Franz Schubert

[Jo498]

They weren't intellectuals, but most had what would amount to a solid middle class background and education around 1900; Hitler being the main exception.
Even a "thuggish" guy like Roehm had finished the Gymnasium with the "Abitur" (which put him in the top 3-5% as far as a formal education was concerned)

[Moonfish]

Brilliant Classics Schubert edition (69 cd) - Aug 29

http://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B00LTQ5EVY/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[Ken B]

Actually, that's not true.  While yes, many Nazi's were this and that, the LEADING members of National Socialism were almost all thugs and/or non-intellectuals - Hitler, Himmler, Goering, Hess, Bormann, Rohm, Kaltenbrunner, Streicher, Ribbentrop . . . the list goes on and on.  The large majority of German intellectuals shunned the National Socialist movement.  The National Socialist regime was not dominated by those relatively few members who had an IQ higher than that of below-average- Speer being one exception, and less than a third of the population actually joined the party.  And for all of Heydrich's artistic education, he was dedicated to sadism and completely without empathy for his fellow man.  This idea is one of the many "urban myths" about the Nazi movement, and is not supported by the studies of it.

If you say my assertion is false contradict it. You contradict things I did not say. For example I made no statement about *majorities* of any sort. I made no claims about IQ. You are straw-manning.

Just some examples: Hitler, painter. Speer architect. Goebbels novelist. Heydrich, violinist. Hanfstaengl wrote music.  Artistic pretensions are common amongst nazis.

I did note the nazis polled best in University towns during their rise. True. They polled better there than in Bavaria and catholic regions for example.  Evans or Bracher have details. Racial theory, volisch theory etc had real cachet and appeal in the 20s and 30s.

For  aesthetes and backgrounds in the arts, Hitler and the Power of Aesthetics by Spotts.

[Ken B]

Brilliant Classics Schubert edition (69 cd) - Aug 29

http://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B00LTQ5EVY/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Cool. I wonder what the lieder will be. That's where the rubber hits the road Schubert-wise.
You know he wrote over 600 lieder, right Peter? In case you are worried about allergies! 

[kishnevi]

Mussolini played the violin.

[Moonfish]

Cool. I wonder what the lieder will be. That's where the rubber hits the road Schubert-wise.
You know he wrote over 600 lieder, right Peter? In case you are worried about allergies! 

I am getting a rash....   

[TheGSMoeller]

Schubert thoughts of the day...

One of the many things I love about the Great 9th symphony is the way the finale brings the entire work to a close. It doesn't have a "get ready for the ending!" type coda, but rather what feels like a continuation of the exciting previous 10+ minutes. Those low calling half note C's from the strings and various winds in unison do fiercely introduce what will eventually be the bringing of the end, but it doesn't feel disconnected in any way, the tempo stays the same and the brass continue their fanfare up to the rapturous, and brief, final C. I recently did a comparison of my 9 recordings of the ending, it's amazing how different they all were! And Harnoncourt was the only one to use the diminuendo in the end.


I think it was amw that mentioned a string ensemble version of the Adagio from the C major string quintet. I haven't heard that one, but an arrangement that I find to be a huge success is Victor Kissine's of the 15th String Quartet in G major performed by Kremerata Baltica. When comparing the quartet version to this larger-ensemble one it's obvious that it's a true arrangement rather than just handing all the violins, violas and cellos the original parts and adding a bass line. It feels like the quartet was carefully dissected to give each of the musicians (I believe there are 16 in the group) their own purpose and to allow certain harmonies to carry more weight. The added cello and bass is a nice touch, having that extra on the low end adds a bit of muscle. This arrangement also creates more depth to the music, not that Schubert needed it, but it's nice to hear this great piece in a different form and offer a unique quality that is quite different from the quartet version. The Scherzo is a little frightening and eerie with the extra strings, almost like a danse macabre, like it's blowing in night wind.

[Brahmsian]

Schubert thoughts of the day...

One of the many things I love about the Great 9th symphony is the way the finale brings the entire work to a close. It doesn't have a "get ready for the ending!" type coda, but rather what feels like a continuation of the exciting previous 10+ minutes. Those low calling half note C's from the strings and various winds in unison do fiercely introduce what will eventually be the bringing of the end, but it doesn't feel disconnected in any way, the tempo stays the same and the brass continue their fanfare up to the rapturous, and brief, final C. I recently did a comparison of my 9 recordings of the ending, it's amazing how different they all were! And Harnoncourt was the only one to use the diminuendo in the end.


I think it was amw that mentioned a string ensemble version of the Adagio from the C major string quintet. I haven't heard that one, but an arrangement that I find to be a huge success is Victor Kissine's of the 15th String Quartet in G major performed by Kremerata Baltica. When comparing the quartet version to this larger-ensemble one it's obvious that it's a true arrangement rather than just handing all the violins, violas and cellos the original parts and adding a bass line. It feels like the quartet was carefully dissected to give each of the musicians (I believe there are 16 in the group) their own purpose and to allow certain harmonies to carry more weight. The added cello and bass is a nice touch, having that extra on the low end adds a bit of muscle. This arrangement also creates more depth to the music, not that Schubert needed it, but it's nice to hear this great piece in a different form and offer a unique quality that is quite different from the quartet version. The Scherzo is a little frightening and eerie with the extra strings, almost like a danse macabre, like it's blowing in night wind.

Great post, Sir Greg Frogger! 

