Maria Callas

Started by knight66, May 08, 2007, 06:16:02 AM

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Sarastro

Quote from: zamyrabyrd on August 28, 2009, 10:18:09 AM
I sort of doubt that a singer like Sutherland would be so fooled that she is not singing high C's.  ???

It seems that she did not have perfect pitch. As far as I remember her book, A Prima Donna's Progress, Sutherland explicitly wrote that Bonynge deliberately played higher scales and she did not notice that until he told her.

zamyrabyrd

#301
Quote from: Sarastro on August 28, 2009, 05:34:25 PM
It seems that she did not have perfect pitch. As far as I remember her book, A Prima Donna's Progress, Sutherland explicitly wrote that Bonynge deliberately played higher scales and she did not notice that until he told her.

That's really weird. I'd like to read the book. Anyone who sings, and not even professionally, usually FEELS where the pitches are. Maybe this is even truer for those who don't read music. So "higher" and "lower" (which is not a real quality of pitch since we are talking about faster or slower vibrations) are sensations felt in the chest, head, etc. Lilli Lehman, in her own book about singing, even included a diagram of every note where SHE felt them.

I remember how horrible it was when an accompanist playing on an electric piano, didn't check the pitch before and was a third higher for the "Quando M'en Vo". I FELT it was wrong before recognizing the actual notes.

ZB
"Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one."

― Charles MacKay, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds

Lilas Pastia

Quando m'en vo lies quite high already, doesn't it? Singing it a third higher must definitely have been a challenge...

Sarastro

Quote from: zamyrabyrd on August 29, 2009, 02:16:37 AM
I'd like to read the book.

I'm pretty sure you can check it out in the library. But on amazon this book costs as little as $1.22. ;D

Lethevich

Speaking of cheap books, I notice that Amazon (UK, at least) marketplace has quite a few Callas biographies going for 1 pence. Are any of the following any good? I expect that her name attracts a lot of nonsense writing, making me unwilling to buy a book on the subject "blind"...

Maria Callas Remembered - Nadia Stancioff
Maria Meneghini Callas - Michael Scott
Callas: Her Life, Her Loves, Her Music - Anne Edwards
Maria Callas: An Intimate Biography - Anne Edwards (perhaps simple a retitle)
Maria Callas: The Woman Behind the Legend - Arianna Huffington
Sisters: Life of Maria Callas - Jackie Callas
Maria Callas - Giandonato Crico
Callas - Stelios Galatopoulos
Callas: Portrait of a Prima Donna - George Jellinek
Maria Callas: A Tribute - Pierre-Jean Remy
Peanut butter, flour and sugar do not make cookies. They make FIRE.

zamyrabyrd

Quote from: Lilas Pastia on August 29, 2009, 06:04:01 AM
Quando m'en vo lies quite high already, doesn't it? Singing it a third higher must definitely have been a challenge...

It was a minor third, so the first note was an F#. I was making faces at the accompanist so he adjusted it gradually back to the right pitch which was also horrible. A thread perhaps should be on "sabotage by accompanists".

ZB
"Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one."

― Charles MacKay, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds

zamyrabyrd

Quote from: Lethe on August 29, 2009, 09:36:17 PM
Speaking of cheap books, I notice that Amazon (UK, at least) marketplace has quite a few Callas biographies going for 1 pence. Are any of the following any good? I expect that her name attracts a lot of nonsense writing, making me unwilling to buy a book on the subject "blind"...

Maria Callas Remembered - Nadia Stancioff
Maria Meneghini Callas - Michael Scott
Callas: Her Life, Her Loves, Her Music - Anne Edwards
Maria Callas: An Intimate Biography - Anne Edwards (perhaps simple a retitle)
Maria Callas: The Woman Behind the Legend - Arianna Huffington
Sisters: Life of Maria Callas - Jackie Callas
Maria Callas - Giandonato Crico
Callas - Stelios Galatopoulos
Callas: Portrait of a Prima Donna - George Jellinek
Maria Callas: A Tribute - Pierre-Jean Remy

I think most of them are good, so one can start with almost any one. I did like Arianna's book, written soon after Callas' passing, having had the benefit of interviews with important people like her mother.

http://www.amazon.com/Maria-Callas-Arianna-Stassinopoulos/dp/034530179X
"Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one."

