GMG Classical Music Forum

The Music Room => General Classical Music Discussion => Topic started by: Irons on November 22, 2018, 11:40:48 PM

Title: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 22, 2018, 11:40:48 PM
This may have been tried in the past and sunk without trace.

Is there any enthusiasm with forum members for a thread on not only the LP record but the music of the era they were produced? A platform to express all views, even if you cannot stand them (an understandable view).

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Archaic Torso of Apollo on November 23, 2018, 07:25:22 AM
Not quite sure I understand your question.

We've had some LP-related threads, as well as any number of threads about mid-20th century music, which would be the LP era. Are you proposing to combine them in some specific way?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 24, 2018, 01:02:34 AM
Quote from: Archaic Torso of Apollo on November 23, 2018, 07:25:22 AM
Not quite sure I understand your question.

We've had some LP-related threads, as well as any number of threads about mid-20th century music, which would be the LP era. Are you proposing to combine them in some specific way?

Not sure I understand it myself. :)

There is a train-spotting element to collecting vinyl, masses of minutia concerning  labels, sound engineers, recording locations and playback, which only a vinyl-head would find of interest and frankly would bore GMG members. That aside, no matter what, the music always comes first and that is why I mentioned it. Recently there was a fascinating thread on GMG "Pianists on LP" I am unable to recall the exact title. Every era, 78's, LP, CD and now Downloads, produces "stars" and artists from past generations fade from view. It has always been thus.

I did not think such a thread in all honesty was a goer. Thanks for your response.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 24, 2018, 01:23:10 AM
I am something of a vinyl collector in a small way but my knowledge of such things is quite limited. I do find them interesting though. There are a number of members here who have good knowledge and memory of the vinyl age. Therefore, may I suggest that you kick things off and see what type of response you get. I will contribute in whatever way that I can and the worst that can happen to me is that I might actually learn something.  Others might find suitable topics for discussion as they arise.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Andante on November 24, 2018, 07:29:55 PM
I still have some vinyl from the 50s some good jazz of that era Kenton, MJQ etc but I seldom play them as I have a small collection of remastered CDs which do get an airing now and again.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 24, 2018, 07:50:41 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 24, 2018, 01:02:34 AM
Not sure I understand it myself. :)

There is a train-spotting element to collecting vinyl, masses of minutia concerning  labels, sound engineers, recording locations and playback, which only a vinyl-head would find of interest and frankly would bore GMG members. That aside, no matter what, the music always comes first and that is why I mentioned it. Recently there was a fascinating thread on GMG "Pianists on LP" I am unable to recall the exact title. Every era, 78's, LP, CD and now Downloads, produces "stars" and artists from past generations fade from view. It has always been thus.

I did not think such a thread in all honesty was a goer. Thanks for your response.

I don't think awareness of recording minutia such as sound engineers, producers, locations, microphone configurations, etc, requires vinyl. I'm a big fan of some of the producers from the golden age of stereo and it is great to hear their work as they heard it when they listened to the playback of their master tapes.

I had a brief vinyl infatuation, but it faded fast. The only thing that tempts me back to vinyl are all of the monaural Mercury records that never made it to CD or SACD. But whenever I have found one on vinyl, it has sounded terrible.

Here's a great one that languished.

(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oznel1WBTyo/maxresdefault.jpg)

This is another that blew my mind when I found the very elaborate LP set from 1949. Then I found a CD transfer.

(https://img.discogs.com/gfSXTzPFF3NhQLeW9JJ1DSGEdJg=/fit-in/600x528/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7845786-1450032471-5869.jpeg.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 25, 2018, 12:17:59 AM
Quote from: aligreto on November 24, 2018, 01:23:10 AM
I am something of a vinyl collector in a small way but my knowledge of such things is quite limited. I do find them interesting though. There are a number of members here who have good knowledge and memory of the vinyl age. Therefore, may I suggest that you kick things off and see what type of response you get. I will contribute in whatever way that I can and the worst that can happen to me is that I might actually learn something.  Others might find suitable topics for discussion as they arise.

I will do as you advise. Thanks.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 25, 2018, 01:04:57 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 24, 2018, 07:50:41 PM


(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oznel1WBTyo/maxresdefault.jpg)

This is another that blew my mind when I found the very elaborate LP set from 1949. Then I found a CD transfer.

(https://img.discogs.com/gfSXTzPFF3NhQLeW9JJ1DSGEdJg=/fit-in/600x528/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7845786-1450032471-5869.jpeg.jpg)

Another aspect here that I quite often admire is the older cover art work which can be quite attractive. [There is also the opposite end of that scale as well, however.] A different marketing age then of course.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 25, 2018, 01:31:21 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 24, 2018, 07:50:41 PM
I don't think awareness of recording minutia such as sound engineers, producers, locations, microphone configurations, etc, requires vinyl. I'm a big fan of some of the producers from the golden age of stereo and it is great to hear their work as they heard it when they listened to the playback of their master tapes.

I had a brief vinyl infatuation, but it faded fast. The only thing that tempts me back to vinyl are all of the monaural Mercury records that never made it to CD or SACD. But whenever I have found one on vinyl, it has sounded terrible.

Here's a great one that languished.

(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oznel1WBTyo/maxresdefault.jpg)

This is another that blew my mind when I found the very elaborate LP set from 1949. Then I found a CD transfer.

(https://img.discogs.com/gfSXTzPFF3NhQLeW9JJ1DSGEdJg=/fit-in/600x528/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7845786-1450032471-5869.jpeg.jpg)

CD is a great resource of historical recordings.

Analogue and digital are different animals as are the LP record and CD. A CD is a replica, the first to the thousandth, and country of manufacture, they are the same. A first edition LP pressing is far more dynamic then pressings further down the line. In the case of Decca, a Dutch pressing has a different sound signature to the same recording from the UK. It is easy on hearing a piece to distinguish from a Philips or EMI recording. There are far more variables with LP.

You make a good point that you are just as able to appreciate the efforts of sound engineers, venues etc on CD. In the age of the CD this does not appear to me to be so important with digital recording and transfers. I may be wrong there.

The CD v LP debate bores me and I feel no missionary zeal to promote vinyl. I just enjoy listening to records.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 25, 2018, 02:23:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 25, 2018, 01:31:21 AM
CD is a great resource of historical recordings.

Analogue and digital are different animals as are the LP record and CD. A CD is a replica, the first to the thousandth, and country of manufacture, they are the same. A first edition LP pressing is far more dynamic then pressings further down the line. In the case of Decca, a Dutch pressing has a different sound signature to the same recording from the UK. It is easy on hearing a piece to distinguish from a Philips or EMI recording. There are far more variables with LP.

You make a good point that you are just as able to appreciate the efforts of sound engineers, venues etc on CD. In the age of the CD this does not appear to me to be so important with digital recording and transfers. I may be wrong there.

The CD v LP debate bores me and I feel no missionary zeal to promote vinyl. I just enjoy listening to records.

I also agree with this but I do also like handling and taking care of my vinyl. Weird, yes, but hey.... ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 25, 2018, 05:22:30 AM
Quote from: aligreto on November 25, 2018, 02:23:14 AM
I also agree with this but I do also like handling and taking care of my vinyl. Weird, yes, but hey.... ;D

Oh yes. Weirdness is a prerequisite as my moniker gives a hint. Not a good day yesterday. :(
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 26, 2018, 12:32:32 AM
I was given a heads up on Supraphon issues of chamber music many years ago and collected them ever since. The Czech label Supraphon ordered from the United States state of the art Fairchild recording equipment. They took delivery just as the "Iron Curtain" took effect which effectively stopped all trade with the West. This gave Supraphon a massive advantage over other recording companies in the Eastern Block.
With the advent of stereo Supraphon designated red labels for stereo and blue for mono. After a short period red labels were dropped and nearly all, stereo and mono, were blue labels. It is said that the early red label issues were recorded with the all valve (tube) Fairchild equipment and the later blue labels with in-house modern transistor based equipment. I take the premise that all red label issues are recorded with valve equipment with a pinch of salt. It makes for a good story but too neat and tidy and that is one thing recording companies never are.
I do not set out to collect the earlier and supposedly better sounding red labels. It is a fact though that the Supraphon on my shelves with the best sound does happen to have a red label.

  (https://i.imgur.com/XtfRnRL.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/pWY6knP.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 26, 2018, 12:54:39 AM
I have kept some of my most treasured vinyls (Boult's EMI Vaughan Williams symphonies box for example) and occasionally buy an LP which meant a lot to me (Karajan's DGG recording of Honegger's 'Liturgique' Symphony for example). However, I need a new turntable as my daughter purloined my old one.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 26, 2018, 01:41:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 26, 2018, 12:32:32 AM
I was given a heads up on Supraphon issues of chamber music many years ago and collected them ever since. The Czech label Supraphon ordered from the United States state of the art Fairchild recording equipment. They took delivery just as the "Iron Curtain" took effect which effectively stopped all trade with the West. This gave Supraphon a massive advantage over other recording companies in the Eastern Block.
With the advent of stereo Supraphon designated red labels for stereo and blue for mono. After a short period red labels were dropped and nearly all, stereo and mono, were blue labels. It is said that the early red label issues were recorded with the all valve (tube) Fairchild equipment and the later blue labels with in-house modern transistor based equipment. I take the premise that all red label issues are recorded with valve equipment with a pinch of salt. It makes for a good story but too neat and tidy and that is one thing recording companies never are.
I do not set out to collect the earlier and supposedly better sounding red labels. It is a fact though that the Supraphon on my shelves with the best sound does happen to have a red label.

  (https://i.imgur.com/XtfRnRL.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/pWY6knP.jpg)

There you go; you have just imparted your first piece of knowledge to me in this thread. I have many Supraphon LPs on my shelf, including the one above, and I did not know any of the information above. Success!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 26, 2018, 01:42:17 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 26, 2018, 12:54:39 AM
I have kept some of my most treasured vinyls (Boult's EMI Vaughan Williams symphonies box for example) and occasionally buy an LP which meant a lot to me (Karajan's DGG recording of Honegger's 'Liturgique' Symphony for example). However, I need a new turntable as my daughter purloined my old one.

Good for her  ;D
I hope that she uses it and listens regularly.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 26, 2018, 06:14:23 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 26, 2018, 12:54:39 AM
I have kept some of my most treasured vinyls (Boult's EMI Vaughan Williams symphonies box for example) and occasionally buy an LP which meant a lot to me (Karajan's DGG recording of Honegger's 'Liturgique' Symphony for example). However, I need a new turntable as my daughter purloined my old one.

Chatting to the chap at a second-hand LP/CD shop I visit, he said a surprising amount of customers purchase LPs and do not own a turntable.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 26, 2018, 06:15:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 26, 2018, 06:14:23 AM
Chatting to the chap at a second-hand LP/CD shop I visit, he said a surprising amount of customers purchase LPs and do not own a turntable.

Makes perfect sense to me. The cover is the best part! :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 26, 2018, 06:54:19 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 26, 2018, 06:15:22 AM
Makes perfect sense to me. The cover is the best part! :)

It is very much an important part. https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/5084782-classique
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 26, 2018, 07:23:35 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 26, 2018, 06:15:22 AM
Makes perfect sense to me. The cover is the best part! :)

:laugh:

Also, ageing eyes like mine do not require an electron microscope when reading LP cover and booklet notes as is the case with many CDs for me.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 26, 2018, 08:00:35 AM
Mercury has a special place in my heart. My father had the famous Mercury Living Presence recording of Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture by Dorati (the stereo one). The LP had a peculiar sound that in not quite duplicated in the CD release. Probably the characteristics of the LP cutter and related electronics. But of course the CD brings more detail, and was prepared by the original record producer.

For years I only knew what was written in the CD notes about the production technique, three omni directional microphones suspended over the orchestra, fed directly into a 3 channel tape deck. No modification of the recording rig or tinkering with the volume settings in the course of a performance. But in those days the dynamic range of the LP, and of the tape deck, was not sufficient to capture the dynamic range of an orchestra. Other labels, such as Decca, resorted to gain-riding. I recently came across an article by Richard Fine's son (I forget where) in which he describes more of the Mercury way. Apparently they worked with the conductor to create a performance that would conform the the limitations of the recording. If there was a quiet passage they would take care not to make it so quiet that it would be inaudible on the LP. They way they could get the recording on tape without engineering interference. You can say this is an interference with the conductor's art, but it seems more honest to me and I prefer it to the engineering solution of adjusting the recording volume to get the signal that they need.

So maybe I've come up with something for your thread after all, and no vinyl was harmed in the creation of this post. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 26, 2018, 01:05:37 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 22, 2018, 11:40:48 PM
This may have been tried in the past and sunk without trace.

Is there any enthusiasm with forum members for a thread on not only the LP record but the music of the era they were produced? A platform to express all views, even if you cannot stand them (an understandable view).

Great idea Irons!  And thank you very much for sharing your Supraphon knowledge and comments tool 

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 26, 2018, 01:07:21 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 26, 2018, 12:54:39 AM
I have kept some of my most treasured vinyls (Boult's EMI Vaughan Williams symphonies box for example) and occasionally buy an LP which meant a lot to me (Karajan's DGG recording of Honegger's 'Liturgique' Symphony for example). However, I need a new turntable as my daughter purloined my old one.

I'm guessing that you're (secretly?) proud of her?   ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 27, 2018, 01:07:42 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 26, 2018, 01:07:21 PM
I'm guessing that you're (secretly?) proud of her?   ;)

PD

Yes, I am although not necessarily for removing my turntable.
8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 27, 2018, 01:30:09 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 26, 2018, 08:00:35 AM
Mercury has a special place in my heart. My father had the famous Mercury Living Presence recording of Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture by Dorati (the stereo one). The LP had a peculiar sound that in not quite duplicated in the CD release. Probably the characteristics of the LP cutter and related electronics. But of course the CD brings more detail, and was prepared by the original record producer.

For years I only knew what was written in the CD notes about the production technique, three omni directional microphones suspended over the orchestra, fed directly into a 3 channel tape deck. No modification of the recording rig or tinkering with the volume settings in the course of a performance. But in those days the dynamic range of the LP, and of the tape deck, was not sufficient to capture the dynamic range of an orchestra. Other labels, such as Decca, resorted to gain-riding. I recently came across an article by Richard Fine's son (I forget where) in which he describes more of the Mercury way. Apparently they worked with the conductor to create a performance that would conform the the limitations of the recording. If there was a quiet passage they would take care not to make it so quiet that it would be inaudible on the LP. They way they could get the recording on tape without engineering interference. You can say this is an interference with the conductor's art, but it seems more honest to me and I prefer it to the engineering solution of adjusting the recording volume to get the signal that they need.

So maybe I've come up with something for your thread after all, and no vinyl was harmed in the creation of this post. :)

All your comments are gratefully received. Hopefully we vinyl-heads don't come over as a precious lot. Funnily enough it was Mercury that weaned me off CD and back to vinyl, but that is another story.

I read your post with interest and knowing that all Mercury LPs have recording details on back cover I pulled one at random. I quote -
The present recording was made on December 21st 1957 in the University of Minnesota's Northrop Memorial Auditorium. Mercury's classical staff and special recording truck were sent to Minneapolis for the sessions. The stage of three Omni-directional microphones of the highest sensitivity were suspended at the aural focal points of the hall, the points at which all orchestral choirs were perfectly balanced, instrumental timbres accurately reproduced, clarity of inner voices effectively projected, and maximum 'presence' obtained. After a level check was conducted, control of dynamics and nuance was strictly in the hands of the conductor; no monitoring or compression of any kind was done during the session or at any step in the processing from tape to disc ............ 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 27, 2018, 05:40:07 AM
I read recently where a music critic made the comment that modern chamber recordings are invariably made with excessive reverberation. This struck a chord as I often read that older recordings are dry and boxy. I agree that a dry acoustic for orchestral recordings is not a good thing but for chamber, I do not mind at all, in some cases I prefer it.

The label Lyrita started out with the owner, Richard Itter, making piano and duo recordings in his living room with a simple single mike mono setup. They are dry, similar as it would sound if the artists were actually performing in my listening room. The ear does adjust and it could be argued this is a more realistic sound picture in a "chamber" setting.

(https://img.discogs.com/vhLBHgAuq4d9f2-XumyeWHhzniM=/fit-in/487x485/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7890677-1451045801-4780.mpo.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 27, 2018, 06:28:05 AM
Here's a nice write-up of Mercury

https://www.stereophile.com/content/fine-art-mercury-living-presence-recordings
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 27, 2018, 07:55:49 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 27, 2018, 06:28:05 AM
Here's a nice write-up of Mercury

https://www.stereophile.com/content/fine-art-mercury-living-presence-recordings

I was not aware there was a son when Wilma Cozart-Fine passed away. I thought eventually the rich Mercury legacy would follow. It is pleasing to learn that Tom Fine will not allow that to happen. Thanks for link.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: david johnson on November 28, 2018, 12:20:51 AM
The lp brands I enjoyed back then (and now, occasionally) were London, Angel, DGG, some Mercury.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 28, 2018, 06:54:11 AM
Quote from: david johnson on November 28, 2018, 12:20:51 AM
The lp brands I enjoyed back then (and now, occasionally) were London, Angel, DGG, some Mercury.

I'm guessing you are based in the US. London/Decca; are they the same quality (both pressed at the Decca factory at New Malden) argument has been going on for decades. Pretty obvious to me they are. American collectors are very critical of Angel, the US arm of EMI. I have not listened to an Angel pressing so cannot comment. In the 1990's thanks to TAS there was a massive surge of interest in Mercury "Living Presence" and RCA "Living Stereo" I got caught up in this myself. Not only US, but UK too,  Reiner, Dorati and other conductors on their roster were superstars. After the death of Harry Pearson, interest waned. I still retain a great affection for both labels.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Archaic Torso of Apollo on November 28, 2018, 07:34:59 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 28, 2018, 06:54:11 AM
I'm guessing you are based in the US. London/Decca; are they the same quality (both pressed at the Decca factory at New Malden) argument has been going on for decades. Pretty obvious to me they are.

I agree with that - I was always happy with the London pressings.

QuoteAmerican collectors are very critical of Angel, the US arm of EMI. I have not listened to an Angel pressing so cannot comment.

I've had many of them. They were variable - could be anywhere from awful to superb. I think Philips probably had the most reliable pressings overall.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 28, 2018, 09:53:32 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 28, 2018, 06:54:11 AM
I'm guessing you are based in the US. London/Decca; are they the same quality (both pressed at the Decca factory at New Malden) argument has been going on for decades. Pretty obvious to me they are. American collectors are very critical of Angel, the US arm of EMI. I have not listened to an Angel pressing so cannot comment. In the 1990's thanks to TAS there was a massive surge of interest in Mercury "Living Presence" and RCA "Living Stereo" I got caught up in this myself. Not only US, but UK too,  Reiner, Dorati and other conductors on their roster were superstars. After the death of Harry Pearson, interest waned. I still retain a great affection for both labels.

You are not aware of the STS apocalypse. I don't know if it had the same name in the UK, but old Decca releases were sold in the US as "Stereo Treasury Series." They had covers on white background (a bit like Naxos art work) and they seemed to be the original Decca pressings, rebranded as bargain releases. They sounded fine, although they were probably a little dull because the pressing masters were so old. But around 1978 "London" started manufacturing them in the US, and the US pressings were horrible.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 29, 2018, 12:06:01 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 28, 2018, 09:53:32 AM
You are not aware of the STS apocalypse. I don't know if it had the same name in the UK, but old Decca releases were sold in the US as "Stereo Treasury Series." They had covers on white background (a bit like Naxos art work) and they seemed to be the original Decca pressings, rebranded as bargain releases. They sounded fine, although they were probably a little dull because the pressing masters were so old. But around 1978 "London" started manufacturing them in the US, and the US pressings were horrible.

Thanks. I didn't know that. As I mentioned earlier any history of a record company is a tangled mess that defies logic. What I know of the US market is sketchy at best. By your description STS could be the US version of "Ace of Diamonds"  I would not describe them as dull though. In some cases the "Ace of Diamonds" reissues are better sonically then the SXL originals. One thing I have heard loud and clear across the Atlantic is that gold label Decca pressings are horrible. American Decca had no connection (historically they did) with the UK company and due to naming rights Decca were called "London" in the US.  1978 sounds about the time that the Decca factory in New Malden on the outskirts of London closed down. Production for the UK was switched to Holland.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 29, 2018, 08:38:38 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 29, 2018, 12:06:01 AM
Thanks. I didn't know that. As I mentioned earlier any history of a record company is a tangled mess that defies logic. What I know of the US market is sketchy at best. By your description STS could be the US version of "Ace of Diamonds"  I would not describe them as dull though. In some cases the "Ace of Diamonds" reissues are better sonically then the SXL originals. One thing I have heard loud and clear across the Atlantic is that gold label Decca pressings are horrible. American Decca had no connection (historically they did) with the UK company and due to naming rights Decca were called "London" in the US.  1978 sounds about the time that the Decca factory in New Malden on the outskirts of London closed down. Production for the UK was switched to Holland.

Quite so, and they are called Decca here now that whoever owns American Decca was bought by whoever owns British Decca.

Typical cover art:

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91f6ZmFzK2L._SX466_.jpg)

A lot of Ansermet in that series.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Daverz on November 29, 2018, 12:33:54 PM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on November 28, 2018, 09:53:32 AM
You are not aware of the STS apocalypse. I don't know if it had the same name in the UK, but old Decca releases were sold in the US as "Stereo Treasury Series." They had covers on white background (a bit like Naxos art work) and they seemed to be the original Decca pressings, rebranded as bargain releases. They sounded fine, although they were probably a little dull because the pressing masters were so old. But around 1978 "London" started manufacturing them in the US, and the US pressings were horrible.

They had yellow labels and were thinner, so are easy to avoid.

The orange label London STS are usually a bargain because they sell for less than Decca pressings on the used market.

Glad to not have to worry about that sort of thing anymore.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 29, 2018, 12:46:44 PM
Cross post from the Listening Thread in relation to Angel versions:


Sibelius: Symphony No. 2 [von Karajan]


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/fO0AAOSwg55Zc24k/s-l1600.jpg)


This is by far my favourite version of this work. It is a strong, sweeping reading that is full of strength, drama, drive and huge intensity; compelling listening.



I have two versions of this vinyl LP, the HMV issue above and the Angel Records below. To my ear the Angel Records version has a greater presence in terms of presentation.


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/8NcAAOSwyWZZPCZi/s-l1600.jpg)


I like that portrait of the maestro.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 29, 2018, 11:50:32 PM
Quote from: Daverz on November 29, 2018, 12:33:54 PM


Glad to not have to worry about that sort of thing anymore.

:D If I didn't worry about that I would soon find something else to worry about.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on November 30, 2018, 11:39:43 AM
I am one of the resident LP enthusiasts, and the author of the pianists on vinyl thread you reference. Briefly, I started collecting them in 1990 when everyone was getting rid of them. In the late 80s, I actually jumped on the CD bandwagon like everyone else. However, one day upon playing an old LP we had in the house, I found I preferred the sound of LPs in many ways--to say nothing of the tactile pleasures of the disk itself and the covers, liner notes, etc.

Back then I was an undergrad and worked on Saturdays at a book/record store, not so much for the money, but to get my hands on the vinyl everyone was bringing in and selling. However, in nearly 30 years of collecting, my collection remains relatively small and manageable at about 1200 LPs (and about as many CDs). This is largely because I have been picky about condition, and to a lesser extent, some of the minutiae you reference (I avoid pressings from certain labels in certain time intervals)

Obviously, there are many great performances from the LP era (roughly 1950 - 1990), but the sound quality is another issue for me. The debate about CD vs LP quality has been hashed over endlessly, and to the extent people disagree with me, I say GREAT--more for me!  :laugh: Clearly, there are advantages with CDs over LPs, and advancing technology (to a certain extent independent of format itself) has yielded important advances over the years--stereo, increased dynamic range, increased frequency response, etc., etc. AND YET, to my ears, there is something special about vinyl--an immediacy, a warmth (call it distortion if you want, don't really even care), and other qualities that are hard to describe. One such quality is the presentation of the acoustic envelope around the instruments--so many CDs to my ears are quite dry and sound as if the the musicians were recorded separately and overdubbed--harmonically dead!

I have extraordinarily sensitive hearing (my ENT, who has practiced for decades was floored by it when he tested me), and I have also invested a fair amount of money over the years in playback equipment--turntable, tonearm, etc. And yet, I don't really consider myself a "golden ears" audiophile. I care about the music first and foremost, and don't have unlimited funds or patience to endlessly futz around with equipment.

I have become interested in certain labels over the years, partly because of their sonic attributes. I am fascinated with the Westminster label, especially from the 1950s. Also Period, Columbia, etc from that same era. Despite all of our advances in recording/playback since then, the sound from this era is very compelling to me and other collectors I know. These were especially compelling for small ensemble, chamber, piano, voice, but not so much for organ or orchestral, for which I do often prefer more modern recordings, or even CD. As a pipe organ enthusiast, I do think this is one case in which I prefer CD, generally.

Vinyl has been coming back in a big way over the last decade or so, and it cannot be entirely due to teh much-maligned hipsters. Vinyl enthsiasts are a very diverse bunch, from classical and jazz lovers like me, to 19 year-old kids who like indie rock and don't even own a turntable (some buy the disk and download the MP3). It will never be what it once was in terms of volume, but it is certainly interesting to visit a brick and mortar record store these days. It is as if time is running in reverse ad the LPs are eating up more and more space once allocated to CDs.

Nevertheless, as a busy person, I often don't want to mess with the LPs themselves, which is why I digitize them on a regular basis (about one a week) and listen mostly on my computer or headphones, or larger system. THe special LP qualities still seem to come through on digital (although I use a higher sampling than 44.1, etc)

As for collecting, I have too much music to listen to if anything, especially on CD, where I have many large sets with many disks I have not even heard yet. I enjoy augmenting my LP collection by picking up a disk or two here and there from eBay or a brick and mortar store. But, it is a luxury, not a necessity. I like to compare it to my watch fascination--sure I could buy a $20 Timex quartz that would keep better time than my mechanical pieces, but it is just not the same!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 01, 2018, 01:49:49 AM
Thank you! A most interesting post and eloquently written.

My road to Damascus is very similar to your own. I embraced CD with a passion and sold my LP collection for a pittance. After a whole string of CD players I arrived at a state of the art Meridian player. The quest for "perfect sound for ever" did not stop there, connected to the Meridian was an all valve (tube) DAC made by Audio Note, which was not one of my best purchases; I phoned the wife from work to switch it on so as the valves were fully warmed up! The sound of CD is much improved, a big improvement from what it was. Back then, I was forever buying more and more of the silver discs seeking musical satisfaction which was proving to be elusive.
I was an avid reader of the US hi-fi magazine TAS. Harry Pearson the owner, promoted Mercury and RCA with an infectious enthusiasm. Each recording was poured over by the minutest detail. In the early 90's Wilma Cozart began to remaster the Mercury catalogue to CD. I loved them, buying every CD on release. Mercury, Everest and RCA were my musical nirvana back then. I started to think if I like analogue recordings from the 1950's so much more then digital recordings then it may be a sensible idea to listen to them on the equipment they were intended for. It took a few more years before I actually took the plunge - or more accurately a back somersault - when vinyl re-entered my life.
No argument, LP and what it is played on is a faff. But I enjoy the hobby side of it.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 01, 2018, 02:09:37 AM
Two well written posts, guys, with many sentiments echoing my own experiences; selling off the vinyl collection and equipment, investing in the new technology and ultimately reverting back many years later. I also still inhabit both media worlds and I only know of one friend who operates exclusively in vinyl. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 01, 2018, 06:57:39 AM
Quote from: aligreto on December 01, 2018, 02:09:37 AM
Two well written posts, guys, with many sentiments echoing my own experiences; selling off the vinyl collection and equipment, investing in the new technology and ultimately reverting back many years later. I also still inhabit both media worlds and I only know of one friend who operates exclusively in vinyl.

I didn't own a CD player until quite recently. The reason I got one is I felt I was missing out on music and artists of the last thirty odd years. As I said I have no wish to score points on either as to which is best. Two things struck me though, music itself, or rather the way it is played, has changed. The HIP movement has had a noticeable positive affect in the intervening years. CD sound has improved, the one thing that bothers me with the medium is ironically, background noise! The music emerges from a blackness, my wife has noticed the same thing. Excessive surface noise from vinyl is usually a sign of a poorly setup or matched system. Get that right, and train your brain to ignore the odd pop and click, and then a LP record produces a natural organic sound.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 01, 2018, 09:42:41 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 01, 2018, 06:57:39 AM
I didn't own a CD player until quite recently. The reason I got one is I felt I was missing out on music and artists of the last thirty odd years. As I said I have no wish to score points on either as to which is best. Two things struck me though, music itself, or rather the way it is played, has changed. The HIP movement has had a noticeable positive affect in the intervening years. CD sound has improved, the one thing that bothers me with the medium is ironically, background noise! The music emerges from a blackness, my wife has noticed the same thing. Excessive surface noise from vinyl is usually a sign of a poorly setup or matched system. Get that right, and train your brain to ignore the odd pop and click, and then a LP record produces a natural organic sound.

Two very valid points highlighted above with which I heartily agree. The friend that I referred to above has minimal interest in Classical Music so for him it is not an issue. I would not want to be without my CD collection either.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 02, 2018, 03:12:23 AM
I don't think I have heard a Philips recording with better sound. Fascinating to hear Bach (both) filtered through Mozart.

(https://img.discogs.com/ibPu6uTsfmeNVlVio0cNY6rxYKg=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7795301-1448922863-4724.gif.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 02, 2018, 06:48:04 AM
Cross post from the Listening Thread:


QuoteHandel: Messiah [Beecham]


(https://img.discogs.com/ZRd-OUVQmYqNzNh9SEzXl-COaOs=/fit-in/600x744/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-12052537-1527344884-8535.jpeg.jpg)   (https://img.discogs.com/i4-lSy7JPWmUvEiPt2a89rZLhko=/fit-in/600x638/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-12052537-1527346200-3365.jpeg.jpg)


This is an interesting historical performance. There is no booklet with the set unfortunately so I do not know the year of the performance. It is an enjoyable performance, one of its time, but obviously quite different in presentation from today's period performances. We are also treated to an interesting introduction [spoken by Beecham himself] which discusses the balance required between choral and orchestral forces in this work which is interesting in itself for that time.


This is among the oldest vinyl that I have in my collection. The set of 4 LPs are housed in 4 sturdy cardboard pages that are hinged to a metal bar inside giving a book effect; a legacy of the old 78 presentations.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 02, 2018, 11:32:52 PM
Quote from: aligreto on December 02, 2018, 06:48:04 AM
Cross post from the Listening Thread:



This is among the oldest vinyl that I have in my collection. The set of 4 LPs are housed in 4 sturdy cardboard pages that are hinged to a metal bar inside giving a book effect; a legacy of the old 78 presentations.

My first reaction was they were a set of 78's but then read the small print. Must be very early. Going by the date helpfully given, could it be possible it was simultaneous release on 78 and 33 1/3 ? Which would explain the unusual packaging.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on December 02, 2018, 11:42:23 PM
One of the greatest recordings ever made in any era, in any medium, is Janos Starker's early 50s recording of the Kodaly sonata for unaccompanied Cello Op. 8, originally recorded on the Period label. It was reissued a number of times on this label, but I have the first one--which was an extremely lucky find. The sound quality is astounding; I have seen people's jaws drop upon hearing this played on my system. The ability of certain early 50s recording engineers to capture the gestalt and timbral accuracy, and immediacy of certain instruments was really phenomenal. (Compare to the sounds you hear in a modern movie theater, which to my ears are horrifically distorted and ugly)

The idea about music coming out of blackness is an interesting one; the medium of vinyl itself has a certain sonic texture of its own, as does canvas as a medium for painting, celluloid for movies, and even stone or wood for three dimensional objects. New vinyl pressings can be extremely quiet, but I actually find the little bit of noise to be a natural and comforting background. In Photoshop, there is actually a feature to add grain to an image, as some people like the texture imparted by the film itself; and indeed in digital image editing, noise reduction and sharpness are always at odds. I am also very drawn to the sound of the rain, which is very much like some vinyl sounds. When I was a kid I used to like to turn the TV to snow and listen.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 02, 2018, 11:52:52 PM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on December 02, 2018, 11:42:23 PM
One of the greatest recordings ever made in any era, in any medium, is Janos Starker's early 50s recording of the Kodaly sonata for unaccompanied Cello Op. 8, originally recorded on the Period label. It was reissued a number of times on this label, but I have the first one--which was an extremely lucky find. The sound quality is astounding; I have seen people's jaws drop upon hearing this played on my system. The ability of certain early 50s recording engineers to capture the gestalt and timbral accuracy, and immediacy of certain instruments was really phenomenal. (Compare to the sounds you hear in a modern movie theater, which to my ears are horrifically distorted and ugly)

The idea about music coming out of blackness is an interesting one; the medium of vinyl itself has a certain sonic texture of its own, as does canvas as a medium for painting, celluloid for movies, and even stone or wood for three dimensional objects. New vinyl pressings can be extremely quiet, but I actually find the little bit of noise to be a natural and comforting background. In Photoshop, there is actually a feature to add grain to an image, as some people like the texture imparted by the film itself; and indeed in digital image editing, noise reduction and sharpness are always at odds. I am also very drawn to the sound of the rain, which is very much like some vinyl sounds. When I was a kid I used to like to turn the TV to snow and listen.

I think one of the reissues was on Saga who also reissued Starker's two LP's he made for Period of the Bach solo cello suites.

I am pleased you at least made some sense of my "blackness" comment. Perhaps "deadness" is more accurate.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on December 03, 2018, 12:10:53 AM
You may find this book of interest. I am interested too, but I have so many other things to read, I doubt I will get to it. Also, I am not completely sold on all the arguments; I am a professional photo/electron micrographer and amateur landscape photographer, and I very much doubt I will ever go back to film.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61fE-QEXQdL._SX332_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg)

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Revenge-Analog-Real-Things-Matter/dp/1610398211/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1543828081&sr=8-1&keywords=revenge+of+analog
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 03, 2018, 12:19:35 AM
Milos Sadlo is not the most of famous cellists. It was a hard slog for him to achieve what he did. An artist living under the Soviet yoke was not easy unless you were fortunate enough to be an appointed one. As a young cellist he had a big break, his label Supraphon chose him to be soloist in the greatest of all Czech works for cello, Dvorak's concerto. Vaclav Talich was to conduct the Czech Phil. After many hours of rehearsal they were ready to record. At the same time another young, but more famous cellist, happened to be in Prague. Perhaps ordered by Moscow, Supraphon kicked Sadlo out and made a famous recording with Rostropovich. Later, Sadlo did make a recording of Dvorak but Talich was long gone.

Listening to Sadlo playing Bach this story comes to mind. There is a humility in his playing, he is not playing for himself, or even  the listener but for Bach. I looked to see if this set enjoyed a release on CD, I cannot find anything. Can't say I'm surprised.

(http://classicrecords.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/1111701.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 03, 2018, 12:25:04 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on December 03, 2018, 12:10:53 AM
You may find this book of interest. I am interested too, but I have so many other things to read, I doubt I will get to it. Also, I am not completely sold on all the arguments; I am a professional photo/electron micrographer and amateur landscape photographer, and I very much doubt I will ever go back to film.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61fE-QEXQdL._SX332_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg)

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Revenge-Analog-Real-Things-Matter/dp/1610398211/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1543828081&sr=8-1&keywords=revenge+of+analog

Thanks. I listened to an interview on the radio recently with David Bailey and he said he would never use a digital camera.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 03, 2018, 01:03:47 PM
Quote from: Irons on December 02, 2018, 03:12:23 AM
I don't think I have heard a Philips recording with better sound. Fascinating to hear Bach (both) filtered through Mozart.

(https://img.discogs.com/ibPu6uTsfmeNVlVio0cNY6rxYKg=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7795301-1448922863-4724.gif.jpg)

Nostalgia rush!

I had that LP, and I have the CD, which was mastered a bit over-bright and doesn't have quite the silkiness of the LP (as I remember it, anyway). In the end, I don't think the performance is the best available. The same forces were more at home in the Mozart recordings, I think (trio, Quintets with friends).

Here's one I wish I had back (well, no turntable).

(https://img.discogs.com/7aWiN3DooWU0NiLNe6Jlx12OHQ0=/fit-in/600x603/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-9466366-1482942381-6778.png.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 04, 2018, 12:01:46 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 03, 2018, 01:03:47 PM
Nostalgia rush!


Here's one I wish I had back (well, no turntable).

(https://img.discogs.com/7aWiN3DooWU0NiLNe6Jlx12OHQ0=/fit-in/600x603/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-9466366-1482942381-6778.png.jpg)

I have the box set which sold like hot cakes! No.4 and No.5 seem to be the most popular, I like No.1 very much. Could be argued Mozart's greatest chamber works.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 04, 2018, 12:33:04 AM
Here's a record which I am sure is better on LP than CD.

(https://img.discogs.com/0doewYXMhm_1Tm8Z64TatQj1L-M=/fit-in/600x608/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-6134247-1432159966-5424.jpeg.jpg)

I won't comment on why.  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 04, 2018, 04:00:38 AM
Very nice, and the music is not bad either!

One big advantage of LP over CD is cover art. Nothing could possibly compare with this one!

(https://i.imgur.com/U6s715P.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 04, 2018, 07:35:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 02, 2018, 11:32:52 PM

(https://img.discogs.com/ZRd-OUVQmYqNzNh9SEzXl-COaOs=/fit-in/600x744/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-12052537-1527344884-8535.jpeg.jpg)   (https://img.discogs.com/i4-lSy7JPWmUvEiPt2a89rZLhko=/fit-in/600x638/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-12052537-1527346200-3365.jpeg.jpg)


My first reaction was they were a set of 78's but then read the small print. Must be very early. Going by the date helpfully given, could it be possible it was simultaneous release on 78 and 33 1/3 ? Which would explain the unusual packaging.

Good point; I did not think of that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 04, 2018, 08:32:57 AM
Quote from: aligreto on December 04, 2018, 07:35:16 AM
Good point; I did not think of that.

It's been released on CD.

https://www.amazon.com/Handel-Messiah-Elsie-Suddaby/dp/B00000FDCF/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1543944291&sr=8-5&keywords=handel+beecham+messiah+royal+philharmonic

One of the comments describes it as a 1947 recording. That would put it before the first LP was marketed, in 1949 and the transfer is described as done from 78 rpm discs.

By that time analog tape recorders existed, but it may be that the original recordings were cut into discs rather than put on tape. Although the LP became commercial in 1949 vinyl discs running at 33 1/3 were in common use for radio transcription and other professional sound production purposes as early as the 1930s.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 04, 2018, 08:48:45 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 04, 2018, 08:32:57 AM
It's been released on CD.

https://www.amazon.com/Handel-Messiah-Elsie-Suddaby/dp/B00000FDCF/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1543944291&sr=8-5&keywords=handel+beecham+messiah+royal+philharmonic

One of the comments describes it as a 1947 recording. That would put it before the first LP was marketed, in 1949 and the transfer is described as done from 78 rpm discs.

By that time analog tape recorders existed, but it may be that the original recordings were cut into discs rather than put on tape. Although the LP became commercial in 1949 vinyl discs running at 33 1/3 were in common use for radio transcription and other professional sound production purposes as early as the 1930s.

Thank you very much for the additional information which is very interesting. Perhaps it explains why it is a 4 X LP set which I did not previously mention.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 04, 2018, 09:00:21 AM
Quote from: aligreto on December 04, 2018, 08:48:45 AM
Thank you very much for the additional information which is very interesting. Perhaps it explains why it is a 4 X LP set which I did not previously mention.

I remember reading somewhere that since they did not have sound "editing" in those days and disc cutting could not be interrupted they would master an 20 minutes LP from 3 minute shellac discs by having an array phonographs cued up.  When as each shellac disc ended they would switch over to the next disc.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 04, 2018, 10:10:01 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 04, 2018, 09:00:21 AM
I remember reading somewhere that since they did not have sound "editing" in those days and disc cutting could not be interrupted they would master an 20 minutes LP from 3 minute shellac discs by having an array phonographs cued up.  When as each shellac disc ended they would switch over to the next disc.

Thank you once again for the interesting information. It was, obviously, a different world back then but they still managed to achieve wonderful things.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Archaic Torso of Apollo on December 04, 2018, 01:53:39 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 22, 2018, 11:40:48 PM
This may have been tried in the past and sunk without trace.

Is there any enthusiasm with forum members for a thread on not only the LP record but the music of the era they were produced? A platform to express all views, even if you cannot stand them (an understandable view).

You might be interested in this thread I started years ago - it's about LPs that were never reissued, or are hard to find:

http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,22613.msg765709.html#msg765709
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 05, 2018, 12:36:57 AM
Quote from: Archaic Torso of Apollo on December 04, 2018, 01:53:39 PM
You might be interested in this thread I started years ago - it's about LPs that were never reissued, or are hard to find:

http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,22613.msg765709.html#msg765709

What goes around, comes around! The sadly defunct magazine "Classical Record Collector" made up a list of recordings of note that never made it to CD. If I can find that issue (out of 81 and no index) I will post. Reading through the thread; I have the Barber/Schuman recording and agree it being very good. I'm alerted to the Dezso Ranki Haydn piano sonatas sets. Will definitely look for those. It is common knowledge that the Decca engineers were not overly impressed with the RCA Dynagroove process. Although RCA recordings pressed by Decca for the UK sport the Dynagroove logo the pressings are not.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 07, 2018, 12:48:11 AM
Recorded at Abbey Road studios 25-27 March 1956. Producer: Walter Legge.

(https://i.imgur.com/MEhW5MO.jpg)

Beethoven's Grosse Fuge and Klemperer conducting the Philharmonia strings are made for each other. A monumental performance of a monumental work.
On paper the couplings are odd, but actually Walter Legge was shrewd. Considering the Grosse Fuge in the original form for string quartet was unintelligible to audiences at its first performances and Mozart wrote Adagio and Fugue K. 546 forty years before Beethoven's work, then Mozart's Adagio and Fugue is not far off being as revolutionary. Eine Kleine Nachtmusik it is not.
To have these works similar in scope and form following each other would be too much. Sandwiched between them is a very fine Serenta Notturna which is a complete contrast. The Philharmonia of the 1950's is my favourite orchestra and enjoying especially the contribution in SN of Manoug Parikian (1st violin) David Wise (2nd violin) Herbert Downes (viola) and James Merrett (double bass).
The image on the front cover is of Otto Klemperer's hands resting on the score of Grosse Fuge.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 09, 2018, 12:34:16 AM
Seeing aligreto's post of the Brahms Double Concerto on "What are you listening to now" thread I was reminded of a long held belief that with CD you are able to pick and choose the way a collection of music takes shape. Vinyl isn't like that, in a way it chooses you, not you choose it. The Double Concerto is a fine work but an overload to have on the shelves -

Bruno Walter with Francescatti/Fournier.
George Szell with Oistrakh/Rostropovich.
Paul Kletzki with Ferras/Tortelier  (two copies, EMI and WRC).
Ferenc Fricsay with Schneiderhan/Starker.
Bernard Haitink with Szeryng/Starker.
Karel Ancerl with Suk/Navarra.

The closest work to the Brahms, Beethoven's Triple Concerto, I do not own a single copy!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 09, 2018, 02:35:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 09, 2018, 12:34:16 AM
Seeing aligreto's post of the Brahms Double Concerto on "What are you listening to now" thread I was reminded of a long held belief that with CD you are able to pick and choose the way a collection of music takes shape. Vinyl isn't like that, in a way it chooses you, not you choose it. The Double Concerto is a fine work but an overload to have on the shelves -

Bruno Walter with Francescatti/Fournier.
George Szell with Oistrakh/Rostropovich.
Paul Kletzki with Ferras/Tortelier  (two copies, EMI and WRC).
Ferenc Fricsay with Schneiderhan/Starker.
Bernard Haitink with Szeryng/Starker.
Karel Ancerl with Suk/Navarra.

The closest work to the Brahms, Beethoven's Triple Concerto, I do not own a single copy!

I think that there is a large element of truth in that. Even to this day, and after all of my collecting, I am still very likely to get a WOW factor if I spot an LP that excites me. I would not have the same reaction with a CD even though I would buy it. Funny that. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 09, 2018, 07:06:27 AM
I love it! Flipping through a stack of records and coming across something interesting. Terry O'Sullivan of Loricraft Audio said to me once "I can't stop buying them"! Sadly nor can I.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 12, 2018, 07:29:36 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/ifzfFZE.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/u6JutC2.jpg)

Big boxes featuring a single instrumentalist or conductor became popular with CD. Not so common on LP which is a pity. There were a few which mostly featured pianists, people like Richter and Kempff amongst others. I have always admired Clara Haskil and Philips have done her proud with this set of nine LPs. Setting out on a Haskil odyssey I started with disc1, one of the greatest piano sonatas, Schubert D.960. When an artist such as Haskil plays such an important work, for a layman to even attempt to analyse is ridiculous. Just sit back and enjoy which is what I did. She is well known for her Mozart, I am looking forward to Schumann and Scarlatti played by Clara Haskil.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 12, 2018, 08:00:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 12, 2018, 07:29:36 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/ifzfFZE.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/u6JutC2.jpg)

Big boxes featuring a single instrumentalist or conductor became popular with CD. Not so common on LP which is a pity. There were a few which mostly featured pianists, people like Richter and Kempff amongst others. I have always admired Clara Haskil and Philips have done her proud with this set of nine LPs. Setting out on a Haskil odyssey I started with disc1, one of the greatest piano sonatas, Schubert D.960. When an artist such as Haskil plays such an important work, for a layman to even attempt to analyse is ridiculous. Just sit back and enjoy which is what I did. She is well known for her Mozart, I am looking forward to Schumann and Scarlatti played by Clara Haskil.

That looks like a very nice set indeed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 12, 2018, 08:11:10 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 12, 2018, 07:29:36 AMBig boxes featuring a single instrumentalist or conductor became popular with CD. Not so common on LP which is a pity.

The reason seems obvious to me. CDs are cheap, LPs were expensive. I don't mind buying a CD set for which I am only interested in half the content. No one in those days wanted to pay for a duplicate LP or an LP that they were not interested listening to.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 12, 2018, 11:30:44 PM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 12, 2018, 08:11:10 AM
The reason seems obvious to me. CDs are cheap, LPs were expensive. I don't mind buying a CD set for which I am only interested in half the content. No one in those days wanted to pay for a duplicate LP or an LP that they were not interested listening to.

Good point.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 22, 2018, 04:55:19 AM
I must confess that one aspect of the vinyl world that I have never liked is the Auto-Coupling back in the days of record changers and the sequence of play necessitated by that. I just want to moan about this as I have recently listened to three older LP box sets presented in this way.


(https://assets.catawiki.nl/assets/2016/8/10/7/2/f/72f6189e-5f07-11e6-833a-9b3fcf600810.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 24, 2018, 06:40:19 AM
Quote from: aligreto on December 22, 2018, 04:55:19 AM
I must confess that one aspect of the vinyl world that I have never liked is the Auto-Coupling back in the days of record changers and the sequence of play necessitated by that. I just want to moan about this as I have recently listened to three older LP box sets presented in this way.


(https://assets.catawiki.nl/assets/2016/8/10/7/2/f/72f6189e-5f07-11e6-833a-9b3fcf600810.jpg)

A pain. Perhaps not quite as bad, but for me off-putting is box sets with a single work on two separate LPs. For example first two movements on second side and movements three and four on the first side of the following LP of the set.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 24, 2018, 07:01:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 24, 2018, 06:40:19 AM
A pain. Perhaps not quite as bad, but for me off-putting is box sets with a single work on two separate LPs. For example first two movements on second side and movements three and four on the first side of the following LP of the set.

That one is not such a bad one for me.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 24, 2018, 07:09:15 AM
Quote from: aligreto on December 24, 2018, 07:01:43 AM
That one is not such a bad one for me.
And you are right. What is the difference of turning a disc over or reaching for a second one? But I passed on a box set only last week for this very reason.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: JBS on December 24, 2018, 07:15:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 24, 2018, 07:09:15 AM
And you are right. What is the difference of turning a disc over or reaching for a second one? But I passed on a box set only last week for this very reason.

Some automatic record changers might have been able to flip over the LP, but most did not.  Hence the sequencing over separate LPs.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 24, 2018, 07:47:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 24, 2018, 07:09:15 AM
And you are right. What is the difference of turning a disc over or reaching for a second one? But I passed on a box set only last week for this very reason.

That is a shame but that is what it is.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 27, 2018, 03:23:43 AM
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Km6972pS_48/WqFjoyU2hbI/AAAAAAAAAco/UNgo4Cqz8b0Xa5sDzwx3rCb_6N9wLePJwCHMYCw/HMV-CLP-1765-sleeve-front_thumb1?imgmax=800)

Pougnet, Riddle and Pini made some excellent string trio recordings for Westminster in Vienna during the early 1950's. EMI waited over ten years to release them under licence in the UK, and then only for a short period. They are well worth looking out for and when they turn up I do not hesitate. A Mozart Divertimento K. 563 is outstanding. Jean Pougnet, who's father was a conductor, was a top violinist of his time and also appeared as a soloist. His RVW "The Lark Ascending" is my favourite recording. There is a lot of competition for the Mozart K. 563 but less for the early Beethoven trios and it is these recordings I treasure the most.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 29, 2018, 04:14:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 27, 2018, 03:23:43 AM
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Km6972pS_48/WqFjoyU2hbI/AAAAAAAAAco/UNgo4Cqz8b0Xa5sDzwx3rCb_6N9wLePJwCHMYCw/HMV-CLP-1765-sleeve-front_thumb1?imgmax=800)

Pougnet, Riddle and Pini made some excellent string trio recordings for Westminster in Vienna during the early 1950's. EMI waited over ten years to release them under licence in the UK, and then only for a short period. They are well worth looking out for and when they turn up I do not hesitate. A Mozart Divertimento K. 563 is outstanding. Jean Pougnet, who's father was a conductor, was a top violinist of his time and also appeared as a soloist. His RVW "The Lark Ascending" is my favourite recording. There is a lot of competition for the Mozart K. 563 but less for the early Beethoven trios and it is these recordings I treasure the most.

Noted and thank you.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 02, 2019, 04:54:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 29, 2018, 12:06:01 AM
Thanks. I didn't know that. As I mentioned earlier any history of a record company is a tangled mess that defies logic. What I know of the US market is sketchy at best. By your description STS could be the US version of "Ace of Diamonds"  I would not describe them as dull though. In some cases the "Ace of Diamonds" reissues are better sonically then the SXL originals. One thing I have heard loud and clear across the Atlantic is that gold label Decca pressings are horrible. American Decca had no connection (historically they did) with the UK company and due to naming rights Decca were called "London" in the US.  1978 sounds about the time that the Decca factory in New Malden on the outskirts of London closed down. Production for the UK was switched to Holland.

I made the mistake about 10(?) years ago buying a label Decca record (one with Casals) with a pretty pink and gold cover.  Well, it didn't do it any favors that it needed cleaning and was before I had purchased an RCM, but even after that, it was so horribly noisy!  I later read on another forum about the gold label's reputation and avoid them.  When looking around at used records, I am quite happy when I see the London ones--but pressed in the UK.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 02, 2019, 05:14:56 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on December 12, 2018, 08:11:10 AM
The reason seems obvious to me. CDs are cheap, LPs were expensive. I don't mind buying a CD set for which I am only interested in half the content. No one in those days wanted to pay for a duplicate LP or an LP that they were not interested listening to.

I remember a friend (who is a bit older) telling me that when she started buying LPs that it cost her a week's salary to purchase one of Wagner's operas.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on January 02, 2019, 06:19:29 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 02, 2019, 05:14:56 AM
I remember a friend (who is a bit older) telling me that when she started buying LPs that it cost her a week's salary to purchase one of Wagner's operas.

PD

When I started buying LPs in 1968/69 a full-price disc cost £2-3s-9d, a bargain price Music for Pleasure disc cost 10/9d. In the summer of 1969 I earned £9-12-0 per week working as a storeman. At the time the exchange rate was $2.40 to the pound. No idea what these prices translate into nowadays.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 06, 2019, 03:14:58 AM
(https://img.discogs.com/ji334PltJcIYvhmrNo4HhykNamM=/fit-in/600x605/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-5484123-1394554453-4101.jpeg.jpg) (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61x%2BKaIBFoL._SY355_.jpg)

Aligreto featured a post of a LP from the Contour label. Serious collectors of vinyl turn their collective nose up at these reissues which is brilliant news for aligreto and myself. They are plentiful and inexpensive, on average about £2 but are a treasure-trove of great music from the top artists of the day at DG, Philips and Decca. Each back-cover has prominently printed "This record has been specially pressed to classical record standards". I actually think they are! Both pressings and transfers are top quality, the only criticism is that the vinyl is thin, I do not put as much importance to weight of vinyl as some other collectors do.
An interesting side issue is the famous Ansermet Decca recording of Scheherzade which is coupled with Borodin's Polovtsian Dances of which a good early pressing you would expect to pay £50. The same recording on Contour is superior for the simple reason Polovtsian Dances is omitted allowing for wider groove spacing for Scheherzade, and costs a fraction of the Decca original. I have both and prefer the sound of the Contour pressing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 06, 2019, 05:02:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 06, 2019, 03:14:58 AM
(https://img.discogs.com/ji334PltJcIYvhmrNo4HhykNamM=/fit-in/600x605/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-5484123-1394554453-4101.jpeg.jpg) (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61x%2BKaIBFoL._SY355_.jpg)

Aligreto featured a post of a LP from the Contour label. Serious collectors of vinyl turn their collective nose up at these reissues which is brilliant news for aligreto and myself. They are plentiful and inexpensive, on average about £2 but are a treasure-trove of great music from the top artists of the day at DG, Philips and Decca. Each back-cover has prominently printed "This record has been specially pressed to classical record standards". I actually think they are! Both pressings and transfers are top quality, the only criticism is that the vinyl is thin, I do not put as much importance to weight of vinyl as some other collectors do.
An interesting side issue is the famous Ansermet Decca recording of Scheherzade which is coupled with Borodin's Polovtsian Dances of which a good early pressing you would expect to pay £50. The same recording on Contour is superior for the simple reason Polovtsian Dances is omitted allowing for wider groove spacing for Scheherzade, and costs a fraction of the Decca original. I have both and prefer the sound of the Contour pressing.

Yes, I have around twenty or so Contour LPs and enjoy them all. Despite the fact that they appear flimsy due to their being so thin I have never had an issue with any of them quality wise. However, let us keep this a secret between ourselves  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 07, 2019, 06:45:06 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 06, 2019, 05:02:47 AM
Yes, I have around twenty or so Contour LPs and enjoy them all. Despite the fact that they appear flimsy due to their being so thin I have never had an issue with any of them quality wise. However, let us keep this a secret between ourselves  ;D
[/b]

...or to the three of us?   ;)  Thanks for the info gents though I probably won't run across many of the LPs where I live (but will file it away in the dusty and cobweb-filled back corners of my brain should I perhaps run across one of them).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 07, 2019, 07:27:19 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 07, 2019, 06:45:06 AM
[/b]

...or to the three of us?   ;)  Thanks for the info gents though I probably won't run across many of the LPs where I live (but will file it away in the dusty and cobweb-filled back corners of my brain should I perhaps run across one of them).

PD

A sister label in the US, Quintessence.

Contour Classics list https://www.discogs.com/label/89072-Contour-Red-Label
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2019, 09:17:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 07, 2019, 07:27:19 AM
A sister label in the US, Quintessence.

Contour Classics list https://www.discogs.com/label/89072-Contour-Red-Label

Thank you for the tip.  I wonder how the pressings compare?  I believe that I have picked up a few of the Quintessence ones from one or more charity shops.  I know that I've at least seen them....is anyone else here familiar with their pressings?  When I have a chance, I'll dig amongst my LPs a bit...trying to recall what I might have purchased and brought home with me!   :-[
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 08, 2019, 09:38:05 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2019, 09:17:16 AM
Thank you for the tip.  I wonder how the pressings compare?  I believe that I have picked up a few of the Quintessence ones from one or more charity shops.  I know that I've at least seen them....is anyone else here familiar with their pressings?  When I have a chance, I'll dig amongst my LPs a bit...trying to recall what I might have purchased and brought home with me!   :-[

No need for embarrassment here, we all do that. That is why we are here  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 11, 2019, 07:35:02 AM
I have not listened to Hi-res (not even sure what it is) but a view from someone who has. https://youtu.be/z4OJo8RVueA
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Archaic Torso of Apollo on January 11, 2019, 09:32:09 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2019, 09:17:16 AM
Thank you for the tip.  I wonder how the pressings compare?  I believe that I have picked up a few of the Quintessence ones from one or more charity shops.  I know that I've at least seen them....is anyone else here familiar with their pressings?

I've had a few Quintessences - I think their main biz was US licensing of European labels. I had some that were originally on Supraphon, but the only one I have now is Leonhardt's 3rd and final Goldbergs, originally on DHM. Pressing sounds great to me, no problems at all.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 13, 2019, 02:08:58 AM
Quote from: Archaic Torso of Apollo on January 11, 2019, 09:32:09 AM
I've had a few Quintessences - I think their main biz was US licensing of European labels. I had some that were originally on Supraphon, but the only one I have now is Leonhardt's 3rd and final Goldbergs, originally on DHM. Pressing sounds great to me, no problems at all.

Interestingly, Quintessence was a source for the Readers Digest boxes. I was always under the impression that RCA were the sole provider of recordings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quintessence_Records

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 15, 2019, 07:36:09 AM
Thank you Archaic Torso of Apollo for your feedback.

Interesting, Irons, I didn't know that!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 15, 2019, 06:28:26 PM
I recently finished digitizing/FLAC-ing the Ginette Doyen Songs Without Words cycle on 1950s Westminster (a wonderful complete set obtained last year on eBay). The set is a real joy, played with great sensitivity (but not sentimentality), a great beauty of tone, and the wonderful mono Westminster sonics I have always appreciated.

(https://s17-us2.startpage.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=https:%2F%2Fimg.discogs.com%2FuZYVN2CuvDKV5fn_U263qDTHGwo%3D%2Ffit-in%2F600x600%2Ffilters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)%2Fdiscogs-images%2FR-9240196-1477185525-8313.jpeg.jpg&sp=8cf0e2d49b9844f78ee4b6ff97b59786)

NOTE: The track listings on the back cover (but not the record label) are horribly inaccurate.

Vol 2 not online! I had to photograph it myself--green cover. Have not post-processed it yet!

(https://img.discogs.com/blJ9tXsldRhwh40Znfb7PkPCAi0=/fit-in/500x500/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-9478672-1481293984-1157.jpeg.jpg)

She did not record very much, but the Faure violin sonatas, Handel violin Sonatas with Jean Fournier (her husband), and a disc of CHabrier 10 Pieces Pittoresques are on my list of future eBay purchases.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 15, 2019, 11:48:40 PM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 15, 2019, 06:28:26 PM
I recently finished digitizing/FLAC-ing the Ginette Doyen Songs Without Words cycle on 1950s Westminster (a wonderful complete set obtained last year on eBay). The set is a real joy, played with great sensitivity (but not sentimentality), a great beauty of tone, and the wonderful mono Westminster sonics I have always appreciated.

(https://s17-us2.startpage.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=https:%2F%2Fimg.discogs.com%2FuZYVN2CuvDKV5fn_U263qDTHGwo%3D%2Ffit-in%2F600x600%2Ffilters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)%2Fdiscogs-images%2FR-9240196-1477185525-8313.jpeg.jpg&sp=8cf0e2d49b9844f78ee4b6ff97b59786)

NOTE: The track listings on the back cover (but not the record label) are horribly inaccurate.

Vol 2 not online! I had to photograph it myself--green cover. Have not post-processed it yet!

(https://img.discogs.com/blJ9tXsldRhwh40Znfb7PkPCAi0=/fit-in/500x500/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-9478672-1481293984-1157.jpeg.jpg)

She did not record very much, but the Faure violin sonatas, Handel violin Sonatas with Jean Fournier (her husband), and a disc of CHabrier 10 Pieces Pittoresques are on my list of future eBay purchases.

Very nice indeed! Were your eBay purchases clean pressings? I realise that you are able to smooth out the sound in the digital domain but understand to do this successfully requires some skill and patience. I am told clean-up programs have a detrimental effect on the sound. Which method do you use and how do you find the results?

I know of Ginette Doyen. Although I have many recordings by her husband, both as a violinist and conductor, sadly none by her. I see she has also made a Debussy recording.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81CMA640MlL._SX679_.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 16, 2019, 05:40:26 AM
I hadn't heard of Ginette Doyen before now.  Did she record much?  I'll have to keep an eye out for her albums.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 17, 2019, 10:54:05 PM
Hi,

Ginette Doyen did not record a whole lot, but including records as an accompanist, there seem to be about a dozen doyen.  :laugh:

I do not use any noise reduction software in digitizing LPs. Surface noise does not bother me as long as it is not excessive. And of course, the older the disc is, the more there will be in general. The Doyen Mendelssohn records are from the early 50s (With few exceptions, I always prefer first pressings) and there is more noise than what you'd get with something newer. It is part of the charm. I would not try to make an LP sound like a CD; it would trash the sonics. Some noise is just a part of the medium, like grain with film and imperfections in old movie reels, sediment in fine red wine, grain in wood, etc. Some of the best and most interesting things in life have some sort of surface texture and imperfections... 

I clean all of my records on a Keith Monks or Clearaudio machine and I am quite picky about condition to begin with. Still, one cannot see all defects, and occasionally, if there is a loud pop, I can edit that out quite easily in Audacity--zoom way in, and the amount of time I end up deleting is well under a second--barely noticeable. I do this more to save my speakers than anything else...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on January 17, 2019, 11:29:48 PM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 17, 2019, 10:54:05 PM

I do not use any noise reduction software in digitizing LPs. Surface noise does not bother me as long as it is not excessive. And of course, the older the disc is, the more there will be in general. The Doyen Mendelssohn records are from the early 50s (With few exceptions, I always prefer first pressings) and there is more noise than what you'd get with something newer. It is part of the charm. I would not try to make an LP sound like a CD; it would trash the sonics. Some noise is just a part of the medium, like grain with film and imperfections in old movie reels, sediment in fine red wine, grain in wood, etc. Some of the best and most interesting things in life have some sort of surface texture and imperfections... 

I agree very much with this. When digitizing all my LPs (and cassette tapes) some twenty years ago. I aimed particularly at retaining the "air" of the LPs, so neither did I use noise reduction - having (of course) secured that the surface of the LP was clean. Often an antistatic pistol was all what was needed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 18, 2019, 04:54:52 AM
Thank you for the further info (and for the bad/good play on words too!).  I haven't tried digitizing any LPs before (save a few 78's done years ago onto a cassette--a parent's special Christmas LPs), but do have a RCM which I've used to clean up some LPs when needed.   :)

Enjoy your douzaine of the doyenne Doyen!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 20, 2019, 05:37:47 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 17, 2019, 10:54:05 PM
Hi,

Ginette Doyen did not record a whole lot, but including records as an accompanist, there seem to be about a dozen doyen.  :laugh:

I do not use any noise reduction software in digitizing LPs. Surface noise does not bother me as long as it is not excessive. And of course, the older the disc is, the more there will be in general. The Doyen Mendelssohn records are from the early 50s (With few exceptions, I always prefer first pressings) and there is more noise than what you'd get with something newer. It is part of the charm. I would not try to make an LP sound like a CD; it would trash the sonics. Some noise is just a part of the medium, like grain with film and imperfections in old movie reels, sediment in fine red wine, grain in wood, etc. Some of the best and most interesting things in life have some sort of surface texture and imperfections... 

I clean all of my records on a Keith Monks or Clearaudio machine and I am quite picky about condition to begin with. Still, one cannot see all defects, and occasionally, if there is a loud pop, I can edit that out quite easily in Audacity--zoom way in, and the amount of time I end up deleting is well under a second--barely noticeable. I do this more to save my speakers than anything else...

So refreshing to read your post. Surface noise is system dependent but as you point out it is not such a big deal anyway. There are extraneous noises at a live concert which our brain filters out. Sit down alone in a crowded pub and beam in on a person across the room, you will hear their conservation above all the other noise. I am seldom aware of surface noise playing vinyl, as pressings are clean, my system does not highlight it and most importantly I concentrate on the music. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 20, 2019, 08:29:06 AM
Vinyl hygiene is very important to help eliminate excessive surface noise as we all know. I believe that the attention to detail in terms of storage, handling and cleaning is one of the major factors in precluding some from re-entering this market. I am constantly surprised at the condition of many of the LPs that I pick up second hand. They are not scratched or damaged [I would not buy them otherwise] but some of them can be quite dirty. However, they generally clean up very well. I can never understand how they can be let get into that condition by previous owners.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 20, 2019, 05:00:19 PM
Typically, spindle tracks on the label (laziness and/or insufficient light  ::) ) and ring wear on the cover are warning signs the LP may have been abused. Also, generally, I've noted the more obscure the music, the more likely the LP will be in good condition. Everyone 50 years ago probably had a Beethoven 5, whereas people in that time period with Schubert songs, Bach cantatas, Second Viennese School, etc. would have had to hunt to find those items and, they were generally not cheap (generally pretty expensive in inflation adjusted terms).

Anyway, this is today's digitization. Hollywood SQ playing Tchaikovsky and Borodin. The sonics on these Capitol LPs were always quite good (later stereos were stunning in some cases), very little inner groove distortion and they were able to pack in 50+ mins of music with no compression. The Hollywood SQ had a lean, muscular, analytic sound, and they always played with great enthusiasm and energy. They do not have the lush, dark sound I prefer in some SQ repertiore as with the Budapest, Baryilli, Paganini (with Henri Temianka) Curtis SQs for example. But, their recordings are always worth collecting, and their approach I find refreshing, especially in more modern repertoire (their Villa-Lobos is incredible). A very nice LP that had been sitting around neglected for 25+ years on my shelves.

(https://s16-us2.startpage.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=https:%2F%2Fimg.discogs.com%2FwIQ21BUnGNNd6whFiIU9_NgylUo%3D%2Ffit-in%2F600x603%2Ffilters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)%2Fdiscogs-images%2FR-9912346-1488411358-1521.jpeg.jpg&sp=c6a43fdba8b4eec7eae799da1a3f8500)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 22, 2019, 12:19:34 AM
Over years of collecting I believe you develop a six sense with regards of condition. Beside the tell-tale signs already mentioned I look for a crease in the front cover which is a sign of repeated removal of LP. If a collector is serious then a RCM is maybe not obligatory, but not far off. I use a Loricraft, which after cleaning I replace the inner sleeve. Never full proof though, a few weeks ago I purchased a pristine copy of  William Wordsworth string quartets on CRD, a label which produced fine clean pressings. On examination under a strong light the vinyl appeared unplayed. Much to my disappointment the music was drowned out by surface noise! Another one will come along, they always do.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 28, 2019, 01:16:26 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/qoKov3N.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2019, 06:02:13 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 28, 2019, 01:16:26 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/qoKov3N.jpg)

:laugh:  :)

PD

p.s.  Probably a good thing that I didn't see your cartoon just before I went to a record store on Saturday (see Recent Purchases from that day).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 28, 2019, 08:16:40 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2019, 06:02:13 AM
:laugh:  :)

PD

p.s.  Probably a good thing that I didn't see your cartoon just before I went to a record store on Saturday (see Recent Purchases from that day).

PD, I was sent the cartoon by our mutual friend, Lee. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2019, 02:05:40 PM
Quote from: Irons on January 28, 2019, 08:16:40 AM
PD, I was sent the cartoon by our mutual friend, Lee. :)
Me thinks Lee was trying to (gently) provoke you!   ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 28, 2019, 05:36:28 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2019, 06:02:13 AM
:laugh:  :)

PD

p.s.  Probably a good thing that I didn't see your cartoon just before I went to a record store on Saturday (see Recent Purchases from that day).

Post 'em here! Don't throw pearls to swine in that other thread...  :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 28, 2019, 05:38:54 PM
Expense and inconvenience are two things I seem to enjoy. Sometimes I think my Ph.D. is in doing things the hard way (rather than biology). Mechanical watches are another one. Some of these old, exotic movements are like owning an old Italian or English sports car--more time in the shop than on my wrist...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 29, 2019, 12:10:44 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 28, 2019, 05:38:54 PM
Expense and inconvenience are two things I seem to enjoy. Sometimes I think my Ph.D. is in doing things the hard way (rather than biology). Mechanical watches are another one. Some of these old, exotic movements are like owning an old Italian or English sports car--more time in the shop than on my wrist...

You and me both! The wife is forever telling me "why do you always do things the hard way!"

I inherited two watches. The one I wear daily is circa 1954 which incredibly doesn't play up and keeps good time.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 29, 2019, 12:47:56 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 28, 2019, 05:36:28 PM
Post 'em here! Don't throw pearls to swine in that other thread...  :laugh:

You are right.

Visited my favourite vinyl emporium on Saturday and returned with a stack. As will be evident I am heavily influenced on my purchases by what I read on this forum by posters more knowledgeable then myself.

Elgar/Vaughan Williams: Violin Sonatas. The Menuhins. EMI.
Moeran: Symphony. Dilkes, English Sinfonia. EMI.
Bruci: Simfonia lesta/Maskal. Belgrade/Zegrab Orchestras, Zdravkovic/Horat. Philips.
R-K/Miaskovsky: Symphony 2/21. Chicago SO, Morton Gould. RCA.
Granados: Goyescas/Escenas Poeticas/Libro De Horas. Thomas Rajna CRD. (Double)
Granados: VOL 2 Thomas Rajna. CRD
Granados: VOL 3  ditto
Granados: VOL 4  ditto
Granados: VOL 7  ditto
Dvorak: PC. Kvapil Brno Jilek. Supraphon.
Gluzounov: The Seasons. MRO Khaikin. Melodiya/EMI.
Liszt: Years of Pilgrimage, Second Year. Farnadi. HMV.
Rameau: Works for Harpsichord, George Malcolm. Argo. (Box)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2019, 09:53:17 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 28, 2019, 05:36:28 PM
Post 'em here! Don't throw pearls to swine in that other thread...  :laugh:

Hello Valkyrie,

Here's a copy of the LP portion of my posting under Recent Purchases:

Went with a friend to see my audio guy at the fine audio store where he works today [Nice guy, he helped me to box up and lift my rather heavy amp into his car and drove us to bring my amp in for a bit of work!].  While we were there, I also suggested that we go to a record store nearby (sells used CDs and LPs).  Did some digging around and came back with these classical LPs (and two CDs):

Nicolai Gedda "Berühmte Italienische Arien" on Odeon
A couple of Gérard Souzay LPs (I was excited to run across!) - GS Sings Operatic Arias on Philips - mono though (also available in stereo), so hope that I'll adjust well to the sound.  It and the next one were promotional copies.
GS - A Century of French Stong, Philips, mono
An unopened copy of Eugene Ormandy and Philly playing Sibelius' Symphony No. 2 on Columbia's Odyssey
Beethoven's Rasumovsky Quartet with the Vlach Quartet on Parliament
Igor Stravinsky's Petrouchka with the L'Orchestre de la Suisse Romande and Ansermet - London
and a double-LP of Domingo called "Bravissimo, Domingo" of arias and duets on RCA Red Seal

and a few pop albums which I might post elsewhere when I have a moment.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2019, 11:23:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 29, 2019, 12:10:44 AM
You and me both! The wife is forever telling me "why do you always do things the hard way!"

I inherited two watches. The one I wear daily is circa 1954 which incredibly doesn't play up and keeps good time.

Mine's in the shop!  Thank you for reminding me.  I should be hearing from them soon.  To be fair, the watch has been quite faithful to me.  I've had it for probably a bit less than 20 years (bought new).  One day, it just stopped working; I figured that it must just need a new battery--nope!  In for, hopefully, a relatively inexpensive overhaul (the jewelers had to send it out to a specialist).

In the meantime, when I feel like I really need to keep track of the time, I wind up my grandfather's old pocket watch!  :-)

By the way, I emailed a screen shot of that comic to 'my guy' at the audio shop.  Hope that he appreciates it!   :-\
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 29, 2019, 11:39:16 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2019, 11:23:06 AM
Mine's in the shop!  Thank you for reminding me.  I should be hearing from them soon.  To be fair, the watch has been quite faithful to me.  I've had it for probably a bit less than 20 years (bought new).  One day, it just stopped working; I figured that it must just need a new battery--nope!  In for, hopefully, a relatively inexpensive overhaul (the jewelers had to send it out to a specialist).

In the meantime, when I feel like I really need to keep track of the time, I wind up my grandfather's old pocket watch!  :-)

By the way, I emailed a screen shot of that comic to 'my guy' at the audio shop.  Hope that he appreciates it!   :-\

I used to wear one, on a chain, in a waistcoat pocket of a three piece suit when I was a young man. It just stopped working on me. I never got it fixed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2019, 04:15:02 PM
Quote from: aligreto on January 29, 2019, 11:39:16 AM
I used to wear one, on a chain, in a waistcoat pocket of a three piece suit when I was a young man. It just stopped working on me. I never got it fixed.
Oh, sweet!   :) Do you still own it?  And is it worth getting it fixed?  I've tucked mine into my purse (though I do have the original chain).  I doubt if it's worth much, but it's rather special as it does also  have his initials engraved into it and was given to me by my father.  I do also have an inexpensive Timex on which I could have had the battery just replaced, but gravitated towards the family piece instead.

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 30, 2019, 12:08:04 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2019, 09:53:17 AM
Hello Valkyrie,

Here's a copy of the LP portion of my posting under Recent Purchases:

Went with a friend to see my audio guy at the fine audio store where he works today [Nice guy, he helped me to box up and lift my rather heavy amp into his car and drove us to bring my amp in for a bit of work!].  While we were there, I also suggested that we go to a record store nearby (sells used CDs and LPs).  Did some digging around and came back with these classical LPs (and two CDs):

Nicolai Gedda "Berühmte Italienische Arien" on Odeon
A couple of Gérard Souzay LPs (I was excited to run across!) - GS Sings Operatic Arias on Philips - mono though (also available in stereo), so hope that I'll adjust well to the sound.  It and the next one were promotional copies.
GS - A Century of French Stong, Philips, mono
An unopened copy of Eugene Ormandy and Philly playing Sibelius' Symphony No. 2 on Columbia's Odyssey
Beethoven's Rasumovsky Quartet with the Vlach Quartet on Parliament
Igor Stravinsky's Petrouchka with the L'Orchestre de la Suisse Romande and Ansermet - London
and a double-LP of Domingo called "Bravissimo, Domingo" of arias and duets on RCA Red Seal

and a few pop albums which I might post elsewhere when I have a moment.

Which Rasumovsky Quartet, P ?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 30, 2019, 12:21:17 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2019, 11:23:06 AM


By the way, I emailed a screen shot of that comic to 'my guy' at the audio shop.  Hope that he appreciates it!   :-\

It's going viral! ;D The best cartoons have an element of truth.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 30, 2019, 05:02:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 30, 2019, 12:08:04 AM
Which Rasumovsky Quartet, P ?

My goof!  It was No. 7 in F. (Op. 59, No. 1).  I wonder how their recordings of the other two are (guessing that the Vlach Quartet also recorded them?  Or no?).  Do you have any of their Beethoven String Quartet recordings Irons?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 30, 2019, 05:03:49 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 30, 2019, 12:21:17 AM
It's going viral! ;D The best cartoons have an element of truth.

Haven't heard back from him yet; hopefully he also found it to be amusing!

Any idea where Lee found it?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 30, 2019, 06:11:28 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 30, 2019, 05:02:00 AM
My goof!  It was No. 7 in F. (Op. 59, No. 1).  I wonder how their recordings of the other two are (guessing that the Vlach Quartet also recorded them?  Or no?).  Do you have any of their Beethoven String Quartet recordings Irons?

PD

I do have that recording, P. The Vlach Quartet are first port of call for the Op.18 set. Josef Vlach made some fine recordings as a conductor.

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/QM8AAOSwgn5XE98w/s-l1600.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 30, 2019, 06:19:12 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 30, 2019, 05:03:49 AM
Haven't heard back from him yet; hopefully he also found it to be amusing!

Any idea where Lee found it?

PD

No I don't. Apparently Alex Gregory is cartoonist for "New Yorker". Recognise the feller on the left?

(https://kenchawkin.files.wordpress.com/2018/03/stages-of-communication-through-technology-by-alex-gregory-tnycartoons.png?w=450)












Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 30, 2019, 07:56:25 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 30, 2019, 06:19:12 AM
No I don't. Apparently Alex Gregory is cartoonist for "New Yorker". Recognise the feller on the left?

(https://kenchawkin.files.wordpress.com/2018/03/stages-of-communication-through-technology-by-alex-gregory-tnycartoons.png?w=450)

No, I don't Irons.

I do love/appreciate many of the cartoons that I've seen in the New Yorker magazine though!  :-)  Are you familiar with this cartoonist's work/style?  I'll bet that you are!   ;)https://condenaststore.com/featured/new-yorker-cover-june-5-1989-ronald-searle.html (https://condenaststore.com/featured/new-yorker-cover-june-5-1989-ronald-searle.html)

PD

p.s.  I'd love to get one of his original cartoons!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 30, 2019, 08:07:33 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2019, 04:15:02 PM
Oh, sweet!   :) Do you still own it?  And is it worth getting it fixed?  I've tucked mine into my purse (though I do have the original chain).  I doubt if it's worth much, but it's rather special as it does also  have his initials engraved into it and was given to me by my father.  I do also have an inexpensive Timex on which I could have had the battery just replaced, but gravitated towards the family piece instead.

Best,

PD

I never gave it away so I do have it somewhere. Like yours it is not worth getting fixed I think as the value is only sentimental.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 31, 2019, 03:33:33 PM
Quote from: aligreto on January 30, 2019, 08:07:33 AM
I never gave it away so I do have it somewhere. Like yours it is not worth getting fixed I think as the value is only sentimental.
Sorry, but I think that you confused my postings a bit as my grandfather's watch (the pocket watch) works; it was my wristwatch that needed fixing (they also cleaned it, etc.).  Perhaps you might want to rethink getting it fixed?  Maybe if you brought it to a reputable  repairer they might give you an idea what it might cost to fix it (for a modest sum)?  Wristwatch is back now and fixed I'm pleased to report.

Good luck!

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 31, 2019, 06:17:29 PM
Funny, some of us are into mechanical watches too. Speaking of that

I just got my "problem child" 1950s hand-wound Movado back in the mail today after trying this watchmaker near our vacation spot on the CA Central Coast. Seems to be working ok, but after lots of money spent on this watch with various watchmakers (bought for too much money online from a supposedly reputable dealer  >:( ), he told me that it had been screwed around with by innumerable half-assed watchmakers over the years and was in pretty bad shape overall. He serviced it as best he could, but told me not to expect much, and not to wear it as an everyday watch (had no plans to do that anyway). When it dies, we agreed, it's not worth the outlay to fix again. It will sit here in my museum of non-working watches.  :( Sad too, because it is a gorgeous, understated watch. OTOH, I have an old Longines Admiral and Doxa Antimagnetic (gorgeous NOS watch at 39 mm) that are quite trouble free and fairly accurate. In the world of watches, finding an honest, knowledgeable, experienced watchmaker and dealer is EVERYTHING. An old mechanical watch is not a Toyota Corolla, and you will likely have to expend a lot of effort to find someone worthy of servicing it.

Sometime, if you really want to feel like a poor, non-Davos vulture capitalist job creator, try shopping for watches in Berlin or Dresden--cheapest Lange in the window = 50,000 Euros!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 01, 2019, 12:42:34 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 31, 2019, 06:17:29 PM
Funny, some of us are into mechanical watches too. Speaking of that

I just got my "problem child" 1950s hand-wound Movado back in the mail today after trying this watchmaker near our vacation spot on the CA Central Coast. Seems to be working ok, but after lots of money spent on this watch with various watchmakers (bought for too much money online from a supposedly reputable dealer  >:( ), he told me that it had been screwed around with by innumerable half-assed watchmakers over the years and was in pretty bad shape overall. He serviced it as best he could, but told me not to expect much, and not to wear it as an everyday watch (had no plans to do that anyway). When it dies, we agreed, it's not worth the outlay to fix again. It will sit here in my museum of non-working watches.  :( Sad too, because it is a gorgeous, understated watch. OTOH, I have an old Longines Admiral and Doxa Antimagnetic (gorgeous NOS watch at 39 mm) that are quite trouble free and fairly accurate. In the world of watches, finding an honest, knowledgeable, experienced watchmaker and dealer is EVERYTHING. An old mechanical watch is not a Toyota Corolla, and you will likely have to expend a lot of effort to find someone worthy of servicing it.

Sometime, if you really want to feel like a poor, non-Davos vulture capitalist job creator, try shopping for watches in Berlin or Dresden--cheapest Lange in the window = 50,000 Euros!

You are right about servicing being a problem. The watch I wear daily is a Zenith Sporto, the only work done is a new winder as the old one was worn. The other, an Omega Seamaster 600, I thought a good idea to send away for a full service. The watch is now very stiff to wind up - I think it may be a self-winder. The service cost just over £100 which in retrospect a proper service would cost much more then that. I actually think this service a waste of time. I inherited both from my father-in-law when he passed away. I have not a clue what they are worth.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 01, 2019, 12:46:44 AM
Back to cartoons. $:)

I can only think of one cartoon style LP cover. But it is a good un -

(https://i.imgur.com/0BPva33.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 01, 2019, 06:59:28 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on January 31, 2019, 06:17:29 PM
Funny, some of us are into mechanical watches too. Speaking of that

I just got my "problem child" 1950s hand-wound Movado back in the mail today after trying this watchmaker near our vacation spot on the CA Central Coast. Seems to be working ok, but after lots of money spent on this watch with various watchmakers (bought for too much money online from a supposedly reputable dealer  >:( ), he told me that it had been screwed around with by innumerable half-assed watchmakers over the years and was in pretty bad shape overall. He serviced it as best he could, but told me not to expect much, and not to wear it as an everyday watch (had no plans to do that anyway). When it dies, we agreed, it's not worth the outlay to fix again. It will sit here in my museum of non-working watches.  :( Sad too, because it is a gorgeous, understated watch. OTOH, I have an old Longines Admiral and Doxa Antimagnetic (gorgeous NOS watch at 39 mm) that are quite trouble free and fairly accurate. In the world of watches, finding an honest, knowledgeable, experienced watchmaker and dealer is EVERYTHING. An old mechanical watch is not a Toyota Corolla, and you will likely have to expend a lot of effort to find someone worthy of servicing it.

Sometime, if you really want to feel like a poor, non-Davos vulture capitalist job creator, try shopping for watches in Berlin or Dresden--cheapest Lange in the window = 50,000 Euros!

Interesting, mine is a Movado--though much more recent than yours; it's back after a 'cleaning' and a replacement of a 'spring' (so I was told).  After reading your posting, I'm praying that the supposedly 'authorized' watch person was/is good! 

Best wishes (for both you and your collection),

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 01, 2019, 07:02:51 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 01, 2019, 12:46:44 AM
Back to cartoons. $:)

I can only think of one cartoon style LP cover. But it is a good un -

(https://i.imgur.com/0BPva33.jpg)
Some very unhappy looking musicians there Irons!!  :(
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 01, 2019, 11:28:00 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 01, 2019, 07:02:51 AM
Some very unhappy looking musicians there Irons!!  :(

Reiner was not known for spreading joy, P.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 02, 2019, 05:34:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 01, 2019, 11:28:00 PM
Reiner was not known for spreading joy, P.
That's my understanding....though I try not to focus nor like to read about things like that...just here to enjoy the music!   ;)

By the way, I spoke to my audio guy and asked what he thought of the cartoon; he hadn't check his email recently!  Alas, he hasn't had a chance yet to look at my amp.   :(  He'll get there eventually.

PD

p.s.  Spent a chunk of time yesterday trying to sort through and also move some LPs...which required temporarily boxing up some books, etc.  What a mess!  I'm hoping that a friend of mine might help me by building some more shelving for me.  Also, need to get rid of some of my books:  too much music and too many books!  Help!   ::)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 02, 2019, 12:36:04 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 01, 2019, 06:59:28 AM
Interesting, mine is a Movado--though much more recent than yours; it's back after a 'cleaning' and a replacement of a 'spring' (so I was told).  After reading your posting, I'm praying that the supposedly 'authorized' watch person was/is good! 

Best wishes (for both you and your collection),

PD

Thanks, same to you. The Movado is actually running quite well although I have not actually worn it yet. My new watchmaker told me that the movement was not Movado's best, and they had the "clever" idea of using some metal clamps (?) where they should have used screws--hence, it was a compromised movement to begin with 15 jewels or not. PM me if you need the details of this watchmaker, I'll send you the info.

Too many books and music--a problem for many of us.  I have recently become tired of always buying new books and music and rushing to listen to them and read them so I can go on to the next thing. I almost feel as I'm overstuffing myself at some all-you-can-eat buffet. I have way too much to listen to, so I've really scaled back my buying. As for books, I've also purposely not bought anything new for a bit--time to go back and explore some old favorites, which I am greatly enjoying. Currently re-reading Colin Thubron's wonderful travel book on Siberia. 

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 04, 2019, 06:48:25 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 02, 2019, 12:36:04 PM
Thanks, same to you. The Movado is actually running quite well although I have not actually worn it yet. My new watchmaker told me that the movement was not Movado's best, and they had the "clever" idea of using some metal clamps (?) where they should have used screws--hence, it was a compromised movement to begin with 15 jewels or not. PM me if you need the details of this watchmaker, I'll send you the info.

Too many books and music--a problem for many of us.  I have recently become tired of always buying new books and music and rushing to listen to them and read them so I can go on to the next thing. I almost feel as I'm overstuffing myself at some all-you-can-eat buffet. I have way too much to listen to, so I've really scaled back my buying. As for books, I've also purposely not bought anything new for a bit--time to go back and explore some old favorites, which I am greatly enjoying. Currently re-reading Colin Thubron's wonderful travel book on Siberia.
Good for you (re consumption)!  One project for this winter--well, two actually--going through books (what to keep, what to donate, and what to sell) and also music!

Watch is working well (knock on wood).   8)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 07, 2019, 12:36:40 AM
HMV lives on!  https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/feb/05/doug-putman-vinyl-hmv-sunrise-records
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on February 07, 2019, 01:04:34 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 07, 2019, 12:36:40 AM
HMV lives on!  https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/feb/05/doug-putman-vinyl-hmv-sunrise-records

I don't want any business to go bust but the loss of HMV wouldn't affect me at all, it ceased to be a serious seller of classical music years ago. Good luck to Mr Putnam in his efforts.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2019, 04:31:53 AM
Yesterday, I cleaned off and played an old Stephen Bishop album that someone had given me.  It was of Beethoven's Third Piano Concerto with Colin Davis and the BBCSO on Philips.  I enjoyed the performance but was surprised at how bad the recording was!  It was from I believe 1972?  Looking at the LP jacket, I noticed that it was manufactured by Columbia House (and New York address).  Did some further digging, and it seems that Columbia had a record club and did pressings at a number of different plants.  This didn't say anything about it being a CRC recording, but I'm guessing that this was the case?

Wondering whether anyone here is familiar with this recording and if so, how do you find it to be?  Also, whether or not anyone has heard either the British pressing or the Dutch ones.  Sadly, I found the sound stage to feel quite distant and rather lacking in focus.  It also was faintly crackly/hissy -- that might have been more due to my cleaning efforts (on a RCM) but I did rinse it well with that fancy 'pure' water. 

This is an image of the Dutch pressing (mine looks the same.  Only difference that I can tell is on the back at the bottom as to who manufactured mine).  (https://img.discogs.com/iA9e2WsvWicQS6jT8KYvzekhzJc=/fit-in/600x616/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-6079298-1410525146-9465.jpeg.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on February 07, 2019, 05:53:58 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2019, 04:31:53 AM
Yesterday, I cleaned off and played an old Stephen Bishop album that someone had given me.  It was of Beethoven's Third Piano Concerto with Colin Davis and the BBCSO on Philips.  I enjoyed the performance but was surprised at how bad the recording was!  It was from I believe 1972?  Looking at the LP jacket, I noticed that it was manufactured by Columbia House (and New York address).  Did some further digging, and it seems that Columbia had a record club and did pressings at a number of different plants.  This didn't say anything about it being a CRC recording, but I'm guessing that this was the case?

Wondering whether anyone here is familiar with this recording and if so, how do you find it to be?  Also, whether or not anyone has heard either the British pressing or the Dutch ones.  Sadly, I found the sound stage to feel quite distant and rather lacking in focus.  It also was faintly crackly/hissy -- that might have been more due to my cleaning efforts (on a RCM) but I did rinse it well with that fancy 'pure' water. 

This is an image of the Dutch pressing (mine looks the same.  Only difference that I can tell is on the back at the bottom as to who manufactured mine).  (https://img.discogs.com/iA9e2WsvWicQS6jT8KYvzekhzJc=/fit-in/600x616/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-6079298-1410525146-9465.jpeg.jpg)

PD

I have this disc as part of a box set of the piano concertos; it was manufactured in Holland by Philips. It sounds fine to me though typical of its time. The piano is rather forward but well-recorded. The orchestra does sound slightly recessed when playing tuttis but I wouldn't describe it as distant. The slow movement where the piano predominates sounds the best. I can't detect any hiss but that is probably down to my ageing ears.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2019, 06:10:38 AM
Quote from: Biffo on February 07, 2019, 05:53:58 AM
I have this disc as part of a box set of the piano concertos; it was manufactured in Holland by Philips. It sounds fine to me though typical of its time. The piano is rather forward but well-recorded. The orchestra does sound slightly recessed when playing tuttis but I wouldn't describe it as distant. The slow movement where the piano predominates sounds the best. I can't detect any hiss but that is probably down to my ageing ears.
Hi Biffo,

Thank you for taking the time to give it a listen and sharing your thoughts with me.  I agree with you about the piano being recorded well.  To me, it (the orchestra) sounded...how to describe it rather homogenized than being able to hear distinct sections or instruments and being able to pinpoint them space-wise?  Whereas today I had a totally different experience; I cleaned off and played Tchaikovsky's Pathétique Symphony with Reiner and the CSO on a RCA Living Stereo album.  I probably should give it another run through before I send it off to a charity shop (currently, it's residing in that pile).  Perhaps the CD transfer is much better in this case?

Am curious here as to whether anyone else here has heard/had experience with the Columbia House pressings and how they find them to be.

Thank you again,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 07, 2019, 07:17:12 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2019, 04:31:53 AM
Yesterday, I cleaned off and played an old Stephen Bishop album that someone had given me.  It was of Beethoven's Third Piano Concerto with Colin Davis and the BBCSO on Philips.  I enjoyed the performance but was surprised at how bad the recording was!  It was from I believe 1972?  Looking at the LP jacket, I noticed that it was manufactured by Columbia House (and New York address).  Did some further digging, and it seems that Columbia had a record club and did pressings at a number of different plants.  This didn't say anything about it being a CRC recording, but I'm guessing that this was the case?

Wondering whether anyone here is familiar with this recording and if so, how do you find it to be?  Also, whether or not anyone has heard either the British pressing or the Dutch ones.  Sadly, I found the sound stage to feel quite distant and rather lacking in focus.  It also was faintly crackly/hissy -- that might have been more due to my cleaning efforts (on a RCM) but I did rinse it well with that fancy 'pure' water. 

This is an image of the Dutch pressing (mine looks the same.  Only difference that I can tell is on the back at the bottom as to who manufactured mine).  (https://img.discogs.com/iA9e2WsvWicQS6jT8KYvzekhzJc=/fit-in/600x616/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-6079298-1410525146-9465.jpeg.jpg)

PD

Interesting, P. In a way you have perfectly described the house sound of Philips. A label (this is a vinyl thread) brilliant for chamber music with Haydn piano trios, Beethoven quartets and lots more they are the absolute best. For larger forces, I think the best way to describe Philips is conservative. Which is not bad in itself, but you are not going to hear the impact of Mercury and RCA or the realism of Decca. UK and Dutch Philips pressings do sound different, so I guess CBS will too, but I think it is more likely the recording you are not warming to.
I do not own that particular record, but have Bishop/Davis on Philips with Mozart PC K.467 & K.503. I will give it a spin tonight and report back.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on February 07, 2019, 07:26:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 07, 2019, 07:17:12 AM
Interesting, P. In a way you have perfectly described the house sound of Philips. A label (this is a vinyl thread) brilliant for chamber music with Haydn piano trios, Beethoven quartets and lots more they are the absolute best. For larger forces, I think the best way to describe Philips is conservative. Which is not bad in itself, but you are not going to hear the impact of Mercury and RCA or the realism of Decca. UK and Dutch Philips pressings do sound different, so I guess CBS will too, but I think it is more likely the recording you are not warming to.
I do not own that particular record, but have Bishop/Davis on Philips with Mozart PC K.467 & K.503. I will give it a spin tonight and report back.

That is one of my all-time favourite Mozart records, I still have the LP. I look forward to hearing what you think of it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 07, 2019, 07:32:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 07, 2019, 07:17:12 AMI do not own that particular record, but have Bishop/Davis on Philips with Mozart PC K.467 & K.503. I will give it a spin tonight and report back.

That was literally the third classical LP that I ever purchased. I still consider it one of the finest recordings I have owned (I have it on CD now, which doesn't seem to have the same silky smoothness as my memory of the LP.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2019, 07:39:24 AM
Thanks Irons.

Speaking of Decca, I cleaned and put on an Ansermet recording of Debussy and Ravel (Nocturnes and Rapsodie Espagnole)...sublime!  One sad thing, and I don't know whether or not you can comment on this from afar, but after cleaning, I did notice a small gouge on the Debussy side.  I went ahead and played it, I could hear a slight thud(?) for about 8 times as the needle went over it.  It didn't make a REALLY loud sound, but it certainly was quite noticeable.  Wondering how much damage this does to a needle?  The performances are so lovely and the sound is great (record made in England)...would love to find another copy of it.  Currently enjoying the R.E. on the flip side.   :)

Speaking of Philips, some time ago, I remember someone mentioning about how the Dutch ended up restricting the dynamics when they did pressings (as compared to the British ones).  Have you (or anyone else here) noticed that?  It does seem that way to me...though I don't believe that I've heard any British pressings of Philips.

PD

p.s.  Will look to see if I perhaps have that Mozart/Bishop one (doubt it, but you never know!).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 07, 2019, 08:43:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2019, 07:39:24 AM
Thanks Irons.

Speaking of Decca, I cleaned and put on an Ansermet recording of Debussy and Ravel (Nocturnes and Rapsodie Espagnole)...sublime!  One sad thing, and I don't know whether or not you can comment on this from afar, but after cleaning, I did notice a small gouge on the Debussy side.  I went ahead and played it, I could hear a slight thud(?) for about 8 times as the needle went over it.  It didn't make a REALLY loud sound, but it certainly was quite noticeable.  Wondering how much damage this does to a needle?  The performances are so lovely and the sound is great (record made in England)...would love to find another copy of it.  Currently enjoying the R.E. on the flip side.   :)


Speaking of Philips, some time ago, I remember someone mentioning about how the Dutch ended up restricting the dynamics when they did pressings (as compared to the British ones).  Have you (or anyone else here) noticed that?  It does seem that way to me...though I don't believe that I've heard any British pressings of Philips.

