Bach: Well-Tempered Clavier

[Karl Henning]

Considering that the entire 19^th century lies between us, I should not wonder if Bach and Couperin mean something quite different to us, by the adjective soulless.

[prémont]

http://www.youtube.com/v/jOzWN-PYh9s

This is what a harpsichord with a cold sounds like!

(I know, I know -- it's not an ideal recording! )

In this case I think it is the performer who lacks soul.

[prémont]

I think Forkel is not very reliable here. Although I love the clavichord, Forkel's information is second hand, principally received from CPE Bach, who was a nut for the clavichord. Additionally, Forkel publishes his biography in 1802, when the harpsichord (not the clavichord which was always a domestic instrument) had totally been replaced by the fortepiano, so probably he is simply expressing the prejudices of that time.

Precisely what Antoine said.

[milk]

Piano - Tureck/DG and BBC, Gould/Sony, Crossland/Signum, Gulda/Philips, Fellner/ECM (Bk. 1).

Harpsichord - Wilson/Apex, Leonhardt/EMI, Gilbert/DG, van Asperen/Virgin Classics, Verlet/Naive.

I just dug this quote out as I'm looking for an opinion on Verlet's WTC. Actually, I'm a fan of van Asperen's also.
So do the Verlet and van Asperen sets equal the majesty of Gilbert's and Leonhardt's performances?

[Mandryka]

I just dug this quote out as I'm looking for an opinion on Verlet's WTC. Actually, I'm a fan of van Asperen's also.
So do the Verlet and van Asperen sets equal the majesty of Gilbert's and Leonhardt's performances?

I've been exploring harpsichord records of WTC2 on and off for the past few months with one particular thing in mind: I'm intested in variety and profundity  of emotional expression. I must say I thought that Verlet was exceptional in that regard, with the music used to express exhileration, yearning, sorrow, nostalgia and so on.

If anyone knows any harpsichord recordings which they find particularly interesting from the affective pont of view, please let me know. I may have missed some goodies.

[Coopmv]

I've been exploring harpsichord records of WTC2 on and off for the past few months with one particular thing in mnd: i'm intested in variety and profundity  of emotional expression. I must say I thought that Verlet was exceptional in that regard, with the music used to express exhileration, yearning, sorrow, nostalgia and so on.

If anyone knows any harpsichord recordings which they find patticularly interesting from the affective pont of view, please let me know. I may have missed some goodies.

I have the WTC by Gilbert, Leonhardt, Kirkpatrick, Jaccottet, van asperen, Verlet, Schornsheim and Watchorn.  All were/are outstanding harpsichordists.  Perhaps Leonhardt is still my favorite.

[xochitl]

are there any recordings of WTC that actually use well-temperament?

or any other bach albums that dont use equal-temperament for that matter?

[Mandryka]

I have the WTC by Gilbert, Leonhardt, Kirkpatrick, Jaccottet, van asperen, Verlet, Schornsheim and Watchorn.  All were/are outstanding harpsichordists.  Perhaps Leonhardt is still my favorite.

Don't forget that it's just the variety and depth of feelings expressed which is interesting me right now. From that point of view Leonhardt doesn't even come close to Verlet in Bk 2.

[Coopmv]

Don't forget that it's just the variety and depth of feelings expressed which is interesting me right now. From that point of view Leonhardt doesn't even come close to Verlet in Bk 2.

Leonhardt's playing can be dry at times.  I am a fan of Verlet, the following CD I bought over 20 years ago first introduced me to her virtuosity on the harpsichord.  She was clearly a much younger harpsichordist then, as the recording was made in 73 and 74 in London ...

[PaulSC]

Don't forget that it's just the variety and depth of feelings expressed which is interesting me right now. From that point of view Leonhardt doesn't even come close to Verlet in Bk 2.

It's tricky to guess what will read as particularly expressive/emotional for you. I suspect Ottavio Dantone's highly inflected performances may do the trick. Alan Curtis is subtler and more introverted, but you may enjoy him as well.

[Mandryka]

I've been playing Dantone's a bit, mainly because some guy on bachcantatas.org said that if you like Vartolo's Goldbergs (which I do), then you'll like Dantone's WTC. I'm not sure I agree, I need more time.

I didn't know Alan Curtis (who I like) had recorded WTC.

[Que]

[...] said that if you like Vartolo's Goldbergs (which I do), then you'll like Dantone's WTC. I'm not sure I agree, I need more time.

Me neither, what an odd statement & comparison. I like Dantone's WTC BTW..