― Charles MacKay, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds

Tsaraslondon

Quote from: Lethe on August 29, 2009, 09:36:17 PM
Speaking of cheap books, I notice that Amazon (UK, at least) marketplace has quite a few Callas biographies going for 1 pence. Are any of the following any good? I expect that her name attracts a lot of nonsense writing, making me unwilling to buy a book on the subject "blind"...

Maria Callas Remembered - Nadia Stancioff
Maria Meneghini Callas - Michael Scott
Callas: Her Life, Her Loves, Her Music - Anne Edwards
Maria Callas: An Intimate Biography - Anne Edwards (perhaps simple a retitle)
Maria Callas: The Woman Behind the Legend - Arianna Huffington
Sisters: Life of Maria Callas - Jackie Callas
Maria Callas - Giandonato Crico
Callas - Stelios Galatopoulos
Callas: Portrait of a Prima Donna - George Jellinek
Maria Callas: A Tribute - Pierre-Jean Remy

In terms of a true appreciation of her art, as opposed to an account of the scandals that attached themselves to her life, I'd go for Michael Scott's book. He concentrates almost entirely on the great career and writes very little about the years in decline and the years of retirement (though he doesn't ignore them either).
Galatapoulos is also good, though more uncritical.
I read Jellinek's book a long time ago, and found it rather better than many biographies. It may have been updated, but Callas was still alive when I read it.
I also enjoyed Pierre-Jean Remy's book, more a fan's eulogy than anything else, but enjoyable none the less.
Crico's book is a short photgraphic book (lots of interesting photos, not much editorial)
I'd avoid the trashy Anne Edwards and the Nadia Stancioff account of the years she worked for Callas, ditto Jackie Callas's "Sisters".
Arianna Huffington's bbook is well written, but often goes for the sensational and she often prefers the tabloid version of events, rather than the true one.
In conclusion, if I were choosing just one book, it would be Michael Scott's. I don't always agree with his arguments, but it  is well researched, and, for once, we get the views of a musician, someone who truly understands music and what it was that made Callas great.

Hope this helps.
\"A beautiful voice is not enough.\" Maria Callas

Lethevich

The Huffington type is exactly what I was trying to avoid, thanks! I'll grab the Scott and Crico ones, as they should compliment each other well.
Peanut butter, flour and sugar do not make cookies. They make FIRE.

Lilas Pastia

Quote from: Lethe on August 31, 2009, 05:54:08 AM
The Huffington type is exactly what I was trying to avoid, thanks! I'll grab the Scott and Crico ones, as they should compliment each other well.

I'm not sure. Authors rarely compliment each other.

Sarastro

Quote from: Tsaraslondon on August 30, 2009, 10:00:55 AM
Hope this helps.

Very interesting, thanks Tsaraslondon. I would pick those with bare facts and constructive critics, not the ones about scandals or sniveling fanaticism. Though I hardy imagine how anyone can criticize Callas, rather than the vocal decline "due to bad technique" or timbre "ugliness". The latter two obviously come from lack of musical understanding and inability to think critically, imo.

Other than that, I also loved the passages and even entire chapter devoted to Callas in Gobbi's The World of Italian Opera. I don't think it was ever published in English, though, I personally read the Russian version, as well as Gedda's The gift is not free of charge, which seems to have been issued only in Swedish, German, and Russian. There, Gedda is quite bitching around Callas... but he also bitches about Caballe and other singers, slways stating how great he himself is along with suicidal thoughts. A very personal and insightful book though, I think I wouldn't have the guts to write something like this about myself for wide public.

Tsaraslondon

Quote from: Sarastro on August 31, 2009, 07:00:00 PM
V

Other than that, I also loved the passages and even entire chapter devoted to Callas in Gobbi's The World of Italian Opera. I don't think it was ever published in English, though, I personally read the Russian version, as well as Gedda's The gift is not free of charge, which seems to have been issued only in Swedish, German, and Russian. There, Gedda is quite bitching around Callas... but he also bitches about Caballe and other singers, slways stating how great he himself is along with suicidal thoughts. A very personal and insightful book though, I think I wouldn't have the guts to write something like this about myself for wide public.

Gobbi's book was published in English. I remember reading it. The Gedda doesn't seem to be listed on Amazon, so my guess is that it wasn't, which is a shame, as, from what you say, it would appear to be an interesting read.