For the 9th, this is my favourite recording of it that I've heard so far.  It was a library check-out from some years ago (I do not actually have it in my collection).  It is Dohnányi conducting the Cleveland Orchestra.  Unfortunately, it seems Dohnányi has only recorded Schubert's 8th and 9th.  I was hoping he would have recorded them all. 

[asin]B00006HMA6[/asin]

[TheGSMoeller]

I'm going to buy Blomstedt's cycle with Dresden Staatskapelle, looking on Amazon I see three different issues...

Are these the same recordings? If so, any differences in sound quality? Box presentation? Or is this mostly a which cover art do you prefer situation?

 

[DavidW]

Probably because his Beethoven cycle has the same Berlin Classics reissue.  I have the brilliant classics set of his Schubert symphonies, sound is fine to me.  That is also the cover art I prefer.  The only Schubert centric cover art I like is this:



That looks awesome!  It makes me tempted to buy it just because the cover art is so cool.

[The new erato]

Probably because his Beethoven cycle has the same Berlin Classics reissue.  I have the brilliant classics set of his Schubert symphonies, sound is fine to me.  That is also the cover art I prefer.  The only Schubert centric cover art I like is this:



That looks awesome!  It makes me tempted to buy it just because the cover art is so cool.

I remember that feeling. I have yet to play it, though......

[TheGSMoeller]

Probably because his Beethoven cycle has the same Berlin Classics reissue.  I have the brilliant classics set of his Schubert symphonies, sound is fine to me.  That is also the cover art I prefer. 

Thank you, David!

[Mookalafalas]

I'm going to buy Blomstedt's cycle with Dresden Staatskapelle,

  So...did you get it?  I'm listening to it now, and I couldn't be more delighted. I'm just re-listening to disk one, the immature boy's 1st and 2nd symphonies.  Wonderful (it's a Saturday afternoon and I'm playing it loudly, which doesn't hurt anything).  At the beginning of this thread people were talking about "not being able to get into" the symphonies, and I'm really surprised.  I find them fresh, powerful, and invigorating. The only other set I have is Harnoncourt, which I also like a lot. Maybe there are other, older sets that are less enjoyable?

[Moonfish]

  So...did you get it?  I'm listening to it now, and I couldn't be more delighted. I'm just re-listening to disk one, the immature boy's 1st and 2nd symphonies.  Wonderful (it's a Saturday afternoon and I'm playing it loudly, which doesn't hurt anything).  At the beginning of this thread people were talking about "not being able to get into" the symphonies, and I'm really surprised.  I find them fresh, powerful, and invigorating. The only other set I have is Harnoncourt, which I also like a lot. Maybe there are other, older sets that are less enjoyable?

I completely agree with you. I started to listen to the Blomstedt cycle as well (symph 3 & 4) and found them very inviting and rich in terms of both sound and performance. Dipping further into the Brilliant box and found myself pleasantly surprised (mostly) as the journey continues. Right now (on my own Saturday afternoon time zone) I am enjoying the Violin Sonatas on disc 7. 

[Mookalafalas]

I completely agree with you. I started to listen to the Blomstedt cycle as well (symph 3 & 4) and found them very inviting and rich in terms of both sound and performance. Dipping further into the Brilliant box and found myself pleasantly surprised (mostly) as the journey continues. Right now (on my own Saturday afternoon time zone) I am enjoying the Violin Sonatas on disc 7. 

  Several hours later, I have joined you   Not really morning coffee music, but first track is very promising.

[TheGSMoeller]

  So...did you get it?  I'm listening to it now, and I couldn't be more delighted. I'm just re-listening to disk one, the immature boy's 1st and 2nd symphonies.  Wonderful (it's a Saturday afternoon and I'm playing it loudly, which doesn't hurt anything).  At the beginning of this thread people were talking about "not being able to get into" the symphonies, and I'm really surprised.  I find them fresh, powerful, and invigorating. The only other set I have is Harnoncourt, which I also like a lot. Maybe there are other, older sets that are less enjoyable?

Sorry for the late reply...I did get the Blomstedt set, and yes it's great. I love the full-bodied sound of Dresden Staatskapelle, and I really like the tempos. I still have the Harnoncourt and Immerseel sets as my two favorites, but this Blomstedt is really a great addition, and could easily be considered as a rec for any listeners first Schubert set.

I need to revisit the 1st and 2nd symphonies. I plead guilty in starting with the 3rd most of the time. 

[Moonfish]

Sorry for the late reply...I did get the Blomstedt set, and yes it's great. I love the full-bodied sound of Dresden Staatskapelle, and I really like the tempos. I still have the Harnoncourt and Immerseel sets as my two favorites, but this Blomstedt is really a great addition, and could easily be considered as a rec for any listeners first Schubert set.

I need to revisit the 1st and 2nd symphonies. I plead guilty in starting with the 3rd most of the time. 

Ha ha! I start with the 3rd all the time as well! 

[Moonfish]

  Several hours later, I have joined you   Not really morning coffee music, but first track is very promising.

I was not too familiar with the violin sonatas so they came across well in my ears! 

[TheGSMoeller]

Ha ha! I start with the 3rd all the time as well! 

I blame it on Wiener/Kleiber's recording of Nos. 3 and 8 on DG, that disc got me hooked on No. 3.

[Mookalafalas]

I blame it on Wiener/Kleiber's recording of Nos. 3 and 8 on DG, that disc got me hooked on No. 3.

  Some years ago I got the Harnoncourt on MP3 and just played it as a loop through my computer speakers.  As a result, they all linked in my mind as a sort of  giant 4-hour symphony.