PD

p.s.  Will look to see if I perhaps have that Mozart/Bishop one (doubt it, but you never know!).

P, have you examined the "gouge" under a strong light? The reason I ask is the noise you describe, a repeated thud, is often a piece of crud affixed to the grooves. Under a spot-light I carefully work on the blob with a finger nail until removal. This happens quite a lot, in fact only last week. If you do it carefully no harm comes to the record itself.

Ansermet is my favourite conductor in this music. The earlier mono Nocturnes is outstanding too.

UK pressings are as you say more dynamic but Dutch are CD quite. I worry less now regarding pressings.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2019, 12:19:25 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 07, 2019, 08:43:44 AM
P, have you examined the "gouge" under a strong light? The reason I ask is the noise you describe, a repeated thud, is often a piece of crud affixed to the grooves. Under a spot-light I carefully work on the blob with a finger nail until removal. This happens quite a lot, in fact only last week. If you do it carefully no harm comes to the record itself.

Ansermet is my favourite conductor in this music. The earlier mono Nocturnes is outstanding too.

UK pressings are as you say more dynamic but Dutch are CD quite. I worry less now regarding pressings.

Irons,

No, it's definitely not any sort of crud alas.  The depression is about (off the top of my head) 1/4 to a 1/3 of an inch wide?  I'll try and take a picture for you later.  This afternoon, I was doing several hours of crawling around on the ground and digging through boxes trying to organize (and move) my LPs (and get rid of some too)...hard getting up after that!   ::)  I did find some to toss and some to donate...trying to get more rigorous in examine those that I gave into purchasing in a moment of weakness that really have seen better days.  Some of them I'll clean first and give them a go on the record player and decide from there.  Almost done going through some that were giving to me--found some that had water damage and were moldy (Bye, bye!)....a set of Beethoven symphonies by a conductor that I already own (donate), etc.  One nice thing (potentially deadly), a friend came up with an idea for shelving and offered to build me some if I wanted!   8) ??? :-\  What to do?! 

The Nocturnes that I listened to were in mono (but still sounded SOOO good!).

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 08, 2019, 01:02:01 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2019, 12:19:25 PM


The Nocturnes that I listened to were in mono (but still sounded SOOO good!).


I can say it now. ;) Ansermet was in his prime when your Nocturnes was recorded. I much prefer the performance to his later stereo remake. When Decca rereleased the mono Nocturnes on Ace of Clubs they paired it with La Mer.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 08, 2019, 01:29:36 AM
Quote from: Biffo on February 07, 2019, 07:26:31 AM
That is one of my all-time favourite Mozart records, I still have the LP. I look forward to hearing what you think of it.

Not bad is it. ;D Definitely no problems of balance on this recording. The slightly soft-focused Philips orchestral sound in this case works to the music's advantage (lost in digital transfer?). Nothing soft-focused in the piano sound, the engineers did a magnificent job. Stephen Bishop's playing is stunning, the "Elvira Madigan" movement is one of those rare moments listening to recorded music where time seems to stop still. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on February 08, 2019, 01:43:30 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 08, 2019, 01:29:36 AM
Not bad is it. ;D Defiantly no problems of balance on this recording. The slightly soft-focused Philips orchestral sound in this case works to the music's advantage (lost in digital transfer?). Nothing soft-focused in the piano sound, the engineers did a magnificent job. Stephen Bishop's playing is stunning, the "Elvira Madigan" movement is one of those rare moments listening to recorded music where time seems to stop still.

Glad you enjoyed it. K503 is probably my favourite Mozart Piano Concerto though I love K467 as well (for me, free of any filmic associations).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 08, 2019, 01:50:14 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 08, 2019, 01:29:36 AM
Not bad is it. ;D Definitely no problems of balance on this recording. The slightly soft-focused Philips orchestral sound in this case works to the music's advantage (lost in digital transfer?). Nothing soft-focused in the piano sound, the engineers did a magnificent job. Stephen Bishop's playing is stunning, the "Elvira Madigan" movement is one of those rare moments listening to recorded music where time seems to stop still.
Will keep an eye out for it..but on Philips proper.  Not certain what you mean about 'lost in digital transfer'?.  The one that I had was recorded in either 1972 or '74?  Or were you referring to the Mozart recordings?  If so, when were they recorded?  I did (as I mentioned earlier) enjoy the performance on my Columbia album.  Took a close look at it again and saw more damage than I had first noticed.  In any event, I'd like to get a copy of that SBK album but on Philips.  'Soft-focused' is probably a nice way to describe the orchestral-part of the miking/recording/mixing/engineering.   :)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 09, 2019, 02:45:34 PM
Some new LP finds today (see New Purchases thread if you're interested).

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 10, 2019, 01:11:13 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 07, 2019, 07:32:26 AM
That was literally the third classical LP that I ever purchased. I still consider it one of the finest recordings I have owned (I have it on CD now, which doesn't seem to have the same silky smoothness as my memory of the LP.

PD. I was addressing the above with "lost in digital transfer".
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 10, 2019, 02:49:50 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 09, 2019, 02:45:34 PM
Some new LP finds today (see New Purchases thread if you're interested).

Best,

PD

You are on a roll!

Tatrai are self recommendable. They recorded all Haydn Quartets. Op. 77 No.1 is one of my favourites.

I do not own that one but collect all Marriner's Argo recordings when I find them.

Do own the Decca Curzon Beethoven/Schubert. Which is a bit of a "collectable". ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 10, 2019, 04:31:19 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 10, 2019, 01:11:13 AM

PD. I was addressing the above with "lost in digital transfer".
Ah, thanks for the clarification! :-)

P
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 10, 2019, 04:41:37 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 10, 2019, 02:49:50 AM
You are on a roll!

Tatrai are self recommendable. They recorded all Haydn Quartets. Op. 77 No.1 is one of my favourites.

I do not own that one but collect all Marriner's Argo recordings when I find them.

Do own the Decca Curzon Beethoven/Schubert. Which is a bit of a "collectable". ;)
;D  I do have a bunch of their Haydn recordings on CD which I enjoy, but I didn't have that one so am looking forward to listening to it.

You mean that I actually managed to find an Argo LP that *The Great Irons doesn't own?!

*meant with affection and great admiration of course.

The friend that I went with yesterday to do a few errands (and also have some fun poking around in the stores/shops) wants to go to yet ANOTHER one today!  Help!!! ;)  I might pass though as I have a bunch of things which I would like to do today.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 10, 2019, 07:15:32 AM
Talking of Argo, I have been after this recording for some time.

(https://img.discogs.com/g8S4756tPnqeRqRDPYAW7QXlmho=/fit-in/549x551/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7014144-1431701249-4736.jpeg.jpg)

A copy purchased through eBay is on its way. A second try, the first (not eBay) an excessive noisy copy. I did expect to pay more which although listed as "near mint" I am worried that this is too good to be true. An "oval" Argo label so fairly old. I have used the seller before a few times and he let me down once with a poor copy not described as such. Very much fingers crossed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2019, 04:13:07 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 10, 2019, 07:15:32 AM
Talking of Argo, I have been after this recording for some time.

(https://img.discogs.com/g8S4756tPnqeRqRDPYAW7QXlmho=/fit-in/549x551/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7014144-1431701249-4736.jpeg.jpg)

A copy purchased through eBay is on its way. A second try, the first (not eBay) an excessive noisy copy. I did expect to pay more which although listed as "near mint" I am worried that this is too good to be true. An "oval" Argo label so fairly old. I have used the seller before a few times and he let me down once with a poor copy not described as such. Very much fingers crossed.
Let us know how it comes out Irons.  By the way, do you happen to know whether or not the seller listens to any of the recordings (or samples) first?  Or just by eyesight?  Good luck! :)

By the way, I did succumb to the (short) road trip with my friend.  Turns out the store was closed!  Just as well....another day.  I did play the Debussy side for him (of that Ansermet album mentioned earlier); he enjoyed it!

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 11, 2019, 07:25:49 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2019, 04:13:07 AM


By the way, I did succumb to the (short) road trip with my friend.  Turns out the store was closed!  Just as well....another day.  I did play the Debussy side for him (of that Ansermet album mentioned earlier); he enjoyed it!


A fine recording. I like the cover of the reissue which makes me feel nostalgic. The cover of Boult's stereo "Wand of Youth" on EMI has the same effect.

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/134/30850710873_c2104c1a7c_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2019, 02:22:30 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 11, 2019, 07:25:49 AM
A fine recording. I like the cover of the reissue which makes me feel nostalgic. The cover of Boult's stereo "Wand of Youth" on EMI has the same effect.

(https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/134/30850710873_c2104c1a7c_b.jpg)
Nice photo!  :-)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 13, 2019, 09:50:26 PM
[CAUTION: Non-classical content]

Locally, found a Frank Sinatra (Where are You?) Capitol, late 50s, stereo. Capitol stereos (And monos for that matter) from this era sounded incredible! Some very nice songs here, but not his famous stuff (which I already have). I'm not a Sinatra fanatic, but I do greatly appreciate his artistry. I was not specifically looking for his records, but something in good condition of his from this era has a ton of warmth and character. Speaking of warmth and character... 

Also found a 10" George Shearing (When Lights Are Low) MGM, early 50s. Cute as hell.

I need to find another one or two classical pieces before I take my next batch of LPs up to my audio dealer for cleaning. I have been perusing eBay, but am not really all that fired up about anything. May buy a Ginette Doyen playing Chabrier, or possibly Faure sonatas with Jean Fournier. Soviet-era Melodiyas of Sofronitsky and Gilels are also tempting...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2019, 04:09:15 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 13, 2019, 09:50:26 PM
[CAUTION: Non-classical content]

Locally, found a Frank Sinatra (Where are You?) Capitol, late 50s, stereo. Capitol stereos (And monos for that matter) from this era sounded incredible! Some very nice songs here, but not his famous stuff (which I already have). I'm not a Sinatra fanatic, but I do greatly appreciate his artistry. I was not specifically looking for his records, but something in good condition of his from this era has a ton of warmth and character. Speaking of warmth and character... 

Also found a 10" George Shearing (When Lights Are Low) MGM, early 50s. Cute as hell.

I need to find another one or two classical pieces before I take my next batch of LPs up to my audio dealer for cleaning. I have been perusing eBay, but am not really all that fired up about anything. May buy a Ginette Doyen playing Chabrier, or possibly Faure sonatas with Jean Fournier. Soviet-era Melodiyas of Sofronitsky and Gilels are also tempting...

Congrats!   :)  A few years back, I had found an old Sinatra LP...wonderful singing...sound, but alas, it was too damaged so I ended up throwing it out--sadly.   :'(

Re:  cleaning...good for you!  Alas, I'm stuck with doing the dirty work myself (use an Okki Nokki).

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 14, 2019, 06:48:53 AM
More of a Dean Martin man myself. Hic.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 14, 2019, 12:14:16 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2019, 04:09:15 AM
Congrats!   :)  A few years back, I had found an old Sinatra LP...wonderful singing...sound, but alas, it was too damaged so I ended up throwing it out--sadly.   :'(

Re:  cleaning...good for you!  Alas, I'm stuck with doing the dirty work myself (use an Okki Nokki).

Best,

PD

Hi,

The greatest Sinatra ever IMO is the one on Reprise with Antonio Carlos Jobim. Be sure to get the stereo. The record is not rare, and you should be able to get a near mint copy for $10 or so.

(https://img.discogs.com/P9HHE_tSpjRzybf4LV-cFeNFbqE=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-2768209-1391825081-8732.jpeg.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 14, 2019, 12:18:42 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 14, 2019, 06:48:53 AM
More of a Dean Martin man myself. Hic.

Haven't listened to much Dean Martin, but I think Tony Bennett is at least as great as Sinatra. I recently digitized one of his LPs with Bill Evans, and I think some of these songs and his interpretations transcend pop and jazz idiom to rise to the level of high art.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2019, 01:45:33 PM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 14, 2019, 12:14:16 PM
Hi,

The greatest Sinatra ever IMO is the one on Reprise with Antonio Carlos Jobim. Be sure to get the stereo. The record is not rare, and you should be able to get a near mint copy for $10 or so.

(https://img.discogs.com/P9HHE_tSpjRzybf4LV-cFeNFbqE=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-2768209-1391825081-8732.jpeg.jpg)
Thank you for the suggestion and the accompanying photo; I'll keep an eye out for it.  Speaking of Tony Bennett, I ran across a double-CD of his recordings at a charity shop (in fine shape) for $1.99.  Looking forward to listening to it.

You gents might appreciate this:  some time ago, I ran across a 10" LP of Benny Goodman and Rosemary Clooney which I cleaned and was in fairly decent shape considering everything.  Fun to listen to.  It's this one:  (https://img.discogs.com/P-RMcuZWYIVkieZwbGeTuCZwE9U=/fit-in/360x360/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-5374092-1391802203-7119.jpeg.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2019, 03:14:50 PM
A question for all of you vinyl lovers:  Today, I cleaned and played an old Columbia Entré record with Aleco Galliera conducting the Philharmonia Orchestra in Debussy's La Mer, Faune, and Ravel's Intro and Allegro for Harp.  I'm sure looking at who all is playing on this LP that surely it must have been recorded in the UK?  Haven't been able to find a listing though.  I would have thought that Columbia must have licensed the rights from someone?  Is it from a combo of albums too?  Was disappointed that the LP was too damaged--for me anyway.   :(

Anyone know here the story behind it?  Here's an image of the one that I have (and which will be leaving my possession):  (https://www.ebay.com/itm/DEBUSSY-LA-MER-PRELUDE-RAVEL-ALCEO-GALLIERA-INTRO-ALLEGRO-FOR-HARP-ENTRE-RL3055/292761565915?hash=item4429f2fadb:g:fvMAAOSw61dbrpfo:rk:1:pf:0)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 14, 2019, 03:28:01 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2019, 03:14:50 PM
A question for all of you vinyl lovers:  Today, I cleaned and played an old Columbia Entré record with Aleco Galliera conducting the Philharmonia Orchestra in Debussy's La Mer, Faune, and Ravel's Intro and Allegro for Harp.  I'm sure looking at who all is playing on this LP that surely it must have been recorded in the UK?  Haven't been able to find a listing though.  I would have thought that Columbia must have licensed the rights from someone?  Is it from a combo of albums too?  Was disappointed that the LP was too damaged--for me anyway.   :(

Anyone know here the story behind it?  Here's an image of the one that I have (and which will be leaving my possession):  (https://www.ebay.com/itm/DEBUSSY-LA-MER-PRELUDE-RAVEL-ALCEO-GALLIERA-INTRO-ALLEGRO-FOR-HARP-ENTRE-RL3055/292761565915?hash=item4429f2fadb:g:fvMAAOSw61dbrpfo:rk:1:pf:0)

Best,

PD

EMI released records in the UK under the name Columbia until the early 70's. (They couldn't use that name in the US because the Columbia trademark was owned by another label in the US at the time.) The parallel U.S. release (if there was one) would have been manufactured in the UK and branded Angel.

Is it mono? Galliera recorded some of the program which was originally release on a 78 rpm shellac disc.

https://www.discogs.com/The-Philharmonia-Orchestra-Alceo-Galliera-Prelude-A-Lapres-Midi-Dun-Faune/release/10312369
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 14, 2019, 09:03:54 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2019, 01:45:33 PM
Thank you for the suggestion and the accompanying photo; I'll keep an eye out for it.  Speaking of Tony Bennett, I ran across a double-CD of his recordings at a charity shop (in fine shape) for $1.99.  Looking forward to listening to it.

You gents might appreciate this:  some time ago, I ran across a 10" LP of Benny Goodman and Rosemary Clooney which I cleaned and was in fairly decent shape considering everything.  Fun to listen to.  It's this one:  (https://img.discogs.com/P-RMcuZWYIVkieZwbGeTuCZwE9U=/fit-in/360x360/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-5374092-1391802203-7119.jpeg.jpg)

PD

An interesting find. Thanks for sharing. The 10" format did not seem to last for long--late 40s-mid 50s. Interestingly, due to nostalgia (or something), I see many new LPs on the 10" format...

If you like jazz and vinyl, you must, must, must get this two LP set...Heaven.

(https://img.discogs.com/1x09IMZAT36jKNly7vkAL5-0MKw=/fit-in/500x500/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7872093-1460987772-1345.jpeg.jpg)

https://www.discogs.com/Chet-Baker-Bill-Evans-The-Complete-Recordings/release/7872093

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 15, 2019, 12:21:40 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 14, 2019, 03:28:01 PM
EMI released records in the UK under the name Columbia until the early 70's. (They couldn't use that name in the US because the Columbia trademark was owned by another label in the US at the time.) The parallel U.S. release (if there was one) would have been manufactured in the UK and branded Angel.

Is it mono? Galliera recorded some of the program which was originally release on a 78 rpm shellac disc.

https://www.discogs.com/The-Philharmonia-Orchestra-Alceo-Galliera-Prelude-A-Lapres-Midi-Dun-Faune/release/10312369

For Debussy you are correct Faune (1947) and Le Mer (1950) were both recorded by American Columbia and released on 78s. Subsequently on LP RL 3055.
Ravel starts to get complicated as this was recorded by UK Columbia which is a different company. This recording in the Kingsway Hall - It is my guess that the Debussy recordings took place there too - in 1957. Recorded in both mono and stereo (33CX 1663 & SAX 2303). Later released with other works by Classics for Pleasure. I have the CFP LP on my shelves and it is excellent.

(https://img.discogs.com/HlryPCsFWbTlCoC1w4FoDCk45cQ=/fit-in/600x593/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-8866330-1471073985-8760.jpeg.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 15, 2019, 10:51:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 15, 2019, 12:21:40 AM
For Debussy you are correct Faune (1947) and Le Mer (1950) were both recorded by American Columbia and released on 78s. Subsequently on LP RL 3055.
Ravel starts to get complicated as this was recorded by UK Columbia which is a different company. This recording in the Kingsway Hall - It is my guess that the Debussy recordings took place there too - in 1957. Recorded in both mono and stereo (33CX 1663 & SAX 2303). Later released with other works by Classics for Pleasure. I have the CFP LP on my shelves and it is excellent.

I think it is the other way around. The Columba 78 was labeled "Made in England" and the Philharmonia was British Columbia's house orchestra.

For instance here is the same recording issued in England as "Columbia" and in the U.S. as "Seraphim." I got it in the "Complete EMI recordings" box. EMI was formed by a merger of several US and UK companies in the 1930's, but didn't start putting the EMI trademark on record labels until 1973.

(https://img.discogs.com/O6LMa03fBd5PxfzraMBpogHgT6c=/fit-in/300x300/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(40)/discogs-images/R-3544440-1334662672.jpeg.jpg)

(https://img.discogs.com/YtHjA4nmxZs9jw2S5jBsvtYLEto=/fit-in/300x300/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(40)/discogs-images/R-9147717-1475604218-1619.jpeg.jpg)

It is all very confusing, EMI, DGG, American Columbia, RCA Victor all are to some extent the same company that kept getting split up, merging, buying itself, splitting again, etc. Every time this comes up I go down the same rabbit hole of Wikipedia pages.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 15, 2019, 12:55:34 PM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 15, 2019, 10:51:22 AM
I think it is the other way around. The Columba 78 was labeled "Made in England" and the Philharmonia was British Columbia's house orchestra.

For instance here is the same recording issued in England as "Columbia" and in the U.S. as "Seraphim." I got it in the "Complete EMI recordings" box. EMI was formed by a merger of several US and UK companies in the 1930's, but didn't start putting the EMI trademark on record labels until 1973.


It is all very confusing, EMI, DGG, American Columbia, RCA Victor all are to some extent the same company that kept getting split up, merging, buying itself, splitting again, etc. Every time this comes up I go down the same rabbit hole of Wikipedia pages.

You could very well be right, directly after posting I had doubts. I was basing the first part on John Hunt's discography "Makers of the Philharmonia". He lists Faune as follows: February 1947= 78: Columbia DX 1381. LP: Columbia (USA) RL 3055.
Le Mer: October 1950= 78: Columbia DX 1726-1728/ DX 8369-8371. LP: Columbia (USA) RL 3055.

It is most unusual that Hunt hasn't listed a UK release in what is essentially a British discography. I think you are right though. I do have a comprehensive British Columbia discography, the only drawback is many Galliera entry's without index. If I have a spare hour or two ??? I will see if I can find a UK release for the two Debussy works. This reference is more comprehensive then the Philharmonia book.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 15, 2019, 01:27:50 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 15, 2019, 12:55:34 PM
You could very well be right, directly after posting I had doubts. I was basing the first part on John Hunt's discography "Makers of the Philharmonia". He lists Faune as follows: February 1947= 78: Columbia DX 1381. LP: Columbia (USA) RL 3055.
Le Mer: October 1950= 78: Columbia DX 1726-1728/ DX 8369-8371. LP: Columbia (USA) RL 3055.

It is most unusual that Hunt hasn't listed a UK release in what is essentially a British discography. I think you are right though. I do have a comprehensive British Columbia discography, the only drawback is many Galliera entry's without index. If I have a spare hour or two ??? I will see if I can find a UK release for the two Debussy works. This reference is more comprehensive then the Philharmonia book.

The 78 rpm disc (DX 1381) is a UK release and evidently the original.

(https://img.discogs.com/DdIKA0l4c7MN2dN_-vie7scuTuA=/fit-in/600x612/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-10312369-1495132491-2490.jpeg.jpg)

It is marked "Made in England" and branded "The Columbia Gramophone Company."

The LP RL 3055 is "Columbia Records," i.e. US Columbia and is recognizable from the photo as a US pressing.

My suspicion is that for a new release a UK Columbia recording would have been cross-released in the US as Angel or Seraphim, but that the "Columbia Entre" LP you had was part of some sort of cross-licensing deal for old recordings, probably at budget price. Who knows really? I have not found anything on the web that would say what the "Entre" series from US Columbia was.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 16, 2019, 12:36:52 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 15, 2019, 01:27:50 PM
The 78 rpm disc (DX 1381) is a UK release and evidently the original.

(https://img.discogs.com/DdIKA0l4c7MN2dN_-vie7scuTuA=/fit-in/600x612/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-10312369-1495132491-2490.jpeg.jpg)

It is marked "Made in England" and branded "The Columbia Gramophone Company."

The LP RL 3055 is "Columbia Records," i.e. US Columbia and is recognizable from the photo as a US pressing.

My suspicion is that for a new release a UK Columbia recording would have been cross-released in the US as Angel or Seraphim, but that the "Columbia Entre" LP you had was part of some sort of cross-licensing deal for old recordings, probably at budget price. Who knows really? I have not found anything on the web that would say what the "Entre" series from US Columbia was.

I did see the link you posted. It was what made me think that you are right. That as to yet I have not found a UK release puzzles me.
I should have made clear my reference only deals with Columbia 33CX LP issues. This is one of those "what comes first the chicken or egg" puzzles. If UK Columbia recorded the pieces then I'm sure they would be released in the UK. I will send a message to PD to ask for the issue number of her LP. That may help.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 16, 2019, 05:17:05 AM
Since the death of Harry Pearson the TAS list does not hold quite the sway it used to. It is interesting and in some cases surprising of some of the recordings that receive that particular honour. Kudos to TAS for looking far and wide, and not just the obvious.

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/2018-tas-super-lp-list/
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 16, 2019, 06:15:23 AM
Amazing how obscure and tangled the relationships of the record labels are, even in the age of googling.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 16, 2019, 06:38:42 PM
In response to the queries and responses (thanks to all!), The Columbia Entré LP is RL 3055 and is mono and says "Made in USA" on it (the LP label itself).  The matrix numbers are:  CXLP 12738-1B for La Mer and CXLP 12739-1C for Debussy's Faune and Ravel's Intro and Allegro for Harp.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 17, 2019, 12:55:09 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 16, 2019, 06:38:42 PM
In response to the queries and responses (thanks to all!), The Columbia Entré LP is RL 3055 and is mono and says "Made in USA" on it (the LP label itself).  The matrix numbers are:  CXLP 12738-1B for La Mer and CXLP 12739-1C for Debussy's Faune and Ravel's Intro and Allegro for Harp.

PD

Many thanks, P. Senior moment on my part - not sure how I mixed Ravel's Daphnis with Intro and Allegro. :o

https://www.popsike.com/pix/20120127/120850823708.jpg

Not bad, $41! Jean Pougnet is a brilliant violinist. He made quite a few recordings for Westminster.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 17, 2019, 02:54:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 17, 2019, 12:55:09 AM
Many thanks, P. Senior moment on my part - not sure how I mixed Ravel's Daphnis with Intro and Allegro. :o

https://www.popsike.com/pix/20120127/120850823708.jpg

Not bad, $41! Jean Pougnet is a brilliant violinist. He made quite a few recordings for Westminster.

I think that you might have missed (or forgotten) the part in which I had said that it was too damaged for me and that I was sending it bye bye so to speak?  :( Can't remember where I posted it....think that I did anyway?? Early morning here.  Would love to find a good copy of it...someday. 

I do remember you mentioning Pougnet before though, so was pleased when I saw his name on there.  Forgive me for asking this, but did anyone do a decent transfer to CD of it?  Just in case another copy never comes my way!

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 17, 2019, 04:36:11 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 17, 2019, 12:55:09 AM
Many thanks, P. Senior moment on my part - not sure how I mixed Ravel's Daphnis with Intro and Allegro. :o

https://www.popsike.com/pix/20120127/120850823708.jpg

Not bad, $41! Jean Pougnet is a brilliant violinist. He made quite a few recordings for Westminster.

I love the old red-label Westminsters from the early 50s. Any thoughts on Jean Fournier--brother of Pierre, husband of Ginette Doyen?? I am looking at acquiring some of the J. Fournier-Doyen recordings-Faure and Handel Sonatas...on LP of course!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 18, 2019, 12:28:03 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 17, 2019, 04:36:11 PM
I love the old red-label Westminsters from the early 50s. Any thoughts on Jean Fournier--brother of Pierre, husband of Ginette Doyen?? I am looking at acquiring some of the J. Fournier-Doyen recordings-Faure and Handel Sonatas...on LP of course!

Doyen is difficult to find and expensive. The French piano school, of which Ginette Doyen a leading light, is highly collectable on LP. I like the series of Westminster recordings released on licence by EMI. They replicate the Westminster covers, see image below, and I note the Fournier/Doyen Fauré record shares the same style cover. I think this is where I would look.

(https://i.imgur.com/s9aUPm9.jpg)

Another French pianist, Jacqueline Eymar, is also legendary . She recorded Fauré chamber music in three volumes released in the UK by Turnabout. They are plentiful and inexpensive. A bargain!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 18, 2019, 04:31:57 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 18, 2019, 12:28:03 AM
Doyen is difficult to find and expensive. The French piano school, of which Ginette Doyen a leading light, is highly collectable on LP. I like the series of Westminster recordings released on licence by EMI. They replicate the Westminster covers, see image below, and I note the Fournier/Doyen Fauré record shares the same style cover. I think this is where I would look.

(https://i.imgur.com/s9aUPm9.jpg)

Another French pianist, Jacqueline Eymar, is also legendary . She recorded Fauré chamber music in three volumes released in the UK by Turnabout. They are plentiful and inexpensive. A bargain!

You're a fountain of knowledge Irons!   :)  Was Eymar also released on Westminster?  I'll certainly keep an extra eye out for them; I have been anyway for that label...alas, normally they aren't in very good condition. 

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 18, 2019, 07:24:37 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 18, 2019, 04:31:57 AM
You're a fountain of knowledge Irons!   :)  Was Eymar also released on Westminster?  I'll certainly keep an extra eye out for them; I have been anyway for that label...alas, normally they aren't in very good condition. 

PD

Think Vox, P. Possibly a box set. If you happen to..... do not hesitate!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 19, 2019, 12:00:49 AM

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/312243097844-0-1/s-l1000.jpg)

On a visit to a charity shop yesterday came across Janacek's Sinfonietta. I had no idea Szell had recorded the work. After a clean and brush-up, gave it a spin. The opening brass fanfare did not bode well, I found it slow and laborious with little sense of excitement . After a silent gap - every recording I have heard has the various sections joined up creating a continues whole. Szell treats sections as movements, which I found okay but a bit odd. As the main body of the work began, to say I was impressed with the precision of the Cleveland Orchestra is an understatement. They turn on a sixpence and back again with ease. By the time of the coda they were in the groove and the fanfare was far better executed then the opening. Not perfect, a couple of quibbles with a dull opening, and to borrow a phrase from London Underground "mind the gap". The recording in typical CBS fashion has a wide stereo spread and lacks depth but this approach suits the music. All that fades into insignificance with George Szell and his Cleveland Orchestra who are superb.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on February 19, 2019, 12:30:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 19, 2019, 12:00:49 AM
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/312243097844-0-1/s-l1000.jpg)

On a visit to a charity shop yesterday came across Janacek's Sinfonietta. I had no idea Szell had recorded the work. After a clean and brush-up, gave it a spin. The opening brass fanfare did not bode well, I found it slow and laborious with little sense of excitement . After a silent gap - every recording I have heard has the various sections joined up creating a continues whole. Szell treats sections as movements, which I found okay but a bit odd. As the main body of the work began, to say I was impressed with the precision of the Cleveland Orchestra is an understatement. They turn on a sixpence and back again with ease. By the time of the coda they were in the groove and the fanfare was far better executed then the opening. Not perfect, a couple of quibbles with a dull opening, and to borrow a phrase from London Underground "mind the gap". The recording in typical CBS fashion has a wide stereo spread and lacks depth but this approach suits the music. All that fades into insignificance with George Szell and his Cleveland Orchestra who are superb.

Interesting, I didn't know Szell had recorded the Sinfonietta. The first recording of the Sinfonietta I bought was from Abbado and the LSO and it has the same Hindemith coupling, I still have the LP though I haven't listened to it for years. Abbado also gets off to a ponderous start and for years I wasn't aware of it as it was the only version I owned.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 19, 2019, 06:14:08 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 14, 2019, 09:03:54 PM
An interesting find. Thanks for sharing. The 10" format did not seem to last for long--late 40s-mid 50s. Interestingly, due to nostalgia (or something), I see many new LPs on the 10" format...

If you like jazz and vinyl, you must, must, must get this two LP set...Heaven.

(https://img.discogs.com/1x09IMZAT36jKNly7vkAL5-0MKw=/fit-in/500x500/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7872093-1460987772-1345.jpeg.jpg)

https://www.discogs.com/Chet-Baker-Bill-Evans-The-Complete-Recordings/release/7872093

Apologies for the delay in responding to you.  I had been meaning to thank you for you Bill Evans/Chet Baker recommendation.  When I went to a local record store the other day, I inquired about it.  The sales person who looked it up was surprised to hear about it as it was new to him and he said that he was a big Bill Evans fan!  It seems that it's available on both CD and vinyl with, of course, more tracks on the CD issue.  Tempting!   :)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 19, 2019, 07:37:10 AM
Quote from: Biffo on February 19, 2019, 12:30:28 AM
Interesting, I didn't know Szell had recorded the Sinfonietta. The first recording of the Sinfonietta I bought was from Abbado and the LSO and it has the same Hindemith coupling, I still have the LP though I haven't listened to it for years. Abbado also gets off to a ponderous start and for years I wasn't aware of it as it was the only version I owned.

I like the recordings Abbado made for Decca with the LSO. Prokofiev's Romeo and Juliet is outstanding and Mendelssohn "Scottish" Symphony is excellent, but I dislike Abbado's Sinfonietta with a passion despite the fact it was top choice in the 1975 Penguin Guide. I owned a wide band copy of which I was delighted to find a buyer for. Ancerl with the Czech Philharmonic is the benchmark for Sinfonietta, the work is part of the conductor and orchestra's DNA. I also have Kubelik on DG which I have not warmed to without working out why.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 19, 2019, 12:15:33 PM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 16, 2019, 06:15:23 AM
Amazing how obscure and tangled the relationships of the record labels are, even in the age of googling.

I used to know a lot more about the histories of the different labels, but it has been years since I cared to research that info--I have less use for that info these days. Some of if is actually quite interesting. In my early days of collecting (early 90s) I had one or two "mentors" in the record collecting world, both of whom had enormous collections and were extremely knowledgeable. One book I found very helpful and intersting is The Fabulous Phonograph by Roland Gelatt: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/5094978-the-fabulous-phonograph-1877-1977

I have the paperback: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/15096330-the-fabulous-phonograph-1877-1977
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2019, 10:39:34 AM
Quote from: Biffo on February 19, 2019, 12:30:28 AM
Interesting, I didn't know Szell had recorded the Sinfonietta. The first recording of the Sinfonietta I bought was from Abbado and the LSO and it has the same Hindemith coupling, I still have the LP though I haven't listened to it for years. Abbado also gets off to a ponderous start and for years I wasn't aware of it as it was the only version I owned.

Biffo,

Have you heard Ancerl's recording before (on Supraphon)?  I have it on CD (part of their 'Gold Edition' series)...wonderful!  I remember the first time that I heard it...not certain of the year, but it was on the BBC Proms...trying to remember who conducted it?  I tried for several years to see if I could find a release of it, but no luck.  Think that my jaw must have hit the floor; I had never heard it before, but wow!  Ah, found it--it was with Boulez in 2008 (see Prom 40) here:  http://www.bbc.co.uk/proms/archive/search/performers/3bce590b-479f-42ca-b9e0-82883e0db9a2/3
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2019, 10:41:41 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 19, 2019, 12:00:49 AM
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/312243097844-0-1/s-l1000.jpg)

On a visit to a charity shop yesterday came across Janacek's Sinfonietta. I had no idea Szell had recorded the work. After a clean and brush-up, gave it a spin. The opening brass fanfare did not bode well, I found it slow and laborious with little sense of excitement . After a silent gap - every recording I have heard has the various sections joined up creating a continues whole. Szell treats sections as movements, which I found okay but a bit odd. As the main body of the work began, to say I was impressed with the precision of the Cleveland Orchestra is an understatement. They turn on a sixpence and back again with ease. By the time of the coda they were in the groove and the fanfare was far better executed then the opening. Not perfect, a couple of quibbles with a dull opening, and to borrow a phrase from London Underground "mind the gap". The recording in typical CBS fashion has a wide stereo spread and lacks depth but this approach suits the music. All that fades into insignificance with George Szell and his Cleveland Orchestra who are superb.
Thank you very much for your review Irons!  I haven't heard this recording either.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2019, 10:42:35 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 19, 2019, 12:15:33 PM
I used to know a lot more about the histories of the different labels, but it has been years since I cared to research that info--I have less use for that info these days. Some of if is actually quite interesting. In my early days of collecting (early 90s) I had one or two "mentors" in the record collecting world, both of whom had enormous collections and were extremely knowledgeable. One book I found very helpful and intersting is The Fabulous Phonograph by Roland Gelatt: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/5094978-the-fabulous-phonograph-1877-1977

I have the paperback: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/15096330-the-fabulous-phonograph-1877-1977

Thank you for bringing up this book.  I'll put it on my wish list and keep an eye out for it.   :)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2019, 10:50:18 AM
I was doing some filing (and rearranging--yet again!  ::)) of my record collection and ran across an LP that I forgot that I had purchased.  Hopefully, I'll listen to at least some of it this afternoon.  Sheesh!  I just looked at the prices they're asking for it on Discogs!

(https://img.discogs.com/C1pizsZGR2klz3vG6Qo770mV3QU=/fit-in/580x577/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7520975-1457974124-8760.png.jpg)

The thing that caught my eye:  I hadn't realized that Serge Koussevitzky was also a composer.  Reading about him (liner notes), I see that he was an accomplished double bass player (virtuoso according to Denis Townsley who wrote the liner notes).  Looking forward to listening to his works in particular.   :)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on February 20, 2019, 10:51:57 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2019, 10:41:41 AM
Thank you very much for your review Irons!  I haven't heard this recording either.

PD

I have it!

[asin]B079VD2YRP[/asin]

Sarge recommends it highly. I haven't gotten to it yet.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 20, 2019, 06:14:09 PM
Szell is great--probably my favorite Brahms symphonies, although the Columbia LPs from that era (esp the 'six eyes') suffered from excessive high-midrange and tape hiss. I would think the Sony reissues have cleared some of that up.

As for Koussevitsky, I have an old RCA LCT ("Long-playing Classical Treasury" LP reissues of 78 rpm recordings) of him playing the double bass and conducting Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet on the other side. 

EDIT:

Just picked up the Bach Sonatas and Partitas played by Oscar Shumsky on eBay:

(https://img.discogs.com/vll79xmruz9fG3fX_vWWJWb1ink=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-9576315-1483032721-7587.jpeg.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 20, 2019, 11:47:52 PM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 20, 2019, 06:14:09 PM


EDIT:

Just picked up the Bach Sonatas and Partitas played by Oscar Shumsky on eBay:

(https://img.discogs.com/vll79xmruz9fG3fX_vWWJWb1ink=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-9576315-1483032721-7587.jpeg.jpg)

Aligreto - trust he is OK, miss his contributions - featured that recording quite recently. I am fairly sure it was on ASV.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 21, 2019, 12:09:56 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2019, 10:50:18 AM
I was doing some filing (and rearranging--yet again!  ::)) of my record collection and ran across an LP that I forgot that I had purchased.  Hopefully, I'll listen to at least some of it this afternoon.  Sheesh!  I just looked at the prices they're asking for it on Discogs!

(https://img.discogs.com/C1pizsZGR2klz3vG6Qo770mV3QU=/fit-in/580x577/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7520975-1457974124-8760.png.jpg)

The thing that caught my eye:  I hadn't realized that Serge Koussevitzky was also a composer.  Reading about him (liner notes), I see that he was an accomplished double bass player (virtuoso according to Denis Townsley who wrote the liner notes).  Looking forward to listening to his works in particular.   :)

The Eccles is interesting too, P. His name does not turn up very often!

Perhaps Russian conductors have an urge to compose double bass concertos. Another famous conductor, Kostantin Ivanov composed the two on this recording. It took a couple of listens before the penny dropped I wasn't listening to a cello! Is the soloist in your recording Russian?

(https://i.imgur.com/HyGrkYo.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 21, 2019, 12:53:18 AM
I very rarely buy LPs especially as I don't currently own a functioning record deck. However this really intrigued me, featuring two of my favourite symphonies, and I've snapped it up:
(//)
Maybe I'll see if I can play it on the microwave turntable.
::)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 21, 2019, 03:38:58 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 20, 2019, 06:14:09 PM
Szell is great--probably my favorite Brahms symphonies, although the Columbia LPs from that era (esp the 'six eyes') suffered from excessive high-midrange and tape hiss. I would think the Sony reissues have cleared some of that up.

As for Koussevitsky, I have an old RCA LCT ("Long-playing Classical Treasury" LP reissues of 78 rpm recordings) of him playing the double bass and conducting Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet on the other side. 

EDIT:

Just picked up the Bach Sonatas and Partitas played by Oscar Shumsky on eBay:

(https://img.discogs.com/vll79xmruz9fG3fX_vWWJWb1ink=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-9576315-1483032721-7587.jpeg.jpg)
Oh, nice!  Will be interested in seeing how you find Szell's Janacek.  The name of Shumsky rings a bell...vaguely...don't know anything about him however.  I listened to the concerto by him last night...enjoyable.  Will have to give it another go maybe today.  The performer (according to some googling) was/is Romanian.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 21, 2019, 03:41:51 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 21, 2019, 12:53:18 AM
I very rarely buy LPs especially as I don't currently own a functioning record deck. However this really intrigued me, featuring two of my favourite symphonies, and I've snapped it up:
(//)
Maybe I'll see if I can play it on the microwave turntable.
::)
Perhaps your daughter will lend you 'hers'?   ;)  Or now a good excuse to go out and buy a new one?

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 22, 2019, 07:13:33 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 21, 2019, 03:41:51 AM
Perhaps your daughter will lend you 'hers'?   ;)  Or now a good excuse to go out and buy a new one?

Best,

PD
Definitely!
Thanks.
:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 24, 2019, 12:17:00 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/YX7z2g0.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/YELsuWq.jpg)

Reiner conducting the Vienna Philharminic in their prime is one of the wonders of the time machine of recorded music. The LSO of the period were no slouch either. I cannot pretend to have heard a long list of DSCH 1st, but Martinon is so good I don't feel I need to. Although stereo is available for both recordings, from this vintage I prefer mono. I have a stereo facsimile of Shostakovich from "Classic Records" but never play that LP. Two very good examples from the superb RCA catalogue of the era.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on February 24, 2019, 05:40:22 PM
Today's LP digitization (FLACulence):

Edith Peinemann playing Dvorak and Ravel--another one I've had sitting around unheard for a couple decades. Wonderful performance and sound quality!

(https://img.discogs.com/ILP5DTOeBLQK2d8_PWUc0OhoEi4=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-1925550-1397556954-7973.jpeg.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: JBS on February 24, 2019, 05:49:04 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 24, 2019, 12:17:00 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/YX7z2g0.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/YELsuWq.jpg)

Reiner conducting the Vienna Philharminic in their prime is one of the wonders of the time machine of recorded music. The LSO of the period were no slouch either. I cannot pretend to have heard a long list of DSCH 1st, but Martinon is so good I don't feel I need to. Although stereo is available for both recordings, from this vintage I prefer mono. I have a stereo facsimile of Shostakovich from "Classic Records" but never play that LP. Two very good examples from the superb RCA catalogue of the era.

Interesting cover art on those two.  Death and Transfiguration gets barely a nod on the Strauss LP....while the DSCH cover reflects the plotline (such as it is) of Age of Gold rather well (heroic Soviet soccer team becomes target of capitalist villiany when it plays a tournament un the decadent West).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: PerfectWagnerite on February 24, 2019, 06:22:16 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 19, 2019, 07:37:10 AM
I like the recordings Abbado made for Decca with the LSO. Prokofiev's Romeo and Juliet is outstanding and Mendelssohn "Scottish" Symphony is excellent, but I dislike Abbado's Sinfonietta with a passion despite the fact it was top choice in the 1975 Penguin Guide. I owned a wide band copy of which I was delighted to find a buyer for. Ancerl with the Czech Philharmonic is the benchmark for Sinfonietta, the work is part of the conductor and orchestra's DNA. I also have Kubelik on DG which I have not warmed to without working out why.
There are many wonderful recordings of this work but for me Ancerl just hits a gram slam with this one. Just unbelievable playing from the Czech brass and so vividly recorded you almost cannot believe the age of the recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: JBS on February 24, 2019, 06:31:57 PM
Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on February 24, 2019, 06:22:16 PM
There are many wonderful recordings of this work but for me Ancerl just hits a gram slam with this one. Just unbelievable playing from the Czech brass and so vividly recorded you almost cannot believe the age of the recording.

Is this it? If so I agree wholeheartedly.
[asin]B00008UEF7[/asin]
Although I have it only on CD, and got it for the Martinu, not the Janacek
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: PerfectWagnerite on February 25, 2019, 05:02:50 AM
Quote from: JBS on February 24, 2019, 06:31:57 PM
Is this it? If so I agree wholeheartedly.
[asin]B00008UEF7[/asin]
Although I have it only on CD, and got it for the Martinu, not the Janacek
Yes that is the one. Ancerl is usually more restrained in his readings but here he just lets it rip.

I am surprised that a few fellow GMG'ers have not heard the Szell recording. I don't think the cd is all that rare. You mean you have not heard the LP version?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 26, 2019, 06:43:54 AM
(https://images.eil.com/large_image/MORTON_GOULD_FALL%2BRIVER%2BLEGEND%2BBALLET%2BSUITE%2B%26%2BSPIRITUALS-540316.jpg) (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/aggAAOSwB4BaKBl2/s-l300.jpg)

Mercury is not a one size fits all label but the recorded legacy would be all the poorer without the brilliance of C. R. Fine and his team. From day one Mercury was an audiophile label, the only one I have encountered which divulges microphone make, type and placement. "Living Presence" is not a slogan but an accurate description of the presentation of recordings by them, the listener feels he or she can reach out and touch the performers. The downside - there has to be one, as every other label would go down the same route -  Mercury recordings are dry and can be boxy. This presentation would not suit Beethoven and Brahms for example, but for 20th century dynamic music, I love Mercury.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on February 26, 2019, 07:03:06 AM
Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on February 25, 2019, 05:02:50 AM
Yes that is the one. Ancerl is usually more restrained in his readings but here he just lets it rip.

I am surprised that a few fellow GMG'ers have not heard the Szell recording. I don't think the cd is all that rare. You mean you have not heard the LP version?

I have Abbado, Ancerl, Kubelik (x2), Rattle, Mackerras, Belohlavek (x2), Gardiner, Netopil and Neumann but not Szell, never even knew it existed until these recent postings.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 27, 2019, 08:04:45 AM
The main difference between a collector of CDs and LPs is that the former chooses his/her additions and the latter the additions chooses the collector. I do enjoy the lucky-dip element of which treasure is going to turn up next, but it is a haphazard way of building a collection of music. A typical motley crew purchase today from the good people at Classical Exchange.

Haydn: String Quartets Op.76 No.2 & No.5. The Hungarian SQ.

Haydn: String Quartets Op.76 No.5 & No.6. Amadeus SQ.

Bartok/Prokofiev: Piano Concerto No.1 & No.4. Rudolf Serkin, Ormandy and The Philadelphia.

Dvorak/Suk: String Serenades. Vlach, Czech Chamber Orchestra.

Anton Rubinstein: 5th Symphony. Zverev USSR Radio Orchestra.

Prokofiev: 1st & 7th Symphonies. Weller and LSO.

Prokofiev: The Prodigal Son. Rozhdestvensky MRSO.

Rimsky/Glazounov: "Antar" Symphony & Scénes de Ballet. Ivanov/Rozhdestvensky, MRSO.

Beethoven" Diabelli Variations. Stephen Bishop.

Kodaly: Galanta/Marosszék/Concerto for Orchestra/Theatre Overture. Dorati with PH.

Kodaly: Peacock Variations/Ballet-Music/Summer Evening/ Rondo. Dorati with PH.

Gabrial Pierné: Images/Paysages/Les Cathédrales. Dervaux with Orchestre Philharmonique des Pays de Loire.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 05, 2019, 07:07:18 AM
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61Ff8SqQlpL._SL1024_.jpg)

I picked this up mainly because the cheesy cover perversely appealed. Cleaned, filed away and promptly forgot all about it. After at least six months I got around to actually playing, and repeated the experience many times since as it is very good! The 3 movements from "Mother Goose" are exquisitely played by Smith and Sellick. Debussy is superb, this pair have a real feel for the French pianistic idiom. Brahms is another world, but they are great here too. Excellent!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 08, 2019, 07:01:59 AM
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51LYn1rc7ZL._SX466_.jpg) (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51uYujF8qYL.jpg)

LP cover art is a subject in itself. A heavy tome published in 2008 "Classique Cover Art for Classical Music" features 777 covers from a LP collection owned by a certain Dr. Horst Scerg Sandhausen.
I have zero knowledge of modern art but that is no barrier in appreciation. I like the covers put out by Supraphon. Some are in-house but others by Czech artists.
The one on the left "Musical Stil-Life" (1928) is by Emil Filla and the other, "Fugue in Two Colours" (1920)  by Frantisek Kupka. Both are housed in the National Gallery, Prague.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 14, 2019, 08:19:03 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 27, 2019, 08:04:45 AM
The main difference between a collector of CDs and LPs is that the former chooses his/her additions and the latter the additions chooses the collector. I do enjoy the lucky-dip element of which treasure is going to turn up next, but it is a haphazard way of building a collection of music. A typical motley crew purchase today from the good people at Classical Exchange.

Haydn: String Quartets Op.76 No.2 & No.5. The Hungarian SQ.

Haydn: String Quartets Op.76 No.5 & No.6. Amadeus SQ.

Bartok/Prokofiev: Piano Concerto No.1 & No.4. Rudolf Serkin, Ormandy and The Philadelphia.

Dvorak/Suk: String Serenades. Vlach, Czech Chamber Orchestra.

Anton Rubinstein: 5th Symphony. Zverev USSR Radio Orchestra.

Prokofiev: 1st & 7th Symphonies. Weller and LSO.

Prokofiev: The Prodigal Son. Rozhdestvensky MRSO.

Rimsky/Glazounov: "Antar" Symphony & Scénes de Ballet. Ivanov/Rozhdestvensky, MRSO.

Beethoven" Diabelli Variations. Stephen Bishop.

Kodaly: Galanta/Marosszék/Concerto for Orchestra/Theatre Overture. Dorati with PH.

Kodaly: Peacock Variations/Ballet-Music/Summer Evening/ Rondo. Dorati with PH.

Gabrial Pierné: Images/Paysages/Les Cathédrales. Dervaux with Orchestre Philharmonique des Pays de Loire.
Quite a nice haul there Irons!   :)

I thought about your comments regarding the differences in terms of CD vs. LP collectors and at first I agreed, but then I thought about it some more and didn't agree quite so much.  I haven't been buying new CDs as much lately--more relying on chance luck whilst digging through used CDs (either at a real record/CD store or at charity shops).  I'll add my 'new' (used) ones to the list of recent acquisitions when I get a chance.

Regarding LPs, I ran across a LP of Fournier playing I believe Nos. 5 & 6 of Bach's Suites for Solo Cello in great shape at a record store whilst browsing with a friend.  I balked at the price though on it partly as I wasn't in the best of moods (thinking that I had lost several things).  My friend, feeling badly for me, went back the next day and bought it for me and surprised me with it the next time that we got together!  And in the end, I was able to locate the items that I had lost.   :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 14, 2019, 08:20:51 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 08, 2019, 07:01:59 AM
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51LYn1rc7ZL._SX466_.jpg) (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51uYujF8qYL.jpg)

LP cover art is a subject in itself. A heavy tome published in 2008 "Classique Cover Art for Classical Music" features 777 covers from a LP collection owned by a certain Dr. Horst Scerg Sandhausen.
I have zero knowledge of modern art but that is no barrier in appreciation. I like the covers put out by Supraphon. Some are in-house but others by Czech artists.
The one on the left "Musical Stil-Life" (1928) is by Emil Filla and the other, "Fugue in Two Colours" (1920)  by Frantisek Kupka. Both are housed in the National Gallery, Prague.

And yet more great finds for you!  Envious of the Gertler finds; were you able to get them for a decent price Irons?

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 15, 2019, 12:14:45 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 14, 2019, 08:19:03 AM
Quite a nice haul there Irons!   :)

I thought about your comments regarding the differences in terms of CD vs. LP collectors and at first I agreed, but then I thought about it some more and didn't agree quite so much.  I haven't been buying new CDs as much lately--more relying on chance luck whilst digging through used CDs (either at a real record/CD store or at charity shops).  I'll add my 'new' (used) ones to the list of recent acquisitions when I get a chance.

Regarding LPs, I ran across a LP of Fournier playing I believe Nos. 5 & 6 of Bach's Suites for Solo Cello in great shape at a record store whilst browsing with a friend.  I balked at the price though on it partly as I wasn't in the best of moods (thinking that I had lost several things).  My friend, feeling badly for me, went back the next day and bought it for me and surprised me with it the next time that we got together!  And in the end, I was able to locate the items that I had lost.   :)



That is what you call a friend, P. :) After reading your post I played 5. I do like the Milos Sadlo set but without doubt Fournier is the top recommendation available on LP. A gentle hint would not be amiss for Vol. 1&2. ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 15, 2019, 06:18:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 15, 2019, 12:14:45 AM
That is what you call a friend, P. :) After reading your post I played 5. I do like the Milos Sadlo set but without doubt Fournier is the top recommendation available on LP. A gentle hint would not be amiss for Vol. 1&2. ;)
I'll keep that in mind!   ;D ;)

By the way,  do you (or anyone else here who reads this) know how to quote multiple people in making a reply?  I haven't been able to figure that one out...  ::)

PD

p.s.  The store that had the record was asking $20 for that LP (which seemed quite pricey to me).  Have you seen any copies of any of those LPs for less Irons?  I found this on e-Bay (It's the same edition that he purchased for me but Nos. 1 & 2).  https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bach-Pierre-Fournier-Suites-for-Solo-Cello-1-2-Archiv-198-186-LP-/173835011173
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on March 15, 2019, 06:39:38 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 15, 2019, 06:18:22 AM
I'll keep that in mind!   ;D ;)

By the way,  do you (or anyone else here who reads this) know how to quote multiple people in making a reply?  I haven't been able to figure that one out...  ::)

PD

When you've started a post you will see that you are at the top of a page where previous posts are arrayed below. Each has an "Insert Quote" link, which inserts a quote wherever your cursor happens to be.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 15, 2019, 07:20:46 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on March 15, 2019, 06:39:38 AM
When you've started a post you will see that you are at the top of a page where previous posts are arrayed below. Each has an "Insert Quote" link, which inserts a quote wherever your cursor happens to be.
Hmmm.....(giving it a try)....like this?

Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 15, 2019, 06:18:22 AM

By the way,  do you (or anyone else here who reads this) know how to quote multiple people in making a reply?  I haven't been able to figure that one out...  ::)

PD



EDIT:  Hey, it worked!  Thank you Ghost!   :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 15, 2019, 07:33:05 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 15, 2019, 06:18:22 AM


p.s.  The store that had the record was asking $20 for that LP (which seemed quite pricey to me).  Have you seen any copies of any of those LPs for less Irons?  I found this on e-Bay (It's the same edition that he purchased for me but Nos. 1 & 2).  https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bach-Pierre-Fournier-Suites-for-Solo-Cello-1-2-Archiv-198-186-LP-/173835011173

That is about right. Solo string Bach has a premium - if the artist is female, a further premium! The Archive cream covers in stereo sell for silly money  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PIERRE-FOURNIER-BACH-Cello-suites-N-1-4-ARCHIV-RED-TAG-GERMANY-2LP-ORG-press/163576172364?hash=item2615e64f4c:g:wRgAAOSw5cJaoEcD I prefer your issue, as extremely difficult to remove LP from the cream cover without tearing and/or leaving finger marks on the record groove.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 15, 2019, 10:02:10 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 15, 2019, 07:33:05 AM
That is about right. Solo string Bach has a premium - if the artist is female, a further premium! The Archive cream covers in stereo sell for silly money  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PIERRE-FOURNIER-BACH-Cello-suites-N-1-4-ARCHIV-RED-TAG-GERMANY-2LP-ORG-press/163576172364?hash=item2615e64f4c:g:wRgAAOSw5cJaoEcD I prefer your issue, as extremely difficult to remove LP from the cream cover without tearing and/or leaving finger marks on the record groove.
Boy, well, then it might take me a while to acquire the other two then.   :(  I will take a good look through that record shop next time I go back there (which could be in the very near future)....perhaps they purchased them from the same person but hadn't yet gotten around to putting them out?  One can hope anyway.  I double-checked through my CDs, but alas, I don't have the Bach recordings of Fournier.  I do have two sets:  that EMI Icon set and also DG's The Originals of his recordings...plus a few single CDs too.  I know that I have at least one other LP with Fournier (on DG)...trying to remember what was on that album.  If I'm recalling correctly, the LP was in good shape; the cover, lousy.

Which female cellists' recordings do you particularly enjoy (re Bach) Irons?

Oooh!  No more music listening to me for a bit; Roger is about ready to step onto the court (vs. a 22 year-old and talented Hungarian tennis player at Indian Wells in the quarters)!   ;D

Best,

PD

EDIT:  My goof; the other player is from Poland!   :-[

EDIT 2:  I see that DG reissued the LPs in 2017 (probably sold out.  I see that they're listed as being on back order on Arkivmusic's website though).  https://www.deutschegrammophon.com/us/cat/4796963
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 15, 2019, 02:41:34 PM
Had an enjoyable day out yesterday. Spent 1.5 hrs cleaning 15 LPs at my audio dealer, followed by lunch. My usual place, which has Ayinger Doppelbock on tap, along with delicious waffles, served until 4PM (you won't see me out of bed before 10) are locally famous. However, the place was closed yesterday due to some nearby construction. Hence, I made it to our local Italian place for a pescatore with tomato base, pinot noir, and dark chocolate/sea salt dessert with cappucino.

Highlights of the classical LPs

- Albert Spalding plays Tartini sonatas on Remington
- Alfred Cortot plays Chopin etudes on Pathé
- Herman Abendroth conducts Tchaikovsky Symphony No 4 on Urania
- Oscar Shumsky plays Bach Sonatas and Partitas on MHS 3 LP (recent eBay find)
- Hollywood SQ plays quartets by Smetana ("From my life") and Glazunov Novelettes
- Paul Paray conducts Mendelssohn Reformation Symphony etc., on Mercury Living Presence Stereo

That, plus a few others and a bunch of jazz will keep me busy for another few months (FLAC one a week)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 16, 2019, 01:43:35 AM
PD, I cannot think of female cellists playing Bach but there are some fine specialist Bach pianists, including Tatiana Nikolaeva and Rosalyn Tureck. But I did say string players so my vote would go to the delectable Johanna Martzy. I see her recording of Bach is sold out and I very much doubt there will be a re-press so my kids may make a few bob out of that one day. ::)

(http://www.coupdarchet.com/images/com_hikashop/upload/19007b.jpg) (https://img.discogs.com/0ZewNJ82wRgzC_n5o1-_ErQtKss=/fit-in/600x609/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-6499446-1445618933-4310.jpeg.jpg)

Her recordings are extremely rare for the simple reason she didn't make many. There is a "me too" reason why, a fascinating but tragic story (if true).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on March 16, 2019, 07:16:25 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 16, 2019, 01:43:35 AM
PD, I cannot think of female cellists playing Bach but there are some fine specialist Bach pianists, including Tatiana Nikolaeva and Rosalyn Tureck. But I did say string players so my vote would go to the delectable Johanna Martzy. I see her recording of Bach is sold out and I very much doubt there will be a re-press so my kids may make a few bob out of that one day. ::)

There are very many female cellists who play Bach, and do it splendidly.

Martzy's Bach S&P are not sold out. They are f.i. contained in this box, but of course it is CD:

https://www.amazon.fr/Bach-Sonates-Partitas-violoncelle-Coffret/dp/B000V1Z0CG/ref=sr_1_10?__mk_fr_FR=%C3%85M%C3%85%C5%BD%C3%95%C3%91&keywords=johanna+martzy+bach&qid=1552749137&s=music&sr=1-10
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 17, 2019, 01:42:08 AM
Quote from: (: premont :) on March 16, 2019, 07:16:25 AM
There are very many female cellists who play Bach, and do it splendidly.

Martzy's Bach S&P are not sold out. They are f.i. contained in this box, but of course it is CD:

https://www.amazon.fr/Bach-Sonates-Partitas-violoncelle-Coffret/dp/B000V1Z0CG/ref=sr_1_10?__mk_fr_FR=%C3%85M%C3%85%C5%BD%C3%95%C3%91&keywords=johanna+martzy+bach&qid=1552749137&s=music&sr=1-10

I'm sure there are.

Thirty three and a third.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 21, 2019, 01:37:38 AM
Michael Fremer, a contributor to "Stereophile",  is well known in the vinyl world. Talks with authority on all things LP, particularly on what it is played on. I would think he would be the first to admit that his knowledge of classical music is not great but should that bar him from talking about the subject? His YT talk on the best Beethoven set of symphonies has caused quiet a stir on a vinyl based forum. One side of the argument most vitriol in their view that he should not give a lecture on a subject he knows nothing about. The other is that is being elitist, why not chip in even if you are not an "expert". To be fair to Fremer he does not pretend to be one.
My own view is listening to Fremer I'm not going to learn anything about Beethoven but am entertained. So fine, talk away. It made me feel slightly queasy that he was mocked for not pronouncing names such as "Rubinstein" correctly. That lost the argument for me.

https://youtu.be/0V82SMCcuPU
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2019, 06:05:30 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 15, 2019, 02:41:34 PM
Had an enjoyable day out yesterday. Spent 1.5 hrs cleaning 15 LPs at my audio dealer, followed by lunch. My usual place, which has Ayinger Doppelbock on tap, along with delicious waffles, served until 4PM (you won't see me out of bed before 10) are locally famous. However, the place was closed yesterday due to some nearby construction. Hence, I made it to our local Italian place for a pescatore with tomato base, pinot noir, and dark chocolate/sea salt dessert with cappucino.

Highlights of the classical LPs

- Albert Spalding plays Tartini sonatas on Remington
- Alfred Cortot plays Chopin etudes on Pathé
- Herman Abendroth conducts Tchaikovsky Symphony No 4 on Urania
- Oscar Shumsky plays Bach Sonatas and Partitas on MHS 3 LP (recent eBay find)
- Hollywood SQ plays quartets by Smetana ("From my life") and Glazunov Novelettes
- Paul Paray conducts Mendelssohn Reformation Symphony etc., on Mercury Living Presence Stereo

That, plus a few others and a bunch of jazz will keep me busy for another few months (FLAC one a week)

Both your meal and your LPs sound lovely!  Are the albums new to you or are those some of the ones that you cleaned and are now listening to?  By the way, what kind of record cleaning machine does your dealer have?

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Sergeant Rock on March 22, 2019, 07:17:24 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 21, 2019, 01:37:38 AMHis YT talk on the best Beethoven set of symphonies has caused quiet a stir on a vinyl based forum[...]
My own view is listening to Fremer I'm not going to learn anything about Beethoven but am entertained.... https://youtu.be/0V82SMCcuPU

I was entertained too. Thanks for the link. Interestingly, his first two recommendations (Karajan and Bernstein) are box sets I too own.

Sarge
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 22, 2019, 07:57:33 AM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on March 22, 2019, 07:17:24 AM
I was entertained too. Thanks for the link. Interestingly, his first two recommendations (Karajan and Bernstein) are box sets I too own.

Sarge

I laughed at his description of a German and English interpretation of a Beethoven symphony.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 22, 2019, 09:04:42 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2019, 06:05:30 AM
Both your meal and your LPs sound lovely!  Are the albums new to you or are those some of the ones that you cleaned and are now listening to?  By the way, what kind of record cleaning machine does your dealer have?

Best wishes,

PD

Hello PD,

Every few months or so I take 12-15 LPs to my dealer to clean--at a rate of one digitization a week, it works out well for me. I'll just go ahead and give them a little plug here (I have zero financial interest in their business). Their owner is the son of the late Brooks Berdan, known as one of the best turntable guys in the world. I bought several pieces from Brooks, including my Oracle, back in the 1990s. https://audio-element.com

A couple years ago, I had them tune the suspension on my Oracle Delphi, install a new cartridge and overhaul my Audible Illusions tube pre-amp with all new tubes. They also have a deal whereby, if you buy cleaning fluid, you can come in and use the machines any time you want. Nice deal. It's also good business, as it keeps people coming back in. I flat out do not need any more equipment now, but every time I visit, I try to buy something, even if it's just an LP.

Anyway, they have a few machines. I have used the Keith Monks machine a few times before, but now I prefer the ClearAudio (don't know the model). Both retail for about $6000, which is waaaaaaaaaay more than I'd ever pay for something like this. Nevertheless, it is great to be able to use them for free. If I had to buy a machine, I'd just go for the basic VPI--absolutely bullet-proof and very functional at about a tenth of the price. There really is no need for such a deluxe maching unless you're cleaning thousands of records a year--or you are filthy rich with money to burn.

ANyway, every time I visit, my records I'm cleaning are a combination of about half new ones I've bought in local shops or online, and half old ones I've had sitting on my shelves, sadly neglected for 2+ decades! Nice to dust them off for a listen!

The neighborhood there is very nice as well, with lots of good restaurants and some very interesting architecture and museums. (Norton Simon, one of the BEST art museums in the world!)

Do you have access to a cleaning machine? Any interesting new finds?  :)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 07, 2019, 06:08:09 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 22, 2019, 09:04:42 PM
Hello PD,

Do you have access to a cleaning machine? Any interesting new finds?  :)

Hello,

Apologies for the long delay in replying.

Sounds like a neat shop!  Really nice that you can clean your LPs there--and using such nice RCMs too.  A few years ago, I purchased an Okki Nokki.  https://www.okkinokki.com  If you scroll down the page, you'll see a photo of two metal RCMs; I have the black one.  Reminds me that I need to contact my guy at the audio store to order some new pads for the brushes.  I just have the arm that is designed to clean 33 1/3 LPs.  They also make ones designed to clean different sized records too.  Works pretty nicely.   :)

Yesterday I went with a friend to a record store and purchased a few LPs.  This is what I came back with:

A Chandos LP of Rachmaninov's Sonata for Cello and Piano Op. 19 and Myaskovsky's Sonata No. 2 for Cello and Piano Op. 81 with Yuli Turovsky and Luba Edlina

A Virgin Classics LP of Finzi's Dies Natalis, Clarinet Concerto and Farewell to Arms with Martyn Hill, Michael Collins, City of London Sinfonia with Richard Hickox

On Supraphon - Janacek's String Quartets with the Smetana Quartet

Linda Ronstadt's "Simple Dreams"

And, lastly, The Eurythmic's "Be Yourself Tonight"

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 17, 2019, 12:34:53 AM
CRD is a fairly recent discovery. Leaving the core repertoire to the majors and concentrating on instrumental and chamber I am most impressed by this label. Through the 1970's in analogue, the production values are first class (all sleeves gatefold). Mostly recorded in churches scattered around the London area all I have so far collected are by Bob Auger as sound engineer. As often the case in both the Britten and Fauré below I already own recordings made by main-stream labels but prefer for both sound and performance the same work from CRD. My focus is analogue, so although I understand they are currently in business I cannot comment how CRD perform today. 

(https://plade-klassikeren.dk/78410-large_default/faure-cello-sonatas-nos-1-2-thomas-igloi-clifford-benson-1-lp-crd.jpg) (https://img.discogs.com/iTKnJqxNkkfJIHCEP1vIF67PK_U=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7087216-1433419729-6220.jpeg.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 17, 2019, 03:37:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 17, 2019, 12:34:53 AM
CRD is a fairly recent discovery. Leaving the core repertoire to the majors and concentrating on instrumental and chamber I am most impressed by this label. Through the 1970's in analogue, the production values are first class (all sleeves gatefold). Mostly recorded in churches scattered around the London area all I have so far collected are by Bob Auger as sound engineer. As often the case in both the Britten and Fauré below I already own recordings made by main-stream labels but prefer for both sound and performance the same work from CRD. My focus is analogue, so although I understand they are currently in business I cannot comment how CRD perform today. 

(https://plade-klassikeren.dk/78410-large_default/faure-cello-sonatas-nos-1-2-thomas-igloi-clifford-benson-1-lp-crd.jpg) (https://img.discogs.com/iTKnJqxNkkfJIHCEP1vIF67PK_U=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7087216-1433419729-6220.jpeg.jpg)

Hi Irons,

I believe that I have one or two of CRD's CDs (will have a go through them later) but don't recall having any of their LPs.  Will certainly keep an eye out for the LPs!  Any duds?  Or particular favorites that you've run across?

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 17, 2019, 06:36:14 AM
Hello, P. Where have you been hiding!

In a flurry of excitement I purchased in one go four LPs which are a part of the complete piano music of Granados by Thomas Rajna on CRD. I normally love Spanish music but for some reason this set (or music) does not work for me.

I recall you are an admirer of The Nash Ensemble so this would be perfect for you. The Trio is my favourite Fauré work.

(http://assets.rootsvinylguide.com/pictures/1982-uk-nrm-crd-1089-stereo-faure-la-bonne-chanson-trio-in-d-minor-the-nash-ens_44267331)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 17, 2019, 10:38:55 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 17, 2019, 12:34:53 AM
CRD is a fairly recent discovery. Leaving the core repertoire to the majors and concentrating on instrumental and chamber I am most impressed by this label. Through the 1970's in analogue, the production values are first class (all sleeves gatefold). Mostly recorded in churches scattered around the London area all I have so far collected are by Bob Auger as sound engineer. As often the case in both the Britten and Fauré below I already own recordings made by main-stream labels but prefer for both sound and performance the same work from CRD. My focus is analogue, so although I understand they are currently in business I cannot comment how CRD perform today. 

(https://plade-klassikeren.dk/78410-large_default/faure-cello-sonatas-nos-1-2-thomas-igloi-clifford-benson-1-lp-crd.jpg) (https://img.discogs.com/iTKnJqxNkkfJIHCEP1vIF67PK_U=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7087216-1433419729-6220.jpeg.jpg)

I have a small number of those gatefold CRD albums and I have always liked their content and presentation.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 18, 2019, 12:06:18 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 17, 2019, 10:38:55 AM
I have a small number of those gatefold CRD albums and I have always liked their content and presentation.

Yes, only a small company so there are not masses of LPs (or CDs) out there, but you have to admire the single mindedness of the label in content and presentation.

The CD catalogue can be found here   http://www.crdrecords.com/about.htm

I notice there are some omissions from the LP era. The most glaring I will post on "Listening now thread".
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 18, 2019, 05:22:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 17, 2019, 06:36:14 AM
Hello, P. Where have you been hiding!

In a flurry of excitement I purchased in one go four LPs which are a part of the complete piano music of Granados by Thomas Rajna on CRD. I normally love Spanish music but for some reason this set (or music) does not work for me.

I recall you are an admirer of The Nash Ensemble so this would be perfect for you. The Trio is my favourite Fauré work.

(http://assets.rootsvinylguide.com/pictures/1982-uk-nrm-crd-1089-stereo-faure-la-bonne-chanson-trio-in-d-minor-the-nash-ens_44267331)

Hello Irons.  :-)  Not trying to hide...just awfully busy lately and am currently trying to get over a cold ...so goes life!   ;)  I hadn't heard of Thomas Rajna before now and googled him.  Perhaps it's his interpretations/performances of the music that are 'off' with you?  Have you heard Alicia de Larrocha's recordings of Granados's music before Irons?  I quite enjoy them and they've received rave reviews.  Don't have any of them on LP myself, but they are available.  Perhaps try this sample and see how you find it?  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5aCv4t4peU

And, yes, you did rightly recall; I am indeed an admirer of the Nash Ensemble.  And I do also love Fauré!   :)

Best,

PD
Quote from: aligreto on April 17, 2019, 10:38:55 AM


I have a small number of those gatefold CRD albums and I have always liked their content and presentation.
Which ones do you own Aligreto?

PD
Quote from: Irons on April 18, 2019, 12:06:18 AM
Yes, only a small company so there are not masses of LPs (or CDs) out there, but you have to admire the single mindedness of the label in content and presentation.


The CD catalogue can be found here   http://www.crdrecords.com/about.htm

I notice there are some omissions from the LP era. The most glaring I will post on "Listening now thread".
And thanks Irons for that link.  I'll check it out later today.

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 18, 2019, 07:16:57 AM
Blimey, P, you are adept at this double quoting. I have not worked it out myself. :(
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 18, 2019, 07:24:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 18, 2019, 07:16:57 AM
Blimey, P, you are adept at this double quoting. I have not worked it out myself. :(

Hey, I had to make a correction to mine after I had posted it, so don't feel badly!  A kind poster here told me how to do it; you go to the second posting of a person whose posting you wish to quote and click on the quote button for that one.  Note:  make sure that before you do that, you have your cursor in the place where you wish the second quote to go in your new posting.  You can then delete any irrelevant parts of the quote.  After doing that, again, move your cursor down past the end of the second quote to type your reply.

Give it a try Irons.   :)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 18, 2019, 08:33:06 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 18, 2019, 05:22:14 AM

Which ones do you own Aligreto?


I will have to check my vinyl collection but Fauré does come to mind immediately along with Ravel.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 18, 2019, 11:29:19 PM
Quote from: Irons on April 18, 2019, 07:16:57 AM
Blimey, P, you are adept at this double quoting. I have not worked it out myself. :(

Quote from: aligreto on April 18, 2019, 08:33:06 AM
I will have to check my vinyl collection but Fauré does come to mind immediately along with Ravel.

Thanks, Aligreto.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 19, 2019, 04:25:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 18, 2019, 11:29:19 PM
 
Thanks, Aligreto.

Bravo sir!  Well done! ;D

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on April 26, 2019, 12:01:04 AM
Found another Doyen/Fournier LP on eBay--Handel sonatas on Vega. I hope to find some of her LPs while in France this summer.

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/R8QAAOSweuNcwSy-/s-l1600.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 27, 2019, 02:46:01 AM
A gorgeous gallery of Gallant Inventions [The City Waites]


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/MtAAAOSwXDVcq4Rk/s-l1600.jpg)


This is something just a little bit different.
This is a novel, wonderful and sometimes quirky offering. The vocals and indeed the vocal harmonies are very engaging. The textures of the instruments add to the atmosphere and the recording is great.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on April 27, 2019, 12:08:04 PM
Also couldn't resist picking up a Jorg Demus--Bach French Suite No 5 and Partita No. 1 on Remington. A wonderful performance, and this is an interesting old label despite the surface noise. You can hear it on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMM-YPjgerk

(https://img.discogs.com/NlMflo-NlsBdXrgMqtc0b_pORwc=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-10880963-1505855714-9068.jpeg.jpg)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 28, 2019, 01:56:05 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on April 27, 2019, 12:08:04 PM
Also couldn't resist picking up a Jorg Demus--Bach French Suite No 5 and Partita No. 1 on Remington. A wonderful performance, and this is an interesting old label despite the surface noise. You can hear it on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMM-YPjgerk

(https://img.discogs.com/NlMflo-NlsBdXrgMqtc0b_pORwc=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-10880963-1505855714-9068.jpeg.jpg)

I am listening to it now. Nice. Thank you for the link.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 28, 2019, 05:03:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 17, 2019, 12:34:53 AM
CRD is a fairly recent discovery. Leaving the core repertoire to the majors and concentrating on instrumental and chamber I am most impressed by this label. Through the 1970's in analogue, the production values are first class (all sleeves gatefold). Mostly recorded in churches scattered around the London area all I have so far collected are by Bob Auger as sound engineer. As often the case in both the Britten and Fauré below I already own recordings made by main-stream labels but prefer for both sound and performance the same work from CRD. My focus is analogue, so although I understand they are currently in business I cannot comment how CRD perform today. 

(https://plade-klassikeren.dk/78410-large_default/faure-cello-sonatas-nos-1-2-thomas-igloi-clifford-benson-1-lp-crd.jpg)

To my great disappointment my only other LP, other than the one shown above, that I own in this series is the following


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/619w90D7fiL._SX679_.jpg)


This is most disappointing as I was convinced that I owned at least one more, if not two more of these.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 28, 2019, 01:53:38 PM
Quote from: aligreto on April 28, 2019, 05:03:33 AM
To my great disappointment my only other LP, other than the one shown above, that I own in this series is the following


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/619w90D7fiL._SX679_.jpg)


This is most disappointing as I was convinced that I owned at least one more, if not two more of these.

That is on my "to get" list. If you like the Britten string quartets I do recommend CRD 1095. Plentiful on eBay and all CRD LPs are inexpensive.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 30, 2019, 08:40:40 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 28, 2019, 01:53:38 PM

If you like the Britten string quartets I do recommend CRD 1095. Plentiful on eBay and all CRD LPs are inexpensive.

Thank you for that recommendation.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 01, 2019, 08:45:50 PM
Quote from: aligreto on April 28, 2019, 01:56:05 AM
I am listening to it now. Nice. Thank you for the link.

Glad you like it; i think his playing of both pieces is gorgeous. I hate to say it, but I think I even prefer it to the Dinu Lipatti.

And also...

Just don't play your Crossley (or anything!) on a Crosley!!  :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 02, 2019, 07:52:05 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 01, 2019, 08:45:50 PM
Glad you like it; i think his playing of both pieces is gorgeous. I hate to say it, but I think I even prefer it to the Dinu Lipatti.

And also...

Just don't play your Crossley (or anything!) on a Crosley!!  :laugh:

What was interesting for me here was that I generally prefer to listen to JS Bach on a harpsichord and this was not difficult on my ears; a tribute to his playing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 07, 2019, 12:20:03 PM
Sadly, the Demus Bach LP on arrived CRACKED. As in, totally cracked (extending from label to edge). Fortunately, the eBay seller refunded my money instantly and did not even ask for me to send it back (hate to waste the better part of an hour going to the post office--really not worth it for a $20 item!!)

No one else had this one on eBay so I just ordered a different one.

Now, a question: Is there any chance of fixing a cracked record like this--i.e., so that it will be playable? Applying the right adhesive (?) with a little bit of gentle pressure? I am very skeptical it would work, that the grooves would line up correctly, and there would not be a tick, tick, tick, tick throughout the entire record. Probably not worth the bother--more of a curiosity thing than anything else.




Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 08, 2019, 12:46:18 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 07, 2019, 12:20:03 PM
Sadly, the Demus Bach LP on arrived CRACKED. As in, totally cracked (extending from label to edge). Fortunately, the eBay seller refunded my money instantly and did not even ask for me to send it back (hate to waste the better part of an hour going to the post office--really not worth it for a $20 item!!)

No one else had this one on eBay so I just ordered a different one.

Now, a question: Is there any chance of fixing a cracked record like this--i.e., so that it will be playable? Applying the right adhesive (?) with a little bit of gentle pressure? I am very skeptical it would work, that the grooves would line up correctly, and there would not be a tick, tick, tick, tick throughout the entire record. Probably not worth the bother--more of a curiosity thing than anything else.

Sadly not a chance. If such a thing could be attempted I dread to think of the damage sustained to your stylus.

Good to hear you were treated fairly by the seller of the recording. As protection for buyers positive/negative feedback works on eBay.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 08, 2019, 07:54:30 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 07, 2019, 12:20:03 PM
Sadly, the Demus Bach LP on arrived CRACKED. As in, totally cracked (extending from label to edge). Fortunately, the eBay seller refunded my money instantly and did not even ask for me to send it back (hate to waste the better part of an hour going to the post office--really not worth it for a $20 item!!)

Now, a question: Is there any chance of fixing a cracked record like this--i.e., so that it will be playable? Applying the right adhesive (?) with a little bit of gentle pressure? I am very skeptical it would work, that the grooves would line up correctly, and there would not be a tick, tick, tick, tick throughout the entire record. Probably not worth the bother--more of a curiosity thing than anything else.

Quote from: Irons on May 08, 2019, 12:46:18 AM
Sadly not a chance. If such a thing could be attempted I dread to think of the damage sustained to your stylus.

Good to hear you were treated fairly by the seller of the recording. As protection for buyers positive/negative feedback works on eBay.


Agreed, the damage to your stylus would be the issue here.

Thankfully this has only happened to me one and, like you, I received a full refund. I then threw the two halves of the LP into the bin.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on May 08, 2019, 10:10:02 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 07, 2019, 12:20:03 PM
Sadly, the Demus Bach LP on arrived CRACKED. As in, totally cracked (extending from label to edge). Fortunately, the eBay seller refunded my money instantly and did not even ask for me to send it back (hate to waste the better part of an hour going to the post office--really not worth it for a $20 item!!)

No one else had this one on eBay so I just ordered a different one.

Now, a question: Is there any chance of fixing a cracked record like this--i.e., so that it will be playable? Applying the right adhesive (?) with a little bit of gentle pressure? I am very skeptical it would work, that the grooves would line up correctly, and there would not be a tick, tick, tick, tick throughout the entire record. Probably not worth the bother--more of a curiosity thing than anything else.

Did it once with a 78 rpm shellac disc (utterly replaceable and only played it once to make a copy on tape). Only worked for one side, tape was used on the other side to hold it together. But an LP has much finer grooves and I think it would be virtually impossible to align them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 09, 2019, 06:39:38 AM
In May 2018 SME surprisingly took ownership to the rights of Garrard Turntables. I wondered at the time where they would go with this. Soon to be announced a replica of the legendary Garrard 301 turntable at a cool £12,500! :o

(https://scontent.flhr2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/59893552_10218115448979173_2066051626413588480_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr2-1.fna&oh=84607090c0b2f35d4856edf196050a4e&oe=5D6A7AB4)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 09, 2019, 09:46:24 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 09, 2019, 06:39:38 AM
In May 2018 SME surprisingly took ownership to the rights of Garrard Turntables. I wondered at the time where they would go with this. Soon to be announced a replica of the legendary Garrard 301 turntable at a cool £12,500! :o

(https://scontent.flhr2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/59893552_10218115448979173_2066051626413588480_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr2-1.fna&oh=84607090c0b2f35d4856edf196050a4e&oe=5D6A7AB4)

Garrard is another nostalgia trip but I don't think I'll be splashing out £12,500 on one. More likely a £45 retro turntable from HMV.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on May 09, 2019, 10:08:50 AM
I had a low-level consumer grade Garrard turntable when I was a kid. I didn't know they made anything remotely "audiophile."
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 10, 2019, 12:42:35 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 09, 2019, 06:39:38 AM
In May 2018 SME surprisingly took ownership to the rights of Garrard Turntables. I wondered at the time where they would go with this. Soon to be announced a replica of the legendary Garrard 301 turntable at a cool £12,500! :o

(https://scontent.flhr2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/59893552_10218115448979173_2066051626413588480_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent.flhr2-1.fna&oh=84607090c0b2f35d4856edf196050a4e&oe=5D6A7AB4)

That is interesting on both counts [I did not know that SME took ownership to the rights of Garrard Turntables]. The names of both SME and Garrard have a good provenance.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 10, 2019, 07:32:58 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on May 09, 2019, 10:08:50 AM
I had a low-level consumer grade Garrard turntable when I was a kid. I didn't know they made anything remotely "audiophile."

Both the 301 and 401 (which I use daily) are excellent.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 13, 2019, 07:59:43 PM
My efforts to buy a Jorg Demus Bach LP on eBay are apparently an affront to the laws of God and nature. The second attempt resulted not in a cracked LP (like the first one), but rather, the delivery of a 50s mono recording of the Nutcracker Suite conducted by Anatole Fistoulari on Decca. (you can stop laughing now) Seller refunded my money, and thinks there is hope of my ultimately receiving the correct article, as soon as he can figure out who he may have shipped to.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 14, 2019, 12:47:24 PM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 13, 2019, 07:59:43 PM
My efforts to buy a Jorg Demus Bach LP on eBay are apparently an affront to the laws of God and nature. The second attempt resulted not in a cracked LP (like the first one), but rather, the delivery of a 50s mono recording of the Nutcracker Suite conducted by Anatole Fistoulari on Decca. (you can stop laughing now) Seller refunded my money, and thinks there is hope of my ultimately receiving the correct article, as soon as he can figure out who he may have shipped to.

Apparently doomed at every turn!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 16, 2019, 12:38:52 AM
(https://d27t0qkxhe4r68.cloudfront.net/t_900/5020926112125.jpg?1542303922)

Discussing a CD on a vinyl thread may be odd but relevant, I think. The above performances - Overture "Conflict" is a cracking piece - were recorded from BBC radio broadcasts using "state-of-the-art" tape recorders by Richard Itter. The overture and 1st Symphony are both in mono which I have no issue with. "Conflict" lives up to it's name, but the quieter passages of the symphony I was struck by a high degree of background hiss. This surprised me as the LP record is not known for silent backgrounds. Many releases from Mercury on LP are very hissy which I do not find bothersome at all, in fact I look at it as part of the Mercury package. I do not have an axe to grind as far as CD as a music carrier is concerned but surprised that in the digital domain I am unable to subconsciously filter background hiss out, but listening in analogue I can.

I am grateful to hear music otherwise unavailable but at full price I do not think this release represents good value due to issues of sound. Perfect as a supplement to the BBC MM. The other Wordsworth Lyrita CD of Symphonies 2 & 3, a regular recording, is superb and a far better representation of the art of William Wordsworth IMO.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 27, 2019, 12:57:41 AM
It doesn't seem possible that it is coming up forty years that Hogwood and The Academy of Ancient Music recorded a complete set of Mozart Symphonies for L'Oiseau-Lyre. I have always admired the performances and slowly collected them over the years. Due to the Decca New Malden vinyl pressing plant closing down in 1980 and all production moved to Holland it follows, or so I thought, the whole series are in Dutch pressings. I had a double take when last week I happened across volume 3 in New Malden pressings. A lot is said on the differences of sound between Dutch and English pressed Decca issues, something I do not concern myself with as much as I once did, but the difference in presentation here is much larger then I would have imagined. The orchestra is more close-up, more immediate and at the same time seems smaller in number. The A of AM has a distant perspective and the sound reverberant and less clear in the Dutch pressing. I surmise that volume 3 was the first (1979) volume from Hogwood and one of the last to be pressed at New Malden, subsequent pressings of the same set were Dutch. An early pressing run will always result in better sound anyway. Recording venue and production team remained the same for the whole series.

(https://i.imgur.com/elCe7Fh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/04Lb3HX.jpg)

Edit: Both sets were made up with the same size orchestra, 9 first violins, 8 second violins, 4 violas, 3 cellos, 2 double basses, 2 flutes, 2 oboes, 3 bassoons, 2 trumpets, 4 horns and timpani.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 27, 2019, 07:55:09 PM
Leaving for France in a couple weeks. Do any of the cognoscenti here know of any good record shops in Paris (St. Malo? Vannes? Dinan? Carnac?)??  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Mandryka on May 27, 2019, 08:20:23 PM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 27, 2019, 07:55:09 PM
Leaving for France in a couple weeks. Do any of the cognoscenti here know of any good record shops in Paris (St. Malo? Vannes? Dinan? Carnac?)??  8)

Paris has the best second hand CD shop I know, Melomania on Boulevard St Germain. If I were you I'd go in there and ask them.

Every Sunday morning there's a very big flea market close to the Vanves metro station, it's always full of LPs.

Gibert Jeune in the 5th arrondissement may be worth trying, it's very close to Melomania in fact.  Again they're a big academic second hand book shop and I've seen CDs there I'm sure - if they don't have LPs they'll put you on to good places.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on May 28, 2019, 02:15:32 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 27, 2019, 07:55:09 PM
Leaving for France in a couple weeks. Do any of the cognoscenti here know of any good record shops in Paris (St. Malo? Vannes? Dinan? Carnac?)??  8)

Classical CDs are generally very expensive in France. I have no information on Paris but the situation in Brittany is now pretty bleak. There used to be harmonia mundi shops in Rennes and Quimper but the whole chain has now closed down. In the past some people have found fnac to be good but I find they now have a pretty feeble selection of compilations, popular classics etc. There is a fnac in the shopping complex just outside Vannes but personally I wouldn't make a special visit.

The specialist shops mentioned by Mandryka are more likely to be worth a visit but otherwise it is probably better just to buy stuff online. The days when most towns and cities had a record shop and browsing was fun are long gone.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on May 28, 2019, 08:01:04 PM
Thanks Mandryka and Biffo, very interesting. If either of you are in the neighborhood (Paris, Brittany) in June, let me know if you want to meet for drinks or lunch.

I am actually mainly looking for LPs. I certainly do not need any, but if I find any, great! LPs by Yvonne Lefebure and some other hard-to-find French artists are at the top of my list.

We will likely end up buying a lot of books, and may have to ship back to the U.S so as not to be overweight in our luggage. LPs will likely have to go in luggage, so I am not looking to buy too many!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 29, 2019, 08:49:24 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 27, 2019, 12:57:41 AM
It doesn't seem possible that it is coming up forty years that Hogwood and The Academy of Ancient Music recorded a complete set of Mozart Symphonies for L'Oiseau-Lyre. I have always admired the performances and slowly collected them over the years. Due to the Decca New Malden vinyl pressing plant closing down in 1980 and all production moved to Holland it follows, or so I thought, the whole series are in Dutch pressings. I had a double take when last week I happened across volume 3 in New Malden pressings. A lot is said on the differences of sound between Dutch and English pressed Decca issues, something I do not concern myself with as much as I once did, but the difference in presentation here is much larger then I would have imagined. The orchestra is more close-up, more immediate and at the same time seems smaller in number. The A of AM has a distant perspective and the sound reverberant and less clear in the Dutch pressing. I surmise that volume 3 was the first (1979) volume from Hogwood and one of the last to be pressed at New Malden, subsequent pressings of the same set were Dutch. An early pressing run will always result in better sound anyway. Recording venue and production team remained the same for the whole series.

(https://i.imgur.com/elCe7Fh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/04Lb3HX.jpg)

Edit: Both sets were made up with the same size orchestra, 9 first violins, 8 second violins, 4 violas, 3 cellos, 2 double basses, 2 flutes, 2 oboes, 3 bassoons, 2 trumpets, 4 horns and timpani.

Most interesting. I have six of those seven box sets in my collection and five of them are Dutch pressings. Coincidentally, the English pressing is Vol. 3.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on May 29, 2019, 09:06:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 27, 2019, 12:57:41 AM
It doesn't seem possible that it is coming up forty years that Hogwood and The Academy of Ancient Music recorded a complete set of Mozart Symphonies for L'Oiseau-Lyre. I have always admired the performances and slowly collected them over the years. Due to the Decca New Malden vinyl pressing plant closing down in 1980 and all production moved to Holland it follows, or so I thought, the whole series are in Dutch pressings. I had a double take when last week I happened across volume 3 in New Malden pressings. A lot is said on the differences of sound between Dutch and English pressed Decca issues, something I do not concern myself with as much as I once did, but the difference in presentation here is much larger then I would have imagined. The orchestra is more close-up, more immediate and at the same time seems smaller in number. The A of AM has a distant perspective and the sound reverberant and less clear in the Dutch pressing. I surmise that volume 3 was the first (1979) volume from Hogwood and one of the last to be pressed at New Malden, subsequent pressings of the same set were Dutch. An early pressing run will always result in better sound anyway. Recording venue and production team remained the same for the whole series.

Hard for me to imagine that changing the pressing plant would alter the apparent recording perspective and make the recording more reverberant. I suspect that those early recordings were just engineered a bit differently.

I have the who series on CD in a big box set and I must say it is the least interesting Mozart series I own. Way to distant and reverberant, fussy playing with weak dynamic contrasts. I can't think of any Mozart I like less. I never heard any of it when it was on LP, however.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: ritter on May 29, 2019, 12:58:07 PM
Quote from: Mandryka on May 27, 2019, 08:20:23 PM
Paris has the best second hand CD shop I know, Melomania on Boulevard St Germain. If I were you I'd go in there and ask them.

Every Sunday morning there's a very big flea market close to the Vanves metro station, it's always full of LPs.

Gibert Jeune in the 5th arrondissement may be worth trying, it's very close to Melomania in fact.  Again they're a big academic second hand book shop and I've seen CDs there I'm sure - if they don't have LPs they'll put you on to good places.
I've  never been to Melomania, but it's been rated very highly by friends of mine.

The FNAC in the Rue de Ternes in the 17ème has an excellent classical section.

Also interesting is La Dame Blanche, 47 Rue de la Montagne Sainte Geneviève, in the 5ème.

I haven't bought CDs at Gibert Jeune in Paris, but in Lyon they had a good selection of secondhand classical CDs. For books, of course, Gibert Jeune is a must. And then, the Librairie Gallimard on the Blvd. Raspail is a temple for French literature.

Have a good trip!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 29, 2019, 01:42:36 PM
Quote from: Ghost of Baron Scarpia on May 29, 2019, 09:06:21 AM
Hard for me to imagine that changing the pressing plant would alter the apparent recording perspective and make the recording more reverberant. I suspect that those early recordings were just engineered a bit differently.

I have the who series on CD in a big box set and I must say it is the least interesting Mozart series I own. Way to distant and reverberant, fussy playing with weak dynamic contrasts. I can't think of any Mozart I like less. I never heard any of it when it was on LP, however.

I'm getting the impression you are not keen then.😛

Seriously, up to a point I agree with you.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 13, 2019, 03:06:40 AM
Eye watering!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SAX-2394-B-S-SAMSON-FRANCOIS-ANDRE-CLUYTENS-RAVEL-PIANO-CONCERTOS-UK-LP-TOP-NM/153522396239?hash=item23bea5dc4f:g:viwAAOSwo5dc~sJa

The seller, Glenn Armstrong is proprietor of the Coup D'Archet record label.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 14, 2019, 08:56:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 13, 2019, 03:06:40 AM
Eye watering!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SAX-2394-B-S-SAMSON-FRANCOIS-ANDRE-CLUYTENS-RAVEL-PIANO-CONCERTOS-UK-LP-TOP-NM/153522396239?hash=item23bea5dc4f:g:viwAAOSwo5dc~sJa

The seller, Glenn Armstrong is proprietor of the Coup D'Archet record label.

WOW!!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 17, 2019, 07:38:59 AM
I am told that Yuja Wang is a major artist of the present generation. DG are scheduling this release on vinyl in July.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81By34DOhUL._SY355_.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on July 03, 2019, 09:34:11 PM
Back from France and found a single LP I wanted in Paris, at Boulinier in the 6th Arr. The prized find is Paul Badura-Skoda playing Beethoven Sonata No. 32, Op. 111 on Opus/Harmonia Mundia 10". I likely could have found additional items if I looked longer, but didn't want to take up too much time record hunting, nor did I want to add more weight to the luggage (incl. books bought over there) we hauled endlessly between planes, trains, buses, rental cars, and up decrepit, narrow, wooden, spiral staircases constructed three centuries ago. Also, at CDG, if your luggage is overweight, the airlines will extract their pound of flesh, and not only in money (fortunately, we avoided the worst of this)!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 06, 2019, 12:45:05 AM
Scratching my head a bit with this one. In the 1970's EMI wrongly thinking that quadraphonic sound would be the next big thing released a whole swathe of recordings in this format. Thankfully for them the records were stereo compatible although pressed with four channels. When EMI realized the buying public were not keen on the idea of extra expense of a SQ decoder and two extra speakers EMI quietly reverted back to stereo.

Fremaux's "Le Cid" has long been a demonstration recording par excellence due to vivid sound. It sold well and although plentiful today commands a decent price. Many copies have passed through my hands but I have never seen a quadraphonic issue - until last week! It is my understanding that a four track cannot be applied retrospectively, the process takes place as early as the recording itself and pressing of the "mother". I can only think EMI were pressing records in four channels as early as 1971 or earlier although the records were titled and sold as stereo. 

(https://i.imgur.com/i58GDZ3.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/MzSnfA8.jpg)

   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 18, 2019, 01:06:03 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/lPH2IIV.jpg)

Jokes along the lines of best place for them not allowed. 8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 18, 2019, 02:05:13 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 18, 2019, 01:06:03 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/lPH2IIV.jpg)

Jokes along the lines of best place for them not allowed. 8)

We are in the process of decorating at the moment. I wonder what my good lady wife would say if I recommended that as an option. On the other hand......perhaps I will keep my recommendations to myself.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 18, 2019, 11:28:45 PM
Quote from: aligreto on August 18, 2019, 02:05:13 AM
We are in the process of decorating at the moment. I wonder what my good lady wife would say if I recommended that as an option. On the other hand......perhaps I will keep my recommendations to myself.

Maybe best. ;) There is also the worry that sitting up in bed enjoying a cuppa you find yourself stuck to the headboard by static!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 20, 2019, 12:52:52 PM
Quote from: Irons on August 18, 2019, 11:28:45 PM
Maybe best. ;) There is also the worry that sitting up in bed enjoying a cuppa you find yourself stuck to the headboard by static!

Oh no, they would be cleaned every day with a carbon fibre brush and washed once a week on my record cleaning machine  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 19, 2019, 12:12:04 AM
Brahms: Violin Concerto.