I didn't know Alan Curtis (who I like) had recorded WTC.

Not to my knowledge, Glen Wilson might be a nice substitute. 

Q

[PaulSC]

I didn't know Alan Curtis (who I like) had recorded WTC.

Not to my knowledge, Glen Wilson might be a nice substitute. 

Oops, I always mix those two up! Q sorted this one out nicely for me...

[Mandryka]

Not to my knowledge, Glen Wilson might be a nice substitute. 

Yes, Glen Wilson He really does mine the music for dark feelings. And (surprisingly for me) he finds some of the most tragic music in major key fugues. My only reservation about what he does is that he doesn't seem so comfortable with simple joyful music making, so I tend to feel that the performance is less balanced and varied emotionally compared with Blandine Verlet's. I could well be wrong there though and clearly Glen Wilson's done something with WTC2 which is astonishing and original, and very poetic.

[kishnevi]

are there any recordings of WTC that actually use well-temperament?

or any other bach albums that dont use equal-temperament for that matter?

Egarr uses a system of temperament which he claims is the one Bach had in mind.  He also uses it in the Goldberg Variations.  Fortunately his WTC is much better than his GV. Whether he's correct is obviously a debatable question--but it certainly is not the standard "equal temperament". 

Of course, if you think Bach had one specific system of temperament in mind when he wrote the WTC (I'd suggest he didn't--merely what might be called a category or family of temperament system), first you have to establish what that system was.  Egarr thinks he has.  If you don't agree with Egarr, then the whole question is still very much up in the air.

ETA: and in reference to the topic Mandryka brought up,  I don't think Egarr goes for affect and emotional content very much. At some points he gets poetic, but not very often.

[Mandryka]

Just wanted to share my story of two complete WTC's from Richard Egarr and Pieter-Jan Belder.

I listened repeatedly to Belder's Bk. 1 for a couple of weeks.  Although not emotionally rich, Belder was very rewarding for the youthful energy he supplied and the different registrations he used in the repeats.  As for his harpsichord, it did sound rather thin but with a nice tangy quality.  Then, I switched to Egarr's Bk. 1 and was amazed at how much more rich and nuanced he played than Belder; I was already aware that Egarr is not one of the more nuanced keyboardists on the block.

Okay, I then started in with Belder's Bk. 2.  What a difference from Bk. 1!  Now Belder is an artist who wants to savor Bach's music.  On top of that, the harpsichord used in Bk. 2 has a much richer sound/more alive.  I really love his Bk. 2.  On to Egarr's Bk. 2 where his nuances only match those in his Bk. 1.  Belder easily surpasses Egarr here.

Overall, I think that Belder had a plan for his interpretations - to go from youthful declarations in Bk. '1 to a mature and highly involved set of performances in Bk. 2, a progression that Egarr does not recognize as he plays both Books in the same manner.

What's your opinion on the differences/similarities between these two sets?

I just wanted to thank you for making thus post. I was interested in the idea that someone would
play Bk 1 very differently from Bk 2, so I got myself a copy of the Belder and I'm enjoying what I'm hearng in fact. It's got me listening to Bk 1 again, I haven't listened to Bk 1 for ages.

In the B minor fugue from Bk 1,  I find myself really moved by Belder, his simplicity, gentle direct eloquence.

[milk]

Now that Schornsheim's WTC has been out for a bit, I'm curious to know what the general consensus on the recording is.

When this first came out I felt totally negative about it. Listening to it tonight, I'm reacting much more positively. She's very direct, if that makes any sense. But she definitely has something to say. I wonder what others think. I don't recall it getting much attention here.

[Sammy]

When this first came out I felt totally negative about it. Listening to it tonight, I'm reacting much more positively. She's very direct, if that makes any sense. But she definitely has something to say. I wonder what others think. I don't recall it getting much attention here.

I haven't listened to it more than 10 times, but I've liked it more and more with each additional hearing.  "Direct" does make sense to me, and it's a pleasure to hear the WTC done this way.

[Leo K.]

I've been listening a bit to Ashkenazy's WTC, and find myself returning to it often. I rather like it more than I thought I would.

[Sammy]

I've been listening a bit to Ashkenazy's WTC, and find myself returning to it often. I rather like it more than I thought I would.

I must have listened to Ashkenazy's WTC a few dozen times, always going back and forth as to what I think of it (ranging from OK to Good).  Ultimately, I don't feel he offers enough angst or power when I want those qualities.