Personality Types

[drogulus]

     I have a high score for savior traits. Often these remain latent so it's nothing I should worry about.

[Florestan]

Crap, you are one of the people who aren't so obvious. 

Ok, I have two guesses (out of 24 types).

379 is my first guess. 279 is my second guess.

Do these feel accurate for you or no?

Thanks. Most of them are quite close, I'd say. I guess I'm pretty obvious after all. 

Is there any website where I can find more details?

[Florestan]

Actually, my one single personality trait that it's not obvious at all from my posts and hard to discern from my online behaviour is that I'm a very sentimental and highly sensitive/impressionable person: things, events or words that might go on unnoticed by others, or to which others might attach little or no importance, can greatly impact my feelings and moods. I've been like that since childhood. It probably explains my attraction to, and love for, "sentimental" even "saccharine" music (eg, Chopin, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninoff, salon music).

[greg]

Actually, my one single personality trait that it's not obvious at all from my posts and hard to discern from my online behaviour is that I'm a very sentimental and highly sensitive/impressionable person: things, events or words that might go on unnoticed by others, or to which others might attach little or no importance, can greatly impact my feelings and moods. I've been like that since childhood. It probably explains my attraction to, and love for, "sentimental" even "saccharine" music (eg, Chopin, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninoff, salon music).

That actually sounds like 4. Not only the description, but all of those composers were type 4.... though my personal template of a 4 is Mahler.
Check the one I attached now. Is it the closest one?
I can send you the complete booklet, but I'd rather email you it, I don't think it would be a good idea to attach the whole thing in a post.

Thanks. Most of them are quite close, I'd say. I guess I'm pretty obvious after all. 

Is there any website where I can find more details?

This was my starting point: https://www.enneagraminstitute.com/type-descriptions

Buuuutt... the best and most comprehensive site really is this one: https://www.enneagrammer.com/types


But it's a lot, I'll do a quick overview, would be easier to read this as a starting point before being lost in those sites.

The nine types are divided into 3 centers:
gut (how anger is dealt with)
mind (how fear is dealt with)
heart (how personal identity as a member of society is dealt with, or how one wants to be loved/appreciated)


Gut types:
8: Tendency to be extreme/aggressive, denies vulnerability, uses rage as a fuel to get stuff done, like a human bulldozer
9: Forgets their anger, tendency to just chill and let stuff pass, even stuff that needs to be dealth with- narcotizes through routine, "comfortably numb," struggles to take action
1: Controls/feels shame about their anger, tends to be critical of self and others, frustrated at the world not meeting their standards, uptight, judgemental, rigid, perfectionistic, "everything in moderation"


Head types:
5: Hermetic, highly introverted, deals with fear by distancing from the world and observing/studying this from afar- tendency to study things of personal interest deeply
6: Hypervigilant, prone to partisan politics, whistleblower, need for external guidance, will test authority to make sure they are proper guides for them, but can be very loyal if they do find the right type of guidance (ideology, leaders, etc.). This type is the most complex and can manifest wildly different from person to person, but quite common. Unhealthy types can be paranoid conspiracy theorists.
7: Deals with fear by saying "why let it bring you down?" and goes out and parties- tendency to be a jack of all trades and not overfocus on anything too long, just wants to have fun


Heart types:
2: Like a prideful waiter, proud to be indispensable, can give to get
3: "Dress for success," performing a role to be successful in society, typically represented as a performer of music or a "live to work" CEO, sensitive to failure
4: Deeply sensitive, feels like an alien among humans, melancholic, "Romanticist"


Instincts (aka subtypes):
sp = self-preservation
sx = sexual
so = social

Example, my instinctual stacking is sp/sx. It's ordered by what worries you the most to least- which naturally gives you a prioritization order of what you focus on.
So that means that self-preservation concerns (finances, health) is the top concern, sexual (having chemistry with someone else) is second, and social (how to operate within the social realm) is last.



From these centers, various triads are extracted.


Hornevian group- How each type moves in relation to other people, stances, how they get what they need/want
Assertive - 378
Compliant/Superego - 126
Withdrawn - 459


Harmonic triads- How each type handles conflict, how they handle situations where their needs are not met, coping mechanisms
Reactive - 468
Positive - 279
Competency - 135


Object Relations
Attachment - 369
Frustration - 147
Rejection - 258



Wings: a secondary type that is next to your main number- ex: type 1 can only be a 1w2 or 1w9. Type 4 can only be 4w3 or 4w5, etc.

