'An Appalling Report'

[Josquin des Prez]

I don't quite follow the complaint here.

Why should anybody read Homer? Can anybody answer this question? Why is it important? Why is it necessary to enforce this particular work of literature upon our children? What is there to be profited from the experience?

[Florestan]

I don't quite follow the complaint here.

If I understand JdP correctly, he points to the cultural relativism that doesn't place any special importance or significance in Homer more than in Danielle Steel.

[karlhenning]

If I understand JdP correctly, he points to the cultural relativism that doesn't place any special importance or significance in Homer more than in Danielle Steel.

Ah, well.  Practically no educator known to me personally would claim any literal equality between Homer and Danielle Steel.

I knew a doddering old former-pharmaceuticals-professor who couldn't think why Michael Jackson is musically inferior to Beethoven;  but he isn't driving the curriculum anywhere, so far as I can tell.

[karlhenning]

Echoes from another thread.

[karlhenning]

In fairness, as a dancer, Beethoven can't touch Michael.

[PSmith08]

If I understand JdP correctly, he points to the cultural relativism that doesn't place any special importance or significance in Homer more than in Danielle Steel.

Danielle Steel? Don't be ridiculous. Everyone knows that John Grisham is every bit as important as Homer.

[mn dave]

Danielle Steel? Don't be ridiculous. Everyone knows that John Grisham is every bit as important as Homer.

No! Jackie Collins!!!

[karlhenning]

No! Jackie Collins!!!

Dave! I can't believe you went there!

[PSmith08]

No! Jackie Collins!!!

Dare I utter the august, well-nigh-unutterable name? I dare, I dare.

Kitty Kelley.

[adamdavid80]

Valid is not the same as particularly insightful. That water boils at 100 degrees Celsius is a valid point, but not particularly insightful.

Precisely. Now, the standard of 1908 differs from that of 2008. JdP thinks the old one was better. I don't see the problem.
Nobody forces you to engage him. But dismissing him as a Nazi, without presenting the slightest evidence in this respect, is intellectually dishonest.

The water boiling thing is a scientific fact...it's not a point of view, which is what a "valid point"...ahem...boils down to.  A world of difference.

The needs and demands of 2008 are completely different from 1908.  If 1908 is is so much better, and you want to revert back to that model, than should we eliminate computers from the curriculum and system?  Should motor vehichles be eliminated as the means of transport to the school?  Should females have to resort to all-women learning facilities like Vassar College?  Should they be eliminated from the workforce?  See?  Dumb.  There's no other word for it. 

And he wears the nazi badge with pride.  to him, its a compliment.  he's called himself a nazi on a number of occassions. 

[Florestan]

The needs and demands of 2008 are completely different from 1908.  If 1908 is is so much better, and revert back to that model, than should we eliminate computers from the curriculum and system?  Should motor vehichles be eliminated as the means of transport to the school?  Should females have to resort to all-women learning facilities like Vassar College?  Should they be eliminated from the workforce? 

Strawman. I won't even bother to respond.
 

And he wears the nazi badge with pride.  to him, its a compliment.  he's called himself a nazi on a number of occassions. 

Does "irony" ring a bell to you?

[Josquin des Prez]

False.

Does this mean you are taking on the challenge? This is exciting.

Truly, that is a misunderstanding on your part.

A single glance at Emmy Noether reveals either wise:

[Josquin des Prez]

Should females have to resort to all-women learning facilities like Vassar College?

Actually yes. I'm in full support of single sex education, for men and women alike.

Should they be eliminated from the workforce? 

Women, no. Femininity? Yes. Same goes for education, or society at large.

[Florestan]

A single glance at Emmy Noether reveals either wise:

This might be your strongest argument, J. It is a common, daily experience that, broadly speaking, feminity and intellectual interests are in inverse proportion.  

[adamdavid80]

Strawman. I won't even bother to respond.
  Does "irony" ring a bell to you?

You won't respond bc you know you've been checkmated.  If 1908 was so great, why did things evolve?  There' a bigger population now, needs have changed, the curriculum for all its flaws, IS better.  Sorry...you didn't learn the boiling point of water from the bible.  Period.

I know what irony is, and I know what a bigotry is.  J employs the latter.  Frankly, you defending him only casts a very poor light on you and your POV.   But then, your own bigotry has caused at least two people to leave this site, so where's the surprise?

[Florestan]

You won't respond bc you know you've been checkmated.

Wishful thinking.

If 1908 was so great, why did things evolve?

Some evolved, some devolved. Long debate.

you didn't learn the boiling point of water from the bible.

Of course. The Bible is no scientific textbook.

your own bigotry has caused at least two people to leave this site, so where's the surprise?

You're very fond of shallow words that mean nothing in particular; nevertheless, you're confusing me with someone else.

[Josquin des Prez]

Frankly, you defending him only casts a very poor light on you and your POV. 

He is defending me because he sees the same problems i do. This doesn't necessarily means he agrees with my (admittedly) radical explanations for those problems. I take full responsibility for my ideas, and have no wish of dumping the burden upon others.

[Florestan]

I'm not even defending JdP, for as he says, he can defend himself. I'm defending rational debate, free from name-calling, ideological parti-pris and sentimental strawmen.

Actually, this isn't a trial with defendants and prosecutors --- or is it?

[Josquin des Prez]

I don't know. Here's more Emmy Noether for ya:



Was Weininger really that crazy?

[Florestan]

Was Weininger really that crazy?

I haven't read him. Could you summarize his views for me?