some listening love today:



There seem to be a gazillion recordings of this piece, so will have to pick up a few more efforts.

[Gurn Blanston]

This one got some listening love today:



There seem to be a gazillion recordings of this piece, so will have to pick up a few more efforts.

Well, you don't need many more, Bill, that one rocks! 

[Lethevich]

BTW, with this talk of the orchestral writing in this quartet in mind, there is a string orchestra transcription, very lovingly done, wonderfully crafted, thought-provking - it's on ECM, Gidon Kremer and his Kremerata.

I finally heard this - I am in two minds about it. It is really impressive, expecially texturally, but it also feels sluggish when each line is mirrored in this way, despite not being the case in terms of actual duration. The work had a certain incisiveness that is lost at the same time as other interesting parts being revealed.

[Scion7]

Somewhat off-topic, do you recall the scene in  Conspiracy (2001) where, after scumbag Heydrich praises the Adagio from Schubert's Quintet in C, and later scumbag Eichmann remarks to the caterers (after Heydrich had left the building) that he "could never understand Schubert's sentimental Viennese sh*t" ?

I know Heydrich praised German musical greats (not that his opinion was worth offal) but I am curious if there is any biographical information that Eichmann did not (nor does his opinion count for anything)?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdhRYMY6IEc   

[calyptorhynchus]

Trying to find a recording of the reconstructed Schubert 10, is Mackerras the only one available?

[Mountain Goat]

Trying to find a recording of the reconstructed Schubert 10, is Mackerras the only one available?

There's one by Marriner and the ASMF as part of a box set of the complete symphonies, not sure if the CD with No. 10 (also containing the similarly reconstructed 7th) is available separately.

[eyeresist]

There's one by Marriner and the ASMF as part of a box set of the complete symphonies, not sure if the CD with No. 10 (also containing the similarly reconstructed 7th) is available separately.

The Marriner box also has the orchestrated 7th, which is actually pretty good.

The "completed" 8th remains unconvincing in either iteration IMHO.

[Uncle Connie]

Trying to find a recording of the reconstructed Schubert 10, is Mackerras the only one available?

Unfortunately the following is unlikely to be of much use because it's nearly impossible to find, but - back in the late days of LP (and then reissued as a CD) was this:





It very much needs to be brought back, perhaps as an ArkivCD?  It's absolutely superb; it takes the Newbould completion, with a certain amount of modification (esp. in much bolder trombones) by the conductor Bartholomee, and adds in the unfinished Scherzo D.708A to make a reasonable semblance of a four-movement version of the sketches.  Now, Newbould in his book is emphatic that he thinks Schubert meant to write a three-movement work only, thus no Scherzo sketch at all.  Perhaps.  But how could we possibly know?  And why would Schubert suddenly wander off into a variant form (3 mvt.)  of the symphony that was not yet much used by anybody, when that was clearly not his tendency in other works at all?  Despite all that, however, alone of the three Tenths known to me, Bartholomee makes it a true performance exemplar.  Write to Arkiv.  Tell them to get off their duffs and reissue this thing.  Meanwhile, check all the used sources and hope you get lucky....

eyeresist mentions he thinks completions of the 8th unsatisfactory.  Again back to LP days (this time c.1960, and not reissued that I know of), the American conductor Max Goberman showed us why this is true.  Goberman teamed up with the Viennese keyboard artist Kurt Rapf to issue a recording of the 8th note for note exactly as Schubert had left it.  This means that the sketch of the third movement was there as well; the first eight measures orchestrated, the rest sketched only in piano score (and the trio consisting only of the melodic line, no harmony; and halfway through it ends entirely).  Never has it been so obvious that the intended Scherzo was completely inadequate when put up against the rest.  Schubert obviously knew this too, and so gave up.   

[eyeresist]

eyeresist mentions he thinks completions of the 8th unsatisfactory.  Again back to LP days (this time c.1960, and not reissued that I know of), the American conductor Max Goberman showed us why this is true.  Goberman teamed up with the Viennese keyboard artist Kurt Rapf to issue a recording of the 8th note for note exactly as Schubert had left it.  This means that the sketch of the third movement was there as well; the first eight measures orchestrated, the rest sketched only in piano score (and the trio consisting only of the melodic line, no harmony; and halfway through it ends entirely).  Never has it been so obvious that the intended Scherzo was completely inadequate when put up against the rest.