Tritypes (aka trifixes) are a more advanced concept. It's recommended to find your "core" type first.
But once you find your trifix, the order doesn't really matter. Example: 479/794/947/974 are all referred to as the same thing.
But you can order them how you like. If your core type is 9, and you feel that your second strongest is 7, and your third strongest is 4, then you are 974. So even though the picture I attached says 479, it still refers to 974.
It again follows the rule: one from each center (heart, head, gut).

[greg]

Oh, also forgot to mention if you come across the list of enneagram passions/virtues, it's better off to find some sort of written interpretation of those.

Ex. Type 8 is called "lust," but it doesn't even have to be sexual, it really just means having a passion in overindulgence- things like loud music, spicy food, thrills, etc.

[Florestan]

That actually sounds like 4. Not only the description, but all of those composers were type 4.... though my personal template of a 4 is Mahler.

Well, my favorite Mahler movement is the Adagietto of the 6th.

[Karl Henning]

Well, my favorite Mahler movement is the Adagietto of the 6th.

Not the Fifth?

[Florestan]

Not the Fifth?

Oopsss... my bad indeed. The Fifth, obviously

[greg]

Anyone interested in more discussion? Anyone venture further into the topic for themselves?

I've had a whirlwind of the last few months with typology, but I have come to some conclusion that makes sense.

The goal was to get external confirmation of my full enneagram type. Why? Because the way the system works, it's actually subconscious, so people very often mistype themselves. External input is necessary to come to a definitive typing conclusion.

The first typing video I did, I sent into enneagrammer typing service, but their guess was so insanely wrong. So I sent in a video to Attitudinal Psyche, where I get my AP type as well as my enneagram type. The video was commented on and I agreed with it- everything about how the types work, and how I work, makes sense now.


So my AP type is VLEF (3241) and my full enneagram type is 594 sp/sx.

But there is an extra dimension to enneagram me and others are discovering- secondary strategies. These are more conscious. For me, it would be 3, 6, and 8.


I personally call the 594 tritype (ordered any way, even 495's, 549's, etc.), the "Mystic." 368 tritype commonly has the "Warrior" nickname. So like a Mystic with a secondary Warrior side, alter ego, whatever you wanna call it. The idea is that 594 "Mystic" is subconscious/automatic behavior, and the 368 "Warrior" is a bit more conscious like a secondary strategy. (The rest- 7, 2, and 1 are also accessible but take a greater deal of effort and are more rare to see in me).

[71 dB]

After a break from thinking too much about personality types I am back to it. Now re-evaluating things and re-thinking my INTJ/INTP confusion I am more convinced the tests I took were right after all: I am an INTJ. It all comes down to what is natural to me. I can choose operating like an INTP, but the INTJ-way is natural for me.

I hadn't paid much attention into understanding the role of cognitive functions. Now I found good explanations for these using all 8 cognitive functions:

INTJ = Ni-Te-Fi-Se-Ne-Ti-Fe-Si, where the roles are:

1...Ni = Dominant / Hero
2...Te = Auxiliary / Good Parent   
3...Fi = Relief / Eternal Child   
4...Se = Aspirational / Soul / Spirit   
5...Ne = Opposing
6...Ti = Critical Parent   
7...Fe = Trickster   
8...Si = Devilish / Transformative

These roles make a lot of sense to me, but there is a lot to analyse.

[greg]

I should probably research the various roles... looked at it a long time ago but didn't make much sense to me, deserves a second look, though.

All I can say is that I have a preference for Ni, Ne, Fi, and Ti. The rest of them feel like a chore usually. Not sure if that fits any model or not.


I've been huge into learning about Rejection types in enneagram lately. Types 5, 8, and 2 are the Rejection types (also called Power types), and have associated them with stuff like DMT art, Mayan art, Hindu art, etc. because it's the weirdest and perhaps rarest tritype combination to have. It's rare to find an example, but they can tend be cult leader-ish (did some research on Teal Swan and she is definitely a 528 or 582). Basically what those types are doing is rejecting their own neediness and "going it alone" in regards to taking care of themselves, hoping to only be in the position of providing for others rather than needing them.


