Box Blather

Started by Ken B, April 19, 2014, 07:07:51 PM

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Todd

Quote from: Mookalafalas on March 02, 2023, 03:47:59 AMHas the whole "Big Box Era" sort of run it's course?

Probably.  Some boxes will return again and again (eg, Glenn Gould), but even the classical world has moved on to streaming as the primary delivery method for recordings.  As aged consumers die off and younger consumers enter and dominate the market, their buying preferences will properly be catered to.  There will always be some boxes here and there.  Why it took so long for a Gieseking box to arrive is something of a mystery.  Well, not really.  He died almost seventy years ago, and compared to even twenty years ago, no one really mentions him anymore.  Most celebrities of the past will fade into oblivion, and current celebrities may never need or receive big box treatment.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Brian

#1261
The average big box seems to be moving more towards niche/smaller audiences. A few years ago, we were getting Reiner, Bernstein, Karajan boxes; now we're getting Robert Craft, Claudio Abbado, Trevor Pinnock boxes. One exception is the upcoming "Solti in Europe" but it sure seems like many of the biggest of big boxes have been done already.

There are still many more one can imagine! My personal list includes the complete Kertesz/Decca, Mackerras/EMI, Mackerras/Decca, Andsnes/EMI, and the remaining Dorati legacy (the Detroit box coming out this spring suggests they will do Dorati as a series of smaller boxes).

I also just looked up Hurwitz's video from June 2020 where he begged for 12 big box sets. Status report:

They've been released: Abbado/LSO, Markevitch/DG, Previn/EMI, Ormandy [mono only], Mitropoulos, Eduard van Beinum, Orpheus Chamber Orchestra, Rodzinski

No sign of a box yet: Scott Joplin/RCA, Slatkin/RCA, Ormandy [stereo], Paris Conservatoire as an institution, Arthur Fiedler/Boston Pops

So in the span of just two and a half years, 8 of his 12 wishes have been granted.

Edit: Istvan Kertesz died 50 years ago this year and the labels love using anniversaries as excuses for big boxes, so I wouldn't be surprised if the Kertesz Big Box appears this fall.

Todd

Quote from: Brian on March 02, 2023, 05:57:34 AM...and the labels love using anniversaries as excuses for big boxes...

They do, so I am hoping this year for a Big Rach box (with artists that interest me) and a Big Byrd box (yes, I saw the phrase as I wrote it).  2027 should hopefully see big boxes denied us in 2020.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Mookalafalas

Quote from: Brian on March 02, 2023, 05:57:34 AMThe average big box seems to be moving more towards niche/smaller audiences. A few years ago, we were getting Reiner, Bernstein, Karajan boxes; now we're getting Robert Craft, Claudio Abbado, Trevor Pinnock boxes.

  But is that a new trend, or just the inevitable result of the "giants" aleady having been represented (or in the cases of Richter, Bernstein, Karajan, Callas, etc., milked completely dry)? There is bound to be a giant Klemperer at some point, but I can't think of another really biggy (well, perhaps an original jackets Kempff).
  I bought a lot of boxes in the past just because they reached bargain basement prices (I got several high quality 50 CD box sets for $67 each), but that doesn't seem to be the case anymore. I have mixed feelings about that ;)
It's all good...

DaveF

Quote from: Todd on March 02, 2023, 06:26:58 AMThey do, so I am hoping this year for a Big Rach box (with artists that interest me) and a Big Byrd box (yes, I saw the phrase as I wrote it).  2027 should hopefully see big boxes denied us in 2020.

I first misread that as a big Bach box... aren't there one or two of them already :-[ ?  Regarding Byrd, I can't see a big collection being a possibility, given how the available recordings are spread around the labels - Andrew Carwood's complete Latin music half on ASV, half on Hyperion, Davitt Moroney's keyboard music on Hyperion, David Skinner's (ongoing) English music on his own Inventa label, the English anthems and services here, there and everywhere... I hope you're wrong, but remain pessimistic.
"All the world is birthday cake" - George Harrison

Todd

Quote from: DaveF on March 03, 2023, 06:11:11 AMRegarding Byrd, I can't see a big collection being a possibility,

I'm hoping for something like Michael Noone's out of the blue ten-disc Victoria box from a decade or so ago. 
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Brian

Quote from: Mookalafalas on March 02, 2023, 08:53:15 PMThere is bound to be a giant Klemperer at some point
Dude...you need to buy a lottery ticket because



Just published on Amazon.de with a release date of June 2. 95 CDs.

I agree that it seems super bargain prices on these big boxes are becoming slightly less common. (Or maybe it's because the boxes are so much bigger. $1.50 per disc adds up after 95 discs!) One exception is Universal's "Center Stage" store in the US, which usually has clearance prices if you're willing to wait 1-2 years. I am cynically waiting on a couple recent Decca and DG boxes hoping they show up in their after-Christmas sale next year.

Also 100% agree that they are moving to more niche artists because the most famous ones have been "done". One more artist I thought of: I have loads of Zino Francescatti thanks to the Szell, Bernstein, and Casadesus boxes, but there's probably enough more to justify buying his own box?

Todd

Quote from: Brian on March 05, 2023, 05:34:19 AMI have loads of Zino Francescatti thanks to the Szell, Bernstein, and Casadesus boxes, but there's probably enough more to justify buying his own box?

Zino who?
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Spotted Horses

Quote from: Brian on March 05, 2023, 05:34:19 AMDude...you need to buy a lottery ticket because



Just published on Amazon.de with a release date of June 2. 95 CDs.

I'm ripe for that one because I have only a smattering of Klemperer.
There are simply two kinds of music, good music and the other kind. - Duke Ellington

Mookalafalas

Quote from: Brian on March 05, 2023, 05:34:19 AMDude...you need to buy a lottery ticket because

Just published on Amazon.de with a release date of June 2. 95 CDs.

  If I hadn't bought each of those little "clamshell" style boxes as they came out, I'd be all over this.

  As it is, I bought a second hand Ozawa, complete Phillips box over the weekend. For $40, it was an easy choice. I have a ton of his Boston era stuff I haven't played, so am planning an Ozawa binge in the not too distant future (when I finish the Munch box, perhaps).

 Spotted Horses, I think you'll be very happy. They gave him a star producer/recording engineer, and the recording quality is very high. Actually, i need to go back and replay a lot of this stuff myself...
It's all good...

Brian

Quote from: Mookalafalas on March 05, 2023, 06:29:20 PMAs it is, I bought a second hand Ozawa, complete Phillips box over the weekend. For $40, it was an easy choice. I have a ton of his Boston era stuff I haven't played, so am planning an Ozawa binge in the not too distant future (when I finish the Munch box, perhaps).
Wow! How? I just checked Amazon US and the Ozawa complete Philips box is $300 there. Having heard Ozawa's work in the Boston Symphony DG box, I would be interested in a copy of the Philips one. His Boston work is really, really good and the orchestra is spectacular. They clearly had a very close and beneficial relationship that brought the best in each other. The Ozawa/Warner box is still available relatively cheaply and I know it has an incredible, bass-prominent Lutoslawski Concerto for Orchestra in Chicago.

Hans Holbein

I wonder if Universal will ever do a complete Hogwood box. How huge would it be? The Mozart and Haydn symphonies plus the Bach family recordings add up to 71 CDs, and that's barely scratching the surface.

Mookalafalas

Quote from: Brian on March 05, 2023, 06:48:01 PMWow! How? I just checked Amazon US and the Ozawa complete Philips box is $300 there. Having heard Ozawa's work in the Boston Symphony DG box, I would be interested in a copy of the Philips one. His Boston work is really, really good and the orchestra is spectacular. They clearly had a very close and beneficial relationship that brought the best in each other. The Ozawa/Warner box is still available relatively cheaply and I know it has an incredible, bass-prominent Lutoslawski Concerto for Orchestra in Chicago.

I'm glad to hear you are a fan. More insentive to dig in.  $300 for the 25 disk Philips box??!! That's nuts. Just someone hoping to get lucky, probably, rather than a real indication of the going price. The copy I got was from a Japanese seller (I live in Japan, so cheap shipping), but I found one in the states for a similar price.