(https://www.popsike.com/pix/20150921/301746969029.jpg)

During the 1990's Testament released every quarter a facsimile of a recording from the "golden age" through the classical music magazine ICRC as it was called then. All issues are 100% analogue, cut on to lacquer at EMI's Abbey Road and hand pressed on 180 virgin vinyl at the original EMI Hayes pressing plant. At the time they went for £14.95 inclusive of postage.

I collected them all avidly which since has proved a very good investment. Most, although not all are violin concerto recordings. Best in my view is the Kogan Brahms VC which I listened yesterday. An original would cost a small fortune and beyond reach of most (sensible) collectors. The Testament issue sounds superb with a CD-quiet pressing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 19, 2019, 08:21:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 19, 2019, 12:12:04 AM
Brahms: Violin Concerto.

(https://www.popsike.com/pix/20150921/301746969029.jpg)

During the 1990's Testament released every quarter a facsimile of a recording from the "golden age" through the classical music magazine ICRC as it was called then. All issues are 100% analogue, cut on to lacquer at EMI's Abbey Road and hand pressed on 180 virgin vinyl at the original EMI Hayes pressing plant. At the time they went for £14.95 inclusive of postage.

I collected them all avidly which since has proved a very good investment. Most, although not all are violin concerto recordings. Best in my view is the Kogan Brahms VC which I listened yesterday. An original would cost a small fortune and beyond reach of most (sensible) collectors. The Testament issue sounds superb with a CD-quiet pressing.

What a nice pension pot for you  8)

Seriously, it is very nice to own something of a unique collection like that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 19, 2019, 11:41:22 PM
Quote from: aligreto on September 19, 2019, 08:21:58 AM
What a nice pension pot for you  8)

Seriously, it is very nice to own something of a unique collection like that.

The kids will get any financial gain. The problem, and I'm sure it is for you too, is that any vinyl collection is a pyramid of which the tip is worth serious money the rest in monetary terms is pretty much worthless. When I go to the great listening room in the sky how will my family know which have value? I shudder when I think my record collection could end in landfill.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 20, 2019, 08:13:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 19, 2019, 11:41:22 PM
The kids will get any financial gain. The problem, and I'm sure it is for you too, is that any vinyl collection is a pyramid of which the tip is worth serious money the rest in monetary terms is pretty much worthless. When I go to the great listening room in the sky how will my family know which have value? I shudder when I think my record collection could end in landfill.

I actually have had this discussion with my daughter. Obviously she is aware of eBay and I am currently logging my collection onto Discogs for her to give her another option. That way I am listing the vast bulk of my collection for her and she can add that tool for the then current value of any item.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 20, 2019, 10:11:56 AM
Quote from: aligreto on September 20, 2019, 08:13:58 AM
I actually have had this discussion with my daughter. Obviously she is aware of eBay and I am currently logging my collection onto Discogs for her to give her another option. That way I am listing the vast bulk of my collection for her and she can add that tool for the then current value of any item.

You are way ahead of me! I am aware of Discogs, of course, but how can a collection be listed there? Sounds a plan.  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 20, 2019, 10:47:42 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 20, 2019, 10:11:56 AM
You are way ahead of me! I am aware of Discogs, of course, but how can a collection be listed there? Sounds a plan.  8)

Register with Discogs and simply start logging your collection.
If you have any problems or questions do not hesitate to PM me.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 20, 2019, 01:27:40 PM
Quote from: aligreto on September 20, 2019, 10:47:42 AM
Register with Discogs and simply start logging your collection.
If you have any problems or questions do not hesitate to PM me.

I had no idea.......I will be away for a bit, on return will begin the process. Excellent idea, thanks.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 20, 2019, 02:36:41 PM
Quote from: Irons on September 20, 2019, 01:27:40 PM
I had no idea.......I will be away for a bit, on return will begin the process. Excellent idea, thanks.

Cheers and enjoy your trip.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 29, 2019, 02:33:27 AM
I have just posted this version of Mozart's Bastien and Bastienne in the Listening Thread


(https://img.discogs.com/CDDQuFbam4nnesohHpHNrOrsxzw=/fit-in/600x450/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7651802-1445971040-2353.jpeg.jpg)


The interesting thing is that there is a label misprint with both labels displaying Part 2


(https://img.discogs.com/6T1a_4ZHMaeHzWBlrjGeLne5qO4=/fit-in/600x450/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7651802-1445971040-5073.jpeg.jpg)   (https://img.discogs.com/dx23uXxOaCOTktPegkMxYItxYck=/fit-in/600x450/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7651802-1445971039-2261.jpeg.jpg)


I wonder if, and at what part of the production process this error was noticed and if it was, was a conscious decision taken to let it go on the basis of cost.

Any other examples of label errors?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Florestan on October 29, 2019, 02:35:10 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 29, 2019, 02:33:27 AM
I have just posted this version of Mozart's Bastien and Bastienne in the Listening Thread


(https://img.discogs.com/CDDQuFbam4nnesohHpHNrOrsxzw=/fit-in/600x450/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7651802-1445971040-2353.jpeg.jpg)


The interesting thing is that there is a label misprint with both labels displaying Part 2


(https://img.discogs.com/6T1a_4ZHMaeHzWBlrjGeLne5qO4=/fit-in/600x450/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7651802-1445971040-5073.jpeg.jpg)   (https://img.discogs.com/dx23uXxOaCOTktPegkMxYItxYck=/fit-in/600x450/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7651802-1445971039-2261.jpeg.jpg)


I wonder if, and at what part of the production process this error was noticed and if it was, was a conscious decision taken to let it go on the basis of cost.

Any other examples of label errors?

The most conspicuous misprint is actually on the cover.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 29, 2019, 02:47:36 AM
Quote from: Florestan on October 29, 2019, 02:35:10 AM
The most conspicuous misprint is actually on the cover.  :laugh:

I presume that you refer to the and/und issue?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Florestan on October 29, 2019, 02:53:00 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 29, 2019, 02:47:36 AM
I presume that you refer to the and/und issue?

Precisely. And to compound the confusion, they have it right on the labels.  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: pjme on October 29, 2019, 03:43:39 AM
And Toni Blankenheim is first a bass (baritone) and then a tenor.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 29, 2019, 03:53:01 AM
Quote from: Florestan on October 29, 2019, 02:53:00 AM
Precisely. And to compound the confusion, they have it right on the labels.  :)

Good spot. I did not notice that one myself.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 29, 2019, 03:55:34 AM
Quote from: pjme on October 29, 2019, 03:43:39 AM
And Toni Blankenheim is first a bass (baritone) and then a tenor.

A multi-talented guy  ;D

Wow, more wrong with this one that I had at first thought.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Florestan on October 29, 2019, 03:56:39 AM
Quote from: pjme on October 29, 2019, 03:43:39 AM
And Toni Blankenheim is first a bass (baritone) and then a tenor.

Hah! Well spotted too.

Maybe we should start a thread, "Most Misprinted Artworks and Labels".  :D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 30, 2019, 12:57:45 AM
Released by the DG subsidiary Polydor I am fairly certain a Philips UK pressing. Very sloppy.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 30, 2019, 03:34:34 AM
I just received this.
I don't even have a functioning turntable  ::)
First LP I've bought in a long time:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 30, 2019, 04:15:28 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 30, 2019, 03:34:34 AM
I just received this.


(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=60649;image)


I don't even have a functioning turntable  ::)
First LP I've bought in a long time:


There is just a little nagging voice in the back of my mind telling me that just might present a minor problem when you attempt to listen to it Jeffrey  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 31, 2019, 03:53:18 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 30, 2019, 04:15:28 AM
There is just a little nagging voice in the back of my mind telling me that just might present a minor problem when you attempt to listen to it Jeffrey  ;D

Thanks Fergus. I've tried playing it on the microwave oven's turntable but without success so far.
8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 31, 2019, 05:25:41 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 31, 2019, 03:53:18 AM
Thanks Fergus. I've tried playing it on the microwave oven's turntable but without success so far.
8)

Did you try switching on the microwave? Wait, no, don't do that.....  :o

Seriously, though, nice purchase. I would buy it too if I saw it on my continuing searches.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 31, 2019, 05:49:57 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 31, 2019, 05:25:41 AM
Did you try switching on the microwave? Wait, no, don't do that.....  :o

Seriously, though, nice purchase. I would buy it too if I saw it on my continuing searches.
:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 31, 2019, 07:59:21 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 31, 2019, 03:53:18 AM
Thanks Fergus. I've tried playing it on the microwave oven's turntable but without success so far.
8)

Try this Jeffrey. If the cat approves it must be good.

(https://s7d5.scene7.com/is/image/UrbanOutfitters/52398849_005_b?$xlarge$&hei=900&qlt=80&fit=constrain)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 01, 2019, 04:02:10 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 31, 2019, 07:59:21 AM
Try this Jeffrey. If the cat approves it must be good.

(https://s7d5.scene7.com/is/image/UrbanOutfitters/52398849_005_b?$xlarge$&hei=900&qlt=80&fit=constrain)

Brings scratchy vinyl to a new high low level  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 01, 2019, 08:02:15 AM
Quote from: aligreto on November 01, 2019, 04:02:10 AM
Brings scratchy vinyl to a new high low level  ;D

;D

It must be said cats (and dusters) with expensive cartridges are not a marriage made in heaven. :o
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 01, 2019, 11:25:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 01, 2019, 08:02:15 AM
;D

It must be said cats (and dusters) with expensive cartridges are not a marriage made in heaven. :o

I know of one case where a stylus got snared in the sleeve of a cardigan thereby destroying an expensive cartridge.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2019, 06:59:38 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 31, 2019, 07:59:21 AM
Try this Jeffrey. If the cat approves it must be good.

(https://s7d5.scene7.com/is/image/UrbanOutfitters/52398849_005_b?$xlarge$&hei=900&qlt=80&fit=constrain)

I remember when I lived at home with my parents our cat jumped on my turntable whilst a record was playing and went round with it.  :o
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 03, 2019, 01:40:31 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2019, 06:59:38 AM
I remember when I lived at home with my parents our cat jumped on my turntable whilst a record was playing and went round with it.  :o

I trust you switched to 78 rpm. >:D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 03, 2019, 02:44:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 03, 2019, 01:40:31 AM
I trust you switched to 78 rpm. >:D

Evil indeed  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 03, 2019, 10:58:26 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 03, 2019, 01:40:31 AM
I trust you switched to 78 rpm. >:D
What a terrible thought - you should be ashamed of yourself Lol!
8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 09, 2019, 12:15:36 AM
Optional protective clothing for second-hand record collectors.

(https://www.audioasylum.com/usr/5/59400/screen_shot_2019-09-19_at_11.12.21_am.png)
Thanks to Waxxy
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 21, 2019, 09:54:30 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 09, 2019, 12:15:36 AM
Optional protective clothing for second-hand record collectors.

(https://www.audioasylum.com/usr/5/59400/screen_shot_2019-09-19_at_11.12.21_am.png)
Thanks to Waxxy
V funny.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 24, 2019, 07:27:14 AM
"Still playing LPs? You're either a clubtastic DJ, an urban hipster or a sweet old duffer." This is the opening paragraph of an article written by Bryan Appleyard in this week's Culture magazine with the Sunday Times (page 22) titled Can the Classics Ride the Digital Stream? I asked the wife which she thought I was, she replied "you are not sweet!". On a more serious note the article makes a case that streaming music could result in the demise of Classical music. The piece rather loses credibility when Appleyard says, I quote "if somebody asks for a Mahler quartet, the algorithm may not know if they want a music group or a track." I lost interest after this and didn't bother to read the (long) rest. Think I will keep to LPs and CDs with or without a Mahler quartet.  ???

Edit: A Google search does unearth an early unfinished Piano Quartet from Mahler.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 24, 2019, 07:31:51 AM
Most likely it is a function of ageing eyes in my case but I find certain LP labels difficult to read. I find them dark and fussy. It can sometimes be difficult for me to even determine which is Side 1. Other labels on the other hand are clear as a bell and present their information easily and readily.

I offer two recent examples by way of demonstration and explanation.


(https://img.discogs.com/nqXGMCn9Z5ChcMcy_GhqUhTvc98=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-1409377-1396190623-4517.jpeg.jpg)   (https://img.discogs.com/IW6f5qnTQ_wv0R4febNdGSkqg5o=/fit-in/400x424/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-4135555-1460245102-9617.jpeg.jpg)


I find the CBS label "fussy" whereas the CfP label is very clear for me. This is obviously a function of the colour contrast.

Do any other vinyl heads have this issue [yet]?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ratliff on November 24, 2019, 08:10:28 AM
Quote from: aligreto on November 24, 2019, 07:31:51 AM
Most likely it is a function of ageing eyes in my case but I find certain LP labels difficult to read. I find them dark and fussy.

I own no vinyl but have the same issue on many CD booklets. Small type in "stylish" combinations of colors with low contrast. Stupid.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 24, 2019, 08:24:43 AM
Quote from: Ratliff on November 24, 2019, 08:10:28 AM
I own no vinyl but have the same issue on many CD booklets. Small type in "stylish" combinations of colors with low contrast. Stupid.

Don't get me started on current CD booklets!!! One almost requires an electron microscope to read some them  >:D   ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 01, 2019, 02:50:46 AM
Collecting vinyl is fun but can be frustrating. A LP can appear pristine and sound like a bowl of rice crispies. Over time with experience a collector learns how to spot clues, and there are many, whether a LP is pre-loved or just second-hand. A sure fire method is collections. If a pre-owned LP has been carefully looked after and played on equipment not causing damage to the vulnerable record groove then there is more then a good chance the rest of the collection would be of similar condition.

    (https://i.imgur.com/Gl8WlDc.jpg)

On a visit to an Oxfam shop I came across a LP with a cover in mint condition. I noticed the previous owner in a neat hand had listed in the inner sleeve not only details of the recording but where and when it was purchased and at what cost. Looking through the rack there were others with the same information. The records did not require any cleaning and play whisper quite. They are literarily "as new". I returned with haste and checked for more with the same inscriptions. I guess a dozen or so including a box set of Martinu symphonies. I commend the previous owner for the fastidious way he has kept his record collection and for what ever reason they arrived at a charity shop - I very much hope it is not the usual reason - he/she can rest assured these records are still giving great pleasure and being looked after the way they are accustomed.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 01, 2019, 03:54:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 01, 2019, 02:50:46 AM
Collecting vinyl is fun but can be frustrating. A LP can appear pristine and sound like a bowl of rice crispies. Over time with experience a collector learns how to spot clues, and there are many, whether a LP is pre-loved or just second-hand. A sure fire method is collections. If a pre-owned LP has been carefully looked after and played on equipment not causing damage to the vulnerable record groove then there is more then a good chance the rest of the collection would be of similar condition.

    (https://i.imgur.com/Gl8WlDc.jpg)

On a visit to an Oxfam shop I came across a LP with a cover in mint condition. I noticed the previous owner in a neat hand had listed in the inner sleeve not only details of the recording but where and when it was purchased and at what cost. Looking through the rack there were others with the same information. The records did not require any cleaning and play whisper quite. They are literarily "as new". I returned with haste and checked for more with the same inscriptions. I guess a dozen or so including a box set of Martinu symphonies. I commend the previous owner for the fastidious way he has kept his record collection and for what ever reason they arrived at a charity shop - I very much hope it is not the usual reason - he/she can rest assured these records are still giving great pleasure and being looked after the way they are accustomed.

Some years ago I bought a somewhat modest collection of around 500 LPs and many of them were preserved and presented in the way that you describe above. Unfortunately, for me anyway, this is the exception rather than the rule.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 05, 2019, 07:31:14 AM
I cannot believe this announcement from SME! The world has gone mad and Alastair Robertson-Aikman must be turning in his grave!

Unbelievable, and very sad -  https://sme.co.uk/2019/12/03/sme-product-announcement/
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 05, 2019, 08:23:12 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 05, 2019, 07:31:14 AM
I cannot believe this announcement from SME! The world has gone mad and Alastair Robertson-Aikman must be turning in his grave!

Unbelievable, and very sad -  https://sme.co.uk/2019/12/03/sme-product-announcement/

WOW!! Amazing decision.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 06, 2019, 12:06:03 AM
Quote from: aligreto on December 05, 2019, 08:23:12 AM
WOW!! Amazing decision.

Aligreto, I just can't get my head around it! ???
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 08, 2019, 06:07:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 06, 2019, 12:06:03 AM
Aligreto, I just can't get my head around it! ???

I agree, even for business reasons.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 10, 2019, 06:02:38 AM
Classics on Vinyl on YT worth a look/listen. Lyrita, Bax 5 on outstanding vinyl playback.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCoOiV11be6CgesXPN40EPKQ
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on December 10, 2019, 10:36:58 PM
FLAC-ing my way through this exquisite 4 LP EMI reissue set of Maggie Teyte that has, inexplicably, been sitting on my shelves for many years. I'm sure it's on CD, but I love the beautiful booklet (sized just right for human usage!) that is included in this set. She is one of my favorite singers of all time.

(https://img.discogs.com/PLTRMbRyYkos6Foh08Qn7Ii-PVw=/fit-in/600x450/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-13008371-1552504325-3532.jpeg.jpg)

(not my photo BTW)



Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 10, 2019, 11:56:39 PM
Quote from: aligreto on December 08, 2019, 06:07:44 AM
I agree, even for business reasons.

Already started - Music Direct are selling SME 309 I,000$ over list price!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 11, 2019, 01:46:49 PM
Quote from: Irons on December 10, 2019, 06:02:38 AM
Classics on Vinyl on YT worth a look/listen. Lyrita, Bax 5 on outstanding vinyl playback.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCoOiV11be6CgesXPN40EPKQ

Yes, it's a terrific playback. Thanks for alerting us to it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: dissily Mordentroge on December 11, 2019, 03:34:10 PM
Quote from: Irons on December 06, 2019, 12:06:03 AM
Aligreto, I just can't get my head around it! ???
It could be that other tonearm manufactures are saturating the market with products equal to or better than the SME examples. Take for instance VPI's 'JMW" 10.5 3d printed arm. Walks all over everything SME has to offer. Not that SME is making anything that's rubbish it's just that advances in this ancient technology are leaping ahead.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 15, 2019, 02:56:49 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 11, 2019, 01:46:49 PM
Yes, it's a terrific playback. Thanks for alerting us to it.

Pleased you enjoyed it, Jeffrey. I did think it rather good and worth posting.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2020, 05:37:52 AM
Has anyone else here purchased any new LPs lately?  If so, any special finds?   :)

Recent(ish) finds for me:

Martinu Sonatas Nos. 1-3 (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91ICqJo4y1L._SL1500_.jpg)
Liszt Sonata in B minor and Schumann Fantasia in C Major with Alicia de Larrocha on London (English pressing)
Hindemith Die 7 Kammermusiken
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91Q53C45BKL._SL1500_.jpg)
Hermann Prey singt Lieder von Carl Maria von Weber on Odeon
Stravinsky Pulcinella and Apollon Musagète
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91roiLCoKKL._SL1500_.jpg)
Stravinsky Le Sacre du Printemps for piano 2 hands on BIS with Dag Achatz
and also his Le Rossignol conducted by him on CBS

What have the rest of you been up to?   :)

Best,

PD

EDIT:  Now if I could just figure out how/where to find images that aren't so huge!   ???

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Papy Oli on February 12, 2020, 06:24:22 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2020, 05:37:52 AM

EDIT:  Now if I could just figure out how/where to find images that aren't so huge!   ???

You would need to edit the first img tag of each image address to img width=250 between the [ ] or any number to suit. usually 250 or 300 works fine.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91ICqJo4y1L._SL1500_.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2020, 07:15:10 AM
Quote from: Papy Oli on February 12, 2020, 06:24:22 AM
You would need to edit the first img tag of each image address to img width=250 between the [ ] or any number to suit. usually 250 or 300 works fine.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91ICqJo4y1L._SL1500_.jpg)

Thank you!   ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 07:27:26 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2020, 05:37:52 AM
Has anyone else here purchased any new LPs lately?  If so, any special finds?   :)

Recent(ish) finds for me:

Martinu Sonatas Nos. 1-3 (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91ICqJo4y1L._SL1500_.jpg)
Liszt Sonata in B minor and Schumann Fantasia in C Major with Alicia de Larrocha on London (English pressing)
Hindemith Die 7 Kammermusiken
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91Q53C45BKL._SL1500_.jpg)
Hermann Prey singt Lieder von Carl Maria von Weber on Odeon
Stravinsky Pulcinella and Apollon Musagète
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91roiLCoKKL._SL1500_.jpg)
Stravinsky Le Sacre du Printemps for piano 2 hands on BIS with Dag Achatz
and also his Le Rossignol conducted by him on CBS

What have the rest of you been up to?   :)

Best,

PD

EDIT:  Now if I could just figure out how/where to find images that aren't so huge!   ???

Yes, I got a cheapo LP player for Christmas:


(//)
[/img]
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 07:33:26 AM
Also these:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 12, 2020, 07:53:54 AM
I know very little of Korngold's music but a fellow member here introduced me extracts from "Die Tote Stadt". I immediately fell in love with the sound world and ordered this set


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/vhMAAOSwNXpckNid/s-l1600.jpg)


I am eagerly awaiting its arrival.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 12, 2020, 07:55:51 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 07:33:26 AM

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=62575;image)

That was one of my earliest introductions to Scandanavian Music. Enjoy  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2020, 08:49:19 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 07:27:26 AM
Yes, I got a cheapo LP player for Christmas:



I'm rather envious of your possession of a nice VW album Vandermolen!

What kind of LP player did you get?  Your image didn't take.  And perhaps you could swap it with your daughter (as I hear that she owns a nice one?   ;)

You've been busy buying too!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2020, 08:52:55 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 12, 2020, 07:53:54 AM
I know very little of Korngold's music but a fellow member here introduced me extracts from "Die Tote Stadt". I immediately fell in love with the sound world and ordered this set


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/vhMAAOSwNXpckNid/s-l1600.jpg)


I am eagerly awaiting its arrival.

I haven't listened to any Korngold in ages...must revisit!  By the way, is your avatar's image your lunch or your dinner platter?  Sorry, I couldn't resist!   :D

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 09:26:10 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 12, 2020, 07:55:51 AM
That was one of my earliest introductions to Scandanavian Music. Enjoy  8)
Thanks Fergus. It's a fabulous disc (both works). Oddly enough I have never been aware that this LP existed. It features two of my favourite 20th Century symphonies in classic recordings. I do own a similar looking LP featuring Rosenberg's fine Symphony No. 6 'Semplice' with Blomdahl's 'Facetter' Symphony - a happy discovery from my early twenties, purchased in Notting Hill Gate in London:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 09:28:19 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2020, 08:49:19 AM
I'm rather envious of your possession of a nice VW album Vandermolen!

What kind of LP player did you get?  Your image didn't take.  And perhaps you could swap it with your daughter (as I hear that she owns a nice one?   ;)

You've been busy buying too!

PD
Yes, my daughter has a very nice German Dual turntable (unused as far as I'm aware). I'm embarrassed to admit, in this company, that my new one is an 'ION' but I have to admit that it's better than expected and I'm having great fun playing LPs after a 30 year or so gap:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 12, 2020, 09:49:10 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 12, 2020, 08:52:55 AM

By the way, is your avatar's image your lunch or your dinner platter?  Sorry, I couldn't resist!   :D

Best wishes,

PD

Both but only at weekends  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 12, 2020, 09:53:06 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 09:28:19 AM
Yes, my daughter has a very nice German Dual turntable (unused as far as I'm aware). I'm embarrassed to admit, in this company, that my new one is an 'ION' but I have to admit that it's better than expected and I'm having great fun playing LPs after a 30 year or so gap:
(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=62579;image)

Nice to be back handling and playing the Black Stuff I am sure Jeffrey  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 01:17:31 PM
Quote from: aligreto on February 12, 2020, 09:53:06 AM
Nice to be back handling and playing the Black Stuff I am sure Jeffrey  8)
Very much so Fergus. There is a tactile aspect of retrieving the LP from the inner sleeve and having to turn it over half-way through that I have missed. It's a bit like going back in time.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 13, 2020, 05:23:18 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 12, 2020, 01:17:31 PM
Very much so Fergus. There is a tactile aspect of retrieving the LP from the inner sleeve and having to turn it over half-way through that I have missed. It's a bit like going back in time.
Does yours have an auto-return?  Must admit, that's the one thing that I miss with mine at times!  Pleased to hear that you're using it and enjoying it.   :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Wanderer on February 13, 2020, 05:24:34 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 12, 2020, 07:53:54 AM
I know very little of Korngold's music but a fellow member here introduced me extracts from "Die Tote Stadt". I immediately fell in love with the sound world and ordered this set


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/vhMAAOSwNXpckNid/s-l1600.jpg)


I am eagerly awaiting its arrival.

You're in for such a treat.  0:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 13, 2020, 09:24:00 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 13, 2020, 05:23:18 AM
Does yours have an auto-return?  Must admit, that's the one thing that I miss with mine at times!  Pleased to hear that you're using it and enjoying it.   :)

Thank you. No auto-return. You have to lift the needle off with a small lever and manually return it to its resting place. When I was still living at home with my parents my cat once jumped onto the turntable while it was in operation and went whizzing round with the record. I don't think that the LP ever recovered.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 13, 2020, 10:38:52 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 13, 2020, 09:24:00 AM
Thank you. No auto-return. You have to lift the needle off with a small lever and manually return it to its resting place. When I was still living at home with my parents my cat once jumped onto the turntable while it was in operation and went whizzing round with the record. I don't think that the LP ever recovered.

Did the cat?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 13, 2020, 10:47:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 13, 2020, 10:38:52 AM
Did the cat?
The cat was fine although she looked rather startled - she was very dopey but affectionate. I recently bought a 'toy clockwork mouse' to entertain my present cat. However, when I received it looked more like a large black bubonic-plague rat. When I  first got it going my cat was terrified and flew straight out of the cat flap. My wife was terrified of the 'clockwork mouse' as well.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 13, 2020, 11:12:00 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 13, 2020, 10:47:06 AM
The cat was fine although she looked rather startled - she was very dopey but affectionate. I recently bought a 'toy clockwork mouse' to entertain my present cat. However, when I received it looked more like a large black bubonic-plague rat. When I  first got it going my cat was terrified and flew straight out of the cat flap. My wife was terrified of the 'clockwork mouse' as well.

I suspect that she was wondering "What strange animal is that which spins around and around and around?"  Glad that cat was o.k.; a bummer about the LP though....hope that it wasn't a favorite of yours?  Or too soon to have even have been able to figure that out as your beloved launched herself onto it shortly after you had lowered the needle?

And the lengths that we will go to to entertain our 'babies'!   ;D

Best wishes,

PD

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 13, 2020, 10:11:14 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 13, 2020, 11:12:00 AM
I suspect that she was wondering "What strange animal is that which spins around and around and around?"  Glad that cat was o.k.; a bummer about the LP though....hope that it wasn't a favorite of yours?  Or too soon to have even have been able to figure that out as your beloved launched herself onto it shortly after you had lowered the needle?

And the lengths that we will go to to entertain our 'babies'!   ;D

Best wishes,

PD

PD
:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 10, 2020, 07:54:50 AM
I subscribe to the theory that eventually they will always turn up but Lyrita SRCS. 126 has tested this to the limit. Not prepared to pay £50+ on eBay but it has taken a long time coming - over 10 years! At last stumbled across a copy, not cheap or silly money either. The one Lyrita desired above all others and the rarest I believe, so delighted.

(https://i.imgur.com/7SSEebK.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 10, 2020, 09:35:27 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 10, 2020, 07:54:50 AM
I subscribe to the theory that eventually they will always turn up but Lyrita SRCS. 126 has tested this to the limit. Not prepared to pay £50+ on eBay but it has taken a long time coming - over 10 years! At last stumbled across a copy, not cheap or silly money either. The one Lyrita desired above all others and the rarest I believe, so delighted.

(https://i.imgur.com/7SSEebK.jpg)
Congratulations Irons!   :)  Did you find it in a shop or online?  Hope that it's in mint condition and most of all that you enjoy the music!

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 10, 2020, 12:33:11 PM
My replacement turntable turned up today (no pun intended) and this one seems to play at the right speed, also I've noticed that the sound is better quality through headphones. Nice to be playing some LPs again. This evening it was Rawsthorne's Piano Concerto No.2
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 10, 2020, 02:38:59 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 10, 2020, 12:33:11 PM
My replacement turntable turned up today (no pun intended) and this one seems to play at the right speed, also I've noticed that the sound is better quality through headphones. Nice to be playing some LPs again. This evening it was Rawsthorne's Piano Concerto No.2
(//)
Yeah!  Scary that the first one died so quickly though.  How many months had you had it for?  Hope that this one is sturdier and will be a faithful servant unto you and your LPs.   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 10, 2020, 11:26:32 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 10, 2020, 02:38:59 PM
Yeah!  Scary that the first one died so quickly though.  How many months had you had it for?  Hope that this one is sturdier and will be a faithful servant unto you and your LPs.   :)

PD
Thanks PD. Only had it since Christmas but it is a cheap turntable so I'm not expecting Bang and Olufsen. Amazon replaced it immediately and thanks for the good wishes.
Latest acquisition and ancient 10" LP of Robert Simpson's First Symphony:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 11, 2020, 12:38:28 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 10, 2020, 12:33:11 PM
My replacement turntable turned up today (no pun intended) and this one seems to play at the right speed, also I've noticed that the sound is better quality through headphones. Nice to be playing some LPs again. This evening it was Rawsthorne's Piano Concerto No.2
(//)

After you said you were ordering I gave the LP a spin. I preferred Lympany's recording of the first concerto.

I have never heard vinyl through headphones.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 11, 2020, 12:53:20 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 10, 2020, 09:35:27 AM
Congratulations Irons!   :)  Did you find it in a shop or online?  Hope that it's in mint condition and most of all that you enjoy the music!

Best wishes,

PD

At an Oxfam store, P. The trouble with Google is everyone has it and they did their homework. But still a bargain and I would willingly have paid more for it.

The condition for both cover and record is as new, plays superbly.

Walter Leigh is not a great loss to music through war as Butterworth was. His music is light and enjoyable if not distinguished. The Harpsichord Concerto is a fine piece though.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 11, 2020, 08:58:18 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 10, 2020, 07:54:50 AM
I subscribe to the theory that eventually they will always turn up but Lyrita SRCS. 126 has tested this to the limit. Not prepared to pay £50+ on eBay but it has taken a long time coming - over 10 years! At last stumbled across a copy, not cheap or silly money either. The one Lyrita desired above all others and the rarest I believe, so delighted.

(https://i.imgur.com/7SSEebK.jpg)

Good for you. It is wonderful when a collector finally tracks down something that they have been hunting for a long time.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 11, 2020, 11:41:13 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 11, 2020, 08:58:18 AM
Good for you. It is wonderful when a collector finally tracks down something that they have been hunting for a long time.
I agree. I also find that Harpsichord Concerto, especially it's slow movement, rather touching. I prefer the Neville Dilkes recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 11, 2020, 12:25:17 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 11, 2020, 11:41:13 AM
I agree. I also find that Harpsichord Concerto, especially it's slow movement, rather touching. I prefer the Neville Dilkes recording.

Jeffrey, impressive that Dilkes himself plays the harpsichord part.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 11, 2020, 01:12:28 PM
Quote from: Irons on March 11, 2020, 12:25:17 PM
Jeffrey, impressive that Dilkes himself plays the harpsichord part.
Oh yes, I'd forgotten that Lol. I'm sorry that we don't hear more of Neville Dilkes. His Moeran Symphony is my favourite recording of that great score.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Ratliff on March 11, 2020, 04:26:00 PM
Is this a thread for laments? There is only one piece of vinyl I can think of that I love, and that has never been on CD.

(https://www.fineday.co.jp/goodsimage/l/06/l06030004.jpg)

I rashly donated it, thinking I had a digital transfer of it on my hard disc. Now I can't find the digital transfer! Gone forever.  :'(

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 11, 2020, 10:20:32 PM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 11, 2020, 04:26:00 PM
Is this a thread for laments? There is only one piece of vinyl I can think of that I love, and that has never been on CD.

(https://www.fineday.co.jp/goodsimage/l/06/l06030004.jpg)

I rashly donated it, thinking I had a digital transfer of it on my hard disc. Now I can't find the digital transfer! Gone forever.  :'(

I just misread the title as 'Coronavirus Wien'  :o
My paranoia I suspect.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 12, 2020, 12:32:21 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 11, 2020, 10:20:32 PM
I just misread the title as 'Coronavirus Wien'  :o
My paranoia I suspect.

I'm praying that football grounds are closed this weekend. My son is working and I have promised my grandson I will take him. I don't want to go!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 12, 2020, 12:37:40 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 11, 2020, 04:26:00 PM
Is this a thread for laments? There is only one piece of vinyl I can think of that I love, and that has never been on CD.

(https://www.fineday.co.jp/goodsimage/l/06/l06030004.jpg)

I rashly donated it, thinking I had a digital transfer of it on my hard disc. Now I can't find the digital transfer! Gone forever.  :'(

What about all the stuff you haven't heard because it has never been on CD but would love if you did - if you follow my drift  ::)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on March 12, 2020, 01:58:52 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 11, 2020, 04:26:00 PM

(https://www.fineday.co.jp/goodsimage/l/06/l06030004.jpg)

This picture is precisely (I can name most of the musicians) how I saw them perform among others Bach's first orchestral suite (two oboes, bassoon, strings and continuo) in 1964. Very nostalgic. Thanks for posting it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on March 12, 2020, 02:05:13 AM
Quote from: aligreto on November 24, 2019, 07:31:51 AM
Most likely it is a function of ageing eyes in my case but I find certain LP labels difficult to read. I find them dark and fussy. It can sometimes be difficult for me to even determine which is Side 1. Other labels on the other hand are clear as a bell and present their information easily and readily.

Not a vinylhead, but I have problems with some CDs for the same reason and particularly problems with the booklets. The letters on the rear side of the LP covers were usually readable.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 03:29:50 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 11, 2020, 04:26:00 PM
Is this a thread for laments? There is only one piece of vinyl I can think of that I love, and that has never been on CD.

(https://www.fineday.co.jp/goodsimage/l/06/l06030004.jpg)

I rashly donated it, thinking I had a digital transfer of it on my hard disc. Now I can't find the digital transfer! Gone forever.  :'(
Oh, no!  Perhaps you could find a good but inexpensive copy online?  :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 03:42:48 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 12, 2020, 12:32:21 AM
I'm praying that football grounds are closed this weekend. My son is working and I have promised my grandson I will take him. I don't want to go!
More and more things/events are being cancelled here in the States Irons; I think that it would be more than fair (particularly knowing how much you love your football--not to mention your grandson) to have a talk with his parents.

Pres. Trump has now even issued a travel ban!   ???

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 04:32:09 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 11, 2020, 04:26:00 PM
Is this a thread for laments? There is only one piece of vinyl I can think of that I love, and that has never been on CD.

(https://www.fineday.co.jp/goodsimage/l/06/l06030004.jpg)

I rashly donated it, thinking I had a digital transfer of it on my hard disc. Now I can't find the digital transfer! Gone forever.  :'(
I believe that I found the same recording, but different cover here:  https://www.ebay.com/itm/BACH-Concerto-Movements-from-Cantatas-HARNONCOURT-Telefunken-6-41970-LP-NM/121225190858?hash=item1c39959dca:g:blgAAOxyzi9SmIAy

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 12, 2020, 07:41:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 12, 2020, 12:32:21 AM
I'm praying that football grounds are closed this weekend. My son is working and I have promised my grandson I will take him. I don't want to go!
My brother, now in his 70s, went to Chelsea v Liverpool about a week ago!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 07:56:22 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 12, 2020, 07:41:47 AM
My brother, now in his 70s, went to Chelsea v Liverpool about a week ago!
I just read that the ATP (men's tennis for those who don't know) has shut things down 'til April 27th.  I expect that the WTA will announce something similar.   :(  I'm sure that it's for the best.  Will be hardest, I think, for the lower ranked players in terms of income.  How they decide rankings and points, let alone whether or not they'll be able to reschedule the events, will be interesting to see!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 12, 2020, 08:14:10 AM
Wimbledon is looking vulnerable this year, P.

I have learnt a painful lesson never clean a cartridge with anything liquid, water or alcohol based.

The good people at Expert Stylus recommended this. Cheap and lasts a lifetime.
  https://www.amazon.co.uk/BERGEON-Bergeon-Professional-Cleaning-Rodico/dp/B008YMGYBU
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 12, 2020, 08:26:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 12, 2020, 08:14:10 AM

I have learnt a painful lesson never clean a cartridge with anything liquid, water or alcohol based.

The good people at Expert Stylus recommended this. Cheap and lasts a lifetime.
  https://www.amazon.co.uk/BERGEON-Bergeon-Professional-Cleaning-Rodico/dp/B008YMGYBU

I have not used it but I am considering this stylus cleaning method


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/713EuAL9gzL._SL1500_.jpg)


https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B004VEORZ0/?coliid=I2QPUCYR8T4O1W&colid=21QG0KG8MTO9O&psc=1
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 08:37:01 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 12, 2020, 08:14:10 AM
Wimbledon is looking vulnerable this year, P.

I have learnt a painful lesson never clean a cartridge with anything liquid, water or alcohol based.

The good people at Expert Stylus recommended this. Cheap and lasts a lifetime.
  https://www.amazon.co.uk/BERGEON-Bergeon-Professional-Cleaning-Rodico/dp/B008YMGYBU
:o :(  I hope that doesn't come to pass.  I did find this article after reading your comment though.  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-8102009/The-England-Club-cancel-Wimbledon-stage-iconic-event-without-spectators.html

I wonder whether or not that stuff that you use is the same thing that a certain MW from days gone by also used(es)?  I seem to recall him mentioning something along those lines?  How do you use it Irons?  I have some stuff that I've never used but was recommended by my audio guy.  It's by a company called Last...https://thelastfactory.com/product/last-stylus-cleaner/  So far, anyway, I've just used that little black brush that came with my cartridge.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 08:42:20 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 12, 2020, 08:26:16 AM
I have not used it but I am considering this stylus cleaning method


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/713EuAL9gzL._SL1500_.jpg)


https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B004VEORZ0/?coliid=I2QPUCYR8T4O1W&colid=21QG0KG8MTO9O&psc=1
Interesting, I hadn't heard of that before now.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 12, 2020, 09:35:49 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 08:42:20 AM
Interesting, I hadn't heard of that before now.

A friend of mine, who has 14,000+ LPs has recommended it to me. I reckon that if it is good enough for him........... ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 10:17:53 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 12, 2020, 09:35:49 AM
A friend of mine, who has 14,000+ LPs has recommended it to me. I reckon that if it is good enough for him........... ;D
14,000+ LPs!!! :o

I suspect that he listens to a number of different types of music?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 12, 2020, 10:41:32 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 10:17:53 AM
14,000+ LPs!!! :o

I suspect that he listens to a number of different types of music?

PD

You have no idea!!  ;D

One track from some obscure album was a recording of some guy smashing up plate glass.

He listens to regular stuff also  ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 12, 2020, 01:47:40 PM
Quote from: aligreto on March 12, 2020, 08:26:16 AM
I have not used it but I am considering this stylus cleaning method


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/713EuAL9gzL._SL1500_.jpg)


https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B004VEORZ0/?coliid=I2QPUCYR8T4O1W&colid=21QG0KG8MTO9O&psc=1

Seems safe which is the main thing. I had the stylus fall of the cantilever of my mono cartridge through using a alcohol based liquid.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 12, 2020, 02:05:18 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 08:37:01 AM
:o :(  I hope that doesn't come to pass.  I did find this article after reading your comment though.  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-8102009/The-England-Club-cancel-Wimbledon-stage-iconic-event-without-spectators.html

I wonder whether or not that stuff that you use is the same thing that a certain MW from days gone by also used(es)?  I seem to recall him mentioning something along those lines?  How do you use it Irons?  I have some stuff that I've never used but was recommended by my audio guy.  It's by a company called Last...https://thelastfactory.com/ ŷproduct/last-stylus-cleaner/  So far, anyway, I've just used that little black brush that came with my cartridge.

I think it was me who put MW on to it, P.
The Bergeon is used as a blob about the size of a pea. After every side with amplifier on gently move the blob to the stylus until hearing a click through speakers and that's it done. I have the blob stuck to the handle of one of those small stylus brushes.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 04:55:37 PM
Quote from: Irons on March 12, 2020, 02:05:18 PM
The Bergeon is used as a blob about the size of a pea. After every side with amplifier on gently move the blob to the stylus until hearing a click through speakers and that's it done. I have the blob stuck to the handle of one of those small stylus brushes.
Oh, neat!  No concerns re speakers though?  My thinking:  turn the volume off and run it through the 'stuff'.  And how do you keep it stuck to the handle and also not have the stylus hit the plastic of the handle?  A bit confused here....And do you use a brush to dust off any remnants from the 'stuff'?

Is the Last product that I mentioned in line with products that you've had problems with in the past?  Not certain what the  base component is of it. 

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 13, 2020, 01:31:01 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 12, 2020, 04:55:37 PM
Oh, neat!  No concerns re speakers though?  My thinking:  turn the volume off and run it through the 'stuff'.  And how do you keep it stuck to the handle and also not have the stylus hit the plastic of the handle?  A bit confused here....And do you use a brush to dust off any remnants from the 'stuff'?

Is the Last product that I mentioned in line with products that you've had problems with in the past?  Not certain what the  base component is of it. 

Best,

PD

No, speakers and system must be on at normal level. Without that you may go in too hard and damage the stylus. Easier to do then explain. There is no residue, that is the beauty of the stuff and it collects dust like a magnet. Watch repairers use it for cleaning the workings of watches. Has a consistency of blutack so stays where you place it.

Last has been around for years but not used it. Is it a liquid? If so I would not let it near any cartridge I own.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 13, 2020, 05:22:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 13, 2020, 01:31:01 AM
No, speakers and system must be on at normal level. Without that you may go in too hard and damage the stylus. Easier to do then explain. There is no residue, that is the beauty of the stuff and it collects dust like a magnet. Watch repairers use it for cleaning the workings of watches. Has a consistency of blutack so stays where you place it.

Last has been around for years but not used it. Is it a liquid? If so I would not let it near any cartridge I own.
Yes, it's a liquid which comes with its own brush.  I provided a link to it a few postings ago.  Thank you for the photo and info!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 14, 2020, 07:01:37 PM
Can one of the cognoscenti tell me the difference between these two boxes (Jorg Demus playing WTC on Intercord) ??

https://www.ebay.com/itm/F059-Demus-Bach-The-well-tempered-Clavier-Vol-2-Intercord-3-x-LP-Stereo/293052897874?_trkparms=aid%3D555021%26algo%3DPL.SIMRVI%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D225074%26meid%3D1f3069c8c49e42a3b1cc1aa784f66fa2%26pid%3D100752%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dpf%26sd%3D301711604037%26itm%3D293052897874%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplRVIAMLv5WebWithPLRVIOnTopCombiner&_trksid=p2047675.c100752.m1982

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rsQAAOSwR55Zl~YT/s-l1600.jpg)


https://www.ebay.com/itm/F034-Demus-Bach-Vol-2-The-well-tempered-Clavier-3-x-LP-Intercord-Stereo/293052196806?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D225074%26meid%3D9efe56c490424512aa773cd8a212c675%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dpf%26sd%3D293052897874%26itm%3D293052196806%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv5PairwiseWebWithBBEV1Filter&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/iTYAAOSwbElZblsR/s-l1600.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 15, 2020, 01:20:45 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 14, 2020, 07:01:37 PM
Can one of the cognoscenti tell me the difference between these two boxes (Jorg Demus playing WTC on Intercord) ??

https://www.ebay.com/itm/F059-Demus-Bach-The-well-tempered-Clavier-Vol-2-Intercord-3-x-LP-Stereo/293052897874?_trkparms=aid%3D555021%26algo%3DPL.SIMRVI%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D225074%26meid%3D1f3069c8c49e42a3b1cc1aa784f66fa2%26pid%3D100752%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dpf%26sd%3D301711604037%26itm%3D293052897874%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplRVIAMLv5WebWithPLRVIOnTopCombiner&_trksid=p2047675.c100752.m1982

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rsQAAOSwR55Zl~YT/s-l1600.jpg)


https://www.ebay.com/itm/F034-Demus-Bach-Vol-2-The-well-tempered-Clavier-3-x-LP-Intercord-Stereo/293052196806?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D225074%26meid%3D9efe56c490424512aa773cd8a212c675%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dpf%26sd%3D293052897874%26itm%3D293052196806%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv5PairwiseWebWithBBEV1Filter&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/iTYAAOSwbElZblsR/s-l1600.jpg)

Unable to offer much advice but I would certainly plump for the cheaper set. I have a few Intercord issues and the German pressings are very good indeed. I don't think you can go wrong here.

They are licensed from Westminster   https://www.bach-cantatas.com/NVP/Demus.htm
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 19, 2020, 01:49:05 AM
Found this over in Vinyl Asylum. The well known makers of turntables, Project have started to produce  LP records, a most surprising development. Difficult to navigate, and as for price and availability little information forthcoming, but this does look tempting.   https://www.project-audio.com/en/product/wiener-philharmoniker-herbert-von-karajan-richard-strauss/
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 19, 2020, 05:07:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 19, 2020, 01:49:05 AM
Found this over in Vinyl Asylum. The well known makers of turntables, Project have started to produce  LP records, a most surprising development. Difficult to navigate, and as for price and availability little information forthcoming, but this does look tempting.   https://www.project-audio.com/en/product/wiener-philharmoniker-herbert-von-karajan-richard-strauss/
Neat!  One question that does come to mind:  what kind of condition are the original tapes in these days?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 19, 2020, 05:50:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 19, 2020, 01:49:05 AM
Found this over in Vinyl Asylum. The well known makers of turntables, Project have started to produce  LP records, a most surprising development. Difficult to navigate, and as for price and availability little information forthcoming, but this does look tempting.   https://www.project-audio.com/en/product/wiener-philharmoniker-herbert-von-karajan-richard-strauss/

Very interesting as a life long advocate of the relationship between von Karajan and the music of Strauss.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 19, 2020, 07:58:17 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 19, 2020, 05:50:05 AM
Very interesting as a life long advocate of the relationship between von Karajan and the music of Strauss.

Karajan, Strauss and Decca is a heady mix. There is another issue of a double LP of Muti conducting Mozart symphonies. I do fancy the Karajan though.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 19, 2020, 10:39:03 PM
Quote from: Irons on March 15, 2020, 01:20:45 AM
Unable to offer much advice but I would certainly plump for the cheaper set. I have a few Intercord issues and the German pressings are very good indeed. I don't think you can go wrong here.

They are licensed from Westminster   https://www.bach-cantatas.com/NVP/Demus.htm

Thanks for your thoughts. My interest in buying any kind of goodies has kind of evaporated with the events of the last week or so. WE are OK on money for the time being (although my wife's place of employment is shuttered for the time being), but I am being very careful because obviously everything is up in the air at this point. Also cancelled our upcoming week's vacation to SF Bay Area and Central Coast--sucks, but these are first world problems in the grand scheme of things. ANd, I have a ton of unheard disks (CDs, LPs) lying around the house.

I hope all you other vinyl lovers are doing OK!!

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 25, 2020, 12:37:36 AM
Don't see many around these days but some good stuff released on the EMI Greensleeve mid-price label. Pretty labels too.

(https://i.imgur.com/V8ELcRE.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 25, 2020, 04:01:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 25, 2020, 12:37:36 AM
Don't see many around these days but some good stuff released on the EMI Greensleeve mid-price label. Pretty labels too.

(https://i.imgur.com/V8ELcRE.jpg)
Cool artwork!  ;D  Thank you for sharing that Irons!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 25, 2020, 07:43:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 25, 2020, 12:37:36 AM
Don't see many around these days but some good stuff released on the EMI Greensleeve mid-price label. Pretty labels too.

(https://i.imgur.com/V8ELcRE.jpg)
I remember that fine old LP!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 25, 2020, 12:21:39 PM
Where does HMV Greensleeve fit into the HMV pantheon?

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 26, 2020, 12:53:35 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 25, 2020, 12:21:39 PM
Where does HMV Greensleeve fit into the HMV pantheon?

Trust you are keeping well, P.

A mid-price label I would guess the vinyl equivalent of the "British Composers" series EMI released on CD. A mixture of new releases and re-issues made up the catalogue. I have noticed the prices hold up well, for example the Haendel VC of Britten/Walton is just as desirable on Greensleeves as full price EMI. Does not delve into the repertoire as Lyrita but masses of good recordings can be had. The series lasted a long time, right up to the "Large dog" period on the cusp of CD, see below.

 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on March 26, 2020, 01:55:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 26, 2020, 12:53:35 AM
Trust you are keeping well, P.

A mid-price label I would guess the vinyl equivalent of the "British Composers" series EMI released on CD. A mixture of new releases and re-issues made up the catalogue. I have noticed the prices hold up well, for example the Haendel VC of Britten/Walton is just as desirable on Greensleeves as full price EMI. Does not delve into the repertoire as Lyrita but masses of good recordings can be had. The series lasted a long time, right up to the "Large dog" period on the cusp of CD, see below.



Thanks for that info - the posting had me wondering. I have Boult's 1968 recording of RVW's A Sea Symphony on a HMV Greensleeves (subtitles English Heritage Series ) LP. The date on the record label is 1981 so it is a reissue. Off hand, it is the only HMVG  disc I think I have.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 26, 2020, 06:00:37 AM
Thank you for the info Irons.   :)

Trying hard to hang onto my sanity--like everyone else these days.   ::)  Walks (often) and looking for 'my hawk' help.

All the best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 26, 2020, 07:49:18 AM
Quote from: Biffo on March 26, 2020, 01:55:44 AM
Thanks for that info - the posting had me wondering. I have Boult's 1968 recording of RVW's A Sea Symphony on a HMV Greensleeves (subtitles English Heritage Series ) LP. The date on the record label is 1981 so it is a reissue. Off hand, it is the only HMVG  disc I think I have.

That follows English Heritage Series used for later issues (your Sea Symphony and my Delius). The earlier issues had a green band running along the top of cover. Interesting you have RVW 1st on Greensleeves, I do not recall ever seeing any other of his symphonies on the label.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on March 26, 2020, 08:58:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 26, 2020, 07:49:18 AM
That follows English Heritage Series used for later issues (your Sea Symphony and my Delius). The earlier issues had a green band running along the top of cover. Interesting you have RVW 1st on Greensleeves, I do not recall ever seeing any other of his symphonies on the label.

The others of that Boult cycle I have (Nos 2, 5, 6 & 7) I bought as full-priced LPs. I don't recall seeing many HMV Greensleeves issues at all.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 26, 2020, 11:20:34 AM
Quote from: Biffo on March 26, 2020, 08:58:31 AM
The others of that Boult cycle I have (Nos 2, 5, 6 & 7) I bought as full-priced LPs. I don't recall seeing many HMV Greensleeves issues at all.

Recordings of great authority. Putting my neck on the block, 6 and 9 are indispensable.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 27, 2020, 03:31:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 26, 2020, 11:20:34 AM
Recordings of great authority. Putting my neck on the block, 6 and 9 are indispensable.
I wouldn't dispute that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 28, 2020, 08:03:21 AM
I have just posted this box set in the Listening Thread but I feel that it is one that is appropriate for here also....


(https://img.discogs.com/vNkxGCbfw45V_fWqKpRKTR6lM5Q=/fit-in/600x589/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-9922613-1488618039-4235.jpeg.jpg)


I like it because it is a big, hinged box containing 8 LP's. What I like about it most is the very tactile nature of it. It is a cloth woven, thick cardboard box, very nice to feel and to touch. It also contains an excellent cycle.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Que on March 28, 2020, 11:30:35 AM
Quote from: Baron Scarpia on March 11, 2020, 04:26:00 PM
Is this a thread for laments? There is only one piece of vinyl I can think of that I love, and that has never been on CD.

(https://www.fineday.co.jp/goodsimage/l/06/l06030004.jpg)

I rashly donated it, thinking I had a digital transfer of it on my hard disc. Now I can't find the digital transfer! Gone forever.  :'(

https://www.discogs.com/Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Nikolaus-Harnoncourt-Concentus-Musicus-Wien-Sinfonia/release/6992790

Last reissue in 1983:
https://www.discogs.com/Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Nikolaus-Harnoncourt-Concentus-Musicus-Wien-Sinfonia/release/7051024



Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 29, 2020, 02:31:14 AM
Currently Playing:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 29, 2020, 02:41:02 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 29, 2020, 02:31:14 AM
Currently Playing:
(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=63434;image)

Small coincidence as I am [slowly] making my way through a set from the same edition


(https://www.popsike.com/pix/20110412/400209241585.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 29, 2020, 03:14:05 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 29, 2020, 02:41:02 AM
Small coincidence as I am [slowly] making my way through a set from the same edition


(https://www.popsike.com/pix/20110412/400209241585.jpg)
Interesting indeed Fergus.

Now playing:
(//)
I'm pleased to report that my replacement turntable plays at the right speed!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 29, 2020, 03:40:33 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 29, 2020, 03:14:05 AM

I'm pleased to report that my replacement turntable plays at the right speed!

Yes, I definitely find that helps a lot  ;)  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 29, 2020, 07:00:41 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 29, 2020, 03:14:05 AMI'm pleased to report that my replacement turntable plays at the right speed!

Hurrah!   ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 29, 2020, 12:02:14 PM
Quote from: aligreto on March 29, 2020, 03:40:33 AM
Yes, I definitely find that helps a lot  ;)  ;D

Yes, makes a big difference  ;D
And thanks to PD too  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 29, 2020, 06:33:42 PM
Flac-ed this today, a very beautiful recording in superb Westminster sound quality.

(http://trmsolutions.co.kr/music/westminster/w-images/xwn18398s.jpg)


I only have three clean LPs left in my stack. My audio dealer--whose Keith Monks machine I use--is closed for obvious reasons, so I am contemplating buying the entry-level VPI. At 600$, these are supposedly bullet-proof and will last forever. (I had a Nitty Gritty ages, ages ago, but it was kind of a POS and stopped working after a couple years.)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 29, 2020, 11:39:27 PM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 29, 2020, 06:33:42 PM
Flac-ed this today, a very beautiful recording in superb Westminster sound quality.

(http://trmsolutions.co.kr/music/westminster/w-images/xwn18398s.jpg)


I only have three clean LPs left in my stack. My audio dealer--whose Keith Monks machine I use--is closed for obvious reasons, so I am contemplating buying the entry-level VPI. At 600$, these are supposedly bullet-proof and will last forever. (I had a Nitty Gritty ages, ages ago, but it was kind of a POS and stopped working after a couple years.)

This may be worth checking out  https://www.whathifi.com/news/pro-ject-launches-two-new-record-cleaners-to-keep-your-vinyl-healthy
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 30, 2020, 05:34:08 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 29, 2020, 06:33:42 PM
Flac-ed this today, a very beautiful recording in superb Westminster sound quality.

(http://trmsolutions.co.kr/music/westminster/w-images/xwn18398s.jpg)


I only have three clean LPs left in my stack. My audio dealer--whose Keith Monks machine I use--is closed for obvious reasons, so I am contemplating buying the entry-level VPI. At 600$, these are supposedly bullet-proof and will last forever. (I had a Nitty Gritty ages, ages ago, but it was kind of a POS and stopped working after a couple years.)
I couldn't see your image on your original post, but I was able to copy the link and see it there (interesting?!).  Bet that it's a neat recording!  I love the Dumky.   :)

I have an Okki Nokki cleaner which I really like.  Looking at their website, I see that they have a couple of new versions.  This is the one that I own.  It's very sturdily built (=heavy to move) but does a quite decent job.  https://www.tonepublications.com/review/the-okki-nokki-record-cleaner/
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 31, 2020, 02:04:36 AM
I also have had an Okki Nokki RCM for some years now and find it quite effective.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 31, 2020, 12:02:11 PM
Quote from: aligreto on March 31, 2020, 02:04:36 AM
I also have had an Okki Nokki RCM for some years now and find it quite effective.
Do you, like me, also wear ear protection when you use it?  I grab the same heavy-duty ear protection headset that I wear when I do things like using my weed whacker! 

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 31, 2020, 08:46:57 PM
Thanks folks for the record cleaning machine rec's. Both the Project and Okki Nokki look really good being more compact and cheaper than the VPI (now $800 not 600!!). I just wonder about long-term reliability/longevity, as people I know with the VPIs have had them for nearly 30 years, and they are apparently bulletproof.

I am still holding off for now, but will keep in mind if things don't return to some semblance of normal in a few months. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 31, 2020, 08:50:17 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 30, 2020, 05:34:08 AM
...neat...

You sound like a member of my generation (born in the 70s!)

Do the phrases "Now you're cookin' with gas!" and/or "Lookie-Loo" mean anything to you?  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 01, 2020, 04:03:38 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on March 31, 2020, 08:50:17 PM
You sound like a member of my generation (born in the 70s!)

Do the phrases "Now you're cookin' with gas!" and/or "Lookie-Loo" mean anything to you?  8)
:-[ ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 01, 2020, 04:49:27 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 31, 2020, 12:02:11 PM
Do you, like me, also wear ear protection when you use it?  I grab the same heavy-duty ear protection headset that I wear when I do things like using my weed whacker! 

PD

Its not too bad but I don't really use it that often. I clean in batches rather than continuously and a lot of mine are done now..
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 03, 2020, 12:00:29 AM
Recordings from behind the old "Iron Curtain" are a treasure trove for collectors of vinyl and surprisingly they are readily available in the West. Possibly over-production by pressing plants led to dumping in the West.

Hungarian, Hungaroton/Qualiton with their distinctive yellow labels - I have never seen any other colour - are excellent pressings. This label served the rich legacy of the music of Hungary well. Hungaroton released every scrap of music composed by Bartok on LP for example.

(https://i.imgur.com/cslbfga.jpg)

Kodaly too is well served and typically not only the popular works. I am particularly impressed by Dances of Marosszék a rondo of fire-cracker and contemplative dances shaped into a whole.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 03, 2020, 05:57:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 03, 2020, 12:00:29 AM
Recordings from behind the old "Iron Curtain" are a treasure trove for collectors of vinyl and surprisingly they are readily available in the West. Possibly over-production by pressing plants led to dumping in the West.

Hungarian, Hungaroton/Qualiton with their distinctive yellow labels - I have never seen any other colour - are excellent pressings. This label served the rich legacy of the music of Hungary well. Hungaroton released every scrap of music composed by Bartok on LP for example.

(https://i.imgur.com/cslbfga.jpg)

Kodaly too is well served and typically not only the popular works. I am particularly impressed by Dances of Marosszék a rondo of fire-cracker and contemplative dances shaped into a whole.
I envy your access to Hungaroton!  I snap them up (either CD or LP) when I come across them.  I know that Qualiton was their importer here in the States, but did they also have their own label?

Any favorites of theirs Irons?  And any ones that you would consider not-that-thrilled-with/'duds' in terms of either the music and/or the performances?

Best wishes from her living room,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 04, 2020, 12:40:17 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 03, 2020, 05:57:36 AM
I envy your access to Hungaroton!  I snap them up (either CD or LP) when I come across them.  I know that Qualiton was their importer here in the States, but did they also have their own label?

Any favorites of theirs Irons?  And any ones that you would consider not-that-thrilled-with/'duds' in terms of either the music and/or the performances?

Best wishes from her living room,

PD

And best wishes from mine to yours, P.

Information on labels from the Soviet bloc is hard to come by (with the exception of Supraphon). You do pick up snippets and get some idea collecting them over the years but most is (educated) guess work. I am of the view that Qualiton and Hungaroton are the same. During the late 1970's or early 80's the Qualiton name was dropped. All the labels in the bloc were state owned and run, of course.

My rule of thumb is that the results of the recording of large-scale orchestras on all labels are variable (with one exception which will post later). I have puzzled for years how can it be that some are excellent and others are poor. Where Hungaroton come into their own is chamber and instrumental.

(https://i.imgur.com/5DpA1eL.jpg)

Many years ago I read an article which is so true. The Soviets allowed only a tiny proportion of a vast pool of gifted artists exposure in the West. Just because the names are unknown to us does not reflect how good they are. Hearing Mihaly Bacher  playing Beethoven Op.32 came as a revelation, a recording I treasure.

Stay safe.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 04, 2020, 05:20:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 04, 2020, 12:40:17 AM
And best wishes from mine to yours, P.

Information on labels from the Soviet bloc is hard to come by (with the exception of Supraphon). You do pick up snippets and get some idea collecting them over the years but most is (educated) guess work. I am of the view that Qualiton and Hungaroton are the same. During the late 1970's or early 80's the Qualiton name was dropped. All the labels in the bloc were state owned and run, of course.

My rule of thumb is that the results of the recording of large-scale orchestras on all labels are variable (with one exception which will post later). I have puzzled for years how can it be that some are excellent and others are poor. Where Hungaroton come into their own is chamber and instrumental.

(https://i.imgur.com/5DpA1eL.jpg)

Many years ago I read an article which is so true. The Soviets allowed only a tiny proportion of a vast pool of gifted artists exposure in the West. Just because the names are unknown to us does not reflect how good they are. Hearing Mihaly Bacher  playing Beethoven Op.32 came as a revelation, a recording I treasure.

Stay safe.
Hi Irons,

I found this on Hungaroton's website:

"About the Publisher


Hungarian Record Productions (MHV), the predecessor of Hungaroton Records, was founded in 1951 by the Hungarian state. It followed private-owned publishers previously owned by Hungarian, later by international companies, as a monopoly. From that time on almost only socialist countries brands (first of all Melodia, Supraphon and Eterna) meant competition for the Hungarian company for almost four decades long in Hungary. As a result of MHV's market position the whole Hungarian classical and pop music, even the best actors made their records at MHV. The archive counted a valuable set of ten thousand records.


Export started to grow stronger from the mid-60s, the brand name Qualiton was changed to Hungaroton. Qualiton remained the brand name for Hungarian music, Gipsy music and operetta. Later from the 1970s in terms of some internal commercialization individual pop music brands (Pepita, Bravó, Krém) were set up within the company. The 1970s and 1980s meant the Golden Age. The most popular pop singers and pop groups easily reached the then awarded Gold Record after one hundred records were sold. Classical records were sold all over the world in large numbers thanks to their excellent art and technical qualities and their relatively low price. Although pop music made more money, convertible currency coming from classical music exportations covered the price of imported raw materials.


Liberalization of the national market in 1988 put a halt to this. Western pop music records and talents of classical music that used to be almost inaccessible became available overnight. The turnover of Hungaroton started to decrease and on top of that repayment of the bank loans got for the construction of the record factory and warehouse in Dorog. These two pressures did almost shatter Hungaroton Hungarian Record Productions. Just before the company holding this name ceased its operations via liquidations, publishing activities were continued in different new companies. From 1992 pop music under the name of Hungaroton Gong, classical and folk music, literature, tale and other genres from 1993 under the name of Hungaroton in two separate limited liability companies.


Following long arrangements Hungaroton Records were privatized in 1995. The state required golden share in the privatized company in order to be able to control the archive, so it set up Hungaroton Music Rt. that had a share in the limited liability companies. The public limited company was privatized when the two limited companies results were going up. Hungaroton became a member of the Fotex Group and being in Hungarian ownership spared it from peculiar difficulties of multinational companies.


Classic and Gong were merged in 1998 and became Hungaroton Records Publishing Kft. The company is merged into Fotexnet Kft. on 1st January 2013 holding naturally both its publishing activity and its brand name. Its catalogue being present on the market includes a total of more than two thousand five hundred recordings of classical and pop music. Records earlier only available on Bakelite or cassette are being digitalized. These albums are available at Hungaroton Music Store an on iTunes.


Hungaroton's classical music artist team includes names of the past along with today's illustrious and future's promising talents, i.e. pianists: Annie Fischer, Tamás Vásáry, Péter Frankl, Ilona Prunyi, Zoltán Kocsis, Dezső Ránki, András Schiff, Gergely Bogányi, Alex Szilasi and Tihamér Hlavacsek; conductors: János Ferencsik, Tamás Vásáry, Iván Fischer, János Kovács, Zoltán Kocsis, György Vashegyi; violinists: Dénes Kovács, György Pauk, Vilmos Szabadi, Barnabás Kelemen, Antal Szalai; string-quartets: Tátrai, Bartók, Takács and Auer Quartets; chamber orchestras Liszt Ferenc, Erkel and Erdődy. A few prestigious artists who had been working abroad with exclusive contracts have recently started new records at Hungaroton (Kocsis, Schiff and Vásáry).


Hungaroton excels in world premiere publications and has a strong early music profile sealed with such names as Malcolm Bilson, Miklós Spányi, Anikó Horváth, Anneke Boeke, Benedek Csalog, Ildikó Kertész, Balázs Máté, Pál Németh, Róbert Mandel and several Hungarian and foreign colleagues. World famous Amadinda Percussion Group, a Cantemus and Pro Musica Girls'Choirs, the Hungarian National Philharmonic Orchestra and Choir make their records at Hungaroton.


The publisher's classical music profile includes never before recorded repertoire and outstanding works of Hungarian music. Just because of the aforementioned, Hungaroton Records uses the pitch "publisher of revelations". The "Bartók New Series", the second edition set of the composer has been experiencing significant success (the first edition was published by Hungaroton, too). Hungaroton's set of Kodály has been started as well. Furthermore, sets concentrating on a given genre have been published selecting from the work of Jenő Hubay, László Lajtha and Leó Weiner.


In pop music life's work of everlasting Hungarian stars is concentrated at Hungaroton as follows Zsuzsa Koncz, György Korda, Péter Máté, Pál Szécsi, Bikini, Illés, Omega, Neoton Família, Benkó Dixieland Band. In the genre of cabaret and pop music Géza Hofi represents the flagship. Children's favourite is Judit Halász either she sings, tells a story or guides them through the world of operas. When talking about folk music Márta Sebestyén and Kati Szvorák singers and Jánosi, Muzsikás and Vujicsics Group have to be highlighted. The best of the bests are queued here in the genre of Hungarian song, Gipsy music as well, e.g. Lakatos, Sánta and Kállai Kiss dynasties, the Budapest Gypsy Symphony Orchestra, Rajkó Band (Gipsy Orchestra) and dulcimer players such as Oszkár Ökrös, Apollónia Kovács, Erzsébet Talabér, Margit Bangó, Károly Solti and singing Ferenc Bessenyei who leads us to actors of literature discs: Zoltán Latinovits, László Mensáros, Imre Sinkovits, Irén Psota, Éva Ruttkay, Klári Tolnay and relics quarding own poetry recitals of poets.


Classical music recordings of the publisher have regularly received prizes at international competitions. In addition to awards by Diapason, Goldberg, Le Monde de la Musique, Pizzicato and other classical music journals, other awards are worth special mention, such as the three MIDEM-awards for the Dohnányi violin concertos (1999), the Bartók Complete Works (2002) and the first SACD of the Bartók New Series (The Wooden Prince, Kossuth – symphonic poem), as well as the Classical Internet Awards prize (2004) for an SACD conducted by Zoltán Kocsis. The most recent CD of the Bartók New Series comprising the violin sonatas performed by Barnabás Kelemen and Zoltán Kocsis won the ,,Recording of the Year" prize in the 2013 competition of Gramophone Awards in the chamber music category. Hungaroton released Beethoven's complete piano concertos in 2015 performed by Dénes Várjon and Concerto Budapest conducted by András Keller; the recording won the Gramofon Prize a year later in the category "Best Hungarian Classical Music CD". Another album entitled "Bartók the pianist" was also picked as "Best Historical Recording of theYear" and at the International Classical Music Awards (ICMA) voting in 2017; it was among the three top choices in the historical category. The Hungaroton label has produced several nominees during the past three years for ICMA, and two of its collections (Bartók the Pianist, 2017, - Best Historical Collection of the Year" category and The Great Book of Flute Sonatas, 2019 - ,,Best Collection" category) have made it to the final three nominees."

It's here:  https://hungarotonmusic.com/cegtortenet.html

A bit confusing to read (perhaps something lost in translation?).  They don't explain where/how/why Qualiton came into existence? It sounds like it might have initially been used as the label name for exports?

In any event, thank you for your thoughts and insight and I'll keep an eye out for Bacher!   :) :)

Must get in a walk today to keep my sanity.  Busy at the allotment?

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 04, 2020, 07:21:47 AM
That is most interesting P, and many thanks for taking the trouble to post. It is a fact that all record companies, and not only from that part of the world, do not follow a logical course. The article's answer to the Hungaroton/Qualiton conundrum sort of makes sense as the Tatrai Quartet recorded the complete Haydn SQ's and some boxes are on H and some on Q. I also notice that the Bartok Quartet have their early SQ set on Qualiton and middle SQ's on Hungaroton but the article states that Qualiton was for Hungarian music only, which Beethoven is plainly not. On the other hand, the names could have switched between the two sets, so yes, you probably have come up with the answer.
The US importer used the name Qualiton for recordings from Hungary but that is different and not to do with above.

Without the allotment I would be climbing up the wall by now! A beautiful sunny day which is the last thing the Government wants.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 04, 2020, 08:14:19 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 04, 2020, 05:20:29 AM
Hi Irons,

I found this on Hungaroton's website:

"About the Publisher


Hungarian Record Productions (MHV), the predecessor of Hungaroton Records, was founded in 1951 by the Hungarian state. It followed private-owned publishers previously owned by Hungarian, later by international companies, as a monopoly. From that time on almost only socialist countries brands (first of all Melodia, Supraphon and Eterna) meant competition for the Hungarian company for almost four decades long in Hungary. As a result of MHV's market position the whole Hungarian classical and pop music, even the best actors made their records at MHV. The archive counted a valuable set of ten thousand records.


Export started to grow stronger from the mid-60s, the brand name Qualiton was changed to Hungaroton. Qualiton remained the brand name for Hungarian music, Gipsy music and operetta. Later from the 1970s in terms of some internal commercialization individual pop music brands (Pepita, Bravó, Krém) were set up within the company. The 1970s and 1980s meant the Golden Age. The most popular pop singers and pop groups easily reached the then awarded Gold Record after one hundred records were sold. Classical records were sold all over the world in large numbers thanks to their excellent art and technical qualities and their relatively low price. Although pop music made more money, convertible currency coming from classical music exportations covered the price of imported raw materials.


Liberalization of the national market in 1988 put a halt to this. Western pop music records and talents of classical music that used to be almost inaccessible became available overnight. The turnover of Hungaroton started to decrease and on top of that repayment of the bank loans got for the construction of the record factory and warehouse in Dorog. These two pressures did almost shatter Hungaroton Hungarian Record Productions. Just before the company holding this name ceased its operations via liquidations, publishing activities were continued in different new companies. From 1992 pop music under the name of Hungaroton Gong, classical and folk music, literature, tale and other genres from 1993 under the name of Hungaroton in two separate limited liability companies.


Following long arrangements Hungaroton Records were privatized in 1995. The state required golden share in the privatized company in order to be able to control the archive, so it set up Hungaroton Music Rt. that had a share in the limited liability companies. The public limited company was privatized when the two limited companies results were going up. Hungaroton became a member of the Fotex Group and being in Hungarian ownership spared it from peculiar difficulties of multinational companies.


Classic and Gong were merged in 1998 and became Hungaroton Records Publishing Kft. The company is merged into Fotexnet Kft. on 1st January 2013 holding naturally both its publishing activity and its brand name. Its catalogue being present on the market includes a total of more than two thousand five hundred recordings of classical and pop music. Records earlier only available on Bakelite or cassette are being digitalized. These albums are available at Hungaroton Music Store an on iTunes.


Hungaroton's classical music artist team includes names of the past along with today's illustrious and future's promising talents, i.e. pianists: Annie Fischer, Tamás Vásáry, Péter Frankl, Ilona Prunyi, Zoltán Kocsis, Dezső Ránki, András Schiff, Gergely Bogányi, Alex Szilasi and Tihamér Hlavacsek; conductors: János Ferencsik, Tamás Vásáry, Iván Fischer, János Kovács, Zoltán Kocsis, György Vashegyi; violinists: Dénes Kovács, György Pauk, Vilmos Szabadi, Barnabás Kelemen, Antal Szalai; string-quartets: Tátrai, Bartók, Takács and Auer Quartets; chamber orchestras Liszt Ferenc, Erkel and Erdődy. A few prestigious artists who had been working abroad with exclusive contracts have recently started new records at Hungaroton (Kocsis, Schiff and Vásáry).


Hungaroton excels in world premiere publications and has a strong early music profile sealed with such names as Malcolm Bilson, Miklós Spányi, Anikó Horváth, Anneke Boeke, Benedek Csalog, Ildikó Kertész, Balázs Máté, Pál Németh, Róbert Mandel and several Hungarian and foreign colleagues. World famous Amadinda Percussion Group, a Cantemus and Pro Musica Girls'Choirs, the Hungarian National Philharmonic Orchestra and Choir make their records at Hungaroton.


The publisher's classical music profile includes never before recorded repertoire and outstanding works of Hungarian music. Just because of the aforementioned, Hungaroton Records uses the pitch "publisher of revelations". The "Bartók New Series", the second edition set of the composer has been experiencing significant success (the first edition was published by Hungaroton, too). Hungaroton's set of Kodály has been started as well. Furthermore, sets concentrating on a given genre have been published selecting from the work of Jenő Hubay, László Lajtha and Leó Weiner.


In pop music life's work of everlasting Hungarian stars is concentrated at Hungaroton as follows Zsuzsa Koncz, György Korda, Péter Máté, Pál Szécsi, Bikini, Illés, Omega, Neoton Família, Benkó Dixieland Band. In the genre of cabaret and pop music Géza Hofi represents the flagship. Children's favourite is Judit Halász either she sings, tells a story or guides them through the world of operas. When talking about folk music Márta Sebestyén and Kati Szvorák singers and Jánosi, Muzsikás and Vujicsics Group have to be highlighted. The best of the bests are queued here in the genre of Hungarian song, Gipsy music as well, e.g. Lakatos, Sánta and Kállai Kiss dynasties, the Budapest Gypsy Symphony Orchestra, Rajkó Band (Gipsy Orchestra) and dulcimer players such as Oszkár Ökrös, Apollónia Kovács, Erzsébet Talabér, Margit Bangó, Károly Solti and singing Ferenc Bessenyei who leads us to actors of literature discs: Zoltán Latinovits, László Mensáros, Imre Sinkovits, Irén Psota, Éva Ruttkay, Klári Tolnay and relics quarding own poetry recitals of poets.


Classical music recordings of the publisher have regularly received prizes at international competitions. In addition to awards by Diapason, Goldberg, Le Monde de la Musique, Pizzicato and other classical music journals, other awards are worth special mention, such as the three MIDEM-awards for the Dohnányi violin concertos (1999), the Bartók Complete Works (2002) and the first SACD of the Bartók New Series (The Wooden Prince, Kossuth – symphonic poem), as well as the Classical Internet Awards prize (2004) for an SACD conducted by Zoltán Kocsis. The most recent CD of the Bartók New Series comprising the violin sonatas performed by Barnabás Kelemen and Zoltán Kocsis won the ,,Recording of the Year" prize in the 2013 competition of Gramophone Awards in the chamber music category. Hungaroton released Beethoven's complete piano concertos in 2015 performed by Dénes Várjon and Concerto Budapest conducted by András Keller; the recording won the Gramofon Prize a year later in the category "Best Hungarian Classical Music CD". Another album entitled "Bartók the pianist" was also picked as "Best Historical Recording of theYear" and at the International Classical Music Awards (ICMA) voting in 2017; it was among the three top choices in the historical category. The Hungaroton label has produced several nominees during the past three years for ICMA, and two of its collections (Bartók the Pianist, 2017, - Best Historical Collection of the Year" category and The Great Book of Flute Sonatas, 2019 - ,,Best Collection" category) have made it to the final three nominees."

It's here:  https://hungarotonmusic.com/cegtortenet.html

A bit confusing to read (perhaps something lost in translation?).  They don't explain where/how/why Qualiton came into existence? It sounds like it might have initially been used as the label name for exports?

In any event, thank you for your thoughts and insight and I'll keep an eye out for Bacher!   :) :)

Must get in a walk today to keep my sanity.  Busy at the allotment?

Best wishes,

PD

Irons,

I also found this on Discogs:  https://www.discogs.com/label/57574-Qualiton  and https://www.discogs.com/label/882260-Tonalit

To add a bit more confusion.  Have you ever run across any of the Tonalit records?  I see that they were 10 inch shellacs.  Do you have the capacity chez vous to be able to play those?

I should probably work outside a bit today.  Am debating on whether or not to bring trash to the local transfer station:  people?   :-\  Has your country started suggestion that one wear masks?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 05, 2020, 06:15:03 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 04, 2020, 08:14:19 AM
Irons,

I also found this on Discogs:  https://www.discogs.com/label/57574-Qualiton  and https://www.discogs.com/label/882260-Tonalit

To add a bit more confusion.  Have you ever run across any of the Tonalit records?  I see that they were 10 inch shellacs.  Do you have the capacity chez vous to be able to play those?

I should probably work outside a bit today.  Am debating on whether or not to bring trash to the local transfer station:  people?   :-\  Has your country started suggestion that one wear masks?

A huge discography and as you say features a fair bit of Hungarian folk music. Tonalit, I have not heard of, and yes my TT does play 78's but has not played one, or a 45 either come to that.

The Hungaroton Bartok edition is pretty amazing. They recorded literally everything he wrote, published or not. All issues included detailed notes in a a gatefold/book format.

If I could get my hands on a mask I would wear one, P. I am sad to say with the fabulous weather this weekend the British public are flagrantly ignoring lock-down instructions. 

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: ritter on April 05, 2020, 06:35:24 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 05, 2020, 06:15:03 AM
...
The Hungaroton Bartok edition is pretty amazing. They recorded literally everything he wrote, published or not. All issues included detailed notes in a a gatefold/book format.
...
Yes! I had several of those issues decades ago (they were my first exposure to Bartók's music, along with the Boulez recordings on Columbia) and they were very beautifully produced.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 05, 2020, 07:30:28 AM
I do have one from that edition.  It has "Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta"; "The Miraculous Mandarin (concert suite)" with György Lehel and the Budapest SO.  Looks like it's Vol. 8 of the Orchestral Works.  Can't find a cover of it.

I did see on Amazon that the CD set of it is going for big bucks!   :(  Didn't catch how many CDs were in it.  I noticed on the back of the LP that I have, they posted a "Draft Program of the Complete Edition" including some posthumous works.  Under that at the bottom "These four records which contain the posthumous works will be followed by others depending on the publication of other compositions written during his youth or unpublished as yet.

Think that I might try and make a list of ones to have on hand should I run across any more of them...or maybe just of the one that I do have?

How many of them do you own Irons?

Ritter, do you recall which ones you had and how you liked them?

Will have to look later and see who all is playing violin and also who plays the piano in his concertos.

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 06, 2020, 12:08:35 AM
I have noticed quite a mix of participants in the series. Both labels also issued many Bartok records outside of the Complete Edition.

P, I do own the VC recording - my favourite Bartok work - with Kovacs Dénes (violin) and Budapest SO conducted by Lukacs Ervin. This is coupled with the two Rhapsodies for Violin and Orchestra.

PC3 from the edition is missing from my shelves. PC 1&2 is Zoltan Kocsis and same orchestra with Gyorgy Lehel.

It would not surprise me if the above works are repeated in the series with other artists.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 06, 2020, 12:25:03 AM
Quote from: ritter on April 05, 2020, 06:35:24 AM
Yes! I had several of those issues decades ago (they were my first exposure to Bartók's music, along with the Boulez recordings on Columbia) and they were very beautifully produced.

Some of the sets have the dates published in small print which is unusual for East European labels (Melodiya excepted). The earliest I have is 1967 - bound to be many before then - and stretches through the 1970's.
As you say they are beautifully turned out with details of works and artists in English translation along with many photos. I was interested to read from PD that the edition had a CD release but for big money. I didn't know that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 06, 2020, 05:18:12 AM
The violin concerto, etc. LP looks quite tempting (though I don't know anything about the musicians nor conductors involved).

Here's a link to the complete set on CD on Amazon.com:  https://www.amazon.com/Hungarotons-Bartok-B/dp/B00004YLIJ/ref=sr_1_22?crid=3PFYM6N10E611&dchild=1&keywords=bartok+complete+edition&qid=1586178902&sprefix=complete+bartok+ed%2Caps%2C200&sr=8-22

Ouch!

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 06, 2020, 06:42:55 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 06, 2020, 05:18:12 AM
The violin concerto, etc. LP looks quite tempting (though I don't know anything about the musicians nor conductors involved).

Here's a link to the complete set on CD on Amazon.com:  https://www.amazon.com/Hungarotons-Bartok-B/dp/B00004YLIJ/ref=sr_1_22?crid=3PFYM6N10E611&dchild=1&keywords=bartok+complete+edition&qid=1586178902&sprefix=complete+bartok+ed%2Caps%2C200&sr=8-22

Ouch!

Best wishes,

PD

Gordon Bennett!

Stay safe, P.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 06, 2020, 07:07:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 06, 2020, 06:42:55 AM
Gordon Bennett!

Stay safe, P.
Will do my best!  And you too.  Will hit the garden soon.  Sunny out, so it should be nice.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: ritter on April 06, 2020, 08:09:49 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 05, 2020, 07:30:28 AM

Ritter, do you recall which ones you had and how you liked them?

Sorry for the late reply, PD. One of them definitely was The Wooden Prince Irons pictured above. Also IIRC, an LP with the Piano Concerto No. 3, and then another with Duke Bluebeard's Castle. I remember enjoying them at the time, but it's been more than 30 years since I'm separated from them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 06, 2020, 09:22:11 AM
Thanks Ritter!   :)

By the way Irons, I had to look up what Gordon Bennett meant (though I had a hunch what you meant)!  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 06, 2020, 09:56:32 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 06, 2020, 09:22:11 AM
Thanks Ritter!   :)

By the way Irons, I had to look up what Gordon Bennett meant (though I had a hunch what you meant)!  ;)

PD

It is odd that a well known and used cockney (which I am) term is derived from a fellow countryman of yours, P.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 07, 2020, 04:33:49 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 06, 2020, 09:56:32 AM
It is odd that a well known and used cockney (which I am) term is derived from a fellow countryman of yours, P.
:laugh: Too true! :)

And you're certainly not a 'used cockney'!!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 08, 2020, 12:13:05 AM
Thought I would make Bulgaria next port of call wandering around the Soviet Bloc. Nice beaches and good vinyl pressing plants too which go under the name Balkanton.

(https://i.imgur.com/z8inUvs.jpg)

The liner notes contain a most ridiculous statement "There is very much in common between the early preludes and Shostakovich's last completed composition ". In my opinion the transcription by Strahov of the Preludes for piano to viola and piano devalues the pieces and comparing them to the viola sonata is like comparing blancmange with marmite.

Listening to the Adagio finale of the sonata is slightly uncomfortable as if eavesdropping on a composer's thoughts at the realisation of a lifetime's work is about to end. Both the recording and performance are excellent. Again it is chamber and instrumental where East European engineers excel.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 08, 2020, 07:25:55 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 08, 2020, 12:13:05 AM
Thought I would make Bulgaria next port of call wandering around the Soviet Bloc. Nice beaches and good vinyl pressing plants too which go under the name Balkanton.

(https://i.imgur.com/z8inUvs.jpg)

The liner notes contain a most ridiculous statement "There is very much in common between the early preludes and Shostakovich's last completed composition ". In my opinion the transcription by Strahov of the Preludes for piano to viola and piano devalues the pieces and comparing them to the viola sonata is like comparing blancmange with marmite.

Listening to the Adagio finale of the sonata is slightly uncomfortable as if eavesdropping on a composer's thoughts at the realisation of a lifetime's work is about to end. Both the recording and performance are excellent. Again it is chamber and instrumental where East European engineers excel.
I don't think that I've run across any of their records before Irons, but will now keep an eye out for sure!

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 11, 2020, 06:54:51 AM
Irons and/or anyone else here:

Is anyone familiar with Lillian Fuchs' (the violist) recordings?  I had mentioned here in the current listening thread and didn't get any replies.  Any recs would be appreciated!   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 12, 2020, 01:34:37 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 11, 2020, 06:54:51 AM
Irons and/or anyone else here:

Is anyone familiar with Lillian Fuchs' (the violist) recordings?  I had mentioned here in the current listening thread and didn't get any replies.  Any recs would be appreciated!   :)

PD

Wish I could help, P. Looking her up obviously an important artist. It seems most of her recordings were on American Decca which has no connection with UK Decca. On Discogs apparently the only issue in Europe is a DG Mozart, there must be others. The name does ring a bell but I think that may be her brother. Lets hope another forum member can come up with something worthwhile.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 12, 2020, 03:12:32 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 12, 2020, 01:34:37 AM
Wish I could help, P. Looking her up obviously an important artist. It seems most of her recordings were on American Decca which has no connection with UK Decca. On Discogs apparently the only issue in Europe is a DG Mozart, there must be others. The name does ring a bell but I think that may be her brother. Lets hope another forum member can come up with something worthwhile.
Thanks Irons,  I'll keep an eye out for her records in my neck of the woods.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 12, 2020, 04:55:54 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 12, 2020, 03:12:32 AM
Thanks Irons,  I'll keep an eye out for her records in my neck of the woods.

PD

I knew the name rung a bell. I have Joseph Fuchs playing the Hindemith concerto with Mozart 3 on WRC from Everest.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 12, 2020, 05:17:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 12, 2020, 04:55:54 AM
I knew the name rung a bell. I have Joseph Fuchs playing the Hindemith concerto with Mozart 3 on WRC from Everest.
Ah, I knew that you must have something from that musical family in those copious record towers of yours!   :D 8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 14, 2020, 07:31:56 AM
Roy Harris: 3rd Symphony on Classics and Vinyl.

https://youtu.be/AS3qIrHkW9Y
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Christo on April 14, 2020, 09:30:40 AM
Still the best performance of one of the finest symphonies I know, the epic Symphony No. 1 (1940) by Eugene Goossens, a recording that never made it to cd:
(https://img.discogs.com/QHhEEFnGeMbBxISWAzWeXrdjVWY=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7874673-1494757780-5085.gif.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: XB-70 Valkyrie on April 14, 2020, 09:31:58 PM
Of some relevance, Joseph Fuchs was a great and largely unknown (in this era) violinist. If you can find him playing the R. Strauss violin sonata with Arthur Balsam (Decca DL 9836), it is a stupendous performance. I also have Joseph and Lilian playing the Mozart Duos (Decca 8523) on another LP that was selling for a ton of money years ago, but was on eBay for a buck or something (these prices vary WILDLY) recently. I bought mine for very little. Will have to listen to that one again.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 14, 2020, 11:44:33 PM
Quote from: Christo on April 14, 2020, 09:30:40 AM
Still the best performance of one of the finest symphonies I know, the epic Symphony No. 1 (1940) by Eugene Goossens, a recording that never made it to cd:
(https://img.discogs.com/QHhEEFnGeMbBxISWAzWeXrdjVWY=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7874673-1494757780-5085.gif.jpg)

Never made it on my shelves either! Two attempts both poor copies. One day........
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 15, 2020, 02:24:47 AM
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on April 14, 2020, 09:31:58 PM
Of some relevance, Joseph Fuchs was a great and largely unknown (in this era) violinist. If you can find him playing the R. Strauss violin sonata with Arthur Balsam (Decca DL 9836), it is a stupendous performance. I also have Joseph and Lilian playing the Mozart Duos (Decca 8523) on another LP that was selling for a ton of money years ago, but was on eBay for a buck or something (these prices vary WILDLY) recently. I bought mine for very little. Will have to listen to that one again.
Thanks!  I'll make note of them.   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 15, 2020, 02:26:50 AM
Quote from: Christo on April 14, 2020, 09:30:40 AM
Still the best performance of one of the finest symphonies I know, the epic Symphony No. 1 (1940) by Eugene Goossens, a recording that never made it to cd:
(https://img.discogs.com/QHhEEFnGeMbBxISWAzWeXrdjVWY=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7874673-1494757780-5085.gif.jpg)
I don't recall hearing anything by Goosens before--though his name is oddly familiar.  Was he better known for being a conductor?  Wondering if that might be why his name is familiar to me?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 15, 2020, 08:15:34 AM
Quote from: Christo on April 14, 2020, 09:30:40 AM
Still the best performance of one of the finest symphonies I know, the epic Symphony No. 1 (1940) by Eugene Goossens, a recording that never made it to cd:
(https://img.discogs.com/QHhEEFnGeMbBxISWAzWeXrdjVWY=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7874673-1494757780-5085.gif.jpg)
Totally agree. Measham was a fine conductor who died too young.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 15, 2020, 08:16:59 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 15, 2020, 02:26:50 AM
I don't recall hearing anything by Goosens before--though his name is oddly familiar.  Was he better known for being a conductor?  Wondering if that might be why his name is familiar to me?

PD
Hi PD,
Yes, much better known as a conductor but I rate both of his symphonies very highly.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 15, 2020, 08:28:14 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 15, 2020, 08:16:59 AM
Hi PD,
Yes, much better known as a conductor but I rate both of his symphonies very highly.
Thanks!  I suspected as much!   :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 15, 2020, 09:11:21 AM
Currently playing: Gordon Jacob 'Concerto for Phyllis and Cyril' a concerto for three hands on one or two pianos.
Sadly never issued on CD:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: staxomega on April 21, 2020, 11:32:33 AM
Has anyone bought new pressings from DG? I bought Krystian Zimerman's latest Schubert double LP set and it was quite noisy.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 24, 2020, 06:51:40 AM
Quote from: hvbias on April 21, 2020, 11:32:33 AM
Has anyone bought new pressings from DG? I bought Krystian Zimerman's latest Schubert double LP set and it was quite noisy.

Not good. Who pressed them?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 25, 2020, 03:14:11 AM
I was looking up something else recently and I stumbled across the "Ace of Clubs" image below. Now, I obviously know the "Ace of Clubs" label but I must admit that I have never come across this particular version of it before.


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/6tQAAOSwlndZFgJJ/s-l1600.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 25, 2020, 06:41:07 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 25, 2020, 03:14:11 AM
I was looking up something else recently and I stumbled across the "Ace of Clubs" image below. Now, I obviously know the "Ace of Clubs" label but I must admit that I have never come across this particular version of it before.


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/6tQAAOSwlndZFgJJ/s-l1600.jpg)

I am fairly certain it is a late ACL pressing. The last pressings before Decca ceased the Ace of Clubs sub-label and moved onto "Ace of Diamonds".
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on April 25, 2020, 06:58:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 25, 2020, 06:41:07 AM
I am fairly certain it is a late ACL pressing. The last pressings before Decca ceased the Ace of Clubs sub-label and moved onto "Ace of Diamonds".

My recollection is that Ace of Diamonds and Ace of Clubs were concurrent, the former being mid-price and the latter bargain price. I still have Sibelius 5 from Collins/LSO in mono on ACL with the sleeve notes dated 1969. I used to have Smetana Ma Vlast from Kubelik/VPO on ACD. I bought both round about the same time. An older reissue I have is Beethoven 3 from Kleiber/VPO on ACL but that was secondhand. I didn't buy many of either label and have no record of how much I paid for them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: staxomega on April 25, 2020, 07:09:07 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 24, 2020, 06:51:40 AM
Not good. Who pressed them?

I'm not too certain, is there a way to tell? I'll copy what I wrote on another forum:

Years ago Pallas vinyl would have sort of a "sharp edge" and maybe a Pallas pressing code in the dead wax. I am not seeing either here; the edge is like most vinyl and all the information in the deadwax is neatly hand written. Here is a picture of the inner sleeve it came in:

(https://i.imgur.com/7VPhEqW.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 25, 2020, 07:59:48 AM
Quote from: hvbias on April 25, 2020, 07:09:07 AM
I'm not too certain, is there a way to tell? I'll copy what I wrote on another forum:

Years ago Pallas vinyl would have sort of a "sharp edge" and maybe a Pallas pressing code in the dead wax. I am not seeing either here; the edge is like most vinyl and all the information in the deadwax is neatly hand written. Here is a picture of the inner sleeve it came in:

(https://i.imgur.com/7VPhEqW.jpg)

There is some discussion here  https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/dg-classics-aaa-reissues.819541/

I am surprised the label is black. A facsimile copy by someone such as "Speakers Corner" would have the famous yellow label. I do not know how current this issue is but I recall at a Hi-Fi show a good few years ago a series of DG recordings with black labels from the Far East, I can't remember Japan or China. Possibly not worth mentioning but the last Lyrita pressings post Decca and Nimbus were sourced from the Europe mainland and they had hand written inscriptions on the dead wax. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 25, 2020, 08:13:35 AM
Quote from: Biffo on April 25, 2020, 06:58:05 AM
My recollection is that Ace of Diamonds and Ace of Clubs were concurrent, the former being mid-price and the latter bargain price. I still have Sibelius 5 from Collins/LSO in mono on ACL with the sleeve notes dated 1969. I used to have Smetana Ma Vlast from Kubelik/VPO on ACD. I bought both round about the same time. An older reissue I have is Beethoven 3 from Kleiber/VPO on ACL but that was secondhand. I didn't buy many of either label and have no record of how much I paid for them.

Ace of Clubs (ACL) are remastered LXT which are all mono recordings. LXT was first launched in 1950 and produced until 1969, after which all new releases were stereo only.
Ace of Diamonds (SDD) are re-releases of SXL stereo recordings. The first SXL was released in 1958.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on April 25, 2020, 08:20:12 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 25, 2020, 08:13:35 AM
Ace of Clubs (ACL) are remastered LXT which are all mono recordings. LXT was first launched in 1950 and produced until 1969, after which all new releases were stereo only.
Ace of Diamonds (SDD) are re-releases of SXL stereo recordings. The first SXL was released in 1958.

Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: ritter on April 25, 2020, 08:34:43 AM
Wasn't Ace of Diamonds to Decca what Richmond  was to London?

I still remember my first Richmond set, Karl Böhm's 1955 recording of Strauss's Die Frau ohne Schatten, the only available recording of the work at the time (mid 70s, the 1963 DG under Keiberth was OOP at the time, and Böhm's second recording—live , also on DG—had not yet been released).

(https://img.discogs.com/sCaPehUJ2V7_JmmkQZkYrdQul28=/fit-in/415x426/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7165332-1435174501-7174.png.jpg)

The quality of these Richmond LPs was rather poor....
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 25, 2020, 10:01:40 AM
Quote from: ritter on April 25, 2020, 08:34:43 AM
Wasn't Ace of Diamonds to Decca what Richmond  was to London?

I still remember my first Richmond set, Karl Böhm's 1955 recording of Strauss's Die Frau ohne Schatten, the only available recording of the work at the time (mid 70s, the 1963 DG under Keiberth was OOP at the time, and Böhm's second recording—live , also on DG—had not yet been released).

(https://img.discogs.com/sCaPehUJ2V7_JmmkQZkYrdQul28=/fit-in/415x426/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7165332-1435174501-7174.png.jpg)

The quality of these Richmond LPs was rather poor....

I would say for certain, yes.