Also observing some similar types- Tosin Abasi is believed to be a 594 tritype like me, and if you watch interviews from him he does give very similar vibes as I do.

Another interesting character is Wednesday Adams, typically typed 584. Close to my typing, but basically the 8 makes her a huge edgelord. Some say she is a 6 but are absolutely wrong because the preference of being alone massively point to 5 (6's feel more comfortable and safe in groups).


Also defining one HUGE distinction between 5 and 6- basically, both can be "scientific" but 6's will sort of wear the scientific method like a shirt, and let it guide their thinking. 5 is the quintessential free-thinker, preferring to speculate and theorize about their special interests moreso than being bound by any system. 6's are trying to find something trustworthy to guide their thinking, 5 is just completely self-reliant on their thinking. (of course, you can be both, but it's a matter of what you are more of)

[71 dB]

8...Si = Devilish / Transformative

So looking into what Introverted Sensing being my "demonic" cognitive function means:

https://www.psychologyjunkie.com/the-demon-of-each-myers-briggs-personality-type/

"INTJs may quickly forget details, even if they're trying to remember them."

Yes!! Yes!! Yes!! That's one of the most annoying things about being me! Trying to memorise stuff and forgetting it immediately afterwards and having to use tons of time and effort to make stuff stay in my head! Only when my dominant Introverted Intuition has thoroughly analysed every damn aspect of the data I am trying to memorise it finally becomes part of my brain, but it may take years! That's why I tend to learn very slowly unless the data is very intuitive/logical/self-evident in nature.

"For example, they may drive to the same place a dozen times but still need to use their GPS to get there."

Yes! I hate driving for many reasons and one of them is because finding places is hard! I am like "Do I need to turn right in this intersection or in the next one? I can't say if the next intersection looks more correct, because I am not there yet! I can't compare!"

"They may forget names, dates, the way a room was decorated, or the phone number of a dear friend."

Yes, I struggle at remembering people's names. It is embarrassing to me and adds to my social anxiety a lot! So, if and when I forgot your name here, please understand it is not because I am rude or insensitive. It is because of Si is my demonic Cognitive Function and I suffer mentally from this weakness!

I am better at remembering room decorations, because I am a visual person. Architecture/decoration/design gives me a specific feeling that I can store in my mind for later (Tertiary function Fi in action I think...).

"INTJs also tend to focus so much on abstract ideas that they lose sight of their physical needs. They may experience muscle aches and pain from lack of concern for their body. While other types might immediately stretch when they are sore or get a drink when they are thirsty, INTJs tend to be oblivious to these things only to experience debilitating physical effects later."

I probably have this tendency, but perhaps not to the extreme. Sometimes I realize I haven't eaten and I am quite hungry when I have been concentrating on introverted activities for a few hours. I do experience muscle aches from time to time, but I thought everybody does!

All in all this INTJ introverted Sensing stuff applies well on me! Now I know why memorizing and learning new things is so hard/slow for me.

[71 dB]

I should probably research the various roles... looked at it a long time ago but didn't make much sense to me, deserves a second look, though.

All I can say is that I have a preference for Ni, Ne, Fi, and Ti. The rest of them feel like a chore usually. Not sure if that fits any model or not.

That doesn't fit the models. You should have 2 sensing functions (S and N) and 2 judging functions (F and T) in your "conscious" main stack. Moreover, if you have Si, you should also have Ne or vice versa and same for F and T. One of these should be your dominant function and then auxiliary from the other type, so for example Se and Ti (1 sensing, 1 judging, the other introvert and the other extravert). You need to have Si or Se in you main stack, because otherwise you taste, see, hear etc. subconsciously!

These things can be confusing so take your time to figure them out. That's what I am doing!

[Florestan]

"For example, they may drive to the same place a dozen times but still need to use their GPS to get there."

Yes! I hate driving for many reasons and one of them is because finding places is hard! I am like "Do I need to turn right in this intersection or in the next one? I can't say if the next intersection looks more correct, because I am not there yet! I can't compare!"

Waze and Google Maps are your best friends... 

When driving for vacation, I don't even turn the key before my wife's phone is set on one of those. 

[71 dB]

Waze and Google Maps are your best friends... 

When driving for vacation, I don't even turn the key before my wife's phone is set on one of those. 

Yes, nowadays, but I haven't driven a car in years! Back in the day when I did in my job navigators were pretty new. Whenever my boss loaned one for me to use, the help was tremendous! 

[Florestan]

Yes, nowadays, but I haven't driven a car in years! Back in the day when I did in my job navigators were pretty new. Whenever my boss loaned one for me to use, the help was tremendous! 

You had a generous boss, it seems, at least occasionally. 

[71 dB]

You had a generous boss, it seems, at least occasionally. 

Everything is relative. Even generosity. 

[DavidW]

Waze and Google Maps are your best friends... 

When driving for vacation, I don't even turn the key before my wife's phone is set on one of those. 

GPS really made me feel much more comfortable about driving to strange locations.  I always had a fear of getting lost, and maps for me are just not nearly as good as technology.  So sue me!

[71 dB]

GPS really made me feel much more comfortable about driving to strange locations.  I always had a fear of getting lost, and maps for me are just not nearly as good as technology.  So sue me!

What I used to do at work when I needed to drive somewhere I drove "virtually" the route in Google Maps (which of course also showed the route from A to B) street view! Not the entire distance perhaps, but the critical parts such as intersections etc. I used my visual memory and the fact that the visual characteristics of a place gives me a specific feeling to memorize when to turn left or right etc. So, I would for example see in the street view that when I arrive to a place where I need to turn left, there is a tall white office building on the right and the trees around it are small while on the left side the trees are taller. This visual "composition" gives a certain feeling. So, when I arrive to that place, I will experience this specific feeling and I know to turn left!

The problem was prepairing myself for a trip this way takes some time (15 minutes perhaps) and my boss was looking at me and probably thinking "Why the f*ck is he still sitting and staring at the monitor instead of just going to get that task done?" It was nerve-wrecking for me and I had to compromise: Ok, I'll prepaire myself for the most challenging parts of the trip only (5 minutes) and hope for the best for the rest of it!

Extraverts can't understand the difficulties we introverts can experience when operating in the real world in real time!

[71 dB]

Looking into the 7th or the Trickster function (Fe):

https://www.psychologyjunkie.com/the-trickster-of-every-myers-briggs-personality-type/

Because you have Extraverted Feeling in the Trickster position, you're likely to see strong expressions of it as somewhat disingenuous. People who "work the room" or demonstrate a lot of emotional intensity can seem suspicious to you. You may project your Trickster onto them, seeing them as inauthentic, cloying, or manipulative. You may inwardly mock or roll your eyes at them, wondering if they're "up to something."

I think this is true, but I haven't really thought about how emotional expressive people appear to me. I might actually admire this kind of people for being able to manipulate other people! However, I am  probably also well aware as a critical thinker that their act can be deceiving and disingenuous!

At the same time, when called upon to use Fe, perhaps in a social situation, it can feel awkward and stressful for you.

Definitely!! Social situations with a small group of people I know well can be easy, even relaxed, for me, but large groups of people I don't know well makes social situations a nightmare for me! It is as bad as forcing a very extravert person to isolate himself/herself for days without interaction with other people to figure out abstract concepts!

It might be more tempting for you to sarcastically exude Fe than to do it in a serious manner.

Could be true, but I haven't thought about these things much, because of the nightmarish flavour they have for me. I want to limit awkward social situations to the moments they actually happen and are unavoidable and not think about them before or afterwards! After a stressful social situation I need to go "back" to my inner world to charge my drained mental batteries.

Because you naturally crave a great deal of independence, having to consider other people's feelings and connect with them on an emotional level can feel overwhelming.

Definitely! For me it is natural to think my "job" as a person among other people is to avoid being a problem for other people and that's it. The idea of needing to consider other people's feelings is very demanding for me. It's not that don't care about what other people feel (I do). It's that I feel my abilities to affect the feelings of other people poor. Considering other people's feelings just seems a task too massive for me unless the situation is very easy for me (I am just hanging out with my best friend who I know very well and whose feelings I understand at least to some degree).

At the same time, you might know how to tap into Trickster Fe to get something you want. Less healthy INTJs can often manipulate the emotions of others in order to get the desired outcome. When someone tries to convince you to do something for the social welfare of the group, you may try to argue against them using different social values to trap them in a lose-lose situation where their argument lacks merit.

I have to figure out now healthy INTJ I am, but this seems something I don't often do if ever...