It's all good...

Mookalafalas

#1273
Quote from: Mookalafalas on March 06, 2023, 02:24:50 PMI'm glad to hear you are a fan. More insentive to dig in.  $300 for the 25 disk Philips box??!! That's nuts. Just someone hoping to get lucky, probably, rather than a real indication of the going price. The copy I got was from a Japanese seller (I live in Japan, so cheap shipping), but I found one in the states for a similar price.



Whoops ::)  ::)  ::)  :-[  :-[  :-[  I just bought the Warner box, not the Philips.  BTW, I think you have most of the other box in your "Boston Symphony Box."  Huge overlap there, as I recall...
It's all good...

Brian

#1274
Forthcoming Big Boxes and their release dates (on Amazon.de; release dates in other countries may be a lot different. I didn't choose Amazon USA because it's not good at listing classical music future releases)



April 21



April 21



April 28



April 28



May 5



May 5



May 19



June 2



June 16

-

Unrelated: A thought I had yesterday after listening to William Steinberg's Planets. How much Steinberg would make up a big box from the complete Universal catalog? The Beethoven symphonies have recently been reissued, and the Boston Holst, Strauss, and Hindemith records are classics, but how much more Steinberg is there? Does he have a whole history of stuff that never got reissued? Or would it pretty much be those 8ish CDs?

ritter

Quote from: Brian on April 16, 2023, 01:20:39 PM...


...
That Robert Craft set now appears at 180€ (both in German Amazon and on JPC). Still expensive IMO for 44 CDs, but better than the prerelease price of above 300€ that I saw somewhere recently... :o

JBS

The Naxos website says that Rachmaninov set won't be available in the US.
Copyright reasons I'm assuming to be why.

Hollywood Beach Broadwalk

Mookalafalas

Quote from: Brian on April 16, 2023, 01:20:39 PMForthcoming Big Boxes and their release dates (on Amazon.de; release dates in other countries may be a lot different. I didn't choose Amazon USA because it's not good at listing classical music future releases)


  Those are irritatingly tasty looking. Irritating because I'm on "no big boxes diet." Still, I'll be monitoring them to see if their prices plunge into "super-duper bargain" territory.
It's all good...

Brian

Guesswork time! Let's see how much I can guess about the future release schedule of some Big Boxes that have not yet been produced.

My logic is that most of the Big Boxes tie into an anniversary of some kind. They don't need to - we'd buy 'em anyway - but they do, and it has been a consistent pattern across maybe two-thirds or three-quarters of all Big Boxes. So with that in mind, I looked at what anniversaries are coming up.

Performer Editions

2023
Istvan Kertesz (50th anniversary of his death; his 100th birthday is in 2029)
Pablo Casals (50th anniversary of his death; his 150th birthday is in 2026)
Michel Plasson (90th birthday)
Andras Schiff (70th birthday)

2024
Michael Tilson Thomas (80th birthday)
Leonard Slatkin (80th birthday)
Nelson Freire (80th birthday)

2025
Cho-Liang Lin (65th birthday)
Stephen Kovacevich (85th birthday)

2026
Truls Mork (65th birthday)
Krystian Zimerman (70th birthday)

2027
Colin Davis (100th birthday)
Zino Francescatti (125th birthday)

2028
Mitsuko Uchida (80th birthday)

2029
Thomas Beecham (150th birthday)
Christoph von Dohnanyi (100th birthday)
Arthur Fiedler (50th anniversary of his death)
Charles Mackerras (100th birthday)
Walter Weller (90th birthday)

Composer Editions

2024
Bruckner (200th birthday)
Faure (100th anniversary of his death)
Schoenberg (150th birthday)
Puccini (100th anniversary of his death)

2025
Shostakovich (50th anniversary of his death)

2026
Britten (50th anniversary of his death)

2027
Beethoven (200th anniversary of his death)

2028
Janacek (100th anniversary of his death)
Schubert (200th anniversary of his death)

Franco_Manitobain

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know what the biggest classical music box set is? How many discs? In circulation or OOP.