\"A beautiful voice is not enough.\" Maria Callas

Sarastro

Quote from: Tsaraslondon on August 31, 2009, 11:07:45 PM
Gobbi's book was published in English.

There are two books by Gobbi: The World of Italian Opera and My Life. The second exists in Italian and English only, as far as I know. Which one did you read? The World of Italian Opera is not too long and each chapter talks about one specific opera and stories Gobbi had with them. Callas appears in the "La Traviata" one.

Tsaraslondon

I've just been listening to Rigoletto with Callas and Gobbi, and am newly amazed at the way Callas so completely inhabits the role of Gilda. It is not just a case of her lightening her voice, as much as the fact that the voice character she presents is so completely different from her Medea or Norma, or even her Amina. The miracle is that in the later acts, though this Gilda matures and becomes a woman, she doesn't just become Leonora  or Aida, she still remains firmly in character. Of course Rigoletto's heart lies in its duets for father and daughter, and it is here that Callas and Gobbi work so wonderfully together. Perhaps more than in any of the other sets they recorded together, it gives them the chance to work closely in harmony, the one completely in sympathy with the other. (What a tragedy that they never recorded Macbeth together).

Callas only sang Gilda on stage for one series of performances in Mexico in 1952. The performances were not a great success, and a  recording that exists of the prima suggests that it was not well prepared. Callas is actually a great deal more assured than her colleagues, though she is obviously still working out some of the roles niceties (a firmer directorial hand would probably not have allowed her the dizzying high E at the end of Caro nome, or the high Eb at the end of the quartet), but her lack of success in the role may have contributed to her decision not to sing it again. Who knows? Had she sung it more often, she may well have forced the opera world to rethink the role, much in the manner she changed perceptions of the role of Lucia di Lammermoor. We are lucky indeed to have her Gilda preserved on disc.

\"A beautiful voice is not enough.\" Maria Callas

knight66

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlsioKE-cUs

Well, here is the link to Magda Olivero singing from Traviata. We have shifted this discussion, though I am not too sure it really belong specifically here, but anyway, I think it would be interesting to discuss this issue of pure sound versus expression.

I enjoyed the Olivero clip a lot. Yes there are a couple of smudges across fast notes and occasionally runs are more picked at than sung through, but I enjoyed this immensely. I found watching the mimed-to video distracting when I was trying to understand how she was producing the sound.

I can see she would be increasingly effective as the opera moves on and she can make the exact fragility of sound, well produced, that the final act needs.

As I was thinking about what I had heard, Youtube automatically moved on to the following.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtRoHckKoiw&a=VhqLD4HPSuk&playnext_from=ML&playnext=1

At 83 she produces a performance that transfixes. Of course the voice does not behave as it once did, especially the lower third which becomes hollow; but what is there is remarkable in terms of what remains of the voice...the high notes!!! More than that is the intensity.

Here is the style of the piece illustrated as a masterclass for us. She shapes it, she varies tone colour, she produces frisson and dramatic punch. It is a little macabre to watch, but what a lifetime of artistry is wrapped up there. I much prefer to hear something committed but perhaps flawed than to listen to a perfect voice that has nothing to say.

Tebaldi has never been a favourite of mine. I find her expression to be generalised and the drama can seem superficial, rather than felt. However, a few years ago I came across some early recordings, before she became famous. Here there was a freshness and she was really using the words. Absolutely wonderful. So, what happened? Why did words then take a comparative back seat?

Much the same happened to Sutherland, whose verbal acuity can be heard in her very earliest recordings,. but not often subsequently. Smoothed out to protect the bel canto line and sound. Swings and roundabouts.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

zamyrabyrd

Perhaps Magda Olivero should have a thread of her own.

The pathos and vulnerability of Butterfly here sound like she was on the verge of giving up after 3 years, a desperation I don't remember hearing from anyone else:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMdV_BDWVNw&feature=related
A singer that reminds me of her in spirit and practice is Claudia Muzio.

Some commenters on different clips wrote they didn't like the quality of the voice very much. I was surprised to read she did mostly verismo roles as usually heavier voices are associated with them. (Being possessed of a light voice myself, I was told never to sing even some arias like those of Santuzza, Amelia, etc.) This may be the reason the voice sounds somewhat metallic when the volume is revved up with a hint of vibrato creeping in.

Her messa di voce is quite fantastic, a technique hardly used or understood these days. To make a swell on a high C, well, that's real mastery. Anyone can blast out high notes but few can control them.  Her diction and dramatic timing are very fine as well.