Interesting post. I also find the Rosamunde Entr'acte inadequate as a finale. It doesn't match.

[Concord]

Schubert heiß ich, Schubert bin ich
Und als solchen geb ich mich.
Was die Besten je geleistet,
Ich erkenn' es, ich verehr' es,
Immer doch bleibt's außer mir.
Selbst die Kunst, die Kränze windet,
Blumen sammelt, wählt und bindet,
Ich kann ihr nur Blumen bieten,
Sichte sie und --- wählet ihr.
Lobt ihr mich, es soll mich freuen,
Schmäht ihr mich, ich muß es dulden,
Schubert heiß ich, Schubert bin ich,
Mag nicht hindern, kann nicht laden,
Geht ihr gern auf meinen Pfaden,
Nun wohlan, so folget mir!

---Franz Grillparzer

Came across this in a little German pocket-book on S. and spent the better part of an hour looking up various words. The tranlation i came up with is approximate at best, and i can't find an English version online.

[calyptorhynchus]

Got hold of the Marriner "10 Symphonies" set and am listening to the early symphonies. I'd forgotten what fun they were, absolutely delightful!

One thing I notice about Schubert is his ability to write music you listen to for the first time and it seems you've always known it. For example, I listened to the 6th and I absolutely convinced I'd never heard it before and yet it sounds so familiar!

Just getting up to the reconstructions.

[eyeresist]

Got hold of the Marriner "10 Symphonies" set and am listening to the early symphonies. I'd forgotten what fun they were, absolutely delightful!

Yes, I think Marriner is outstanding in 1 and 2.

[Brahmsian]

Was listening last night to Schubert's Piano Sonata in D major, D850.

Now, in the 2nd movement Con moto, I immediately recognized a theme.  Well, at least, to my ears, what sounded like a familiar famous theme.

It was a theme from the Nessun Dorma aria from Puccini's Turandot.  Does anyone know what I'm talking about and am I somewhat right, or just hallucinating? 

[Brahmsian]

Was listening last night to Schubert's Piano Sonata in D major, D850.

Now, in the 2nd movement Con moto, I immediately recognized a theme.  Well, at least, to my ears, what sounded like a familiar famous theme.

It was a theme from the Nessun Dorma aria from Puccini's Turandot.  Does anyone know what I'm talking about and am I somewhat right, or just hallucinating? 

I can only conclude that the non-response to me query means that I was delusion at the time I was listening to the Sonata. 

[Gurn Blanston]

I can only conclude that the non-response to me query means that I was delusion at the time I was listening to the Sonata. 

I don't know Turandot, so I couldn't know if Puccini ripped off Schubert. Wouldn't be surprised though.

[Opus106]

I can only conclude that the non-response to me query means that I was delusion at the time I was listening to the Sonata. 

If you can post the links to the appropriate moments from YouTube clips, we'll make sure to send across a diagnosis.

[mc ukrneal]

I can only conclude that the non-response to me query means that I was delusion at the time I was listening to the Sonata. 

Intrigued, I put it on. I'm halfway through and have not noticed anything so far. Maybe the interpretation affects it a bit too?

[calyptorhynchus]

Just been listening to the reconstructions from the Marriner CD set.

No 7 is great, I think that Schubert had written it all out in short score and so Newbould had only to orchestrate it. It sounds exactly as you'd expect a symphony between No 6 and No 8 to sound.

No.8 great performance of the movements by Marriner and the ASMF; great to hear the Scherzo realised, I think it's the equal of the first two movements. However, I'm not convinced by the Entr'acte from Rosamunde as the finale. I just don't think it was intended as the finale, or Schubert recomposed it so much it no longer fits. The Entr'acte is minor key, dramatic &c, but stage dramatic, not profound as the first two (three movements).

No.10 What a revelation, really exciting material and almost completely convincing realisation. (I say this because with any reconstruction, eg Mahler 10, Bruckner 9 &c you have the sense that the composer would have done so much more). As to the three movement form, I think this works too, the finale is both scherzo and finale. Marriner plays other fragments as well as these three recnstructions so you can make a disk or a playlist with the scherzo D708a as a third movement, and, although it's earlier in style, it does fit, but it's not necessary (IMHO). Both this scherzo and the finale start with little flowing chattering figures, only they're different, so if you play a 4 movement version when you get the finale you think 'haven't I heard this before? no, wait, it was different then....' And you lose the thread. Three movement version for me!