A never ending debate between vinyl heads is the difference if any between Decca and London LPs.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: staxomega on April 25, 2020, 12:43:33 PM
Quote from: Irons on April 25, 2020, 07:59:48 AM
There is some discussion here  https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/dg-classics-aaa-reissues.819541/

I am surprised the label is black. A facsimile copy by someone such as "Speakers Corner" would have the famous yellow label. I do not know how current this issue is but I recall at a Hi-Fi show a good few years ago a series of DG recordings with black labels from the Far East, I can't remember Japan or China. Possibly not worth mentioning but the last Lyrita pressings post Decca and Nimbus were sourced from the Europe mainland and they had hand written inscriptions on the dead wax.

This is a new recording from a couple of years ago (released by DG themselves), that might be why they're using the black label instead of a reproduction label. Or maybe they did it to suit the theme of the album which is mostly black album art. I'm going to get a replacement, I'll update how it is.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71X-ZPoA2NL._SY355_.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 25, 2020, 12:46:20 PM
Quote from: hvbias on April 25, 2020, 12:43:33 PM
This is a new recording from a couple of years ago (released by DG themselves), that might be why they're using the black label instead of a reproduction label. I'm going to get a replacement, I'll update how it is.
Sorry to hear that the sound/pressing isn't good.  I'll have to go back and re-visit some of my DG LPs.  I believe that I remember reading some time ago (somewhere!?) that DG pressings had a tendency to be that way (and this was referring to older LP pressings).

What do others here think of DG pressings overall?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: staxomega on April 25, 2020, 12:52:10 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 25, 2020, 12:46:20 PM
Sorry to hear that the sound/pressing isn't good.  I'll have to go back and re-visit some of my DG LPs.  I believe that I remember reading some time ago (somewhere!?) that DG pressings had a tendency to be that way (and this was referring to older LP pressings).

What do others here think of DG pressings overall?

PD

Thank you PD but I don't think it's worth the trouble. These new pressings seem to reflect the problem with the vinyl world today - too much demand with too few plants, pressing plants over stressed, slipping quality control and so on.

Unfortunately with this Zimerman album this is the only pressing that exists since it's a new recording. It was a fine recording to show off a hifi product we're developing which is why I was keen on it instead of just buying the CD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 25, 2020, 12:59:32 PM
Quote from: hvbias on April 25, 2020, 12:52:10 PM
Thank you PD but I don't think it's worth the trouble. These new pressings seem to reflect the problem with the vinyl world today - too much demand with too few plants, pressing plants over stressed, slipping quality control and so on.

Unfortunately with this Zimerman album this is the only pressing that exists since it's a new recording. It was a fine recording to show off a hifi product we're developing which is why I was keen on it instead of just buying the CD.
You would have thought that some new plants might have opened up?  Or perhaps the PTB don't think that the demand for them will last?

Sounds like you are having fun developing a new turntable?   :)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 25, 2020, 11:41:45 PM
I remember Ace of Diamonds as the stereo version and Ace of Clubs as the mono recordings but this is no doubt too simplistic as some of the mono recordings were then converted into 'reprocessed stereo' which, I recall, did not have a good reputation.
Currently enjoying this LP:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 26, 2020, 12:21:03 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 25, 2020, 11:41:45 PM
I remember Ace of Diamonds as the stereo version and Ace of Clubs as the mono recordings but this is no doubt too simplistic as some of the mono recordings were then converted into 'reprocessed stereo' which, I recall, did not have a good reputation.
Currently enjoying this LP:
(//)

Off the top of my head, I should check, but I think Decca put all their fake stereo on "Eclipse".

That is a fabulous cover, Jeffrey. One of the best.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 26, 2020, 12:34:28 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 25, 2020, 12:59:32 PM
You would have thought that some new plants might have opened up?  Or perhaps the PTB don't think that the demand for them will last?



Best,

PD

I read an article recently where the MD of Nimbus was asked due to the resurgence of interest in vinyl would he consider reopening their pressing plants. He said that he would not give it even a moment's consideration as the operation is fraught with difficulties and a dangerous and uncomfortable working environment.

DG had a bit of a reputation but not due to pressings. Most of the LPs released in the UK were pressed by Phillips.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on April 26, 2020, 01:10:27 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 26, 2020, 12:34:28 AM
I read an article recently where the MD of Nimbus was asked due to the resurgence of interest in vinyl would he consider reopening their pressing plants. He said that he would not give it even a moment's consideration as the operation is fraught with difficulties and a dangerous and uncomfortable working environment.

DG had a bit of a reputation but not due to pressings. Most of the LPs released in the UK were pressed by Phillips.

I have too many DG LPs to start checking this but I find it odd. I don't recall having any problems of any kind with DG but numerous flaws, including bad pressings, with Philips. I purchased a badly pressed Philips disc of Beethoven disc from Arrau and it went back to the shop so many times they gave up and I got a refund. A box set of Mahler symphonies (Haitink/Concertgebouw) went back at least three times before I got a perfect set of six discs.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 26, 2020, 01:55:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 26, 2020, 12:21:03 AM
Off the top of my head, I should check, but I think Decca put all their fake stereo on "Eclipse".

That is a fabulous cover, Jeffrey. One of the best.

Ah yes, the famous Decca Eclipse label that I owe so much to, having made so many inexpensive classical discoveries through it.

Yes that RCA LP cover is lovely and I was so glad that they reproduced a mini version of it when RCA released their Morton Gould boxed CD set. The LP also features my favourite recording of Rimsky Korsakov's 'Antar' which is the perfect coupling for Miaskovsky's 21st Symphony. I'm listening to it now.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on April 26, 2020, 03:23:50 AM
Quote from: Biffo on April 26, 2020, 01:10:27 AM
I have too many DG LPs to start checking this but I find it odd. I don't recall having any problems of any kind with DG but numerous flaws, including bad pressings, with Philips. I purchased a badly pressed Philips disc of Beethoven disc from Arrau and it went back to the shop so many times they gave up and I got a refund. A box set of Mahler symphonies (Haitink/Concertgebouw) went back at least three times before I got a perfect set of six discs.

I collected vinyl from the 1960es to the late 1980es. One of the most annoying things about LPs, which often drove me mad, was bad centering. Several of my DG items had this error, while it was rare among LPs from the other big labels. With small labels it was also relatively common. It was most often useless to get a replacement LP, because this would have the same flaw.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on April 26, 2020, 03:35:21 AM
Quote from: (: premont :) on April 26, 2020, 03:23:50 AM
I collected vinyl from the 1960es to the late 1980es. One of the most annoying things about LPs, which often drove me mad, was bad centering. Several of my DG items had this error, while it was rare among LPs from the other big labels. With small labels it was also relatively common. It was most often useless to get a replacement LP, because this would have the same flaw.

I can't say I ever noticed the problem but you probably had a more sophisticated turntable than me. I was more concerned about warping, something EMI/HMV records seemed prone to.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 26, 2020, 03:43:44 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 25, 2020, 03:14:11 AM
I was looking up something else recently and I stumbled across the "Ace of Clubs" image below. Now, I obviously know the "Ace of Clubs" label but I must admit that I have never come across this particular version of it before.


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/6tQAAOSwlndZFgJJ/s-l1600.jpg)

Thank you all for the information and contributions on the above.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on April 26, 2020, 04:21:31 AM
Quote from: Biffo on April 26, 2020, 03:35:21 AM
I can't say I ever noticed the problem but you probably had a more sophisticated turntable than me. I was more concerned about warping, something EMI/HMV records seemed prone to.

Well, often a pulsating out of tune quality (the result of bad centering) makes the music completely unlistenable to me, but if it is not too pronounced I can sometimes deliberately ignore it. I often needed to do so at that time. BTW I agree that warping was another irritating thing, but fortunately occurring more seldom than bad centering, at least in my collection, which for the most part consisted of items from the great labels.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 26, 2020, 05:45:30 AM
Quote from: Biffo on April 26, 2020, 01:10:27 AM
I have too many DG LPs to start checking this but I find it odd. I don't recall having any problems of any kind with DG but numerous flaws, including bad pressings, with Philips. I purchased a badly pressed Philips disc of Beethoven disc from Arrau and it went back to the shop so many times they gave up and I got a refund. A box set of Mahler symphonies (Haitink/Concertgebouw) went back at least three times before I got a perfect set of six discs.

I think you unlucky. For pressings Philips have a good reputation, but there are two Philips. The British one and the Dutch one and as always with vinyl there are pluses and minuses. The Dutch are thinner but lovely and clean with little or no surface noise, the sound is a tad constricted. The British pressings are thicker, the sound more dynamic lacking the whisper quietness of the Dutch pressings. Both are very good without being the best, and I have always thought Philips a safe purchase Dutch or British. 

Edit: The top image is a UK pressing the other from Holland.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on April 26, 2020, 06:04:01 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 26, 2020, 05:45:30 AM
I think you unlucky. For pressings Philips have a good reputation, but there are two Philips. The British one and the Dutch one and as always with vinyl there are pluses and minuses. The Dutch are thinner but lovely and clean with little or no surface noise, the sound is a tad constricted. The British pressings are thicker, the sound more dynamic lacking the whisper quietness of the Dutch pressings. Both are very good without being the best, and I have always thought Philips a safe purchase Dutch or British. 

Edit: The top image is a UK pressing the other from Holland.

The Mahler set I had all the problems with has a purple rather than a red label and no country of origin. Judging by the serial number it is a British pressing. Once I got a 'clean' set there were no problems and it still sounds fine nearly 50 years later. Getting that 'clean' set nearly drove the lady in my local record shop to distraction.

However, I still have the impression that Philips caused me more problems than any other label, including the highly erratic HMV/EMI.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: staxomega on April 26, 2020, 02:03:15 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 25, 2020, 12:59:32 PM
You would have thought that some new plants might have opened up?  Or perhaps the PTB don't think that the demand for them will last?

Sounds like you are having fun developing a new turntable?   :)

Best,

PD

A moving coil step up transformer and possibly a tube phono stage that uses inductors (LCR) for the RIAA EQ :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 26, 2020, 04:32:37 PM
Quote from: hvbias on April 26, 2020, 02:03:15 PM
A moving coil step up transformer and possibly a tube phono stage that uses inductors (LCR) for the RIAA EQ :)
I don't know anything about transformers, but I do have all tubes (amp and pre-amp).  So much to learn/keep up with!   ::)  Been a while since I've done research into current systems too...so far behind!  Wish you the best of luck/work though.  Please keep us up to date with how things are going.

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 26, 2020, 11:31:34 PM
Quote from: Biffo on April 26, 2020, 06:04:01 AM
The Mahler set I had all the problems with has a purple rather than a red label and no country of origin. Judging by the serial number it is a British pressing. Once I got a 'clean' set there were no problems and it still sounds fine nearly 50 years later. Getting that 'clean' set nearly drove the lady in my local record shop to distraction.

However, I still have the impression that Philips caused me more problems than any other label, including the highly erratic HMV/EMI.

That is early. More about collecting then music-reproduction but the issues with "Hi-Fi Stereo" inscribed on label and cover sell at a premium.

EMI went through a dodgy period in the mid-seventies.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 01, 2020, 11:48:18 PM
This arrived yesterday and looks and sounds brand new. It is an LP that I never owned and regretted not having acquired it when it first came out. Maybe at the time (early 1970s) I was put off on realising that it featured Copland's more 'modernist' works. I'm very pleased to have it now. The Symphonic Ode has subsequently become a favourite of mine. Nice to see that familiar old blue CBS label!
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 02, 2020, 12:06:48 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 01, 2020, 11:48:18 PM
This arrived yesterday and looks and sounds brand new. It is an LP that I never owned and regretted not having acquired it when it first came out. Maybe at the time (early 1970s) I was put off on realising that it featured Copland's more 'modernist' works. I'm very pleased to have it now. The Symphonic Ode has subsequently become a favourite of mine. Nice to see that familiar old blue CBS label!
(//)

What's on it, Jeffrey? I listened to Copland last night, "Quiet City" terrific piece.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 02, 2020, 05:14:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 02, 2020, 12:06:48 AM
What's on it, Jeffrey? I listened to Copland last night, "Quiet City" terrific piece.
That's a lovely piece Irons.  Are you familiar with his music for The Red Pony which I really enjoy.  Every once in a while, his music "Billy the Kid" hits the spot too.   :)

Quote from: vandermolen on May 01, 2020, 11:48:18 PM
This arrived yesterday and looks and sounds brand new. It is an LP that I never owned and regretted not having acquired it when it first came out. Maybe at the time (early 1970s) I was put off on realising that it featured Copland's more 'modernist' works. I'm very pleased to have it now. The Symphonic Ode has subsequently become a favourite of mine. Nice to see that familiar old blue CBS label!
(//)I don't know his "Symphonic Ode"...will have to check it out?

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 02, 2020, 06:54:48 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 02, 2020, 05:14:06 AM
That's a lovely piece Irons.  Are you familiar with his music for The Red Pony which I really enjoy.  Every once in a while, his music "Billy the Kid" hits the spot too.   :)

I don't know "The Red Pony" P, will look out for it. There is something in Copland's music I find most appealing. "Billy the Kid" is great, but I think "Appalachian Spring" would be my first choice. I have yet to hear a piece I don't like.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 02, 2020, 08:40:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 02, 2020, 06:54:48 AM
I don't know "The Red Pony" P, will look out for it. There is something in Copland's music I find most appealing. "Billy the Kid" is great, but I think "Appalachian Spring" would be my first choice. I have yet to hear a piece I don't like.
:laugh: I had meant to include "Appalachian Spring" but I forgot to!   :-[

Speaking of spring, I've started hauling my plants out...should have taken a photo.  I had to put my rosemary plant (shrub really!) onto an old suitcase carrier, tie it on and haul it outside as too heavy and to awkward to hold onto it for very long.  It worked though!   ;D

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 02, 2020, 08:48:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 02, 2020, 12:06:48 AM
What's on it, Jeffrey? I listened to Copland last night, "Quiet City" terrific piece.
Quiet City is a great work Lol.
The LP features 'Preamble to a Solemn Occasion', 'Orchestral Variations' and my favourite the declamatory 'Symphonic Ode'.
I also like the Red Pony film score, The Tender Land, Orchestral Suite, Symphony for Organ and Orchestra, Third Symphony and nearly everything I've ever heard by Copland.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 03, 2020, 12:50:26 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 02, 2020, 08:48:20 AM
Quiet City is a great work Lol.
The LP features 'Preamble to a Solemn Occasion', 'Orchestral Variations' and my favourite the declamatory 'Symphonic Ode'.
I also like the Red Pony film score, The Tender Land, Orchestral Suite, Symphony for Organ and Orchestra, Third Symphony and nearly everything I've ever heard by Copland.

I must get hold of a copy, Jeffrey. Makes a change from your excellent CD recommendations. ;D Talking of which, the Bloch has finally arrived.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 12, 2020, 07:02:37 AM
There has been a few 45 rpm recordings released of classic material which I have ignored in the past although they claim superior sound. I must admit this 45 rpm of Goossens conducting "Symphonie Fantastique" is spine tingling good!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjhEnkciQEY&t=479s
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 12, 2020, 09:43:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 03, 2020, 12:50:26 AM
I must get hold of a copy, Jeffrey. Makes a change from your excellent CD recommendations. ;D Talking of which, the Bloch has finally arrived.
Yes, I think you'd enjoy that Copland LP Lol. Hope you enjoy the Bloch CD as well.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 22, 2020, 06:31:00 AM
Logically analogue recordings are best on LP and digital on CD. I wished to purchase a copy of the Bax Piano Quartet, a digital recording from the 1980's. A search on eBay came up with a CD and LP of the identical recording with the CD one penny dearer and both including free postage. My mouse hovered over each, I couldn't make a decision. Eventually heart overruled head and what swung it in favour of LP is that the seller York Records is reliable and trustworthy. The LP arrived today and is in tip top condition but so I dare say is the CD ............ :-\ 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 22, 2020, 08:02:38 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 22, 2020, 06:31:00 AM
Logically analogue recordings are best on LP and digital on CD. I wished to purchase a copy of the Bax Piano Quintet, a digital recording from the 1980's. A search on eBay came up with a CD and LP of the identical recording with the CD one penny dearer and both including free postage. My mouse hovered over each, I couldn't make a decision. Eventually heart overruled head and what swung it in favour of LP is that the seller York Records is reliable and trustworthy. The LP arrived today and is in tip top condition but so I dare say is the CD ............ :-\

I would have gone the same way. Enjoy it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 22, 2020, 08:08:16 AM
Quote from: aligreto on May 22, 2020, 08:02:38 AM
I would have gone the same way. Enjoy it.

Good to know. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 22, 2020, 09:41:48 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 22, 2020, 06:31:00 AM
Logically analogue recordings are best on LP and digital on CD. I wished to purchase a copy of the Bax Piano Quartet, a digital recording from the 1980's. A search on eBay came up with a CD and LP of the identical recording with the CD one penny dearer and both including free postage. My mouse hovered over each, I couldn't make a decision. Eventually heart overruled head and what swung it in favour of LP is that the seller York Records is reliable and trustworthy. The LP arrived today and is in tip top condition but so I dare say is the CD ............ :-\
Love the Harp Quintet. My favourite Bax chamber work alongside the Piano Quintet.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 23, 2020, 06:23:13 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 22, 2020, 09:41:48 AM
Love the Harp Quintet. My favourite Bax chamber work alongside the Piano Quintet.

Oh Jeffrey, I need a brain transplant! I purchased this thinking it was the Quintet you recommended. It doesn't end there though! Putting the LP away I find I already own a copy, again in mint condition. ::)

If anyone one can give the LP of Bax above a good home, PM me, and I will pop it in the post.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 18, 2020, 12:37:20 AM
On this day ( June 18th) 1948, Columbia Records unveiled the long-playing record.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 18, 2020, 02:45:37 PM
Quote from: Irons on June 18, 2020, 12:37:20 AM
On this day ( June 18th) 1948, Columbia Records unveiled the long-playing record.
Ooooooohhhhhh! Yippee!  What a day!   ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 19, 2020, 09:44:13 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 18, 2020, 02:45:37 PM
Ooooooohhhhhh! Yippee!  What a day!   ;D
+1
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 22, 2020, 06:51:24 AM
Record shops are opening up again (hurrah!) albeit in a rather constrained and strange sort of way.  I did run across a LP in a series which we've discussed here a bit:  Bela Bartok--The Complete Edition on Hungaroton.  The one that I picked up is part of his chamber music, specifically, Sonatas for Violin and Piano Nos. 1 and 2 with Gidon Kremer and Yuri Smirnov.   :)

PD

p.s.  I did manage to lightly twist a friend's wrist and encourage him to purchase a CD.  It's one that I have myself and hoping that he will enjoy it.  It's this one:  (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51AF05NMVVL.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 22, 2020, 07:22:23 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 22, 2020, 06:51:24 AM
Record shops are opening up again (hurrah!) albeit in a rather constrained and strange sort of way.  I did run across a LP in a series which we've discussed here a bit:  Bela Bartok--The Complete Edition on Hungaroton.  The one that I picked up is part of his chamber music, specifically, Sonatas for Violin and Piano Nos. 1 and 2 with Gidon Kremer and Yuri Smirnov.   :)

PD

p.s.  I did manage to lightly twist a friend's wrist and encourage him to purchase a CD.  It's one that I have myself and hoping that he will enjoy it.  It's this one:  (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51AF05NMVVL.jpg)

A good find P, congratulations. I miss sorting through bins of LPs, CDs too, and coming across something interesting. Ordering online has its uses but just not the same. Over the years I have derived as much pleasure finding stuff as listening to it. My first port of call will be, when it opens, Farnham Oxfam. I would love a visit to Classical Exchange at Notting Hill Gate but this involves either train, Underground or bus and I don't feel confident enough to use any of these options at the present time.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 22, 2020, 11:14:56 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 22, 2020, 07:22:23 AM
A good find P, congratulations. I miss sorting through bins of LPs, CDs too, and coming across something interesting. Ordering online has its uses but just not the same. Over the years I have derived as much pleasure finding stuff as listening to it. My first port of call will be, when it opens, Farnham Oxfam. I would love a visit to Classical Exchange at Notting Hill Gate but this involves either train, Underground or bus and I don't feel confident enough to use any of these options at the present time.
Thanks!

Any idea when stores will be opening up again?  Here, they had to limit the number of customers in accordance with the number of square feet of the store.  Plexi-shields up, safe distancing, box set up for cash, credit/debit card machine set up to avoid contact with customers.  You even get to bag your own items.  Awkward looking at stuff trying to read labels with face mask on.   :(  Better than nothing though!  Also, store hours are more limited for the time being too.  And they're also not doing 'instant buys' at the moment; they're letting things sit for x-number of days before handling it to look at the items and condition and then getting back to the seller.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 23, 2020, 01:22:22 AM
My daughter kindly bought me this. A great nostalgia trip. I went to see the film eight times at the cinema when it first came out when I was 12/13. My daughter is a great fan as well:
(//)
Thinking about it this may be the first record that I bought (in 1968) which featured any classical music. My new copy seems to be in mint condition.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Papy Oli on June 23, 2020, 02:09:19 AM
Belated Happy Birthday Jeffrey, Hope you had a good one yesterday !
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 23, 2020, 04:48:30 AM
Cool album!  And a belated Happy Birthday from me too!   :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 23, 2020, 11:44:31 AM
Thanks for the good wishes Olivier and PD. I had a great time, having a (vegan) picnic with my wife and daughter in a park in London, having not seen her for several months.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 23, 2020, 12:26:01 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 23, 2020, 11:44:31 AM
Thanks for the good wishes Olivier and PD. I had a great time, having a (vegan) picnic with my wife and daughter in a park in London, having not seen her for several months.
Out of curiosity, what did your picnic consist of Jeffrey?  Glad that you had a good time out and hope that it wasn't too hot for you?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 23, 2020, 01:30:25 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 22, 2020, 06:51:24 AM
Record shops are opening up again (hurrah!) albeit in a rather constrained and strange sort of way.  I did run across a LP in a series which we've discussed here a bit:  Bela Bartok--The Complete Edition on Hungaroton.  The one that I picked up is part of his chamber music, specifically, Sonatas for Violin and Piano Nos. 1 and 2 with Gidon Kremer and Yuri Smirnov.   :)

PD

p.s.  I did manage to lightly twist a friend's wrist and encourage him to purchase a CD.  It's one that I have myself and hoping that he will enjoy it.  It's this one:  (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51AF05NMVVL.jpg)
That is a very nice CD in all respect.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 23, 2020, 01:36:08 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 23, 2020, 12:26:01 PM
Out of curiosity, what did your picnic consist of Jeffrey?  Glad that you had a good time out and hope that it wasn't too hot for you?

PD
OT
It was a vegan picnic PD as my wife is vegetarian and my daughter is vegan. I am so by default but I sneak a 'secret meat lunch'  >:D when I am at the school where I work (not that that is happening now). Anyway the picnic was very tasty (I think it involved tofu, rice, couscous etc) and my daughter made a banana bread cake for me which I over-indulged in. It was too hot for me but as my wife kindly offered to drive I was able to have some glasses of wine to cheer myself up.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 23, 2020, 03:55:52 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 23, 2020, 01:36:08 PM
OT
It was a vegan picnic PD as my wife is vegetarian and my daughter is vegan. I am so by default but I sneak a 'secret meat lunch'  >:D when I am at the school where I work (not that that is happening now). Anyway the picnic was very tasty (I think it involved tofu, rice, couscous etc) and my daughter made a banana bread cake for me which I over-indulged in. It was too hot for me but as my wife kindly offered to drive I was able to have some glasses of wine to cheer myself up.
A banana bread cake?!  Oh my!  I do love banana bread and over the years (particularly in my teens to early 20's) have tried to perfect the perfect banana bread recipe.   ;D

Does your wife and/or daughter give you a hard time if you go out for dinner and you want to order something non-vegetarian?  And any 'occasional pescatarians' in that mix?  Just curious.  I do love my vegetables and many vegetarian dishes and am always trying to push myself in the kitchen to cook new dishes too.  Love making baba ganoush during the summertime for example...I have some personal variations in making it that I love (if you're interested).   :)

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 23, 2020, 09:26:42 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 23, 2020, 03:55:52 PM
A banana bread cake?!  Oh my!  I do love banana bread and over the years (particularly in my teens to early 20's) have tried to perfect the perfect banana bread recipe.   ;D

Does your wife and/or daughter give you a hard time if you go out for dinner and you want to order something non-vegetarian?  And any 'occasional pescatarians' in that mix?  Just curious.  I do love my vegetables and many vegetarian dishes and am always trying to push myself in the kitchen to cook new dishes too.  Love making baba ganoush during the summertime for example...I have some personal variations in making it that I love (if you're interested).   :)

Best wishes,

PD
OT
'Baba ganoush' sounds most interesting and I can swop the recipe for my daughter's banana cake one if you like. It was more than just banana bread as she added stuff to it like dark chocolate. Now that I've reminded myself of the meaning of pescatarian I can answer your question. Wife: Yes, Daughter: No. In fairness, my wife does not give me a bad time if I eat meat (which I rarely do anyway). My addiction to tomato ketchup is much more of an issue for her. It rang true recently, when watching the excellent drama on the Salisbury Poisonings the other day, when the young son of one of the main characters gets an earful from his mother for asking for tomato ketchup with stew. My sympathies were with him, especially as tomato ketchup is supposed to have (as I often tell my wife) some health benefits. My daughter is rather less tolerant if I have meat. Still, I have already done my bit for nature this morning by rescuing a bird from my cat's mouth  0:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 24, 2020, 08:04:43 AM
I'll post my recipe over in the 'What are you eating thread' so as to not go OT yet again!

And that birdie owes you one!  Yeah you!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 29, 2020, 11:53:48 PM
The German company Teldec invented a new process for manufacturing LPs known as DMM (Direct Metal Mastering) there is a Wiki page if anyone is interested. Although it did have its critics I am a great admirer of records produced using the DMM process. It came along late in the day and over time I have replaced where available DMM copies for records pressed in the normal way. Teldec pressed the late RCA "Gold Seal" series which included all the Previn RVW recordings (Not all "Gold Seal" are from Teldec).

(https://i.imgur.com/H7GF5SW.jpg)

The earlier "Red Seal" are pressed at various plants including Decca at New Malden but none far as I'm aware are DMM.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 30, 2020, 04:21:45 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 29, 2020, 11:53:48 PM
The German company Teldec invented a new process for manufacturing LPs known as DMM (Direct Metal Mastering) there is a Wiki page if anyone is interested. Although it did have its critics I am a great admirer of records produced using the DMM process. It came along late in the day and over time I have replaced where available DMM copies for records pressed in the normal way. Teldec pressed the late RCA "Gold Seal" series which included all the Previn RVW recordings (Not all "Gold Seal" are from Teldec).

(https://i.imgur.com/H7GF5SW.jpg)

The earlier "Red Seal" are pressed at various plants including Decca at New Malden but none far as I'm aware are DMM.
I have some of their (Teldec's) DMMs.  Thanks for telling us about the Previn/RVW pressings Irons!  I'll keep an eye out for them.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 03, 2020, 03:06:49 AM
The cartridge on my main turntable is beginning to come close to the end of its life. I will have to replace it but what to do? I am just at the initial stage of looking and the Benz Micro MC Gold Moving Coil Cartridge has caught my eye.


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/318GSPg4ufL._AC_.jpg)


Does anyone have any experience with this cartridge?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 03, 2020, 04:37:46 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 30, 2020, 04:21:45 AM
I have some of their (Teldec's) DMMs.  Thanks for telling us about the Previn/RVW pressings Irons!  I'll keep an eye out for them.

PD
By the way, Irons, where does it show that they were pressed by Teldec?  Is there something on the label or jacket?

PD
Quote from: aligreto on July 03, 2020, 03:06:49 AM
The cartridge on my main turntable is beginning to come close to the end of its life. I will have to replace it but what to do? I am just at the initial stage of looking and the Benz Micro MC Gold Moving Coil Cartridge has caught my eye.


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/318GSPg4ufL._AC_.jpg)


Does anyone have any experience with this cartridge?

I haven't heard anything about it; I'll ask my audio friend, though, if he knows anything about them (he also subscribes to various audio magazines).  We hope to visit a record store today; however, the weather is not looking good.  So much for trusting the weather app on my phone (Forecast:  sunny and hot).  After spending a good half hour watering, I turned on the radio...cloudy and good chance of showers later!   ::)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 03, 2020, 05:10:23 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 03, 2020, 04:37:46 AM

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/318GSPg4ufL._AC_.jpg)

PDI haven't heard anything about it; I'll ask my audio friend, though, if he knows anything about them (he also subscribes to various audio magazines).  We hope to visit a record store today; however, the weather is not looking good.  So much for trusting the weather app on my phone (Forecast:  sunny and hot).  After spending a good half hour watering, I turned on the radio...cloudy and good chance of showers later!   ::)

PD

Cheers PD. I know that the name has a great provenance at the higher end. However, this is their "entry level" cartridge and this is what I am specifically wondering about.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 03, 2020, 07:14:56 AM
Quote from: aligreto on July 03, 2020, 03:06:49 AM
The cartridge on my main turntable is beginning to come close to the end of its life. I will have to replace it but what to do? I am just at the initial stage of looking and the Benz Micro MC Gold Moving Coil Cartridge has caught my eye.


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/318GSPg4ufL._AC_.jpg)


Does anyone have any experience with this cartridge?

I cannot help you with the Benz Aligreto as I have had not heard it. I was in a similar situation late last year as the AT-OC9/111 I was using did not sound right and time for retirement I thought. I had three old cartridges in a draw, a 13 year old Koetsu Rosewood, a 15 year old Ortofon Kontrapunct C and Miyajima Spirit mono. The first two were worn and third the tip had parted company with the cantilever. I could not afford spending a four figured sum on a new cartridge so on a whim contacted Dominic Harper up at Northwest Audio. We agreed that I send my Kontrapunkt to him for inspection which I duly did. I must say the service I received from Dominic and his wife was top class and my Kontrapunkt is as good as new and delighted with the performance of my refurbished cartridge.

https://www.northwestanalogue.com/
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 03, 2020, 07:34:41 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 03, 2020, 04:37:46 AM
By the way, Irons, where does it show that they were pressed by Teldec?  Is there something on the label or jacket?

PD

Look to the small print at top of label, P.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 03, 2020, 11:02:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 03, 2020, 07:14:56 AM

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/318GSPg4ufL._AC_.jpg)

I cannot help you with the Benz Aligreto as I have had not heard it. I was in a similar situation late last year as the AT-OC9/111 I was using did not sound right and time for retirement I thought. I had three old cartridges in a draw, a 13 year old Koetsu Rosewood, a 15 year old Ortofon Kontrapunct C and Miyajima Spirit mono. The first two were worn and third the tip had parted company with the cantilever. I could not afford spending a four figured sum on a new cartridge so on a whim contacted Dominic Harper up at Northwest Audio. We agreed that I send my Kontrapunkt to him for inspection which I duly did. I must say the service I received from Dominic and his wife was top class and my Kontrapunkt is as good as new and delighted with the performance of my refurbished cartridge.

https://www.northwestanalogue.com/

Cheers and thank you for the input. I will check that link later.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 03, 2020, 02:49:07 PM
Quote from: Irons on July 03, 2020, 07:14:56 AM
I cannot help you with the Benz Aligreto as I have had not heard it. I was in a similar situation late last year as the AT-OC9/111 I was using did not sound right and time for retirement I thought. I had three old cartridges in a draw, a 13 year old Koetsu Rosewood, a 15 year old Ortofon Kontrapunct C and Miyajima Spirit mono. The first two were worn and third the tip had parted company with the cantilever. I could not afford spending a four figured sum on a new cartridge so on a whim contacted Dominic Harper up at Northwest Audio. We agreed that I send my Kontrapunkt to him for inspection which I duly did. I must say the service I received from Dominic and his wife was top class and my Kontrapunkt is as good as new and delighted with the performance of my refurbished cartridge.

https://www.northwestanalogue.com/
Nice Irons! 

So, if I'm remembering correctly--and it's been quite a while since I did much looking into cartridges, one can replace the stylus of a cartridge (some of them anyway) rather than having to buy a whole new cartridge?  Which it sounds like what was done for you?  Or did they 'just' reattach the stylus to your cartridge?  Where you also able to salvage your other two cartridges?  Or do you need to send them elsewhere for service?  Or just not possible?

And thanks for the pic of the label Irons!   :)

And Aligreto,

Glad that you found a lead.  I spoke to my friend earlier and he had heard good things about that company/brand, but no experience with them himself.

We did manage to get to a record store today and this is what I ended up getting.

(https://img.discogs.com/18xBWzPJuREIMhhkji2SzC9-OkU=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-4968780-1380903123-1213.jpeg.jpg)

and (https://img.discogs.com/ioEUzQjrHGbIDkiA-shizz5IK5c=/fit-in/600x591/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-5973563-1407916295-1273.jpeg.jpg)

I love the Four Sea Interludes; don't know the pieces on the other album.  Nice, though, to see father and son playing together.   :)

Best,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 05, 2020, 02:10:09 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 03, 2020, 02:49:07 PM

And Aligreto,

....  I spoke to my friend earlier and he had heard good things about that company/brand, but no experience with them himself.


Thank you for enquiring.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 05, 2020, 02:17:04 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 03, 2020, 02:49:07 PM
Nice Irons! 

So, if I'm remembering correctly--and it's been quite a while since I did much looking into cartridges, one can replace the stylus of a cartridge (some of them anyway) rather than having to buy a whole new cartridge?  Which it sounds like what was done for you?  Or did they 'just' reattach the stylus to your cartridge?  Where you also able to salvage your other two cartridges?  Or do you need to send them elsewhere for service?  Or just not possible?

And thanks for the pic of the label Irons!   :)

And Aligreto,

Glad that you found a lead.  I spoke to my friend earlier and he had heard good things about that company/brand, but no experience with them himself.

We did manage to get to a record store today and this is what I ended up getting.

(https://img.discogs.com/18xBWzPJuREIMhhkji2SzC9-OkU=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-4968780-1380903123-1213.jpeg.jpg)

and (https://img.discogs.com/ioEUzQjrHGbIDkiA-shizz5IK5c=/fit-in/600x591/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-5973563-1407916295-1273.jpeg.jpg)

I love the Four Sea Interludes; don't know the pieces on the other album.  Nice, though, to see father and son playing together.   :)

Best,

PD

Right, for MM (and you have one of, if not the best) a simple operation as the stylus assembly slides in and out and can be replaced in seconds. MC - moving coil as opposed to moving magnet, this cannot be done. It is the nature of the beast that MC can be expensive and unlike a laser beam wear out. A MC cartridge can be rebuilt with where required either a stylus, cantilever and suspension replaced or all three. Highly skilled work that requires specialist tools including an electronic microscope. I sent my Ortofon and received a report from Northwest detailing work required and cost. If you decide you do not wish the work to be carried out, they charge, I think, £60 for inspection and return the cartridge.

I'm dead jealous, P! Two great finds - but more then that, to walk in a shop and walk out with something unexpected.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 05, 2020, 04:20:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 05, 2020, 02:17:04 AM
Right, for MM (and you have one of, if not the best) a simple operation as the stylus assembly slides in and out and can be replaced in seconds. MC - moving coil as opposed to moving magnet, this cannot be done. It is the nature of the beast that MC can be expensive and unlike a laser beam wear out. A MC cartridge can be rebuilt with where required either a stylus, cantilever and suspension replaced or all three. Highly skilled work that requires specialist tools including an electronic microscope. I sent my Ortofon and received a report from Northwest detailing work required and cost. If you decide you do not wish the work to be carried out, they charge, I think, £60 for inspection and return the cartridge.

I'm dead jealous, P! Two great finds - but more then that, to walk in a shop and walk out with something unexpected.
Thanks for the explanation Irons.  Over time, I forgot what the differences were between MC vs. MM.  And nice to know that mine is an easy swap-out too!   :)  Can you salvage your other two cartridges?  Or too expensive?

Was nice to walk into a store.  At most, there were I think four of us customers and one sales person (the wife of the owner) in there...all with masks.  I tried to remain cognizant of how far away others were there.  I suspect that most people were not quite so aware as it's very easy to start looking through a section and keep moving along it .....drawn deep inside the world of vinyl!

Aligreto,

Let us know what you decide to get and how it works for you.

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 05, 2020, 04:26:15 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 05, 2020, 04:20:33 AM

Aligreto,

Let us know what you decide to get and how it works for you.

PD

Do not hold your breadth. This is not an urgent project. It can be difficult to move away from one's tried and tested, and trusted, cartridges.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 06, 2020, 07:22:05 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 05, 2020, 04:20:33 AM
Thanks for the explanation Irons.  Over time, I forgot what the differences were between MC vs. MM.  And nice to know that mine is an easy swap-out too!   :)  Can you salvage your other two cartridges?  Or too expensive?

Was nice to walk into a store.  At most, there were I think four of us customers and one sales person (the wife of the owner) in there...all with masks.  I tried to remain cognizant of how far away others were there.  I suspect that most people were not quite so aware as it's very easy to start looking through a section and keep moving along it .....drawn deep inside the world of vinyl!

Aligreto,

Let us know what you decide to get and how it works for you.

PD

Hopefully they stay in a draw, P, but if the worse happens.......

Entering the basement of Classical Exchange was an experience at the best of times, post covid I just can't imagine! I am certain I told you of the time a mouse ran across the records I was looking at and the owner calmly dropped a complete set of Beethoven SQ's on the creature. Then he offered me a discount on the set (EMI Hungarian SQ). I didn't take him up on it! 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 06, 2020, 08:02:32 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 06, 2020, 07:22:05 AM
Hopefully they stay in a draw, P, but if the worse happens.......

Entering the basement of Classical Exchange was an experience at the best of times, post covid I just can't imagine! I am certain I told you of the time a mouse ran across the records I was looking at and the owner calmly dropped a complete set of Beethoven SQ's on the creature. Then he offered me a discount on the set (EMI Hungarian SQ). I didn't take him up on it!
Shudder!  No you did not tell me this story!   ??? :o  I do understand the damage that mice can do, but ugh!  Sounds like he needs to get an exterminator or a whole bunch of mousetraps.  Cat would work best, but could also do further damage to the LPs.   ;)

We did also go to an outdoor sale (mixture of books, CDs, DVDs, etc.--no LPs) which worked pretty well....tables spaced apart and pretty much one person to a table, etc.  Picked up those CDs that I mentioned in the New Purchases thread and one pop CD (a Peter Gabriel compilation CD).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 07, 2020, 06:57:58 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 06, 2020, 08:02:32 AM
Shudder!  No you did not tell me this story!   ??? :o  I do understand the damage that mice can do, but ugh!  Sounds like he needs to get an exterminator or a whole bunch of mousetraps.  Cat would work best, but could also do further damage to the LPs.   ;)

We did also go to an outdoor sale (mixture of books, CDs, DVDs, etc.--no LPs) which worked pretty well....tables spaced apart and pretty much one person to a table, etc.  Picked up those CDs that I mentioned in the New Purchases thread and one pop CD (a Peter Gabriel compilation CD).

PD

PD, my mum and Peter Gabriel's mum were friends. She, PG mum not mine, was something to do with the Queen (HM not the pop group). I can't recall the details as so long ago but a maid of honour or something like that.
Solsbury Hill is a great record, in fact I will go over to YT to listen to it now.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 07, 2020, 08:05:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 07, 2020, 06:57:58 AM
PD, my mum and Peter Gabriel's mum were friends. She, PG mum not mine, was something to do with the Queen (HM not the pop group). I can't recall the details as so long ago but a maid of honour or something like that.
Solsbury Hill is a great record, in fact I will go over to YT to listen to it now.
Oh neat Irons!  Did you ever meet her (and or her son too)?  Or did she meet him?  I know some of his songs, but this is the first album of his that I've purchased.  Am keeping an eye out for others...also for Genesis.   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 07, 2020, 11:17:56 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 07, 2020, 08:05:44 AM
Oh neat Irons!  Did you ever meet her (and or her son too)?  Or did she meet him?  I know some of his songs, but this is the first album of his that I've purchased.  Am keeping an eye out for others...also for Genesis.   :)

PD

No didn't meet either unfortunately. If mother ever met Peter she didn't tell me. I think PG's mum was quite posh - to be honest I didn't pay much attention at the time - but they got on well.

Hooray! First foray in a bricks and mortar record shop today, followed by a pint in a pub. 8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 08, 2020, 07:37:25 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 07, 2020, 11:17:56 PM
No didn't meet either unfortunately. If mother ever met Peter she didn't tell me. I think PG's mum was quite posh - to be honest I didn't pay much attention at the time - but they got on well.

Hooray! First foray in a bricks and mortar record shop today, followed by a pint in a pub. 8)
Wow Irons!  And both in one day!  How did things go in the record shop?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 08, 2020, 11:56:49 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 08, 2020, 07:37:25 AM
Wow Irons!  And both in one day!  How did things go in the record shop?

Went well P, two each of LPs and CDs. On vinyl a DCC reissue of Villa-Lobos and Prokofiev from Stokowski and Beethoven's Septet with Collegium Aureum which is of course HIP.

RVW and Handley feature strongly on CD. Job/Fantasia/Five Variants on one. The other has Piers Lane playing RVW and Delius piano concertos along with Finzi's Eclogue.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 08, 2020, 12:09:48 PM
Excellent!  How many others were in there with you at the time?  And were all being good by wearing masks, etc.?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 09, 2020, 01:34:22 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 08, 2020, 12:09:48 PM
Excellent!  How many others were in there with you at the time?  And were all being good by wearing masks, etc.?

Unlike the pub which was ridiculous - sadly a British institution, the local pub will die through this unless a vaccine is found sharpish - Oxfam Media store were exemplary. I walked straight in and asked to squirt my hands from a hand sanitiser. I did notice some after me were asked to wait, there must have been three or four of us in the store. The payment area was screened off and the assistant put on gloves to handle my purchases. No silly notices and everything spotlessly clean, a template how it should be done.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 09, 2020, 07:31:17 AM
Excellent!   8)

Hope that the pubs manage to figure things out.  Imagine that it would be hard if you don't have any outdoor seating areas?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 09, 2020, 09:46:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 09, 2020, 07:31:17 AM
Excellent!   8)

Hope that the pubs manage to figure things out.  Imagine that it would be hard if you don't have any outdoor seating areas?

PD
My wife and I went for a walk near the town of Battle (as in Battle of Hastings) last weekend and at the the end of it there was a pub with outside seating! It was so nice to have a taste of normality.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 09, 2020, 09:56:38 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 09, 2020, 09:46:44 AM
My wife and I went for a walk near the town of Battle (as in Battle of Hastings) last weekend and at the the end of it there was a pub with outside seating! It was so nice to have a taste of normality.
Yeah!  Happy for you!

By the way, are there many pubs in your area that have smaller locally-brewed beer?  I never cease to be amazed at how many micro-breweries there are in the States these days.  A bewildering abundance of choices.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 10, 2020, 05:12:10 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 09, 2020, 09:56:38 AM
Yeah!  Happy for you!

By the way, are there many pubs in your area that have smaller locally-brewed beer?  I never cease to be amazed at how many micro-breweries there are in the States these days.  A bewildering abundance of choices.

PD
OT
Thank you. The best known locally is Harvey's of Lewes who manufacture my favourite dark 'Old' beer which is a winter brew although you can get it in bottled form all the year round. That is the River Ouse to the bottom left of the photo.
[/img]
Now playing, Muir Mathieson's fine LP of Tchaikovsky's 'Pathetique' Symphony with the Sinfonia of London:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 10, 2020, 05:15:19 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 10, 2020, 05:12:10 AM
OT
Thank you. The best known locally is Harvey's of Lewes who manufacture my favourite dark 'Old' beer which is a winter brew although you can get it in bottled form all the year round. That is the River Ouse to the bottom left of the photo.
[/img]
Nice!  Boy, another new term for me 'Old beer'?  :-[

Thanks for the photos.   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 10, 2020, 07:00:40 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 10, 2020, 05:12:10 AM
OT
Thank you. The best known locally is Harvey's of Lewes who manufacture my favourite dark 'Old' beer which is a winter brew although you can get it in bottled form all the year round. That is the River Ouse to the bottom left of the photo.
[/img]
Now playing, Muir Mathieson's fine LP of Tchaikovsky's 'Pathetique' Symphony with the Sinfonia of London:
(//)

Great stuff, Jeffrey. We have friends in West Wittering and a visit to the local for a pint of Harvey's Sussex Best is a joy.

Pleased you are enjoying the Mathieson LP, have you a clean copy? A early release from WRC and only available to subscribers as the rest of a huge catalogue released over it must be a good few years.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 10, 2020, 07:26:30 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 10, 2020, 07:00:40 AM
Great stuff, Jeffrey. We have friends in West Wittering and a visit to the local for a pint of Harvey's Sussex Best is a joy.

Pleased you are enjoying the Mathieson LP, have you a clean copy? A early release from WRC and only available to subscribers as the rest of a huge catalogue released over it must be a good few years.
Thanks Lol,
Yes, it's in surprisingly good condition, almost mint I think. Very nice and deeply felt performance, especially the finale. The whole thing has a kind of 'old-fashioned' feel to it which is part of its appeal. The disc itself is very hard vinyl, like something between a 78 and an LP, or like one of those old Melodiya LPs made of very heavy plastic. Thanks for the recommendation. Glad to hear that you enjoy a pint of Harvey's every now and then. I've always liked dark beer or mild and Old is my special favourite.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 10, 2020, 01:43:20 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 10, 2020, 07:26:30 AM
Thanks Lol,
Yes, it's in surprisingly good condition, almost mint I think. Very nice and deeply felt performance, especially the finale. The whole thing has a kind of 'old-fashioned' feel to it which is part of its appeal. The disc itself is very hard vinyl, like something between a 78 and an LP, or like one of those old Melodiya LPs made of very heavy plastic. Thanks for the recommendation. Glad to hear that you enjoy a pint of Harvey's every now and then. I've always liked dark beer or mild and Old is my special favourite.

Yes, I agree Jeffrey, a far cry from the digital spotlight. A modern sports car would leave a 60's Jag E-Type for dead but there is something about an E-Type that cannot be replicated. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 10, 2020, 09:54:59 PM
Quote from: Irons on July 10, 2020, 01:43:20 PM
Yes, I agree Jeffrey, a far cry from the digital spotlight. A modern sports car would leave a 60's Jag E-Type for dead but there is something about an E-Type that cannot be replicated.
I very much agree.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 21, 2020, 09:43:57 AM
Enjoying this at the moment:
Symphonic Ode:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 23, 2020, 07:45:57 AM
Glazunov: The Seasons and Concert Waltzes 1 & 2.

(https://i.imgur.com/Kv8Oow7.jpg)

Must be something in the water that Russian ballets are so good. Arguably Tchaikovsky is the greatest composer of ballet music with Glazunov is not far behind. The Seasons is a lovely score.

This issue is on the legendary Decca "wide band" label with stamped on the dead wax ZAL-7421-3W. A grooved label so early. I am not convinced wide band pressings are superior to narrow band even if they sell for a premium with many ending up in the Far East.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 25, 2020, 12:02:17 AM
Bruckner: 4th Symphony.

(https://i.imgur.com/9RGEFgc.jpg)

It is unusual to find a LP issue of Bruckner's 4th spread over four sides - each movement per side. Most recordings of this symphony are released on a single LP. For such expansive music the afforded extra groove width makes a noticeable difference especially at the big Bruckner climaxes. Superb sound.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 25, 2020, 05:27:32 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 25, 2020, 12:02:17 AM
Bruckner: 4th Symphony.

(https://i.imgur.com/9RGEFgc.jpg)

It is unusual to find a LP issue of Bruckner's 4th spread over four sides - each movement per side. Most recordings of this symphony are released on a single LP. For such expansive music the afforded extra groove width makes a noticeable difference especially at the big Bruckner climaxes. Superb sound.
Cool Irons!  Wonder whether or not that one was also issued similarly in the US?

In any event, glad that you enjoyed it.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 25, 2020, 06:03:08 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 25, 2020, 05:27:32 AM
Cool Irons!  Wonder whether or not that one was also issued similarly in the US?

In any event, glad that you enjoyed it.  :)

PD

Very late in the day, P, I'm getting into Bruckner. It is all that Denham's fault. ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 25, 2020, 08:52:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 25, 2020, 06:03:08 AM
Very late in the day, P, I'm getting into Bruckner. It is all that Denham's fault. ;D
lol  I've been skirting around him...so far, so good!  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 27, 2020, 11:27:23 PM
Quote from: Irons on July 23, 2020, 07:45:57 AM
Glazunov: The Seasons and Concert Waltzes 1 & 2.

(https://i.imgur.com/Kv8Oow7.jpg)

Must be something in the water that Russian ballets are so good. Arguably Tchaikovsky is the greatest composer of ballet music with Glazunov is not far behind. The Seasons is a lovely score.

This issue is on the legendary Decca "wide band" label with stamped on the dead wax ZAL-7421-3W. A grooved label so early. I am not convinced wide band pressings are superior to narrow band even if they sell for a premium with many ending up in the Far East.
I listen to Glazunov's 'The Seasons' more than any ballet by Tchaikovsky.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 04, 2020, 07:16:05 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/zdTvrgM.jpg)

In 2004 the Rare Classical Record price guide had this listed at £250. Recorded 1962 and extremely rare. In the 1990's Testament re-released a facsimile which I purchased at the time. Simple to distinguish as the Testament issue has EMI logo at top left. As with other issues from same source the Testament is beginning to rise in value too.

A fabulous inspirational performance from a great orchestra directed by a great conductor.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 04, 2020, 07:48:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 04, 2020, 07:16:05 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/zdTvrgM.jpg)

In 2004 the Rare Classical Record price guide had this listed at £250. Recorded 1962 and extremely rare. In the 1990's Testament re-released a facsimile which I purchased at the time. Simple to distinguish as the Testament issue has EMI logo at top left. As with other issues from same source the Testament is beginning to rise in value too.

A fabulous inspirational performance from a great orchestra directed by a great conductor.
Nice!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 04, 2020, 08:30:13 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 04, 2020, 07:48:05 AM
Nice!  :)

PD

For the non-Bruckner specialist that the 4th and 9th are the most popular is correct. A good starting point to explore the others.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Mahlerian on August 04, 2020, 08:31:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 04, 2020, 08:30:13 AM
For the non-Bruckner specialist that the 4th and 9th are the most popular is correct. A good starting point to explore the others.

My impression was that the 7th was the second most popular after the 4th. Was I mistaken?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 04, 2020, 08:48:20 AM
Thanks Irons,  I'll keep that in mind (as I know that I have some Brucknerian 'bits and bobs' around here.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on August 04, 2020, 08:51:34 AM
Quote from: Mahlerian on August 04, 2020, 08:31:29 AM
My impression was that the 7th was the second most popular after the 4th. Was I mistaken?

Hm, interesting. Maybe the 9th is currently getting more performances, maybe the 7th got that earlier ... maybe. I agree that the 7th makes easier listening (and also: those two works form a good illustration of how different Anton's symphonies actually are).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 04, 2020, 11:19:08 PM
Quote from: Mahlerian on August 04, 2020, 08:31:29 AM
My impression was that the 7th was the second most popular after the 4th. Was I mistaken?

Probably not. My use of words not the best as it appeared an opinion was a fact.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 15, 2020, 06:02:38 AM
My first foray since lock down to the vinyl emporium I have frequented for 30 years plus.
A first to London (west) too. Surprisingly busy with plenty footfall, the only difference are wearing of masks on transport and shops. I had not realised masks makes you so thirsty. :P Anyway, a first step to some resemblance of normal life.

Frank Bridge: Sextet/Phantasie SQ. Hanson SQ. Pearl.

Bridge again: Piano Quintet/Phantasie Trio. Music Group of London. Enigma.

Myslivecec/Benda/Stamic: Violin Concertos. Eugen Prokop Prague Chamber Orchestra, Sadlo.

Schumann: SQ 1&2. Alberni Quartet. CRD.

Miklos Rozsa: Sonata/Bagatelles/Variations/The Vintner's Daughter. Eric Parkin. Unicorn. ( Sad to learn of the recent passing of Unicorn's founder, John Goldsmith.)

Bruckner: 2nd Symphony. Concertgebouw, Haitink. Philips.

Rodrigo: A l'ombre de Torre Bermeja/4 Estampas Andaluzas/Preludio al Gallo Mananero/ Sonatas de Castilla/Pastorol. Simone Guttman. Pavane.

Hindemith/Honegger: SQ No.3/No.2. Prague SQ/Dvorak SQ. Supraphon.

Richard Yardumian: 1st Symphony/Armenian Suite/Cantus Animae et Cordis. Brusilow Bournemouth SO. EMI.

Arthur Somervell/Gordon Jacob: Clarinet Quintets. Thea King with Aeolian SQ. Hyperion.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 15, 2020, 07:18:41 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 15, 2020, 06:02:38 AM
My first foray since lock down to the vinyl emporium I have frequented for 30 years plus.
A first to London (west) too. Surprisingly busy with plenty footfall, the only difference are wearing of masks on transport and shops. I had not realised masks makes you so thirsty. :P Anyway, a first step to some resemblance of normal life.

Frank Bridge: Sextet/Phantasie SQ. Hanson SQ. Pearl.

Bridge again: Piano Quintet/Phantasie Trio. Music Group of London. Enigma.

Myslivecec/Benda/Stamic: Violin Concertos. Eugen Prokop Prague Chamber Orchestra, Sadlo.

Schumann: SQ 1&2. Alberni Quartet. CRD.

Miklos Rozsa: Sonata/Bagatelles/Variations/The Vintner's Daughter. Eric Parkin. Unicorn. ( Sad to learn of the recent passing of Unicorn's founder, John Goldsmith.)

Bruckner: 2nd Symphony. Concertgebouw, Haitink. Philips.

Rodrigo: A l'ombre de Torre Bermeja/4 Estampas Andaluzas/Preludio al Gallo Mananero/ Sonatas de Castilla/Pastorol. Simone Guttman. Pavane.

Hindemith/Honegger: SQ No.3/No.2. Prague SQ/Dvorak SQ. Supraphon.

Richard Yardumian: 1st Symphony/Armenian Suite/Cantus Animae et Cordis. Brusilow Bournemouth SO. EMI.

Arthur Somervell/Gordon Jacob: Clarinet Quintets. Thea King with Aeolian SQ. Hyperion.
Lots of yummy looking vinyl there Irons!  Always envious of your easy access to Supraphon (as you know).  And, yes, I'm trying to remember to carry some cold water with me during errands via car these days.  Summertime heat is bad enough without adding to it having to wear a mask!  May I ask what you were able to get your Supraphon albums for these days?

It was nice to start the day off with music (see other thread), but must get back to chores.  Take care!

PD

p.s.  Pleased to report (knock on wood) that good stereo system is up and running again these days...so much nicer to listen to music on it!  Though I do have a fan trained on it whilst it's running; those tubes put off a lot of heat!  :(
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 15, 2020, 08:25:21 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 15, 2020, 07:18:41 AM
Lots of yummy looking vinyl there Irons!  Always envious of your easy access to Supraphon (as you know).  And, yes, I'm trying to remember to carry some cold water with me during errands via car these days.  Summertime heat is bad enough without adding to it having to wear a mask!  May I ask what you were able to get your Supraphon albums for these days?

It was nice to start the day off with music (see other thread), but must get back to chores.  Take care!

PD

p.s.  Pleased to report (knock on wood) that good stereo system is up and running again these days...so much nicer to listen to music on it!  Though I do have a fan trained on it whilst it's running; those tubes put off a lot of heat!  :(

Good to hear your main system is up and running, P. Tubes do run hot and depending on circuit can overheat.

Records start at usually £5, can be higher for rare items. After a few weeks the price drops and keeps doing so until sold or ends up on the scrap heap. I will take a photo of the label attached to every record and it will all make sense. The main shop area is rock and jazz with classical LP and CD in basement. The Supraphon cost £4.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 16, 2020, 01:49:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 15, 2020, 08:25:21 AM

Records start at usually £5, can be higher for rare items. After a few weeks the price drops and keeps doing so until sold or ends up on the scrap heap.

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=66806;image)


That could be a case of how long you can hold your nerve to get a low price  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 16, 2020, 05:21:48 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 16, 2020, 01:49:00 AM
That could be a case of how long you can hold your nerve to get a low price  ;D
Thanks for the explanation Irons.

And, Aligreto, that's what I was thinking! lol   ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 16, 2020, 05:31:00 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 16, 2020, 01:49:00 AM
That could be a case of how long you can hold your nerve to get a low price  ;D

Good point, why have I not thought of that. ::) Tell you what, forget about "social distancing" for LP and CD recent arrivals, elbows out and each man for himself. >:D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 16, 2020, 05:42:08 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 16, 2020, 05:31:00 AM
.... Tell you what, forget about "social distancing" for LP and CD recent arrivals, elbows out and each man for himself. >:D

As it should be. Some things are more important than others  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 16, 2020, 05:42:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 16, 2020, 05:31:00 AM
Good point, why have I not thought of that. ::) Tell you what, forget about "social distancing" for LP and CD recent arrivals, elbows out and each man for himself. >:D
Or 'woman'....I just had an idea; next time I might dress like this (encourages social distancing--and would keep others away from where you are wanting to dig/look around too).   ;D

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ZPzNmRv1QSo/VNkmEHhK8yI/AAAAAAAAU2Q/wTmFdtoFccQ/s1600/Ms%2BBroadshoulders%2BCabinet%2BCard03.jpg)

It's a photo from a well-known skit on The Carol Burnett Show [costume design by the famous Bob Mackie].
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 17, 2020, 08:07:22 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 16, 2020, 05:42:16 AM
Or 'woman'....I just had an idea; next time I might dress like this (encourages social distancing--and would keep others away from where you are wanting to dig/look around too).   ;D

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-ZPzNmRv1QSo/VNkmEHhK8yI/AAAAAAAAU2Q/wTmFdtoFccQ/s1600/Ms%2BBroadshoulders%2BCabinet%2BCard03.jpg)

It's a photo from a well-known skit on The Carol Burnett Show [costume design by the famous Bob Mackie].

Sorry P. Isn't "man" in this context like "actor" can mean either? "Guy" doesn't cut it somehow.

A fellow American of yours spent at auction $25,113.00 on jazz and classical records. He now can't afford a pair of socks!

https://youtu.be/v6Mj5GGrzwg
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 17, 2020, 08:18:27 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 17, 2020, 08:07:22 AM
Sorry P. Isn't "man" in this context like "actor" can mean either? "Guy" doesn't cut it somehow.

A fellow American of yours spent at auction $25,113.00 on jazz and classical records. He now can't afford a pair of socks!

https://youtu.be/v6Mj5GGrzwg
I was just joking around Irons.  It used to be when I went to things like record shows or bin digging at charity shops, that I was one of the few females there (I had the impression that the few others were either girlfriends or wives of the 'diggers').  I think that is starting to change a bit (though I haven't been to a record show in a few years).  Or even at the record stores themselves!

Do you often see women digging through LP bins Irons (others feel free to also contribute here)?  And of that, many in the classical bins?

Thanks for the link; I'll finish watching it later (a repair person could arrive here in as soon as 45 minutes...hoping that any necessary repairs will all be external).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 19, 2020, 01:05:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 17, 2020, 08:07:22 AM

A fellow American of yours spent at auction $25,113.00 on jazz and classical records. He now can't afford a pair of socks!

https://youtu.be/v6Mj5GGrzwg

That turned out to make for interesting viewing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 19, 2020, 07:12:20 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 19, 2020, 01:05:43 AM
That turned out to make for interesting viewing.

Pleased it was of interest to you.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on August 21, 2020, 08:08:57 PM
My Oracle Delphi MK. III is down (literally) again. I bought this lightly used in 1993 or so and added an SME V tonearm a year later. They performed brilliantly until 2015, when one of the suspension towers collapsed. For 22 years I had zero issues with it; My only expenditures were cartridge replacements. In 2016, I had it completely re-spung and had a new belt and new cartridge (another Blue Point) installed (very well-known and respected dealer in my area).

About this time last year the belt broke--only got 2.5 years out of that one, as opposed to 22 on the first one! Had to have that replaced. 40$ is not big deal, but I HATE transporting that thing in my car: I secure it down as best I can, but, still, it's BOING, BOING, BOING! I have to drive like a little old lady!

Then, a month or so ago, I was looking at it out of the corner of my eye and something did not seem right. Sure enough, one of the other towers had collapsed. These parts are little more than 3.5 years old.

It seems to me that the replacment parts from Oracle are garbage compared to the originals. Has anyone experienced a similar thing on their 'table? I guess I will have it fixed again. I cannot imaging shelling out $7K for a new one. The only other 'tables that look good to me are the VPIs, and those are nearly as expesive.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 22, 2020, 12:01:44 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on August 21, 2020, 08:08:57 PM
My Oracle Delphi MK. III is down (literally) again. I bought this lightly used in 1993 or so and added an SME V tonearm a year later. They performed brilliantly until 2015, when one of the suspension towers collapsed. For 22 years I had zero issues with it; My only expenditures were cartridge replacements. In 2016, I had it completely re-spung and had a new belt and new cartridge (another Blue Point) installed (very well-known and respected dealer in my area).

About this time last year the belt broke--only got 2.5 years out of that one, as opposed to 22 on the first one! Had to have that replaced. 40$ is not big deal, but I HATE transporting that thing in my car: I secure it down as best I can, but, still, it's BOING, BOING, BOING! I have to drive like a little old lady!

Then, a month or so ago, I was looking at it out of the corner of my eye and something did not seem right. Sure enough, one of the other towers had collapsed. These parts are little more than 3.5 years old.

It seems to me that the replacment parts from Oracle are garbage compared to the originals. Has anyone experienced a similar thing on their 'table? I guess I will have it fixed again. I cannot imaging shelling out $7K for a new one. The only other 'tables that look good to me are the VPIs, and those are nearly as expesive.

Oh dear, not good. You own a beautiful looking, top of the range turntable with a pedigree going back as far as I remember. To make the investment you have the Delphi should give a lifetime of trouble-free superb music. Can the platter be removed for transit, and are there suspension locking nuts? Your description of the journey to the dealer is a worry, is it possible the damage to the tower was caused by the trip?
 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 22, 2020, 03:48:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 22, 2020, 12:01:44 AM
Oh dear, not good. You own a beautiful looking, top of the range turntable with a pedigree going back as far as I remember. To make the investment you have the Delphi should give a lifetime of trouble-free superb music. Can the platter be removed for transit, and are there suspension locking nuts? Your description of the journey to the dealer is a worry, is it possible the damage to the tower was caused by the trip?

Oh, no!   :(  I did find the original manual for you (if it didn't come with it).  Do you have the original packaging that hopefully the previous owner kept and passed along to you?
https://493bd2cc-7df8-478d-aa2a-5e9ccb8dd6cd.filesusr.com/ugd/a191a2_594c13d0d55b4de1b148a5bd8b328a8e.pdf  Page 7 talks about unpacking and packing it.  If nothing else, perhaps you could either call Oracle directly or call your dealer for tips and help?  Just a suggestion.  And good luck!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on August 22, 2020, 07:54:38 PM
Thanks guys. The god of all things Oracle, Brooks Berdan (designer of the "BrooksMod", which was incorporated into all later models), set it up himself when I bought it in '93. His only suggestion was to stuff rolled up (clean  8) ) socks under the suspension while transporting it. I have been doing that ever since. He, and my current dealer told me not to worry so much, that the whole thing is more robust than it seems.

I don't think the trip in the car had anything to do with it, as it worked OK for  a year or more after the last trip home.

Funny story: Last year the Oracle belt broke a few days after we returned from our three week vacation in France. While in Brittany, trying to find our AIRBnB in our rental car, I drove past the correct house and had to reverse (one-way street). The owner opened the gate and directed me in (about a picometer of clearance on either side of my rental car). The whole manouver took me about five minutes with a line of French drivers waiting patiently behind me. Not a sign of obnoxiousness from any of them.

Then, after having returned here to to Murica/SoCal, I had to drive up to Pasadena to have the new Oracle belt installed. This audio shop has ONE reserved parking spot in front of the store--otherwise you have to pay $8 in the crappy garage and schlepp it a good distance. I was lucky enough that the spot was free, but I had to parallel park. In the minute or so it took me to do this, I must have had no fewer than FIVE drivers of various Escalades, Denalis, Silverados, Hummers (do you see a pattern here???) honk and give me the finger! Welcome back home!!!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 23, 2020, 01:26:58 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on August 21, 2020, 08:08:57 PM
My Oracle Delphi MK. III is down (literally) again. I bought this lightly used in 1993 or so and added an SME V tonearm a year later. They performed brilliantly until 2015, when one of the suspension towers collapsed. For 22 years I had zero issues with it; My only expenditures were cartridge replacements. In 2016, I had it completely re-spung and had a new belt and new cartridge (another Blue Point) installed (very well-known and respected dealer in my area).

About this time last year the belt broke--only got 2.5 years out of that one, as opposed to 22 on the first one! Had to have that replaced. 40$ is not big deal, but I HATE transporting that thing in my car: I secure it down as best I can, but, still, it's BOING, BOING, BOING! I have to drive like a little old lady!

Then, a month or so ago, I was looking at it out of the corner of my eye and something did not seem right. Sure enough, one of the other towers had collapsed. These parts are little more than 3.5 years old.

It seems to me that the replacment parts from Oracle are garbage compared to the originals. Has anyone experienced a similar thing on their 'table? I guess I will have it fixed again. I cannot imaging shelling out $7K for a new one. The only other 'tables that look good to me are the VPIs, and those are nearly as expesive.

That is a very elegant looking TT. I sympathize with your issues and I hope they are resolved soon and to your satisfaction. Do keep us posted on the outcome.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 23, 2020, 03:55:02 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on August 22, 2020, 07:54:38 PM

Funny story: Last year the Oracle belt broke a few days after we returned from our three week vacation in France. While in Brittany, trying to find our AIRBnB in our rental car, I drove past the correct house and had to reverse (one-way street). The owner opened the gate and directed me in (about a picometer of clearance on either side of my rental car). The whole manouver took me about five minutes with a line of French drivers waiting patiently behind me. Not a sign of obnoxiousness from any of them.

Then, after having returned here to to Murica/SoCal, I had to drive up to Pasadena to have the new Oracle belt installed. This audio shop has ONE reserved parking spot in front of the store--otherwise you have to pay $8 in the crappy garage and schlepp it a good distance. I was lucky enough that the spot was free, but I had to parallel park. In the minute or so it took me to do this, I must have had no fewer than FIVE drivers of various Escalades, Denalis, Silverados, Hummers (do you see a pattern here???) honk and give me the finger! Welcome back home!!!
Sighhhhhhh.... :(

Fingers crossed for you!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 24, 2020, 01:33:05 PM
Currently enjoying the Roy Harris Symphony No.3
LP, which was very cheap, seems to be in good condition.
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on August 24, 2020, 07:09:30 PM
Thanks for the kind concern folks. It's a first-world problem to be sure, and I do have a ton of other music that I have yet to listen to. But, I do miss my FLAC-ed LP of the week (several hundred still to go in my collection), and looking around for LPs on eBay. My next one will have to be the Jorg Demus WTC, which I think is not available on CD (but maybe someone will prove me wrong).  8)

I am busy with teaching a new (university) semester (fortunately 100% remote) and the slightly daunting proposition of setting up a new Windows system this weekend. But, I will get the Oracle up to the shop soon enough for another set of springs, a new mat, and whatever else it needs. I know the dealer will push the new motor/power supply upgrade for 1500$, but not necessary now (even though it would be cool).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 24, 2020, 11:25:38 PM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on August 24, 2020, 07:09:30 PM
Thanks for the kind concern folks. It's a first-world problem to be sure, and I do have a ton of other music that I have yet to listen to. But, I do miss my FLAC-ed LP of the week (several hundred still to go in my collection), and looking around for LPs on eBay. My next one will have to be the Jorg Demus WTC, which I think is not available on CD (but maybe someone will prove me wrong).  8)

I am busy with teaching a new (university) semester (fortunately 100% remote) and the slightly daunting proposition of setting up a new Windows system this weekend. But, I will get the Oracle up to the shop soon enough for another set of springs, a new mat, and whatever else it needs. I know the dealer will push the new motor/power supply upgrade for 1500$, but not necessary now (even though it would be cool).
Just caught up with this. What a song-and-dance! Hope you get it sorted.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 25, 2020, 08:00:17 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 24, 2020, 01:33:05 PM
Currently enjoying the Roy Harris Symphony No.3
LP, which was very cheap, seems to be in good condition.
(//)
Nice!  Wonder whether or not that's the same recording that I have?  I have a 2-CD set which is part of the Great Conductors of the 20th Century.  It says that it was remastered from shellacs and is from Nov. 8, 1939.  Alas, I don't have the other two works, but it is a nice set though.   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 25, 2020, 11:31:16 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 25, 2020, 08:00:17 AM
Nice!  Wonder whether or not that's the same recording that I have?  I have a 2-CD set which is part of the Great Conductors of the 20th Century.  It says that it was remastered from shellacs and is from Nov. 8, 1939.  Alas, I don't have the other two works, but it is a nice set though.   :)

PD

I think so but am not 100% sure. I have that set as well as the recording on the Pearl label (x2  :-\) and now the LP, which I really enjoyed as I did the Sibelius couplings. I've just ordered a copy of Harris's Third Symphony conducted by Ormandy, which I thought sounded terrific and was unaware of - it's from a CD 'Ormandy in Russia Vol.2', so it may be different from Ormandy's LP release of the work, which I was also unaware of until a couple of days ago. I'm surprised that the Harris Symphony No.3 is not more popular here on GMG Forum.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 18, 2020, 09:05:40 AM
Prokofieff: Lieutenant Kijé Suite [Kurtz]


(https://ring.cdandlp.com/vinylsuniverse/photo_grande/115001285.jpg)


This one is on 10" vinyl.

I like the look and feel of 10" vinyl. I also like how, in Classical Music, you usually, but not always, get one work per disc. I don't keep a count of such things but I suppose that I would have about 100 of these in my collection. I would always be interested in buying them if I see them for sale in charity shops, for example. I simply find them to be appealing for some reason.

I have a friend who has a very large vinyl collection who is also interested in very modern music and he tells me that a number of artists that he is interested in have released 10" vinyl versions of their music in recent years.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 18, 2020, 09:59:37 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 18, 2020, 09:56:21 AM
There is a small shop that sells anything and everything, odds and ends for next to nothing.  The owner seals up 50 or so LPs in plastic wrap and sells the bundle for $6.00.  Kind of a grab bag of vinyl.  I bought one because the two records on the outside were jazz LPs and I figured there might bee more inside, and it was such a small investment.  It ended up being of little interest.  While there were a few others I kept, most were not my thing.  Some were even empty. 

But, the one I checked, Ramsey Lewis "The In Crowd," was in surprisingly good condition.
It's one thing to sell a mystery package, but ones with no LPs?!  :o

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 18, 2020, 12:15:52 PM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 18, 2020, 11:11:14 AM
I don't think he even checked, just grabbed a handful from the stack and wrapped them up.  The record jackets were torn in several cases, and I'm sure the vinyl just fell out.  Who knows, the records might be hiding in one of the other bundles.
No, I didn't think that he was doing it on purpose; just not checking things well....still [possibly] 50 LPs for $6 is cheap!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 18, 2020, 12:36:52 PM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 18, 2020, 09:56:21 AM
There is a small shop that sells anything and everything, odds and ends for next to nothing.  The owner seals up 50 or so LPs in plastic wrap and sells the bundle for $6.00.  Kind of a grab bag of vinyl.  I bought one because the two records on the outside were jazz LPs and I figured there might bee more inside, and it was such a small investment.  It ended up being of little interest.  While there were a few others I kept, most were not my thing.  Some were even empty. 

But, the one I checked, Ramsey Lewis "The In Crowd," was in surprisingly good condition.

That is a very fair gamble. I would also go for it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 19, 2020, 11:30:52 PM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 19, 2020, 09:23:26 AM
So I found my old inexpensive Behringer phono amp in a box of cables, and hooked it up in anticipation of the arrival of my Schlit.

Am listening to my pristine new copy of Kind of Blue.

(https://img.discogs.com/dPM-5F9r7fzh5WasjAZjLj6Vgfg=/fit-in/600x601/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7606066-1445010340-4683.jpeg.jpg)

Fantastic!

Jazz on the vinyl thread? In the words of Miles "So What".

(https://i.imgur.com/h0efwwR.jpg)

Enjoy your vinyl set-up. Looking forward to reading your posts.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 20, 2020, 02:00:39 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 19, 2020, 09:23:26 AM
So I found my old inexpensive Behringer phono amp in a box of cables, and hooked it up in anticipation of the arrival of my Schlit.

Am listening to my pristine new copy of Kind of Blue.

(https://img.discogs.com/dPM-5F9r7fzh5WasjAZjLj6Vgfg=/fit-in/600x601/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7606066-1445010340-4683.jpeg.jpg)

Fantastic!

Great that you are ahead of schedule. I am sure that you will find a great difference when your Schlit arrives.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 20, 2020, 04:24:10 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 20, 2020, 03:12:04 AM
The sound is much richer than I imagined - it sounds like I've got the group in my studio - the bass, especially, sounds magnificent.  Not boomy, but a deep rich sound you can feel in your stomach.

That is great. I was never one of those "I told you so" merchants about vinyl playback. It was not always a great medium and has many drawbacks but, when it works, and you get the balance of all things right [a very big rabbit hole] it can work very, very well; particularly for the type of music that you enjoy. I hope that you have many happy listening adventures ahead.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 20, 2020, 07:54:56 AM
I have just posted this on the Classical Music Listening thread


QuoteVerdi: Requiem [Reiner]


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/9184gWRqVRL._AC_SL1500_.jpg)   (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81Kj2gcftJL._AC_SL1500_.jpg)


It has just struck me that I do believe this double LP to be the only coloured vinyl that I own [Burgundy coloured, as above]. I have not actively avoided buying coloured vinyl. For the most part the music that I listen to does not come on coloured vinyl. I do remember reading somewhere years ago, I cannot remember where, that there were either longevity or quality issues with coloured vinyl. Do people own much of it and have they found any long term issues with the medium? Indeed, have they found any difference whatsoever with it when compared with standard black vinyl?





Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 20, 2020, 08:02:03 AM
I had heard that in the past, that the colored vinyl sounded horrible; I did ask a friend (who buys a ton of new and used vinyl) for his thoughts and he said that that has changed these days and that the sound is just fine.  Trying to remember if I might have one or two used ones or if I just looked at them in shops?  Sorry, not being very helpful here!

San Antone,

Hope that you enjoy your new setup and am looking forward to your comments!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 20, 2020, 09:24:32 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 20, 2020, 08:02:03 AM
I had heard that in the past, that the colored vinyl sounded horrible; I did ask a friend (who buys a ton of new and used vinyl) for his thoughts and he said that that has changed these days and that the sound is just fine.  Trying to remember if I might have one or two used ones or if I just looked at them in shops?  Sorry, not being very helpful here!

PD

Did he originally think that the sound was poorer or does he think that the quality has improved? I am genuinely curious.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 20, 2020, 09:26:43 AM
Quote from: aligreto on September 20, 2020, 09:24:32 AM
Did he originally think that the sound was poorer or does he think that the quality has improved? I am genuinely curious.
Will ask him when I talk to him next.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 20, 2020, 10:40:36 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 20, 2020, 09:26:43 AM
Will ask him when I talk to him next.  :)

PD

Cheers PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 22, 2020, 06:35:05 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 21, 2020, 11:01:33 AM
My Schlit preamp arrived today, and I have connected it and set the little switches on the bottom for optimum performance with my Thorens.  Also Charles Mingus Ah Um, 180 gram reissue vinyl was just delivered, and so without delay it was on the turntable.  Double maiden voyage.   ;)

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61uF7ieUOPL._SX522_.jpg)

Nice.   8)

Charles Mingus, along with Joni Mitchell, is the only jazz artist or any artist come to that, who gives my lifelong profession a shout. A first and a last methinks. ;D

https://youtu.be/dgx9e-5_fE8
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 22, 2020, 07:33:50 AM
I am not into "collector" labels anymore, more into the music. They do turn up occasionally without actively looking which occurred last week. Not big bucks, Menuhin never is, although I believe him an excellent musician. His technique did slip in later life but his understanding of a work remained very good, one of the best IMO.

White and Gold is a very pretty label.

  (https://i.imgur.com/GTuRJVo.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 22, 2020, 07:42:13 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 22, 2020, 07:26:11 AM
So, is your screen name actually a pun?   ;D

For my sins I support West Ham United a soccer team who at their conception in 1895 were named Thames Ironworks. Hence their nickname the "Hammers" or "Irons".
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 23, 2020, 12:33:40 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 22, 2020, 06:01:37 AM
Another one of my favorite LP boxes retrieved from storage.  Thankfully these are in really good condition and sound fine.

(https://img.discogs.com/2eVMnAlXC1wQYQErjvWIBf9iGnc=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-10727449-1503184797-4894.jpeg.jpg)

It says "Volume 1" but I don't think I've ever seen Vol. 2.

Great to see you up and running. May it be trouble free and enjoyable  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 23, 2020, 08:01:49 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 23, 2020, 06:41:05 AM
Le sacre du printemps - Leonard Bernstein (1958)

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71sSb2CGRoL._SL1500_.jpg)

I bought this hi-quality vinyl recording three or four years ago, but never played it since it also came with the digital download version.  Nice to hear the vinyl.

Does it come with a facsimile of the famous 6-eye label?

I have the UK issue on CBS. To say an exciting performance is stating the obvious. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 23, 2020, 09:34:42 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 23, 2020, 09:21:13 AM
One thing Ive noticed since listening to my vinyl (and this may have been mentioned before in this thread) I find myself listening to the record more attentively than I usually do with a CD and most definitely with streaming.  I like that each side contains a really nice amount of music, about 22 minutes.  That seems like a perfect amount of time, and then there's the little physical involvement of flipping the record.

The physical aspect, the larger disc, cleaning it, the whole act of engaging the turntable, it all amounts to a somewhat richer experience.  It reminds me of my obsession with making espresso at one time.  Very process oriented.

Welcome back to the tactile world of vinyl. Long may it last  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 23, 2020, 11:37:46 AM
Quote from: aligreto on September 20, 2020, 10:40:36 AM
Cheers PD.

Talked to my friend and here's my (hopefully correct) summery of his comments:

1) Current/new non-black vinyl (since the 2000's) sounds fine
2) Older NB vinyl oftened sounded hissy/noisy.  He used to buy two copies of a record if there was a special edition of it coming out (the second being the normal black vinyl).
3) Regarding picture discs:  they never sound(ed) good (newer and old ones too)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 23, 2020, 01:05:50 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 23, 2020, 11:37:46 AM
Talked to my friend and here's my (hopefully correct) summery of his comments:

1) Current/new non-black vinyl (since the 2000's) sounds fine
2) Older NB vinyl often sounded hissy/noisy.  He used to buy two copies of a record if there was a special edition of it coming out (the second being the normal black vinyl).
3) Regarding picture discs:  they never sound(ed) good (newer and old ones too)

PD

Thank you very much PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 23, 2020, 01:46:14 PM
Quote from: aligreto on September 23, 2020, 01:05:50 PM
Thank you very much PD.
You're very much welcome Fergus!

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Andante on September 23, 2020, 01:50:46 PM
I have only about 300 vinyl left most are 12 inch dating from the early 50s , I do occasionally listen to one but there is always the constant hiss in the quite passages, and for me they just do not stack up against the CD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 02, 2020, 12:55:05 AM
Quote from: Old San Antone on September 28, 2020, 01:39:04 PM
The Savoy 10-inch LP Collection [4 Disc Deluxe Box Set]
Charlie Parker

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/714hoLR4z-L._SX522_.jpg)

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71%2BnnJ356BL._SX522_.jpg)

Arrived today.  The production values are amazing - what a fine set.  Very retro.  Sound's great.

What a wonderful idea. I am very fond of 10" vinyls for some reason  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 02, 2020, 06:42:57 AM
Armed with mask and hand sanitizer visited my favourite record store today.

On vinyl-

Blomdahl/Roseenberg: 3rd/6th Symphonies. Ehrling/Westerberg Stockholm PO. Turnabout.

Bach: Orchestral Suites 1-4 (2 LPs). Concentus Musicus. Telefunken.

Hoddinott: Landscapes/ PC No3/ Sinfonietta No.2. New Philharmonia Schonzeler. RCA.

Shostakovich/Britten: Piano Quintet/ SQ No.1. Benson with Alberni Quartet. CRD.

Nielsen: Tone Poems. Blomstedt and Danish RSO. HMV Greensleeve.

Bach: Violin Concertos. Standage & Wilcock with Pinnock and English Concert. Archive.

Roussel: Violin Sonatas 1&2. Galperin & Alberti. Cybelia.

On CD-

Glazunov: Symphonies 1, 7 & 8 Ballade, Slavonic Festival (2 CDs) Rozhdestvensky. Olympia.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 02, 2020, 06:54:17 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 02, 2020, 06:42:57 AM
Armed with mask and hand sanitizer visited my favourite record store today.

On vinyl-

Blomdahl/Roseenberg: 3rd/6th Symphonies. Ehrling/Westerberg Stockholm PO. Turnabout.

Bach: Orchestral Suites 1-4 (2 LPs). Concentus Musicus. Telefunken.

Hoddinott: Landscapes/ PC No3/ Sinfonietta No.2. New Philharmonia Schonzeler. RCA.

Shostakovich/Britten: Piano Quintet/ SQ No.1. Benson with Alberni Quartet. CRD.

Nielsen: Tone Poems. Blomstedt and Danish RSO. HMV Greensleeve.

Bach: Violin Concertos. Standage & Wilcock with Pinnock and English Concert. Archive.

Roussel: Violin Sonatas 1&2. Galperin & Alberti. Cybelia.

On CD-

Glazunov: Symphonies 1, 7 & 8 Ballade, Slavonic Festival (2 CDs) Rozhdestvensky. Olympia.
That Blomdahl/Rosenberg LP had a great impact on my youthful self, especially the Rosenberg with its strong sense of nature. There was a fine Swedish EMI LP of Rosenberg's epic 3rd Symphony (Blomstedt conducting I think). It is one of the great 20th Century symphonies IMO. The only thing was that there was a pressing fault with an annoying 'click' repeating all the way through the very moving final movement. Fortunately it was not replicated on the CD released. The Glazunov CD is very fine as well. Happy listening!
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 02, 2020, 08:43:57 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 02, 2020, 06:54:17 AM
That Blomdahl/Rosenberg LP had a great impact on my youthful self, especially the Rosenberg with its strong sense of nature. There was a fine Swedish EMI LP of Rosenberg's epic 3rd Symphony (Blomstedt conducting I think). It is one of the great 20th Century symphonies IMO. The only thing was that there was a pressing fault with an annoying 'click' repeating all the way through the very moving final movement. Fortunately it was not replicated on the CD released. The Glazunov CD is very fine as well. Happy listening!
(//)

Interesting re Rosenberg, thanks for info. I have been on the lookout for a decent Turnabout pressing for some time.

With Glazunov I have been in a bit of a quandary. The EMI licensed from Melodiya Svetlanov LP recordings have really good cover art, but it ends there. Svetlanov's Glazunov symphony cycle is in particularly poor sound (LP) which I must admit spoils the listening experience. The Svetlanov Miaskovsky recordings are far superior in this regard on both vinyl and CD as are many other Melodiya recordings. When I spied Rozhdestvensky I thought worth a try.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 02, 2020, 09:16:56 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 02, 2020, 06:42:57 AM
Armed with mask and hand sanitizer visited my favourite record store today.

On vinyl-

Blomdahl/Roseenberg: 3rd/6th Symphonies. Ehrling/Westerberg Stockholm PO. Turnabout.

Bach: Orchestral Suites 1-4 (2 LPs). Concentus Musicus. Telefunken.

Hoddinott: Landscapes/ PC No3/ Sinfonietta No.2. New Philharmonia Schonzeler. RCA.

Shostakovich/Britten: Piano Quintet/ SQ No.1. Benson with Alberni Quartet. CRD.

Nielsen: Tone Poems. Blomstedt and Danish RSO. HMV Greensleeve.

Bach: Violin Concertos. Standage & Wilcock with Pinnock and English Concert. Archive.

Roussel: Violin Sonatas 1&2. Galperin & Alberti. Cybelia.

On CD-

Glazunov: Symphonies 1, 7 & 8 Ballade, Slavonic Festival (2 CDs) Rozhdestvensky. Olympia.

Nice haul  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on October 02, 2020, 09:35:59 PM
Quote from: aligreto on October 02, 2020, 12:55:05 AM
What a wonderful idea. I am very fond of 10" vinyls for some reason  8)

Tempting, but how much for that Charlie Parker set??? I could probably buy a box set of 20 LPs on 10 CDs for something like a buck these days, but these?? PLUS all the time and effort digitizing. (But still, soooo coool.)

BTW, as for colored vinyl, one of the BEST sounding LPs in my collection is a Tawainese ORANGE vinyl 12" "sterfo" of "Lohnny Mathis". Incredible. (Yes, I do like Johnny Mathis.) So, I don't think colored vinyl is incompatible with great sound.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 03, 2020, 12:33:40 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 02, 2020, 09:16:56 AM
Nice haul  8)

Cheers. Cleaned three, so far so good.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 03, 2020, 04:25:41 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on October 02, 2020, 09:35:59 PM
Tempting, but how much for that Charlie Parker set??? I could probably buy a box set of 20 LPs on 10 CDs for something like a buck these days, but these?? PLUS all the time and effort digitizing. (But still, soooo coool.)

BTW, as for colored vinyl, one of the BEST sounding LPs in my collection is a Tawainese ORANGE vinyl 12" "sterfo" of "Lohnny Mathis". Incredible. (Yes, I do like Johnny Mathis.) So, I don't think colored vinyl is incompatible with great sound.
How old is your pressing?  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on October 03, 2020, 01:11:35 PM
Quote from: Old San Antone on October 03, 2020, 04:24:01 AM
I think it was $67.  Yeah, I could listen to this music on Spotify and not have bought anything.  As to why did I buy these?  First it is the experience of playing the discs on my turntable, the sound of the music (really very good) and the selections (the early Bird that defined bebop), broken up into about 10 minutes per side.  I like this way of listening.

Thanks, yes, I agree--there are far cheaper and easier ways of listening to music than vinyl, but vinyl is arguably the best (at least, more enjoyable) for many of us. In my case, I weigh each LP purchase carefully due mostly to time and space considerations. I have a huge backlog of vinyl to listen to and FLAC. I love browsing through stores and eBay for interesting finds, and I still buy used and new LPs regularly. But still, for large volumes of music (e.g., large box sets), it is far more sensible (for me at least) to go the CD route.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on October 03, 2020, 01:13:53 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 03, 2020, 04:25:41 AM
How old is your pressing?  :)

PD

Hi PD. That Johnny Mathis LP looks to be late 60s or early 70s. I will try to dig out a photo. Orange vinyl (translucent) and incredibly good sounding.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 04, 2020, 01:58:09 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on October 02, 2020, 09:35:59 PM

BTW, as for colored vinyl, one of the BEST sounding LPs in my collection is a Tawainese ORANGE vinyl 12" "sterfo" of "Lohnny Mathis". Incredible. (Yes, I do like Johnny Mathis.) So, I don't think colored vinyl is incompatible with great sound.

Good to hear that from another vinyl owner.

How is the TT getting on these days?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 04, 2020, 07:38:38 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on October 03, 2020, 01:13:53 PM
Hi PD. That Johnny Mathis LP looks to be late 60s or early 70s. I will try to dig out a photo. Orange vinyl (translucent) and incredibly good sounding.
Wonder if it might have something to do with the formulas used in colored-but-translucent vs. colored-but-opaque LPs?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on October 04, 2020, 01:02:25 PM
Quote from: aligreto on October 04, 2020, 01:58:09 AM
Good to hear that from another vinyl owner.

How is the TT getting on these days?

Hi Fergus, it has been busy lately, and I have not had a chance to take the Oracle back to Delphi. However, I plan to do so in the next month or so, when things will quiet down significantly for me. Then, six weeks off for winter break. Late Jan gets busy again with teaching Medical Parasitology for the first time---lots of work! So, I plan to get busy digitizing in Nov, Dec.

How are you doing??
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 04, 2020, 01:11:21 PM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on October 04, 2020, 01:02:25 PM
Hi Fergus, it has been busy lately, and I have not had a chance to take the Oracle back to Delphi. However, I plan to do so in the next month or so, when things will quiet down significantly for me. Then, six weeks off for winter break. Late Jan gets busy again with teaching Medical Parasitology for the first time---lots of work! So, I plan to get busy digitizing in Nov, Dec.

How are you doing??

All good here, my friend, thankfully.

Let us know when you eventually bring the TT to be looked at.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on October 04, 2020, 01:25:21 PM
Thanks, yes I will! Glad you are doing well. (I have been very slow with email lately. sorry.)

Here is the specimen in question--attached photos (image quality is much better after clicking on the image!). On the morning of 7 April 2007, I did not set out to find an orange vinyl LP of Johnny Mathis (from Taiwan, no less), but it just worked out that way! The fun of rummaging around in bins of used LPs!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 04, 2020, 02:25:23 PM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on October 04, 2020, 01:25:21 PM
I have been very slow with email lately. sorry.



In your own time.



QuoteHere is the specimen in question--attached photos (image quality is much better after clicking on the image!). On the morning of 7 April 2007, I did not set out to find an orange vinyl LP of Johnny Mathis (from Taiwan, no less), but it just worked out that way! The fun of rummaging around in bins of used LPs!

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=67792;image)



Nice!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 05, 2020, 05:32:26 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on October 04, 2020, 01:25:21 PM
Thanks, yes I will! Glad you are doing well. (I have been very slow with email lately. sorry.)

Here is the specimen in question--attached photos (image quality is much better after clicking on the image!). On the morning of 7 April 2007, I did not set out to find an orange vinyl LP of Johnny Mathis (from Taiwan, no less), but it just worked out that way! The fun of rummaging around in bins of used LPs!
Thanks for the photos.  Pretty orange and blue!  :)  Wonderful singer Johnny Mathis.  Glad that it worked out well for you.

Yes, it is fun to dig through bins.  My one gripe here:  often the classical record bins are on the floor (or just slightly off of the ground).  Makes for awkward (and increasingly painful) digging through them!  Bad light too.  Is this often the case outside of the US?

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 05, 2020, 10:15:05 AM
I very rarely buy LPs but have recently acquired these two Miaskovsky discs. Gauk's recording of Symphony 27 is the most moving of all. I'm sorry that it wasn't released on CD in the Brilliant Gauk boxed set. I have never owned a recording of the 7th Symphony or 'Links' on LP:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 06, 2020, 07:06:54 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 05, 2020, 10:15:05 AM
I very rarely buy LPs but have recently acquired these two Miaskovsky discs. Gauk's recording of Symphony 27 is the most moving of all. I'm sorry that it wasn't released on CD in the Brilliant Gauk boxed set. I have never owned a recording of the 7th Symphony or 'Links' on LP:
(//)

Congratulations, Jeffrey. I always look in my usual haunts but never find Miaskovsky other then Melodiya/EMI symphonies and quartets.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 06, 2020, 09:07:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 06, 2020, 07:06:54 AM
Congratulations, Jeffrey. I always look in my usual haunts but never find Miaskovsky other then Melodiya/EMI symphonies and quartets.

Thanks Lol. I got a good deal for buying two LPs. He also had an LP with Symphony 17 (Gauk I think) if you are interested. 17 is one of the very best.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 08, 2020, 01:08:23 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/AZnrTP3.jpg)

Recorded in the Kingsway Hall 17-19th February 1958 with an initial release on full price Decca (wide band). Reissued in 1968 on Decca Ace of Diamonds and also issued on the Decca "World of Classics" series.

I own a copy of Ace of Diamonds SDD 188 which sounds very fine with a cracking performance from Peter Katin and Sir Adrian.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 17, 2020, 01:50:41 AM
Currently listening to Miaskovsky Symphony No. 27 Moscow Radio SO cond. Alexander Gauk.
This is by far the most moving performance I have heard of this great work - it has a depth of feeling which goes beyond the more recent performances by Svetlanov and Polyansky, good as they are. The sound quality is much better than I anticipated:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 17, 2020, 08:04:48 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 08, 2020, 01:08:23 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/AZnrTP3.jpg)

Recorded in the Kingsway Hall 17-19th February 1958 with an initial release on full price Decca (wide band). Reissued in 1968 on Decca Ace of Diamonds and also issued on the Decca "World of Classics" series.

I own a copy of Ace of Diamonds SDD 188 which sounds very fine with a cracking performance from Peter Katin and Sir Adrian.
The Ace of Diamonds cover is quite nice.  The Decca one seems a bit strange to me; any idea where the photo was taken?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 17, 2020, 08:06:18 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 17, 2020, 01:50:41 AM
Currently listening to Miaskovsky Symphony No. 27 Moscow Radio SO cond. Alexander Gauk.
This is by far the most moving performance I have heard of this great work - it has a depth of feeling which goes beyond the more recent performances by Svetlanov and Polyansky, good as they are. The sound quality I'd much better than I anticipated:
(//)
I really need to check out Miaskovsky.  I remember hearing about him a number of years ago.  If I'm remembering correctly, he wrote a heck of a lot of symphonies??

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 17, 2020, 09:50:50 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 17, 2020, 08:06:18 AM
I really need to check out Miaskovsky.  I remember hearing about him a number of years ago.  If I'm remembering correctly, he wrote a heck of a lot of symphonies??

PD

Twenty seven in total PD

My recommendations are 3,6,17,21,25 and 27.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 17, 2020, 11:55:33 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 17, 2020, 08:04:48 AM
The Ace of Diamonds cover is quite nice.  The Decca one seems a bit strange to me; any idea where the photo was taken?

PD

Not a clue, P. After amazingly coming up with the correct location recently of a stream by a forum member it would not surprise me if someone knows.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 18, 2020, 03:54:51 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 17, 2020, 09:50:50 AM
Twenty seven in total PD

My recommendations are 3,6,17,21,25 and 27.
Thanks Jeffrey.  I've duly noted them and will have them with me when I visit record stores--so long as I remember to take my phone with me!  ::)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 18, 2020, 03:56:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 17, 2020, 11:55:33 PM
Not a clue, P. After amazingly coming up with the correct location recently of a stream by a forum member it would not surprise me if someone knows.
I can tell you that the photographer was Hans Wild in any event.  :) From Discogs.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 18, 2020, 05:10:59 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 17, 2020, 01:50:41 AM
Currently listening to Miaskovsky Symphony No. 27 Moscow Radio SO cond. Alexander Gauk.
This is by far the most moving performance I have heard of this great work - it has a depth of feeling which goes beyond the more recent performances by Svetlanov and Polyansky, good as they are. The sound quality is much better than I anticipated:
(//)

You may or may not be interested Jeffrey but I find this a handy tool for dating Melodiya LPs.

http://www.pnprecords.spb.ru/vynil-labels/index.phtml
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 20, 2020, 02:31:18 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 18, 2020, 05:10:59 AM
You may or may not be interested Jeffrey but I find this a handy tool for dating Melodiya LPs.

http://www.pnprecords.spb.ru/vynil-labels/index.phtml

Very interesting and helpful Lol. Thank you.
I remember that some of my earliest Melodiya LPs featured heavy vinyl and the blue label. These included Kondrashin's LP set of Miaskovsky's 6th Symphony - recently reissued on an Alto CD ( ;D) and Kabalevsky's 4th Symphony conducted by Kabalevsky. As far as I recall these came in plain white cardboard sleeves with no notes at all, either in Russian or English. These would have both been borrowed from the record library in London. Later ones, like Miaskovsky's 27th Symphony (Svetlanov) I acquired myself and featured the red label. It's interesting to have the historical context of those releases explained.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 20, 2020, 08:28:07 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 20, 2020, 02:31:18 AM
Very interesting and helpful Lol. Thank you.
I remember that some of my earliest Melodiya LPs featured heavy vinyl and the blue label. These included Kondrashin's LP set of Miaskovsky's 6th Symphony - recently reissued on an Alto CD ( ;D) and Kabalevsky's 4th Symphony conducted by Kabalevsky. As far as I recall these came in plain white cardboard sleeves with no notes at all, either in Russian or English. These would have both been borrowed from the record library in London. Later ones, like Miaskovsky's 27th Symphony (Svetlanov) I acquired myself and featured the red label. It's interesting to have the historical context of those releases explained.

Any LP is an artefact and some have historical importance. I am particularly interested Jeffrey in music for the home market manufactured on LP behind the old "Iron Curtain". Russia, GDR, Bulgaria, Poland and many more are a treasure trove of rare and interesting music. I have been searching for a particular string quartet for years without success only to discover over the weekend it is available on CD! ::) Lesson learned - don't discount other music carriers. I will post my thoughts on this work in the very near future. Many others due to the passage of time the master tapes will be either lost or unusable. A LP copy may be all that has survived and if in good condition, historically significant.

Quite possibly available in digital form, but even so I prize a first pressing of Rostropvich with the Taneyev Quartet performing the Schubert String Quintet. Tully Potter describes this as the greatest recording of the Quintet and I for one have no argument with that.

(https://i.imgur.com/DeJvkSJ.jpg)


   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 20, 2020, 08:48:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 20, 2020, 08:28:07 AM
Any LP is an artefact and some have historical importance. I am particularly interested Jeffrey in music for the home market manufactured on LP behind the old "Iron Curtain". Russia, GDR, Bulgaria, Poland and many more are a treasure trove of rare and interesting music. I have been searching for a particular string quartet for years without success only to discover over the weekend it is available on CD! ::) Lesson learned - don't discount other music carriers. I will post my thoughts on this work in the very near future. Many others due to the passage of time the master tapes will be either lost or unusable. A LP copy may be all that has survived and if in good condition, historically significant.

Quite possibly available in digital form, but even so I prize a first pressing of Rostropvich with the Taneyev Quartet performing the Schubert String Quintet. Tully Potter describes this as the greatest recording of the Quintet and I for one have no argument with that.

(https://i.imgur.com/DeJvkSJ.jpg)


   
Cool!  8)  You might find the reviews here to be of interest Irons.  https://www.amazon.com/Schubert-Quintet-Taneyev-Mistislav-Rostropovich/dp/B007S9IWYW#customerReviews

Now you have me intrigued as to what other recording you've been searching for!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 20, 2020, 09:04:37 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 20, 2020, 08:28:07 AM
Any LP is an artefact and some have historical importance. I am particularly interested Jeffrey in music for the home market manufactured on LP behind the old "Iron Curtain". Russia, GDR, Bulgaria, Poland and many more are a treasure trove of rare and interesting music. I have been searching for a particular string quartet for years without success only to discover over the weekend it is available on CD! ::) Lesson learned - don't discount other music carriers. I will post my thoughts on this work in the very near future. Many others due to the passage of time the master tapes will be either lost or unusable. A LP copy may be all that has survived and if in good condition, historically significant.

Quite possibly available in digital form, but even so I prize a first pressing of Rostropvich with the Taneyev Quartet performing the Schubert String Quintet. Tully Potter describes this as the greatest recording of the Quintet and I for one have no argument with that.

(https://i.imgur.com/DeJvkSJ.jpg)


   
Interesting indeed Lol. Works like Balanchivadze's excellent First Symphony, which a kind person copied for me years ago, may only be available on LP for all I know.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 21, 2020, 12:52:36 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 20, 2020, 08:48:31 AM
Cool!  8)  You might find the reviews here to be of interest Irons.  https://www.amazon.com/Schubert-Quintet-Taneyev-Mistislav-Rostropovich/dp/B007S9IWYW#customerReviews

Now you have me intrigued as to what other recording you've been searching for!

PD

Thank you very much for that, P. Does this mean there is indeed no CD release?

Secrets from you I will not keep  ;D  https://youtu.be/QOl04Ap_wTU
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 21, 2020, 01:37:48 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 20, 2020, 09:04:37 AM
Interesting indeed Lol. Works like Balanchivadze's excellent First Symphony, which a kind person copied for me years ago, may only be available on LP for all I know.

Checked but no Balanchivadze sadly, I will keep the name in mind, if not the spelling. ??? Sifting through I seem to have accumulated quite a few Rakov LPs, is he known to you, Jeffrey?

Many Melodiya LPs for the home market are printed in Russian only. I have found by googling birth/death dates the English translation appears. Pakob born 1908 = Rakov.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 21, 2020, 05:45:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 21, 2020, 12:52:36 AM
Thank you very much for that, P. Does this mean there is indeed no CD release?

Secrets from you I will not keep  ;D  https://youtu.be/QOl04Ap_wTU
Thank you for the link, but it's not working/playing.  It shows String Quartet No. 3 and Naxos of America, but the screen is black.  What is it for Irons?

I'll try and google further for you Irons.  I did see it uploaded to youtube though.  I did find this on Discogs showing other releases on vinyl.  https://www.discogs.com/Taneyev-Quartet-Mstislav-Rostropovich-Franz-Schubert-String-Quintet-Op-163/release/10045110

You might try posting this question elsewhere too (perhaps more people might read it)?  Maybe on a Schubert thread or it there is one on Rostropovich or the Taneyevs, etc.?

PD

EDIT:  By the way, I've been tempted to create a 'cheat sheet' to bring to record stores...of Russian  (and maybe also some non-Russian composers?), some groups and orchestras, performers and also of conductors with their names in Russian to help me try and identify what I'm looking at.  :)  Clever idea, Irons to use their dates.  Are they normally on the LPs?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 21, 2020, 08:03:40 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 21, 2020, 05:45:06 AM
Thank you for the link, but it's not working/playing.  It shows String Quartet No. 3 and Naxos of America, but the screen is black.  What is it for Irons?

I'll try and google further for you Irons.  I did see it uploaded to youtube though.  I did find this on Discogs showing other releases on vinyl.  https://www.discogs.com/Taneyev-Quartet-Mstislav-Rostropovich-Franz-Schubert-String-Quintet-Op-163/release/10045110

You might try posting this question elsewhere too (perhaps more people might read it)?  Maybe on a Schubert thread or it there is one on Rostropovich or the Taneyevs, etc.?

PD

EDIT:  By the way, I've been tempted to create a 'cheat sheet' to bring to record stores...of Russian  (and maybe also some non-Russian composers?), some groups and orchestras, performers and also of conductors with their names in Russian to help me try and identify what I'm looking at.  :)  Clever idea, Irons to use their dates.  Are they normally on the LPs?

The link is good, P. I have checked. Must be an issue with licensing to the US. Try searching Yuri Falik there is a very noisy vinyl upload on YT of the 3rd Quartet which introduced me to the work. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 22, 2020, 04:54:18 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 21, 2020, 08:03:40 AM
The link is good, P. I have checked. Must be an issue with licensing to the US. Try searching Yuri Falik there is a very noisy vinyl upload on YT of the 3rd Quartet which introduced me to the work.
Thanks Irons; I found the 'noisy' one.  Strange that I couldn't listen to the other one as it was uploaded by Naxos of America!  I'll listen to the other upload whilst eating my breakfast....which I'm off to prepare.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 22, 2020, 06:14:14 AM
Just listened to it (post-breakfast).  Eerie and haunting at times...intriguing Irons.  Thanks for sharing that with me.  I hadn't heard of him before now.  Wonder how well known his music is outside of Russia?  Despite the comments by the uploader, I read in several other places that his music isn't well-known outside of there.  What are you thoughts though?  I'd be interested to hear them.

I see that he's written at least one cello concerto; have you heard them?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 22, 2020, 07:23:21 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 22, 2020, 06:14:14 AM
Just listened to it (post-breakfast).  Eerie and haunting at times...intriguing Irons.  Thanks for sharing that with me.  I hadn't heard of him before now.  Wonder how well known his music is outside of Russia?  Despite the comments by the uploader, I read in several other places that his music isn't well-known outside of there.  What are you thoughts though?  I'd be interested to hear them.

I see that he's written at least one cello concerto; have you heard them?

PD

I am relieved your breakfast wasn't spoilt, P. :) I first heard the vinyl YT upload about five years ago which left a deep impression. Falik does feature on my LP shelves with a short work (12.55) "Music for String Instruments".
(https://i.imgur.com/PZpGptb.jpg)

I'm not even close in making any sort of judgment how important Falik is, but like you I am intrigued. Apparently he enjoyed considerable success in Soviet Russia as a composer, teacher and cellist and enjoyed the trappings of success, yet to my ears the little music I have heard, is angry - there are no peasants dancing in fields. His music is extremely rhythmic, which I love, dissonance is sparingly used. My initial impression is a mirror of post-Stalin Soviet city life. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on October 22, 2020, 09:40:03 AM
My small Falik collection  :)

lp    Falik:"Musik for Strings" (1965)/Vronsky,PragSO/sup 79 1110 2280
LP   Falik:"Elegiac Music I.M.Stravinsky" f.Ens. (1975)/Rozhdestvensky,LeningradCO/mel-eterna 827 369
lp    Falik:"Elegiac Music I.M.Stravinsky" f.Ens. (1975)/Rezucha,SlovakPO/opus 83 9110 1448
LP   Falik:"Concerto for Orchestra no.1, Tyll Ulenspiegel" (1967)/Rozhdestvensky,LenPO/mel-eterna 827 369
CD  Falik:"Concerto for Orchestra no.2, Symphonic Studies" (1988)/Dmitriev,StPetPO/north flow 04 nfpma9924
CD  Falik:"Cello Concerto, Delle Passione" (1988)/Gutman,Dmitriev,StPetPO/north flow 04 nfpma9924
LP   Falik:"3rd String Quartet" (1975)/Taneyev4/mel-eterna 827 369
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 22, 2020, 01:11:01 PM
Quote from: MusicTurner on October 22, 2020, 09:40:03 AM
My small Falik collection  :)

lp    Falik:"Musik for Strings" (1965)/Vronsky,PragSO/sup 79 1110 2280
LP   Falik:"Elegiac Music I.M.Stravinsky" f.Ens. (1975)/Rozhdestvensky,LeningradCO/mel-eterna 827 369
lp    Falik:"Elegiac Music I.M.Stravinsky" f.Ens. (1975)/Rezucha,SlovakPO/opus 83 9110 1448
LP   Falik:"Concerto for Orchestra no.1, Tyll Ulenspiegel" (1967)/Rozhdestvensky,LenPO/mel-eterna 827 369
CD  Falik:"Concerto for Orchestra no.2, Symphonic Studies" (1988)/Dmitriev,StPetPO/north flow 04 nfpma9924
CD  Falik:"Cello Concerto, Delle Passione" (1988)/Gutman,Dmitriev,StPetPO/north flow 04 nfpma9924
LP   Falik:"3rd String Quartet" (1975)/Taneyev4/mel-eterna 827 369

Just the person I would like to have a word with. Yuri Falik could never be described as a rounded composer but I am resisting the urge to go OTT with difficulty. His music is ugly and brutal at times but never short of excitement and enters the "great" category on a regular basis. What do you think?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on October 26, 2020, 09:43:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 22, 2020, 01:11:01 PM
Just the person I would like to have a word with. Yuri Falik could never be described as a rounded composer but I am resisting the urge to go OTT with difficulty. His music is ugly and brutal at times but never short of excitement and enters the "great" category on a regular basis. What do you think?

I'll be checking the material in the coming days, it's been a long time since I heard it. But overall, there are often certain motoric or martial characteristics to be found in the music of many Soviet era composers - such as with Boris Tischenko, Boris Tchaikovsky, Shchedrin, Khrennikov or Herman Galynin, for example.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on October 31, 2020, 10:34:58 AM
Have been listening to this old LP, bought second/hand, of both music by Falik, plus apparently a celebration of USSR transformer stations and constructivism, cf. the cover ...  there is the 3rd String Quartet, Elegiac Music IM Stravinsky for strings and trombones, and a Concerto for Orchestra.

The quartet (1975) has some similarities with late Shostakovitch or some Schnittke, with feverish, martial rhythms, partly in pizzicato. Somewhere into the work, elegiac solo passages add more sweeping melodies, also reminding of Faliks background as a cello player. It is not a long work, lasting only 16 minutes, so it does not become that emotionally arresting. As regards the Elegiac Music (1975), the liner notes, written by a GDR professor, say that Falik seems to get inspiration from late Stravinsky, but as a layman I am not hearing much of a classicist or emotional restrain in the work, the trombones do perhaps add a bit of it, but it is a dark work.
The Concerto for Orchestra (1967) is in a lighter, very virtuoso and episodical style, with a lot of orchestral brilliance and including an organ, reminding of say the orchestral concertos by Bartok and Lutoslawski, or a Shostakovich ouverture. There is social and revolutionary optimism in the celebration of the Tyl Eulenspiegel hero story. It is quite ambitious and lasts more than 22 minutes.

Overall, I think his expression is somewhat varied, if one just thinks of the selection on this LP, but it is within the typical USSR and Eastern Bloc expression of the day, often sombre. Maybe it is characteristic that this applies especially to the works from the 70s. A cleaner CD sound might contribute further to the experience of it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 31, 2020, 11:20:13 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 21, 2020, 01:37:48 AM
Checked but no Balanchivadze sadly, I will keep the name in mind, if not the spelling. ??? Sifting through I seem to have accumulated quite a few Rakov LPs, is he known to you, Jeffrey?

Many Melodiya LPs for the home market are printed in Russian only. I have found by googling birth/death dates the English translation appears. Pakob born 1908 = Rakov.

I have this CD Lol:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 01, 2020, 01:05:26 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on October 31, 2020, 10:34:58 AM
Have been listening to this old LP, bought second/hand, of both music by Falik, plus apparently a celebration of USSR transformer stations and constructivism, cf. the cover ...  there is the 3rd String Quartet, Elegiac Music IM Stravinsky for strings and trombones, and a Concerto for Orchestra.

The quartet (1975) has some similarities with late Shostakovitch or some Schnittke, with feverish, martial rhythms, partly in pizzicato. Somewhere into the work, elegiac solo passages add more sweeping melodies, also reminding of Faliks background as a cello player. It is not a long work, lasting only 16 minutes, so it does not become that emotionally arresting. As regards the Elegiac Music (1975), the liner notes, written by a GDR professor, say that Falik seems to get inspiration from late Stravinsky, but as a layman I am not hearing much of a classicist or emotional restrain in the work, the trombones do perhaps add a bit of it, but it is a dark work.
The Concerto for Orchestra (1967) is in a lighter, very virtuoso and episodical style, with a lot of orchestral brilliance and including an organ, reminding of say the orchestral concertos by Bartok and Lutoslawski, or a Shostakovich ouverture. There is social and revolutionary optimism in the celebration of the Tyl Eulenspiegel hero story. It is quite ambitious and lasts more than 22 minutes.

Overall, I think his expression is somewhat varied, if one just thinks of the selection on this LP, but it is within the typical USSR and Eastern Bloc expression of the day, often sombre. Maybe it is characteristic that this applies especially to the works from the 70s. A cleaner CD sound might contribute further to the experience of it.

An interesting summery and thanks for making it. I am not keen when labels mix up differing genres on the same issue preferring keeping orchestral and chamber separate.
Interesting that you make the point of the length of the 3rd Quartet and emotional depth. All the quartets, 3, 4, 5 & 6, with the exception of the 6th, are cast in a single movement and of similar length. The 6th, the most original, has two movements and the shortest of all at 13:23.
As you say there is a tangible 1970's era flavour which bothered me at first but faded as I delved deeper in the music.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 01, 2020, 01:25:58 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 31, 2020, 11:20:13 AM
I have this CD Lol:
(//)

Another recording from the excellent Dudarova, Jeffrey. I must give her Miaskovsky 11th a spin.

I have a Melodiya LP of Rakov's 2nd Violin Concerto (1963) coupled with Sinfonietta and Little Symphony.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2020, 02:47:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 01, 2020, 01:25:58 AM
Another recording from the excellent Dudarova, Jeffrey. I must give her Miaskovsky 11th a spin.

I have a Melodiya LP of Rakov's 2nd Violin Concerto (1963) coupled with Sinfonietta and Little Symphony.
The Dudarova recording of Miaskovsky's 11th Symphony is excellent Lol as are the Two Pieces for String Orchestra, transcribed from the middle movements of Symphony 19 for Band. The first one is very moving. I had an old Melodiya LP of those works but since I've acquired a turntable I have bought the ASD/Melodiya release LP:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2020, 02:49:37 AM
New arrival today. Great to have The Forgotten Rite, Mai Dun and the Legend on the same LP, featuring the late Eric Parkin:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 02, 2020, 03:23:56 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 01, 2020, 01:25:58 AM
(...)

I have a Melodiya LP of Rakov's 2nd Violin Concerto (1963) coupled with Sinfonietta and Little Symphony.

Ditto here.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 02, 2020, 06:43:27 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2020, 02:47:15 AM
The Dudarova recording of Miaskovsky's 11th Symphony is excellent Lol as are the Two Pieces for String Orchestra, transcribed from the middle movements of Symphony 19 for Band. The first one is very moving. I had an old Melodiya LP of those works but since I've acquired a turntable I have bought the ASD/Melodiya release LP:
(//)

Not purist but given a choice between Melodiya and licensed EMI I choose the latter, Jeffrey. I have both in a a few issues but not made a comparison. I would like to think EMI to protect their reputation would sort the wheat from the chaff and only issue Melodiya recordings that reach a certain standard of performance and sonics. My theory is not full-proof as the sound on LP of the Glazunov symphonies is disappointingly poor.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 02, 2020, 06:55:44 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on November 02, 2020, 03:23:56 AM
Ditto here.

(https://i.imgur.com/7kccj7O.jpg)

Rakov. Side 1, here are three waltzes and Side 2, Concert Suite and Geroichesky March.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2020, 12:08:52 PM
Just purchased this for £6.00
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 03, 2020, 12:13:19 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2020, 12:08:52 PM
Just purchased this for £6.00
(//)

Excellent investment, Jeffrey. When I visited 2nd hand record shops - sadly a rare occurrence these days, I hoovered up WRC LPs. The WRC licensed hundreds of titles from other labels and they also made their own recordings, one of which you may find of interest. A 1960 stereo recording of Bliss conducting 'Checkmate'.


   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 03, 2020, 12:21:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 02, 2020, 06:55:44 AM
(...)

Rakov. Side 1, here are three waltzes and Side 2, Concert Suite and Geroichesky March.

I don't have that one, have never seen it, I think. This is mine of the 2nd Violin Cto etc. Rakov's music is quite attractive and one could easily see Naxos embarking on a project.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 03, 2020, 02:23:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 03, 2020, 12:13:19 AM
Excellent investment, Jeffrey. When I visited 2nd hand record shops - sadly a rare occurrence these days, I hoovered up WRC LPs. The WRC licensed hundreds of titles from other labels and they also made their own recordings, one of which you may find of interest. A 1960 stereo recording of Bliss conducting 'Checkmate'.




Thanks Lol. I recall taking the WRC LP out of the High Street Kensington record library and thoroughly enjoying it. I have this LP - an early acquisition which may feature the same performance as the one that you recommend. The HMV Concert Classics label was a great, inexpensive source of early classical music discoveries for me - not least Sargent's record of Walton's First Symphony and one featuring Walton's film music:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 03, 2020, 04:04:45 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2020, 12:08:52 PM
Just purchased this for £6.00
(//)
Oh, nice!  I haven't listened to any Solomon recordings in ages, but I did enjoy what I heard and purchased that EMI (now Warner) Icon boxset of his.

What label is yours on Jeffrey?  I don't recognize the logo.

PD

EDIT:  Oh, so it's a WRC?  Just read Irons' subsequent post.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 03, 2020, 05:56:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 03, 2020, 04:04:45 AM
Oh, nice!  I haven't listened to any Solomon recordings in ages, but I did enjoy what I heard and purchased that EMI (now Warner) Icon boxset of his.

What label is yours on Jeffrey?  I don't recognize the logo.

PD

EDIT:  Oh, so it's a WRC?  Just read Irons' subsequent post.

Yes, WRC PD. I also had their fine LPs of historic Sibelius recordings (Kajanus etc), VW conducting his own 4th Symphony and Walton's excellent Sinfonia Concertante and Elgar conducting his own symphonies.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 03, 2020, 06:57:14 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 03, 2020, 05:56:44 AM
Yes, WRC PD. I also had their fine LPs of historic Sibelius recordings (Kajanus etc), VW conducting his own 4th Symphony and Walton's excellent Sinfonia Concertante and Elgar conducting his own symphonies.
Nice!  I've really been wanting to get Kajanus' Sibelius recordings; one of these days!  The logo looked different than I had remembered.  Did it change much over the years?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 03, 2020, 07:35:20 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 03, 2020, 02:23:15 AM
Thanks Lol. I recall taking the WRC LP out of the High Street Kensington record library and thoroughly enjoying it. I have this LP - an early acquisition which may feature the same performance as the one that you recommend. The HMV Concert Classics label was a great, inexpensive source of early classical music discoveries for me - not least Sargent's record of Walton's First Symphony and one featuring Walton's film music:
(//)

Same one indeed, Jeffrey. EMI went on to buy The World Record Club and of course their back catalogue. One of the reasons I find WRC so attractive is they could only be purchased new by subscription. Similar to book clubs of the period a member had to make a minimum monthly purchase. Sometimes to fill a quota a subscriber would buy a record they didn't particularly want with the outcome of few if any plays.

I agree that Concert Classics is a great source of inexpensive LPs. I picked up one last month - Le Mer and Nocturnes with Giulini conducting the Philharmonia. Not only releases from their own catalogue and WRC but also desirable Westminster and Everest recordings.
Is the Concert Classics Walton film music you mention the one below? My guess an original EMI recording followed by WRC for their subscribers. A chance of a WRC original but I doubt that. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 03, 2020, 09:42:45 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 03, 2020, 07:35:20 AM
Same one indeed, Jeffrey. EMI went on to buy The World Record Club and of course their back catalogue. One of the reasons I find WRC so attractive is they could only be purchased new by subscription. Similar to book clubs of the period a member had to make a minimum monthly purchase. Sometimes to fill a quota a subscriber would buy a record they didn't particularly want with the outcome of few if any plays.

I agree that Concert Classics is a great source of inexpensive LPs. I picked up one last month - Le Mer and Nocturnes with Giulini conducting the Philharmonia. Not only releases from their own catalogue and WRC but also desirable Westminster and Everest recordings.
Is the Concert Classics Walton film music you mention the one below? My guess an original EMI recording followed by WRC for their subscribers. A chance of a WRC original but I doubt that.
This is the one that I have Lol. The same as yours + the Spitfire I think - in the same series as Symph No. 1. Am not sure about PD's question about the WRC labels:

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 04, 2020, 12:52:34 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 03, 2020, 09:42:45 AM
This is the one that I have Lol. The same as yours + the Spitfire I think - in the same series as Symph No. 1. Am not sure about PD's question about the WRC labels:

Jeffrey, I am coming around to the view that the Walton film music is an original WRC recording. Looking up Discogs the earliest (1972) EMI issue is your Concert Classics SXLP 30I39. I have looked elsewhere and drawn a blank. Although  not dated the WRC, I'm convinced, would be earlier and EMI would make an initial release full price with the composer conducting.

(https://i.imgur.com/2v82cyY.jpg)

The WRC logo is a globe and a vinyl record in a figure of eight. The green labels are much more sexy then the red.

I do not think I have Walton conducting "Spitfire". My version is Groves.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 04, 2020, 02:56:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 04, 2020, 12:52:34 AM
Jeffrey, I am coming around to the view that the Walton film music is an original WRC recording. Looking up Discogs the earliest (1972) EMI issue is your Concert Classics SXLP 30I39. I have looked elsewhere and drawn a blank. Although  not dated the WRC, I'm convinced, would be earlier and EMI would make an initial release full price with the composer conducting.

(https://i.imgur.com/2v82cyY.jpg)

The WRC logo is a globe and a vinyl record in a figure of eight. The green labels are much more sexy then the red.

I do not think I have Walton conducting "Spitfire". My version is Groves.
That makes sense to me Lol. I think that the Concert Classics Walton Film Music release is the WRC release + the Spitfire Prelude and Fugue. That Groves Spitfire LP is great and it reappears on CD with an identical CD sized cover image in the Groves boxed set.

Do you have this Lol? It is smaller than usual LP size. My neighbour at my university hall of residence gave it to me when he heard that I was a VW fan:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 04, 2020, 04:35:09 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 04, 2020, 02:56:02 AM
That makes sense to me Lol. I think that the Concert Classics Walton Film Music release is the WRC release + the Spitfire Prelude and Fugue. That Groves Spitfire LP is great and it reappears on CD with an identical CD sized cover image in the Groves boxed set.

Do you have this Lol? It is smaller than usual LP size. My neighbour at my university hall of residence gave it to me when he heard that I was a VW fan:
(//)
Thanks Irons for the photo; I see where the "World Record" part comes into the log.  ;)

Great looking Vaughan Williams cover there Jeffrey!  Other than the symphony, have all of the other works been released on other labels...like maybe EMI?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 04, 2020, 04:53:52 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 04, 2020, 04:35:09 AM
Thanks Irons for the photo; I see where the "World Record" part comes into the log.  ;)

Great looking Vaughan Williams cover there Jeffrey!  Other than the symphony, have all of the other works been released on other labels...like maybe EMI?

PD

Hi PD,
That unusual disc only contained the Tuba and Oboe concertos - it's a bit confusing as it says 'and' the London Symphony Orchestra which looks like it might feature the London Symphony, but it doesn't.
You can find them here on this nice double CD set:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 04, 2020, 05:56:08 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 04, 2020, 04:53:52 AM
Hi PD,
That unusual disc only contained the Tuba and Oboe concertos - it's a bit confusing as it says 'and' the London Symphony Orchestra which looks like it might feature the London Symphony, but it doesn't.
You can find them here on this nice double CD set:
(//)
Whoopsie!  Reading too quickly! lol  Thanks Jeffrey!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 04, 2020, 06:43:04 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 04, 2020, 02:56:02 AM
That makes sense to me Lol. I think that the Concert Classics Walton Film Music release is the WRC release + the Spitfire Prelude and Fugue. That Groves Spitfire LP is great and it reappears on CD with an identical CD sized cover image in the Groves boxed set.

Do you have this Lol? It is smaller than usual LP size. My neighbour at my university hall of residence gave it to me when he heard that I was a VW fan:


I do not have it Jeffrey, and never seen it! Alegrito (sp) is a fan of 10" LPs as he mentions on this thread. I do not own a single one. Great image of RVW on the cover.
I would think I have the same recording of the Oboe Concerto on a HMV 20 issue.

(https://i.imgur.com/myzJvlA.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 05, 2020, 12:21:24 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 04, 2020, 06:43:04 AM
I do not have it Jeffrey, and never seen it! Alegrito (sp) is a fan of 10" LPs as he mentions on this thread. I do not own a single one. Great image of RVW on the cover.
I would think I have the same recording of the Oboe Concerto on a HMV 20 issue.

(https://i.imgur.com/myzJvlA.jpg)

Yes, it's the same recording Lol. It's 'Aligreto' I think  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 05, 2020, 07:07:13 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 05, 2020, 12:21:24 AM
Yes, it's the same recording Lol. It's 'Aligreto' I think  :)

Typical! Discovered late in life I may have a touch of dyslexia. Mind you as a young lad there was no such word, you were just thick.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 05, 2020, 11:04:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 05, 2020, 07:07:13 AM
Typical! Discovered late in life I may have a touch of dyslexia. Mind you as a young lad there was no such word, you were just thick.

Often a sign of high intelligence.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 05, 2020, 11:05:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 05, 2020, 07:07:13 AM
Typical! Discovered late in life I may have a touch of dyslexia. Mind you as a young lad there was no such word, you were just thick.

I shouldn't worry. I refer to PD as PJ half the time.  ::)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 05, 2020, 12:06:35 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 05, 2020, 07:07:13 AM
Typical! Discovered late in life I may have a touch of dyslexia. Mind you as a young lad there was no such word, you were just thick.
Hey, we all know that you're smart here, know your music, are an amazing gardener, a kind and generous person...and much more! And to deal with issues regarding reading difficulties....not easy!  So there!  ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 05, 2020, 12:08:11 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 05, 2020, 11:05:36 AM
I shouldn't worry. I refer to PD as PJ half the time.  ::)
No problems Jeffrey, between all of the students that you have, friends, and all of the people on here?  Not an issue.   :)

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 05, 2020, 01:19:15 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 05, 2020, 12:06:35 PM
Hey, we all know that you're smart here, know your music, are an amazing gardener, a kind and generous person...and much more! And to deal with issues regarding reading difficulties....not easy!  So there!  ;D

PD

Hang on DP PD, my head will get so big I won't get through the door! Leg-pulling aside the above is a much more accurate description of your good self. So there! ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 06, 2020, 03:21:44 AM
New arrival today. Greatly enjoying it. A surprisingly good recording for 1943.
A WRC Red Label release complete with a chart of stereo settings (even though the LP is Mono!) that you can fill in for 'Treble', 'Bass' and 'Stereo Balance'. Great cover art:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 06, 2020, 04:30:18 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 06, 2020, 03:21:44 AM
New arrival today. Greatly enjoying it. A surprisingly good recording for 1943.
A WRC Red Label release complete with a chart of stereo settings (even though the LP is Mono!) that you can fill in for 'Treble', 'Bass' and 'Stereo Balance'. Great cover art:
(//)
Nice!  I don't recall hearing the Bliss piano concerto before?  Will have to look through that Icon set that I have.

PD

p.s.  Interesting about the stereo settings; new technology then?   ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 07, 2020, 01:27:24 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 06, 2020, 04:30:18 AM
Nice!  I don't recall hearing the Bliss piano concerto before?  Will have to look through that Icon set that I have.

PD

p.s.  Interesting about the stereo settings; new technology then?   ;)

I like the Bliss PC although some find it overblown. The climax of the first movement is perhaps my favourite moment in Bliss's music. The PC was premiered in the USA by the NYPO (Boult/Solomon) in 1939.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 07, 2020, 03:58:42 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 07, 2020, 01:27:24 AM
I like the Bliss PC although some find it overblown. The climax of the first movement is perhaps my favourite moment in Bliss's music. The PC was premiered in the USA by the NYPO (Boult/Solomon) in 1939.
Ah, I see that it's on the last CD (No. 7) in that set...will have to follow up on it!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 08, 2020, 03:55:46 AM
One LP purchased yesterday (amidst a flurry of CD purchasing - see other thread):

Vorisek

(https://plade-klassikeren.dk/102940-large_default/vorisek-symphony-in-d-major-ivan-parik-prague-chamber-orch-1-lp-supraphon.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 08, 2020, 04:47:47 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 07, 2020, 03:58:42 AM
Ah, I see that it's on the last CD (No. 7) in that set...will have to follow up on it!

PD

What Icon set is that PD?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 08, 2020, 05:32:10 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 08, 2020, 04:47:47 AM
What Icon set is that PD?
This set Jeffrey (originally came out on EMI):

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/0KkAAOSwFKlfHwl3/s-l300.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 08, 2020, 03:15:18 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 08, 2020, 05:32:10 AM
This set Jeffrey (originally came out on EMI):

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/0KkAAOSwFKlfHwl3/s-l300.jpg)

PD
Thanks PD. I wasn't even aware of that box. I'm v glad that it has the Bliss PC. There is also a CD recording of the premiere performance (Solomon/Boult/NYPO) from 1939 but the sound is execrable. I have it and enjoy it. Adam Zero is a much better recording. I was never aware of a Volume 2 release:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 09, 2020, 12:23:59 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 08, 2020, 03:15:18 PM
Thanks PD. I wasn't even aware of that box. I'm v glad that it has the Bliss PC. There is also a CD recording of the premiere performance (Solomon/Boult/NYPO) from 1939 but the sound is execrable. I have it and enjoy it. Adam Zero is a much better recording. I was never aware of a Volume 2 release:
(//)

Noted that Constant Lambert directed the premiere of Adam Zero.

I have the WRC Solomon but try as I might can't find it. :-[ Searching, I came across this with a message to the American people on the cover. Perhaps Johnson should send a copy to Biden. :-*

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 03:04:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 09, 2020, 12:23:59 AM
Noted that Constant Lambert directed the premiere of Adam Zero.

I have the WRC Solomon but try as I might can't find it. :-[ Searching, I came across this with a message to the American people on the cover. Perhaps Johnson should send a copy to Biden. :-*

Haha - brilliant idea Lol. There's also a message 'To our American Friends' from Adrian Boult on the Everest LP (first recording) of Vaughan Williams's 9th Symphony, recorded on the day of the composer's death (he had been due to attend the recording session) - I think that is a very special recording.

I was listening the other day to my CD of 'Dunkirk - BBC Archive Recordings' (sad, I know  ::)) when I heard an account given by someone, with a very posh accent, of his flight from Holland in 1940. It turned out to be Constant Lambert whose tour of the Netherlands with the Sadler's Wells Ballet Company in May 1940 had unfortunately coincided with Hitler's invasion of the Netherlands. The route to the Hook of Holland had been blocked and they had been lucky to escape, still wearing their evening clothes.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 09, 2020, 04:33:21 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 08, 2020, 03:15:18 PM
Thanks PD. I wasn't even aware of that box. I'm v glad that it has the Bliss PC. There is also a CD recording of the premiere performance (Solomon/Boult/NYPO) from 1939 but the sound is execrable. I have it and enjoy it. Adam Zero is a much better recording. I was never aware of a Volume 2 release:
(//)
Jeffrey and Irons,

Looking at the booklet, it says that the Bliss PC was recorded with the Liverpool Phil. Orch. with Boult on January 12-13, 1943 (Producer:  Walter Legge and Balance engineer:  Arthur Clarke--no "C"  ;)  ).  The comments are interesting:  "He played little music of his own time, but his friendship with Sir Arthur Bliss resulted in a grand, post-Lisztian concerto that was premiered in New York with the New York Philharmonic in the context of the 1939 World Fair.  Solomon took it to many British cities during the Second World War and it became something of a symbol of Anglo-American solidarity."

Notes by Stephen Plaistow, 2008

Hadn't heard of Adam Zero before.  What was the title referring to by the way?

PD

Quote from: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 03:04:47 AM
Haha - brilliant idea Lol. There's also a message 'To our American Friends' from Adrian Boult on the Everest LP (first recording) of Vaughan Williams's 9th Symphony, recorded on the day of the composer's death (he had been due to attend the recording session) - I think that is a very special recording.

I was listening the other day to my CD of 'Dunkirk - BBC Archive Recordings' (sad, I know  ::)) when I heard an account given by someone, with a very posh accent, of his flight from Holland in 1940. It turned out to be Constant Lambert whose tour of the Netherlands with the Sadler's Wells Ballet Company in May 1940 had unfortunately coincided with Hitler's invasion of the Netherlands. The route to the Hook of Holland had been blocked and they had been lucky to escape, still wearing their evening clothes.

Irons, any words of kindness or encouragement would be most welcome here now!

That Dunkirk CD sounds quite interesting too!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 09, 2020, 08:26:32 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 03:04:47 AM
Haha - brilliant idea Lol. There's also a message 'To our American Friends' from Adrian Boult on the Everest LP (first recording) of Vaughan Williams's 9th Symphony, recorded on the day of the composer's death (he had been due to attend the recording session) - I think that is a very special recording.

I was listening the other day to my CD of 'Dunkirk - BBC Archive Recordings' (sad, I know  ::)) when I heard an account given by someone, with a very posh accent, of his flight from Holland in 1940. It turned out to be Constant Lambert whose tour of the Netherlands with the Sadler's Wells Ballet Company in May 1940 had unfortunately coincided with Hitler's invasion of the Netherlands. The route to the Hook of Holland had been blocked and they had been lucky to escape, still wearing their evening clothes.

Not sad at all, Jeffrey. My wife had a moan for me not wearing a poppy - how can you when not going anywhere due to lockdown? So for some digging exercise at allotment today poppy pinned to chest.

Great Lambert story. Typical of the man for wearing a DJ and not fatigues when escaping from Nazis. Bet he was smoking a cigar too!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 09, 2020, 08:35:52 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 09, 2020, 04:33:21 AM
Jeffrey and Irons,

Looking at the booklet, it says that the Bliss PC was recorded with the Liverpool Phil. Orch. with Boult on January 12-13, 1943 (Producer:  Walter Legge and Balance engineer:  Arthur Clarke--no "C"  ;)  ).  The comments are interesting:  "He played little music of his own time, but his friendship with Sir Arthur Bliss resulted in a grand, post-Lisztian concerto that was premiered in New York with the New York Philharmonic in the context of the 1939 World Fair.  Solomon took it to many British cities during the Second World War and it became something of a symbol of Anglo-American solidarity."

Notes by Stephen Plaistow, 2008

Hadn't heard of Adam Zero before.  What was the title referring to by the way?

PD

Irons, any words of kindness or encouragement would be most welcome here now!

That Dunkirk CD sounds quite interesting too!

PD

Not much to add, P. Only that the concerto's dedication - To the People of the United States of America.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 01:19:08 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 09, 2020, 08:26:32 AM
Not sad at all, Jeffrey. My wife had a moan for me not wearing a poppy - how can you when not going anywhere due to lockdown? So for some digging exercise at allotment today poppy pinned to chest.

Great Lambert story. Typical of the man for wearing a DJ and not fatigues when escaping from Nazis. Bet he was smoking a cigar too!

That's a great LP cover with David McFall's wonderful head of VW, modelled while he was working on the Ninth Symphony.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 01:23:10 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 09, 2020, 04:33:21 AM
Jeffrey and Irons,

Looking at the booklet, it says that the Bliss PC was recorded with the Liverpool Phil. Orch. with Boult on January 12-13, 1943 (Producer:  Walter Legge and Balance engineer:  Arthur Clarke--no "C"  ;)  ).  The comments are interesting:  "He played little music of his own time, but his friendship with Sir Arthur Bliss resulted in a grand, post-Lisztian concerto that was premiered in New York with the New York Philharmonic in the context of the 1939 World Fair.  Solomon took it to many British cities during the Second World War and it became something of a symbol of Anglo-American solidarity."

Notes by Stephen Plaistow, 2008

Hadn't heard of Adam Zero before.  What was the title referring to by the way?

PD

Irons, any words of kindness or encouragement would be most welcome here now!

That Dunkirk CD sounds quite interesting too!

PD

I noticed PD that the Solomon box set featured nothing from his own time apart from the Bliss Concerto (Scriabin at least lived into the 20th Century).
Here is an Adam Zero synopsis:

The ballet is an allegory of the cycle of man's life; the world in which he lives is represented by a stage on which a ballet is being created: Adam is cast as the principal dancer, Omnipotence is represented by the Stage Director and Adam's Fates by the Designer, Wardrobe Mistress and Dresser.

Adam falls in love, marries, and achieves power, but his triumph is brief; his world crumbles about him, he is stripped of his glory, and a new generation (Understudy) takes his place. He seeks distraction in dissipation but everyone deserts him and he is left alone to face Death.[2]
I think that you'd like Adam Zero PD.
Here is the Dunkirk CD:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 09, 2020, 01:23:32 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 01:19:08 PM
That's a great LP cover with David McFall's wonderful head of VW, modelled while he was working on the Ninth Symphony.
Ah, I've wondered who did that sculpture of VW.  :)

By the way, what is a DJ?

PD

Sorry, I missed your other posting (whilst typing).  Thanks for telling me about Adam Zero and the image of that Dunkirk CD Jeffrey.  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 01:24:32 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 09, 2020, 01:23:32 PM
Ah, I've wondered who did that sculpture of VW.  :)

By the way, what is a DJ?

Pd

Dinner Jacket (usually black)
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 09, 2020, 01:27:11 PM
We keep typing over each other.  I had just modified my earlier one to you whilst you were typing your dinner jacket reply! lol

But thanks!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 01:32:08 PM
Well, as a man of action I don't hang around with my GMG responses  ;D
Here are some recordings of Adam Zero:
(//)

My bedtime now - have a good evening PD  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 09, 2020, 01:35:48 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 01:32:08 PM
Well, as a man of action I don't hang around with my GMG responses  ;D
Here are some recordings of Adam Zero:
(//)

My bedtime now - have a good evening PD  :)
:laugh:  Thanks Jeffrey.

And please, no nightmares about your daughter swiping a package of CDs from your doorstep and filling them with ones from your library!  >:D  :-*  ;)  Sweet dreams!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 01:57:16 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 09, 2020, 01:35:48 PM
:laugh:  Thanks Jeffrey.

And please, no nightmares about your daughter swiping a package of CDs from your doorstep and filling them with ones from your library!  >:D  :-*  ;)  Sweet dreams!

PD
Thank you!
Haha - as you see, I'm back again - just to post some info about the McFall Head of VW which you might find interesting:
http://davidmcfall.co.uk/page90.html
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 09, 2020, 11:16:20 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 01:57:16 PM
Thank you!
Haha - as you see, I'm back again - just to post some info about the McFall Head of VW which you might find interesting:
http://davidmcfall.co.uk/page90.html

Most interesting! Brilliant that the WRC LP cover is listed in the link, I did not expect that.

I thought this excellent cover image of RVW worth posting. Taken from a portrait by Sir Gerald Kelly.

(https://i.imgur.com/xgEQCtH.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Handelian on November 10, 2020, 12:19:14 AM
I can remember quite some years ago a relative of mine leaving me some LPs some of which were original Columbia stereo. I had long since dispensed with my LPs so I contacted a dealer through the gramophone magazine. He offered me quite a high price as these LPs were valuable as they were original stereo and highly collectible. No doubt he sold them in a much higher price than he paid me but I was happy and so was he. Some of these old LPs are worth a fortune if they're in good condition
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 10, 2020, 12:55:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 09, 2020, 11:16:20 PM
Most interesting! Brilliant that the WRC LP cover is listed in the link, I did not expect that.

I thought this excellent cover image of RVW worth posting. Taken from a portrait by Sir Gerald Kelly.

(https://i.imgur.com/xgEQCtH.jpg)

I hadn't noticed the WRC LP link. That EMI LP of Symphony No.8 coupled with the Vronsky/Babin/Boult recording of the Concerto for Two Pianos is a real nostalgia trip for me because, in the early days of my youthful VW obsession I continuously took that LP out of my local record library. And yes, it has one of the great cover images of VW. That painting belongs to the National Portrait Gallery and I often went to see it there. Some years ago I was appalled to see it no longer on display. So, I wrote a 'disgusted of Tunbridge Wells' type letter (Tunbridge Wells is just down the road anyway!) complaining that the gallery had not a single image of one of our greatest composers on display. I think that it has been reinstated. There is no VW museum either as there is for Holst and Elgar. Another great cover image is the McFall Head on the Boult boxed set of VW symphonies. I'm surprised that the McFall bronze head has, to my knowledge, only ever been used on the WRC LP of Symphony No.9 and on the Boult boxed set:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 10, 2020, 01:01:45 AM
Quote from: Handelian on November 10, 2020, 12:19:14 AM
I can remember quite some years ago a relative of mine leaving me some LPs some of which were original Columbia stereo. I had long since dispensed with my LPs so I contacted a dealer through the gramophone magazine. He offered me quite a high price as these LPs were valuable as they were original stereo and highly collectible. No doubt he sold them in a much higher price than he paid me but I was happy and so was he. Some of these old LPs are worth a fortune if they're in good condition

Yes, I sold some of my LPs off one years and some of them were probably quite valuable. Recently I've bought some LPs again as I have a turntable (of sorts) but I only pay a few pounds for them. One of them is the LP posted by Irons above. I did have the LP of the PC but it had a much less interesting cover and coupling:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 10, 2020, 04:46:06 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2020, 12:55:05 AM
I hadn't noticed the WRC LP link. That EMI LP of Symphony No.8 coupled with the Vronsky/Babin/Boult recording of the Concerto for Two Pianos is a real nostalgia trip for me because, in the early days of my youthful VW obsession I continuously took that LP out of my local record library. And yes, it has one of the great cover images of VW. That painting belongs to the National Portrait Gallery and I often went to see it there. Some years ago I was appalled to see it no longer on display. So, I wrote a 'disgusted of Tunbridge Wells' type letter (Tunbridge Wells is just down the road anyway!) complaining that the gallery had not a single image of one of our greatest composers on display. I think that it has been reinstated. There is no VW museum either as there is for Holst and Elgar. Another great cover image is the McFall Head on the Boult boxed set of VW symphonies. I'm surprised that the McFall bronze head has, to my knowledge, only ever been used on the WRC LP of Symphony No.9 and on the Boult boxed set:
(//)
Somehow or another I can't find the link to WRC that Irons mentioned.  Also, I clicked on the link to McFall's Pocahontas as I was curious as to what Epstein had said and couldn't find any info there.  Is it there and I just missed it?

Excellent painting of Vaughan Williams by the way.  And way to go Jeffrey for your letter writing!  ;D  Hadn't thought about it before now, but I can't believe that there isn't a museum dedicated to Vaughan Williams!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 10, 2020, 04:52:12 AM
Quote from: Handelian on November 10, 2020, 12:19:14 AM
I can remember quite some years ago a relative of mine leaving me some LPs some of which were original Columbia stereo. I had long since dispensed with my LPs so I contacted a dealer through the gramophone magazine. He offered me quite a high price as these LPs were valuable as they were original stereo and highly collectible. No doubt he sold them in a much higher price than he paid me but I was happy and so was he. Some of these old LPs are worth a fortune if they're in good condition
Sometime, Handelian, ask Irons about this.  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 10, 2020, 06:20:46 AM
Quote from: Handelian on November 10, 2020, 12:19:14 AM
I can remember quite some years ago a relative of mine leaving me some LPs some of which were original Columbia stereo. I had long since dispensed with my LPs so I contacted a dealer through the gramophone magazine. He offered me quite a high price as these LPs were valuable as they were original stereo and highly collectible. No doubt he sold them in a much higher price than he paid me but I was happy and so was he. Some of these old LPs are worth a fortune if they're in good condition

A blue and silver label? There has only been one UK price guide in book form, from 2004 Rare Classical Record Price Guide. If you can recall any titles I will look them up.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 10, 2020, 06:57:18 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2020, 12:55:05 AM
I hadn't noticed the WRC LP link. That EMI LP of Symphony No.8 coupled with the Vronsky/Babin/Boult recording of the Concerto for Two Pianos is a real nostalgia trip for me because, in the early days of my youthful VW obsession I continuously took that LP out of my local record library. And yes, it has one of the great cover images of VW. That painting belongs to the National Portrait Gallery and I often went to see it there. Some years ago I was appalled to see it no longer on display. So, I wrote a 'disgusted of Tunbridge Wells' type letter (Tunbridge Wells is just down the road anyway!) complaining that the gallery had not a single image of one of our greatest composers on display. I think that it has been reinstated. There is no VW museum either as there is for Holst and Elgar. Another great cover image is the McFall Head on the Boult boxed set of VW symphonies. I'm surprised that the McFall bronze head has, to my knowledge, only ever been used on the WRC LP of Symphony No.9 and on the Boult boxed set:
(//)

To my horror it dawned on me that I didn't own a copy of the EMI 8th Symphony on vinyl just recently. Soon rectified that!

You are right Jeffrey - why no museum? We visited Malvern on a pilgrimage of sorts and the visit to Elgar's house and the attached museum was an unforgettable experience. Also Britten's Red House is excellent but we love Aldeburgh anyway. Missed out on Holst - when the world gets back to normal......

Does angry of Tonbridge want a lawn to die for? My son, who's career in the travel industry fell away under his feet thanks to Covid, set out as a lawn treatment provider for the Eastbourne territory of 'Greensleeves' yesterday. One door closes, another opens. :)     
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 10, 2020, 07:05:20 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 10, 2020, 04:46:06 AM
Somehow or another I can't find the link to WRC that Irons mentioned.  Also, I clicked on the link to McFall's Pocahontas as I was curious as to what Epstein had said and couldn't find any info there.  Is it there and I just missed it?

Excellent painting of Vaughan Williams by the way.  And way to go Jeffrey for your letter writing!  ;D  Hadn't thought about it before now, but I can't believe that there isn't a museum dedicated to Vaughan Williams!

PD

If you look down on the "references" of the link P you will come across WRC LP.

If a museum dedicated to RVW was in Dorking I would offer my services on a voluntary basis.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 10, 2020, 09:52:55 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 10, 2020, 04:46:06 AM
Somehow or another I can't find the link to WRC that Irons mentioned.  Also, I clicked on the link to McFall's Pocahontas as I was curious as to what Epstein had said and couldn't find any info there.  Is it there and I just missed it?

Excellent painting of Vaughan Williams by the way.  And way to go Jeffrey for your letter writing!  ;D  Hadn't thought about it before now, but I can't believe that there isn't a museum dedicated to Vaughan Williams!

PD
http://davidmcfall.co.uk/page90.html
See Reference (iv) on the above page PD.

Oh, I see that Lol has already responded.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 10, 2020, 09:54:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 10, 2020, 07:05:20 AM
If you look down on the "references" of the link P you will come across WRC LP.

If a museum dedicated to RVW was in Dorking I would offer my services on a voluntary basis.
Ah, thanks, I see it there now.

Wonder whether or not they would allow American volunteers?  :)  ;)

By the way, does anyone here know what work(s) Vaughan Williams was working on during the five modeling sessions?  I smiled when I read that "During the five days on which he came Ralph told me that he had worked harder than usual himself. 'I mustn't let the young man see me slacking,' he said."

extract from R.V.W. A Biography by Ursula Vaughan Williams

EDIT:  Thanks anyway Jeffrey!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 10, 2020, 09:56:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 10, 2020, 06:57:18 AM
To my horror it dawned on me that I didn't own a copy of the EMI 8th Symphony on vinyl just recently. Soon rectified that!

You are right Jeffrey - why no museum? We visited Malvern on a pilgrimage of sorts and the visit to Elgar's house and the attached museum was an unforgettable experience. Also Britten's Red House is excellent but we love Aldeburgh anyway. Missed out on Holst - when the world gets back to normal......

Does angry of Tonbridge want a lawn to die for? My son, who's career in the travel industry fell away under his feet thanks to Covid, set out as a lawn treatment provider for the Eastbourne territory of 'Greensleeves' yesterday. One door closes, another opens. :)   

Angry of Tunbridge Wells actually!
Sorry to hear about your son's job - a dreadful time for so many.
I'll ask the Boss about the lawn but it's more of a smallish garden really.

I think at Leith Hill Place, where VW grew up there is an exhibition devoted to VW of some sort.
https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/leith-hill-place/features/ralph-vaughan-williams-at-leith-hill-place
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 11, 2020, 12:15:24 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 10, 2020, 09:56:58 AM
Angry of Tunbridge Wells actually!
Sorry to hear about your son's job - a dreadful time for so many.
I'll ask the Boss about the lawn but it's more of a smallish garden really.

I think at Leith Hill Place, where VW grew up there is an exhibition devoted to VW of some sort.
https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/leith-hill-place/features/ralph-vaughan-williams-at-leith-hill-place

Thanks for link, Jeffrey. Leith Hill is no distance so worth a look when normality returns.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 11, 2020, 12:43:17 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 11, 2020, 12:15:24 AM
Thanks for link, Jeffrey. Leith Hill is no distance so worth a look when normality returns.

I'd be interested to know what you find there Lol. Maybe VW's piano? Another McFall Head?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 11, 2020, 04:26:28 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 11, 2020, 12:43:17 AM
I'd be interested to know what you find there Lol. Maybe VW's piano? Another McFall Head?
Is this what one could call the episode "Mystery of the 'Fall'n Head"?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 11, 2020, 07:09:00 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 11, 2020, 12:43:17 AM
I'd be interested to know what you find there Lol. Maybe VW's piano? Another McFall Head?

I wonder if wearing a loose fitting coat.... how big is the McFall head?

Leith Hill I discover is closer then I thought. So yes Jeffrey, I will visit at the first opportunity.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 11, 2020, 08:52:19 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 11, 2020, 07:09:00 AM
I wonder if wearing a loose fitting coat.... how big is the McFall head?

Leith Hill I discover is closer then I thought. So yes Jeffrey, I will visit at the first opportunity.

Life size. Take a wheelbarrow Lol.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 19, 2020, 07:41:51 AM
lol.  :)

Question for all of you vinyl lovers, have there been any new pressings of Starker and Kodaly's Sonata for Solo Cello?  Also, which of his recordings do you think is the best of them?  I think that he recorded it (I want to say...) five times?  And which used LPs do you have and how did you find them to be (both sound-wise and performance-wise)?

The only one that I have (and on CD)...so far anyway, is the one on Delos.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on November 19, 2020, 10:33:35 PM
I have the original pressing on Period. This is the one you want. Musically, technically, sonically, it is quite possibly the single greatest  recording ever made... in history. I was lucky enough to find this one in NM condition among a collection I was buying in the early 90s and it is one of the prizes of my collection. Will be hard to find ($$$) in good condition.

(https://img.discogs.com/5SgwbEXaQ6uzLkJPcFKsgakg598=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-11690135-1520710059-7120.jpeg.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 20, 2020, 12:39:54 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 19, 2020, 07:41:51 AM
lol.  :)

Question for all of you vinyl lovers, have there been any new pressings of Starker and Kodaly's Sonata for Solo Cello?  Also, which of his recordings do you think is the best of them?  I think that he recorded it (I want to say...) five times?  And which used LPs do you have and how did you find them to be (both sound-wise and performance-wise)?

The only one that I have (and on CD)...so far anyway, is the one on Delos.

PD

Hi PD trust you are well.

Starker made a fine recording at the Kingsway Hall for Walter Legg in 1957 which was issued on (English) Columbia 33CX 1595. You would expect to pay at least £75 for a copy. But not for the first time the wonderful World Record Club rides to the rescue and released the work under licence in October 1968. Cheapskate that I am this is the recording I own. :)

(https://i.imgur.com/qDCU3Pm.jpg)

Coincidently I am about to post here on another WRC reissue which has led me a bit of song and dance.

The Period issue posted above was issued in the UK under licence by Saga Records.





Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 20, 2020, 04:01:20 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on November 19, 2020, 10:33:35 PM
I have the original pressing on Period. This is the one you want. Musically, technically, sonically, it is quite possibly the single greatest  recording ever made... in history. I was lucky enough to find this one in NM condition among a collection I was buying in the early 90s and it is one of the prizes of my collection. Will be hard to find ($$$) in good condition.

(https://img.discogs.com/5SgwbEXaQ6uzLkJPcFKsgakg598=/fit-in/600x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-11690135-1520710059-7120.jpeg.jpg)
Nice!  And thanks for the pic!  Out of curiosity, do you listen to it with a mono cartridge or on your stereo setup?  Am wondering whether or not anyone has also released this recording on CD?  May have to post elsewhere for an answer to that one. 

Best wishes,

PD
Quote from: Irons on November 20, 2020, 12:39:54 AM
Hi PD trust you are well.

Starker made a fine recording at the Kingsway Hall for Walter Legg in 1957 which was issued on (English) Columbia 33CX 1595. You would expect to pay at least £75 for a copy. But not for the first time the wonderful World Record Club rides to the rescue and released the work under licence in October 1968. Cheapskate that I am this is the recording I own. :)

(https://i.imgur.com/qDCU3Pm.jpg)

Coincidently I am about to post here on another WRC reissue which has led me a bit of song and dance.

The Period issue posted above was issued in the UK under licence by Saga Records.

Doing pretty well here Irons--with the exception of all of the post-election shenanigans driving me cuckoo!

Thank you very much for the info and the photos.  I'll add them and André's info and photos into my Notes on my Mac (which copies over onto my iPhone--handy to have when around vinyl and CDs too).  You're lower photo (after your signature) was a bit hard to read (and didn't show up here when I quoted your post).  What is that photo of?

PD






Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 20, 2020, 07:46:23 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 20, 2020, 04:01:20 AM
Nice!  And thanks for the pic!  Out of curiosity, do you listen to it with a mono cartridge or on your stereo setup?  Am wondering whether or not anyone has also released this recording on CD?  May have to post elsewhere for an answer to that one. 

Best wishes,

PD
Doing pretty well here Irons--with the exception of all of the post-election shenanigans driving me cuckoo!

Thank you very much for the info and the photos.  I'll add them and André's info and photos into my Notes on my Mac (which copies over onto my iPhone--handy to have when around vinyl and CDs too).  You're lower photo (after your signature) was a bit hard to read (and didn't show up here when I quoted your post).  What is that photo of?

PD

It is small isn't it. Hopefully this is better. Saga released four - I have forgotten which - of the Bach suites for solo cello and the Kodaly sonata from the Period catalogue.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 20, 2020, 10:21:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 20, 2020, 07:46:23 AM
It is small isn't it. Hopefully this is better. Saga released four - I have forgotten which - of the Bach suites for solo cello and the Kodaly sonata from the Period catalogue.
Thanks!  :)

Take a look at these (new pressings):  The prices for the Bach...ouch!  And as 45 rpms!  Double ouch!  :(

https://www.musicdirect.com/Search?searchterm=starker&sort=popularity%7CDESC&page=1&pagesize=24&c1=tab-products&c2=grid

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 20, 2020, 01:28:40 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 20, 2020, 10:21:20 AM
Thanks!  :)

Take a look at these (new pressings):  The prices for the Bach...ouch!  And as 45 rpms!  Double ouch!  :(

https://www.musicdirect.com/Search?searchterm=starker&sort=popularity%7CDESC&page=1&pagesize=24&c1=tab-products&c2=grid

PD

Think I will stick with Fournier!

Lots of Starker on vinyl. Both Beethoven and Brahms sonatas with Sebok on WRC. The rarest Starker recording on my shelves is a recital of French music with Leon Pommers (piano) on Pye Nixa. Surprisingly Starker made a recording for Supraphon of Bach in Prague. There are many more.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2020, 03:48:42 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 20, 2020, 01:28:40 PM
Think I will stick with Fournier!

Lots of Starker on vinyl. Both Beethoven and Brahms sonatas with Sebok on WRC. The rarest Starker recording on my shelves is a recital of French music with Leon Pommers (piano) on Pye Nixa. Surprisingly Starker made a recording for Supraphon of Bach in Prague. There are many more.
Good morning!  Well, afternoon for you.  :)

I don't blame you; bet that they sound really good though!  Have you ever tried comparing a 45 with a 33 (same recording obviously)?  If so, did you notice any difference?  I do have this LP with Fournier..trying to find a decent picture.  Well, anyway, it's Nos. 5 & 6 on Archiv Produktion.  Would love to get the other two albums or the boxset.  Do you know which pressings came first--what do they look like?  Here's one of the pressings from which I have 5 & 6.  Mine were printed in West Germany.

(https://www.popsike.com/pix/20191201/352874744079.jpg)

Neat about the Supraphon LP!  When was that recorded?  I did see one French album (part of a series) but it wasn't on Pye Nixa.  It was on Period (Round the World with Starker, Volume 2:  Music of France).  How do you like it?

Sometime, I'd like to get ahold of a copy of his book:  The World of Music According to Starker.  I was able to borrow a copy from a library (a couple of years ago?) which I really enjoyed reading.  It's kind of a combo of autobiography plus some essays/chapters of his thoughts on cello playing/the musical world, etc.  I seldom read bios straight through, but I did with this one.  It also comes with a CD (not released elsewhere) of some short pieces with piano (Shigeo Neriki).  Anyway, at the end of the book is a nice discography--way too long for me to try and copy it by hand and I didn't want to damage the book by trying to scan it on my scanner/printer.  Hmm...interesting, on Amazon, some are listed as new.  I thought that it was OOP?  Maybe some people purchased remainders?  https://www.amazon.com/World-Music-According-Starker/dp/0253344522/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=the+world+of+music+according+to+starker&qid=1605962755&sr=8-2

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 21, 2020, 07:11:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2020, 03:48:42 AM
Good morning!  Well, afternoon for you.  :)

I don't blame you; bet that they sound really good though!  Have you ever tried comparing a 45 with a 33 (same recording obviously)?  If so, did you notice any difference?  I do have this LP with Fournier..trying to find a decent picture.  Well, anyway, it's Nos. 5 & 6 on Archiv Produktion.  Would love to get the other two albums or the boxset.  Do you know which pressings came first--what do they look like?  Here's one of the pressings from which I have 5 & 6.  Mine were printed in West Germany.

(https://www.popsike.com/pix/20191201/352874744079.jpg)

Neat about the Supraphon LP!  When was that recorded?  I did see one French album (part of a series) but it wasn't on Pye Nixa.  It was on Period (Round the World with Starker, Volume 2:  Music of France).  How do you like it?

Sometime, I'd like to get ahold of a copy of his book:  The World of Music According to Starker.  I was able to borrow a copy from a library (a couple of years ago?) which I really enjoyed reading.  It's kind of a combo of autobiography plus some essays/chapters of his thoughts on cello playing/the musical world, etc.  I seldom read bios straight through, but I did with this one.  It also comes with a CD (not released elsewhere) of some short pieces with piano (Shigeo Neriki).  Anyway, at the end of the book is a nice discography--way too long for me to try and copy it by hand and I didn't want to damage the book by trying to scan it on my scanner/printer.  Hmm...interesting, on Amazon, some are listed as new.  I thought that it was OOP?  Maybe some people purchased remainders?  https://www.amazon.com/World-Music-According-Starker/dp/0253344522/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=the+world+of+music+according+to+starker&qid=1605962755&sr=8-2

PD

Yes PD, that is the Fournier set on my shelves. Not first pressings, which were the generic DG gatefold type which I hate as impossible to extract without fingers coming into contact with record grooves. I did own a first pressing but sold it.

I am a vinyl conservative (small c  ;)). 45 rpm has little appeal.

The Starker/Supraphon is from the early 1970's I believe. The Nixa would indeed be from the Period catalogue.

You mention a Starker book. Many moons ago I read a small fascinating book, not about Starker but his cello. It traced the history and ownership of the instrument from it's creation to the present day. I no longer own the book and cannot find mention of it on the web which is odd. Starker played a "Lord Aylesford" which was passed on to him via Piatigorsky. A long time ago, but I seem to recall that du Pré inherited Starker's cello, but she never played the "Lord Aylesford" so must be mistaken. If ever I cull a book or recording I eventually regret it, every time!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2020, 07:31:39 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 21, 2020, 07:11:44 AM
Yes PD, that is the Fournier set on my shelves. Not first pressings, which were the generic DG gatefold type which I hate as impossible to extract without fingers coming into contact with record grooves. I did own a first pressing but sold it.

I am a vinyl conservative (small c  ;)). 45 rpm has little appeal.

The Starker/Supraphon is from the early 1970's I believe. The Nixa would indeed be from the Period catalogue.

You mention a Starker book. Many moons ago I read a small fascinating book, not about Starker but his cello. It traced the history and ownership of the instrument from it's creation to the present day. I no longer own the book and cannot find mention of it on the web which is odd. Starker played a "Lord Aylesford" which was passed on to him via Piatigorsky. A long time ago, but I seem to recall that du Pré inherited Starker's cello, but she never played the "Lord Aylesford" so must be mistaken. If ever I cull a book or recording I eventually regret it, every time!
Is this the kind of DG cover that you mean (re original issue)?  (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/db0AAOSwm79dJbCF/s-l300.jpg)

Ah, yes, he did go into some depth regarding his cello in the book.  This is an image of the cover of the book that I had mentioned:  (https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1348208618l/1818659.jpg)

I wonder whether or not it might have been an article that he had written for a magazine?  I'll try and borrow a copy of the book again soon and let you know what I find out.

PD

p.s.  Take a look here:  does anything at the bottom (under references) sound familiar?  https://tarisio.com/cozio-archive/property/?ID=40267
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 21, 2020, 12:20:22 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 21, 2020, 07:11:44 AM
Yes PD, that is the Fournier set on my shelves. Not first pressings, which were the generic DG gatefold type which I hate as impossible to extract without fingers coming into contact with record grooves. I did own a first pressing but sold it.
(...)

I tend to avoid the DG Archiv type of it too, they are fragile, and also on the basis that the sound is usually not that good, and that some performers are less interesting (Wenzinger, Lehmann etc.). The Bach/Fournier in that format (1961) came in stereo too, though.

As regards the early, yellow DG gatefolds, I have a few, since they comprise some interesting Fricsays etc.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2020, 01:11:01 PM
Quote from: MusicTurner on November 21, 2020, 12:20:22 PM
I tend to avoid the DG Archiv type of it too, they are fragile, and also on the basis that the sound is usually not that good, and that some performers are less interesting (Wenzinger, Lehmann etc.). The Bach/Fournier in that format (1961) came in stereo too, though.

As regards the early, yellow DG gatefolds, I have a few, since they comprise some interesting Fricsays etc.
Hi MT,

When you say that you tend to avoid the DG Archiv type are you referring to the ones that I said that I had a copy of one of the Fournier/Bach Suites one and had provided a photo?  Or of a different pressing?  And, also, you think that the sound is better on the old yellow DG gatefolds?  I have a few of those--of early Gregorian chant music.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 22, 2020, 12:22:31 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on November 21, 2020, 12:20:22 PM
I tend to avoid the DG Archiv type of it too, they are fragile, and also on the basis that the sound is usually not that good, and that some performers are less interesting (Wenzinger, Lehmann etc.). The Bach/Fournier in that format (1961) came in stereo too, though.

As regards the early, yellow DG gatefolds, I have a few, since they comprise some interesting Fricsays etc.

With the old DG gatefolds the opening to extract record is from the inside (middle) which makes it impossible to handle correctly.

I agree, the sound is nothing special either.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 22, 2020, 12:57:18 AM
My first copy of the WRC recording of Finzi's Dies Natalis which although mono sounded fine. When EMI took over the WRC catalogue they rereleased the recording in stereo at mid price. On obtaining a copy I was slightly disappointed, the sound had a veiled effect, lacking impact.

(https://i.imgur.com/3PZxI4w.jpg)

After buying a dud on online auction for 99p - something too good to be true, usually is - I purchased from a trusted seller, York Records, a stereo WRC Dies Natalis. The veil is lifted! With deep bass and dynamic visceral sound the EMI transfer is left in it's wake.
A gatefold, only this time correctly done, with full texts and photos from the recording sessions (Abbey Road?).

(https://i.imgur.com/IJwKylP.jpg)

A random thought. Has another recording featured the only child of two composers conducting their father's works?

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 26, 2020, 07:25:24 AM
Playing "Myths" last night I reminisced of the hours and money spent at Harold Moores of Great Marlborough Street just off Oxford Street opposite the massive HMV store. Harold had his own label, Rediffusion Aurora which licenced recordings from the old Soviet bloc, "Myths" is an original Polskie Nagrania recording. There are many others, not least from Supraphon.
The basement of Harold Moores was devoted to classical vinyl plus some jazz. You could, and I did, spend hours in splendid isolation sorting through many treasures, the only drawback being the eye-watering prices!
Harold retired and sold his business to a couple of Americans. His timing was fortunate as although CD sales were high the digital revolution which was to wipe out bricks and mortar record shops was in it's infancy. Sadly, "Harold Moores" is now just a memory, as is HMV opened by Edward Elgar in the 1930's, which now sells trainers. 

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 27, 2020, 03:46:57 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 26, 2020, 07:25:24 AM
Playing "Myths" last night I reminisced of the hours and money spent at Harold Moores of Great Marlborough Street just off Oxford Street opposite the massive HMV store. Harold had his own label, Rediffusion Aurora which licenced recordings from the old Soviet bloc, "Myths" is an original Polskie Nagrania recording. There are many others, not least from Supraphon.
The basement of Harold Moores was devoted to classical vinyl plus some jazz. You could, and I did, spend hours in splendid isolation sorting through many treasures, the only drawback being the eye-watering prices!
Harold retired and sold his business to a couple of Americans. His timing was fortunate as although CD sales were high the digital revolution which was to wipe out bricks and mortar record shops was in it's infancy. Sadly, "Harold Moores" is now just a memory, as is HMV opened by Edward Elgar in the 1930's, which now sells trainers.
Years ago I remember hearing/reading about Harold Moores; I had hoped to visit it one day.  :(  Sad story regarding it and HMV.  Strangely, imagine if they could have made it through the CD years, they could have been doing a grand business selling vinyl--again?!

I didn't know that Harold had his own label.  How were the pressings Irons?  And besides Polskie Nagrania and Supraphon, do you recall what other labels he licensed from?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 27, 2020, 07:07:09 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 27, 2020, 03:46:57 AM
Years ago I remember hearing/reading about Harold Moores; I had hoped to visit it one day.  :(  Sad story regarding it and HMV.  Strangely, imagine if they could have made it through the CD years, they could have been doing a grand business selling vinyl--again?!

I didn't know that Harold had his own label.  How were the pressings Irons?  And besides Polskie Nagrania and Supraphon, do you recall what other labels he licensed from?

PD

The pressings are excellent, P. The problem for them is the location of the shop sandwiched between Oxford and Carnaby Street with rent and rates through the roof!
The box set of Dvorak chamber works on the sister label Legend is outstanding. I recall buying it in the early days of the second coming for me of vinyl and being pleased as punch with the purchase.
https://www.discogs.com/search/?q=Rediffusion%20legend&type=all
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on November 27, 2020, 07:43:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 26, 2020, 07:25:24 AM
Playing "Myths" last night I reminisced of the hours and money spent at Harold Moores of Great Marlborough Street just off Oxford Street opposite the massive HMV store. Harold had his own label, Rediffusion Aurora which licenced recordings from the old Soviet bloc, "Myths" is an original Polskie Nagrania recording. There are many others, not least from Supraphon.
The basement of Harold Moores was devoted to classical vinyl plus some jazz. You could, and I did, spend hours in splendid isolation sorting through many treasures, the only drawback being the eye-watering prices!
Harold retired and sold his business to a couple of Americans. His timing was fortunate as although CD sales were high the digital revolution which was to wipe out bricks and mortar record shops was in it's infancy. Sadly, "Harold Moores" is now just a memory, as is HMV opened by Edward Elgar in the 1930's, which now sells trainers.

Harold Moores has been teetering on the brink of extinction for years now so I am not surprised. I didn't know about the HMV shop though. Their main store in Oxford Street used to be up near the Marble Arch end but they opened a mega-store near the Tottenham Court Road end; the latter had an extensive classical department in the basement. Have both stores now closed?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 27, 2020, 10:00:59 AM
Quote from: Biffo on November 27, 2020, 07:43:02 AM
Harold Moores has been teetering on the brink of extinction for years now so I am not surprised. I didn't know about the HMV shop though. Their main store in Oxford Street used to be up near the Marble Arch end but they opened a mega-store near the Tottenham Court Road end; the latter had an extensive classical department in the basement. Have both stores now closed?

I had a nice chat with the famous Harold in the shop one day - a nice New Zealander, We both preferred Prokofiev's 'Ivan the Terrible' to 'Alexander Nevsky'.

I often picked up interesting stuff in that shop such as Symphony No.5 by Kabelac.

Their staff were notoriously surly and supercilious with their customers. I remember the following telephone conversation exchange whilst ordering a CD from home.

HM Staff Member: 'What are the initials on your credit card?'

Me: 'J and M'

HM Staff: 'Was that M or N?'

Me (answering quickly): 'M for Monkey'

HM Staff, (with surprised and supercilious tone): 'Oh, what an unusual middle name!'
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 27, 2020, 01:03:22 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 27, 2020, 07:07:09 AM
The pressings are excellent, P. The problem for them is the location of the shop sandwiched between Oxford and Carnaby Street with rent and rates through the roof!
The box set of Dvorak chamber works on the sister label Legend is outstanding. I recall buying it in the early days of the second coming for me of vinyl and being pleased as punch with the purchase.
https://www.discogs.com/search/?q=Rediffusion%20legend&type=all
Thanks Irons!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 28, 2020, 12:14:13 AM
Quote from: Biffo on November 27, 2020, 07:43:02 AM
Harold Moores has been teetering on the brink of extinction for years now so I am not surprised. I didn't know about the HMV shop though. Their main store in Oxford Street used to be up near the Marble Arch end but they opened a mega-store near the Tottenham Court Road end; the latter had an extensive classical department in the basement. Have both stores now closed?

I always thought the store by the Regent Street and Oxford Street crossroads was the main store, but I may be wrong. The last time I was up there the one by Bond Street station was still open. The infamous Mike Ashley took over the former for his Sport Direct brand. I wandered in out of curiosity and felt like crying. As you say the classical department was extensive and had an air of tranquillity, the knowledgeable staff were always ready to offer advice. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 28, 2020, 03:39:24 AM
Novak - Slovak Suite (1903) + South-Bohemian Suite (1937) /Vajnar /supraphon LP 1984

  It's a bit of a mystery why Novak recordings are so less plentiful than those of Suk, with few, if any, non-Czech among them, since they both wrote attractive music, and Novak perhaps was the most ambitious one of the two composers ... perhaps there's a bit of an autumnal glow in these quasi-nostalgic works, besides the folksy traits, reminding of say, Delius. In the Slovak Suite, maybe even Wagner comes to mind in the first, hymn-like setting, complete with harp and organ. There are more modern traits in the South Bohemian Suite, where say, in the long March of the Taborites, a percussive piano helps underlining the atmosphere and build-up, reminding almost of Honegger, for instance.

  Sonics and the performance are good, I can't imagine that the other versions I have (Sejna/LP in the Slovak Suite, and Bostock/CD in the South Bohemian Suite) are better. The liner notes are good and informative too.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 28, 2020, 03:47:40 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2020, 01:11:01 PM
Hi MT,

When you say that you tend to avoid the DG Archiv type are you referring to the ones that I said that I had a copy of one of the Fournier/Bach Suites one and had provided a photo?  Or of a different pressing?  And, also, you think that the sound is better on the old yellow DG gatefolds?  I have a few of those--of early Gregorian chant music.

PD

I don't think I have any of the Archiv gatefold ones to directly compare, so it's a just a general, perhaps misunderstood opinion of mine, based on the few I've heard. None of the yellow gatefold DGs I own (which are few) are in stereo, but the performances and music are of more interest to me, than the Archiv ones. But some of those DG releases have apparently been in stereo too; then I have just them in different releases by DG. Stereo gatefolds were in fact a novelty to me, which I only discovered due to the theme of the recent entries here, in this thread ...  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 28, 2020, 04:21:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 27, 2020, 07:07:09 AM
The pressings are excellent, P. The problem for them is the location of the shop sandwiched between Oxford and Carnaby Street with rent and rates through the roof!
The box set of Dvorak chamber works on the sister label Legend is outstanding. I recall buying it in the early days of the second coming for me of vinyl and being pleased as punch with the purchase.
https://www.discogs.com/search/?q=Rediffusion%20legend&type=all
Looking again at some of the Rediffusion LPs, I noticed that there was at least one LP which wasn't a license but a new recording; it was recorded at Wigmore Hall.  This one:

https://www.discogs.com/Radoslav-Kvapil-Songs-Of-Innocence-And-Experience-Mussorgsky-Piano-Music/release/8080626

Did they do many of these?

Quote from: vandermolen on November 27, 2020, 10:00:59 AM


HM Staff Member: 'What are the initials on your credit card?'

Me: 'J and M'

HM Staff: 'Was that M or N?'

Me (answering quickly): 'M for Monkey'

HM Staff, (with surprised and supercilious tone): 'Oh, what an unusual middle name!'
::)  Trying to be witty I'm sure.

Quote from: MusicTurner on November 28, 2020, 03:47:40 AM
I don't think I have any of the Archiv gatefold ones to directly compare, so it's a just a general, perhaps misunderstood opinion of mine, based on the few I've heard. None of the yellow gatefold DGs I own (which are few) are in stereo, but the performances and music are of more interest to me, than the Archiv ones. But some of those DG releases have apparently been in stereo too; then I have just them in different releases by DG. Stereo gatefolds were in fact a novelty to me, which I only discovered due to the theme of the recent entries here, in this thread ...  :)
Thanks for your thoughts on them and good to read your comments regarding Novak too.  Looking at the Wiki entry, I see some possible reasons as to why his music at least during his lifetime didn't become more popular.   :(  It sounds though that there was a renewed interest in at least some of his works late in his life (see "musical resistance").  I would love to hear more of it and more often too (like on the radio and in concert halls).

PD

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 28, 2020, 04:34:05 AM
Indeed, reading that entry, there seems to have been a lot of both political stuff and personal intrigues & rivalry influencing the musical climate in his days, besides the obvious problems of the wars and the Nazi invasion ...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 28, 2020, 07:52:24 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 28, 2020, 04:21:21 AM
Looking again at some of the Rediffusion LPs, I noticed that there was at least one LP which wasn't a license but a new recording; it was recorded at Wigmore Hall.  This one:

https://www.discogs.com/Radoslav-Kvapil-Songs-Of-Innocence-And-Experience-Mussorgsky-Piano-Music/release/8080626


PD

At least two, methinks. :-[
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 28, 2020, 08:42:11 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on November 28, 2020, 04:34:05 AM
Indeed, reading that entry, there seems to have been a lot of both political stuff and personal intrigues & rivalry influencing the musical climate in his days, besides the obvious problems of the wars and the Nazi invasion ...

Probably fanciful, but I have often thought that having a genius as Dvorak did Czech music more harm then good, and none more so then his son-in-law, Josef Suk. The only composer of note of the following generation that completely shook off the shackles of the great man and had his own voice from day one is Janacek. Some of Suk's chamber music is very good but too like Dvorak's for its own good. Suk was a composer of real worth who had a voice, the Asrael Symphony proves that, but maybe the Dvorak influence curtailed his development as a composer. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on November 28, 2020, 02:55:41 PM
Quote from: MusicTurner on November 21, 2020, 12:20:22 PM
...... and that some performers are less interesting (Wenzinger, Lehmann etc.).

:o ??? :o ??? :o ???
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 28, 2020, 09:05:26 PM
Quote from: (: premont :) on November 28, 2020, 02:55:41 PM
:o ??? :o ??? :o ???

What would be some of your favourites from them, then, preferably in stereo?

I'm not much into Baroque mono, like it's the case with 'Impressionist' orchestral music, much preferring a better, 'festive' sound picture and timbre. Chosen exceptions are some Scherchen, Mengelberg and pianist's recordings, with plenty of individuality. I also have some Casals, Landowska, Neel and Schweitzer in Bach, but mainly due to their importance in the recorded legacy. Maybe more. Culled a few others.

And I own the Wenzinger Brockes Passion, in stereo, but it's been ages since I heard it. And Lehmann's mono Water Music. Both LPs.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 29, 2020, 04:15:23 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 28, 2020, 08:42:11 AM
Probably fanciful, but I have often thought that having a genius as Dvorak did Czech music more harm then good, and none more so then his son-in-law, Josef Suk. The only composer of note of the following generation that completely shook off the shackles of the great man and had his own voice from day one is Janacek. Some of Suk's chamber music is very good but too like Dvorak's for its own good. Suk was a composer of real worth who had a voice, the Asrael Symphony proves that, but maybe the Dvorak influence curtailed his development as a composer.
Interesting thoughts Irons.

It would be interesting to know how often (if at all) Josef Suk, Sr. either asked for Dvorak's opinion about works in progress, or ideas that he had for works, etc.  Also, if Dvorak commented much about Suk's works, offered suggestions and how his approval or displeasure of them influenced Suk's compositions.  He (Suk, Sr.) did study under Dvorak (how many years I don't know) plus he was married to his daughter.  In any event, I do enjoy Suk, Sr.'s music.   :)

Quote from: Irons on November 28, 2020, 07:52:24 AM
At least two, methinks. :-[
Neat!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on November 29, 2020, 04:47:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 28, 2020, 08:42:11 AM
Probably fanciful, but I have often thought that having a genius as Dvorak did Czech music more harm then good, and none more so then his son-in-law, Josef Suk. The only composer of note of the following generation that completely shook off the shackles of the great man and had his own voice from day one is Janacek. Some of Suk's chamber music is very good but too like Dvorak's for its own good. Suk was a composer of real worth who had a voice, the Asrael Symphony proves that, but maybe the Dvorak influence curtailed his development as a composer.

Janacek is really only half a generation behind Dvorak and probably more influenced by Smetana, initially at least, before finding his own way through folksong.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 29, 2020, 12:35:18 PM
Some recent LP acquisitions for me:

Fibich:  Spring, The Romance of Spring, At Twilight and A Night at Karlstein with Nada Sormova, Karel Prusa, Prague Radio Chorus and Orchestra and Frantisek Vajnar (a digital recording on Supraphon):

(https://plade-klassikeren.dk/5903-large_default/fibich-the-romance-of-spring-frantisek-vajnar-prag-rso-and-chorus-1-cd-supraphon.jpg)

and an album by David Geringas (cellist) of works by Haydn, Boccherini and Vivaldi with the RIAS-Sinfonietta Berlin and Leopold Hager on Parnass:

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/xHAAAOSwmxVd4p~p/s-l640.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 29, 2020, 01:08:09 PM
Quote from: Biffo on November 29, 2020, 04:47:44 AM
Janacek is really only half a generation behind Dvorak and probably more influenced by Smetana, initially at least, before finding his own way through folksong.

You are right. Idyla for String Orchestra, an early work, is absolutely charming and an influence from Smetana (and Dvorak) is clear. It was late in life when the Janacek as we know him emerged with for example, Taras Bulba and Sinfonietta.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 29, 2020, 01:25:47 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 29, 2020, 12:35:18 PM
Some recent LP acquisitions for me:

Fibich:  Spring, The Romance of Spring, At Twilight and A Night at Karlstein with Nada Sormova, Karel Prusa, Prague Radio Chorus and Orchestra and Frantisek Vajnar (a digital recording on Supraphon):

(https://plade-klassikeren.dk/5903-large_default/fibich-the-romance-of-spring-frantisek-vajnar-prag-rso-and-chorus-1-cd-supraphon.jpg)

and an album by David Geringas (cellist) of works by Haydn, Boccherini and Vivaldi with the RIAS-Sinfonietta Berlin and Leopold Hager on Parnass:

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/xHAAAOSwmxVd4p~p/s-l640.jpg)

PD

I do not know David Geringas, P. Is that a German label?

In the past I avoided digital LP recordings but not any more as I have found them very good.
Checking my shelves I have two Fibich recordings: 2nd Symphony with Sejna and CPO (mono) and String Trio plus Quintet for Violin, Clarinet, French Horn, Cello and Piano.
Your Fibich looks very nice - I like the titles - I would purchase for certain if coming across a copy. Post your thoughts, I look forward to reading them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 30, 2020, 04:33:09 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 29, 2020, 01:25:47 PM
I do not know David Geringas, P. Is that a German label?

In the past I avoided digital LP recordings but not any more as I have found them very good.
Checking my shelves I have two Fibich recordings: 2nd Symphony with Sejna and CPO (mono) and String Trio plus Quintet for Violin, Clarinet, French Horn, Cello and Piano.
Your Fibich looks very nice - I like the titles - I would purchase for certain if coming across a copy. Post your thoughts, I look forward to reading them.
I remember hearing about David Geringas years ago...I forget exactly how.  Checked into getting his Boccherini recording on Claves, but passed as it was quite expensive then.  Yes, it looks like Parnass is a German label; can't find out much about it, but it also says "Originalaufnahmen/Eurodisc MPC".  I believe that this was the original release:  https://www.discogs.com/Haydn-Boccherini-Vivaldi-David-Geringas-RIAS-Sinfonietta-Leopold-Hager-Berühmte-Cellokonzerte-Conce/release/10287981  This is a little bit about Geringas from Wiki (there's much more there):  "David Geringas (Lithuanian: Dovydas Geringas; born 29 July 1946 in Vilnius) is a Lithuanian cellist and conductor who studied under Mstislav Rostropovich. In 1970 he won the gold medal at the International Tchaikovsky Competition. He also plays the baryton, a rare instrument associated with music of Joseph Haydn.[1]"

The only other work that I have by Fibich is his String Quartet No. 1 with the Talich Quartet (the newer incarnation) on Calliope.  I was fortunate a number of years ago to purchase a box set of Czech quartets (on CD) which Callipe put together.  If you ever run across, grab it!   Wonderful recordings and in great sound.   :)  Note:  They are (or at least were?) available separately too.

PD

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 30, 2020, 08:56:55 AM
Geringas'  recording of the Boccherini cello concertos set on Claves is magnificent.

Eurodisc is (was) indeed German and specialized particularly in releasing recordings from Melodiya label / the USSR on LP, for the German public.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 30, 2020, 12:13:38 PM
Quote from: MusicTurner on November 30, 2020, 08:56:55 AM
Geringas'  recording of the Boccherini cello concertos set on Claves is magnificent.

Eurodisc is (was) indeed German and specialized particularly in releasing recordings from Melodiya label / the USSR on LP, for the German public.
I suspect that I had heard how good they were and that was why I was trying to get ahold of them.  :) ;)  Thanks for the further info on Eurodisc too.

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on November 30, 2020, 01:25:59 PM
Should the Boccherini set somehow appear cheaply, it will be worth it. But yes, it's surely expensive in the US.

I checked the German amazon.de though, and right now it's 3.5 Euros + postage there at Medimops currently.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 01, 2020, 08:35:13 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on November 30, 2020, 01:25:59 PM
Should the Boccherini set somehow appear cheaply, it will be worth it. But yes, it's surely expensive in the US.

I checked the German amazon.de though, and right now it's 3.5 Euros + postage there at Medimops currently.
Thank you for the info; it was very sweet of you to check for me.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on December 01, 2020, 02:07:48 PM
Quote from: MusicTurner on November 28, 2020, 09:05:26 PM
What would be some of your favourites from them, then, preferably in stereo?

And I own the Wenzinger Brockes Passion, in stereo, but it's been ages since I heard it. And Lehmann's mono Water Music. Both LPs.

Well, i prefer stereo - but not exclusively, because some artists didn't live into the stereo age.

Fritz Lehmann died 1956, and I do not think he left any stereo recordings. Of his recordings I own the SMP, some Beethoven symphonies and Capriccio Italian, but I recall from my youth his Water music and some concerti grossi op.6 by Handel.

Concerning August Wenzinger I always admired his Brandenburg concertos (from 1950-53). Worth considering are also his recording of Bach's cello suites, Dowland's Lacrimae, Water music, Händels organ concertos (with Eduard Müller), and Machaut's messe. Recently I also got hold of his recording of Bach's orchestral suites.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on December 01, 2020, 08:08:05 PM
Thanks. Not stuff one'll see that often. I see there's a quite detailed, loyal review of the Wenz Brandenburgs on Amazon.co.uk
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Brandenburg-Concertos-Nos/dp/B0097958R0

But it just doesn't seem to be items that will float my boat, I don't tend to investigate Baroque music into the degree of really many recordings. About a dozen of the Brandenburgs is the peak for me, but some have many more.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on December 02, 2020, 02:27:30 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on December 01, 2020, 08:08:05 PM
Thanks. Not stuff one'll see that often. I see there's a quite detailed, loyal review of the Wenz Brandenburgs on Amazon.co.uk
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Brandenburg-Concertos-Nos/dp/B0097958R0

The review is about the later published electronic Heliodor stereo version, which was rather artificial sounding. The original Archiv mono is the one to have. The reviewer also writes, that only concerto 6 is played OPPP, but this is also true of concerto 3, and even if is not stated in the notes, I feel sure, that the ripieno section generally is played OPPP except maybe in concerto no 1.  The Brandenburg concertos have been a region of interest to me, and I own many versions. It's surprising how different they are.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 05, 2020, 05:57:18 AM
A good haul this morning including a most interesting Russian box set.

Lajtha: Symphonies 4 (Spring) & 9. Hungarian State Orchestra, Ferencsik. Hungaroton.

Vaughan Williams: Wasps Overture, Dives & Lazarus, Oboe & Tuba Concertos. Barbirolli. The Barbirolli Society.

Ditto: Toward the Unknown Region, Serenade, Wasps and Greensleeves. Sargent LSO. HMV.

Bax: 5th Symphony, LPO Leppard, Lyrita (a whole batch of Lyritas at Farnham including the Morgan VC which is rare).

Ditto: 3rd Symphony & Happy Forest, Downes LSO. RCA.

CP & JC Bach: Symphonies & Concertos. Collegium Aureum. BASF (double).

Nystroem: Sinfonia del Mare. Westerberg, Swedish Radio Orchestra. Swedish Society.

Prokofiev: Collected Chamber works. Melodiya (4 LPs).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on December 05, 2020, 06:02:17 AM
Nice. And that Lajtha rarity is the best recording of those symphonies ...

Never saw that Prokofiev chamber music box ... stereo, presumably ?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 05, 2020, 10:18:32 PM
Quote from: Irons on December 05, 2020, 05:57:18 AM
A good haul this morning including a most interesting Russian box set.

Lajtha: Symphonies 4 (Spring) & 9. Hungarian State Orchestra, Ferencsik. Hungaroton.

Vaughan Williams: Wasps Overture, Dives & Lazarus, Oboe & Tuba Concertos. Barbirolli. The Barbirolli Society.

Ditto: Toward the Unknown Region, Serenade, Wasps and Greensleeves. Sargent LSO. HMV.

Bax: 5th Symphony, LPO Leppard, Lyrita (a whole batch of Lyritas at Farnham including the Morgan VC which is rare).

Ditto: 3rd Symphony & Happy Forest, Downes LSO. RCA.

CP & JC Bach: Symphonies & Concertos. Collegium Aureum. BASF (double).

Nystroem: Sinfonia del Mare. Westerberg, Swedish Radio Orchestra. Swedish Society.

Prokofiev: Collected Chamber works. Melodiya (4 LPs).
What a great selection Lol! The Leppard Bax is the best available IMO and the most epic, likewise the Downes No.3 although mine is the minority view. The Nystroem is a wonderful work of which I have three versions on CD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 06, 2020, 01:01:27 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 05, 2020, 10:18:32 PM
What a great selection Lol! The Leppard Bax is the best available IMO and the most epic, likewise the Downes No.3 although mine is the minority view. The Nystroem is a wonderful work of which I have three versions on CD.

I think the vinyl Gods were looking down at me, Jeffrey. I confess of not even have heard of Nystroem, a complete shot in the dark, that you give a thumbs up is excellent news. I was shocked to find the Lajtha LP, again a composer I had not heard of (although I have since discovered I have a string quartet by him as a coupling of Beethoven of all people!) until watching the Hurwitz video a couple of days ago which spiked my interest. Very odd as the same thing happened following your heads-up at the same store with Hadley/Sainton CD last year. If Nystroem and Lajtha prove to be as valued, then happy days! :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 06, 2020, 01:31:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 06, 2020, 01:01:27 AM
I think the vinyl Gods were looking down at me, Jeffrey. I confess of not even have heard of Nystroem, a complete shot in the dark, that you give a thumbs up is excellent news. I was shocked to find the Lajtha LP, again a composer I had not heard of (although I have since discovered I have a string quartet by him as a coupling of Beethoven of all people!) until watching the Hurwitz video a couple of days ago which spiked my interest. Very odd as the same thing happened following your heads-up at the same store with Hadley/Sainton CD last year. If Nystroem and Lajtha prove to be as valued, then happy days! :)
Sounds like the intervention of Fate Lol  ;D
I remember a very odd experience with an online dealer over a BBC Radio Classics CD of extracts from a radio version of Pilgrim's Progress by VW. He sent me the Boult version which I already had and then did not reply to my emails. I then wrote a negative review. He responded by suggesting that I was trying to rip him off by ordering and copying CDs and then demanding a refund - a completely dishonourable practice. I responded asking him why I would order a CD that was already in my collection and pointing out that the picture on his website was not of the CD that he sent me. He apologised and told me to keep the Boult set 'as a sorry' but I sent it back and removed my stroppy review, which I had probably been too hasty to post. Anyway, I thought that was the end of it but a day or two later he contacted me again to say that someone had just come in to his shop with the rare BBC Radio Classics CD which I had wanted in the first place. He told me that he had to sit down to recover himself after that experience. I then bought the CD from him and we ended up on friendly terms.
I look forward to hearing what you think of the Nystroem which is a hauntingly beautiful work - you'll know that moment when you get there. ,
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 06, 2020, 05:24:25 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 05, 2020, 05:57:18 AM
A good haul this morning including a most interesting Russian box set.

Lajtha: Symphonies 4 (Spring) & 9. Hungarian State Orchestra, Ferencsik. Hungaroton.

Vaughan Williams: Wasps Overture, Dives & Lazarus, Oboe & Tuba Concertos. Barbirolli. The Barbirolli Society.

Ditto: Toward the Unknown Region, Serenade, Wasps and Greensleeves. Sargent LSO. HMV.

Bax: 5th Symphony, LPO Leppard, Lyrita (a whole batch of Lyritas at Farnham including the Morgan VC which is rare).

Ditto: 3rd Symphony & Happy Forest, Downes LSO. RCA.

CP & JC Bach: Symphonies & Concertos. Collegium Aureum. BASF (double).

Nystroem: Sinfonia del Mare. Westerberg, Swedish Radio Orchestra. Swedish Society.

Prokofiev: Collected Chamber works. Melodiya (4 LPs).
Well done Irons!  Wish that I were there to scoop up the Lyritas.   :(  Out of curiosity, who recorded the Prokofiev chamber works?

Quote from: vandermolen on December 06, 2020, 01:31:20 AM
Sounds like the intervention of Fate Lol  ;D
I remember a very odd experience with an online dealer over a BBC Radio Classics CD of extracts from a radio version of Pilgrim's Progress by VW. He sent me the Boult version which I already had and then did not reply to my emails. I then wrote a negative review. He responded by suggesting that I was trying to rip him off by ordering and copying CDs and then demanding a refund - a completely dishonourable practice. I responded asking him why I would order a CD that was already in my collection and pointing out that the picture on his website was not of the CD that he sent me. He apologised and told me to keep the Boult set 'as a sorry' but I sent it back and removed my stroppy review, which I had probably been too hasty to post. Anyway, I thought that was the end of it but a day or two later he contacted me again to say that someone had just come in to his shop with the rare BBC Radio Classics CD which I had wanted in the first place. He told me that he had to sit down to recover himself after that experience. I then bought the CD from him and we ended up on friendly terms.
I look forward to hearing what you think of the Nystroem which is a hauntingly beautiful work - you'll know that moment when you get there. ,
Jeffrey,

Is this the Vaughan Williams one which you were searching for (and found)?  https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/products/8077163--vaughan-williams-the-pilgrim-s-progress

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 06, 2020, 06:47:07 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 06, 2020, 01:31:20 AM
Sounds like the intervention of Fate Lol  ;D
I remember a very odd experience with an online dealer over a BBC Radio Classics CD of extracts from a radio version of Pilgrim's Progress by VW. He sent me the Boult version which I already had and then did not reply to my emails. I then wrote a negative review. He responded by suggesting that I was trying to rip him off by ordering and copying CDs and then demanding a refund - a completely dishonourable practice. I responded asking him why I would order a CD that was already in my collection and pointing out that the picture on his website was not of the CD that he sent me. He apologised and told me to keep the Boult set 'as a sorry' but I sent it back and removed my stroppy review, which I had probably been too hasty to post. Anyway, I thought that was the end of it but a day or two later he contacted me again to say that someone had just come in to his shop with the rare BBC Radio Classics CD which I had wanted in the first place. He told me that he had to sit down to recover himself after that experience. I then bought the CD from him and we ended up on friendly terms.
I look forward to hearing what you think of the Nystroem which is a hauntingly beautiful work - you'll know that moment when you get there. ,

To be fair it is quite likely he has been ripped off  ;D in the past and jumped to the wrong conclusion and felt pretty bad about it. Then divine intervention intervenes, the CD causing the problem falls into his hands and he is able to right a wrong. I bet he was very pleased with the outcome and his conscience cleared.

You mention dishonourable practice, Jeffrey. I have heard of a scam where a rare expensive LP in mint condition is purchased online and the buyer replaces the good copy by a poor one, returns it and demands a refund. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 06, 2020, 06:53:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 06, 2020, 06:47:07 AM
To be fair it is quite likely he has been ripped off  ;D in the past and jumped to the wrong conclusion and felt pretty bad about it. Then divine intervention intervenes, the CD causing the problem falls into his hands and he is able to right a wrong. I bet he was very pleased with the outcome and his conscience cleared.

You mention dishonourable practice, Jeffrey. I have heard of a scam where a rare expensive LP in mint condition is purchased online and the buyer replaces the good copy by a poor one, returns it and demands a refund.
Oooh!  Evildoers!!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 06, 2020, 07:09:17 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 06, 2020, 05:24:25 AM
Well done Irons!  Wish that I were there to scoop up the Lyritas.   :(  Out of curiosity, who recorded the Prokofiev chamber works?


Best wishes,

PD

A very good question, P! No translation and my Russian is poor - non-existent actually ??? Luckily enough the leaflet with the box includes photos of the artists - David and Igor Oistrakh, Kremer, Shafran and others I have not heard of. I am struggling with the accompanists, which all of which with the exception of Shafran's are female. Both string quartets are performed by an all female quartet which for Soviet Russia is surprising and I have not heard of such an ensemble.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 06, 2020, 07:56:46 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 06, 2020, 07:09:17 AM
A very good question, P! No translation and my Russian is poor - non-existent actually ??? Luckily enough the leaflet with the box includes photos of the artists - David and Igor Oistrakh, Kremer, Shafran and others I have not heard of. I am struggling with the accompanists, which all of which with the exception of Shafran's are female. Both string quartets are performed by an all female quartet which for Soviet Russia is surprising and I have not heard of such an ensemble.
Is it this set?  If so, the artists are listed (scroll down).  https://www.ebay.com/itm/MELODIYA-S-PROKOFIEV-COLLECTED-WORKS-ON-RECORDS-OISTRAKH-4-LPs-BOX-NM-/254526659870

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 07, 2020, 12:24:49 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 06, 2020, 07:56:46 AM
Is it this set?  If so, the artists are listed (scroll down).  https://www.ebay.com/itm/MELODIYA-S-PROKOFIEV-COLLECTED-WORKS-ON-RECORDS-OISTRAKH-4-LPs-BOX-NM-/254526659870

PD

PD, you are clever! 8) Yes that is the one, I have printed off the description to keep with the box - the seller does not know the string quartet but the rest of the artists are all listed. Many thanks.
By the way I paid £20.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 07, 2020, 03:58:54 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 06, 2020, 05:24:25 AM
Well done Irons!  Wish that I were there to scoop up the Lyritas.   :(  Out of curiosity, who recorded the Prokofiev chamber works?
Jeffrey,

Is this the Vaughan Williams one which you were searching for (and found)?  https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/products/8077163--vaughan-williams-the-pilgrim-s-progress

Best wishes,

PD
It was this one PD:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 07, 2020, 04:02:23 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 06, 2020, 06:47:07 AM
To be fair it is quite likely he has been ripped off  ;D in the past and jumped to the wrong conclusion and felt pretty bad about it. Then divine intervention intervenes, the CD causing the problem falls into his hands and he is able to right a wrong. I bet he was very pleased with the outcome and his conscience cleared.

You mention dishonourable practice, Jeffrey. I have heard of a scam where a rare expensive LP in mint condition is purchased online and the buyer replaces the good copy by a poor one, returns it and demands a refund.

You are probably right Lol. We ended up on friendly terms and had some nice communications. I had been too hasty to write the stroppy review anyway. Nothing surprises me these days about some people's duplicity, but those kind of stories are deeply dispiriting.
I've always admired Taoism as a philosophy and one of their sayings is 'Trust the trustworthy. Trust the untrustworthy. Then you will gain in trust'. I try, not always successfully, to follow this.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2020, 04:09:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 07, 2020, 12:24:49 AM
PD, you are clever! 8) Yes that is the one, I have printed off the description to keep with the box - the seller does not know the string quartet but the rest of the artists are all listed. Many thanks.
By the way I paid £20.
Thank you!  :D  I just double-checked and you're correct about the two string quartets not listing the musicians.  Ah!  I just found this (after further 'sleuthing');  I wonder whether or not the first link that I provided you had the last two LPs incorrectly identified?  Pretty easy to tell:  are they string quartets or not?  Take a look at this other listing (works and musicians identified):
https://www.cdandlp.com/en/shafran-gavrysh-yagling-oistrakh-monighetti/prokofiev-complete-recordings-cello-and-violin-works-ussr-melodiya-4lp-box-mint/lp-box-set/r117996126/

Note that the first two LPs (and as far as I can tell photo of the box set) are identical.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 07, 2020, 07:25:39 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 07, 2020, 04:02:23 AM
You are probably right Lol. We ended up on friendly terms and had some nice communications. I had been too hasty to write the stroppy review anyway. Nothing surprises me these days about some people's duplicity, but those kind of stories are deeply dispiriting.
I've always admired Taoism as a philosophy and one of their sayings is 'Trust the trustworthy. Trust the untrustworthy. Then you will gain in trust'. I try, not always successfully, to follow this.

Been there, Jeffrey. I actually think your situation worked out very well but horrible when it does not. The internet magnifies the problem. A wise philosophy but easier said then done.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 07, 2020, 07:39:30 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2020, 04:09:02 AM
Thank you!  :D  I just double-checked and you're correct about the two string quartets not listing the musicians.  Ah!  I just found this (after further 'sleuthing');  I wonder whether or not the first link that I provided you had the last two LPs incorrectly identified?  Pretty easy to tell:  are they string quartets or not?  Take a look at this other listing (works and musicians identified):
https://www.cdandlp.com/en/shafran-gavrysh-yagling-oistrakh-monighetti/prokofiev-complete-recordings-cello-and-violin-works-ussr-melodiya-4lp-box-mint/lp-box-set/r117996126/

Note that the first two LPs (and as far as I can tell photo of the box set) are identical.

PD

How weird. My box set definitely has the two string quartets on the fourth LP.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 07, 2020, 07:48:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 07, 2020, 07:25:39 AM
Been there, Jeffrey. I actually think your situation worked out very well but horrible when it does not. The internet magnifies the problem. A wise philosophy but easier said then done.
Yes, very true Lol.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on December 07, 2020, 09:51:09 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 07, 2020, 07:39:30 AM
How weird. My box set definitely has the two string quartets on the fourth LP.

The female quartet was simply called the Prokofiev Quartet and did other Melodiya LPs too.
Here's one currently on eBay (I'd have to work on the names, but the cellist's name is there; they're playing Grieg's Quartet and Wolff's Italian Serenade)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/PROKOFIEV-QUARTET-with-autograph-KIRA-SLAVYANOVA-on-the-cover-of-the-record-/142828661863

EDIT: the names were often:
Polina Guberman 1st violin, Ludmila Granova 2nd violin, Galina Odinetz viola, Kira Slavyanova cello; but the violist varied, and it's is different here, Galina Vakromeeva or something like that. Maybe she simply married ...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2020, 09:53:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 07, 2020, 07:39:30 AM
How weird. My box set definitely has the two string quartets on the fourth LP.
Strange!  I did see that photo of the female quartet somewhere online too, but can't remember where!  ::)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 07, 2020, 11:36:57 PM
Quote from: MusicTurner on December 07, 2020, 09:51:09 AM
The female quartet was simply called the Prokofiev Quartet and did other Melodiya LPs too.
Here's one currently on eBay (I'd have to work on the names, but the cellist's name is there; they're playing Grieg's Quartet and Wolff's Italian Serenade)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/PROKOFIEV-QUARTET-with-autograph-KIRA-SLAVYANOVA-on-the-cover-of-the-record-/142828661863

EDIT: the names were often:
Polina Guberman 1st violin, Ludmila Granova 2nd violin, Galina Odinetz viola, Kira Slavyanova cello; but the violist varied, and it's is different here, Galina Vakromeeva or something like that. Maybe she simply married ...

Mystery solved, thanks. I have not come across the Prokofiev Quartet before.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2020, 04:38:29 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on December 07, 2020, 09:51:09 AM
The female quartet was simply called the Prokofiev Quartet and did other Melodiya LPs too.
Here's one currently on eBay (I'd have to work on the names, but the cellist's name is there; they're playing Grieg's Quartet and Wolff's Italian Serenade)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/PROKOFIEV-QUARTET-with-autograph-KIRA-SLAVYANOVA-on-the-cover-of-the-record-/142828661863

EDIT: the names were often:
Polina Guberman 1st violin, Ludmila Granova 2nd violin, Galina Odinetz viola, Kira Slavyanova cello; but the violist varied, and it's is different here, Galina Vakromeeva or something like that. Maybe she simply married ...
Sorry that I missed your post yesterday.  Good job you!  Do you have any recordings by them MT?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 14, 2020, 11:39:32 AM
My most recent LP acquisition:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 14, 2020, 01:23:29 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 14, 2020, 11:39:32 AM
My most recent LP acquisition:
(//)

Great! Is your copy a red or yellow label, Jeffrey?

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 14, 2020, 01:38:12 PM
Nice acquisition Jeffrey!

Alas, most of the LPs of VW with Previn that I've found haven't been the greatest of pressings, etc.  :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on December 15, 2020, 05:40:02 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2020, 04:38:29 AM
Sorry that I missed your post yesterday.  Good job you!  Do you have any recordings by them MT?

PD

Sorry about my late answer: yes, I own Boris Tchaikovsky's 5th Quartet, possibly a single item more. I don't register according to artists, so that's just what I remember. But there's a - possibly incomplete - discography of their recordings here:
https://www.discogs.com/artist/2114063-Prokofiev-Quartet
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 15, 2020, 05:53:49 AM
Thanks MT for that link.  I wonder why their names (members) were crossed out?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on December 15, 2020, 05:56:48 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 15, 2020, 05:53:49 AM
Thanks MT for that link.  I wonder why their names (members) were crossed out?

PD

Hm, I don't know either. Maybe-maybe because they could vary through time ...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 15, 2020, 06:02:40 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on December 15, 2020, 05:56:48 AM
Hm, I don't know either. Maybe-maybe because they could vary through time ...
That's what I was thinking too.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 18, 2020, 06:35:34 AM
After success of last visit a return was always on the cards.

Stenhammar: 2nd Symphony. Stockholm Phil, Westerberg. Caprice.

Somervell, Butterworth, Moeran, Peel, Orr, Gibbs, Bax, Ireland and Gurney: A Shropshire Lad. Trew, Vignoles and The Coull Quartet. Meridian (double album).

Haydn: Symphonies 100 & 104. AAM Hogwood. L'Oiseau-Lyre.

Lennox Berkeley: 1st Symphony/Concerto for Two Pianos. LPO Del Mar. Lyrita.

Howells: Piano Quartet, Fantasy String Quartet, Rhapsodic Quintet. Richards Ensemble with Thea King. Lyrita.

Bliss; A Colour Symphony/Things to Come. RPO Groves. EMI.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 18, 2020, 09:07:01 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 18, 2020, 06:35:34 AM
After success of last visit a return was always on the cards.

Stenhammar: 2nd Symphony. Stockholm Phil, Westerberg. Caprice.

Somervell, Butterworth, Moeran, Peel, Orr, Gibbs, Bax, Ireland and Gurney: A Shropshire Lad. Trew, Vignoles and The Coull Quartet. Meridian (double album).

Haydn: Symphonies 100 & 104. AAM Hogwood. L'Oiseau-Lyre.

Lennox Berkeley: 1st Symphony/Concerto for Two Pianos. LPO Del Mar. Lyrita.

Howells: Piano Quartet, Fantasy String Quartet, Rhapsodic Quintet. Richards Ensemble with Thea King. Lyrita.

Bliss; A Colour Symphony/Things to Come. RPO Groves. EMI.
What a great haul Lol! The Berkeley, Bliss and Stenhammar LPs are unrivalled performances. The Berkeley Symphony No.1 is far better coupled with the marvellous Concerto for Two Pianos that with the far less interesting work of Berkeley Jnr on the Chandos CD. That was a misconceived idea IMO.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 18, 2020, 11:58:51 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 18, 2020, 09:07:01 AM
What a great haul Lol! The Berkeley, Bliss and Stenhammar LPs are unrivalled performances. The Berkeley Symphony No.1 is far better coupled with the marvellous Concerto for Two Pianos that with the far less interesting work of Berkeley Jnr on the Chandos CD. That was a misconceived idea IMO.

Played Bliss Colours last night (twice) Jeffrey, I needed a "modern" recording. Morning Heroes also on the store shelf.

Also played some of the "Shropshire Lad" which threw up some mildly interesting thoughts. After more listening I may comment later if worthwhile.

Have you viewed the Hurwitzer RVW video yet? He can do a much better English accent then I can American! 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 19, 2020, 12:29:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 14, 2020, 01:23:29 PM
Great! Is your copy a red or yellow label, Jeffrey?
Hi Lol.
Red - is that good news?
:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 19, 2020, 12:31:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 18, 2020, 11:58:51 PM
Played Bliss Colours last night (twice) Jeffrey, I needed a "modern" recording. Morning Heroes also on the store shelf.

Also played some of the "Shropshire Lad" which threw up some mildly interesting thoughts. After more listening I may comment later if worthwhile.

Have you viewed the Hurwitzer RVW video yet? He can do a much better English accent then I can American!

You need 'Morning Heroes' (Groves) Lol - by far the best performance IMO. Which RVW video? I listen to one on 'Job' which Hurwitz considers his greatest work.

I was amused by the Classics Today review of Elder's recording of VW's Symphony No.6 (not written by Hurwitz) which says that it sounds like the soundtrack to a Lassie movie!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 19, 2020, 02:46:03 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 19, 2020, 12:31:05 AM
You need 'Morning Heroes' (Groves) Lol - by far the best performance IMO. Which RVW video? I listen to one on 'Job' which Hurwitz considers his greatest work.

I was amused by the Classics Today review of Elder's recording of VW's Symphony No.6 (not written by Hurwitz) which says that it sounds like the soundtrack to a Lassie movie!
??? ::) :laugh:

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 19, 2020, 06:52:03 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 19, 2020, 12:29:04 AM
Hi Lol.
Red - is that good news?
:)

;D As you are probably aware Jeffrey an anorak is part of my wardrobe. Good news either way, red comes first followed by yellow. Red are far as I'm aware British pressings and yellow German. Does it make a difference? Not really, but I like to know.  8)   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 19, 2020, 06:59:28 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 19, 2020, 12:31:05 AM
You need 'Morning Heroes' (Groves) Lol - by far the best performance IMO. Which RVW video? I listen to one on 'Job' which Hurwitz considers his greatest work.

I was amused by the Classics Today review of Elder's recording of VW's Symphony No.6 (not written by Hurwitz) which says that it sounds like the soundtrack to a Lassie movie!

Hurwitz does take the p--- out of the Brits. He does have a point. :)  https://youtu.be/kDIaepn3758
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 20, 2020, 12:31:35 PM
Quote from: Irons on December 19, 2020, 06:59:28 AM
Hurwitz does take the p--- out of the Brits. He does have a point. :)  https://youtu.be/kDIaepn3758
That was one of the only Hurwitz videos that I found irritating. Not because of his p--- take of the Brits but because of some sloppy basic errors.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 21, 2020, 12:52:24 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 20, 2020, 12:31:35 PM
That was one of the only Hurwitz videos that I found irritating. Not because of his p--- take of the Brits but because of some sloppy basic errors.

I missed the one's you spotted, Jeffrey. Obviously not paying attention, but I did pick up on the mono Decca eight symphonies when of course the 8th is stereo.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 21, 2020, 02:14:34 AM
I was surprised to hear him say (something along the lines of) that he didn't believe that most people had heard the Everest/Boult/Ninth recording before; I love it!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 06, 2021, 01:48:25 AM
The Electric Record Company are currently producing facsimile copies of selected classical and jazz recordings - https://electricrecordingco.com/shop
Selling at a cool £300 + each a limited run is usually sold out within 24 hours. 2nd hand copies are being sold at two to three times cost price.

A short video showing the care and expertise that goes into a The Electric Record Company LP.
https://youtu.be/DhMuIqa9Dno
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 06, 2021, 04:22:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 06, 2021, 01:48:25 AM
The Electric Record Company are currently producing facsimile copies of selected classical and jazz recordings - https://electricrecordingco.com/shop
Selling at a cool £300 + each a limited run is usually sold out within 24 hours. 2nd hand copies are being sold at two to three times cost price.

A short video showing the care and expertise that goes into a The Electric Record Company LP.
https://youtu.be/DhMuIqa9Dno
Ooooh!   Would love to get ahold of one of the Starker Bach's!

Hadn't heard of Yura Guller before now.  Do you have any of her recordings Irons?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 06, 2021, 07:41:25 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 06, 2021, 04:22:14 AM
Ooooh!   Would love to get ahold of one of the Starker Bach's!

Hadn't heard of Yura Guller before now.  Do you have any of her recordings Irons?

PD

PD, Starker's Bach on this label would be a pension pot, not something to play and enjoy!

I did not notice Yura Guller on the label's roster. I actually do have a Nimbus LP by her.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 06, 2021, 08:12:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 06, 2021, 07:41:25 AM
PD, Starker's Bach on this label would be a pension pot, not something to play and enjoy!

I did not notice Yura Guller on the label's roster. I actually do have a Nimbus LP by her.
True! lol

I did see at least two LPs of her recordings (both Chopin):  https://theelectricrecordingco.com/shop/nocturnes and

https://theelectricrecordingco.com/shop/mazurkas-favorites

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 06, 2021, 09:23:19 AM
New purchase via Oxfam Shop
I once owned the original LP when it was first released:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 06, 2021, 10:38:35 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on January 06, 2021, 09:23:19 AM
New purchase via Oxfam Shop
I once owned the original LP when it was first released:
(//)
Excellent find you!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 06, 2021, 12:35:10 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 06, 2021, 10:38:35 AM
Excellent find you!
Thanks PD!
:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 07, 2021, 12:38:51 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 06, 2021, 08:12:11 AM
True! lol

I did see at least two LPs of her recordings (both Chopin):  https://theelectricrecordingco.com/shop/nocturnes and

https://theelectricrecordingco.com/shop/mazurkas-favorites

PD

Think I'm due a visit to Specsavers. 8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 07, 2021, 12:49:02 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on January 06, 2021, 09:23:19 AM
New purchase via Oxfam Shop
I once owned the original LP when it was first released:


Great find, Jeffrey. That issue is my favourite of the three due to best sound but two more from the same source you may consider.

(https://i.imgur.com/XxkgixM.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/YgwmW6u.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 07, 2021, 12:58:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 07, 2021, 12:49:02 AM
Great find, Jeffrey. That issue is my favourite of the three due to best sound but two more from the same source you may consider.

(https://i.imgur.com/XxkgixM.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/YgwmW6u.jpg)
Thanks Lol - I don't know either of them. I like the look of the one featuring 'In the Tatras' which is a wonderful work. I think (famous last words) that I should cease buying more LPs (three are on the way  ::)) until I decide if I'm going to get a decent quality turntable. I doubt whether my old Dual one would function now.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 07, 2021, 06:38:56 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 07, 2021, 12:38:51 AM
Think I'm due a visit to Specsavers. 8)
You and me both!  I'm trying to read the names of various people who have resigned, etc., following yesterday's events in DC on my t.v. and I can't even read them up close!  Mind you, I don't currently have a high-def broadcast package, so this is not helping things.   :(
Quote from: vandermolen on January 07, 2021, 12:58:43 AM
Thanks Lol - I don't know either of them. I like the look of the one featuring 'In the Tatras' which is a wonderful work. I think (famous last words) that I should cease buying more LPs (three are on the way  ::)) until I decide if I'm going to get a decent quality turntable. I doubt whether my old Dual one would function now.
Go for it Jeffrey!  :D  ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 07, 2021, 07:57:26 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on January 07, 2021, 12:58:43 AM
Thanks Lol - I don't know either of them. I like the look of the one featuring 'In the Tatras' which is a wonderful work. I think (famous last words) that I should cease buying more LPs (three are on the way  ::)) until I decide if I'm going to get a decent quality turntable. I doubt whether my old Dual one would function now.

A turntable is the easy bit, Jeffrey. Plenty of excellent examples available on the 2nd hand market. http://www.retrotechaudio.co.uk/currently-for-sale.html

More challenging is incorporating into a modern setup as a phono input is unlikely to be available, although there are ways around this. PD I know and increasingly more listeners, as proved by increased LP sales, have CD as a primary source and yet able to enjoy the benefits that vinyl brings - in your case, for starters Bax 3 and Goossens 1  >:D. Anyway, LP is more fun then CD. ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 07, 2021, 08:15:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 07, 2021, 07:57:26 AM
A turntable is the easy bit, Jeffrey. Plenty of excellent examples available on the 2nd hand market. http://www.retrotechaudio.co.uk/currently-for-sale.html

More challenging is incorporating into a modern setup as a phono input is unlikely to be available, although there are ways around this. PD I know and increasingly more listeners, as proved by increased LP sales, have CD as a primary source and yet able to enjoy the benefits that vinyl brings - in your case, for starters Bax 3 and Goossens 1  >:D. Anyway, LP is more fun then CD. ;)
Perhaps some suggestions for Jeffrey of a decent *separate phono preamp (don't know what his price-range is)?  Also, a question for Jeffrey, how much room do you have around your other stereo equipment to fit in a turntable and separate amp?  You might also be able to use a wall-mounted shelf (several benefits for that one)?

*I remember that there was one which MW liked to use.  Was it a Graham Slee?  I found this:  https://www.whathifi.com/best-buys/accessories/best-phono-preamps

Trying to remember, do you use a separate phono preamp Irons?  I'm thinking that you do.  If so, what do you use and how do you like it?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 08, 2021, 12:44:19 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 07, 2021, 08:15:21 AM
Perhaps some suggestions for Jeffrey of a decent *separate phono preamp (don't know what his price-range is)?  Also, a question for Jeffrey, how much room do you have around your other stereo equipment to fit in a turntable and separate amp?  You might also be able to use a wall-mounted shelf (several benefits for that one)?

*I remember that there was one which MW liked to use.  Was it a Graham Slee?  I found this:  https://www.whathifi.com/best-buys/accessories/best-phono-preamps

Trying to remember, do you use a separate phono preamp Irons?  I'm thinking that you do.  If so, what do you use and how do you like it?

PD

MW had one of these, PD. https://iconaudio.com/ps3-mkii-pure-valve-phono-pre-amplifier-ps3-mkii

I do own a separate Phono Pre but not using it at present - if Jeffrey would like to borrow it then he is more then welcome. My preamp includes both MM and MC inputs which sound good and it is more convenient this way.

I have never owned a Graham Slee but would like to. That was a great list, the only one I would add is the inexpensive Project https://www.henleyaudio.co.uk/Project-Phono-Stages
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2021, 03:05:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 08, 2021, 12:44:19 AM
MW had one of these, PD. https://iconaudio.com/ps3-mkii-pure-valve-phono-pre-amplifier-ps3-mkii

I do own a separate Phono Pre but not using it at present - if Jeffrey would like to borrow it then he is more then welcome. My preamp includes both MM and MC inputs which sound good and it is more convenient this way.

I have never owned a Graham Slee but would like to. That was a great list, the only one I would add is the inexpensive Project https://www.henleyaudio.co.uk/Project-Phono-Stages
Have you 'given in' and hooked up your CD player to it?  ;) :)

The Project prices for their two lower end ones are nice!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 08, 2021, 05:23:39 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 07, 2021, 07:57:26 AM
A turntable is the easy bit, Jeffrey. Plenty of excellent examples available on the 2nd hand market. http://www.retrotechaudio.co.uk/currently-for-sale.html

More challenging is incorporating into a modern setup as a phono input is unlikely to be available, although there are ways around this. PD I know and increasingly more listeners, as proved by increased LP sales, have CD as a primary source and yet able to enjoy the benefits that vinyl brings - in your case, for starters Bax 3 and Goossens 1  >:D. Anyway, LP is more fun then CD. ;)
Thanks Lol (and PD) for the thoughtful advice. Yes and also Gordon Jacob's 'Concerto for Two Pianos', Janis Ivanov's (excellent) 11th Symphony  etc.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 08, 2021, 05:29:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 07, 2021, 08:15:21 AM
Perhaps some suggestions for Jeffrey of a decent *separate phono preamp (don't know what his price-range is)?  Also, a question for Jeffrey, how much room do you have around your other stereo equipment to fit in a turntable and separate amp?  You might also be able to use a wall-mounted shelf (several benefits for that one)?

*I remember that there was one which MW liked to use.  Was it a Graham Slee?  I found this:  https://www.whathifi.com/best-buys/accessories/best-phono-preamps

Trying to remember, do you use a separate phono preamp Irons?  I'm thinking that you do.  If so, what do you use and how do you like it?

PD
Hi PD,
In the living room I have my main system which consists of a NAD CD player, NAD amp and Wharfedale speakers. The CD player and amplifier are in a wooden unit without a hinged lid. The turntable could theoretically sit on top of the unit (currently occupied by my cold-cast bronze head of Vaughan Williams, the landline, modem and a candle). I could find somewhere else to put them but I'm not too sure how this would go down with 'my other half'  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2021, 07:20:20 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on January 08, 2021, 05:29:44 AM
Hi PD,
In the living room I have my main system which consists of a NAD CD player, NAD amp and Wharfedale speakers. The CD player and amplifier are in a wooden unit without a hinged lid. The turntable could theoretically sit on top of the unit (currently occupied by my cold-cast bronze head of Vaughan Williams, the landline, modem and a candle). I could find somewhere else to put them but I'm not too sure how this would go down with 'my other half'  ;D
So, is your NAD an integrated amplifier?

Hmmm...perhaps build some more shelving for 'excess' CDs and then you'll have room to move the other things?  And perhaps a dedicated shelf for the VW bust?  :-\ ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 08, 2021, 07:27:02 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2021, 07:20:20 AM
So, is your NAD an integrated amplifier?

Hmmm...perhaps build some more shelving for 'excess' CDs and then you'll have room to move the other things?  And perhaps a dedicated shelf for the VW bust?  :-\ ;)

PD
Not sure what that means PD. The amp is a separate unit.
Good 'shelving' points!  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 08, 2021, 07:28:29 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on January 08, 2021, 05:29:44 AM
Hi PD,
In the living room I have my main system which consists of a NAD CD player, NAD amp and Wharfedale speakers. The CD player and amplifier are in a wooden unit without a hinged lid. The turntable could theoretically sit on top of the unit (currently occupied by my cold-cast bronze head of Vaughan Williams, the landline, modem and a candle). I could find somewhere else to put them but I'm not too sure how this would go down with 'my other half'  ;D

For the better half factor a turntable would be a walk in the park compared with my circa 1974 speakers which I admit are on the large side. "I must be mad allowing those monstrosities in our living room!". Do what I do Jeffrey, rise above it and ask "like a cup of tea darling". :-*
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2021, 09:53:56 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on January 08, 2021, 07:27:02 AM
Not sure what that means PD. The amp is a separate unit.
Good 'shelving' points!  :)
Hi Jeffrey.

I'm certainly not the best one to explain this, so here is a link:  https://www.gearpatrol.com/tech/audio/a33767168/power-amp-vs-integrated-amp-explained/

As for myself, I have a preamp (tube), a [power] amplifier (also tube), a tuner (for radio), a combo DVD/SACD/CD player, a record player (that has a separate power supply/record speed unit), and a surge-protector unit/component (which everything plugs into)...and a set of monitor speakers on stands.  An integrated amplifier is a combo of a preamplifier (which has various number of stages for plugging in your various components) and a power amplifier. You can, as we were just talking about, buy one with only (=dedicated) phono stage or ones that can handle various components (like for a tuner, CD player, etc.).  This article here explains what power amps do:  https://www.electronicshub.org/power-amplifier/

Things have changed so much over the past 20(?) years, that once I've learned something, there's something new!  Many more options this days.

Hope that this helps!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 08, 2021, 11:44:54 PM
Looked up a host of Nad amps and all have a phono input. ::)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 09, 2021, 11:21:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 08, 2021, 11:44:54 PM
Looked up a host of Nad amps and all have a phono input. ::)
Well, that makes it easy then for Jeffrey to upgrade just the turntable--at least for the time being!  :)  Now I'm wondering what his current turntable setup is like?

PD

p.s.  Jeffrey, just to be on the safe side (as we don't know which NAD amp you have and whether or not things have changed at all over the years), take a look on the back of yours and see whether or not there are phono inputs.  Good time to dust too.  ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 11, 2021, 06:08:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 09, 2021, 11:21:22 AM
Well, that makes it easy then for Jeffrey to upgrade just the turntable--at least for the time being!  :)  Now I'm wondering what his current turntable setup is like?

PD

p.s.  Jeffrey, just to be on the safe side (as we don't know which NAD amp you have and whether or not things have changed at all over the years), take a look on the back of yours and see whether or not there are phono inputs.  Good time to dust too.  ;)
Don't laugh (my one has built-in speakers at the front)  ;D
One of the disadvantages of vinyl occurred today. I received a second hand LP from Denmark (Richard Rodney Bennett 'Nicholas and Alexandra' soundtrack) which was so badly warped that it completely distorted the sound  :(
(//)
Thanks v much to you and Lol for the advice which is much appreciated.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 11, 2021, 07:55:32 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on January 11, 2021, 06:08:44 AM
Don't laugh (my one has built-in speakers at the front)  ;D
One of the disadvantages of vinyl occurred today. I received a second hand LP from Denmark (Richard Rodney Bennett 'Nicholas and Alexandra' soundtrack) which was so badly warped that it completely distorted the sound  :(
(//)
Thanks v much to you and Lol for the advice which is much appreciated.
Hey, as long as you can listen to and enjoy your music, that's all that matters!  :)

Sorry to hear about your LP issue, have you contacted the seller?  I once bought a used LP (luckily from a store not too far away), brought it home, and put it on and (if I'm recalling correctly), it was so badly warped that the needle jumped!  I was able to exchange it for a different one next time I went there.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 14, 2021, 01:27:36 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 11, 2021, 07:55:32 AM
Hey, as long as you can listen to and enjoy your music, that's all that matters!  :)

Sorry to hear about your LP issue, have you contacted the seller?  I once bought a used LP (luckily from a store not too far away), brought it home, and put it on and (if I'm recalling correctly), it was so badly warped that the needle jumped!  I was able to exchange it for a different one next time I went there.

PD
Thanks PD - yes, I immediately received a refund.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 15, 2021, 02:13:28 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on January 14, 2021, 01:27:36 PM
Thanks PD - yes, I immediately received a refund.
Yeah!  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Szykneij on January 17, 2021, 09:07:42 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 06, 2019, 12:45:05 AM
Scratching my head a bit with this one. In the 1970's EMI wrongly thinking that quadraphonic sound would be the next big thing released a whole swathe of recordings in this format. Thankfully for them the records were stereo compatible although pressed with four channels. When EMI realized the buying public were not keen on the idea of extra expense of a SQ decoder and two extra speakers EMI quietly reverted back to stereo.

Fremaux's "Le Cid" has long been a demonstration recording par excellence due to vivid sound. It sold well and although plentiful today commands a decent price. Many copies have passed through my hands but I have never seen a quadraphonic issue - until last week! It is my understanding that a four track cannot be applied retrospectively, the process takes place as early as the recording itself and pressing of the "mother". I can only think EMI were pressing records in four channels as early as 1971 or earlier although the records were titled and sold as stereo. 

(https://i.imgur.com/i58GDZ3.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/MzSnfA8.jpg)

   

Can someone explain how quad was produced with vinyl? I had (and still have) a quad 8-track player/recorder. How this worked makes sense to me. The tape heads were designed to read 4 tracks instead of the usual 2 simultaneously. The unit had four speaker outputs and the tape time was half of what it would be if it were the basic stereo.

Was a special stylus required for vinyl quad? As was mentioned, the records play on a conventional system. Examining the vinyl, though, reveals an unusual appearance. The grooves are much closer and narrower, at least on the example I'm looking at. The whole disc has a smoother appearance.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 17, 2021, 11:10:44 AM
Quote from: Szykneij on January 17, 2021, 09:07:42 AM
Can someone explain how quad was produced with vinyl? I had (and still have) a quad 8-track player/recorder. How this worked makes sense to me. The tape heads were designed to read 4 tracks instead of the usual 2 simultaneously. The unit had four speaker outputs and the tape time was half of what it would be if it were the basic stereo.

Was a special stylus required for vinyl quad? As was mentioned, the records play on a conventional system. Examining the vinyl, though, reveals an unusual appearance. The grooves are much closer and narrower, at least on the example I'm looking at. The whole disc has a smoother appearance.

You are correct quadraphonic and stereo LP recordings do appear different. The photo below is of side one of Le Cid, quad left, stereo right. The groove is more pronounced on the stereo LP.

(https://i.imgur.com/0q7vlKc.jpg)

The back cover includes the following information: This EMI 33 1/3 Quadraphonic record is produced by the SQ system which permits the reproduction of sound from four separate channels when a special SQ Decoder is used in association with suitable amplifiers and four loudspeakers. This SQ record will be reproduced as 2-channel stereo when played through standard stereo equipment.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Szykneij on January 17, 2021, 11:25:01 AM
Thanks, Irons.

I'm trying to wrap my non-engineer mind around how SQ decoder technology was able to "recover four channels from the two channels recorded on the record."
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 17, 2021, 01:00:58 PM
Quote from: Szykneij on January 17, 2021, 11:25:01 AM
Thanks, Irons.

I'm trying to wrap my non-engineer mind around how SQ decoder technology was able to "recover four channels from the two channels recorded on the record."

There were different systems. In the RCA system the additional channels are encoded on a high frequency carrier, above the audible range. If you don't have a cartridge with adequate bandwidth and the decoder you don't hear it the additional channels.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Szykneij on January 17, 2021, 03:09:29 PM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on January 17, 2021, 01:00:58 PM
There were different systems. In the RCA system the additional channels are encoded on a high frequency carrier, above the audible range. If you don't have a cartridge with adequate bandwidth and the decoder you don't hear it the additional channels.

Aah! Thanks!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 18, 2021, 02:52:43 AM
Quote from: Szykneij on January 17, 2021, 09:07:42 AM
Can someone explain how quad was produced with vinyl? I had (and still have) a quad 8-track player/recorder. How this worked makes sense to me. The tape heads were designed to read 4 tracks instead of the usual 2 simultaneously. The unit had four speaker outputs and the tape time was half of what it would be if it were the basic stereo.

Was a special stylus required for vinyl quad? As was mentioned, the records play on a conventional system. Examining the vinyl, though, reveals an unusual appearance. The grooves are much closer and narrower, at least on the example I'm looking at. The whole disc has a smoother appearance.
I'm trying to figure out how "the tape time was half of what it would be if it were basic stereo"?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Szykneij on January 18, 2021, 04:11:38 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 18, 2021, 02:52:43 AM
I'm trying to figure out how "the tape time was half of what it would be if it were basic stereo"?

PD

A regular 8-track cassette had music recorded on 4 sections of the tape, each section using 2 tracks for stereo. When the end of the first section was reached, a metal tab on the tape switched the heads to read the music on the next section. The quad recordings used four tracks (half) of the tape instead of two, so there were only two sections instead of 4.
   8-track recordings could only turn in one direction and had tape twice as wide (the same width of reel-to-reel) as the cassettes that came later. Those cassettes can be reversed to play the other side, utilizing 4 tracks total.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 18, 2021, 04:20:28 AM
Quote from: Szykneij on January 18, 2021, 04:11:38 AM
A regular 8-track cassette had music recorded on 4 sections of the tape, each section using 2 tracks for stereo. When the end of the first section was reached, a metal tab on the tape switched the heads to read the music on the next section. The quad recordings used four tracks (half) of the tape instead of two, so there were only two sections instead of 4.
   8-track recordings could only turn in one direction and had tape twice as wide (the same width of reel-to-reel) as the cassettes that came later. Those cassettes can be reversed to play the other side, utilizing 4 tracks total.
Ah, thanks for the explanation!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 18, 2021, 07:40:00 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 18, 2021, 02:52:43 AM
I'm trying to figure out how "the tape time was half of what it would be if it were basic stereo"?

PD

PD, I did own a 8-track player once! Must go down as the most odd and impractical of formats ever.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-track_tape

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 18, 2021, 08:21:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 18, 2021, 07:40:00 AM
PD, I did own a 8-track player once! Must go down as the most odd and impractical of formats ever.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-track_tape
My parents' had one, so I listened to it (never purchased any recordings for it though).   Anyone here remember that age-old craft of making mixed-compilation cassette for parties, etc.?  ;D  Ah, the careful calculations that one had to make.... the art of the mixed-tape!  :D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Szykneij on January 18, 2021, 08:58:57 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 18, 2021, 07:40:00 AM
PD, I did own a 8-track player once! Must go down as the most odd and impractical of formats ever.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-track_tape

Yes, for sure.

The link you posted had a good picture of the inner workings. The cartridges had a continuous loop tape that had to be pulled out of the center spool to go back around again. This put some significant wear on the tape itself which was notorious for breaking, especially in car players. I got pretty good at opening them up and splicing the tape back together.

Another drawback was the short length of each track, which made it nearly impossible to fit all pieces of an album within the allotted times (about 12-15 minutes) and in the correct order. Commercially produced ones often had a song fade out and fade back in to finish when the player needed to make the switch. If you had a recorder (which wasn't that common) and made your own, the switch just occurred where it needed to with a pop, which I thought was much preferable.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 18, 2021, 09:04:47 AM
Quote from: Szykneij on January 18, 2021, 08:58:57 AM
Yes, for sure.

The link you posted had a good picture of the inner workings. The cartridges had a continuous loop tape that had to be pulled out of the center spool to go back around again. This put some significant wear on the tape itself which was notorious for breaking, especially in car players. I got pretty good at opening them up and splicing the tape back together.

Another drawback was the short length of each track, which made it nearly impossible to fit all pieces of an album within the allotted times (about 12-15 minutes) and in the correct order. Commercially produced ones often had a song fade out and fade back in to finish when the player needed to make the switch. If you had a recorder (which wasn't that common) and made your own, the switch just occurred where it needed to with a pop, which I thought was much preferable.
Looking at that Wiki page reminded me of that endless loop and hearing it go back to the 'start' of the tape! lol

And sounds like you're good at tape surgery there Tony!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 31, 2021, 02:05:05 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/13Ge4OL.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/1aLJjha.jpg)

For over half a century the du Pré iconic recording of the Elgar Cello Concerto ASD 655 has not left the catalogue. The coupling although excellent is odd. Even odder, in the same year (1965) EMI coupled Jackie's Delius recording in a similar way (ASD 644). EMI obviously thought it more important to have composer over artist continuity. Although later they were to have second thoughts with ASD 2764.

(https://i.imgur.com/WxPwQ08.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 20, 2021, 12:09:45 AM
I like the look of the Delius only EMI/HMV LP Lol.

From WAYLTN thread:
(//)
Kabalevsky Symphony No.4

The politically correct soviet notes are very characteristic:
'...[the Symphony embodies] the grand and lofty thoughts and emotions of the Soviet people.'
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 20, 2021, 12:32:41 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 20, 2021, 12:09:45 AM
I like the look of the Delius only EMI/HMV LP Lol.

From WAYLTN thread:
(//)
Kabalevsky Symphony No.4

Picked the Delius up at a charity shop that had just opened in Kensington Church Street, Jeffrey. Could not believe my luck.

Your MK has the the best cover image I have seen. Not a label noted for cover artwork. I will listen later to a YouTube upload of the recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 20, 2021, 12:41:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 20, 2021, 12:32:41 AM
Picked the Delius up at a charity shop that had just opened in Kensington Church Street, Jeffrey. Could not believe my luck.

Your MK has the the best cover image I have seen. Not a label noted for cover artwork. I will listen later to a YouTube upload of the recording.
Yes Lol and it's in vg condition. Was on offer on eBay for £10. I offered £5.00 which was immediately accepted. I had the LP in a white cardboard sleeve many decades ago and it's nice to have a copy complete with an attractive jacket design and characteristically poorly-translated and propagandist soviet notes (see above). I knew Kensington Church St well from my youth in Earl's Court. As a boy I remember being dragged round the very trendy clothes boutique 'Biba' probably by our au-pair girl.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 20, 2021, 08:23:50 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 20, 2021, 12:41:44 AM
Yes Lol and it's in vg condition. Was on offer on eBay for £10. I offered £5.00 which was immediately accepted. I had the LP in a white cardboard sleeve many decades ago and it's nice to have a copy complete with an attractive jacket design and characteristically poorly-translated and propagandist soviet notes (see above). I knew Kensington Church St well from my youth in Earl's Court. As a boy I remember being dragged round the very trendy clothes boutique 'Biba' probably by our au-pair girl.

Most enjoyable. Russian to it's bootstraps! Tchaikovsky and Shostakovich influence in equal measure. Anyway, I have ordered a copy. ;D

In my youf I worked at John Barkers for a few years.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 27, 2021, 05:20:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 20, 2021, 08:23:50 AM
Most enjoyable. Russian to it's bootstraps! Tchaikovsky and Shostakovich influence in equal measure. Anyway, I have ordered a copy. ;D

In my youf I worked at John Barkers for a few years.
Excellent - it is my favourite of Kabalevsky's symphonies. I worked at Harrods and Whiteley's of Bayswater (where I was told that I was driving customer's out of the shop by playing Durufle's 'Requiem' at top volume) in my youth.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 27, 2021, 05:35:06 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 27, 2021, 05:20:28 AM
Excellent - it is my favourite of Kabalevsky's symphonies. I worked at Harrods and Whiteley's of Bayswater (where I was told that I was driving customer's out of the shop by playing Durufle's 'Requiem' at top volume) in my youth.
Whoopsie!  :-[ 😆
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: DavidW on February 27, 2021, 08:11:14 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 27, 2021, 05:20:28 AM
Excellent - it is my favourite of Kabalevsky's symphonies.

If you're talking the fourth symphony I just listened to it last night.  It is great!  I doubt it was the specific recording you and Irons are discussing though.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 28, 2021, 12:33:14 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 27, 2021, 05:20:28 AM
Excellent - it is my favourite of Kabalevsky's symphonies. I worked at Harrods and Whiteley's of Bayswater (where I was told that I was driving customer's out of the shop by playing Durufle's 'Requiem' at top volume) in my youth.

We did get around didn't we, Jeffrey. :) Took my wife for lunch at Whiteley's for her birthday once. Very olde worlde, I was expecting to bump into Mrs Slocombe! Worked at Bentalls, Kingston too. Unfortunately not at any time in record departments.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: DavidW on February 28, 2021, 05:42:50 AM
So I'm confused, is this 40+ page thread actually devoted to the 33 (as the title suggests), or you mostly talking about 45s? 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 28, 2021, 11:43:43 PM
Quote from: DavidW on February 28, 2021, 05:42:50 AM
So I'm confused, is this 40+ page thread actually devoted to the 33 (as the title suggests), or you mostly talking about 45s?

I am now confused as you. I cannot recall any mention of 45s on this thread.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 01, 2021, 11:48:08 AM
Quote from: DavidW on February 27, 2021, 08:11:14 AM
If you're talking the fourth symphony I just listened to it last night.  It is great!  I doubt it was the specific recording you and Irons are discussing though.
Yes, we are David. There are, AFAIK, only two recordings, the one conducted by Kabalevsky which has had various LP and CD manifestations and the more recent CPO recording. I wouldn't be without either of them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 01, 2021, 11:51:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 28, 2021, 12:33:14 AM
We did get around didn't we, Jeffrey. :) Took my wife for lunch at Whiteley's for her birthday once. Very olde worlde, I was expecting to bump into Mrs Slocombe! Worked at Bentalls, Kingston too. Unfortunately not at any time in record departments.
Haha, yes we did Lol. At Harrods I wanted to be in the record dept but was placed in the silk dept  ???. My boss, whom I recall as being very keen on security, was later arrested and sent to prison for stealing 1000s of pounds of material.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 01, 2021, 12:04:52 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 01, 2021, 11:51:14 AM
Haha, yes we did Lol. At Harrods I wanted to be in the record dept but was placed in the silk dept  ???. My boss, whom I recall as being very keen on security, was later arrested and sent to prison for stealing 1000s of pounds of material.
:o  Oh, my!  Did you ever manage to get transferred to the record department?  I'm sure that they could have used you there.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: DavidW on March 01, 2021, 12:34:38 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 01, 2021, 11:48:08 AM
Yes, we are David. There are, AFAIK, only two recordings, the one conducted by Kabalevsky which has had various LP and CD manifestations and the more recent CPO recording. I wouldn't be without either of them.

I didn't realize that there were only two recordings!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 02, 2021, 07:07:13 AM
So, I'm curious as to where you guys are currently able to (and willing to go to these days) go to to shop for LPs at the moment?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 03, 2021, 12:44:53 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 02, 2021, 07:07:13 AM
So, I'm curious as to where you guys are currently able to (and willing to go to these days) go to to shop for LPs at the moment?

PD

In a way PD I am enjoying my sabbatical from buying LPs - the only good thing to come out of covid. With a fairly large collection of 6000ish I am enjoying reacquainting with records not exactly forgotten but discovering they are in fact better then I thought they were. I dare say when the world opens up I will climb back in the saddle as I get nearly as much pleasure buying LPs as listening to them. But the truth is I have well enough to see me out.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 03, 2021, 02:13:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 03, 2021, 12:44:53 AM
In a way PD I am enjoying my sabbatical from buying LPs - the only good thing to come out of covid. With a fairly large collection of 6000ish I am enjoying reacquainting with records not exactly forgotten but discovering they are in fact better then I thought they were. I dare say when the world opens up I will climb back in the saddle as I get nearly as much pleasure buying LPs as listening to them. But the truth is I have well enough to see me out.
Glad that you are stockpiled up there Irons!  :)  What shops/stores that you like to frequent are open at the moment?  Or hope to open soon?  The usual haunts in my area have been open for some time but with reduced numbers of customers allowed in at one time [I believe it's currently 25% of capacity?] with hand sanitizer stations by the doors and masks and social-distancing required.  I haven't been to any charity shops in some time though.

Like you, I have an ample store of both CDs and LPs to work my way through too.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 03, 2021, 08:18:08 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 03, 2021, 02:13:20 AM
Glad that you are stockpiled up there Irons!  :)  What shops/stores that you like to frequent are open at the moment?  Or hope to open soon?  The usual haunts in my area have been open for some time but with reduced numbers of customers allowed in at one time [I believe it's currently 25% of capacity?] with hand sanitizer stations by the doors and masks and social-distancing required.  I haven't been to any charity shops in some time though.

Like you, I have an ample store of both CDs and LPs to work my way through too.

PD

Nothing open here PD, we are still in a midst of lockdown. Visiting your family is a criminal offence never mind a record shop!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 03, 2021, 08:39:52 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 03, 2021, 08:18:08 AM
Nothing open here PD, we are still in a midst of lockdown. Visiting your family is a criminal offence never mind a record shop!
Wow!  Probably smarter to do it 'your' way.  A number of POBs are worried about how certain states are dropping a lot of the restrictions and opening up things too quickly.  You'd think that with vaccines starting to roll out that folks could be patient for a few more months (Hard, I'm sure, if you own your own business though..plus it looks like unemployment benefits will be ending soon too).  :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 06, 2021, 01:22:37 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 01, 2021, 12:04:52 PM
:o  Oh, my!  Did you ever manage to get transferred to the record department?  I'm sure that they could have used you there.

PD
No PD but when I got another job in another department store I did work in the record dept. At Harrods I did at least spend my lunch breaks browsing round the record dept. and used my staff discount. The best discovery that I made there was Moeran's Symphony conducted by Neville Dilkes on LP. I had neither heard of the work or the composer and it has remained one of my favourite symphonies:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 06, 2021, 01:31:25 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 02, 2021, 07:07:13 AM
So, I'm curious as to where you guys are currently able to (and willing to go to these days) go to to shop for LPs at the moment?

PD
Just online PD (Amazon/discogs/ebay) but that has been the case for a long time before lockdown, as the old record shops have long disappeared.  :(
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 14, 2021, 03:56:28 AM
I was not sure where to put this so I have cross posted it from the Classical Listening thread.



The Four Seasons in Kyoto [Tosha Suiho]


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/817xXobmM7L._AC_SL1500_.jpg)


If you want to get into a Zen Zone this could well be the thing for you. It is very serene. The music is played on Japanese flute and is occasionally set against the background of singing birds, chanting monks as well as a gong and flowing water; but it is primarily solo flute playing. I will immediately say that this will not be for everybody. However, I found it to be very atmospheric, relaxing and peace inducing. The presentation is nicely laid out on four LPs with each season represented on each respective disc. It was a lovely purchase; the vinyl was in pristine condition.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2021, 03:11:48 AM
A few LP purchases yesterday (also posted in Latest acquisitions thread):

Martinu's Concertos Nos. 1 & 2 for Violin and Orchestra with Josef Suk, Neumann and the Czech Phil. Orch. on Supraphon
Gérard Souzay & Dalton Baldwin:  Songs of Poulenc on RCA Victor Red Seal
Panufnik's Sinfonia Sacra and Sinfonia Rustica with the Monte Carlo Opera Orchestra conducted by the composer on Unicorn

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/K5EAAMXQU6tQ9oIg/s-l300.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/SJQAAOSw5cNYElcw/s-l300.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/9uEAAOSww9VXgV32/s-l640.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 22, 2021, 08:13:03 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2021, 03:11:48 AM
A few LP purchases yesterday (also posted in Latest acquisitions thread):

Martinu's Concertos Nos. 1 & 2 for Violin and Orchestra with Josef Suk, Neumann and the Czech Phil. Orch. on Supraphon
Gérard Souzay & Dalton Baldwin:  Songs of Poulenc on RCA Victor Red Seal
Panufnik's Sinfonia Sacra and Sinfonia Rustica with the Monte Carlo Opera Orchestra conducted by the composer on Unicorn

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/K5EAAMXQU6tQ9oIg/s-l300.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/SJQAAOSw5cNYElcw/s-l300.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/9uEAAOSww9VXgV32/s-l640.jpg)

PD

I have the first and third on my shelves PD but perhaps the most unusual and the most interesting is Poulenc. Great purchase.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2021, 08:20:18 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 22, 2021, 08:13:03 AM
I have the first and third on my shelves PD but perhaps the most unusual and the most interesting is Poulenc. Great purchase.
Thanks!  A friend and I ventured into a record store [There were only three of us in there plus the two owners.  One owner left soon thereafter plus the other customer, so quite a bit of space between all of us.].  Per normal, I'm often the only one flipping through the classical LPs....though I did also look through the film section (hoping to find some Waxman/Gerhardt LPs)--which is right next to it.  My friend did also manage to find a Hollies LP in excellent shape there (the owner/wife had put it on and we were all enjoying it).

The Poulenc one is a Dynagroove (stereo vs. mono) one though in pristine shape.  Fingers crossed here.

PD

p.s.  I only have a tiny bit of Panufnik so this will be an experiment!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 22, 2021, 08:36:48 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2021, 08:20:18 AM
Thanks!  A friend and I ventured into a record store [There were only three of us in there plus the two owners.  One owner left soon thereafter plus the other customer, so quite a bit of space between all of us.].  Per normal, I'm often the only one flipping through the classical LPs....though I did also look through the film section (hoping to find some Waxman/Gerhardt LPs)--which is right next to it.  My friend did also manage to find a Hollies LP in excellent shape there (the owner/wife had put it on and we were all enjoying it).

The Poulenc one is a Dynagroove (stereo vs. mono) one though in pristine shape.  Fingers crossed here.

PD

p.s.  I only have a tiny bit of Panufnik so this will be an experiment!

Ah Dynagroove. RCA got an absolute kicking from American audiophiles for that. Decca for the British market retained the moniker but ignored the process for RCA Dynagroove LPs released under licence.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2021, 09:00:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 22, 2021, 08:36:48 AM
Ah Dynagroove. RCA got an absolute kicking from American audiophiles for that. Decca for the British market retained the moniker but ignored the process for RCA Dynagroove LPs released under licence.
Ah, I was confusing it with *Dynaflex in my mind.  Perhaps I might be able to exchange it for something else?  I've often shopped there.  If not, at least it wasn't expensive.  If nothing else, I could just take it as a learning/listening experience and see what it sounds like. 

*Been some time since I've read about labels and recordings news...and brain failed me!  :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2021, 09:32:06 AM
Irons,

Is this record listed like the ones that you were referring to in the UK?  Or do they say Decca on the label instead?

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/SB-6782-Songs-Of-Poulenc-Gerard-Souzay-Dalton-Baldwin-EXCELLENT-Stereo-RCA/363120160714?hash=item548ba5efca:g:ursAAOSwHUdfbuu0

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 23, 2021, 01:04:56 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2021, 09:32:06 AM
Irons,

Is this record listed like the ones that you were referring to in the UK?  Or do they say Decca on the label instead?

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/SB-6782-Songs-Of-Poulenc-Gerard-Souzay-Dalton-Baldwin-EXCELLENT-Stereo-RCA/363120160714?hash=item548ba5efca:g:ursAAOSwHUdfbuu0

PD

Yes they do. I have posted an example below. Coincidently both Poulenc and Nielsen were recorded in the same year. The Poulenc is, I think, a later pressing but still could be a Decca pressing but likely I think not. I know Decca transfer engineers dispensed with Dynagroove and probable other UK pressing plants would use the same masters.

By the way I would be more then happy to own that recording Dynagroove or not!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 23, 2021, 07:53:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 23, 2021, 01:04:56 AM
Yes they do. I have posted an example below. Coincidently both Poulenc and Nielsen were recorded in the same year. The Poulenc is, I think, a later pressing but still could be a Decca pressing but likely I think not. I know Decca transfer engineers dispensed with Dynagroove and probable other UK pressing plants would use the same masters.

By the way I would be more then happy to own that recording Dynagroove or not!
I'm rather confused as I thought that the sound was supposed to be horrible--at least with modern elliptical styluses?  The one that I had sent you a link to says "Manufactured by RCA, Ltd. England from master recordings" and doesn't say anything about Decca.  Well, I'll let you know how it turns out.

This is what my label looks like (and made in the US):  (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/-JkAAOSwqY5fbutJ/s-l64.jpg)  Whoops!  Came out pretty tiny.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 23, 2021, 08:35:15 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 23, 2021, 07:53:00 AM
I'm rather confused as I thought that the sound was supposed to be horrible--at least with modern elliptical styluses?  The one that I had sent you a link to says "Manufactured by RCA, Ltd. England from master recordings" and doesn't say anything about Decca.  Well, I'll let you know how it turns out.

This is what my label looks like (and made in the US):  (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/-JkAAOSwqY5fbutJ/s-l64.jpg)  Whoops!  Came out pretty tiny.

PD

Now you have me confused. Do you have a US or UK pressing? I for years would not touch digital LPs with a barge pole. I have since found many are quite good. The received wisdom is that Decca Phase 4 are poor due to multi-miked spotlighted recordings. My best Dvorak Symphony 9 is on Phrase 4. I would not throw out Dynagroove just because it is that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 23, 2021, 11:22:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 23, 2021, 08:35:15 AM
Now you have me confused. Do you have a US or UK pressing? I for years would not touch digital LPs with a barge pole. I have since found many are quite good. The received wisdom is that Decca Phase 4 are poor due to multi-miked spotlighted recordings. My best Dvorak Symphony 9 is on Phrase 4. I would not throw out Dynagroove just because it is that.
Sorry to be confusing.  I had mentioned (see above posting) that mine was made in the US.  I had included a (tiny) photo (found on Ebay) that gives you an idea as to what the label looks like (Notice the RCA and Red Seal are more contemporary).  Also, I found this to be of interest on Wiki...how accurate it is???  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynagroove

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 23, 2021, 12:12:10 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 22, 2021, 03:11:48 AM
A few LP purchases yesterday (also posted in Latest acquisitions thread):

Martinu's Concertos Nos. 1 & 2 for Violin and Orchestra with Josef Suk, Neumann and the Czech Phil. Orch. on Supraphon
Gérard Souzay & Dalton Baldwin:  Songs of Poulenc on RCA Victor Red Seal
Panufnik's Sinfonia Sacra and Sinfonia Rustica with the Monte Carlo Opera Orchestra conducted by the composer on Unicorn

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/K5EAAMXQU6tQ9oIg/s-l300.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/SJQAAOSw5cNYElcw/s-l300.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/9uEAAOSww9VXgV32/s-l640.jpg)

PD
I have/had the LPs of Panufnik and Martinu - both VG.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 23, 2021, 01:48:52 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 23, 2021, 12:12:10 PM
I have/had the LPs of Panufnik and Martinu - both VG.
Nice to hear.  :)  I love Martinu and the violinist Josef Suk, so I was very happy to see that one.  Panufnik--took a chance there but the works sounded interesting and the fact that he too was conducting them seemed like it could be a good thing.

In any event, pleased to hear that you enjoy them Jeffrey.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 24, 2021, 01:28:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 23, 2021, 01:48:52 PM
Nice to hear.  :)  I love Martinu and the violinist Josef Suk, so I was very happy to see that one.  Panufnik--took a chance there but the works sounded interesting and the fact that he too was conducting them seemed like it could be a good thing.

In any event, pleased to hear that you enjoy them Jeffrey.  :)

PD
I especially like the 'Rustica' and 'Sacra' symphonies PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 28, 2021, 07:19:39 AM
I have just read this article on Discogs on the storage of vinyl. A lot of it is common sense but it was written after consultation with one Harrison Behl, Reference Librarian of the Library of Congress in the US who has one of the largest record collections in the world. I thought that it might be relevant here and of interest.


Quote
How to Store Vinyl Records
Steven Williams posted March 19, 2021

A question many record collectors face is, "Where can I put all these records?" We'll do our best to answer by covering a variety of storage options and tips. Let's start by outlining the recommended, government-approved guidelines for how to store vinyl records.

The leading professional in media storage is the United States federal government. Yes, you read that right. They have one of the largest collections of records in the world, safely nestled in the remarkably dust-free archives of the Library of Congress. We reached out to staff librarians through the Recorded Sound Research Center and utilized their guide to storing audiovisual materials to learn how to store vinyl records properly.

A collector like you has an advantage when it comes to storing vinyl. Records are the most stable physical format developed to date. Unlike cassettes and CDs, they can last 100 years in a controlled environment. However, a wide range of variables — from dust and foreign matter to heat and pressure — can cause distortion and surface noise in playback. Also note that although vinyl records are relatively hardy, record covers are not. You'll want to keep in mind the fragility of the sleeve as much as the record itself.

We only pick the coolest stuff because we like it. However, when you purchase something through our affiliate links, Discogs may earn a commission.

Household Vinyl Record Storage

We'll start with the four core tenets of sound vinyl storage: heat, light, humidity, and pressure.

Heat: For home collections, room temperature or below is preferable. Room temperature, for those accustomed to living without air conditioning, is generally considered to be between 15 to 25 °C (59 to 77 °F). Make sure you keep those records clear of radiators, vents, and your kitchen appliances.
Light: Minimal exposure to all kinds of light and no exposure to direct or intense light. Vinyl records are most susceptible to ultraviolet light, which can damage records in just a few minutes. For best results, don't store your records near a bright window, a grow room, or a tanning bed.
Humidity: This is where vinyl record storage guidelines part ways from indoor plant care. Unlike your greenery, vinyl records should be stored in a relatively dry environment (about 35% to 40% relative humidity, or RH). Hygrometers are cheap and efficient tools that measure humidity.
Pressure: Don't stack things on your records. Don't stack your records on other records. We know it saves space, but sometimes life ain't that easy. In addition, do not store your records too tightly together. You should leave enough space to easily flip through your records.
Though less problematic than the rules above, there are a few other factors to consider when storing vinyl records.

Vibration: Despite whatever #goodvibes your records give off, their structural integrity can be compromised by strong vibrations. Keep your records a reasonable distance from speakers, washers and dryers, and stampedes of wild stallions. Here's a complete guide to reducing vibration.
Vinyl of a similar diameter, store together: Don't tuck your 12-inch records next to your 10-inch records. Separate records of a different diameter with a divider.


Best Record Storage Options

Now that you know the requirements for the location, let's talk a bit about what vinyl records should be stored in.

Use protection. Unlike grocery bags, paper is out and plastic is in. Commercial vinyl records may be stored in their original sleeve, but they should also be placed in a static-free polyethylene liner to avoid print-through from the original sleeve. Yes, we know, this is different than the paper liners most records come with. In addition to storing records in a plastic sleeve, you should store record covers in a plastic sleeve. To recap: put the record in a plastic sleeve and the album cover in a plastic sleeve. Turntable Lab has sets of inner sleeves, outer sleeves, and combo packs.
Ensure your shelving is sturdy enough to support the weight of vinyl records, which average 35 pounds per shelf-foot. All formats concentrate weight on the centerline of a shelf, which can cause some shelving to collapse.
To reduce static, opt for wood vinyl record storage containers instead of metal.
Once they are on a shelf, vinyl records should be stored with sturdy, immovable dividers (every 4 to 6 inches) that support the entire face of the disc in its sleeve. This recommendation is one that we rarely see used in the wild. A quick search will lead you to both relatively affordable and cool but indulgent resources that provide these. Dividers have the added benefit of helping in the quest to organize a vinyl record collection.

Overflow and Long-Term Record Storage

Many of us are at a place in our life where we have run out of room in our living quarters to store all of the records we have acquired. At this point, some tough decisions must be made: Which ones should be kept? Which ones can be let go? For those who cannot trim their collection, overflow storage becomes a necessity. Whether it's a basement, attic, or storage unit, there are some precautions you can take to ward off potential disasters.

Avoid any place susceptible to water damage (like your basement). Have you heard the story of what happened to Eyebeam Art and Technology Center in Hurricane Sandy? Though the vinyl itself is relatively resistant to water damage, record covers and labels are certainly not.
Avoid extreme temperatures and places where temperature fluctuations of more than 19°C (35°F) in 24 hours are possible (like your attic). Remember, no matter what kind of container you store your records in, they will be vulnerable to warping due to temperature.
You're going to want to ensure air circulation. This means you need to avoid storing your records in a sealed container of any kind, including plastic bins with lids or taped-up cardboard boxes. Sealing your records can lead to the creation of a damaging micro-climate and makes it more difficult to monitor their condition. Take care when using mobile vinyl crates – once you've made it to your destination, either open the box or remove the records from the case.
As a rule of thumb, attics and basements are typically not the best places to store vinyl records, though there are exceptions. Neither are non-climate controlled storage units. My parents made the mistake of storing their collection in a non-climate-controlled storage unit in Texas one summer. None of the discs made it out in a playable form. Try to find a place that is relatively clean, cool, and stable.


Record-Handling Tips

OK, now you know the cardinal rules to follow while storing records. You're welcome! While you're here, jot down some notes — or refresh your memory — on how to properly handle vinyl records.

Wash your hands before handling vinyl records. Those dirty paws of yours contain oils that can promote fungal growth on records and sleeves.
Handle any grooved discs (78s, 45s, LPs, lacquer discs, picture discs, even those Star Wars creature-shaped ones) by the edge and label areas only. This takes practice to get good at. What better time to start than now?
Keep your machines clean and well maintained. Make sure your mat is dust-free and replace your needles when they start to get worn folks. We've got more guides on how to clean your records, the best record-cleaning solutions, and how to take care of your stylus.


Resources

Author's note: I want to give credit to the Library of Congress and Reference Librarian, Harrison Behl, for assisting with this post. They were a huge help in leading me to informative resources and answering specific questions I had. If you're curious about the work they do or have questions that weren't answered above, check out the Recorded Sound Research Center, where you can read more and reach out to librarians for assistance. For those that are interested, I dropped some resources I used below:

Gilles St. Laurent's article: Written 20 years ago and still a standard today. I found this to be an excellent starting point in my research.
ARSC Guide to Audio Preservation: A collaboration between the Association of Recorded Sound Collections (ARSC) and the Council on Library and Information Resources (CLIR) contains chapters on care and handling of many different audio formats, as well as storage and digitization information. Geared towards archival professionals or the general public seeking an introduction to audio preservation.
ARSC listserv: A great resource for specific questions related to the care of audio collections. Beware, by signing up for this forum, you will get dozens of fascinating, but technical questions in your inbox.
The ARSC Journal: Archive of a popular journal that contains a wealth of detailed information on a wide range of topics, including preservation and care of audio materials.
The International Association of Sound Archives (IASA): They produce a journal and other publications related to the study of vinyl record storage.
The Sound Directions Project at the University of Indiana Bloomington: An organization that documents best practices for storage, preservation, and digitization.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on March 28, 2021, 06:15:34 PM
It's very interesting, thanks Fergus. Some of it is contradictory to other advice I've heard (e.g., about not packing records in tight--I have always left a little wiggle room as the article suggests). Nevertheless, as a serious collector of vinyl for over thirty years, it is amazing to me how durable the medium actually is. A number of records I've bought (used) have obviously not been cared for all that well, and yet they still sound quite good, with minimal surface noise or other damage--especially after cleaning and playing on a good turntable/arm/cartridge setup. The bit about light is also interesting, as I have a pretty bright LED light above my turntable, which illuminates things before, during, and after record play. I don't think ~20 minutes per side is going to fry them, but I will consider toning it down a bit, at least during play.

My former "high end" audio dealer/turntable guru (no less than Brooks Berdan himself) also insisted that the bit about stylus wear is bull, and that the real danger is lack of compliance in the suspension of the cartridge assembly, which occurs with age and will damage grooves. They recommend cartridge replacement ever five years. I will likely get yet another Sumiko Blue Point, but of course, he is nudging me to get the more expensive Hana...

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 29, 2021, 12:28:59 AM
All sensible advice aligreto and thanks for posting. The one important omission although mentioned, is cleaning and keeping records clean. For any serious collector a RCM is mandatory. After trying outer sleeves I found them too much of a faff and gave up on the idea. I replace all inner sleeves as a matter of course buying them from a company I have used for many years, Covers33. Mentioned in the article, and a big bugbear of mine is the correct handling of LPs. It is so annoying to purchase a treasured pre-loved LP in mint condition only to find under a strong light a clear finger/thumb print covering the first track which acts as a magnet for dust. I find Isopropyl Alcohol diluted by pure water removes fingerprints. I was shown how to correctly handle a LP when started collecting in the 1970's and now comes as second nature.

Interesting point made by André concerning cartridge suspension being the culprit of record wear over worn stylus. Not thought of that but does make sense.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 29, 2021, 03:33:07 AM
Cheers guys. When I meet someone new who claims to be a vinyl collector I always ask them to open and remove a disc on the pretext of showing me some detail or other. In the short time that it takes to do this and how they handle it reveals a multitude.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 29, 2021, 03:39:58 AM
Thanks for posting that Aligreto.  :)  I wonder how many collectors really have dividers every 4-6 inches?  :-\  I certainly don't!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 29, 2021, 07:16:05 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 29, 2021, 03:39:58 AM
Thanks for posting that Aligreto.  :)  I wonder how many collectors really have dividers every 4-6 inches?  :-\  I certainly don't!

PD

Mine are spaced every 13 inches but that is purely down to the construction of the shelving that they are housed in. Some of them are squeezed a bit tight though. I will have to try to thin them out with another attempt of the dreaded cull.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 29, 2021, 07:35:56 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 29, 2021, 07:16:05 AM
Mine are spaced every 13 inches but that is purely down to the construction of the shelving that they are housed in. Some of them are squeezed a bit tight though. I will have to try to thin them out with another attempt of the dreaded cull.
I understand.  Some of mine are a bit too tight too.  A friend has offered to make some proper shelving for them (I buy the wood) and I'm tempted!  I think that before I commit to that, however, I should get ride of some more stuff that I don't use/need.  Also, I don't want to feel like LPs are taking over my house!  ::)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 29, 2021, 11:20:08 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 29, 2021, 07:35:56 AM
I understand.  Some of mine are a bit too tight too.  A friend has offered to make some proper shelving for them (I buy the wood) and I'm tempted!  I think that before I commit to that, however, I should get ride of some more stuff that I don't use/need. Also, I don't want to feel like LPs are taking over my house!  ::)

PD

Why not? Seems a pretty good idea to me!  >:D :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 30, 2021, 01:40:19 AM
A well presented vinyl collection can really look very well. It can be a real feature in a room.

However, I do understand the requirement for other living space. But, if it was just down to me............... ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on March 30, 2021, 11:15:15 AM
Finding room for books is an even greater challenge for me. I am actually thinking of getting a second shed and turning it into a library. Then I'll have two sheds...  :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 30, 2021, 01:45:28 PM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on March 30, 2021, 11:15:15 AM
Finding room for books is an even greater challenge for me. I am actually thinking of getting a second shed and turning it into a library. Then I'll have two sheds...  :laugh:

Getting a shed to turn into a library is a neat idea. I was going to say that you will need to insulate against damp and cold but then I remembered where you live.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Archaic Torso of Apollo on March 30, 2021, 05:27:11 PM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on March 28, 2021, 06:15:34 PM
My former "high end" audio dealer/turntable guru (no less than Brooks Berdan himself) also insisted that the bit about stylus wear is bull, and that the real danger is lack of compliance in the suspension of the cartridge assembly, which occurs with age and will damage grooves. They recommend cartridge replacement ever five years. I will likely get yet another Sumiko Blue Point, but of course, he is nudging me to get the more expensive Hana...

Stylus wear is something I've wondered about. I've never worn out a stylus, and I have a strong suspicion that with good care, the active life of a stylus can be prolonged beyond the "official" life.

I have an Ortofon Blue which supposedly lasts 500-1000 hours. That leaves a lot of wiggle room. If I clean it often enough, it should go well beyond 1000 hours, I think.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 31, 2021, 02:30:40 AM
Quote from: Archaic Torso of Apollo on March 30, 2021, 05:27:11 PM
Stylus wear is something I've wondered about. I've never worn out a stylus, and I have a strong suspicion that with good care, the active life of a stylus can be prolonged beyond the "official" life.

I have an Ortofon Blue which supposedly lasts 500-1000 hours. That leaves a lot of wiggle room. If I clean it often enough, it should go well beyond 1000 hours, I think.

I use an Orthofon Rondo Blue which would be very near to its 1000 hour mark. I know that degradation is gradual but it still sounds very good to my ear and I believe that I can comfortably extend that life expectancy by at least 25%. I must state, however, that I do wash my vinyl and I am very careful about handling, storage etc.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Archaic Torso of Apollo on March 31, 2021, 06:46:29 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 31, 2021, 02:30:40 AM
I use an Orthofon Rondo Blue which would be very near to its 1000 hour mark. I know that degradation is gradual but it still sounds very good to my ear and I believe that I can comfortably extend that life expectancy by at least 25%. I must state, however, that I do wash my vinyl and I am very careful about handling, storage etc.

I wash my records, and after listening to an album or two, I dip the stylus in the Magic Eraser. It's a cheap but effective way to keep it clean.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 31, 2021, 09:14:40 AM
Quote from: Archaic Torso of Apollo on March 31, 2021, 06:46:29 AM
I wash my records, and after listening to an album or two, I dip the stylus in the Magic Eraser. It's a cheap but effective way to keep it clean.

Oh, I have seen the Magic Eraser method proposed many times over the years but you are the first person that I have come across who actually uses it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Archaic Torso of Apollo on March 31, 2021, 09:31:11 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 31, 2021, 09:14:40 AM
Oh, I have seen the Magic Eraser method proposed many times over the years but you are the first person that I have come across who actually uses it.

It actually works. My previous stylus had some dirt on it which was affecting playback, and the Eraser took the dirt right off. So now I use it for regular maintenance. Best of all it only costs a couple of bucks.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 01, 2021, 03:10:17 AM
Quote from: Archaic Torso of Apollo on March 31, 2021, 09:31:11 AM
It actually works. My previous stylus had some dirt on it which was affecting playback, and the Eraser took the dirt right off. So now I use it for regular maintenance. Best of all it only costs a couple of bucks.

It must be the cheapest fix in HiFi.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 01, 2021, 07:38:34 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 01, 2021, 03:10:17 AM
It must be the cheapest fix in HiFi.

With a steady hand.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 01, 2021, 04:19:21 PM
Quote from: Irons on April 01, 2021, 07:38:34 AM
With a steady hand.

A steady hand is always essential in this realm.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 01, 2021, 11:05:56 PM
This was one of my favourite Lyrita LPs. Unfortunately the works were issued on separate CDs:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 02, 2021, 05:48:41 AM
I thought that I would post this as it is unique in my collection. It is a double vinyl album but it is the only one in my collection which has a springback binding. The spine is metal.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 02, 2021, 05:52:02 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 02, 2021, 05:48:41 AM
I thought that I would post this as it is unique in my collection. It is a double vinyl album but it is the only one in my collection which has a springback binding. The spine is metal.
Interesting!  I've never seen one like that before.  How often did they manufacture ones like that?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 02, 2021, 07:10:47 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 01, 2021, 11:05:56 PM
This was one of my favourite Lyrita LPs. Unfortunately the works were issued on separate CDs:
(//)

Jeffrey, my first ever Lyrita LP purchase was the Berkeley 2nd Symphony and my most recent the 1st Symphony. Lyrita served Berkeley well with all three Symphonies along with a cracking issue of miscellaneous works. He seldom features in conversations of British composers because in my opinion he had his own voice and didn't go down the "cowpat" route. 

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 02, 2021, 08:35:32 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 02, 2021, 05:52:02 AM
Interesting!  I've never seen one like that before.  How often did they manufacture ones like that?

PD

I have no idea PD but I have never come across another one like it in all of my shopping and digging.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on April 02, 2021, 07:10:15 PM
Quote from: aligreto on April 02, 2021, 05:48:41 AM
I thought that I would post this as it is unique in my collection. It is a double vinyl album but it is the only one in my collection which has a springback binding. The spine is metal.

I have one like that of Anton Heiller--one of my favorite organists--playing Bach. It is Dutch Philips I believe--usually pretty good. Unfortunately, the sound quality is horrendous! I love the sound of vinyl and am used to listening to historic recordings--I find the mono recordings of the 30s - 50s, especially, and even some from the acoustic era to have a very beautiful quality! However, this one was basically unlistenable. It has nothing to do with the spiral binding of course, but just adding my 2 cents.

As for the cartridges, I was not necessarily saying that I agreed with the idea that cartridges need replacing every five years; I had a Blue Point that I used for nearly 15 years--albeit very low hours--before I had it replaced in 2016 and it performed flawlessly during the entire period. I replayed records with my new cartridge and noticed no hint of degradation whatsoever. Too bad I can't say the same for the suspension on the Oracle that failed after 3.5 years! STILL have not had that fixed...Too much going on with the pandemic, the death of my mother from it, and so on... Hopefully this summer life will stop being crappy and I will get it fixed (and go on vacation far from the Loss Angeles/HELL A area!)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 03, 2021, 12:19:12 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 02, 2021, 07:10:47 AM
Jeffrey, my first ever Lyrita LP purchase was the Berkeley 2nd Symphony and my most recent the 1st Symphony. Lyrita served Berkeley well with all three Symphonies along with a cracking issue of miscellaneous works. He seldom features in conversations of British composers because in my opinion he had his own voice and didn't go down the "cowpat" route.
Very interesting Lol and yes, that might explain, why he is relatively neglected. the Second Symphony is my favourite along with No.1 and, of course, they are coupled together on the Lyrita CD, (as are the piano concertos) with the nice cover painting of Berkeley from your LP. I have an odd feeling that I may have attended the first performance or maybe first London performance of Symphony No.4 which is possibly when I asked Berkeley to sign my concert programme. I'm not certain however. Anyway, I prefer the first two symphonies and the marvellous Concerto for Two Pianos (the companion to Symphony No.1 on that fine old Lyrita LP). Along with Cyril Scott's Piano Concerto No.1 (Ogdon/Herrmann)and Hadley's 'The Trees So High' (which I know you like) it was one of my favourite Lyrita LPs alongside the Bax and Rubbra symphony releases.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 03, 2021, 12:40:54 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on April 02, 2021, 07:10:15 PM
I have one like that of Anton Heiller--one of my favorite organists--playing Bach. It is Dutch Philips I believe--usually pretty good. Unfortunately, the sound quality is horrendous! I love the sound of vinyl and am used to listening to historic recordings--I find the mono recordings of the 30s - 50s, especially, and even some from the acoustic era to have a very beautiful quality! However, this one was basically unlistenable. It has nothing to do with the spiral binding of course, but just adding my 2 cents.

As for the cartridges, I was not necessarily saying that I agreed with the idea that cartridges need replacing every five years; I had a Blue Point that I used for nearly 15 years--albeit very low hours--before I had it replaced in 2016 and it performed flawlessly during the entire period. I replayed records with my new cartridge and noticed no hint of degradation whatsoever. Too bad I can't say the same for the suspension on the Oracle that failed after 3.5 years! STILL have not had that fixed...Too much going on with the pandemic, the death of my mother from it, and so on... Hopefully this summer life will stop being crappy and I will get it fixed (and go on vacation far from the Loss Angeles/HELL A area!)

Sorry to hear of the loss of your mother.

I purchased an Ortofon Kontrapunkt C eighteen years ago. After using the cartridge for about four years, at a special birthday I treated myself to a Koetsu and put the Ortofon away with all the other cartridges accumulated over the years. Reading about a company last year that refurbishes cartridges on a whim I sent them the Ortofon for a report. It transpired that the stylus was as good as new but reaffixing to the cantilever required. That and cleaning after disassembly was all that needed to be done. The cartridge tested well and more importantly impressive in listening tests. I am currently using the Ortofon which is nearly twenty years old in my system.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 03, 2021, 12:53:18 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 03, 2021, 12:19:12 AM
Very interesting Lol and yes, that might explain, why he is relatively neglected. the Second Symphony is my favourite along with No.1 and, of course, they are coupled together on the Lyrita CD, (as are the piano concertos) with the nice cover painting of Berkeley from your LP. I have an odd feeling that I may have attended the first performance or maybe first London performance of Symphony No.4 which is possibly when I asked Berkeley to sign my concert programme. I'm not certain however. Anyway, I prefer the first two symphonies and the marvellous Concerto for Two Pianos (the companion to Symphony No.1 on that fine old Lyrita LP). Along with Cyril Scott's Piano Concerto No.1 (Ogdon/Herrmann)and Hadley's 'The Trees So High' (which I know you like) it was one of my favourite Lyrita LPs alongside the Bax and Rubbra symphony releases.

Ah, there is a fourth Jeffrey, not aware of that. The third is more "difficult" then the first two. Favourite Lyrita recordings? That could be a thread all of it's own. Hardly gets a mention but I like the Scott 2nd PC too. Lets not forget Moeran or Finzi ...... I give up, the list is endless!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on April 03, 2021, 04:36:17 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 01, 2021, 11:05:56 PM
This was one of my favourite Lyrita LPs. Unfortunately the works were issued on separate CDs:
(//)

I still have that one ...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on April 03, 2021, 04:38:47 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 02, 2021, 05:48:41 AM
I thought that I would post this as it is unique in my collection. It is a double vinyl album but it is the only one in my collection which has a springback binding. The spine is metal.

As far as I know, Ahlgrimm was the first  to record Bach's (almost) complete harpsichord works (Philips 1952). About 40 years ago I acquired the LPs you own. I have to say, that I found the interpretation very pedestrian and also found the monstrous instrument (Ammer pedal harpsichord) less suited for these small-scale works. Also as far as I recall, she doesn't do any repeats in the suites, thereby virtually truncating them. So I didn't take it with me into the digital age. However I also purchased her WTC and AoF in a newer Philips LP (1977) release, and as I appreciate her playing in these works far more, I have made a digital copy of these.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on April 03, 2021, 04:39:23 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 03, 2021, 12:40:54 AM
Sorry to hear of the loss of your mother.

(...)

My condolences too.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on April 03, 2021, 04:40:56 AM
Quote from: (: premont :) on April 03, 2021, 04:38:47 AM
As far as I know, Ahlgrimm was the first  to record Bach's (almost) complete harpsichord works (Philips 1952). About 40 years ago I acquired the LPs you own. I have to say, that I found the interpretation very pedestrian and also found the monstrous instrument (Ammer pedal harpsichord) less suited for these small-scale works. Also as far as I recall, she doesn't do any repeats in the suites, thereby virtually truncating them. So I didn't take it with me into the digital age. However I also purchased her WTC and AoF in a newer Philips LP (1977) release, and as I appreciate her playing in these works far more, I have made a digital copy of these.

What I heard of old Ahlgrimm recordings didn't sparkle either, but others might disagree.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on April 03, 2021, 04:44:13 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on April 03, 2021, 04:39:23 AM
My condolences too.

And mine.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on April 03, 2021, 04:53:39 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on April 02, 2021, 07:10:15 PM
I have one like that of Anton Heiller--one of my favorite organists--playing Bach. It is Dutch Philips I believe--usually pretty good. Unfortunately, the sound quality is horrendous!

Anton Heiller was the second (Philips 1952) to record Bach's almost complete organ works. Walcha was the first (Archiv 1947-52). I have never seen other volumes of Heiller's set for sale than the one with the toccatas. As you write the sound quality was very, very poor. This may be the reason why the set is completely forgotten to day. He re-recorded some of the works for Vanguard and Amadeo in much better sound. These newer recordings represent - as it was to be expected - a kind of proto HIP paticularly concerning registrations and articulation, and it would have been interesting to hear how informed his 1952 recording was.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 03, 2021, 05:14:16 AM
Quote from: André Le Nôtre on April 02, 2021, 07:10:15 PM

As for the cartridges, I was not necessarily saying that I agreed with the idea that cartridges need replacing every five years; I had a Blue Point that I used for nearly 15 years--albeit very low hours--before I had it replaced in 2016 and it performed flawlessly during the entire period. I replayed records with my new cartridge and noticed no hint of degradation whatsoever. Too bad I can't say the same for the suspension on the Oracle that failed after 3.5 years! STILL have not had that fixed...Too much going on with the pandemic, the death of my mother from it, and so on... Hopefully this summer life will stop being crappy and I will get it fixed (and go on vacation far from the Loss Angeles/HELL A area!)

My sincerest condolences on the death of your mother.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 03, 2021, 05:15:25 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 03, 2021, 12:40:54 AM

I purchased an Ortofon Kontrapunkt C eighteen years ago. After using the cartridge for about four years, at a special birthday I treated myself to a Koetsu and put the Ortofon away with all the other cartridges accumulated over the years. Reading about a company last year that refurbishes cartridges on a whim I sent them the Ortofon for a report. It transpired that the stylus was as good as new but reaffixing to the cantilever required. That and cleaning after disassembly was all that needed to be done. The cartridge tested well and more importantly impressive in listening tests. I am currently using the Ortofon which is nearly twenty years old in my system.

An interesting story and good for you! As a matter of interest, how did you find the Koetsu?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 03, 2021, 07:15:03 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 03, 2021, 05:15:25 AM
An interesting story and good for you! As a matter of interest, how did you find the Koetsu?

A Koetsu Rosewood - and safe to say the same applies to the more exotic Koetsu - is not an allrounder. The midrange (which is the most important) is liquid gold but the bass is loose and treble curtailed. In some respects a magical cartridge. Oddly, no markings and nilch documentation on tracking force etc.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 03, 2021, 10:48:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 03, 2021, 07:15:03 AM
A Koetsu Rosewood - and safe to say the same applies to the more exotic Koetsu - is not an allrounder. The midrange (which is the most important) is liquid gold but the bass is loose and treble curtailed. In some respects a magical cartridge. Oddly, no markings and nilch documentation on tracking force etc.

Very interesting description of its capabilities; thank you for that.
How did you eventually sort it out? Was it by trial and error, researching on the web or contacting them directly?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 03, 2021, 11:21:40 PM
Quote from: aligreto on April 03, 2021, 05:14:16 AM
My sincerest condolences on the death of your mother.

+1 Very sorry to hear that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 04, 2021, 12:40:19 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 03, 2021, 10:48:11 AM
Very interesting description of its capabilities; thank you for that.
How did you eventually sort it out? Was it by trial and error, researching on the web or contacting them directly?

Thanks. For VTF I used the Cartridge Database at Vinyl Engine. My tonearm is a fixed head shell type so at the best of times installing a cartridge is problematic. Without colour coding on cartridge body wiring the four tonearm wires upside down is a nightmare. The Koetsu has a longer body then standard which adds to the fun. I find the easiest cartridges to install are Audio-Technica.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 05, 2021, 02:51:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 04, 2021, 12:40:19 AM
Thanks. For VTF I used the Cartridge Database at Vinyl Engine. My tonearm is a fixed head shell type so at the best of times installing a cartridge is problematic. Without colour coding on cartridge body wiring the four tonearm wires upside down is a nightmare. The Koetsu has a longer body then standard which adds to the fun. I find the easiest cartridges to install are Audio-Technica.

Yes, all in a day's work for a vinyl enthusiast. Thankfully cart changes are not too frequent.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 07, 2021, 12:01:32 PM
The Poetry of Thomas Hardy read by Richard Burton


(https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/224052165085_/Richard-Burton-The-Poetry-Of-Thomas-Hardy-Caedmon.jpg)


As a young man I devoured the writings of Hardy. Burton's voice is one that echoes through the ages. It is just such a pleasure to listen to him speaking.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 08, 2021, 06:33:55 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 07, 2021, 12:01:32 PM
The Poetry of Thomas Hardy read by Richard Burton


(https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/224052165085_/Richard-Burton-The-Poetry-Of-Thomas-Hardy-Caedmon.jpg)


As a young man I devoured the writings of Hardy. Burton's voice is one that echoes through the ages. It is just such a pleasure to listen to him speaking.

Settings of Hardy by British composers are endless and listening to song I have come to realise the genius of him.

Argo made a speciality of issuing spoken word on LP.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 08, 2021, 06:41:05 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 07, 2021, 12:01:32 PM
The Poetry of Thomas Hardy read by Richard Burton


(https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/224052165085_/Richard-Burton-The-Poetry-Of-Thomas-Hardy-Caedmon.jpg)


As a young man I devoured the writings of Hardy. Burton's voice is one that echoes through the ages. It is just such a pleasure to listen to him speaking.
'The Darkling Thrush' by Thomas Hardy is one of my favourite poems. The rather tragic figure of Robert Milford based a rather beautiful (purely orchestral) tone poem on it. I wonder if you or Lol know it. There is a Dutton CD recording:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 08, 2021, 06:45:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 08, 2021, 06:33:55 AM
Settings of Hardy by British composers are endless and listening to song I have come to realise the genius of him.

Argo made a speciality of issuing spoken word on LP.

I also have some recording of and by Dylan Thomas but I cannot remember which label they are on.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 08, 2021, 06:46:03 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 08, 2021, 06:41:05 AM
'The Darkling Thrush' by Thomas Hardy is one of my favourite poems. The rather tragic figure of Robert Milford based a rather beautiful (purely orchestral) tone poem on it. I wonder if you or Lol know it. There is a Dutton CD recording:
(//)

I may have read it but I honestly do not remember it, Jeffrey, to be honest. I will look it up.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 08, 2021, 08:44:48 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 08, 2021, 06:46:03 AM
I may have read it but I honestly do not remember it, Jeffrey, to be honest. I will look it up.
Yes, do Fergus - I think that it's very special. I first heard it when the bishop of Oxford used it for his BBC Radio 4 'Thought for the Day' which I had tuned into on my way to work. By the way, the composer whom I mentioned earlier was Robin (not Robert) Milford.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 09, 2021, 03:45:21 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 08, 2021, 08:44:48 AM
Yes, do Fergus - I think that it's very special. I first heard it when the bishop of Oxford used it for his BBC Radio 4 'Thought for the Day' which I had tuned into on my way to work. By the way, the composer whom I mentioned earlier was Robin (not Robert) Milford.

See the Poetry thread Jeffrey.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 10, 2021, 12:29:03 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 09, 2021, 03:45:21 AM
See the Poetry thread Jeffrey.
I've just seen it. Thank you for doing that Fergus. I think that it's my favourite poem.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 16, 2021, 06:48:59 AM
A distinct sense of freedom today. Online without argument, is the best way to build a collection but nothing beats the thrill of entering a bricks and mortar record shop and coming across something special that is beyond your radar. Nothing mind-blowing today but felt good getting back in the saddle. -

Hoddinott: Landscapes, PC No.3, Sinfonietta No.2. Woodward, New Philharmonia, Schonzeller. RCA.

Ostrcil: Sinfonietta, Impromptu. Prague SO, Belohlavek. Supraphon.

Wilfred Josephs: Requiem. Adelaide SO, Measham. Unicorn.

Prokofiev: Symphonies 1 & 7. LSO Weller. Decca.

Penderecki: Symphony. LSO Penderecki. EMI.

English songs: Ian & Jennifer Partridge. Oxford University Press (double LP).

Not much of interest on the CD front, lots of Beethoven, Mozart etc. But cheaper then LPs (Oxfam pushing their luck hear at times) at mostly £I.99. I found two that appealed -

Haydn: Symphonies 39, 70, 73, and 75. The Esterhazy Orchestra, David Blum. Vanguard Classics.

Moeran: Cello Concerto, Serenade, Lonely Waters, Whythorne's Shadow. Guy Johnston, Ulster Orchestra, Falletta. Naxos.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 16, 2021, 07:25:35 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 16, 2021, 06:48:59 AM
A distinct sense of freedom today. Online without argument, is the best way to build a collection but nothing beats the thrill of entering a bricks and mortar record shop and coming across something special that is beyond your radar. Nothing mind-blowing today but felt good getting back in the saddle. -

Hoddinott: Landscapes, PC No.3, Sinfonietta No.2. Woodward, New Philharmonia, Schonzeller. RCA.

Ostrcil: Sinfonietta, Impromptu. Prague SO, Belohlavek. Supraphon.

Wilfred Josephs: Requiem. Adelaide SO, Measham. Unicorn.

Prokofiev: Symphonies 1 & 7. LSO Weller. Decca.

Penderecki: Symphony. LSO Penderecki. EMI.

English songs: Ian & Jennifer Partridge. Oxford University Press (double LP).

Not much of interest on the CD front, lots of Beethoven, Mozart etc. But cheaper then LPs (Oxfam pushing their luck hear at times) at mostly £I.99. I found two that appealed -

Haydn: Symphonies 39, 70, 73, and 75. The Esterhazy Orchestra, David Blum. Vanguard Classics.

Moeran: Cello Concerto, Serenade, Lonely Waters, Whythorne's Shadow. Guy Johnston, Ulster Orchestra, Falletta. Naxos.
Excellent Lol - the Moeran CD gets my top vote!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 16, 2021, 07:57:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 16, 2021, 06:48:59 AM
A distinct sense of freedom today. Online without argument, is the best way to build a collection but nothing beats the thrill of entering a bricks and mortar record shop and coming across something special that is beyond your radar. Nothing mind-blowing today but felt good getting back in the saddle. -

Hoddinott: Landscapes, PC No.3, Sinfonietta No.2. Woodward, New Philharmonia, Schonzeller. RCA.

Ostrcil: Sinfonietta, Impromptu. Prague SO, Belohlavek. Supraphon.

Wilfred Josephs: Requiem. Adelaide SO, Measham. Unicorn.

Prokofiev: Symphonies 1 & 7. LSO Weller. Decca.

Penderecki: Symphony. LSO Penderecki. EMI.

English songs: Ian & Jennifer Partridge. Oxford University Press (double LP).

Not much of interest on the CD front, lots of Beethoven, Mozart etc. But cheaper then LPs (Oxfam pushing their luck hear at times) at mostly £I.99. I found two that appealed -

Haydn: Symphonies 39, 70, 73, and 75. The Esterhazy Orchestra, David Blum. Vanguard Classics.

Moeran: Cello Concerto, Serenade, Lonely Waters, Whythorne's Shadow. Guy Johnston, Ulster Orchestra, Falletta. Naxos.
I have that English Songs album...will put it on soon.  :)  Looks like you had a nice haul too!  Which Oxfam shop to you like to visit by the way?

And how are you feeling after your second jab so far?

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 16, 2021, 11:34:21 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 16, 2021, 07:25:35 AM
Excellent Lol - the Moeran CD gets my top vote!

Good to know, Jeffrey. By the way, have you heard Josephs Requiem? Not had a chance to listen yet but the back history of the work and the use of a String Quintet makes intriguing reading. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 16, 2021, 11:52:39 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 16, 2021, 07:57:11 AM
I have that English Songs album...will put it on soon.  :)  Looks like you had a nice haul too!  Which Oxfam shop to you like to visit by the way?

And how are you feeling after your second jab so far?

PD

I am a creature of habit PD but I guess you already know that ::). Farnham. I didn't realise the music department of Oxford University issued LPs. A professional project with Anthony Howell as sound engineer and German pressing. I listened to side 1 of Warlock songs and impressed with the clear diction of Ian Partridge.

Paul has a sore arm but I have had no reaction from jab.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 17, 2021, 04:22:57 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 16, 2021, 11:52:39 PM
I am a creature of habit PD but I guess you already know that ::). Farnham. I didn't realise the music department of Oxford University issued LPs. A professional project with Anthony Howell as sound engineer and German pressing. I listened to side 1 of Warlock songs and impressed with the clear diction of Ian Partridge.

Paul has a sore arm but I have had no reaction from jab.
I had forgotten which one you liked to frequent (getting old I guess).  Glad that you are enjoying it.  I watched a movie last night instead.

A friend of mine had a similar reaction when he received his second dose (forget which one he got).  Said it felt like someone had hit him with a softball.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 17, 2021, 11:03:28 PM
Quote from: Irons on April 16, 2021, 11:34:21 PM
Good to know, Jeffrey. By the way, have you heard Josephs Requiem? Not had a chance to listen yet but the back history of the work and the use of a String Quintet makes intriguing reading.
Yes Lol, as it's on a Lyrita double CD set with Symphony No.5. I haven't heard it for a long time and should give it another hearing soon.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 19, 2021, 02:24:34 AM
Music from the works of James Joyce


(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/HKYGa1nWKytGsMe8LE5hEkbz3PckjJ3dnvbeVlFpirjdjFE1QPj9sgWD8qttFHqOM9RjRgL3Mu771043UO_nT_2PJhO3Pa17Od72WP58uHygEw4)


This album contains the music mentioned by Joyce in his works. It is all appropriately performed by a tenor [McDermottt] and a pianist [Richey]. It also includes Joyce's only known composition Bid Adieu to Girlish Days. These are good performances of their type.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 22, 2021, 02:04:48 AM
I came across these images of a lady who obviously likes her vinyl....


(https://thevinylfactory.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/gladys-palmera.jpg)   (https://oncubatravel.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Gladys-Palmera-Cortesia-2.jpg)



PD take note  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 22, 2021, 05:20:33 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 22, 2021, 02:04:48 AM
I came across these images of a lady who obviously likes her vinyl....


(https://thevinylfactory.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/gladys-palmera.jpg)   (https://oncubatravel.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Gladys-Palmera-Cortesia-2.jpg)


PD take note  8)
Oh, cool! I suspect that she had a specially-for-her built house though!  Love that she has library ladders too!  Did you notice that in the second picture that in the room beyond, there are compact bookstacks/movable track shelving.  More LPs?  Or is that where she keeps her books?  ;D 

Ah, I just checked out the article (haven't watched the film yet); looks like most of it is Latin and Caribbean music?   :)    https://thevinylfactory.com/films/gladys-palmera-latin-american-vinyl/
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 22, 2021, 07:10:13 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 22, 2021, 05:20:33 AM
Oh, cool! I suspect that she had a specially-for-her built house though!  Love that she has library ladders too!  Did you notice that in the second picture that in the room beyond, there are compact bookstacks/movable track shelving.  More LPs?  Or is that where she keeps her books?  ;D 

No, it is all vinyl. Her books are in another part of the house.


QuoteAh, I just checked out the article (haven't watched the film yet); looks like most of it is Latin and Caribbean music?   :)    https://thevinylfactory.com/films/gladys-palmera-latin-american-vinyl/

Yes, she apparently specializes in Latin and Caribbean music.

I did watch the film. It is in Spanish and I speak no Spanish but it was still interesting.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 22, 2021, 07:29:29 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 22, 2021, 07:10:13 AM
No, it is all vinyl. Her books are in another part of the house.


Yes, she apparently specializes in Latin and Caribbean music.

I did watch the film. It is in Spanish and I speak no Spanish but it was still interesting.
And a radio station too!  8)  I watched some of the longer film.  Am having trouble finding their shorter version with the subtitles though.  Any idea where one can see that Fergus?

PD

EDIT:  Never mind, I found it.  It's here:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfFdSRkpqbM
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 22, 2021, 02:18:30 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 22, 2021, 07:29:29 AM
And a radio station too!  8)  I watched some of the longer film.  Am having trouble finding their shorter version with the subtitles though.  Any idea where one can see that Fergus?

PD

EDIT:  Never mind, I found it.  It's here:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfFdSRkpqbM

Thank you for the link, PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 23, 2021, 04:01:55 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 22, 2021, 02:18:30 PM
Thank you for the link, PD.
You're welcome Fergus.  :)  I found it to be quite interesting (both of them actually, though like you, I don't speak Spanish so the original version was lost on me in many respects).  Found it to be quite amazing that she went from (originally asked) hosting a radio program to starting her own radio stations in three cities in Spain!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 23, 2021, 06:06:07 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 23, 2021, 04:01:55 AM
You're welcome Fergus.  :)  I found it to be quite interesting (both of them actually, though like you, I don't speak Spanish so the original version was lost on me in many respects).  Found it to be quite amazing that she went from (originally asked) hosting a radio program to starting her own radio stations in three cities in Spain!

PD

Yes, indeed, PD. I found her and her collection fascinating especially that really thick vinyl and the huge one which must be nearly 24". Wonderful.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 23, 2021, 08:08:47 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 23, 2021, 06:06:07 AM
Yes, indeed, PD. I found her and her collection fascinating especially that really thick vinyl and the huge one which must be nearly 24". Wonderful.
Trying to recall what I read ages ago about those huge (wide) records.  Weren't they used for awhile in radio stations?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 23, 2021, 01:20:08 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 23, 2021, 08:08:47 AM
Trying to recall what I read ages ago about those huge (wide) records.  Weren't they used for awhile in radio stations?

PD

I honestly have never seen them before. I do not know how they would be played. Surely a very large platter would be required?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 24, 2021, 12:19:02 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 23, 2021, 01:20:08 PM
I honestly have never seen them before. I do not know how they would be played. Surely a very large platter would be required?

They are called Transcription discs mainly used by radio stations. I have seen a BBC modified Garrard 401 with an enlarged platter.

Edit: https://youtu.be/v85ZZrxihw8
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 24, 2021, 12:45:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 24, 2021, 12:19:02 AM
They are called Transcription discs mainly used by radio stations. I have seen a BBC modified Garrard 401 with an enlarged platter.

Edit: https://youtu.be/v85ZZrxihw8

Great, and thank you for the link also.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 27, 2021, 11:53:59 PM
Classics and Vinyl for their latest upload feature Sinfonia Concertante by Malcolm Williamson. A most imaginative choice which I enjoyed greatly.

https://youtu.be/Fn1tosJMIT4
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 28, 2021, 04:55:10 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 27, 2021, 11:53:59 PM
Classics and Vinyl for their latest upload feature Sinfonia Concertante by Malcolm Williamson. A most imaginative choice which I enjoyed greatly.

https://youtu.be/Fn1tosJMIT4

I enjoyed that, thank you.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 28, 2021, 06:13:45 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 28, 2021, 04:55:10 AM
I enjoyed that, thank you.

Kicking myself! Came across the double LP between lockdowns and passed as already having the VC included on my shelves.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 28, 2021, 07:02:51 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 28, 2021, 06:13:45 AM
Kicking myself! Came across the double LP between lockdowns and passed as already having the VC included on my shelves.

You can't get them all but, yes, I hate when that happens.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 29, 2021, 07:47:29 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 28, 2021, 07:02:51 AM
You can't get them all but, yes, I hate when that happens.

Whenever I'm sensible I end up regretting it and not only collecting records! :D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 29, 2021, 08:23:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 29, 2021, 07:47:29 AM
Whenever I'm sensible I end up regretting it and not only collecting records! :D

:laugh:

Well you know what to do, so  ;)  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: geralmar on April 29, 2021, 01:18:17 PM
One of the odder L.P.s in my collection:

(https://i.postimg.cc/5tNkkCtC/R-3099354-1469327918-6721-jpeg.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
1981

(https://i.postimg.cc/90GpfmM2/R-3099354-1469327919-3158-jpeg.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)

All I lack is an elevator.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 30, 2021, 09:01:18 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 29, 2021, 07:47:29 AM
Whenever I'm sensible I end up regretting it and not only collecting records! :D
:laugh:  Hard to get everything in life right!

Quote from: geralmar on April 29, 2021, 01:18:17 PM
One of the odder L.P.s in my collection:

(https://i.postimg.cc/5tNkkCtC/R-3099354-1469327918-6721-jpeg.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
1981

(https://i.postimg.cc/90GpfmM2/R-3099354-1469327919-3158-jpeg.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)

All I lack is an elevator.


lol Personally, if I came across that LP, I think that I might recoil in horror and run away screaming.  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on April 30, 2021, 04:02:10 PM
Muzak gets a bad rap, but I actually kind of enjoy it in the background in some settings--the airport for example.

I can also tell you that I'd rather listen to Muzak than much of what passes for "music" in our society. (Does that make me a snob? I hope so!  :P  )
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 04, 2021, 01:08:50 AM
New purchase (from Sweden):
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 23, 2021, 12:46:33 AM
Meagre pickings from a visit to Farnham Oxfam yesterday. Possibly down to Covid but both LP and CD sections had little of interest. My grand total was a single LP of wind music and a Naxos CD of orchestral pieces by Holst. A couple of Audiophile LPs on the Sheffield Lab direct to disc label sparked interest. I recall Sheffield Lab being sought after in the 1970's especially by American Audiophiles. Each featured Leinsdorf conducting with bleeding chunks of Wagner and Prokofiev's "Romeo and Juliet". Not bad at £9 a pop but decided not to purchase.

A trip to the capital and "Classical Exchange" is long overdue.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on May 23, 2021, 12:50:44 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 22, 2021, 02:04:48 AM
I came across these images of a lady who obviously likes her vinyl....


(https://thevinylfactory.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/gladys-palmera.jpg)   (https://oncubatravel.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Gladys-Palmera-Cortesia-2.jpg)



PD take note  8)

Very impressive  8).

I read somewhere that Elton John pays a person as a librarian to deal with his music collection; this is also such a library on a professional level ... a good source for those radio stations, for sure.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 23, 2021, 02:34:04 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on May 23, 2021, 12:50:44 AM
Very impressive  8).

I read somewhere that Elton John pays a person as a librarian to deal with his music collection; this is also such a library on a professional level ... a good source for those radio stations, for sure.
I wonder whether or not the music librarian is there to deal with cataloging his personal recordings or his own music collection overall or a combo of both?  Years ago, I knew someone who worked for a while with Paul Simon in terms of coming up with a system and cataloging his personal recordings.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 23, 2021, 03:08:42 AM
New arrival:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 23, 2021, 04:25:37 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 23, 2021, 03:08:42 AM
New arrival:

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=73918;image)

Straight back to your "Cat Thread" at the earliest opportunity after your recent family celebrations. Congratulations to one and all concerned, Jeffrey  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 23, 2021, 06:14:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 23, 2021, 12:46:33 AM
Meagre pickings from a visit to Farnham Oxfam yesterday. Possibly down to Covid but both LP and CD sections had little of interest. My grand total was a single LP of wind music and a Naxos CD of orchestral pieces by Holst. A couple of Audiophile LPs on the Sheffield Lab direct to disc label sparked interest. I recall Sheffield Lab being sought after in the 1970's especially by American Audiophiles. Each featured Leinsdorf conducting with bleeding chunks of Wagner and Prokofiev's "Romeo and Juliet". Not bad at £9 a pop but decided not to purchase.

A trip to the capital and "Classical Exchange" is long overdue.
Soon we will be able to get out more!
Quote from: aligreto on May 23, 2021, 04:25:37 AM
Straight back to your "Cat Thread" at the earliest opportunity after your recent family celebrations. Congratulations to one and all concerned, Jeffrey  :)
Cool cover; I hope that you enjoy the music.  And, sorry, I missed what the celebrations were about (or was this private message?  If that's the case, please ignore my inquiry!).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 23, 2021, 06:31:07 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 23, 2021, 06:14:04 AM
And, sorry, I missed what the celebrations were about (or was this private message?  If that's the case, please ignore my inquiry!).

PD

His daughter was very recently married  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 23, 2021, 06:34:55 AM
Quote from: aligreto on May 23, 2021, 06:31:07 AM
His daughter was very recently married  :)
Oh, cool!  I remember him telling us that she was engaged.  :)

I can see the light emerging through the clouds....

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 23, 2021, 07:51:04 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 23, 2021, 06:34:55 AM
Oh, cool!  I remember him telling us that she was engaged.  :)

I can see the light emerging through the clouds....

PD

Are those clouds of insect repellent PD?  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 23, 2021, 08:19:06 AM
Quote from: aligreto on May 23, 2021, 07:51:04 AM
Are those clouds of insect repellent PD?  ;D
Somedays, yes....followed by yours truly wrinkling up her nose in distaste to the odor and a goodly amount of coughing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 24, 2021, 06:06:17 AM
Quote from: aligreto on May 23, 2021, 04:25:37 AM
Straight back to your "Cat Thread" at the earliest opportunity after your recent family celebrations. Congratulations to one and all concerned, Jeffrey  :)
Absolutely right Fergus! I had to make up for a considerable amount of missed 'Cat Thread' time on my return. The 'cat thread' actually came up in the conversation at the pub after the marriage ceremony - so you see how central it is to my life. I had to give a lengthy explanation to my charming new Canadian son-in-law.

Thanks very much for your good wishes  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 24, 2021, 06:21:56 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 23, 2021, 06:14:04 AM
Soon we will be able to get out more!Cool cover; I hope that you enjoy the music.  And, sorry, I missed what the celebrations were about (or was this private message?  If that's the case, please ignore my inquiry!).

PD
Hi PD - I wanted to post something about it (my daughter's wedding) but the 'Ippolitov-Ivanov' thread, or some such similar place, didn't seem to be the right place ( 8)). So, I placed it in the 'What do you look like' thread? - but, you've caught up with it already.
:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 30, 2021, 12:23:19 AM
"It sounds like cardboard". ;D

Potted history of Mercury Living Presence. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzNf-mIQDtY
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on May 30, 2021, 03:05:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 30, 2021, 12:23:19 AM
"It sounds like cardboard". ;D

Potted history of Mercury Living Presence. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzNf-mIQDtY

I enjoyed that.
She was truly remarkable.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 31, 2021, 06:36:16 AM
Quote from: aligreto on May 30, 2021, 03:05:31 AM
I enjoyed that.
She was truly remarkable.

Pleased it was of interest.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: George O on June 02, 2021, 12:55:33 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 23, 2021, 03:08:42 AM
New arrival:


Good to see that someone else has this album in his collection.

(https://i.postimg.cc/bJ4TcPB1/417-D1-C9-C-6772-4020-9-A7-F-5-B395-A790-B13.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/R6QfKk90)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 04, 2021, 02:31:46 AM
Here is a recent interesting article posted on the Discogs website:

Anatomy of a Record Collector:

By analyzing Collections in the Database, Discogs found compelling insights into how many releases people collect, the average value of these collections, and which albums are most collected around the world. Through a series of surveys to Discogs' most engaged fans, we also uncovered details surrounding what, why, and how people embrace their collections. How do they organize their music? Do they prefer color vinyl over standard black? And what other kinds of record variants do they collect? What follows is a snapshot of the typical visitor to Discogs right now.


On average, the 3 million collectors on Discogs, defined by the number of users who added at least one item in their Collections, have 184 releases. The largest individual collector on Discogs has more than 512,279 releases — 2,780 times the average collection size.


Considering the value of the average collection, it makes sense that vinyl fans want to take good care of their music. When asked how they organize their collections, alphabetical-by-artist was overwhelmingly the most common way to organize their music. According to the survey, 60% of respondents use this method, while 18% organize them by genre and 8% say they don't organize at all.


The Discogs Database contains more than 14 million releases maintained by a large, loyal group of contributors who regularly submit new music and continuously provide updates to existing submissions. The Database includes recordings that date back to the 1800s, album details such as tracklist and release date, information on a variety of recorded music formats, and data about limited variants coveted by die-hard music fans and hardcore collectors.


Just over 51% of Discogs collectors have more than one version or copy of an album in their possession. Audiophiles might own multiple pressings of a record purely to pursue a superior listening experience, but some collectors prospect vinyl variants based on scarcity and demand, which brings us to the much-debated topic of limited editions.


Discogs users boldly defined what makes a limited-edition vinyl record: 78% of the Community believe 1,000 copies or less is the preferred run for a limited-edition pressing. And 38% of those polled stated a run of 500 or less is truly a limited release. Music fans have spoken, and this data should be heeded by labels stamping "limited-edition" on pressings of upwards of 10,000 or even 25,000 — or no identifiable number at all.


When the Community was asked why they seek exclusives and multiple variations of their favorite recordings, the reasons were diverse and evenly split:

Enthusiasm to collect versions that come with different color variants, album art, or other exclusives.
Goal to have the best-sounding releases available.
Desire to collect an artist's entire discography.
Preference to preserve original versions and listen to reissues.
Potential resale value.


Color vinyl records are a hot trend for some collectors. However, within the Discogs Community, 66% prefer traditional black vinyl because they are easier to find and less expensive than color variants. The audiophiles among survey respondents strongly believe that black vinyl simply sounds better than colored vinyl.

Of the one-third of collectors who prefer color variants, their primary reasons are the cool factor over basic black and the general perception that they are more valuable. Discogs witnesses this color vinyl trend each time a popular new album is released and several variants appear on the monthly list of best-selling records.


Everyone's collection is incredibly personal and tailored to the specific listener. Each Discogs Community member builds their collection a different way, but there are similarities across most record collectors: Their unequivocal dedication to music and shared interests in artists, genres, and labels.


The Database makes it easy for music fans to explore the most collected Master Releases (which includes every version of a release) among the Community. For a deeper understanding of these records, Discogs uncovered the most collected albums released by decade between the 1950s and the beginning of the 2020s, revealing trends in popular music over the past 70 years. Interestingly, Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon — the biggest release of the 1970s — has been the most collected album on Discogs since 2010.



Release metrics in this report were gathered from the Discogs Database and represent totals through April 31, 2021. The 3 million collectors figure was determined by the number of users that added at least one item to their Collection. Survey responses were gathered between April 20-27, 2021, and from 10,000 Discogs Community members with account profiles across multiple English-speaking countries.




Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 03:42:58 AM
Quite interesting!  Thanks for posting this survey Aligreto.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 05:03:48 AM
I suspect that you gents will appreciate this one.  It's called "Nipper Runs Amok".  Interesting reading the history behind it.  Would have loved to have been able to talk to the people who produced it as to their reasoning behind it and thoughts about the results.   :)

https://www.emiarchivetrust.org/secrets-of-the-emi-archive-1/

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 04, 2021, 05:19:48 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 05:03:48 AM
I suspect that you gents will appreciate this one.  It's called "Nipper Runs Amok".  Interesting reading the history behind it.  Would have loved to have been able to talk to the people who produced it as to their reasoning behind it and thoughts about the results.   :)

https://www.emiarchivetrust.org/secrets-of-the-emi-archive-1/

PD

I would love to get a few hours to rummage in that place  8)


(https://www.emiarchivetrust.org/files/2019/05/The-Museum-140513_7523-300x200.jpg)


Also, that is a terrific clip at the end with the dog  :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 05:25:52 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 04, 2021, 05:19:48 AM
I would love to get a few hours to rummage in that place  8)


(https://www.emiarchivetrust.org/files/2019/05/The-Museum-140513_7523-300x200.jpg)


Also, that is a terrific clip at the end with the dog  :laugh:
I agree; it would be a lot of fun to look through all of that 'stuff'--and to listen to some music on those vintage players.  And, yes.  I cracked up when I saw what the dog did to that horn!  ??? :laugh:

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 04, 2021, 05:42:58 AM
And the dog meant it too  >:D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 05:53:21 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 04, 2021, 05:42:58 AM
And the dog meant it too  >:D
Yes, you could tell right away by his barking and body language that he was having none of that noisy contraption!

I found some cool photos here on their website.  Wish, though, that their descriptions were a bit better--more thorough.  Out of curiosity, who were the visiting royals to Hayes?  I don't recognize them.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/100030765@N07/sets/72157635013975944/with/9470912821/

PD

p.s.  I loved the photos of the earliest studio...quite an eye-opener!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 04, 2021, 06:44:01 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 05:03:48 AM
I suspect that you gents will appreciate this one.  It's called "Nipper Runs Amok".  Interesting reading the history behind it.  Would have loved to have been able to talk to the people who produced it as to their reasoning behind it and thoughts about the results.   :)

https://www.emiarchivetrust.org/secrets-of-the-emi-archive-1/

PD

Thanks for posting PD. Very funny, Nipper wasn't having it!

The famous dog features on the wall above my PC screen. No need for Eamon Andrews famous red book just a wall! ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 07:09:27 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 04, 2021, 06:44:01 AM
Thanks for posting PD. Very funny, Nipper wasn't having it!

The famous dog features on the wall above my PC screen. No need for Eamon Andrews famous red book just a wall! ;D
Sweet!  I've been wanting to get one of those old Nipper statues for some time.   :)  I do have a magnet like this one (on my fridge)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/r9sAAOSwve1azEAa/s-l300.jpg)

By the way, if you've had a chance to look at any of those old EMI pictures (that I had also posted a link to earlier), any idea who the royals were that were visiting Hayes?  There are several photos of them there.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 04, 2021, 07:59:56 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 05:53:21 AM
Yes, you could tell right away by his barking and body language that he was having none of that noisy contraption!

I found some cool photos here on their website.  Wish, though, that their descriptions were a bit better--more thorough.  Out of curiosity, who were the visiting royals to Hayes?  I don't recognize them.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/100030765@N07/sets/72157635013975944/with/9470912821/

PD

p.s.  I loved the photos of the earliest studio...quite an eye-opener!

Wonderful photos indeed PD  8)
I don't do "Royals" so I cannot help you there.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 08:16:44 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 04, 2021, 07:59:56 AM
Wonderful photos indeed PD  8)
I don't do "Royals" so I cannot help you there.
That's o.k.  :)  I suspect that the photos are of Mary of Teck...and I'm not certain of whom else.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 18, 2021, 07:35:47 AM
Looking at a couple of Saga records that I own (mentioned in the Vaughan Williams thread) and a question came to my mind:  I noticed that on the back of the JS-Q record (Songs of Travel) that at the top it says "Debut Series No. 4".  I tried googling Saga Records Debut Series (and also used other wording) as I was curious as to what other records were in that series and didn't have any luck.  Tried Discogs too (a rather confusing history of Saga there).  Does anyone here have any more info on that series?  And any particularly 'yummy' ones in it?

PD

p.s.  Looking a bit more closely at the two album covers, the mono one says Saga on the back (but according to Discogs the label went bankrupt in 1960 and was acquired by Allied.  The recording appears to be from 1963.  It does say 'manufactured by Allied Records').  The stereo one that I have is from a later date (shows a copyright date from Art & Sound, Ltd., 1973 re the liner notes) and again says Pressed by Allied Records, Ltd.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 19, 2021, 12:25:24 AM
Quote from: George O on June 02, 2021, 12:55:33 PM
Good to see that someone else has this album in his collection.

(https://i.postimg.cc/bJ4TcPB1/417-D1-C9-C-6772-4020-9-A7-F-5-B395-A790-B13.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/R6QfKk90)
Thanks! Nice photo. Haven't played the LP yet.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 19, 2021, 12:26:38 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 04, 2021, 06:44:01 AM
Thanks for posting PD. Very funny, Nipper wasn't having it!

The famous dog features on the wall above my PC screen. No need for Eamon Andrews famous red book just a wall! ;D
Love the 'Nipper' photo but not so sure about 'West Ham United'.
8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 19, 2021, 12:34:20 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2021, 05:03:48 AM
I suspect that you gents will appreciate this one.  It's called "Nipper Runs Amok".  Interesting reading the history behind it.  Would have loved to have been able to talk to the people who produced it as to their reasoning behind it and thoughts about the results.   :)

https://www.emiarchivetrust.org/secrets-of-the-emi-archive-1/

PD
I loved 'Nipper Runs Amok'.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 19, 2021, 08:21:21 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 19, 2021, 12:26:38 AM
Love the 'Nipper' photo but not so sure about 'West Ham United'.
8)

I haven't been sure about West Ham United since 1957, Jeffrey.  :D

As for the work of art on my wall as Kenny Everett would say "In the best possible taste"!

https://youtu.be/ZkqxagJglaI
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 19, 2021, 12:10:37 PM
Quote from: Irons on June 19, 2021, 08:21:21 AM
I haven't been sure about West Ham United since 1957, Jeffrey.  :D

As for the work of art on my wall as Kenny Everett would say "In the best possible taste"!

https://youtu.be/ZkqxagJglaI
;D I loved that your grandkid made a card for you with their logo!  Sweet!  And that it meant enough to you to put it next to their plaque(?).

Afraid that I wasn't able to watch your youtube link.  I received a message saying something like "Problem loading.  Please try again later."

Any thoughts re Saga recordings (see earlier posting from me)?  If/when you have a chance.

PD

p.s.  Am trying to cool off now after running around doing some grocery shopping.  By the way, do you folks in the UK (and elsewhere) celebrate Fathers' Day?  That's this weekend here (Sunday).  It's also Juneteenth today thanks to President Biden and most of the folks in Congress....along with the campaigning for it by a number of relentless and hardworking souls like Ms. Opal Lee.  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 20, 2021, 10:51:50 PM
Quote from: Irons on June 19, 2021, 08:21:21 AM
I haven't been sure about West Ham United since 1957, Jeffrey.  :D

As for the work of art on my wall as Kenny Everett would say "In the best possible taste"!

https://youtu.be/ZkqxagJglaI
OT

Excellent Lol! I was always a fan of Mt Everett. I must have started supporting Chelsea at the same time, maybe c.1959 as I went there as a 4 year old!

The 'Grandad' card is lovely, so that is excusable!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 20, 2021, 11:57:43 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 19, 2021, 12:10:37 PM
;D I loved that your grandkid made a card for you with their logo!  Sweet!  And that it meant enough to you to put it next to their plaque(?).

Afraid that I wasn't able to watch your youtube link.  I received a message saying something like "Problem loading.  Please try again later."

Any thoughts re Saga recordings (see earlier posting from me)?  If/when you have a chance.

PD

p.s.  Am trying to cool off now after running around doing some grocery shopping.  By the way, do you folks in the UK (and elsewhere) celebrate Fathers' Day?  That's this weekend here (Sunday).  It's also Juneteenth today thanks to President Biden and most of the folks in Congress....along with the campaigning for it by a number of relentless and hardworking souls like Ms. Opal Lee.  :)

The plaque is a very trashy mirror PD but so old, half a century at least, worth a small fortune.

We have always had Mothers Day but Fathers Day similar to Halloween has crossed the Atlantic and become popular here fairly recently. Weather not good at present but plumped for a barbeque anyway. Kenny Everett's humour is a bit like my mirror, trashy ;D.

Buying Saga LPs is a leap of faith. The mono turquoise label from the 1960's if you can find a clean pressing are very collectable. The latter British stereo pressings are awful. The very late German pressings are good. So for Saga best to go very early or late and miss out on the middle.

Edit: Sorry PD missed your Saga post above. I have not heard of the "Debut" series.

   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 21, 2021, 12:22:46 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 20, 2021, 10:51:50 PM
OT

Excellent Lol! I was always a fan of Mt Everett. I must have started supporting Chelsea at the same time, maybe c.1959 as I went there as a 4 year old!

The 'Grandad' card is lovely, so that is excusable!

I have been to Stamford Bridge a few times, Jeffrey. The most recent being 2019 when believe it or not West Ham won 1-0! I was in the Chelsea enclosure of the Matthew Harding stand - fabulous view - so had to sit on my hands! Obviously your Chelsea support comes from an older member of the family. My father was a Gooner!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 21, 2021, 02:58:45 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 20, 2021, 11:57:43 PM
The plaque is a very trashy mirror PD but so old, half a century at least, worth a small fortune.

We have always had Mothers Day but Fathers Day similar to Halloween has crossed the Atlantic and become popular here fairly recently. Weather not good at present but plumped for a barbeque anyway. Kenny Everett's humour is a bit like my mirror, trashy ;D.

Buying Saga LPs is a leap of faith. The mono turquoise label from the 1960's if you can find a clean pressing are very collectable. The latter British stereo pressings are awful. The very late German pressings are good. So for Saga best to go very early or late and miss out on the middle.

Edit: Sorry PD missed your Saga post above. I have not heard of the "Debut" series.


Thank you for the info.  I'll have to see how the mono one sounds.  It's a dark torquoise (teal?) colored label with "Made in England" on it.  Alas the stereo one was pressed in the UK.  Hope to fire up the charcoal grill today, but boy is it ever (and already) muggy out!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 21, 2021, 09:13:56 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on June 21, 2021, 08:34:34 AM
The photos of a stern-looking lady wearing what appears to be a wrap-around turban on her head is indeed Queen Mary, wife of George V. She was known as 'Mary of Teck' for a while, but that kind of went out of fashion in 1910 when she became Queen of the United Kingdom and the British Dominions and Empress of India! The picture to the left of the one of Gracie Fields on a flight of outdoor stairs: the guy in the bowler hat looking over the shoulders of the seated lady workers is George V himself.

The photo of everyone looking out of the windows at a diminutive couple, one of whom is wearing military uniform, next to the one of Glen Miller... well, the woman is definitely Queen Elizabeth, a.k.a. the Queen Mother (but not when that photo was taken) and also known as Elizabeth Bowes Lyon befote she got married to the younger brother of Edward VIII, who ended up as George VI. I *think* that's him (i.e., Elizabeth's husband) in the military uniform, but he's a bit small and indistinct, so I can't be certain. They often went around places together, of course, because he was such a dreadful public speaker, what with his stutter (and having his wife around made things better for him, somewhat).
Thank you for the further identifications.  And, yes, I did do a bit of historical calculations checking out to see who was queen around that time and did find photos of her.  ;)  Nice to know who some of the other ones were though.  I'm guessing that Queen Mary was being given the tour by the head of EMI?  Or one of the heads involved with the production of the records?  Any idea there?  In any event, hope that you had fun looking at the photos.  By the way, did you watch the short video of "Nipper Run Amok" [Note:  not the original Nipper].  That had me laughing.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 22, 2021, 04:52:35 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on June 21, 2021, 09:30:26 AM
I know it's the vinyl thread (and I can count those on my bookshelf right now... 4 of them. Plus 16 78 rpm shellac thingies.

My own personal stats:

         Statistic                   Value
         -----------                 -----
    1    Unique Composers:           544 
    2    Recordings (total):         12744
    3    Days of continuous play:    231.7
    4    Count of Plays:             3111
    5    Recordings not yet played:  10298
    6    Plays per day (avg):        21.02

         Duration Range              Total   Played  Unplayed
         --------------              -----   ------  --------
    1    Less than 5 minutes:         1391   662     729     
    2    Between 5 and 10 minutes:    2247   660     1587   
    3    Between 10 and 30 minutes:   3460   435     3025   
    4    Between 30 and 60 minutes:   4591   570     4021   
    5    Between 60 and 120 minutes:  688    86      602     
    6    Longer than 2 hours:         367    33      334     


That's the digital stuff only and it lists an alarmingly high percentage of 'unplayed' only because it's a new piece of playback software, so I've only played about 2,500 compositions in the six months I've been using it. (The digital stuff is organised by composition, not the piece of plastic it was supplied on).

Anyway: it's got nothing to do with the thread, so I'm sorry to go off-topic, but I saw the headline statistics that the Discogs people averaged 184 'releases' in their collections and practically fell off my chair with the thought that I would never cope with that little quantity of minims and quavers! Moar notes!!

That was a standout statistic for me also. I wondered if it was a typo.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2021, 02:33:47 AM
Recent LP purchases:

Moussorgski:  L'oeuvre pour piano seul, les tableaux d'une exposition/Victoria Postnikova/Le Chant du Monde
Martinu/Schulhoff:  Concertos for String quartet and Orchestra/Talich Quartet/Czech Phil Orch/Kosler on Panton
from Bartok (The Complete Edition):  Violin Concerto with Szekely/Amsterdam Concertgebouw Orch/Mengelberg/Hungaroton
Schubert Impromptu As-dur, op. 142, No. 2 and Sonata c-moll op. post. with Richter on Eurodisc/Melodia
Bartok:  Concerto No. 2 & Prokofiev:  Concerto No. 5 with Richter/Maazel/Orch de Paris & LSO on EMI Angel
Poulenc:  Concerto for Organ, Strings & Timpani with Simon Preston/Andre Previn/LSO on Angel (part of their 45 Angel Sonic Series)

And there you have it!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 24, 2021, 02:55:55 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2021, 02:33:47 AM
Recent LP purchases:

Moussorgski:  L'oeuvre pour piano seul, les tableaux d'une exposition/Victoria Postnikova/Le Chant du Monde
Martinu/Schulhoff:  Concertos for String quartet and Orchestra/Talich Quartet/Czech Phil Orch/Kosler on Panton
from Bartok (The Complete Edition):  Violin Concerto with Szekely/Amsterdam Concertgebouw Orch/Mengelberg/Hungaroton
Schubert Impromptu As-dur, op. 142, No. 2 and Sonata c-moll op. post. with Richter on Eurodisc/Melodia
Bartok:  Concerto No. 2 & Prokofiev:  Concerto No. 5 with Richter/Maazel/Orch de Paris & LSO on EMI Angel
Poulenc:  Concerto for Organ, Strings & Timpani with Simon Preston/Andre Previn/LSO on Angel (part of their 45 Angel Sonic Series)

And there you have it!  :)

PD

Great haul, PD! Like the look of the Martinu/Schulhoff Panton disc. Late (1986) with nice cover too. Will look out for that one. The Bartok is of major historical significance. I hope Angel have retained the original EMI cover for Previn, the artwork is one of my all-time favourites. I'm too lazy for 45 rpm but concede they sound better.
Now to search for a copy of your Panton. 8) 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2021, 03:24:25 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 24, 2021, 02:55:55 AM
Great haul, PD! Like the look of the Martinu/Schulhoff Panton disc. Late (1986) with nice cover too. Will look out for that one. The Bartok is of major historical significance. I hope Angel have retained the original EMI cover for Previn, the artwork is one of my all-time favourites. I'm too lazy for 45 rpm but concede they sound better.
Now to search for a copy of your Panton. 8)
I thought it was pretty cool that it was the standard 12-inch size LP but transferred at 45 (so just one work on it and need to flip it to hear all of it).  This is what it looks like:

(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.nLhGaiKG5f94bo8mMnPmLAAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1)

My cover is on the darker side (like above) vs. some of the other images that I've seen online.

I was happy to see the Panton one for various reasons including I seldom run across recordings of Schulhoff.   :)  And knowing you, you'll find a copy of it in a heartbeat!

PD

EDIT:  The name of Victoria Postnikova sounded vaguely familiar to me, so thought that I'd chance it--particularly as I love the piano version of Pictures.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 24, 2021, 01:35:42 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2021, 03:24:25 AM
I thought it was pretty cool that it was the standard 12-inch size LP but transferred at 45 (so just one work on it and need to flip it to hear all of it).  This is what it looks like:

(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.nLhGaiKG5f94bo8mMnPmLAAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1)

My cover is on the darker side (like above) vs. some of the other images that I've seen online.

I was happy to see the Panton one for various reasons including I seldom run across recordings of Schulhoff.   :)  And knowing you, you'll find a copy of it in a heartbeat!

PD

EDIT:  The name of Victoria Postnikova sounded vaguely familiar to me, so thought that I'd chance it--particularly as I love the piano version of Pictures.

Very Nice  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2021, 01:41:43 PM
Quote from: aligreto on July 24, 2021, 01:35:42 PM
Very Nice  8)
Thank you!  I'm looking forward to listening to them.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 25, 2021, 12:58:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2021, 03:24:25 AM
I thought it was pretty cool that it was the standard 12-inch size LP but transferred at 45 (so just one work on it and need to flip it to hear all of it).  This is what it looks like:

(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.nLhGaiKG5f94bo8mMnPmLAAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1)

My cover is on the darker side (like above) vs. some of the other images that I've seen online.

I was happy to see the Panton one for various reasons including I seldom run across recordings of Schulhoff.   :)  And knowing you, you'll find a copy of it in a heartbeat!

PD

EDIT:  The name of Victoria Postnikova sounded vaguely familiar to me, so thought that I'd chance it--particularly as I love the piano version of Pictures.

I thought she was married to someone famous, Rostropovich maybe. Looked it up, in fact Gennady Rozhdestvensky.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on July 25, 2021, 01:12:40 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2021, 03:24:25 AM
I thought it was pretty cool that it was the standard 12-inch size LP but transferred at 45 (so just one work on it and need to flip it to hear all of it).  This is what it looks like:

(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.nLhGaiKG5f94bo8mMnPmLAAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1)

My cover is on the darker side (like above) vs. some of the other images that I've seen online.

I was happy to see the Panton one for various reasons including I seldom run across recordings of Schulhoff.   :)  And knowing you, you'll find a copy of it in a heartbeat!

PD

EDIT:  The name of Victoria Postnikova sounded vaguely familiar to me, so thought that I'd chance it--particularly as I love the piano version of Pictures.

Great Poulenc recordings I think, including an exquisite Concert Champetre ... and Richter in Schubert + Bartok, and Mengelberg in Bartok also very fine... congrats.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 25, 2021, 03:19:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 25, 2021, 12:58:44 AM
I thought she was married to someone famous, Rostropovich maybe. Looked it up, in fact Gennady Rozhdestvensky.
Oh, neat!  :)

Quote from: MusicTurner on July 25, 2021, 01:12:40 AM
Great Poulenc recordings I think, including an exquisite Concert Champetre ... and Richter in Schubert + Bartok, and Mengelberg in Bartok also very fine... congrats.
Thank you!  :)

By the way, the Poulenc one just has the Concerto for Organ, Strings and Timpani on it.  It looks like the original album also included the Concert Champetre, but due to the space limitations of mine being a 45 rpm disc (vs. a 33 1/3), they could only fit the Organ Concerto on it.  I know, looks strange to me too as I'm not used to seeing a 12-inch record being played at 45 rpm!  I do have a friend though who has at least one of those:  a Beach Boys lp (2 lp set) of Pet Sounds.  https://store.acousticsounds.com/d/98211/The_Beach_Boys-Pet_Sounds-45_RPM_Vinyl_Record  There's also a stereo version of it too.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on July 25, 2021, 03:27:13 AM
Oh yes sorry, the longer LP has the same cover.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on July 26, 2021, 02:01:50 PM
Has anyone ever picked up the Readers' Digest LP boxes? Oddly enough they're still considered "in print" (as in- they're on Spotify, with Readers Digest logos on them, even!), and the ones I picked up are almost always in good condition. Not to mention that they have zero resale value - I picked up the "Festival of Light Classical Music" for $1.50.

https://www.discogs.com/Various-Festival-Of-Light-Classical-Music/release/2992354


There's a lot of Rene "I hate Sibelius" Leibowitz in there- I particularly liked his recordings of French music in that set, much of which is with the Paris Conservatory - also the box's programming is far more interesting than the title might indicate. "La Valse" is in there, which is hardly my idea of "Light classical!"

And it's basically RCA Living Stereo quality sound - they produced them, and unlike other compilations from the likes of Time-Life etc, these really were well made.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHKcXHU6ytA

Also given their penchant for condensing and abridging books, having all four movements of Eine Kleine Nachtmusick, when virtually every light compilation I've ever seen gives you just the first- was a bit ironic.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 27, 2021, 12:54:45 AM
Quote from: fbjim on July 26, 2021, 02:01:50 PM
Has anyone ever picked up the Readers' Digest LP boxes? Oddly enough they're still considered "in print" (as in- they're on Spotify, with Readers Digest logos on them, even!), and the ones I picked up are almost always in good condition. Not to mention that they have zero resale value - I picked up the "Festival of Light Classical Music" for $1.50.

https://www.discogs.com/Various-Festival-Of-Light-Classical-Music/release/2992354


There's a lot of Rene "I hate Sibelius" Leibowitz in there- I particularly liked his recordings of French music in that set, much of which is with the Paris Conservatory - also the box's programming is far more interesting than the title might indicate. "La Valse" is in there, which is hardly my idea of "Light classical!"

And it's basically RCA Living Stereo quality sound - they produced them, and unlike other compilations from the likes of Time-Life etc, these really were well made.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHKcXHU6ytA

Also given their penchant for condensing and abridging books, having all four movements of Eine Kleine Nachtmusick, when virtually every light compilation I've ever seen gives you just the first- was a bit ironic.

Firstly, welcome and thanks for posting. The Readers Digest boxes produced  by the legendary Charles Gerhardt are from the high water mark of analogue sound. If not all, most were engineered  by the equally legendary Kenneth Wilkinson. Both production and artistic values are exemplary through the whole series. Chesky Records, an audiophile label, released individually at premium price the contents of the Readers Digest "Treasury if Great Music," a stunning set. Leibowitz features along with Sargent, Reiner, Kempe, Horenstein, Munch, Krips and Dorati. There is also a box set of film music which if I recall correctly is conducted by Gerhardt. Not to be forgotten a set of Beethoven Symphonies with again Leibowitz.
Wearing my deerstalker, as the sets were only available on subscription to readers of Readers Digest many of whom not that interested in Classical music it can be the case the sets were not played much. Finding a set in mint condition is not beyond the realms of possibility.       
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 27, 2021, 01:32:16 AM
Quote from: fbjim on July 26, 2021, 02:01:50 PM
Has anyone ever picked up the Readers' Digest LP boxes? Oddly enough they're still considered "in print" (as in- they're on Spotify, with Readers Digest logos on them, even!), and the ones I picked up are almost always in good condition. Not to mention that they have zero resale value - I picked up the "Festival of Light Classical Music" for $1.50.

https://www.discogs.com/Various-Festival-Of-Light-Classical-Music/release/2992354


There's a lot of Rene "I hate Sibelius" Leibowitz in there- I particularly liked his recordings of French music in that set, much of which is with the Paris Conservatory - also the box's programming is far more interesting than the title might indicate. "La Valse" is in there, which is hardly my idea of "Light classical!"

And it's basically RCA Living Stereo quality sound - they produced them, and unlike other compilations from the likes of Time-Life etc, these really were well made.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHKcXHU6ytA

Also given their penchant for condensing and abridging books, having all four movements of Eine Kleine Nachtmusick, when virtually every light compilation I've ever seen gives you just the first- was a bit ironic.

A big welcome from me also  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on July 27, 2021, 02:37:28 AM
Quote from: fbjim on July 26, 2021, 02:01:50 PM
Has anyone ever picked up the Readers' Digest LP boxes? Oddly enough they're still considered "in print" (as in- they're on Spotify, with Readers Digest logos on them, even!), and the ones I picked up are almost always in good condition. Not to mention that they have zero resale value - I picked up the "Festival of Light Classical Music" for $1.50.

https://www.discogs.com/Various-Festival-Of-Light-Classical-Music/release/2992354


There's a lot of Rene "I hate Sibelius" Leibowitz in there- I particularly liked his recordings of French music in that set, much of which is with the Paris Conservatory - also the box's programming is far more interesting than the title might indicate. "La Valse" is in there, which is hardly my idea of "Light classical!"

And it's basically RCA Living Stereo quality sound - they produced them, and unlike other compilations from the likes of Time-Life etc, these really were well made.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHKcXHU6ytA

Also given their penchant for condensing and abridging books, having all four movements of Eine Kleine Nachtmusick, when virtually every light compilation I've ever seen gives you just the first- was a bit ironic.

When I was a teenager my older brother bought Festival of Light Classical Music from Reader's Digest. I listened to it far more than he did and it was my introduction to numerous classical composers. It was far more interesting (to me) than the stuff we listened to in school music lessons. A few years ago I found a near mint copy (though lacking the booklet) in a charity shop. I still dip into it from time to time when feeling nostalgic.

Another RD box I own, also bought from a charity shop, is The Great Barbirolli. This is made up of recordings from the Pye Catalogue; I have just about all of it on later CD reissues but still occasionally listen to the LPs.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 27, 2021, 03:13:14 AM
Quote from: fbjim on July 26, 2021, 02:01:50 PM
Has anyone ever picked up the Readers' Digest LP boxes? Oddly enough they're still considered "in print" (as in- they're on Spotify, with Readers Digest logos on them, even!), and the ones I picked up are almost always in good condition. Not to mention that they have zero resale value - I picked up the "Festival of Light Classical Music" for $1.50.

https://www.discogs.com/Various-Festival-Of-Light-Classical-Music/release/2992354


There's a lot of Rene "I hate Sibelius" Leibowitz in there- I particularly liked his recordings of French music in that set, much of which is with the Paris Conservatory - also the box's programming is far more interesting than the title might indicate. "La Valse" is in there, which is hardly my idea of "Light classical!"

And it's basically RCA Living Stereo quality sound - they produced them, and unlike other compilations from the likes of Time-Life etc, these really were well made.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHKcXHU6ytA

Also given their penchant for condensing and abridging books, having all four movements of Eine Kleine Nachtmusick, when virtually every light compilation I've ever seen gives you just the first- was a bit ironic.
Yes, I do keep an eye out for them....actually, first of all, welcome to the forum!!  :)

Alas, the one set that I did pick up turned out not to be in the best of shape.  Am still on the hunt for it though.

What other LPs do you have that you love?  Or are on the look out for?  :)

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on July 27, 2021, 07:09:13 AM
I got a factory sealed set of the Command Records Steinberg/Pittsburgh Brahms performances. He's not the most prestigious conductor but Command/Pittsburgh stuff is in great sound quality and the performances of the German rep is underappreciated (is it even still in print?).

A great copy of the Boulez NY Phil Concerto for Orchestra was a good dollar-bin pickup too. Not to mention that the store owner tossed in a box of the Colin Davis Tosca because "nobody buys opera" (he actually tried to get me to take a big moving box of classical stuff off his hands for space reasons- if I had a car I would have taken him up on it. If I actually had a hustle mindset, you could make decent money shuttling things from the stores here that don't know how to price classical music to the ones who do- that's the same store that sold me a pristine MLP DSO/Paray record of La Mer/Iberia for a buck)



as far as stuff I'm looking for - there's a Nonesuch LP of Xenakis with Bohor on it that I've really wanted for a bit, and pretty much any Hollywood String Quartet LP.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 27, 2021, 08:13:58 AM
Quote from: fbjim on July 27, 2021, 07:09:13 AM
I got a factory sealed set of the Command Records Steinberg/Pittsburgh Brahms performances. He's not the most prestigious conductor but Command/Pittsburgh stuff is in great sound quality and the performances of the German rep is underappreciated (is it even still in print?).

A great copy of the Boulez NY Phil Concerto for Orchestra was a good dollar-bin pickup too. Not to mention that the store owner tossed in a box of the Colin Davis Tosca because "nobody buys opera" (he actually tried to get me to take a big moving box of classical stuff off his hands for space reasons- if I had a car I would have taken him up on it. If I actually had a hustle mindset, you could make decent money shuttling things from the stores here that don't know how to price classical music to the ones who do- that's the same store that sold me a pristine MLP DSO/Paray record of La Mer/Iberia for a buck)



as far as stuff I'm looking for - there's a Nonesuch LP of Xenakis with Bohor on it that I've really wanted for a bit, and pretty much any Hollywood String Quartet LP.
I don't believe that the Brahms/Steinberg is still in print.  Looks like it came out on CD as a set a while ago?  Perhaps as a download these days?

Drat, sorry that you couldn't have taken him up on that box of records!  And congrats on the Paray record.

They're some "for sale" listing of the Xenakis record that you want on Discogs though they're not dirt cheap.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on July 27, 2021, 08:23:48 AM
I'd guess the Command stuff is in that quasi-legal European public-domain status where you can probably find hyper-budget labels putting them out as LP transfers. Not sure if anyone owns that label but there was some relatively strong stuff on it. Maybe not enough for a reissue box, though...


(speaking of boxes, I got invited to poke through a box of classical records that came into one of the nicer stores here- picked up a few of the original Haitink Mahler symphonies (and Das Lied) for a fair price. unfortunately when I pulled out a copy of Music for 18 Musicians the owner immediately knew that record was worth decent money...)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 27, 2021, 09:00:48 AM
Quote from: fbjim on July 27, 2021, 08:23:48 AM
I'd guess the Command stuff is in that quasi-legal European public-domain status where you can probably find hyper-budget labels putting them out as LP transfers. Not sure if anyone owns that label but there was some relatively strong stuff on it. Maybe not enough for a reissue box, though...


(speaking of boxes, I got invited to poke through a box of classical records that came into one of the nicer stores here- picked up a few of the original Haitink Mahler symphonies (and Das Lied) for a fair price. unfortunately when I pulled out a copy of Music for 18 Musicians the owner immediately knew that record was worth decent money...)
Yes, a lot of that 60's-70's experimental music can go for high prices--particularly if the composer becomes well-known.  I've tried a few albums from that time period; so far, in any event, the music hasn't really appealed to me.   :(
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 27, 2021, 01:27:54 PM
Quote from: fbjim on July 27, 2021, 08:23:48 AM
I'd guess the Command stuff is in that quasi-legal European public-domain status where you can probably find hyper-budget labels putting them out as LP transfers. Not sure if anyone owns that label but there was some relatively strong stuff on it. Maybe not enough for a reissue box, though...


(speaking of boxes, I got invited to poke through a box of classical records that came into one of the nicer stores here- picked up a few of the original Haitink Mahler symphonies (and Das Lied) for a fair price. unfortunately when I pulled out a copy of Music for 18 Musicians the owner immediately knew that record was worth decent money...)

I recall Command Classics I think, rather garish covers? They got on the Mercury Living Presence and RCA Living Stereo bandwagon, bit like Everest. I can only remember US imports with thick covers, not European pressings
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 09, 2021, 09:50:15 AM
45 RPM actually! I've been enjoying my Arthur Bliss EP which arrived today in remarkably good condition:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 09, 2021, 10:15:51 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 09, 2021, 09:50:15 AM
45 RPM actually! I've been enjoying my Arthur Bliss EP which arrived today in remarkably good condition:
(//)
Neat!  I love the cover!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 12, 2021, 12:53:57 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 09, 2021, 09:50:15 AM
45 RPM actually! I've been enjoying my Arthur Bliss EP which arrived today in remarkably good condition:
(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=76402;image)

Very nice. Is that a 7" or a 12" Jeffrey?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 12, 2021, 06:32:06 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 09, 2021, 10:15:51 AM
Neat!  I love the cover!

PD
Me too PD which was one of the attractions of the disc, along with the inexpensive price, my enjoyment of the music and the excellent condition of the vinyl.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 12, 2021, 06:33:05 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 12, 2021, 12:53:57 AM
Very nice. Is that a 7" or a 12" Jeffrey?
7" Fergus, like an old 45 RPM pop music single.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 12, 2021, 07:04:13 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 12, 2021, 06:33:05 AM
7" Fergus, like an old 45 RPM pop music single.

Very nice, Jeffrey. That would be something that I would buy if I came across it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 15, 2021, 08:56:10 AM
I just had fun yakking with a friend of mine over the phone and checking out some things online.  He told me that he was looking at an article in the current issue of The Absolute Sound about a roughly $600,000 turntable (not including tone arm nor cartridge) and weighing I believe about 330 kg.  It's called the TechDas Air Force Zero.

You can see the installation of it here:  https://www.audionirvana.org/forum/the-audio-vault/the-cutting-edge/156406-installation-of-techdas-air-force-zero-at-jacob-heilbrun-s

And the specs here:  https://techdas.jp/pages/air-force-zero/

Anyone in?

PD

p.s.  Here's one photo of it:  (https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse2.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.YIy0h5aUWnmk3AOD0VXszQHaE3%26pid%3DApi&f=1)  And you can get an idea of how big it is here:

(https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/images.theabsolutesound.com/zp_tas/media/articles/images/IMG_1380.jpg)

p.p.s.   Sorry, but I don't have access to the article....just recalling what my friend said.

And last edit:  Here's a link to an earlier article on it (preview from 2019)  https://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/techdas-air-force-zero-turntable-preview
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 17, 2021, 12:09:03 AM
Over-engineering at it's worse. I admit not as simple as it sounds but a turntable design has two goals, to revolve at a constant speed without deviation and suppress micro vibrations. Engineers have come up with many designs to tackle these two elements, some more successful then others. In my view the finest turntables are well engineered, so not inexpensive, with simplicity a key to the design.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 17, 2021, 03:44:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 17, 2021, 12:09:03 AM
Over-engineering at it's worse. I admit not as simple as it sounds but a turntable design has two goals, to revolve at a constant speed without deviation and suppress micro vibrations. Engineers have come up with many designs to tackle these two elements, some more successful then others. In my view the finest turntables are well engineered, so not inexpensive, with simplicity a key to the design.
Well, it's certainly not simple with four(!)platters, etc. (including working with another company to build a stand just for it) and taking three people to set it up (due to the weight of the various platters, etc.).

Must admit, it would be fun to hear it...just even once.  With those Wilson Audio WAMM Master Chronosonic loudspeakers of course!  :D

We had just talked about it trying to wrap our heads around the idea of how on earth could there be such an expensive turntable and what was it made of, etc.   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on August 18, 2021, 08:58:56 AM
Picked this up for five bucks. For whatever reason Sony has been very stingy with re-releasing this one.

(https://i.imgur.com/vO3z3dv.jpeg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 18, 2021, 09:39:47 AM
Quote from: fbjim on August 18, 2021, 08:58:56 AM
Picked this up for five bucks. For whatever reason Sony has been very stingy with re-releasing this one.

(https://i.imgur.com/vO3z3dv.jpeg)
Nice!  :)

Pd
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 18, 2021, 02:15:23 PM
Quote from: fbjim on August 18, 2021, 08:58:56 AM
Picked this up for five bucks. For whatever reason Sony has been very stingy with re-releasing this one.

(https://i.imgur.com/vO3z3dv.jpeg)

+1 Enjoy your purchase  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 19, 2021, 12:17:48 AM
Quote from: fbjim on August 18, 2021, 08:58:56 AM
Picked this up for five bucks. For whatever reason Sony has been very stingy with re-releasing this one.

(https://i.imgur.com/vO3z3dv.jpeg)

I have that, a US pressing but unlike yours, mono. I like the Schuman performance very much.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Jo498 on August 19, 2021, 01:14:43 AM
For some reason whenever I see this thread title, my first thought is of the Diabelli Variations, not of Vinyl Long Playing Records.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 19, 2021, 02:40:56 AM
Quote from: Jo498 on August 19, 2021, 01:14:43 AM
For some reason whenever I see this thread title, my first thought is of the Diabelli Variations, not of Vinyl Long Playing Records.
:laugh:  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 19, 2021, 03:09:50 AM
Quote from: fbjim on August 18, 2021, 08:58:56 AM
Picked this up for five bucks. For whatever reason Sony has been very stingy with re-releasing this one.

(https://i.imgur.com/vO3z3dv.jpeg)
Looks like a fine LP.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 25, 2021, 07:47:46 AM
Pleased to pick SRCS 116 up, not cheap but not silly eBay prices.

(https://i.imgur.com/fvUX9cP.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 25, 2021, 08:52:54 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 25, 2021, 07:47:46 AM
Pleased to pick SRCS 116 up, not cheap but not silly eBay prices.

(https://i.imgur.com/fvUX9cP.jpg)
Congrats on your find Irons!  Must admit, I've heard of her but don't know her music.  :(  Am currently visiting and revisiting, in a number of cases, some of Bartok's music.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 25, 2021, 10:57:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 25, 2021, 07:47:46 AM
Pleased to pick SRCS 116 up, not cheap but not silly eBay prices.

(https://i.imgur.com/fvUX9cP.jpg)
Excellent Lol! I have the CD version and very good it is too.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 25, 2021, 10:58:55 AM
And, boy Irons, you were not kidding regarding eBay prices!  Looking today, $100!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 25, 2021, 11:54:00 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 25, 2021, 10:57:29 AM
Excellent Lol! I have the CD version and very good it is too.

I was expecting RVW-light, Jeffrey. Not at all, more gnarly but in a good way.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 25, 2021, 11:57:28 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 25, 2021, 10:58:55 AM
And, boy Irons, you were not kidding regarding eBay prices!  Looking today, $100!

PD

I know, PD. I have been on the lookout for some time and knew one would turnup eventually. I paid £20 and it is a lovely copy.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 26, 2021, 01:40:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 25, 2021, 11:54:00 PM
I was expecting RVW-light, Jeffrey. Not at all, more gnarly but in a good way.
+1 I saw her interviewed on TV about VW and she came across as very nice.

Here is a brief but informative film about her;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-xcFnwuVJE

Music is 'Proud Thames'.

A pity that she withdrew her two symphonies.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 26, 2021, 07:15:27 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 26, 2021, 01:40:21 AM
+1 I saw her interviewed on TV about VW and she came across as very nice.

Here is a brief but informative film about her;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-xcFnwuVJE

Music is 'Proud Thames'.

A pity that she withdrew her two symphonies.

Brilliant! I enjoyed that, thanks. I have the Lyrita recording of "Proud Thames". Which will grace my TT this evening. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 26, 2021, 12:12:21 PM
Quote from: Irons on August 26, 2021, 07:15:27 AM
Brilliant! I enjoyed that, thanks. I have the Lyrita recording of "Proud Thames". Which will grace my TT this evening. :)
My pleasure Lol. Yes, watching the short video made me realise what a fine work 'Proud Thames' is. It would be gracing my CD player as well...if I could find the CD!  ::)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 26, 2021, 11:51:15 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 26, 2021, 12:12:21 PM
My pleasure Lol. Yes, watching the short video made me realise what a fine work 'Proud Thames' is. It would be gracing my CD player as well...if I could find the CD!  ::)

Can't see the wood for the trees, Jeffrey?

I must say I'm bowled over by Symphony for Double String Orchestra. The Lento and Passacalia movements are very special.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 27, 2021, 12:47:09 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 26, 2021, 11:51:15 PM
Can't see the wood for the trees, Jeffrey?

I must say I'm bowled over by Symphony for Double String Orchestra. The Lento and Passacalia movements are very special.
All the more reason to resume my panicky search for the CD Lol.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 27, 2021, 02:24:59 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 27, 2021, 12:47:09 AM
All the more reason to resume my panicky search for the CD Lol.
Do I dare suggest that perhaps it's time for a bit of culling?  >:D  And, perhaps working with someone to design some new shelving/cases too?  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 27, 2021, 06:15:24 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 27, 2021, 02:24:59 AM
Do I dare suggest that perhaps it's time for a bit of culling?  >:D  And, perhaps working with someone to design some new shelving/cases too?  ;)

PD
Good point CD - although the culling is underway with the local charity shops being the main beneficiaries. Having said that I wonder how many admirers there of Klaus Egge and Peterson-Berger in the local community.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 27, 2021, 06:32:25 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 27, 2021, 06:15:24 AM
Good point PD - although the culling is underway with the local charity shops being the main beneficiaries. Having said that I wonder how many admirers there of Klaus Egge and Peterson-Berger in the local community.
Not easy I know!  I'm slowly (rather haphazardly) going through mine and yanking some of them--for either relisten, they're duplicates and putting them into a box to sort through a bit further:  Friends? Sell? Donations? Dump?  I have some sets too which I haven't tapped into much--sometimes due to initial reactions to some of the instruments and/or playing style such as this one which I need to give a serious rethink:

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51ThpPPt05L.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 27, 2021, 07:09:25 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 27, 2021, 06:15:24 AM
Good point CD - although the culling is underway with the local charity shops being the main beneficiaries. Having said that I wonder how many admirers there of Klaus Egge and Peterson-Berger in the local community.

Me outside Jeffrey's local charity shop!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 27, 2021, 11:38:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 27, 2021, 07:09:25 AM
Me outside Jeffrey's local charity shop!
No doubt on the search for Arnell's Third Symphony  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 27, 2021, 11:54:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 27, 2021, 07:09:25 AM
Me outside Jeffrey's local charity shop!
:laugh: Wait, I thought it was "Ladies First"?!  :D  ;)

For what its worth, I listened further to that Bach/Brilliant set.  Not a happy camper..will dive in a bit further, but, truthfully, it's not doing anything for me--probably my fault.

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 08, 2021, 11:09:54 PM
Just bought this (never seen this LP before):
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 09, 2021, 12:21:09 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 08, 2021, 11:09:54 PM
Just bought this (never seen this LP before):
(//)

With a fabulous pedigree of The Central Band of the Royal Air Force, Director of Music, Wing Commander J L Wallace OBE LRAM ARCM RAF who himself conducts "Hammersmith". You can't get much more authentic then that, especially with Imogen directing.

A terrific purchase, Jeffrey.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 09, 2021, 12:23:42 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 09, 2021, 12:21:09 AM
With a fabulous pedigree of The Central Band of the Royal Air Force, Director of Music, Wing Commander J L Wallace OBE LRAM ARCM RAF who himself conducts "Hammersmith". You can't get much more authentic then that, especially with Imogen directing.

A terrific purchase, Jeffrey.
Thanks Lol - that's good to know. It wasn't expensive (£7.00) and I like the cover design as well.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 09, 2021, 02:02:35 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 08, 2021, 11:09:54 PM
Just bought this (never seen this LP before):

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=78218;image)

What a wonderful find!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 09, 2021, 02:04:26 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 09, 2021, 02:02:35 AM
What a wonderful find!
Thanks Fergus - I thought so too.
There's another copy available at a similar price through a different seller.
:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Papy Oli on October 09, 2021, 02:18:31 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 08, 2021, 11:09:54 PM
Just bought this (never seen this LP before):

Quote from: Irons on October 09, 2021, 12:21:09 AM
With a fabulous pedigree of The Central Band of the Royal Air Force, Director of Music, Wing Commander J L Wallace OBE LRAM ARCM RAF who himself conducts "Hammersmith". You can't get much more authentic then that, especially with Imogen directing.

A terrific purchase, Jeffrey.

I think it was you Lol who was mentioning and praising this LP already when I was exploring Holst's works beyond the Lyrita CDs, probably in the British composers thread. I might have have been inquiring about some of the works in the Holst Collector's Edition, that those were part of I believe.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 09, 2021, 02:19:17 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 09, 2021, 02:04:26 AM
Thanks Fergus - I thought so too.
There's another copy available at a similar price through a different seller.
:)

Cheers Jeffrey but I have stopped buying altogether from the UK since Brexit. Vat charges and Post Office handling charges, coupled with the resulting delays, make relatively small purchases much more expensive now, unfortunately.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 09, 2021, 03:30:21 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 09, 2021, 02:19:17 AM
Cheers Jeffrey but I have stopped buying altogether from the UK since Brexit. Vat charges and Post Office handling charges, coupled with the resulting delays, make relatively small purchases much more expensive now, unfortunately.
Sorry to hear that Fergus.  Buying things from anywhere (well, many places at least) should be getting easier rather than harder these days.

Quote from: vandermolen on October 08, 2021, 11:09:54 PM
Just bought this (never seen this LP before):
(//)
Cool!  May I ask what label/s it is on as the image is a bit blurry to me.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 09, 2021, 08:24:06 AM
Quote from: Papy Oli on October 09, 2021, 02:18:31 AM
I think it was you Lol who was mentioning and praising this LP already when I was exploring Holst's works beyond the Lyrita CDs, probably in the British composers thread. I might have have been inquiring about some of the works in the Holst Collector's Edition, that those were part of I believe.

If I recall correctly I did, Olivier. A LP I value greatly.

Jeffrey mentions the cover, I travelled over that bridge (Hammersmith) back and forth for 37 years!   Retired now, so not an issue for me, thankfully. The bridge is closed for all traffic. Deemed so dangerous that boats are not allowed to travel under it! I believe even the annual Oxford/Cambridge boat race has been rerouted. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 09, 2021, 08:25:13 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 09, 2021, 08:24:06 AM
If I recall correctly I did, Olivier. A LP I value greatly.

Jeffrey mentions the cover, I travelled over that bridge (Hammersmith) back and forth for 37 years!   Retired now, so not an issue for me, thankfully. The bridge is closed for all traffic. Deemed so dangerous that boats are not allowed to travel under it! I believe even the annual Oxford/Cambridge boat race has been rerouted.
Wow!  ???

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on October 09, 2021, 08:57:44 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 09, 2021, 02:19:17 AM
Cheers Jeffrey but I have stopped buying altogether from the UK since Brexit. Vat charges and Post Office handling charges, coupled with the resulting delays, make relatively small purchases much more expensive now, unfortunately.

This is precisely the situation in Denmark too, so I have also stopped bying physical discs from Presto and all other British sources. Fortunately there are many fine CD dealers within EU, among them JPC, who's Paypal solution works well.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on October 09, 2021, 09:06:59 AM
Quote from: (: premont :) on October 09, 2021, 08:57:44 AM
This is precisely the situation in Denmark too, so I have also stopped bying physical discs from Presto and all other British sources. Fortunately there are many fine CD dealers within EU, among them JPC, who's Paypal solution works well.

Ditto. JPC also works with Mastercard now.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 09, 2021, 12:15:42 PM
Quote from: aligreto on October 09, 2021, 02:19:17 AM
Cheers Jeffrey but I have stopped buying altogether from the UK since Brexit. Vat charges and Post Office handling charges, coupled with the resulting delays, make relatively small purchases much more expensive now, unfortunately.
Don't blame you Fergus.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 09, 2021, 12:18:47 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 09, 2021, 03:30:21 AM
Sorry to hear that Fergus.  Buying things from anywhere (well, many places at least) should be getting easier rather than harder these days.
Cool!  May I ask what label/s it is on as the image is a bit blurry to me.

PD
HMV label PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 09, 2021, 01:12:33 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 09, 2021, 12:18:47 PM
HMV label PD.
I think that it was an HMV/Pathé....hard to read.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 12, 2021, 06:36:18 AM
On Classics and Vinyl Bliss: Medications on a Theme of John Blow.

https://youtu.be/IVpxt2zZ2OI
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 12, 2021, 08:43:30 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 12, 2021, 06:36:18 AM
On Classics and Vinyl Bliss: Medications on a Theme of John Blow.

https://youtu.be/IVpxt2zZ2OI
Possibly Bliss's greatest work, although Rignold's CBSO version on Lyrita is my favourite version. Handley's is very good though.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 13, 2021, 02:26:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 12, 2021, 06:36:18 AM
On Classics and Vinyl Bliss: Medications on a Theme of John Blow.

https://youtu.be/IVpxt2zZ2OI

Wonderfully nerdy that: listening to classical music while watching an LP spinning on a nice TT on a YT video  ;D  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 13, 2021, 08:02:53 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 13, 2021, 02:26:28 AM
Wonderfully nerdy that: listening to classical music while watching an LP spinning on a nice TT on a YT video  ;D  8)

:laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 15, 2021, 12:10:00 AM
Found a copy last week of Shostakovich's 10th Symphony. Wearing my train-spotting hat I noted this was the first issue of what was to be a full set of the symphonies by Bernard Haitink.

(https://i.imgur.com/EzBiqMi.jpg)

Recorded in January 1977 at the Kingsway Hall. The next instalment was to be the 15th in March 1978 and I think the final analogue recording, a surprising choice, the 4th in January 1979. With the onset of the 1980's I surmise the rest of the cycle was recorded in the digital domain. I know the 5th was as the first CD I ever heard and purchased. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 15, 2021, 04:02:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 15, 2021, 12:10:00 AM
Found a copy last week of Shostakovich's 10th Symphony. Wearing my train-spotting hat I noted this was the first issue of what was to be a full set of the symphonies by Bernard Haitink.

(https://i.imgur.com/EzBiqMi.jpg)

Recorded in January 1977 at the Kingsway Hall. The next instalment was to be the 15th in March 1978 and I think the final analogue recording, a surprising choice, the 4th in January 1979. With the onset of the 1980's I surmise the rest of the cycle was recorded in the digital domain. I know the 5th was as the first CD I ever heard and purchased.
Well-spotted Irons!  And thanks for the information behind the recordings.  :) 8)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 15, 2021, 06:38:27 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 15, 2021, 04:02:15 AM
Well-spotted Irons!  And thanks for the information behind the recordings.  :) 8)

PD

A pleasure, PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 16, 2021, 01:31:03 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 15, 2021, 12:10:00 AM
Found a copy last week of Shostakovich's 10th Symphony. Wearing my train-spotting hat I noted this was the first issue of what was to be a full set of the symphonies by Bernard Haitink.

(https://i.imgur.com/EzBiqMi.jpg)

Recorded in January 1977 at the Kingsway Hall. The next instalment was to be the 15th in March 1978 and I think the final analogue recording, a surprising choice, the 4th in January 1979. With the onset of the 1980's I surmise the rest of the cycle was recorded in the digital domain. I know the 5th was as the first CD I ever heard and purchased.

Nice.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 17, 2021, 04:23:36 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 16, 2021, 01:31:03 AM
Nice.

A set with usually positive feedback on GMG.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 17, 2021, 05:16:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 17, 2021, 04:23:36 AM
A set with usually positive feedback on GMG.

Cheers. I do believe that I have one or two of that set on vinyl.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 12, 2021, 01:30:24 PM
When the stars align with work, performance, recording and pressing the LP record is capable of producing a unique listening experience. Admittedly rare and usually when you least expect it.

(https://i.imgur.com/UTe4Loi.jpg)

Bernstein both playing and conducting his NYP in the Shostakovich 2nd Piano Concerto was such an event. Bernstein's playing is inhuman, an avalanche of sound. Directing the orchestra at the same time is taking the p---!
Although also available in stereo this copy is a Dutch mono recording. I have a theory that 1950's recordings (this is circa 6/1/1958) are more focused and dynamic in the mono format. Stereo was to come into it's own in the 1960's. My pressing is hot, with the music leaping from the grooves. But more importantly, what a performance!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 13, 2021, 04:17:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 12, 2021, 01:30:24 PM
When the stars align with work, performance, recording and pressing the LP record is capable of producing a unique listening experience. Admittedly rare and usually when you least expect it.

(https://i.imgur.com/UTe4Loi.jpg)

Bernstein both playing and conducting his NYP in the Shostakovich 2nd Piano Concerto was such an event. Bernstein's playing is inhuman, an avalanche of sound. Directing the orchestra at the same time is taking the p---!
Although also available in stereo this copy is a Dutch mono recording. I have a theory that 1950's recordings (this is circa 6/1/1958) are more focused and dynamic in the mono format. Stereo was to come into it's own in the 1960's. My pressing is hot, with the music leaping from the grooves. But more importantly, what a performance!
Cool!   8)  Sounds like you had an amazing listening session!   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 13, 2021, 07:16:42 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 13, 2021, 04:17:05 AM
Cool!   8)  Sounds like you had an amazing listening session!   :)

PD

;)

A strange one, PD. Purchased today a US Everest pressing of RVW 9th Symphony SDBR 3006. All well and good but it is sealed! A label which is a minefield. The Belock originals from the early 1960's are wonderful but post the demise of the company the pressings have a reputation of being awful. The label would settle it but breaking the seal does not appeal to me. The image below is an exact replica. I note the right hand edge has "Hi-Fi LP" not "Stereo" although a stereo recording. What would you do? 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 13, 2021, 02:19:13 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 13, 2021, 07:16:42 AM
;)

A strange one, PD. Purchased today a US Everest pressing of RVW 9th Symphony SDBR 3006. All well and good but it is sealed! A label which is a minefield. The Belock originals from the early 1960's are wonderful but post the demise of the company the pressings have a reputation of being awful. The label would settle it but breaking the seal does not appeal to me. The image below is an exact replica. I note the right hand edge has "Hi-Fi LP" not "Stereo" although a stereo recording. What would you do?
Hi Irons,

I have some info saved somewhere about Everest and pressings.  Will try and find it for you.  Off the top of my head and from what I can recall, the early ones had a narrowish stripe going from top to bottom on the cover by the opening and said something like "An original Belock recording"..maybe including his first name too.  Found this digging around:  Harry Belock was the original owner of Everest and he had his name prominently displayed on the cover.  The first pressings sound fantastic.  Belock soon lost interest and sold.  And the quality went down from there...

Think that I've found an image of an early pressing: 

(https://classicalvoiceamerica.org/wp-content/uploads/91kHYtMPaTL._SS500_-420x420.jpg)

I'd be tempted to do a bit more research re your cover and dating it.  I think (despite the comments that I found), from what I recall, it wasn't just the first pressings which sounded good.  If I find out more info, I'll happily share it with you.  Are you concerned with returning it to a seller and that's why you're holding off opening it up?  Was it very expensive?

PD

EDIT:  I found the website that I had remembered:  http://vinylbeat.com/cgi-bin/labelfocus.cgi?label=EVEREST&label_section=D,E,F  From what I recall, it was the later reissue ones which were supposedly inferior.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 14, 2021, 04:01:51 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 13, 2021, 02:19:13 PM
Hi Irons,

I have some info saved somewhere about Everest and pressings.  Will try and find it for you.  Off the top of my head and from what I can recall, the early ones had a narrowish stripe going from top to bottom on the cover by the opening and said something like "An original Belock recording"..maybe including his first name too.  Found this digging around:  Harry Belock was the original owner of Everest and he had his name prominently displayed on the cover.  The first pressings sound fantastic.  Belock soon lost interest and sold.  And the quality went down from there...

Think that I've found an image of an early pressing: 

(https://classicalvoiceamerica.org/wp-content/uploads/91kHYtMPaTL._SS500_-420x420.jpg)

I'd be tempted to do a bit more research re your cover and dating it.  I think (despite the comments that I found), from what I recall, it wasn't just the first pressings which sounded good.  If I find out more info, I'll happily share it with you.  Are you concerned with returning it to a seller and that's why you're holding off opening it up?  Was it very expensive?

PD

Thanks PD, you are confirming my suspicions that not an original Belock pressing. No, not expensive its just if sealed for sixty years I didn't want to be the one that broke it. My knowledge of US pressings is sketchy at best so I thought of asking you. An inscription on the lower right hand corner of the back cover - An Everest Records Production, 1313 N. Vine St, Hollywood 28, Calf.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 14, 2021, 06:53:27 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 14, 2021, 04:01:51 AM
Thanks PD, you are confirming my suspicions that not an original Belock pressing. No, not expensive its just if sealed for sixty years I didn't want to be the one that broke it. My knowledge of US pressings is sketchy at best so I thought of asking you. An inscription on the lower right hand corner of the back cover - An Everest Records Production, 1313 N. Vine St, Hollywood 28, Calf.
Hey, life is short.  Why not open it up and give it a shot?  Some time ago, I found a website that showed the various label incarnations and changes over the years.  Will try and find it again for you.  This weekend has been pretty busy, but I won't forget you.   :)

PD

Note:  I went to modify this reply and accidentally added my comments to an earlier posting!  See above.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 14, 2021, 11:04:52 PM
That performance of VW's 9th Symphony, recorded a few hours after the composer died in August 1958, is a very fine one. Some of the LPs included a speech by Boult 'To our American friends...' The other Everest LP I really liked was Copland conducting his own Third Symphony with the LSO (much better than Bernstein's CBS/Sony recording IMO). There a very good VW 'Job' as well (also Boult) although there were play-back problems when it transferred to CD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 15, 2021, 12:00:53 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 14, 2021, 11:04:52 PM
That performance of VW's 9th Symphony, recorded a few hours after the composer died in August 1958, is a very fine one. Some of the LPs included a speech by Boult 'To our American friends...' The other Everest LP I really liked was Copland conducting his own Third Symphony with the LSO (much better than Bernstein's CBS/Sony recording IMO). There a very good VW 'Job' as well (also Boult) although there were play-back problems when it transferred to CD.

I have the RVW 9th released under licence by the WRC. Not the 3rd Symphony, but I do have Copland's "Billy the Kid" on Everest which is excellent. I recall Vanguard released a series of Everest CD's in the mid 1990's which I avidly collected as they were so good.

I will take PD's advice and open up the sealed LP. Hopefully post a label image.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 15, 2021, 04:05:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 15, 2021, 12:00:53 AM
I have the RVW 9th released under licence by the WRC. Not the 3rd Symphony, but I do have Copland's "Billy the Kid" on Everest which is excellent. I recall Vanguard released a series of Everest CD's in the mid 1990's which I avidly collected as they were so good.

I will take PD's advice and open up the sealed LP. Hopefully post a label image.
Not certain whether or not you caught my edit (to an earlier posting), but you can compare your label to ones on this website which will give you an idea of how early/late your pressing was made in the history of that record company:  http://vinylbeat.com/cgi-bin/labelfocus.cgi?label=EVEREST&label_section=D,E,F

Working on morning coffee here.....  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 15, 2021, 06:40:02 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 15, 2021, 04:05:14 AM
Not certain whether or not you caught my edit (to an earlier posting), but you can compare your label to ones on this website which will give you an idea of how early/late your pressing was made in the history of that record company:  http://vinylbeat.com/cgi-bin/labelfocus.cgi?label=EVEREST&label_section=D,E,F

Working on morning coffee here.....  :)

PD

Morning coffee is addictive. If I miss out my teeth start to itch!

Label 5 PD, so late. UK pressed 3 are horrible.

The Copland above is 4A and I think I have 4C somewhere. Sadly 1A I don't have.

Thanks for info.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 15, 2021, 11:40:24 PM
Quote from: geralmar on November 15, 2021, 10:03:13 PM
Regarding Everest Records (in the United States).  Unless the back of the record jacket is silver and the record label is also silver-themed, the record is a near worthless reissue.  Everest, after bankruptcy sale in 1962, became a notorious cheap reissue label.  The genuine Everest classical recordings-- the first sixty or so numerically in the SDBR catalogue-- particularly suffered in reissue because worn stampers and inferior vinyl were used.  Everest dominated my early classical record collecting years and I took no pleasure in its decline.

Ahh, I thought as much. Thanks for the information. I guess original good pressings would be very expensive in the US.

A few facsimile issues were released in 1996 on the audiophile label DCC. Would not surprise me if these are now becoming expensive.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: geralmar on November 16, 2021, 12:06:35 PM
Everest, as a legitimate, viable classical L.P. label, only lasted 1958-62.  It was a subsidiary of Belock Instruments, which manufactured underwater microphones for the U.S. Navy.  Unfortunately Belock Instruments was caught defrauding the Government, and Everest was a victim of the dissolution of the parent company.  The label was purchased by an investor; afterwards "Everest" was slapped on all kinds of indifferent reissue product.  Furtwangler's widow sued the company for its unauthorized issue of a set of Beethoven symphonies under the Everest/Olympic label.  Among her complaints was that the 2nd symphony was not conducted by Furtwangler.  The set was quickly withdrawn; but of course I own a copy.

I read that Stokowski was furious when he found one of his Everest recordings in a record store cut-out bin.  I've always wondered if this was the reason Everest recordings were later issued under pseudonyms on the ultra-cheap Peerless Classics label, hundreds of which I once encountered in a Woolworths.  I didn't buy any at the time; but own a few now.


(https://i.postimg.cc/9QNrFDD3/R-14981250-1585060242-6341-jpeg.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
1974
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 16, 2021, 09:46:57 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 15, 2021, 12:00:53 AM
I have the RVW 9th released under licence by the WRC. Not the 3rd Symphony, but I do have Copland's "Billy the Kid" on Everest which is excellent. I recall Vanguard released a series of Everest CD's in the mid 1990's which I avidly collected as they were so good.

I will take PD's advice and open up the sealed LP. Hopefully post a label image.
The Third Symphony was included in the CD release Lol:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 17, 2021, 12:09:19 AM
Quote from: geralmar on November 16, 2021, 12:06:35 PM
Everest, as a legitimate, viable classical L.P. label, only lasted 1958-62.  It was a subsidiary of Belock Instruments, which manufactured underwater microphones for the U.S. Navy.  Unfortunately Belock Instruments was caught defrauding the Government, and Everest was a victim of the dissolution of the parent company.  The label was purchased by an investor; afterwards "Everest" was slapped on all kinds of indifferent reissue product.  Furtwangler's widow sued the company for its unauthorized issue of a set of Beethoven symphonies under the Everest/Olympic label.  Among her complaints was that the 2nd symphony was not conducted by Furtwangler.  The set was quickly withdrawn; but of course I own a copy.

I read that Stokowski was furious when he found one of his Everest recordings in a record store cut-out bin.  I've always wondered if this was the reason Everest recordings were later issued under pseudonyms on the ultra-cheap Peerless Classics label, hundreds of which I once encountered in a Woolworths.  I didn't buy any at the time; but own a few now.


(https://i.postimg.cc/9QNrFDD3/R-14981250-1585060242-6341-jpeg.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
1974

Fascinating. I was aware of the short life of the Company but the rest of your post is all new to me. There is a parallel with Decca who were heavily involved in the development of radar systems during WWII.
I have a DCC Everest reissue of Stokowski conducting the Shostakovich 5th.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 17, 2021, 12:35:35 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 16, 2021, 09:46:57 PM
The Third Symphony was included in the CD release Lol:


The World Record Club, who reissued many Everest titles in the UK, went for Susskind, Jeffrey! Initially I thought an odd choice and surprised he even recorded for the label, but Appalachian Spring does have more popular appeal.

(https://i.imgur.com/q8AbypL.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/0DRUNJS.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 17, 2021, 03:34:18 AM
Interesting to read about the World Record Club.  You're fortunate that they released so many wonderful LPs in your neck of the woods.  :)

I do have several of those Everest CDs and they are wonderful!  Probably my favorite is the Vaughan Williams' 9th one.  Some years ago BRO had a bunch of them for sale at discount prices.  Lucky me!  :D

By the way, I stumbled across a listing on Prestomusic's website.  They offer a number of the Everest recordings as downloads in various quality from Mp3 on up.  A sample here.... https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/search?search_query=Everest%20vaughan%20williams

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 17, 2021, 06:58:26 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 17, 2021, 03:34:18 AM
Interesting to read about the World Record Club.  You're fortunate that they released so many wonderful LPs in your neck of the woods.  :)

I do have several of those Everest CDs and they are wonderful!  Probably my favorite is the Vaughan Williams' 9th one.  Some years ago BRO had a bunch of them for sale at discount prices.  Lucky me!  :D

By the way, I stumbled across a listing on Prestomusic's website.  They offer a number of the Everest recordings as downloads in various quality from Mp3 on up.  A sample here.... https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/search?search_query=Everest%20vaughan%20williams

PD

Today sound engineers are not held in such high esteem as the early days of stereo. Three greats in the US - Bob Fine at Mercury, Lewis Leyton at RCA and Bert Whyte at Everest were masters of the art. With all the tech progress in the intervening years I still prefer recordings by these guys to the super-clean digital age we are now in. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 19, 2021, 01:21:57 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 17, 2021, 06:58:26 AM
Today sound engineers are not held in such high esteem as the early days of stereo. Three greats in the US - Bob Fine at Mercury, Lewis Leyton at RCA and Bert Whyte at Everest were masters of the art. With all the tech progress in the intervening years I still prefer recordings by these guys to the super-clean digital age we are now in.

People like those mentioned above, and others, of course, defined the "Sound" of their label. One knew what to expect, in a good way.
I agree regarding the super-clean digital comment above and would add that many modern recording [far from all, I hastily add] can unfortunately sound too sterile to these ears. However, I am happy to be a dinosaur of the Analogue Age.  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 19, 2021, 05:26:53 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 17, 2021, 06:58:26 AM
Today sound engineers are not held in such high esteem as the early days of stereo. Three greats in the US - Bob Fine at Mercury, Lewis Leyton at RCA and Bert Whyte at Everest were masters of the art. With all the tech progress in the intervening years I still prefer recordings by these guys to the super-clean digital age we are now in.
The best ones should be.

Quote from: aligreto on November 19, 2021, 01:21:57 AM
People like those mentioned above, and others, of course, defined the "Sound" of their label. One knew what to expect, in a good way.
I agree regarding the super-clean digital comment above and would add that many modern recording [far from all, I hastily add] can unfortunately sound too sterile to these ears. However, I am happy to be a dinosaur of the Analogue Age.  ;D
+1  And, yes, sometimes the digital recordings sound off--balance-wise and/or too much in your face; I really don't need to hear every breath that the musician takes.   :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on November 19, 2021, 08:25:16 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 19, 2021, 05:26:53 AM
The best ones should be.
+1  And, yes, sometimes the digital recordings sound off--balance-wise and/or too much in your face; I really don't need to hear every breath that the musician takes.   :(

PD

Walter Legge and EMI and Kenneth Wilkinson at Decc probablly also deserve some mention is this connection. There are more recent labels who pursued an honest microphone technique, such as Steven Epstein at Sony and Jack Renner at Telarc.

One of the big drivers of ultra-many microphone technique is economics. A very large array of microphones, almost to the point where every instrument is recorded separately, facilitates editing - dropping a wrong note out of the mix and replacing it with the the same instrument on another take, cutting between takes while using separately recorded reverb to cover the break, etc. It makes it possible to use live recordings, and rehearsals, rather than costly recording sessions.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on November 19, 2021, 08:42:03 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on November 19, 2021, 08:25:16 AM

One of the big drivers of ultra-many microphone technique is economics. A very large array of microphones, almost to the point where every instrument is recorded separately, facilitates exiting - dropping a wrong note out of the mix and replacing it with the the same instrument on another take, cutting between takes while using separately recorded reverb to cover the break, etc. It makes it possible to use live recordings, and rehearsals, rather than costly recording sessions.

A good point, well made. As in every business, economics becomes the driver.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Iota on November 19, 2021, 12:58:15 PM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on November 19, 2021, 08:25:16 AM
One of the big drivers of ultra-many microphone technique is economics. A very large array of microphones, almost to the point where every instrument is recorded separately, facilitates editing - dropping a wrong note out of the mix and replacing it with the the same instrument on another take, cutting between takes while using separately recorded reverb to cover the break, etc. It makes it possible to use live recordings, and rehearsals, rather than costly recording sessions.

Interesting!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 02, 2021, 02:36:04 AM
My late father-in-law was fond of saying "something of low cost has low value". Supraphon flooded the classical LP market in the late 1960's at a bargain-bin price of around £1 each and the record buying public (including myself) did not hold the label in particularly high regard. Len Gregory aka The Cartridge Man - writing this I discovered with great sadness Len has passed away - showed me the error of my ways by demonstrating the excellence of Supraphon chamber music, especially string quartets. Orchestral I find hit or miss, mostly miss.

(https://i.imgur.com/d0VcOFC.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/hM8ofxi.jpg)

Listening to the 1962 recording of the Vlach Quartet I could not help thinking how right Len was. Unlike the more forensic recordings of today but a richness of sound which is addictive. With performing practice from another age - I have never heard such a distinctive viola sound as part of a string quartet. Of course it helps that Dvorak is part of the DNA of the Vlach, Smetana, Prague and my favourite Janacek Quartets. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 02, 2021, 03:21:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 02, 2021, 02:36:04 AM
My late father-in-law was fond of saying "something of low cost has low value". Supraphon flooded the classical LP market in the late 1960's at a bargain-bin price of around £1 each and the record buying public (including myself) did not hold the label in particularly high regard. Len Gregory aka The Cartridge Man - writing this I discovered with great sadness Len has passed away - showed me the error of my ways by demonstrating the excellence of Supraphon chamber music, especially string quartets. Orchestral I find hit or miss, mostly miss.

(https://i.imgur.com/d0VcOFC.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/hM8ofxi.jpg)

Listening to the 1962 recording of the Vlach Quartet I could not help thinking how right Len was. Unlike the more forensic recordings of today but a richness of sound which is addictive. With performing practice from another age - I have never heard such a distinctive viola sound as part of a string quartet. Of course it helps that Dvorak is part of the DNA of the Vlach, Smetana, Prague and my favourite Janacek Quartets.
I googled "The Cartridge Man" and found a short article by Michael Fremer on Analogue Planet announcing the news.  From all of the comments there, it sounds like he was a really generous and kind human being--as well as manufacturing all kinds of neat turntable tools, accessories and equipment.  Did you ever meet him Irons?  I read that he lived in London.  And what is the story about how he introduced you to Supraphon recordings?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 02, 2021, 07:33:27 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 02, 2021, 03:21:29 AM
I googled "The Cartridge Man" and found a short article by Michael Fremer on Analogue Planet announcing the news.  From all of the comments there, it sounds like he was a really generous and kind human being--as well as manufacturing all kinds of neat turntable tools, accessories and equipment.  Did you ever meet him Irons?  I read that he lived in London.  And what is the story about how he introduced you to Supraphon recordings?

PD

Blimey PD brace yourself for a long reply. :o Many years ago I phoned Len regarding his Music Maker cartridge. He invited me over to his house in Croydon which is only a forty minute drive. An experience I will never forget, for starters once seated I had dogs of every shape, size and colour climbing all over me which Len found to be a normal occurrence. His system had me salivating with big Quad Electrostatic speakers driven by vintage BBC valve amps, I can't recall his TT which sported a Hadcock tonearm and of course his Music Maker cartridge. I purchased his cartridge and a few years later bought another. But it is not this I remember about Len, his enthusiasm for the classical LP record that lingers in the mind and introducing the wonders of Supraphon. After many hours listening I walked out of his house with not only a cartridge but a double album of the Prague Quartet playing Mozart as a free gift.
Pre-Covid, Fairfield Halls at Croydon held a record fair twice a year and Len was always in attendance and we had a good chat all things Supraphon. His infectious enthusiasm and personality is something I will not forget and learning today of his passing has made me quite sad.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 02, 2021, 10:27:55 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 02, 2021, 07:33:27 AM
Blimey PD brace yourself for a long reply. :o Many years ago I phoned Len regarding his Music Maker cartridge. He invited me over to his house in Croydon which is only a forty minute drive. An experience I will never forget, for starters once seated I had dogs of every shape, size and colour climbing all over me which Len found to be a normal occurrence. His system had me salivating with big Quad Electrostatic speakers driven by vintage BBC valve amps, I can't recall his TT which sported a Hadcock tonearm and of course his Music Maker cartridge. I purchased his cartridge and a few years later bought another. But it is not this I remember about Len, his enthusiasm for the classical LP record that lingers in the mind and introducing the wonders of Supraphon. After many hours listening I walked out of his house with not only a cartridge but a double album of the Prague Quartet playing Mozart as a free gift.
Pre-Covid, Fairfield Halls at Croydon held a record fair twice a year and Len was always in attendance and we had a good chat all things Supraphon. His infectious enthusiasm and personality is something I will not forget and learning today of his passing has made me quite sad.
Sounds like you had some wonderful times with him and some great memories to cherish.  That said, it's still hard to wrap ones head around the idea that someone is gone--particularly when you had no warning/news ahead of his death.  I'm so sorry for you loss Irons.   :(

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 03, 2021, 12:40:38 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 02, 2021, 10:27:55 AM
Sounds like you had some wonderful times with him and some great memories to cherish.  That said, it's still hard to wrap ones head around the idea that someone is gone--particularly when you had no warning/news ahead of his death.  I'm so sorry for you loss Irons.   :(

PD

Cheers, PD.

(https://i.imgur.com/WohoOtk.jpg)

I listened last night to Mozart's String Quartet No.20 from the double LP mentioned in previous post. Great piece.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 03, 2021, 05:29:52 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 03, 2021, 12:40:38 AM
Cheers, PD.

(https://i.imgur.com/WohoOtk.jpg)

I listened last night to Mozart's String Quartet No.20 from the double LP mentioned in previous post. Great piece.
Not at all surprised that you revisited that album; actually, I'd have been more surprised if you hadn't!  ;)

Listening to Papa Haydn at the moment (see current listening thread).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 08, 2021, 06:23:03 AM
Due to the closure of my favourite (and only) record emporium recently I came to the decision that's it, no more LPs. Not such a bad thing as I have well enough to see out my days.
Could not resist popping in when passing Oxfam in Epsom this morning. I am finding that currently charity shops are losing interest in stocking CDs, let alone LPs. Surprisingly, two boxes with quite a few classical from which I pulled -

(https://i.imgur.com/r6EpBOy.jpg)  (https://i.imgur.com/RAiT9Jv.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/k4uGfTf.jpg)  (https://i.imgur.com/rQ6mgeb.jpg)

My resolution didn't last long! The Mozart is a double LP. "Music from Sweden" is the most interesting, one I have not seen before. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2021, 06:32:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 08, 2021, 06:23:03 AM
Due to the closure of my favourite (and only) record emporium recently I came to the decision that's it, no more LPs. Not such a bad thing as I have well enough to see out my days.
Could not resist popping in when passing Oxfam in Epsom this morning. I am finding that currently charity shops are losing interest in stocking CDs, let alone LPs. Surprisingly, two boxes with quite a few classical from which I pulled -

(https://i.imgur.com/r6EpBOy.jpg)  (https://i.imgur.com/RAiT9Jv.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/k4uGfTf.jpg)  (https://i.imgur.com/rQ6mgeb.jpg)

My resolution didn't last long! The Mozart is a double LP. "Music from Sweden" is the most interesting, one I have not seen before.
And I'm glad that it didn't!  I was just going "Oh, no!!!" when I saw your pictures.  :D ;D

Interesting observation at your end Irons.  Last time I was in a charity shop (probably over a month ago), I noticed that they had upped the prices on their LPs (not sure about the CDs).  They were now priced at either 3 or 4 bucks--I forget wish.  A friend that was with me bought a country LP.

Cool finds:  particularly (for me) the Rostropovich and that Swedish one--bizarre cover on that one!  Is there actually a huge statue of a fish like that?!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on December 08, 2021, 06:40:59 AM
Nice finds ... HMV Concert Classics usually have great sound & performances, and I'd like that Swedish one too, that Rosenberg piece seems to be a real rarity ...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 08, 2021, 07:28:15 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2021, 06:32:00 AM
And I'm glad that it didn't!  I was just going "Oh, no!!!" when I saw your pictures.  :D ;D

Interesting observation at your end Irons.  Last time I was in a charity shop (probably over a month ago), I noticed that they had upped the prices on their LPs (not sure about the CDs).  They were now priced at either 3 or 4 bucks--I forget wish.  A friend that was with me bought a country LP.

Cool finds:  particularly (for me) the Rostropovich and that Swedish one--bizarre cover on that one!  Is there actually a huge statue of a fish like that?!

PD

Sort of given up with charity shops, PD. I look for boxes - always on the floor - but even Mantovani and Roger Whittaker are becoming in short supply.
Details are given of the cover image of a fish which is a sculpture by Carl Milles.

Quote from: MusicTurner on December 08, 2021, 06:40:59 AM


Nice finds ... HMV Concert Classics usually have great sound & performances, and I'd like that Swedish one too, that Rosenberg piece seems to be a real rarity ...

Agreed, I like Concert Classics too. I guess as every forum member, I don't need another recording of the Dvorak, but Rostropovich swung it.

Yes, what's "Voyage to America" about? The sub-title is Intermezzo; The Railway Fugue. ???
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2021, 07:33:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 08, 2021, 07:28:15 AM
Sort of given up with charity shops, PD. I look for boxes - always on the floor - but even Mantovani and Roger Whittaker are becoming in short supply.
Details are given of the cover image of a fish which is a sculpture by Carl Milles.

Agreed, I like Concert Classics too. I guess as every forum member, I don't need another recording of the Dvorak, but Rostropovich swung it.

Yes, what's "Voyage to America" about? The sub-title is Intermezzo; The Railway Fugue. ???
The condition of the records these days--at least in my neck of the woods--is normally pretty poor.  Must admit, my enthusiasm for wading through them is normally quite low.

PD

p.s.  And thanks for the info re the sculpture!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on December 08, 2021, 07:34:32 AM
Remarkably, one of my latest purchases is a relatively recent release (from the last few years) of Stockhausen piano recordings. Apparently someone is still bothering to press avant-garde music on vinyl- more power to them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on December 08, 2021, 08:09:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 08, 2021, 06:23:03 AM
Due to the closure of my favourite (and only) record emporium recently I came to the decision that's it, no more LPs. Not such a bad thing as I have well enough to see out my days.
Could not resist popping in when passing Oxfam in Epsom this morning. I am finding that currently charity shops are losing interest in stocking CDs, let alone LPs. Surprisingly, two boxes with quite a few classical from which I pulled -

(https://i.imgur.com/r6EpBOy.jpg)  (https://i.imgur.com/RAiT9Jv.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/k4uGfTf.jpg)  (https://i.imgur.com/rQ6mgeb.jpg)

My resolution didn't last long! The Mozart is a double LP. "Music from Sweden" is the most interesting, one I have not seen before.

I would have been surprised and disappointed if it did  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 09, 2021, 12:31:29 AM
Quote from: aligreto on December 08, 2021, 08:09:36 AM
I would have been surprised and disappointed if it did  :)

;D

The Rosenberg piece is rhythmic with the forward motion of a big steam train without attempting to sound like one. Impressive.

Voyage to America: Intermezzo; The Railway Fugue -  https://youtu.be/z1e-XAL4_SU
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on December 09, 2021, 01:09:55 AM
Breaking the rules with a fortyfive.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on December 09, 2021, 05:41:49 AM
I ought to pick up a few classical 45s - they seem pretty rare for whatever reason.