ZB

"Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one."

― Charles MacKay, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds

knight66

I agree with all of that, she is terrific in that extract. Shame the sound quality is so awful, but she shines through. I also hear echos of Claudia Muzio, who was a clear and obvious influence on Callas. Muzio is another underrepresented and underappreciated singer.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

Tsaraslondon

Quote from: knight on July 03, 2010, 12:02:32 AM
I also hear echos of Claudia Muzio, who was a clear and obvious influence on Callas.

Mike

I know what you mean, Mike, but there is little to suggest, in any of the books I have read, that Muzio was an influence on Callas. The greatest influence on Callas was more probably Ponselle, whom she revered above all other singers. In fact, in her masterclass on Elvira's aria from Ernani, she tells her student to seek out the Ponselle recording, citing it as the best extant version of the aria. Actually, though Ponselle is a deal more secure, Callas sings the aria with more grace and elegance.

Interestingly Walter Legge apparently suggested that Callas study with Ponselle, when she first started having vocal problems. Callas apparently said, "No way! She started out with much better material than me."

\"A beautiful voice is not enough.\" Maria Callas

knight66

#318
The only thing I am going on is my ears. It was the exact experience I  had when hearing the music of Mehul for the first time. There were the fingerprints of the orchestral sound of Berlioz, yet he predated Berlioz.

The voices are not to be mistaken for one another, but I hear some distinct similarities in the way they use words, making specific words count. Also some of the phrasing and the use of the chest register, the intensity. I am not suggesting Callas was any less of an original than was Berlioz. But each heard what they heard, absorbed it and produced a transformed end result.

This recording is the 1935 Columbia recording.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxVZL_frj20

Muzio, all references to the later Callas apart, had an unusual verbal acuity and coloured the words very carefully. What I get from this is an ability to mold the line, it becomes plastic, without being at all damaging to the music. Very few singers do this. The reading is highly detailed.

Here is another very great singer in the same aria.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ObFzgwlglo&feature=related

Oddly enough, like Muzio a forshortened career through ill health. Here the words are certainly well used, but there is not the variety of tone coloring and despite it being at a slower tempo, the ebb and flow, the plasticity of Muzio is missing. But this is a type of voice and a performance which it would be hard to find today

Finally, Tebaldi. The right voice and great singing, (top note apart), but I miss the 'face' I like so much with some other singers. It is classical in the approach, but I don't find it memorable.  I want memorable and will take the flaws with that experience.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1SM6AnP2Cg

Mike







DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

zamyrabyrd

Quote from: knight on July 03, 2010, 11:45:40 PM

This recording is the 1935 Columbia recording.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxVZL_frj20

Muzio, all references to the later Callas apart, had an unusual verbal acuity and coloured the words very carefully. What I get from this is an ability to mold the line, it becomes plastic, without being at all damaging to the music. Very few singers do this. The reading is highly detailed.

Here is another very great singer in the same aria.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ObFzgwlglo&feature=related

Oddly enough, like Muzio a forshortened career through ill health. Here the words are certainly well used, but there is not the variety of tone coloring and despite it being at a slower tempo, the ebb and flow, the plasticity of Muzio is missing. But this is a type of voice and a performance which it would be hard to find today

Finally, Tebaldi. The right voice and great singing, (top note apart), but I miss the 'face' I like so much with some other singers. It is classical in the approach, but I don't find it memorable.  I want memorable and will take the flaws with that experience.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1SM6AnP2Cg

Mike

I'll start with the last first. Tebaldi was really boring here visually and vocally, in an aria about the death of a mother in a fire, no less. Somehow I can appreciate her better when hearing only audio recordings.

From Tsaras' post  about Ponselle, "Callas apparently said, "No way! She started out with much better material than me." Tebaldi had a golden set of chords, but I'm not sure she exploited them to the hilt. 

Whereas Ponselle had a Strad of a voice and it is evident here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXix1jvkEnU&feature=related

"O del mio amato ben" by Stephano Donaudy is rather uncomplicated piece of music but Ponselle above and Muzio below wrench so much expression out of it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6gr-GVSLOw

And as for raw material, Callas' voice may have been troublesome to herself at times but it was a great instrument with a special timbre.

ZB
"Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one."

― Charles MacKay, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds