GMG Classical Music Forum

The Back Room => The Diner => Topic started by: Karl Henning on November 11, 2021, 07:54:30 AM

Title: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: Karl Henning on November 11, 2021, 07:54:30 AM
On Kristallnacht anniversary, Austria unveils memorial wall with 64,440 names. (https://www.timesofisrael.com/on-kristallnacht-anniversary-austria-unveils-memorial-wall-with-64440-names/)

QuoteAustrian governments had maintained until the early 2000s that the country, which Nazi Germany in 1938 annexed without bloodshed amid mass displays of enthusiasm by the population, was primarily a victim of Adolf Hitler's Germany, rather than a willing collaborator.

But amid criticism on this attitude, Austrian leaders have since acknowledged their nation and society's active role in the murder of about 65,000 Austrian Jews, the vast majority of the country's Jewish population in 1938. About 50,000 of the victims came from Vienna.

Tangentially, it is posts like this when I especially do not miss snyprrr.
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: bhodges on November 11, 2021, 08:31:36 AM
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 11, 2021, 07:54:30 AM
On Kristallnacht anniversary, Austria unveils memorial wall with 64,440 names. (https://www.timesofisrael.com/on-kristallnacht-anniversary-austria-unveils-memorial-wall-with-64440-names/)

Tangentially, it is posts like this when I especially do not miss snyprrr.

Oh lord, he was a handful.

--Bruce
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: JBS on November 11, 2021, 10:34:48 AM
In his biography of Freud, Peter Gay noted that after the Anschluss, Austrians often acted worse than the German Nazis in their treatment of Jews.
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: Jo498 on November 12, 2021, 12:44:09 AM
I am not sure how well documented it is but I would not be surprised if around 1900 antisemitism in Germany would have been among the lowest in most European countries.
There was nothing like the Dreyfus affair in Germany and don't even start with Eastern Europe (and Austria-Hungaria was in some regions mor like Eastern Europe and also probably had more non-assimilated Jews in its realm) or Russia where they had pogroms in the early 20th century.
The almost perfect assimilation of Jews in Germany made the antisemitism of the 3rd Reich all the more shocking and very probably led many assimilated Jews to seriously underestimate the imminent threat around 1930.
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: JBS on November 12, 2021, 08:48:16 AM
Quote from: Jo498 on November 12, 2021, 12:44:09 AM
I am not sure how well documented it is but I would not be surprised if around 1900 antisemitism in Germany would have been among the lowest in most European countries.
There was nothing like the Dreyfus affair in Germany and don't even start with Eastern Europe (and Austria-Hungaria was in some regions mor like Eastern Europe and also probably had more non-assimilated Jews in its realm) or Russia where they had pogroms in the early 20th century.
The almost perfect assimilation of Jews in Germany made the antisemitism of the 3rd Reich all the more shocking and very probably led many assimilated Jews to seriously underestimate the imminent threat around 1930.

From what I've read, there was a not-low level of antisemitism in Wilhelmine Germany, but it didn't reach to dramatic incidents or violence.  There were plenty of people with antisemitic attitudes (including the Kaiser, it seems) and things like hotels advertising that they didn't allow Jews as guests. So not like Russia or Austria  but rather similar to the USA when comparing it to other countries of that era.
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: vandermolen on November 16, 2021, 09:34:06 AM
I find Rachel Whiteread's Holocaust Memorial (the Nameless Library) in Vienna to be very moving:
(//)
I like this short video posted by a young American visitor:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yq8m3xaYjNM
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: LKB on November 16, 2021, 11:39:05 AM
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 11, 2021, 07:54:30 AM
On Kristallnacht anniversary, Austria unveils memorial wall with 64,440 names. (https://www.timesofisrael.com/on-kristallnacht-anniversary-austria-unveils-memorial-wall-with-64440-names/)

Tangentially, it is posts like this when I especially do not miss snyprrr.

Who?
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: Karl Henning on November 16, 2021, 12:19:03 PM
Quote from: LKB on November 16, 2021, 11:39:05 AM
Who?

Don't worry ....
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: Cato on November 27, 2021, 05:26:19 AM
Quote from: LKB on November 16, 2021, 11:39:05 AM

Who?



Let's just call him an eccentric in style and content.  ;)

If his real persona is anywhere close to what he seemed to be like here, then yes, he must be "a handful" indeed!
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: LKB on November 28, 2021, 07:12:03 AM
TD...

The Holocaust has haunted my imagination ever since l was first exposed to it as a young boy via Night and Fog, which all students at my school were required to see.

Years later, it became more personal after l discovered that an uncle had been a political prisoner at Bergen-Belsen, the camp where Anne Frank met her fate.

My uncle survived but eventually went insane, and died prematurely.

So whenever any organization, individual or state decides to accept accountability ( however belatedly ), l will always support such an effort.
Title: Re: New Viennese Holocaust Monument
Post by: Karl Henning on November 28, 2021, 03:16:26 PM
Quote from: LKB on November 28, 2021, 07:12:03 AM
TD...

The Holocaust has haunted my imagination ever since l was first exposed to it as a young boy via Night and Fog, which all students at my school were required to see.

Years later, it became more personal after l discovered that an uncle had been a political prisoner at Bergen-Belsen, the camp where Anne Frank met her fate.

My uncle survived but eventually went insane, and died prematurely.

So whenever any organization, individual or state decides to accept accountability ( however belatedly ), l will always support such an effort.

Thank you for sharing.