Author Topic: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon  (Read 200870 times)

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Offline 71 dB

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1640 on: December 15, 2020, 05:15:48 PM »
I think it would be a good time to take some deep breaths and relax. :-\

Deep breaths are easy. Relaxing is a bit more challenging. However, I deleted half-dozen posts.
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Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1641 on: December 15, 2020, 05:23:24 PM »
Järvi is consistent on Prokofiev. A cycle I'm liking is the one conducted by Kirill Karabits on Onyx. What I've heard has been satisfactory thus far.

Järvi is quite good, indeed. I like Rozhdestvensky the best even if it is rough around the edges. There’s a certain spirit in the playing that I think makes a deep impact.
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Offline 71 dB

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1642 on: December 15, 2020, 05:43:58 PM »
Järvi is quite good, indeed. I like Rozhdestvensky the best even if it is rough around the edges. There’s a certain spirit in the playing that I think makes a deep impact.

Unlike others here I have limited funds. I have never understood how people find time to listen to several symphonic cycles. I have several performances of Elgar's symphonies, but it's just 2 symphonies (plus the "elaborated" third) and Elgar happens to be my favorite composer. I feel like people here have several symphony/concerto/sonata/etc. cycles of MANY composer and those cycles typically have more than 2 works. It's amazing to me. For me comparing performances is very difficult. I can do it with Elgar.

David Hurwitz insists Neeme Järvi is the best cycle of all.
Spatial distortion is a serious problem deteriorating headphone listening.
Crossfeeders reduce spatial distortion and make the sound more natural
and less tiresome in headphone listening.

My Sound Cloud page <-- NEW track "Yin Yang"

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1643 on: December 15, 2020, 05:54:21 PM »
Unlike others here I have limited funds. I have never understood how people find time to listen to several symphonic cycles. I have several performances of Elgar's symphonies, but it's just 2 symphonies (plus the "elaborated" third) and Elgar happens to be my favorite composer. I feel like people here have several symphony/concerto/sonata/etc. cycles of MANY composer and those cycles typically have more than 2 works. It's amazing to me. For me comparing performances is very difficult. I can do it with Elgar.

David Hurwitz insists Neeme Järvi is the best cycle of all.

I think it’s important to take what any critic says, especially Hurwitz, with a grain of salt. Well, Elgar is easier as you stated because there’s only two symphonies. If you decide to go with Järvi, then I doubt you will be disappointed. Truth be told, I’m not too keen on Prokofiev’s symphonies in general as I prefer his ballets, concerti, solo piano music and chamber works much more. I just never have thought of him as a great symphonist. YMMV of course.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2020, 05:56:13 PM by Mirror Image »
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1644 on: December 15, 2020, 08:14:05 PM »
Unlike others here I have limited funds. I have never understood how people find time to listen to several symphonic cycles. I have several performances of Elgar's symphonies, but it's just 2 symphonies (plus the "elaborated" third) and Elgar happens to be my favorite composer. I feel like people here have several symphony/concerto/sonata/etc. cycles of MANY composer and those cycles typically have more than 2 works. It's amazing to me. For me comparing performances is very difficult. I can do it with Elgar.

David Hurwitz insists Neeme Järvi is the best cycle of all.

I disagree with Hurwitz, although on returning to the Järvi set, I've found it better than my earlier recollection. I find his Piano Concerto set stronger than his Symphony set.
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His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline 71 dB

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1645 on: December 15, 2020, 08:55:06 PM »
I disagree with Hurwitz, although on returning to the Järvi set, I've found it better than my earlier recollection. I find his Piano Concerto set stronger than his Symphony set.

I have the Kun Woo Paik discs on Naxos and I don't think I need another Piano Concerto set at this point.

I think it’s important to take what any critic says, especially Hurwitz, with a grain of salt. Well, Elgar is easier as you stated because there’s only two symphonies. If you decide to go with Järvi, then I doubt you will be disappointed. Truth be told, I’m not too keen on Prokofiev’s symphonies in general as I prefer his ballets, concerti, solo piano music and chamber works much more. I just never have thought of him as a great symphonist. YMMV of course.

Not saying I'm taking Hurwitz with a grain of salt, but I think he's got an interesting personality and I like to listen to him. I have had the Järvi set on my wishlist for years. Someone here must have recommended it. You may have a point about Prokofiev as a symphonist.
Spatial distortion is a serious problem deteriorating headphone listening.
Crossfeeders reduce spatial distortion and make the sound more natural
and less tiresome in headphone listening.

My Sound Cloud page <-- NEW track "Yin Yang"

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1646 on: December 16, 2020, 11:48:20 AM »
I have the Kun Woo Paik discs on Naxos and I don't think I need another Piano Concerto set at this point.

I'm alive to limitations in disposable assets.
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Offline 71 dB

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1647 on: December 16, 2020, 01:04:17 PM »
I'm alive to limitations in disposable assets.

It's only about money. I'm struggling to allocate time. As crazy as it sounds I didn't have internet connection home until 2002. No wonder I had time to listen to tons of classical music on daily basis. Nowadays I can watch Jake Verda's "Therewasanattempt" videos on Youtube. Or Urbex videos by The Proper People. Or Kyle Kulinski ranting about social media censorship. Or ElectroBOOM, Action Lab, Michael Penn, Mathologer, Dave Cad, Dan Bell, Ihana Pön, Aleksi Himself, Numberphile, TYR the White Fox, Two Minute Papers, The Science Asylum, In The Mix, Music Matters, Signals Music Studio, Hack Music Theory and Dr Peyam just to mention a fraction of the "content creators" to my taste. All of that did not exist before Youtube! Youtube is an astronomical cornucopia of interesting and entertaining content. If 99 % of Youtube videos disappeared I would still find tons of stuff to watch! I don't even watch cat videos, because I feel there's so much BETTER content available. Cool content is being created and uploaded to Youtube servers faster than I can watch it!!  ???

So, WHEN am I supposed to listen to Prokofiev? FakeJake has uploaded a new "Therewasanattempt" video 5 hours ago! Must see! All I can say it there was an attempt to listen to Prokofiev!  ;D

Spatial distortion is a serious problem deteriorating headphone listening.
Crossfeeders reduce spatial distortion and make the sound more natural
and less tiresome in headphone listening.

My Sound Cloud page <-- NEW track "Yin Yang"

Offline relm1

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1648 on: December 16, 2020, 04:59:06 PM »
Järvi is consistent on Prokofiev. A cycle I'm liking is the one conducted by Kirill Karabits on Onyx. What I've heard has been satisfactory thus far.

I was very mixed on Karabits on Onyx.  I LOVED some and Loathed some.  They had such a range of audio I would never listen to them ever again.  I believe his No. 3 was atrocious.  His No. 4 revised was fantastic.  A very mixed bag. 

Offline Daverz

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1649 on: December 16, 2020, 05:40:50 PM »
I was very mixed on Karabits on Onyx.  I LOVED some and Loathed some.  They had such a range of audio I would never listen to them ever again.  I believe his No. 3 was atrocious.  His No. 4 revised was fantastic.  A very mixed bag.

I have all the Karabits series, but have yet to revisit them.  Same for Gaffigan.

This reminds me that I need to give the Inkinen recording of 3 & 6 an audition.



Another "up and comer" that impressed me in Russian music was Tugan Sokhiev.  His Prokofiev 5 is on the light side, but I really liked it because I'm tired of "heavy metal" Fifths.  He also did a really good Ivan the Terrible (without the Stasev narration, praise be).






Offline vandermolen

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1650 on: December 16, 2020, 11:28:13 PM »
I have all the Karabits series, but have yet to revisit them.  Same for Gaffigan.

This reminds me that I need to give the Inkinen recording of 3 & 6 an audition.



Another "up and comer" that impressed me in Russian music was Tugan Sokhiev.  His Prokofiev 5 is on the light side, but I really liked it because I'm tired of "heavy metal" Fifths.  He also did a really good Ivan the Terrible (without the Stasev narration, praise be).


I like that recording of the Ivan the Terrible music as well.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Offline T. D.

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1651 on: January 13, 2021, 12:25:14 PM »
I saw John switched his avatar to Prokofiev and thought I'd post some material on the Prokofiev-David Oistrakh chess match:

https://en.chessbase.com/post/the-1937-prokofiev-oistrakh-match
https://chessimprover.com/chess-and-music-part-4-oistrakh-plays-prokofiev/#:~:text=In%201937%20a%20chess%20match,Prokofiev%20won%20the%20fifth%20game.

Mikhail Botvinnik wrote of the two musicians' fondness for chess in his Achieving the Aim, but I'm too lazy to transcribe the passage right now (I do recall a statement that Oistrakh "played [chess  ;) ] cautiously and had good technique.").

More on SP and chess: https://www.chesshistory.com/winter/extra/prokofiev.html
« Last Edit: January 13, 2021, 12:32:50 PM by T. D. »

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1652 on: January 13, 2021, 12:41:09 PM »
I’d prefer to talk about the music and recordings. ;) But, yes, I was quite aware that Prokofiev loved chess. Interestingly enough, I do as well.
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Offline T. D.

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1653 on: January 13, 2021, 12:47:57 PM »
Strictly FYI. Fully aware it's off-topic, but at least it briefly distracted me from politics.

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1654 on: January 13, 2021, 12:52:50 PM »
Strictly FYI. Fully aware it's off-topic, but at least it briefly distracted me from politics.

I hope the music is even more of a distraction for you from the political threads. :)
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Offline T. D.

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1655 on: January 13, 2021, 12:57:55 PM »
I hope the music is even more of a distraction for you from the political threads. :)

I've been listening more to non-classical music, in search of upbeat material.

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1656 on: January 13, 2021, 01:00:45 PM »
I've been listening more to non-classical music, in search of upbeat material.

Listen to some Milhaud. He’s guaranteed to lift your spirits.
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Offline Dry Brett Kavanaugh

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1657 on: January 13, 2021, 05:43:05 PM »
Listen to some Milhaud. He’s guaranteed to lift your spirits.

Dave Brubeck's teacher!

Offline Daverz

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1658 on: January 13, 2021, 06:35:08 PM »
Listen to some Milhaud. He’s guaranteed to lift your spirits.

Also Françaix, Saint-Saëns, and any Poulenc without nuns in it.

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon
« Reply #1659 on: January 13, 2021, 06:45:20 PM »
Dave Brubeck's teacher!

That’s right! And if I’m not mistaken, Brubeck got to study with him at Mills College where Milhaud taught.
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy