GMG Classical Music Forum

The Music Room => Great Recordings and Reviews => Topic started by: Mandryka on March 04, 2021, 11:25:31 AM

Title: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 04, 2021, 11:25:31 AM
Please recommend me your favourite recordings.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: André Le Nôtre on March 04, 2021, 01:10:23 PM
a few off the top of my head (there are many more in this and other genres). As you can see, my tastes tend toward the older mono/historic stuff, but I also do love great stereo recordings as well.

Janos Starker playing Kodaly Sonata for Unaccompanied Cello, OP 8; Period

Gioconda de Vito/Edwin Fischer playing Brahms sonatas 1, 3; Angel/EMI

Kai Laursen playing violin music of Karl Nielsen; Washington

Klemens Krauss/VPO playing Strauss Also Sprach Zarathustra; London

Pierre Monteux conducting Haydn symphonies (incl. "clock"); RCA Victor Living Stereo

Mischa Elman/Joseph Seiger  playing Grieg Sonatas; Decca/London

Janos Starker playing Bach suites--TWO sets; one on Period (my favorite); one on Mercury

Ossy Renardy/Charles Munch, Brahms Concerto; Remington

Paul Badura-Skoda, Beethoven Op. 111; Harmonia Mundi (French)

Music of Ancient Greece; Harmonia Mundi (French) <---One of the best-sounding recordings ever made

Jennie Tourel/Paul Ulanoswky, A French/Italian Program: London/Decca

Elisabeth Schwarzkopf/Furtwängler (piano!), Wolf Songs; EMI

Boris Christoff, Glinka songs; EMI

Joseph Szigeti/Leonid Hambro (?), Prokofieff Sonatas; Columbia

Vlado Perlemuter, Piano music of Ravel; VOX set


There are many more...







Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 04, 2021, 01:27:27 PM
I give up.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: André Le Nôtre on March 04, 2021, 01:34:47 PM
Quote from: Mandryka on March 04, 2021, 01:27:27 PM
I give up.

Not sure what you are asking here if not for recommendations for recordings on LP. Guess I'm not cool enough for you. (You would do well do listen to some of this music BTW!!)

My mother AND my aunt just died of COVID-19 last week, and in the midst of a lockdown, I was just looking for some human interaction.

I give up.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 04, 2021, 01:42:16 PM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on March 04, 2021, 01:34:47 PM
Not sure what you are asking here if not for recommendations for recordings on LP. Guess I'm not cool enough for you.

My mother AND my aunt just died of COVID-19 last week, and in the midst of a lockdown, I was just looking for some human interaction.

I give up.

Sorry, you have human interaction! And I didn't mean any offence, it's just that I saw the big list, got all excited, and looked carefully, and realised what had happened. And of course I'm sorry for your mother and aunt, we live in tough times.

As far as your sort of turnbableism goes, I don't do it and haven't done since 1990 or thereabouts. But sometimes I toy with the idea of learning how to make digital transfers. I of course heard some of the recordings you mentioned.

The Music of Ancient Greece, is that Conrad Steinmann with Andrea Savall? If so I know it well, I have a transfer, it is wonderful.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51MWceGZCcL._AC_SX466_.jpg)
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 04, 2021, 01:46:53 PM
And just to be clear, this is real turntableism!


https://www.youtube.com/v/ta0vKwNYg0E
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: T. D. on March 04, 2021, 02:39:25 PM
Not classical, rather a hybrid of notated/improv/free jazz, but I've started listening to Lawrence D. "Butch" Morris's Conductions, and quite a few of these include turntables (some operated by the aforementioned Christian Marclay). I like what I've heard, just listened to Conductions #39E and #40E with turntables.
Some too-brief clips at https://www.newworldrecords.org/products/testament-a-conduction-collection-conductions-38-39-40
Many of the New World recordings on Youtube, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyYMu-GxnaU
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: 71 dB on March 04, 2021, 04:45:28 PM
Quote from: Mandryka on March 04, 2021, 01:46:53 PM
And just to be clear, this is real turntableism!


https://www.youtube.com/v/ta0vKwNYg0E

I was also ignorant enough to think this thread is about vinyl LPs.  ;D Never heard of turntableism before and it sound pretty weird. The closest of the music I listen to this comes perhaps Australian band The Avalanches:

https://www.youtube.com/v/qLrnkK2YEcE

[asin]B00004XN07[/asin]

Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Hans Holbein on March 04, 2021, 08:54:07 PM
Martin Tetreault & Xavier Charles - MXCT
Martin Tetreault & Otomo Yoshihide - 21 Situations
Christian Marclay & Otomo Yoshihide - Moving Parts
Many Philip Jeck recordings (and BTW he was the turntablist on the recording of Bryars' "Titanic" mentioned upthread).
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 12:03:39 AM
Quote from: 71 dB on March 04, 2021, 04:45:28 PM
it sound pretty weird.



We are very far from Bach, Mozart and Beethoven with this sort of music.

But at another level, when Bach used the E flat major chord at the start of the Eroica, he was helping himself to an artefact he found in common practice tonality. When turntableists use samples of records, they are also using found artefacts. It's the same thing. All art is sample.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: premont on March 05, 2021, 12:34:47 AM
Quote from: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 12:03:39 AM


...... when Bach used the E flat major chord at the start of the Eroica.....

Breaking news !
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 12:49:18 AM
Quote from: (: premont :) on March 05, 2021, 12:34:47 AM
Breaking news !

All the Bs are the same as far as I'm concerned.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 12:50:00 AM
Quote from: Hans Holbein on March 04, 2021, 08:54:07 PM
Martin Tetreault & Otomo Yoshihide - 21 Situations

Excellent, looking forward to hearing the rest.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: 71 dB on March 05, 2021, 01:38:20 AM
Quote from: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 12:03:39 AM
We are very far from Bach, Mozart and Beethoven with this sort of music.

Sure, but it sounds weird for my ears because I have never before even heard about this "genre/style", which is weird in itself. When was Turntableism invented? 10 years ago? 20 years ago? Who was the pioneer? Where in the World is this music made? Anywhere? Why are you into it yourself? So many questions...

There's so many genres and sub genres nowadays nobody can know them all. For example, do you know what Neurofunk is?  ;D
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 02:47:57 AM
Quote from: 71 dB on March 05, 2021, 01:38:20 AM
Sure, but it sounds weird for my ears because I have never before even heard about this "genre/style", which is weird in itself. When was Turntableism invented? 10 years ago? 20 years ago? Who was the pioneer? Where in the World is this music made? Anywhere? Why are you into it yourself? So many questions...



You have to go back to Schaeffer and Henry I think.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: 71 dB on March 05, 2021, 03:10:22 AM
Quote from: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 02:47:57 AM
You have to go back to Schaeffer and Henry I think.

Oh, okay. That starts to explain things. My knowledge of music movements of that time period is very weak. For example "electronic music" of the 50's and 60's is for the most part silly for my ears. Sinewave and white noise generators.  ;D  Imo in the 70's the technology started to be adequate to create good electronic music, but even at that time it was clumsy.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 03:21:26 AM
Quote from: 71 dB on March 05, 2021, 03:10:22 AM
Oh, okay. That starts to explain things. My knowledge of music movements of that time period is very weak. For example "electronic music" of the 50's and 60's is for the most part silly for my ears. Sinewave and white noise generators.  ;D  Imo in the 70's the technology started to be adequate to create good electronic music, but even at that time it was clumsy.

Well the most impressive piece of electronic music I've heard is Stockhausen's Hymnen III and IV, 1968. When that man interrupts the white noise and sine waves and says bizarrely "faites votre jeu messieurs" it is like I'm taken to another planet.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: premont on March 05, 2021, 03:44:50 AM
Quote from: 71 dB on March 05, 2021, 01:38:20 AM
Sure, but it sounds weird for my ears because I have never before even heard about this "genre/style", which is weird in itself.

My first thought when I saw  the word Turntablism was DJ. But this is obviously only part of the concept. It seems to be about a very advanced DJ-ism.

And now to some music.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 05, 2021, 04:01:24 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on March 04, 2021, 01:34:47 PM
Not sure what you are asking here if not for recommendations for recordings on LP. Guess I'm not cool enough for you. (You would do well do listen to some of this music BTW!!)

My mother AND my aunt just died of COVID-19 last week, and in the midst of a lockdown, I was just looking for some human interaction.

I give up.
André,

I am so very sorry to hear of your losses!  One of which would be hard enough to cope with.

Like you, I thought that Mandryka was asking about favorite recordings on LP, but was also a bit confused as there is also already a thread on vinyl.

All the best wishes to you and your family,

PD
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: T. D. on March 05, 2021, 08:18:20 AM
Whoa, forgot about this one which I purchased long ago:

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51bTyIXFsRL._SX425_.jpg)

You (Mandryka) might like it, esp. considering repertoire. Christian Marclay plays (?) some turntables.

Wiki: SYR4 featured works by avant-garde classical composers such as John Cage, Yoko Ono, Steve Reich and Christian Wolff*, played by Sonic Youth and several collaborators from the modern avant-garde music scene, such as Christian Marclay, William Winant, Wharton Tiers and Takehisa Kosugi.

*Also [T.D.] Cardew, Oliveros, George Maciunas (of Fluxus "fame").
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: DavidW on March 05, 2021, 08:36:55 AM
Quote from: (: premont :) on March 05, 2021, 03:44:50 AM
My first thought when I saw  the word Turntablism was DJ.

My first thought was "this is Mandryka so he is probably asking about the sound of a turntable falling into a black holes as clocks melt, the dwarf speaks in reverse and this is not a pipe."  Not surprised that I wasn't far off. $:)
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 09:14:38 AM
Quote from: DavidW on March 05, 2021, 08:36:55 AM
My first thought was "this is Mandryka so he is probably asking about the sound of a turntable falling into a black holes as clocks melt, the dwarf speaks in reverse and this is not a pipe."  Not surprised that I wasn't far off. $:)

I especially enjoy the dwarf speaking in reverse. Fire walk with me.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Szykneij on March 05, 2021, 12:19:22 PM
Garmonbozia
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Iota on March 06, 2021, 03:51:10 AM
Quote from: Mandryka on March 05, 2021, 09:14:38 AM
I especially enjoy the dwarf speaking in reverse. Fire walk with me.

What a moment in televisual history that was! I and a Japanese woman I was sharing a flat with at the time, were both obsessed with that series!
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 12, 2021, 01:20:55 AM
Quote from: Hans Holbein on March 04, 2021, 08:54:07 PM
Martin Tetreault & Xavier Charles - MXCT

Also excellent!
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 14, 2021, 10:31:57 AM
(https://media.pitchfork.com/photos/5929bc3fc0084474cd0c2a49/1:1/w_600/7c8cbc73.jpeg)

Philip Jeck, Sand. Immersive, introverted, richly polyphonic, expressive - often melancholic. Genius.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 16, 2021, 12:42:45 AM
And a fabulous, haunting, thing on this, on Spotify , half an hour or more, called Phase of Post Music, I chose the word "haunting" carefully. It is now my favourite track of Christmas music!

(https://f4.bcbits.com/img/a3019721440_10.jpg)
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: steve ridgway on March 16, 2021, 10:48:09 AM
Quote from: 71 dB on March 05, 2021, 01:38:20 AM
When was Turntableism invented? 10 years ago? 20 years ago? Who was the pioneer?

John Cage - Imaginary Landscape No. 1, for two variable-speed phono turntables, frequency recordings, muted piano and cymbal (1939).
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Rinaldo on March 16, 2021, 11:13:38 AM
Jeck is very interesting, so is Marclay.

From a less experimental bag, this is actually one of my all-time favourite records: Kaleidoscope by the collective DJ Food.

https://www.youtube.com/v/FPfkK0Jl2Wo

Their sampling is all over the place, they even nip a bit of Verklärte Nacht, to great effect:

https://www.youtube.com/v/ytDdPZgHlfE
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Hans Holbein on March 17, 2021, 09:29:23 PM
Not quite turntablism, strictly speaking, but possibly relevant to the interest of some here:

The Caretaker (Leyland Kirby) - Everywhere at the end of time
A 6.5-hour piece (series of albums, really) using 78s of dance bands as the raw material - lightly processed and edited at first; increasingly unrecognizable as the piece progresses.
https://youtu.be/wJWksPWDKOc (https://youtu.be/wJWksPWDKOc)

He also did a piece based on old Winterreise recordings - mostly Gerhard Husch.
https://youtu.be/C5PFGj9Z0cg (https://youtu.be/C5PFGj9Z0cg)
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Rinaldo on March 18, 2021, 01:26:37 AM
Quote from: Hans Holbein on March 17, 2021, 09:29:23 PM
Not quite turntablism, strictly speaking, but possibly relevant to the interest of some here:

The Caretaker (Leyland Kirby) - Everywhere at the end of time
A 6.5-hour piece (series of albums, really) using 78s of dance bands as the raw material - lightly processed and edited at first; increasingly unrecognizable as the piece progresses.
https://youtu.be/wJWksPWDKOc (https://youtu.be/wJWksPWDKOc)

He also did a piece based on old Winterreise recordings - mostly Gerhard Husch.
https://youtu.be/C5PFGj9Z0cg (https://youtu.be/C5PFGj9Z0cg)

Now we're talking! It's interesting to see these hauntological ventures mutating into the mainstream. Nowadays videos like this one – Oldies playing in the car and it's raining (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lkc5Woyy47I) – get over million views in a few months.
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 18, 2021, 02:03:31 AM
Quote from: Rinaldo on March 18, 2021, 01:26:37 AM
Now we're talking! It's interesting to see these hauntological ventures mutating into the mainstream. Nowadays videos like this one – Oldies playing in the car and it's raining (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lkc5Woyy47I) – get over million views in a few months.

Is Jeck a hauntologist?
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Rinaldo on March 18, 2021, 04:35:58 AM
Quote from: Mandryka on March 18, 2021, 02:03:31 AM
Is Jeck a hauntologist?

I think he fits that label but not by his own words, no.

QuoteDavid Toop has talked of the inexpicably mournful character of Jeck's work, while Mark Fisher has used the concept of 'hauntology' (from the work of French philosopher Jacques Derrida) to explain its eerie nostalgia and uncanny sense of loss. Jeck himself claims to have little time for analysis: "Once I've made a CD or played a concert and that has gone out into the world, anyone can place it in their own view or understanding of music, sound or the world. And that is interesting to me — but what it sounds like is paramount."

From The Marks Of History: Philip Jeck And The Outer Reaches Of Turntablism (https://thequietus.com/articles/01826-the-marks-of-history-the-outer-reaches-turntablism-of-philip-jeck)
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 18, 2021, 04:51:12 AM
I'm very tempted to buy this book, does anyone know it?

https://primaryinformation.org/product/broken-music/
Title: Re: Turntableism
Post by: Mandryka on March 27, 2022, 12:52:46 PM
Philip Jeck has died, sadly.