Someone at a store tried to sell me some old 78 albums (the ones which were actually albums, in a bound book) but I had nothing to play them on.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 09, 2021, 06:22:08 AM
Quote from: fbjim on December 08, 2021, 07:34:32 AM
Remarkably, one of my latest purchases is a relatively recent release (from the last few years) of Stockhausen piano recordings. Apparently someone is still bothering to press avant-garde music on vinyl- more power to them.
When was the work composed and when was the LP pressed?  :)

Quote from: Valentino on December 09, 2021, 01:09:55 AM
Breaking the rules with a fortyfive.
Cool!  ;D

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on December 09, 2021, 06:57:25 AM
2016, though the works were from the 1950s - this was the release.

https://www.discogs.com/release/8600047-Karlheinz-Stockhausen-Beton-Studie-Zeitmass-F%C3%BCr-F%C3%BCnf-Holzbl%C3%A4ser-Klavierstuck-XI

Haven't actually listened to the thing yet because my record player is currently out of commission  ???
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 09, 2021, 07:05:15 AM
Quote from: fbjim on December 09, 2021, 06:57:25 AM
2016, though the works were from the 1950s - this was the release.

https://www.discogs.com/release/8600047-Karlheinz-Stockhausen-Beton-Studie-Zeitmass-F%C3%BCr-F%C3%BCnf-Holzbl%C3%A4ser-Klavierstuck-XI

Haven't actually listened to the thing yet because my record player is currently out of commission  ???
Ah, yes, you had mentioned that.  Is it something relatively simple to fix?  Or is there anyone near you who does repairs (and can also let you know whether or not it's worth putting the money into to fix it?)?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on December 09, 2021, 07:12:39 AM
It's more of a "my player is a cheapo model" issue, though the needle is nice. I've got a triple paycheck month this month plus a Christmas bonus so I'm just going to replace it entirely.

Currently I have my eyes on this one.

https://www.hawthornestereo.com/rega-planar-2-turntable.html
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 09, 2021, 07:17:07 AM
Quote from: fbjim on December 09, 2021, 07:12:39 AM
It's more of a "my player is a cheapo model" issue, though the needle is nice. I've got a triple paycheck month this month plus a Christmas bonus so I'm just going to replace it entirely.
Good luck with it!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 10, 2021, 01:08:45 AM
Quote from: fbjim on December 09, 2021, 06:57:25 AM
2016, though the works were from the 1950s - this was the release.

https://www.discogs.com/release/8600047-Karlheinz-Stockhausen-Beton-Studie-Zeitmass-F%C3%BCr-F%C3%BCnf-Holzbl%C3%A4ser-Klavierstuck-XI

Haven't actually listened to the thing yet because my record player is currently out of commission  ???

Extremely rare I would think. Value will only rise.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on December 10, 2021, 06:56:08 AM
possibly. most classical isn't too valuable aside from the really old-school record collector stuff like LSCs which were in that Ultimate Sound book or etc.


a few new releases have risen in value like the Jarvi Beethoven box set. Japan and China have their own market but that tends to be some relatively obscure Bach and Beethoven recordings
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 10, 2021, 08:18:49 AM
Quote from: fbjim on December 10, 2021, 06:56:08 AM
possibly. most classical isn't too valuable aside from the really old-school record collector stuff like LSCs which were in that Ultimate Sound book or etc.


a few new releases have risen in value like the Jarvi Beethoven box set. Japan and China have their own market but that tends to be some relatively obscure Bach and Beethoven recordings

Which is my point. Companies producing LPs currently have the best of intentions but fall into the trap of issuing of "popular" repertoire. Any half-decent vinyl collection will have more then one set of Beethoven symphonies obtained at little cost. So why pay top dollar for a new set with probably "lesser" artists?
Currently Tacet are an example of this misguided policy -  https://www.tacet.de/main/seite1.php?language=en&filename=lp.php

I admire that at last someone has the balls to stray from the well trodden path and issued Stockhausen on vinyl. I hope they don't lose money on the venture, but they probably will.

I agree with your assessment of vinyl's worth. Good luck to the person who disposes of my collection when I upgrade to the listening room in the sky. A collection painstakingly built over decades has little monetary value.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on December 10, 2021, 08:38:28 AM
From what I can tell it's one of those companies which release recordings in the public domain, so it's probably not particularly expensive apart from the production cost. That said, from reading online reviews they did get them from the original tapes rather than something like a LP transfer that you sometimes see with historical public-domain labels.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 11, 2021, 12:49:43 AM
Quote from: fbjim on December 10, 2021, 08:38:28 AM
From what I can tell it's one of those companies which release recordings in the public domain, so it's probably not particularly expensive apart from the production cost. That said, from reading online reviews they did get them from the original tapes rather than something like a LP transfer that you sometimes see with historical public-domain labels.

A LP pressing from a digital master is pointless. I would rather the CD.

Reading an interview some time ago with the head man at Nimbus and he was asked if he would ever contemplate returning to the production of LP records. He was adamant that it would never happen, describing the process of pressing records as fraught with difficulties and downright dangerous for operators.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 11, 2021, 04:16:54 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 11, 2021, 12:49:43 AM
A LP pressing from a digital master is pointless. I would rather the CD.

Reading an interview some time ago with the head man at Nimbus and he was asked if he would ever contemplate returning to the production of LP records. He was adamant that it would never happen, describing the process of pressing records as fraught with difficulties and downright dangerous for operators.   
Irons,

Is the interview online?  If so, I'd be interested in reading it--if you can and would be so kind as to provide a link to it.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 12, 2021, 01:07:29 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 11, 2021, 04:16:54 AM
Irons,

Is the interview online?  If so, I'd be interested in reading it--if you can and would be so kind as to provide a link to it.  :)



PD

PD, I cannot honestly recall but possibly Gramophone.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 12, 2021, 03:22:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 12, 2021, 01:07:29 AM
PD, I cannot honestly recall but possibly Gramophone.
Thanks!  I'll try more googling later.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on December 13, 2021, 12:51:36 PM
Quote from: fbjim on December 09, 2021, 05:41:49 AMSomeone at a store tried to sell me some old 78 albums (the ones which were actually albums, in a bound book) but I had nothing to play them on.
You obviously need a Rega Planar 78 with the associated RB78 pickup.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 30, 2021, 12:07:24 AM
Whilst staying with us over Christmas my daughter had a 'sort out' of her stuff and I had the task of taking the clothes, books, CDs and DVDs to the local charity shops (Mind, Oxfam and Animal Welfare). Before doing that I discovered about 50% of the DVDs and CDs either contained no discs at all or the wrong ones (a Spice Girls CD in a Beyoncé CD box, a disc from the American series 'Friends' in a DVD box of the Movie 'Captain Phillips' etc - you get the idea). I may have severe OCDCDCD but at least I tend to keep the relevant CDs and DVDs with their boxes! When I pointed this out this to my daughter she apologised stating that it had been done 'in a bit of a rush'. Anyway, the Oxfam shop features some classical CDs and LPs and I rewarded myself with the two LPs below. Oddly enough I never owned Boult's Decca LP of VW's 'A London symphony' as after I bought the Symphony No.6 from that series, which made such an impact on me, I saved up for the EMI boxed set of LPs. One nice thing about the Eclipse series was the informative notes by Gilbert Burnett:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 30, 2021, 03:48:51 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 30, 2021, 12:07:24 AM
Whilst staying with us over Christmas my daughter had a 'sort out' of her stuff and I had the task of taking the clothes, books, CDs and DVDs to the local charity shops (Mind, Oxfam and Animal Welfare). Before doing that I discovered about 50% of the DVDs and CDs either contained no discs at all or the wrong ones (a Spice Girls CD in a Beyoncé CD box, a disc from the American series 'Friends' in a DVD box of the Movie 'Captain Phillips' etc - you get the idea). I may have severe OCDCDCD but at least I tend to keep the relevant CDs and DVDs with their boxes! When I pointed this out this to my daughter she apologised stating that it had been done 'in a bit of a rush'. Anyway, the Oxfam shop features some classical CDs and LPs and I rewarded myself with the two LPs below. Oddly enough I never owned Boult's Decca LP of VW's 'A London symphony' as after I bought the Symphony No.6 from that series, which made such an impact on me, I saved up for the EMI boxed set of LPs. One nice thing about the Eclipse series was the informative notes by Gilbert Burnett:
Were you two able to find and correct the contents?  And secondly, how are your plans going for turning her old bedroom into a second "man cave"?

Nice haul!  Did you sort through any of your stuff to bring too?  ;)
PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 30, 2021, 02:39:10 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 30, 2021, 03:48:51 AM
Were you two able to find and correct the contents?  And secondly, how are your plans going for turning her old bedroom into a second "man cave"?

Nice haul!  Did you sort through any of your stuff to bring too?  ;)
PD
No PD in most cases I was not able to find the correct contents! Yes, I did donate some stuff of my own (mainly books) and will continue to do so as 'de-cluttering' makes sense at my time of life and it is, I think, psychologically healthy as well. There's no way I'd be allowed to turn my daughter's bedroom into 'Man Cave No.2'.
;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 31, 2021, 03:39:18 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 30, 2021, 02:39:10 PM
No PD in most cases I was not able to find the correct contents! Yes, I did donate some stuff of my own (mainly books) and will continue to do so as 'de-cluttering' makes sense at my time of life and it is, I think, psychologically healthy as well. There's no way I'd be allowed to turn my daughter's bedroom into 'Man Cave No.2'.
;D
Oh, no!  I suspect that she had taken favorites with her years ago when she had moved out (or at least thought that she had)?  And, yes, it's a good feeling to pass things along and also to declutter.  And I was teasing you about MCII--though if you're wife said that you could put a few CD shelves and/or record cabinets in there in a "discreet and non-intrusive way", I'd bet my stereo speakers that you would go for it and inwardly be jumping up and down with joy!  ;) :)


PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 08, 2022, 08:09:13 AM
Some acquisitions today -

Scriabin: The Devine Poem. Svetlanov USSR SO. Melodiya/EMI ASD 2523.

Glazounov: 6th Symphony & Saxophone Concerto. Fedoseyev/Korneyev Moscow RSO. Melodiya/EMI ASD 3383.

Ravel: Daphnis and Chloe. Maazel, Cleveland Orchestra. Decca SXL 6703.

Ravel: Two Piano Concertos. Monique Haas, ONP Paray. DG 138988 SLPM.

Also a double CD of Barbirolli conducting Delius and a single CD of Mackerras/Janacek. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2022, 10:47:49 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 08, 2022, 08:09:13 AM
Some acquisitions today -

Scriabin: The Devine Poem. Svetlanov USSR SO. Melodiya/EMI ASD 2523.

Glazounov: 6th Symphony & Saxophone Concerto. Fedoseyev/Korneyev Moscow RSO. Melodiya/EMI ASD 3383.

Ravel: Daphnis and Chloe. Maazel, Cleveland Orchestra. Decca SXL 6703.

Ravel: Two Piano Concertos. Monique Haas, ONP Paray. DG 138988 SLPM.

Also a double CD of Barbirolli conducting Delius and a single CD of Mackerras/Janacek.
I'm not familiar with any of those recordings, but I'll bet that they are yummy!  :)

Curious here as to what is on that Mackerras/Janacek CD!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 09, 2022, 01:21:43 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 08, 2022, 10:47:49 AM
I'm not familiar with any of those recordings, but I'll bet that they are yummy!  :)

Curious here as to what is on that Mackerras/Janacek CD!

PD

A clean up on the Loricraft and then see how we go. No rush as lots of Sibelius, Bartok and Dvorak to catch up with. ;)

When CD first came out there was one particular disc that hit the spot, an early Decca digital issue of Sinfonietta and Taras Bulba with the Vienna Phil and Mackerras. Best thing since sliced bread. When upgrading to vinyl >:D I sold all my CDs. Since buying the blighters again, I have been on the lookout for the above. A sealed unopened copy with in the latest incarnation the addition of The Age of Gold with Haitink for the princely sum of £1.99. I'm fully prepared for disappointment after a 40 year gap. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 09, 2022, 02:17:19 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 09, 2022, 01:21:43 AM
A clean up on the Loricraft and then see how we go. No rush as lots of Sibelius, Bartok and Dvorak to catch up with. ;)

When CD first came out there was one particular disc that hit the spot, an early Decca digital issue of Sinfonietta and Taras Bulba with the Vienna Phil and Mackerras. Best thing since sliced bread. When upgrading to vinyl >:D I sold all my CDs. Since buying the blighters again, I have been on the lookout for the above. A sealed unopened copy with in the latest incarnation the addition of The Age of Gold with Haitink for the princely sum of £1.99. I'm fully prepared for disappointment after a 40 year gap.
Sounds like a nice CD!  I'm guessing that it's this one? 

(https://img.discogs.com/fgKZtLYChLwMJbJur3ZseTTZx0A=/fit-in/592x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7162835-1438532056-5603.jpeg.jpg)

And happy listening!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 10, 2022, 12:29:52 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 09, 2022, 02:17:19 AM
Sounds like a nice CD!  I'm guessing that it's this one? 

(https://img.discogs.com/fgKZtLYChLwMJbJur3ZseTTZx0A=/fit-in/592x600/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-7162835-1438532056-5603.jpeg.jpg)

And happy listening!  :)

PD

It is and from forty years ago -
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 15, 2022, 12:38:51 AM
Schumann: Violin Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/oSsQj2j.jpg?1)

Posting, I discovered this a Mercury recording without credits on label or cover. Szerying recorded with Haitink the Mendelssohn VC coupled with Tchaikovsky, again released on Philips.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 15, 2022, 12:44:30 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 15, 2022, 12:38:51 AM
Schumann: Violin Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/oSsQj2j.jpg?1)

Posting, I discovered this a Mercury recording without credits on label or cover. Szerying recorded with Haitink the Mendelssohn VC coupled with Tchaikovsky, again released on Philips.
Oh, interesting!  Where was the record pressed Irons--I didn't see anything on the label?  And how did you enjoy it (including the sound)?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 15, 2022, 01:05:16 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 15, 2022, 12:44:30 AM
Oh, interesting!  Where was the record pressed Irons--I didn't see anything on the label?  And how did you enjoy it (including the sound)?

PD

Nor can I, PD. My guess Dutch. I find Schumann an elusive composer but enjoy trying to work him out. Must confess listening I had no idea a Mercury recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 15, 2022, 05:15:13 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 15, 2022, 12:38:51 AM
Schumann: Violin Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/oSsQj2j.jpg?1)

Posting, I discovered this a Mercury recording without credits on label or cover. Szerying recorded with Haitink the Mendelssohn VC coupled with Tchaikovsky, again released on Philips.

Mercury Living Presence ceased operations in 1968 (according to Wikipedia) and were acquired by Polygram. Mercury recordings were issued on the Philips label starting in the 1970's, but I thought they had Mercury branding. Part of the unique sound of the Mercury LPs were the use of their own cutting system, so I imagine the Philips reissues didn't sound quite the same.

I was curious enough to look up the release history:
https://www.discogs.com/master/781280-Henryk-Szeryng-London-Symphony-Antal-Dorati-Felix-Mendelssohn-Bartholdy-Robert-Schumann-Concerto-In-


It was perhaps more surprising to me that some of the recordings of Barbirolli that now appear on EMI were Mercury productions, originally recorded for Pye-Nixa. For instance, the Dvorak.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 17, 2022, 01:13:12 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on January 15, 2022, 05:15:13 AM
Mercury Living Presence ceased operations in 1968 (according to Wikipedia) and were acquired by Polygram. Mercury recordings were issued on the Philips label starting in the 1970's, but I thought they had Mercury branding. Part of the unique sound of the Mercury LPs were the use of their own cutting system, so I imagine the Philips reissues didn't sound quite the same.

I was curious enough to look up the release history:
https://www.discogs.com/master/781280-Henryk-Szeryng-London-Symphony-Antal-Dorati-Felix-Mendelssohn-Bartholdy-Robert-Schumann-Concerto-In-


It was perhaps more surprising to me that some of the recordings of Barbirolli that now appear on EMI were Mercury productions, originally recorded for Pye-Nixa. For instance, the Dvorak.

Never straightforward delving into the twist and turns of record labels during the LP era. Mercury were first licensed to Pye, which I think are all mono. After Pye, EMI took over and then Philips who  eventually purchased the back-catalogue. I like the British EMI Mercury pressings but some collectors claim they are inferior to the US originals.

You make a good point re cutting of the "mother" by Philips. This may go some way to explain I didn't recognise Szerying as a Mercury recording - that and my cloth ears. :)
Incidentally, the Discogs link did not include my pressing SAL 3504. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 17, 2022, 06:51:01 PM
It is confusing. Some of the Philips issues looked like this:

(https://img.discogs.com/0dRSkpHGZht4hrBKA7maAXb0vl8=/fit-in/300x300/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(40)/discogs-images/R-1951133-1397278379-6717.jpeg.jpg)

but later the Mercury branding returned

(https://img.discogs.com/XE3_RVS-Fb7igmar9DYP-IBYFsk=/fit-in/600x596/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-8936504-1471811681-4332.jpeg.jpg)

The latter is a 1982 release, disc made in Holland.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 18, 2022, 12:11:04 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on January 17, 2022, 06:51:01 PM
It is confusing. Some of the Philips issues looked like this:

(https://img.discogs.com/0dRSkpHGZht4hrBKA7maAXb0vl8=/fit-in/300x300/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(40)/discogs-images/R-1951133-1397278379-6717.jpeg.jpg)

but later the Mercury branding returned

(https://img.discogs.com/XE3_RVS-Fb7igmar9DYP-IBYFsk=/fit-in/600x596/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-8936504-1471811681-4332.jpeg.jpg)

The latter is a 1982 release, disc made in Holland.

I like the Golden Imports series. Swings and roundabouts comparing UK with pressings from Holland. The former are dynamic but noisier and the latter more even in quality but without the wow factor that can occasionally occur with a "hot" UK pressing. Saying that, there is a house sound from all Philips records I find most attractive no matter where they are pressed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 18, 2022, 10:56:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 18, 2022, 12:11:04 AM
I like the Golden Imports series. Swings and roundabouts comparing UK with pressings from Holland. The former are dynamic but noisier and the latter more even in quality but without the wow factor that can occasionally occur with a "hot" UK pressing. Saying that, there is a house sound from all Philips records I find most attractive no matter where they are pressed.

There is something to be said for house sound. My father had this record in the original 1960 Mercury pressing. It had a certain unique sound that is not reproduced on the CDs, even though they were remastered under the supervision of Wilma Cozart herself.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 18, 2022, 01:43:18 PM
I found an original 1957 British pressing. Three discs, but five sides. Everything intact. Sounds like new and quite great too I must say:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/a436dc70-e25f-4a93-a62e-32beac20222b-jpeg.782067/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/5ca55cca-8044-4a62-983c-928e9e8a93c1-jpeg.782068/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/62676baf-41ec-4949-8100-3d9acc10eaea-jpeg.782069/)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 18, 2022, 11:42:51 PM
Quote from: Valentino on January 18, 2022, 01:43:18 PM
I found an original 1957 British pressing. Three discs, but five sides. Everything intact. Sounds like new and quite great too I must say:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/a436dc70-e25f-4a93-a62e-32beac20222b-jpeg.782067/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/5ca55cca-8044-4a62-983c-928e9e8a93c1-jpeg.782068/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/62676baf-41ec-4949-8100-3d9acc10eaea-jpeg.782069/)

Produced by the peerless Walter Legge.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 18, 2022, 11:59:09 PM
Mahler: 6th Symphony.

(https://i.imgur.com/A0XiJay.jpg)

Quite a surprise, not what I expected from a Bernstein performance. A young man in a hurry.

Side 4 is taken up by interviews with associates of Mahler himself including his daughter, Anna.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 19, 2022, 01:07:06 AM
^There is a cutting engineer who's been at tad hot on the controls in one of the tuttis, on side two iirc. But yes Walter Legge was a magician with the equipment available.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 19, 2022, 02:17:00 AM
Quote from: Valentino on January 18, 2022, 01:43:18 PM
I found an original 1957 British pressing. Three discs, but five sides. Everything intact. Sounds like new and quite great too I must say:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/a436dc70-e25f-4a93-a62e-32beac20222b-jpeg.782067/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/5ca55cca-8044-4a62-983c-928e9e8a93c1-jpeg.782068/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/62676baf-41ec-4949-8100-3d9acc10eaea-jpeg.782069/)
Very cool!  8)

Do you have a separate mono setup?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 19, 2022, 02:36:58 AM
No, I use the same setup and I don't even use a mono switch.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 19, 2022, 02:53:04 AM
Quote from: Valentino on January 19, 2022, 02:36:58 AM
No, I use the same setup and I don't even use a mono switch.
In any event, glad to hear that you're enjoying them!  Did you have to pay much to get such a nice copy?  Or just a case of being in the right place at the right time?  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 19, 2022, 06:20:18 AM
Quote from: Valentino on January 19, 2022, 02:36:58 AM
No, I use the same setup and I don't even use a mono switch.

Of course mono LPs produce mono sound on a stereo pickup, but I think there is an issue that modern cartridges with delicate styli don't track the older LPs as well. My father had a Thorens with a Rek-O-Kut tonearm and a Shure M3D cartridge (the first stereo cartridge) and I felt it produced a more appropriate sound than the modern cartridges on the older LPs.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 21, 2022, 12:47:12 AM
Respighi: Pines of Rome.

(https://i.imgur.com/r1JHh2H.jpg)

Great sound. A tulips (edge of label) "Alle Hersteller" recording which has the reputation to be the best sound on DG. My copy is not a first pressing which has a red background to the stereo logo on front cover.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 01:23:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 21, 2022, 12:47:12 AM
Respighi: Pines of Rome.

(https://i.imgur.com/r1JHh2H.jpg)

Great sound. A tulips (edge of label) "Alle Hersteller" recording which has the reputation to be the best sound on DG. My copy is not a first pressing which has a red background to the stereo logo on front cover.
Thank you for the reminder; it's been a while since I've checked into those things.  When was it recorded Irons?

Hope to change the pads on my Okki Nokki wand today.  I had ordered them over the holidays.

(http://www.osageaudio.com/images/Okki%20Nokki/Black%20Finish.jpg)This is what my RCM looks like.  You put the record down on the rubber-covered mat, screw the little round disc back into place (It holds the record down.).  And then go about your cleaning process.  There are two velvet-like pads that are glued onto the bottom of the wand.  This will be my first attempt at removing them and then applying new ones.  Wish me luck!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 21, 2022, 01:49:49 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 01:23:47 AM
Thank you for the reminder; it's been a while since I've checked into those things.  When was it recorded Irons?

Hope to change the pads on my Okki Nokki wand today.  I had ordered them over the holidays.

(http://www.osageaudio.com/images/Okki%20Nokki/Black%20Finish.jpg)This is what my RCM looks like.  You put the record down on the rubber-covered mat, screw the little round disc back into place (It holds the record down.).  And then go about your cleaning process.  There are two velvet-like pads that are glued onto the bottom of the wand.  This will be my first attempt at removing them and then applying new ones.  Wish me luck!

PD

Your pic does not show up for me PD. Is your Okki Nokki this https://youtu.be/AbXRKjMuPz0
If so a nice piece of kit.

The Maazel is from 1961.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 02:28:49 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 21, 2022, 01:49:49 AM
Your pic does not show up for me PD. Is your Okki Nokki this https://youtu.be/AbXRKjMuPz0
If so a nice piece of kit.

The Maazel is from 1961.
Yes, it is!  :) Mine's all black though.   Wonder why the pic didn't show up?  It does at my end.  Works pretty well.  I could tell that my pads were getting warn as they were starting to leave behind  some of the cleaning solution--plus I had used them quite a bit.  ;)

Trying to remember what you have Irons?  If I'm recalling correctly, you have one which uses a cleaning "thread" to help get into the grooves?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 02:48:44 AM
I cannot see the pic either, PD, but I also own an Okki NokKi. Mine is the white version.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 02:59:33 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 02:48:44 AM
I cannot see the pic either, PD, but I also own an Okki NokKi. Mine is the white version.
Interesting!  I'll try a different pic for those who might be interested:

(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse2.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.Dil9PZQmmh4rem0NmKa_NAHaEg%26pid%3DApi&f=1)

How do you like yours Fergus?  And do you do anything special/particular re cleaning your records?

PD

p.s.  Can you gents see the above image?

p.p.s.  One thing:  I do wear a decent pair of landscaper-type ear protection though as it is loud!  Something like these

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71kUOc9XmEL.jpg)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 03:17:07 AM
Pictures are quite clear now PD.

I find the Okki Nokki to be simple to use and effective.

I like to keep it very simple when I am cleaning my vinyl.
Place LP on platter and switch on.
Clean with dry carbon fibre brush first.
Apply cleaning fluid.
Clean with bristle brush held upright and with not too much pressure in clockwise direction.
Apply vacuum to remove fluid.
Repeat process in anticlockwise direction on same face of LP.

Remove LP and repeat process for second face of LP.

Leave to dry in an upright position.


So, the process is very simple and always the same so I never forget where I am!!

Note: I never use alcohol or any mix of alcohol in a cleaning fluid.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 04:20:28 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 03:17:07 AM
Pictures are quite clear now PD.

I find the Okki Nokki to be simple to use and effective.

I like to keep it very simple when I am cleaning my vinyl.
Place LP on platter and switch on.
Clean with dry carbon fibre brush first.
Apply cleaning fluid.
Clean with bristle brush held upright and with not too much pressure in clockwise direction.
Apply vacuum to remove fluid.
Repeat process in anticlockwise direction on same face of LP.

Remove LP and repeat process for second face of LP.

Leave to dry in an upright position.


So, the process is very simple and always the same so I never forget where I am!!

Note: I never use alcohol or any mix of alcohol in a cleaning fluid.
Routine has its advantages.  :)  I'll sometimes use some *alcohol.  I also normally use a couple of Mofi (Mobile Fidelity) brushes instead--one for cleaning and one for rinsing off.  https://mofi.com/collections/accessories/products/mfsllpb_record_cleaning_brush  And I also like their cleaning liquids (see same website).

*I use a photographic-grade alcohol (purchased a case of it several years ago); it's about as pure as you can get short of a medical one which I believe is a bit purer.

I also put a small, lightweight round plastic dish (think a light food storage tight container) carefully over the label to protect it from possible water damage.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 04:26:12 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 04:20:28 AM
Routine has its advantages.  :)  I'll sometimes use some *alcohol.  I also normally use a couple of Mofi (Mobile Fidelity) brushes instead--one for cleaning and one for rinsing off.  https://mofi.com/collections/accessories/products/mfsllpb_record_cleaning_brush  And I also like their cleaning liquids (see same website).

*I use a photographic-grade alcohol (purchased a case of it several years ago); it's about as pure as you can get short of a medical one which I believe is a bit purer.

I also put a small, lightweight round plastic dish (think a light food storage tight container) carefully over the label to protect it from possible water damage.

PD

Good point, PD, I forgot that. I use something similar too.

With regard to the MoFi type brush I would use something similar on every LP face prior to playing. Dust is the Enemy!!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 04:44:27 AM
Just as an aside I use a rigid plastic file holder that holds six LPs when drying at the moment. Recently, a friend who was decluttering, gave me a proper old 1950's storage rack with velvet covering each metal separator. This will allow me to increase my batch size when cleaning significantly.  8)


(https://skypic.attic.city/?bucket=cdn.attic.city&key=items/61ae975413d34ba3105ee3f12bcd6c190c8c9c3c66b2ab57bfbc493c41528e57-w375h375q75fill.jpeg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on January 21, 2022, 04:50:33 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 04:44:27 AM
Just as an aside I use a rigid plastic file holder that holds six LPs when drying at the moment. Recently, a friend who was decluttering, gave me a proper old 1950's storage rack with velvet covering each metal separator. This will allow me to increase my batch size when cleaning significantly.  8)


(https://skypic.attic.city/?bucket=cdn.attic.city&key=items/61ae975413d34ba3105ee3f12bcd6c190c8c9c3c66b2ab57bfbc493c41528e57-w375h375q75fill.jpeg)

That's an even decorative type of furniture ...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 04:57:43 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 04:26:12 AM
Good point, PD, I forgot that. I use something similar too.

With regard to the MoFi type brush I would use something similar on every LP face prior to playing. Dust is the Enemy!!
Yep!

Quote from: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 04:44:27 AM
Just as an aside I use a rigid plastic file holder that holds six LPs when drying at the moment. Recently, a friend who was decluttering, gave me a proper old 1950's storage rack with velvet covering each metal separator. This will allow me to increase my batch size when cleaning significantly.  8)


(https://skypic.attic.city/?bucket=cdn.attic.city&key=items/61ae975413d34ba3105ee3f12bcd6c190c8c9c3c66b2ab57bfbc493c41528e57-w375h375q75fill.jpeg)

Quote from: MusicTurner on January 21, 2022, 04:50:33 AM
That's an even decorative type of furniture ...
Yes, quite stylish!

I have a couple of different options.  At a church tag sale, I found two 6-LP stands.  They're rubber coated--one is actually for 45's!  8)

I also have (and have used) some sort of rubber/vinyl coated lid cover stand (for pot lids) that was my mother's.  No room in my current kitchen setup for it, but it's worked a peach for when cleaning records and letting them dry!  ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on January 21, 2022, 05:23:55 AM
I don't even have any such thing, but I see how the advantages appear obvious, and presumably it inspires one to clean the records more often, and more properly ...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 05:59:03 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on January 21, 2022, 05:23:55 AM
I don't even have any such thing, but I see how the advantages appear obvious, and presumably it inspires one to clean the records more often, and more properly ...
I wouldn't say that I clean them more often; so far anyway, I clean them once and then put them into a new inner sleeve and then store it inside of the  jacket (along with the original inner sleeve if in decent shape.  I also try and be good and if in doubt, give them a cleaning before playing them so as to avoid damaging the LP (besides the musical enjoyment of them sounding better and less junk accumulating on my stylus).

Also, I should add, a fellow music friend of mine recently gave me a half of a bottle of Mobile Fidelity's cleaning product called One (as in one step I think?).  He needed to order some over the holidays and was sweet and poured half of the new bottle into his old and gave it to me over the holidays.  I had expressed interest into how he cleaned his LPs.  He doesn't have an RPM and instead squirts a small amount around the record in a few spots and then uses a brush I believe in a circular direction (like the ones that I had linked to) and hand cleans them going in a circular direction.  He has brought over a few of his dirtier records (we're talk grime here people--nothing else!) for me to clean and was impressed with how they came out.  :)  Thinking that I'll try the One on records that just look to have a tiny bit of surface lint/hair, etc., but that look otherwise bright and shiny.   Or if I'm not feeling like hauling out my O.N. at the moment and want to see how it works.  :D 

Any idea about how many LPs that you have MT?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 21, 2022, 07:05:53 AM
On the subject of cleaning records. Words to the wise, give L' Art Du Son a miss.
https://www.vinylgourmet.com/en/music/917-lart-du-son-vinyl-record-cleaning-fluid-loricraft-100ml-to-dilute-in-5-litres.html
Not a stable emulsion. Broke down fairly quickly with congealed bits floating around in the solution. Half a bottle down the sink!

I do not use anything fancy 1/10 Isopropyl Alcohol/Distilled Water.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 08:50:52 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 21, 2022, 07:05:53 AM
On the subject of cleaning records. Words to the wise, give L' Art Du Son a miss.
https://www.vinylgourmet.com/en/music/917-lart-du-son-vinyl-record-cleaning-fluid-loricraft-100ml-to-dilute-in-5-litres.html
Not a stable emulsion. Broke down fairly quickly with congealed bits floating around in the solution. Half a bottle down the sink!

I do not use anything fancy 1/10 Isopropyl Alcohol/Distilled Water.
Thanks for the heads up!  :)  Remind me:  which RCM do you have ....trying to remember...is it a Loricraft?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 02:32:09 PM
Quote from: Irons on January 21, 2022, 07:05:53 AM
On the subject of cleaning records. Words to the wise, give L' Art Du Son a miss.
https://www.vinylgourmet.com/en/music/917-lart-du-son-vinyl-record-cleaning-fluid-loricraft-100ml-to-dilute-in-5-litres.html
Not a stable emulsion. Broke down fairly quickly with congealed bits floating around in the solution. Half a bottle down the sink!


Do you think that it might be temperature sensitive in terms of storage?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 22, 2022, 12:05:41 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 21, 2022, 02:32:09 PM
Do you think that it might be temperature sensitive in terms of storage?

Possibly, but I think passage of time more likely. My RCM with liquids and brushes is one metre from where I'm typing this in what I laughingly call a study. L'Art Du Son was not exposed to anything extreme on the temperature scale.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 22, 2022, 04:17:46 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 22, 2022, 12:05:41 AM
Possibly, but I think passage of time more likely. My RCM with liquids and brushes is one metre from where I'm typing this in what I laughingly call a study. L'Art Du Son was not exposed to anything extreme on the temperature scale.
I'm guessing that you tried to give it some serious shaking up?  I just did a bit of googling and on another forum, I saw that one person said that you need to keep it in a dark bottle and that he also keeps it in a dark closet.

Have you tried contacting the manufacturer?  Just a thought.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 22, 2022, 08:00:38 AM
Well, this morning I took the old pads off of my Okki Nokki wand and then used a combo of rubbing alcohol and Goo Gone.  As expected, the rubbing alcohol didn't do a good job of removing the residual adhesive.  Goo Gone to the rescue!  In case you're wondering what the heck that is, it's a special liquid that is great at removing things like old price stickers on books and LPs (please only use on shiny type covers!), CD cases, etc.  Once all of the goop was gone, I washed it off with a bit of dish detergent to get off the somewhat oily GG, let wand dry and then carefully applied the new strips to the wand (hopefully in the correct places).  To be on the safe side, I'm going to give it 24 hours to firm up (You can carefully push or lift and move the strips to position them properly.).

Fergus, have you replaced your strips yet?  If so, did you run into any issues?  And how long did you let the adhesive set up before using them?

PD

p.s.  Goo Gone:  https://googone.com/original-adhesive-remover

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 22, 2022, 10:59:28 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 22, 2022, 08:00:38 AM
Well, this morning I took the old pads off of my Okki Nokki wand and then used a combo of rubbing alcohol and Goo Gone.  As expected, the rubbing alcohol didn't do a good job of removing the residual adhesive.  Goo Gone to the rescue!  In case you're wondering what the heck that is, it's a special liquid that is great at removing things like old price stickers on books and LPs (please only use on shiny type covers!), CD cases, etc.  Once all of the goop was gone, I washed it off with a bit of dish detergent to get off the somewhat oily GG, let wand dry and then carefully applied the new strips to the wand (hopefully in the correct places).  To be on the safe side, I'm going to give it 24 hours to firm up (You can carefully push or lift and move the strips to position them properly.).

Fergus, have you replaced your strips yet?  If so, did you run into any issues?  And how long did you let the adhesive set up before using them?

PD

p.s.  Goo Gone:  https://googone.com/original-adhesive-remover

Hi PD, no I have not used my machine for long enough to replace the said pads but I note your effort with interest  ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 22, 2022, 01:57:27 PM
Quote from: aligreto on January 22, 2022, 10:59:28 AM
Hi PD, no I have not used my machine for long enough to replace the said pads but I note your effort with interest  ;)
Well, I'll let you know if I run into any problems then!  :) ;)

I did debate whether to go to the extra effort to remove the old bits of still somewhat sticky residue; as far as I can tell, there's no further info from O.N.  I just thought that I'd try what someone else had suggested on another forum (PM me if you're curious).  Will let you know how it comes out.  :)

Yesterday seemed to be a repair day here--a handful of projects involving either adhesive or using Gorilla Glue!  Will be interesting to see tomorrow how well things have held/bonded.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on January 22, 2022, 10:58:37 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 21, 2022, 05:59:03 AM
I wouldn't say that I clean them more often; so far anyway, I clean them once and then put them into a new inner sleeve and then store it inside of the  jacket (along with the original inner sleeve if in decent shape.  I also try and be good and if in doubt, give them a cleaning before playing them so as to avoid damaging the LP (besides the musical enjoyment of them sounding better and less junk accumulating on my stylus).

Also, I should add, a fellow music friend of mine recently gave me a half of a bottle of Mobile Fidelity's cleaning product called One (as in one step I think?).  He needed to order some over the holidays and was sweet and poured half of the new bottle into his old and gave it to me over the holidays.  I had expressed interest into how he cleaned his LPs.  He doesn't have an RPM and instead squirts a small amount around the record in a few spots and then uses a brush I believe in a circular direction (like the ones that I had linked to) and hand cleans them going in a circular direction.  He has brought over a few of his dirtier records (we're talk grime here people--nothing else!) for me to clean and was impressed with how they came out.  :)  Thinking that I'll try the One on records that just look to have a tiny bit of surface lint/hair, etc., but that look otherwise bright and shiny.   Or if I'm not feeling like hauling out my O.N. at the moment and want to see how it works.  :D 

Any idea about how many LPs that you have MT?

PD

I think around 3,500  ... it's rare that I buy any nowadays, there isn't much space and I've got a lot of the interesting stuff already, cf. also my CDs ... the most recent one was an obscure live Mahler 6th with the conductor Jiracek ... normally I just use an ordinary soft cloth, maybe slightly humid, when cleaning LPs, but I don't mind a little surface noise, except dots or repetitive clicks, of course.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 23, 2022, 01:06:15 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 22, 2022, 08:00:38 AM
Well, this morning I took the old pads off of my Okki Nokki wand and then used a combo of rubbing alcohol and Goo Gone.  As expected, the rubbing alcohol didn't do a good job of removing the residual adhesive.  Goo Gone to the rescue!  In case you're wondering what the heck that is, it's a special liquid that is great at removing things like old price stickers on books and LPs (please only use on shiny type covers!), CD cases, etc.  Once all of the goop was gone, I washed it off with a bit of dish detergent to get off the somewhat oily GG, let wand dry and then carefully applied the new strips to the wand (hopefully in the correct places).  To be on the safe side, I'm going to give it 24 hours to firm up (You can carefully push or lift and move the strips to position them properly.).

Fergus, have you replaced your strips yet?  If so, did you run into any issues?  And how long did you let the adhesive set up before using them?

PD

p.s.  Goo Gone:  https://googone.com/original-adhesive-remover

Your attention to detail is impressive PD. Sounds as if you have done a fine job refurbishing your RCM.
If possible I peel off price stickers and re-stick to inner sleeves. Mainly for where I bought the LP also how much I paid. Talking of which, came across an interesting site earlier this week -

https://gripsweat.com/

It is true that L'art Du Son comes in a dark glass bottle but no instructions to store in a dark place. I did try giving it a good shake.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 23, 2022, 02:13:00 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on January 22, 2022, 10:58:37 PM
I think around 3,500  ... it's rare that I buy any nowadays, there isn't much space and I've got a lot of the interesting stuff already, cf. also my CDs ... the most recent one was an obscure live Mahler 6th with the conductor Jiracek ... normally I just use an ordinary soft cloth, maybe slightly humid, when cleaning LPs, but I don't mind a little surface noise, except dots or repetitive clicks, of course.
Wow, that's a lot!  I haven't ever counted mine, so no idea really.  Guessing here...(including all genres)....maybe 400-500?  Will count at some point in time.   :)

Quote from: Irons on January 23, 2022, 01:06:15 AM
Your attention to detail is impressive PD. Sounds as if you have done a fine job refurbishing your RCM.
If possible I peel off price stickers and re-stick to inner sleeves. Mainly for where I bought the LP also how much I paid. Talking of which, came across an interesting site earlier this week -

https://gripsweat.com/

It is true that L'art Du Son comes in a dark glass bottle but no instructions to store in a dark place. I did try giving it a good shake.
That's a clever ID re price stickers!  I've run across LPs at times which the previous owner wrote very neatly in pen I think as to where, when and price of LP just inside on the inner back cover of the LP.

And thank you for your kind words!  :)

And that's still a drag (and waste of money) regarding that cleaner.  I'd be tempted to send an email off to the company.  Any idea when you purchased the product Irons?

Yes, interesting website.  I wonder what that Ricci/Sibelius one went for?  They seem to be unsure there.  Have you tried to search any of your rarer LPs to see what they have sold for Irons.  That could be fun!  ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 23, 2022, 02:45:58 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 22, 2022, 01:57:27 PM
Well, I'll let you know if I run into any problems then!  :) ;)

I did debate whether to go to the extra effort to remove the old bits of still somewhat sticky residue; as far as I can tell, there's no further info from O.N.  I just thought that I'd try what someone else had suggested on another forum (PM me if you're curious).  Will let you know how it comes out.  :)

Yesterday seemed to be a repair day here--a handful of projects involving either adhesive or using Gorilla Glue!  Will be interesting to see tomorrow how well things have held/bonded.

PD

Thank you PD, I would certainly be interested in that link, at your leisure, please.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 24, 2022, 01:06:02 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 23, 2022, 02:13:00 AM
Wow, that's a lot!  I haven't ever counted mine, so no idea really.  Guessing here...(including all genres)....maybe 400-500?  Will count at some point in time.   :)
That's a clever ID re price stickers!  I've run across LPs at times which the previous owner wrote very neatly in pen I think as to where, when and price of LP just inside on the inner back cover of the LP.

And thank you for your kind words!  :)

And that's still a drag (and waste of money) regarding that cleaner.  I'd be tempted to send an email off to the company.  Any idea when you purchased the product Irons?

Yes, interesting website.  I wonder what that Ricci/Sibelius one went for?  They seem to be unsure there.  Have you tried to search any of your rarer LPs to see what they have sold for Irons.  That could be fun!  ;D

PD

I had the Ricci/Sibelius on a Decca WB but disliked the performance. The LP was not in the best of shape but being so collectable I decided to sell it being honest and upfront concerning condition. It was over two years ago but definitely three figures and the buyer was happy with his purchase.

On the subject of Ricci this is a strange one -

(https://i.imgur.com/XEfLp53.jpg)

Ricci and Ansermet are both hugely collectable and together are sure-fire winners. Decca Eclipse was Decca's bargain-basement reissue label. Mostly mono and issued on Eclipse in fake stereo. ECS 746 is unique in being the only LP to receive it's first and only release in the UK (there was a full price issue in the US). In real stereo, popular composer and artists and yet Decca only put it out on the cheapest label in their catalogue! Very strange. My theory is, as the sound is excellent, artistic. I think the more knowledgeable GMG would throw their hands up at the second movement of the second concerto. Even to my cloth ears it doesn't sound right.
The price I paid is on the sticker at top right of inner sleeve. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 24, 2022, 01:53:13 AM
Coincidentally, while we are discussing cleaning, I was checking something on Discogs and I noticed this article:


How to Clean and Care for Your Turntable Stylus

Kat Bein posted March 11, 2021

When was the last time you cleaned the needle on your record player? If your answer is, "Hahahahahahah .. wut," you're not alone!

I've been collecting vinyl since college, which is closer to 15 years than I'd like to admit, and I don't think I've more than once or twice even thought about properly cleaning my stylus, let alone giving it a try.

That's, uh, not great, though. It turns out that stylus care is one of the easiest and most important steps to a healthy record relationship. Now that you've been alerted to the danger living right under your nose, take two deep breaths and follow this simple guide toward a brighter vinyl future.

We only share the coolest stuff because we like it. However, when you purchase something through our affiliate links, Discogs may earn a commission.


What is a turntable stylus?

Did you know your record player doesn't run on magic? That little tonearm on your turntable is some kind of mechanical wonder. The whole system contains magnets, coils, a cantilever, and a cartridge, wherein lives this tiny, diamond-tipped stylus (AKA needle) that runs across the face of your vinyl record, reading the vibrations and turning them into electrical signals. While there have been leaps and bounds of technological advancement between your Technics and the humble phonograph, it's the same process by which phonographs worked way back in 1877. Wild.


What happens if I don't clean it?

Your stylus is on the front line of your record-listening experience. If things break down here, it will affect every element of the process from there on out. It's the most delicate part of your record player, and unfortunately, it's the one taking a face-dive into the dirty trenches of your record: the grooves. As the records play, the stylus catches all that dust and dirt settled on your LP.

Are your re-, are your re-, are your re-, are your records skipping? Could be a dirty needle! Does it sound like a dusty vinyl mess? Maybe it is! A quick, 20-second clean of that stylus could turn your muckiest, scratchiest sounding LP into a golden chorus. (But hey, if the vinyl is actually scratched, that's another story).

Even more importantly, a dust-laden, dirty needle dragging across your record could lead to further degradation of the vinyl itself. No one wants to ignorantly damage their precious, carefully-curated collection – not after I spent all that time searching for the original pressing of Lou Reed!


How do I clean the stylus?

The good news is, cleaning your stylus is nothing like cleaning your bathroom. It's quick, easy, painless, and very cheap. Here are a few tried-and-true options from dutiful collectors across the Discogs Community and beyond.

Needle or stylus brush: Any time you buy a cartridge or stylus, it probably comes with a little needle or stylus brush. If you don't have a brush handy, there are lots of them on the market, usually for $10 or less. Look online or ask your local record shop clerk. They've got little, round heads and short, soft bristles. Big tip: Never, ever, for any reason whatsoever, rub your needle sideways. Always brush from front to back, mimicking the movement of a record underneath. Brushing your needle side-to-side will damage the tip or break the damn thing clean off. Then you need a new stylus, and that was opposite your original goal.

Mr. Clean Magic Eraser: Before you head to the record store or search online, look underneath your kitchen sink. If you've got a Mr. Clean Magic Eraser in your broom closet, you've got a perfectly-good needle cleaner. Do not brush the Magic Eraser against your needle. The abrasive surface is good for getting crayons off the wall but not so good for your needle. Instead, cut a small square from the eraser, place it on your turntable just below the stylus, and gently (very gently) drop your needle on the eraser. Lift the needle back up, and you'll find the eraser snagged some of that dust, leaving a small mark. Move the eraser a smidge and continue the process until no residue is left.

Onzow Zero Dust Stylus Cleaner: If the Mr. Clean Magic Eraser feels a little scary to you, you can invest $39 into Onzow's ultra-soft gel product. It works pretty much the same way, in that you drop your needle gently onto the gel pad two or three times, but Onzow's Zero Dust Stylus Cleaner has been specially formulated to be needle-friendly. You can clean the pad by running it under warm water, which means you'll get a lot of use from the investment.

Audio Technica Cleaning Kits: A trusted name in the turntable game, Audio Technica offers a couple products to keep your stylus stylin'. There's the AT617a Cartridge Stylus Cleaner, a polyurethane gel pad that runs about $35 and is used the same way you would use the Onzow gel pad. Make sure you don't force the needle down or leave it on the gel pad too long, or you might pick up small gel debris. There's also an alcohol/ethanol-based liquid cleaner that promises a "more thorough cleaning" called the AT607a. For $12, you get a 10 ml bottle with a brush head. Just be sure you brush from back to front, as with any needle brush, and do note that liquid spillage from the bottle onto the vinyl can damage the record. Audio Technica recommends removing the stylus before cleaning, just to be safe.



But for real, how often is cleaning necessary?

Well, it only takes a few seconds, so you might as well leave the cleaning tool of your choice right next to the player and do a little brush between LPs or dance with the gel pad right before you kick off a long night of spins.

If a daily clean seems unrealistic (that's going 0 to 100 real quick), we recommend refreshing your tip at least once a week. If you treat your stylus nicely, it'll last for 1,000 or maybe even 2,000 hours. What's 20 seconds of your life against 2,000 hours of jams? Time and money well spent.





Take what you will, readers, out of the above.
We have discussed here, in the past, the Mr. Clean Magic Eraser [or equivalent product] method. I have never used it myself.

The one major issue that I have with the above advice is that when using the Needle or stylus brush method it states that one never brushes the stylus from side to side. This is absolutely correct. What the article advises is that one should "Always brush from front to back". This is where I have the problem. I was taught by gnarly old Vinyl Heads when I was a youngster that one always brushed from back to front, to avoid potential damage to the stylus. Therefore, brush from behind the stylus towards you. 


What do others do here, please?


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 24, 2022, 02:26:55 AM
Are there really people who don't know they should brush the dust of their stylus with the little brush that came with the cartridge?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 03:23:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 24, 2022, 01:06:02 AM
I had the Ricci/Sibelius on a Decca WB but disliked the performance. The LP was not in the best of shape but being so collectable I decided to sell it being honest and upfront concerning condition. It was over two years ago but definitely three figures and the buyer was happy with his purchase.

On the subject of Ricci this is a strange one -

(https://i.imgur.com/XEfLp53.jpg)

Ricci and Ansermet are both hugely collectable and together are sure-fire winners. Decca Eclipse was Decca's bargain-basement reissue label. Mostly mono and issued on Eclipse in fake stereo. ECS 746 is unique in being the only LP to receive it's first and only release in the UK (there was a full price issue in the US). In real stereo, popular composer and artists and yet Decca only put it out on the cheapest label in their catalogue! Very strange. My theory is, as the sound is excellent, artistic. I think the more knowledgeable GMG would throw their hands up at the second movement of the second concerto. Even to my cloth ears it doesn't sound right.
The price I paid is on the sticker at top right of inner sleeve.
Congrats on your sale!  And thanks for the further info on Eclipse.

If you're not keen on the Prokofiev LP, perhaps time to send it on its way?

Quote from: Spotted Horses on January 24, 2022, 02:26:55 AM
Are there really people who don't know they should brush the dust of their stylus with the little brush that came with the cartridge?

Perhaps they were addressing newbies?  Or those who just bought either a very basic turntable or a used one which didn't come with a brush?  Out of curiosity, I looked at a Rega manual online and they only suggest blowing dust off of the needle; whereas, on the Ortofon website, they say to use a brush and to use it back to front.....which is what I do.

Quote from: aligreto on January 24, 2022, 01:53:13 AM
Coincidentally, while we are discussing cleaning, I was checking something on Discogs and I noticed this article:


Take what you will, readers, out of the above.
We have discussed here, in the past, the Mr. Clean Magic Eraser [or equivalent product] method. I have never used it myself.

The one major issue that I have with the above advice is that when using the Needle or stylus brush method it states that one never brushes the stylus from side to side. This is absolutely correct. What the article advises is that one should "Always brush from front to back". This is where I have the problem. I was taught by gnarly old Vinyl Heads when I was a youngster that one always brushed from back to front, to avoid potential damage to the stylus. Therefore, brush from behind the stylus towards you. 


What do others do here, please?
I also have a product by Last purchased some years ago though I've never used it.  It comes in a little bottle with a brush (looks rather like a bottle of nail polish!).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 24, 2022, 04:51:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 03:23:28 AM

Out of curiosity, I looked at a Rega manual online and they only suggest blowing dust off of the needle; whereas, on the Ortofon website, they say to use a brush and to use it back to front.....which is what I do.

PD

Cheers, PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 05:27:41 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 24, 2022, 04:51:44 AM
Cheers, PD.
Here's a link to the 'stuff' that I've held off using--so far anyway (purchased from the same audio store where I had originally purchased my equipment).

https://www.amazon.com/LAST-PRODUCTS-Stylus-Cleaner-Last/dp/B004MM5YIU#customerReviews

PD

p.s.  Off to set up my Okki Nokki...wish me luck!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 24, 2022, 05:53:48 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 03:23:28 AMPerhaps they were addressing newbies?  Or those who just bought either a very basic turntable or a used one which didn't come with a brush?  Out of curiosity, I looked at a Rega manual online and they only suggest blowing dust off of the needle; whereas, on the Ortofon website, they say to use a brush and to use it back to front.....which is what I do.

I suppose. I remember using using an Audio Technica cartridge, then a Shure V15 Type V, and both came with similar little brushes. Blowing on the stylus was always the first measure, and brushing the last resort. I was also struck by the suggestion in the article to clean the stylus once a week. Huh? It seemed obvious that I had to give a puff or a brush every time I dropped the needle.

Anyway, inevitable that the thread would devolve into LP cleaning rituals. I wonder if there are still threads around here where CD listeners can debate bit jitter? :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 07:21:26 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on January 24, 2022, 05:53:48 AM
I suppose. I remember using using an Audio Technica cartridge, then a Shure V15 Type V, and both came with similar little brushes. Blowing on the stylus was always the first measure, and brushing the last resort. I was also struck by the suggestion in the article to clean the stylus once a week. Huh? It seemed obvious that I had to give a puff or a brush every time I dropped the needle.

Anyway, inevitable that the thread would devolve into LP cleaning rituals. I wonder if there are still threads around here where CD listeners can debate bit jitter? :)
:laugh:  :)

In any event, knock on wood, the replacement pads for my Okki Nokki have stayed put and must be in the correct spots as no damage to the record.  I did for first round grab an old and slightly beat up LP that a friend gave to me figuring that if something went awry, it at least wouldn't be a major fiasco if the LP got damaged in the process of cleaning it.  :)

Later on today, I will be giving it a spin. 

PD

p.s.  A hint as to which one I cleaned, Song No. 2, Side One:  Baby I'm Gonna Leave You
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 24, 2022, 08:19:12 AM
I was advised to use Bergeon by The Expert Stylus Company.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bergeon-6033-Watchmakers-Original-Rodico-One-Touch-Cleaner-Stick-HR6033-/264532295469?var=0&mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338268676&toolid=10044&customid=Cj0KCQiAubmPBhCyARIsAJWNpiOnFYAtF4WXZkjw8QHQdRllFOs-emyrOdtcE1UTHMuobtV69t0IziAaAs0CEALw_wcB

One stick lasts a lifetime. Used for cleaning watches it is perfect for styli. Make a pea sized blob and attach to a small stick. With system fired up address the "pea" to styli until a pop through speakers. Job done. I do it after every side. One "pea" lasts six months approx.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 08:31:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 24, 2022, 08:19:12 AM
I was advised to use Bergeon by The Expert Stylus Company.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bergeon-6033-Watchmakers-Original-Rodico-One-Touch-Cleaner-Stick-HR6033-/264532295469?var=0&mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338268676&toolid=10044&customid=Cj0KCQiAubmPBhCyARIsAJWNpiOnFYAtF4WXZkjw8QHQdRllFOs-emyrOdtcE1UTHMuobtV69t0IziAaAs0CEALw_wcB

One stick lasts a lifetime. Used for cleaning watches it is perfect for styli. Make a pea sized blob and attach to a small stick. With system fired up address the "pea" to styli until a pop through speakers. Job done. I do it after every side. One "pea" lasts six months approx.   
Boy, you're really thorough!  :)  How do you attach it to your stick?

And I trust that you turn the volume down a fair bit too?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 24, 2022, 10:02:42 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 07:21:26 AM
:laugh:  :)

In any event, knock on wood, the replacement pads for my Okki Nokki have stayed put and must be in the correct spots as no damage to the record.  I did for first round grab an old and slightly beat up LP that a friend gave to me figuring that if something went awry, it at least wouldn't be a major fiasco if the LP got damaged in the process of cleaning it.  :)

Later on today, I will be giving it a spin. 

PD

p.s.  A hint as to which one I cleaned, Song No. 2, Side One:  Baby I'm Gonna Leave You

Congratulations, PD. Well done 8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 24, 2022, 10:03:49 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 24, 2022, 08:19:12 AM
I was advised to use Bergeon by The Expert Stylus Company.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bergeon-6033-Watchmakers-Original-Rodico-One-Touch-Cleaner-Stick-HR6033-/264532295469?var=0&mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338268676&toolid=10044&customid=Cj0KCQiAubmPBhCyARIsAJWNpiOnFYAtF4WXZkjw8QHQdRllFOs-emyrOdtcE1UTHMuobtV69t0IziAaAs0CEALw_wcB

One stick lasts a lifetime. Used for cleaning watches it is perfect for styli. Make a pea sized blob and attach to a small stick. With system fired up address the "pea" to styli until a pop through speakers. Job done. I do it after every side. One "pea" lasts six months approx.   

How interesting!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 10:20:10 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 24, 2022, 10:02:42 AM
Congratulations, PD. Well done 8)
Thanks!  I probably over-obsessed it lol, but it's done.  Don't know whether or not it made any difference or needed to be done in terms of removing the old remaining adhesive.

Listened to a little bit of the Zeppelin album after it dried.  A bit crackly but not bad.  Am concerned about one of the scuffs on it.  Will have to give it a full run through soon.  But, boy oh boy, listening to it on my stereo system.....yummmmm!!  A big treat.  ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 25, 2022, 12:04:48 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 08:31:14 AM
Boy, you're really thorough!  :)  How do you attach it to your stick?

And I trust that you turn the volume down a fair bit too?

PD

I have it on the handle of one of those small pad thingies. A cocktail stick would be fine. See pic.

No, do not alter volume. Just requires the lightest of touch and the plop from speaker is the guide. I have been using Bergeon for three years without mishap and I'm pretty clumsy.

Quote from: aligreto on January 24, 2022, 10:03:49 AM
How interesting!

I highly recommend, Fergus.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 25, 2022, 02:11:03 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 24, 2022, 10:20:10 AM
Thanks!  I probably over-obsessed it lol, but it's done.  Don't know whether or not it made any difference or needed to be done in terms of removing the old remaining adhesive.

PD

Are you calling yourself a drama queen, PD?  ;D

Seriously though, one of the replaced pads falling off during the vacuum process would not be good so I think that it was wise to be careful.  ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 25, 2022, 02:12:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 25, 2022, 12:04:48 AM
I have it on the handle of one of those small pad thingies. A cocktail stick would be fine. See pic.

No, do not alter volume. Just requires the lightest of touch and the plop from speaker is the guide. I have been using Bergeon for three years without mishap and I'm pretty clumsy.

I highly recommend, Fergus.

Thank you, Lol. Definitely something to try.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 25, 2022, 02:41:45 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 25, 2022, 12:04:48 AM
I have it on the handle of one of those small pad thingies. A cocktail stick would be fine. See pic.

No, do not alter volume. Just requires the lightest of touch and the plop from speaker is the guide. I have been using Bergeon for three years without mishap and I'm pretty clumsy.

I highly recommend, Fergus.
Pretty cool Irons!  How do you know when your "blob" is used up?  Does it get dark from the "gunk" on your stylus?  Or dry out and get crumbly or???

Quote from: aligreto on January 25, 2022, 02:11:03 AM
Are you calling yourself a drama queen, PD?  ;D

Seriously though, one of the replaced pads falling off during the vacuum process would not be good so I think that it was wise to be careful.  ;)
Should things have gone awry, I had this next to me:

(https://i.etsystatic.com/6381131/r/il/896cef/2745680006/il_1140xN.2745680006_6s30.jpg)

And, yes, that metal wand hitting and rubbing up against the LP would not have done the vinyl any favors!  ???

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 25, 2022, 04:40:13 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 25, 2022, 02:41:45 AM

Should things have gone awry, I had this next to me:

(https://i.etsystatic.com/6381131/r/il/896cef/2745680006/il_1140xN.2745680006_6s30.jpg)

And, yes, that metal wand hitting and rubbing up against the LP would not have done the vinyl any favors!  ???

PD

Thankfully you did not need it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 25, 2022, 07:06:55 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 25, 2022, 04:40:13 AM
Thankfully you did not need it.

The GMG vinyl Queen. This thread would be all the poorer without her!

(https://i.imgur.com/PMfTrSx.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 25, 2022, 08:15:01 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 25, 2022, 07:06:55 AM
The GMG vinyl Queen. This thread would be all the poorer without her!

(https://i.imgur.com/PMfTrSx.jpg)

8)

Now that is a truth  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 25, 2022, 08:55:40 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 25, 2022, 04:40:13 AM
Thankfully you did not need it.
Yes!  ;D

Used it again today to clean a boxed set of Ashkenazy/Previn/LSO Prokofiev piano concertos.  Will listen to one of those later.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 26, 2022, 11:56:03 PM
Gems from the Philips Catalogue: https://youtu.be/1Nx2I0Nt3SA

I found the section on David Lloyd-Jones particularly interesting. A conductor I admire and yet knew nothing of.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 27, 2022, 02:04:35 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 26, 2022, 11:56:03 PM
Gems from the Philips Catalogue: https://youtu.be/1Nx2I0Nt3SA

I found the section on David Lloyd-Jones particularly interesting. A conductor I admire and yet knew nothing of.

I will give that a look later on.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2022, 03:23:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 26, 2022, 11:56:03 PM
Gems from the Philips Catalogue: https://youtu.be/1Nx2I0Nt3SA

I found the section on David Lloyd-Jones particularly interesting. A conductor I admire and yet knew nothing of.
Thanks for that link.  It will be either some evening or early morning listening for me.  :)

How did you happen upon this channel by the way Irons?  By the way, had a chuckle when I clicked on the link and heard a very British-sounding voice saying that it was a sunny day in Los Angeles!  ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 27, 2022, 07:47:01 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2022, 03:23:26 AM
Thanks for that link.  It will be either some evening or early morning listening for me.  :)

How did you happen upon this channel by the way Irons?  By the way, had a chuckle when I clicked on the link and heard a very British-sounding voice saying that it was a sunny day in Los Angeles!  ;D

PD

Funny you say that PD. I found it amusing with his cut-glass British accent he says "gitting" or "git". When in Los Angeles do as Los Angeles do. :D

Jokes aside, I find what he says about vinyl and beyond most interesting and worth sharing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2022, 08:25:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 27, 2022, 07:47:01 AM
Funny you say that PD. I found it amusing with his cut-glass British accent he says "gitting" or "git". When in Los Angeles do as Los Angeles do. :D

Jokes aside, I find what he says about vinyl and beyond most interesting and worth sharing.
I look forward to checking it out.

Having fun doing a trip down memory lane....listening to Carole King's Tapestry.  So many great songs on that album.  See non-classical listening thread.

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/16/22/9f/16229f4b683a86ce5f02e0e52d6703d3.jpg)

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 27, 2022, 08:30:46 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2022, 08:25:31 AM
I look forward to checking it out.

Having fun doing a trip down memory lane....listening to Carole King's Tapestry.  So many great songs on that album.  See non-classical listening thread.

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/16/22/9f/16229f4b683a86ce5f02e0e52d6703d3.jpg)

PD

The cat what sold it! ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2022, 08:33:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 27, 2022, 08:30:46 AM
The cat what sold it! ;D
:laugh: :laugh:  ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2022, 06:49:02 AM
And thank you both for your kind comments; I had missed them earlier.  :)

So, a question for our vinyl experts here.  When cleaning my Bach/Souzay LP the other day (see current listening thread), I noticed that the label is in French including "La Vox de son Maitre" and that it also says "Stereo & Gravure Universelle".

1)  How was this LP cut?  From what I understand, it's supposed to be playable with both stereo and mono cartridges.  I had listened to it with my stereo one (don't have a mono) and for the most part, it sounded wonderful.  A tiny and short bit of distortion in one section.  I believe though that it was recorded in mono (looking at Discogs).

2)Looking at the jacket, the text is either English or German and also says that it was printed in Germany.  Souzay was a Frenchman.  I found it rather strange that the LP labels would be in French, but no French text on the jacket (Thinking that they were catering towards the French market?).  Any thoughts/insights?

(https://i.discogs.com/viuRTqJmMB4eE_6L4EthXJGr5h7q9nPMmpkmUEdt0zE/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:593/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWltYWdlcy9SLTc0/MDM5MTYtMTQ0MDc3/ODMyNy01Njg5Lmpw/ZWc.jpeg)

Note:  It looks like my copy (purchased used) was purchased at a discount store in the US.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 28, 2022, 07:53:59 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2022, 06:49:02 AM
And thank you both for your kind comments; I had missed them earlier.  :)

So, a question for our vinyl experts here.  When cleaning my Bach/Souzay LP the other day (see current listening thread), I noticed that the label is in French including "La Vox de son Maitre" and that it also says "Stereo & Gravure Universelle".

1)  How was this LP cut?  From what I understand, it's supposed to be playable with both stereo and mono cartridges.  I had listened to it with my stereo one (don't have a mono) and for the most part, it sounded wonderful.  A tiny and short bit of distortion in one section.  I believe though that it was recorded in mono (looking at Discogs).

2)Looking at the jacket, the text is either English or German and also says that it was printed in Germany.  Souzay was a Frenchman.  I found it rather strange that the LP labels would be in French, but no French text on the jacket (Thinking that they were catering towards the French market?).  Any thoughts/insights?

(https://i.discogs.com/viuRTqJmMB4eE_6L4EthXJGr5h7q9nPMmpkmUEdt0zE/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:593/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWltYWdlcy9SLTc0/MDM5MTYtMTQ0MDc3/ODMyNy01Njg5Lmpw/ZWc.jpeg)

Note:  It looks like my copy (purchased used) was purchased at a discount store in the US.

Electrola is the German arm of EMI, PD. Great pressings every bit as good as those from UK, not sure they are not superior. The later one's are red with a smaller Nipper, early are white and gold. I'm a bit confused as I think, I need to check, "La Vox de Son Maitre" is French. A French pressing in a German sleeve makes no sense.

In the early days of stereo, labels so as not to restrict sales stated Stereo playable Mono instruction on the sleeve. Rest assured, you definitely have a stereo recording.

Edit: After further research - where would we be without Discogs! "La Vox de Son Maitre" is simply French for "His Master's Voice". The French arm for EMI is Pathé Marconi, but as I said in an earlier post the relationship of record labels through the LP era is very complicated.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2022, 08:38:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 28, 2022, 07:53:59 AM
Electrola is the German arm of EMI, PD. Great pressings every bit as good as those from UK, not sure they are not superior. The later one's are red with a smaller Nipper, early are white and gold. I'm a bit confused as I think, I need to check, "La Vox de Son Maitre" is French. A French pressing in a German sleeve makes no sense.

In the early days of stereo, labels so as not to restrict sales stated Stereo playable Mono instruction on the sleeve. Rest assured, you definitely have a stereo recording.

Edit: After further research - where would we be without Discogs! "La Vox de Son Maitre" is simply French for "His Master's Voice". The French arm for EMI is Pathé Marconi, but as I said in an earlier post the relationship of record labels through the LP era is very complicated.
Whoopsie, just noticed that I had left out the "i" in "voix" (or maybe autocorrect kicked in?) and yes, thanks, I knew what it meant and should have offered up a translation to have saved you the time!  ::)

Looks like whomever purchased it originally bought it in LA in 1973...which would make sense looking at the store's sticker on it [I had forgotten that someone had written on the inside back of the jacket where and when they had purchased it.].

The labels on the record are quite nice.  I can't find an image of one though.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 28, 2022, 09:04:29 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2022, 06:49:02 AM1)  How was this LP cut?  From what I understand, it's supposed to be playable with both stereo and mono cartridges.  I had listened to it with my stereo one (don't have a mono) and for the most part, it sounded wonderful.  A tiny and short bit of distortion in one section.  I believe though that it was recorded in mono (looking at Discogs).

I don't know how well you remember your high school geometry, but mono LPs are always compatible with a stereo pickup, but not vice versa.

Refer to that attached sketch. In a stereo LP the left channel is encoded on one wall, the right channel on the other wall of the groove. As I've sketched it, the left channel moves the stylus up and to the right for positive signal, and the right channel moves the stylus down and to the right for positive signal. Suppose the right and left channel are identical. Then the two contributions result in cancelation of the up-down motion and addition of the left-right motion. If the left and right channels are not identical the stylus will also move up and down. In a mono LP the stylus only moves side to side and a stereo cartridge would just interpret this as identical left and right channels.

You could get into trouble playing a stereo record on a mono cartridge, because if the mono cartridge is only designed for horizontal motion of the stylus it may not have the flexibility for the stylus to move up and down, putting undue force on the groove.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 28, 2022, 09:35:08 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on January 28, 2022, 09:04:29 AM
I don't know how well you remember your high school geometry, but mono LPs are always compatible with a stereo pickup, but not vice versa.

Refer to that attached sketch. In a stereo LP the left channel is encoded on one wall, the right channel on the other wall of the groove. As I've sketched it, the left channel moves the stylus up and to the right for positive signal, and the right channel moves the stylus down and to the right for positive signal. Suppose the right and left channel are identical. Then the two contributions result in cancelation of the up-down motion and addition of the left-right motion. If the left and right channels are not identical the stylus will also move up and down. In a mono LP the stylus only moves side to side and a stereo cartridge would just interpret this as identical left and right channels.

You could get into trouble playing a stereo record on a mono cartridge, because if the mono cartridge is only designed for horizontal motion of the stylus it may not have the flexibility for the stylus to move up and down, putting undue force on the groove.
Thank you for the explanation (and diagrams!); it's been some time since I've read about the differences in movement between stereo and mono cartridges.  I had read something somewhere where someone had asked what they meant by the "Stereo and Gravure Universelle" which had confused me (long story).  I looked into getting a separate mono system but decided against it...tempting as it was though!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 28, 2022, 10:23:38 AM
I may be repeating myself, but I think a different cartridge might be optimum for shellac records. I even notice that late LPs (60's and 70's) seem to be made of a different grade of vinyl than the really old LPs (Columbia mono LPs) even though technically they conform to the same microgroove format specification.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on January 28, 2022, 02:44:30 PM
Some tonearms allow for removeable head shells. This obviously allows for the interchange of heads with a different cartridge on each head shell i.e. either a stereo or mono cartridge on each head shell which is interchangeable. I have never owned a tonearm that allowed this swop over. I would certainly like to experience listening to a mono cartridge on a mono vinyl recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 29, 2022, 01:07:14 AM
Quote from: aligreto on January 28, 2022, 02:44:30 PM
Some tonearms allow for removeable head shells. This obviously allows for the interchange of heads with a different cartridge on each head shell i.e. either a stereo or mono cartridge on each head shell which is interchangeable. I have never owned a tonearm that allowed this swop over. I would certainly like to experience listening to a mono cartridge on a mono vinyl recording.

The main problem is that a tonearm suitable for one cartridge is unsuitable for the other. I did for a time have two decks, one stereo the other mono. A previous preamp had a mono switch. Alas they have all gone! The second deck is now residing in a box in a spare bedroom. I miss the mono capability mainly because there is much less surface noise from old mono records played this way.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2022, 02:25:18 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on January 28, 2022, 10:23:38 AM
I may be repeating myself, but I think a different cartridge might be optimum for shellac records. I even notice that late LPs (60's and 70's) seem to be made of a different grade of vinyl than the really old LPs (Columbia mono LPs) even though technically they conform to the same microgroove format specification.
It's my understanding that during the 1970's when much of the world was struggling with various energy (oil) crisis that sometimes plants would crush up and reuse older recordings making for crappy-sounding records.  Who were the worst culprits for doing this?  Perhaps that is part of what you were referring to SH?

Or perhaps it had to do with the popularity and increased mass-production of records (or in addition to)?

Interesting thoughts about the use of a different cartridge for shellac.....one could have all kinds of different stereo setups!  8) >:D

Quote from: Irons on January 29, 2022, 01:07:14 AM
The main problem is that a tonearm suitable for one cartridge is unsuitable for the other. I did for a time have two decks, one stereo the other mono. A previous preamp had a mono switch. Alas they have all gone! The second deck is now residing in a box in a spare bedroom. I miss the mono capability mainly because there is much less surface noise from old mono records played this way.
Perhaps time to haul it out Irons....get that baby working again!  :)

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on January 29, 2022, 04:17:24 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2022, 02:25:18 AM
It's my understanding that during the 1970's when much of the world was struggling with various energy (oil) crisis that sometimes plants would crush up and reuse older recordings making for crappy-sounding records.  Who were the worst culprits for doing this?  Perhaps that is part of what you were referring to SH?

I think the main culprits were some of the American labels such as CBS.

My comment was based on a vague recollection that the old LPs I had collected (Columbia "ML" records from the early 50's) were not as glossy, maybe more a flat black rather than a glossy black. Maybe they were just old.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 31, 2022, 10:25:39 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on January 29, 2022, 04:17:24 AM
I think the main culprits were some of the American labels such as CBS.

My comment was based on a vague recollection that the old LPs I had collected (Columbia "ML" records from the early 50's) were not as glossy, maybe more a flat black rather than a glossy black. Maybe they were just old.
Thanks.  I think that I saw CBS mentioned elsewhere too.

Cleaned up a couple of my Ivan Moravec LPs today (see current listening thread).  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 01, 2022, 12:06:00 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 31, 2022, 10:25:39 AM
Thanks.  I think that I saw CBS mentioned elsewhere too.

Cleaned up a couple of my Ivan Moravec LPs today (see current listening thread).  :)

PD

Have you any Moravec LPs that he recorded for the US audiophile label Connoisseur Society, PD?

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 01, 2022, 02:07:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 01, 2022, 12:06:00 AM
Have you any Moravec LPs that he recorded for the US audiophile label Connoisseur Society, PD?
I do Irons.  I'm always on the lookout for them (or 99% of other Connoisseur ones the I see.  I seem to recall passing on one once, but that might have been more to do with the condition of it on second thought).  As you know, that's the rub of buying used LPs.  Now that my Okki Nokki is back up and running, I'll give them a clean--saying prayers before, during and afterwards!   ::)

Have you come across any Irons?  If so, which ones?  And how did you like them?

And others here?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 01, 2022, 07:34:25 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 01, 2022, 02:07:00 AM
I do Irons.  I'm always on the lookout for them (or 99% of other Connoisseur ones the I see.  I seem to recall passing on one once, but that might have been more to do with the condition of it on second thought).  As you know, that's the rub of buying used LPs.  Now that my Okki Nokki is back up and running, I'll give them a clean--saying prayers before, during and afterwards!   ::)

Have you come across any Irons?  If so, which ones?  And how did you like them?

And others here?

PD

Seems your Okki Nokki is earning it's keep!  8)

I have only two Connoisseur issues but wish I owned more as the sound is very good indeed. One I  find bizarre with the great Polish violinist Wanda Wilkomirska playing the three Delius sonatas in New York. :o
The other is Moravec. Checking the back cover he recorded for Connoisseur CS 163 Beethoven, CS 1165 Chopin, 1266 Chopin/Beethoven/Debussy, CS 2000 Beethoven and CS 2002 Mozart.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 01, 2022, 09:27:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 01, 2022, 07:34:25 AM
Seems your Okki Nokki is earning it's keep!  8)

I have only two Connoisseur issues but wish I owned more as the sound is very good indeed. One I  find bizarre with the great Polish violinist Wanda Wilkomirska playing the three Delius sonatas in New York. :o
The other is Moravec. Checking the back cover he recorded for Connoisseur CS 163 Beethoven, CS 1165 Chopin, 1266 Chopin/Beethoven/Debussy, CS 2000 Beethoven and CS 2002 Mozart.
Cool!  There are some other ones too:

I'll type the list that I can see...
For the stereo ones

CS 163   Beethoven PC No. 4
CS 1065 Chopin - Nocurnes (complete) Volume 1
CS 1165 Volume 2 of the above
CS 1266 Chopin - Ballades (Complete)
CS 1366 Chopin - Preludes, Op. 28 (Complete)
CS 1566 Beethoven - Sonatas Moonlight, Pathetique
CS 1866 Debussy - Five Preludes, Children's Corner Suite, Clair de Lune
CS 2000 Beethoven - Sonatas Appassionata and 32 Variations
CS 2002 Mozart Sonatas Fantasia in C Minor, K. 475/Sonata in C minor, K. 457/Sonata in B Flat Major, K. 570

Believe it or not, I have 3 copies of my Debussy one (in varying conditions)--none totally blemish-free; I'll have to check out the other two copies over the course of the week and see if one of them reigns supreme.  I'll bet that your Ravel/Debussy one is lovely!

I also have that Mozart one on Connoisseur too.

PD

p.s.  By the way and this is a separate issue.  It's been a long time since I've played around with the weight on my tone arm.  At the moment, it seems to be going straight down when I release the cue.  I'm thinking that I've read in the past that it's possibly better to have it pulling a touch towards the outside of the record with the reasoning being that it gets pulled towards the center of the record the further that you go in?  The reason that I'm bringing this up is that it seems that there is a bit more "noise" coming from my left speaker vs. the right.  Would adjusting this help?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 01, 2022, 10:12:04 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 01, 2022, 09:27:02 AMp.s.  By the way and this is a separate issue.  It's been a long time since I've played around with the weight on my tone arm.  At the moment, it seems to be going straight down when I release the cue.  I'm thinking that I've read in the past that it's possibly better to have it pulling a touch towards the outside of the record with the reasoning being that it gets pulled towards the center of the record the further that you go in?  The reason that I'm bringing this up is that it seems that there is a bit more "noise" coming from my left speaker vs. the right.  Would adjusting this help?

This note from Audio Technica may help.

https://www.audio-technica.com/en-us/support/audio-solutions-question-week-anti-skate-feature-turntable-need-set/

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 02, 2022, 08:15:20 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 01, 2022, 10:12:04 AM
This note from Audio Technica may help.

https://www.audio-technica.com/en-us/support/audio-solutions-question-week-anti-skate-feature-turntable-need-set/

Excellent advice from Audio Technica.

Back to cleaning LPs. My two penneth worth is it isn't an exact science, quite the opposite. Sometimes if the LP is in good nick I don't clean at all. Very often, if not always, a pressing can be more noisy post cleaning but that is to be expected, no need to panic. It makes perfect sense that dislodging years of embedded micro-muck will make a pressing more noisy, not less. The next step in my cleaning regime is actually playing the record, as the stylus tracks the groove it will push aside the loosened debris. Even after vacuuming first play can be pretty bad but more often then not after a few spins noise is a thing of the past. But not always! If the LP is shot, nothing will bring it back. The only time I clean more then once is if there are bad visual finger marks.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 02, 2022, 10:40:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 02, 2022, 08:15:20 AM
Excellent advice from Audio Technica.

Back to cleaning LPs. My two penneth worth is it isn't an exact science, quite the opposite. Sometimes if the LP is in good nick I don't clean at all. Very often, if not always, a pressing can be more noisy post cleaning but that is to be expected, no need to panic. It makes perfect sense that dislodging years of embedded micro-muck will make a pressing more noisy, not less. The next step in my cleaning regime is actually playing the record, as the stylus tracks the groove it will push aside the loosened debris. Even after vacuuming first play can be pretty bad but more often then not after a few spins noise is a thing of the past. But not always! If the LP is shot, nothing will bring it back. The only time I clean more then once is if there are bad visual finger marks.

Yes, agreed on the non necessity for overcleaning.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 02, 2022, 12:28:14 PM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 01, 2022, 10:12:04 AM
This note from Audio Technica may help.

https://www.audio-technica.com/en-us/support/audio-solutions-question-week-anti-skate-feature-turntable-need-set/
Thank you for that link.

I have an old Telarc Omnidisc set which I used to adjust the anti-skate device.  One thought that had crossed my mind:  if the original owner didn't have their a.s. adjusted well, could I be hearing their damage to the left channel?

Quote from: Irons on February 02, 2022, 08:15:20 AM
Excellent advice from Audio Technica.

Back to cleaning LPs. My two penneth worth is it isn't an exact science, quite the opposite. Sometimes if the LP is in good nick I don't clean at all. Very often, if not always, a pressing can be more noisy post cleaning but that is to be expected, no need to panic. It makes perfect sense that dislodging years of embedded micro-muck will make a pressing more noisy, not less. The next step in my cleaning regime is actually playing the record, as the stylus tracks the groove it will push aside the loosened debris. Even after vacuuming first play can be pretty bad but more often then not after a few spins noise is a thing of the past. But not always! If the LP is shot, nothing will bring it back. The only time I clean more then once is if there are bad visual finger marks.
Normally I don't clean LPs twice, but these are special ones to me.  I also wondered if perhaps at the time that I hadn't rinsed them well (I have some special rinse solution, but I also rinse the brushes every so often in over the counter distilled water).  I'll try giving them some additional plays.  For what it's worth, the Mozart LP that I had cleaned of his looks to be in much better shape that the Debussy one(s).
Quote from: aligreto on February 02, 2022, 10:40:36 AM
Yes, agreed on the non necessity for overcleaning.
Agreed:  please see my comments above.

PD

p.s.  Will give all of them a further listen to soon.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 02, 2022, 07:06:14 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 02, 2022, 12:28:14 PM
Thank you for that link.

I have an old Telarc Omnidisc set which I used to adjust the anti-skate device.  One thought that had crossed my mind:  if the original owner didn't have their a.s. adjusted well, could I be hearing their damage to the left channel?

I seem to recall that my Shure V15 Type V cartridge came with a fixture which was intended to adjust the cartridge mounting and a test LP.

Yes, here it is:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/294683978544?hash=item449c88ab30:g:HAgAAOSwXI1hlAFr

It seems possible that an old LP might have asymmetric groove wear. Probably advisable to adjust the anti-skate with a pristine LP cut at very high recording velocity at the inner groove.

One nice thing about the Shure V15 Type V was that it had a damper, a little brush mounted in front of the stylus that stabilized the tone arm. An indirect benefit was that it effectively cleaned the record as you were playing it.

Sadly the V15 Type V was discontinued when Shure had difficulty getting the materials required to manufacture it. The last batch was purchased by the U.S. Library of Congress for transcribing archival material in their collection.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 03, 2022, 02:55:36 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 02, 2022, 07:06:14 PM
I seem to recall that my Shure V15 Type V cartridge came with a fixture which was intended to adjust the cartridge mounting and a test LP.

Yes, here it is:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/294683978544?hash=item449c88ab30:g:HAgAAOSwXI1hlAFr

It seems possible that an old LP might have asymmetric groove wear. Probably advisable to adjust the anti-skate with a pristine LP cut at very high recording velocity at the inner groove.

One nice thing about the Shure V15 Type V was that it had a damper, a little brush mounted in front of the stylus that stabilized the tone arm. An indirect benefit was that it effectively cleaned the record as you were playing it.

Sadly the V15 Type V was discontinued when Shure had difficulty getting the materials required to manufacture it. The last batch was purchased by the U.S. Library of Congress for transcribing archival material in their collection.
I've seen cartridges like that that have a brush in front of it--very handy!  ;D  Wonder whether of not they might try bringing those cartridges back considering the vinyl revival?  Several years ago, I ran across this set:  https://www.ebay.com/itm/334306155512?_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item4dd6331bf8:g:9PkAAOSwDsth8ZEA&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAACoPYe5NmHp%252B2JMhMi7yxGiTJkPrKr5t53CooMSQt2orsSprd4IgPv6LBzlteBBg9Pe9Q%252BOW36Tb9R0W1zeWKjxlGGClHcKeK0zohvTG1CB5biDE7a%252FFuLPcZF3bYz%252FW73C84r2uEJtp0aatiVPcZUog3%252FeCUJXNj5M%252FvJ0HAPF6dSD6efibYqdBx27mUnXerIWIrfECnFz%252FCOt2hCKw3A%252F%252BtOJ%252Fj%252FvNOOZzqW%252BQ4UNyFhm0FcmRKjHeRkIruq8DeCW8dzsDfknf8bUItokKyIkLkWHejldbRNtztisB1oIuU9DRSRbfXO%252BJTta5MkOQv9amAhnwHq8gDXB79ckXEHJl3Dhb9MRvmLgajwV9C98gS0atsX8lZcij1aNPdn4q9uXkDUJTLxKTyPMi61monCnwz%252FTF2GXTSCIHNYHaug0MIYQjutWUvmxo18j6nVXQsBqMhTXvAKwIa9vxR3sRUa1x4iJE%252BeaHOJ%252FMO6hZScHWp3bxNI5cNtbl2pzxKZzxED1ULZ9lbLdRZobSzgRrqtpedH57O5qRD1HXg3V4Ih6AoN61oOOKBLe2c9xiScUJjXh9Q3%252FB448XgakI70dBH4nf4O7H1sl0j8hbiZYoN6zNahd5CbJakZJPPw3WED9i71eJtxvmBq0Y%252FOT6lllAWx%252FQvsarhuRdWUkWjLOXn5ql8zk%252B%252F6CLEE%252F1Jtua%252FONNYozlwPsKu%252BmjNjC7NaNHQXm2WrbluhbFLmZBCwf3QeHbKmPreY473YqBeYw%252B%252Fe0RtKCnQDwdWBjt9orBaIY12WplWWPlOtnYLBdgOV%252Bc%252BktrsYXJnCAb4s7tmcohJJKexjcqUdpKkbYk0%252BKEL7ULT%252FCuuUpTAczw4BPQ92GYmnGRUz%252BlDw2ftwkwqpQIrRIg2BsQ%253D%253D%7Cclp%3A2334524%7Ctkp%3ABFBM7sSs9tdf

Looking at the sticker, the most I paid for it would have been $8.  Scary to see what one vender has it listed for on eBay!

Which label would you suggest (or record) to try that would fit that recording criteria...Decca?  Or a Mercury?  I didn't notice this before when I played an old Don Henley LP (which bedsides great music also sounded wonderful!).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 03, 2022, 06:58:37 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 03, 2022, 02:55:36 AMWhich label would you suggest (or record) to try that would fit that recording criteria...Decca?  Or a Mercury?  I didn't notice this before when I played an old Don Henley LP (which bedsides great music also sounded wonderful!).

PD

It's been a long time since I played an LP. I'd be inclined to pick as recent a record as possible with a loud passage at the very end, to test inner groove distortion. I seem to remember Deutsche Gramophone vinyl being the most problematic in terms of tracking, especially since they seemed to master the digital recordings louder, presumably to emphasize the greater S/N ratio of digital recordings.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 03, 2022, 07:52:41 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 03, 2022, 06:58:37 AM
It's been a long time since I played an LP. I'd be inclined to pick as recent a record as possible with a loud passage at the very end, to test inner groove distortion. I seem to remember Deutsche Gramophone vinyl being the most problematic in terms of tracking, especially since they seemed to master the digital recordings louder, presumably to emphasize the greater S/N ratio of digital recordings.
And I'm probably not helping you here in terms of wanting to revisit your albums!  :D ;)

But seriously, that's a good idea re loud passage at the end as a way of testing things...thanks for the suggestion.

No LPs for me so far today...too busy cooking and trying to get trash together for garbage day!   ::)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 05, 2022, 10:16:10 AM
A friend told me today about a new Project turntable--a vertical one!  Looking around, I see that there are some other ones out there.  Has anyone ever tried one before?  Or knows someone who has one?  Just curious.  :)

(https://www.son-video.com/images/dynamic/Platines_vinyle/articles/Pro_Ject/PROJVERTTURNEDROITOM5BCBT/Pro-Ject-Vertical-Turntable-E-droitier-OM5e-Bluetooth-Blanc_L1_1200.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on February 05, 2022, 11:11:06 AM
That's very peculiar indeed. Visually, it looks nice.  But normally, one would assume that a linear pick up movement, such as some of the old turntable designs (cf. photo of a Bang & Olufsen model below), would provide a more even and stable use of the pick-up, in any vertical design:

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 06, 2022, 05:20:59 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 05, 2022, 10:16:10 AM
A friend told me today about a new Project turntable--a vertical one!  Looking around, I see that there are some other ones out there.  Has anyone ever tried one before?  Or knows someone who has one?  Just curious.  :)

(https://www.son-video.com/images/dynamic/Platines_vinyle/articles/Pro_Ject/PROJVERTTURNEDROITOM5BCBT/Pro-Ject-Vertical-Turntable-E-droitier-OM5e-Bluetooth-Blanc_L1_1200.jpg)

PD

This seems bizarre. The rational behind a horizontal turntable is that gravity provides an utterly constant downward tracking force and you only have to worry about compensating the skating effect with a small correction to equalize force on the two sides of the groove. With the vertical arrangement the downward tracking force has to be generated mechanically and gravity applies a skating or anti-skating force which varies as the tonearm moves across the record and which has to be corrected? Strikes me as different for the sake of being different.

To me, in this age of cheap high performance electronics, a linear tracking turntable with an elegant system for keeping the tonearm parallel to the groove seems the be obvious next generation. Probably it's out there, but not weird enough to become popular.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 06, 2022, 11:40:06 PM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 06, 2022, 05:20:59 AM
This seems bizarre. The rational behind a horizontal turntable is that gravity provides an utterly constant downward tracking force and you only have to worry about compensating the skating effect with a small correction to equalize force on the two sides of the groove. With the vertical arrangement the downward tracking force has to be generated mechanically and gravity applies a skating or anti-skating force which varies as the tonearm moves across the record and which has to be corrected? Strikes me as different for the sake of being different.

To me, in this age of cheap high performance electronics, a linear tracking turntable with an elegant system for keeping the tonearm parallel to the groove seems the be obvious next generation. Probably it's out there, but not weird enough to become popular.

It is out there. The "Conductor" is featured in the pic below and there have been others. A normal tonearm swinging on an axis is full of compromises which are eliminated by a linear tracker. I have lusted over one for years but the engineering involved scares me. The "Conductor" was developed by the late Len Gregory I mentioned in an earlier post.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 12:01:35 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 06, 2022, 11:40:06 PM
It is out there. The "Conductor" is featured in the pic below and there have been others. A normal tonearm swinging on an axis is full of compromises which are eliminated by a linear tracker. I have lusted over one for years but the engineering involved scares me. The "Conductor" was developed by the late Len Gregory I mentioned in an earlier post.

The engineering doesn't scare me too much. I would put the tonearm on a pivot, just like a conventional tonearm. But the pivot would be on a linear translation stage with a sensor that determines if the pivot has moved ever so slightly away from a perfect 90 degrees. When a deviation is detected, the pivot scoots over until the pivot angle is restored to 90 degrees. The scooting over has to be very steady and well controlled. If they can make a stage that keeps a read head aligned with a hard disk drive spinning at 9500 RPM, they can easily make a stage that keeps a tonearm aligned with a disk spinning at 33 1/3 RPM. :) 

The picture you attached appears to be along the lines of what I described. The difference is between a lone guru making a prototype and an engineering team developing a design for mass production.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 03:08:19 AM
The interesting discussion above brought to mind a demonstration of a Mag-Lev Audio TT I attended prior to the pandemic. Here are a couple of stock shots:


(https://article-imgs.scribdassets.com/3pajiaymo07pwjdk/images/fileZ7OR9ABY.jpg)


(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR_SydeaMjMp8Cl9TbMpEhAOhP6-Y6BpcBWlA&usqp=CAU)


The platter rises like a UFO and is maintained by the use of magnetic forces.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2022, 03:13:16 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 06, 2022, 05:20:59 AM
This seems bizarre. The rational behind a horizontal turntable is that gravity provides an utterly constant downward tracking force and you only have to worry about compensating the skating effect with a small correction to equalize force on the two sides of the groove. With the vertical arrangement the downward tracking force has to be generated mechanically and gravity applies a skating or anti-skating force which varies as the tonearm moves across the record and which has to be corrected? Strikes me as different for the sake of being different.

To me, in this age of cheap high performance electronics, a linear tracking turntable with an elegant system for keeping the tonearm parallel to the groove seems the be obvious next generation. Probably it's out there, but not weird enough to become popular.
I think that there are a couple of reasons why they came up with something like this (I'll also provide a link to their turntables--the two ones at the bottom are the vertical-type ones.):  the attraction to those who have limited cabinet/table space (You can either put it on a table and it will take up less room or wall-mount it) and secondly, I've seen comments by users who ere particularly attracted to it as they buy a lot of records that are either colored  and/or have pictures on them and would thus be more visible, and thirdly, they also have usb and blu tooth capacities.

https://www.project-audio.com/en/?s=vertical+turntable&asp_active=1&p_asid=1&p_asp_data=1&current_page_id=34246&woo_currency=EUR&qtranslate_lang=0&polylang_lang=en&filters_changed=0&filters_initial=1&asp_gen%5B%5D=title&asp_gen%5B%5D=content&asp_gen%5B%5D=excerpt&customset%5B%5D=product&customset%5B%5D=review&customset%5B%5D=pressrelease&customset%5B%5D=partner&aspf%5Bin_archive__1%5D=1

Quote from: Irons on February 06, 2022, 11:40:06 PM
It is out there. The "Conductor" is featured in the pic below and there have been others. A normal tonearm swinging on an axis is full of compromises which are eliminated by a linear tracker. I have lusted over one for years but the engineering involved scares me. The "Conductor" was developed by the late Len Gregory I mentioned in an earlier post.
Quite snazzy-looking there Irons!
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 12:01:35 AM
The difference is between a lone guru making a prototype and an engineering team developing a design for mass production.
I know that linear ones aren't anything new.  When did they first come out...1980's ?  Or late '70's?  Don't know.  If I'm recalling correctly, weren't they mass-produced?  But not nearly so much as the more traditional set-up?


PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2022, 03:16:58 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on February 05, 2022, 11:11:06 AM
That's very peculiar indeed. Visually, it looks nice.  But normally, one would assume that a linear pick up movement, such as some of the old turntable designs (cf. photo of a Bang & Olufsen model below), would provide a more even and stable use of the pick-up, in any vertical design:
Cool-looking turntable!

And a good point!

As an aside, the Project's ones have both a left-handed set up and one for righties.

Quote from: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 03:08:19 AM
The interesting discussion above brought to mind a demonstration of a Mag-Lev Audio TT I attended prior to the pandemic. Here are a couple of stock shots:


(https://article-imgs.scribdassets.com/3pajiaymo07pwjdk/images/fileZ7OR9ABY.jpg)


(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR_SydeaMjMp8Cl9TbMpEhAOhP6-Y6BpcBWlA&usqp=CAU)


The platter rises like a UFO and is maintained by the use of magnetic forces.
Wow!  That must have been quite something to have seen Fergus!   8)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 05:10:10 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2022, 03:16:58 AM

Wow!  That must have been quite something to have seen Fergus!   8)

PD

I think that the expression on this guy's face says it all:


(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/JUlPN2A_r-g/maxresdefault.jpg)



Here is a very short YT video which shows how it operates:


https://www.youtube.com/v/Ky0D00iyHAA
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2022, 06:44:55 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 05:10:10 AM
I think that the expression on this guy's face says it all:


(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/JUlPN2A_r-g/maxresdefault.jpg)



Here is a very short YT video which shows how it operates:


https://www.youtube.com/v/Ky0D00iyHAA
Wow!  Cool!  Wonder what its cat-attractivity value is?   :-\  And is that like $30,000 cool?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 07:09:59 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2022, 03:13:16 AMI know that linear ones aren't anything new.  When did they first come out...1980's ?  Or late '70's?  Don't know.  If I'm recalling correctly, weren't they mass-produced?  But not nearly so much as the more traditional set-up?

Yes, a little googling indicates that relatively lowbrow linear tracking turntables were produced in the 80's. I seem to remember the most widely known one had the cartridge transport built into the cover, but Radio Shack had one with a tonearm on a moving pivot. The design wasn't adopted by the mainstream audiophile manufacturers like Thorens, then the CD deflated the market. At that point anyone who wanted actual good sound rather than a super elegant mechanical contraption went digital. (runs away)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 07:20:38 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 03:08:19 AM
The interesting discussion above brought to mind a demonstration of a Mag-Lev Audio TT I attended prior to the pandemic. Here are a couple of stock shots:


(https://article-imgs.scribdassets.com/3pajiaymo07pwjdk/images/fileZ7OR9ABY.jpg)


(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR_SydeaMjMp8Cl9TbMpEhAOhP6-Y6BpcBWlA&usqp=CAU)

The platter rises like a UFO and is maintained by the use of magnetic forces.

That is truly bizarre. I guess the rational is that the spinning disk is isolated from vibration of the base. On the other hand, the restoring force that would keep the spinning platter centered would be very weak compared to a bearing. If something nudged it off center it would wobble back and forth, I think. Great for gawking at and photographs, not great for listening to records, I'd wager. :)


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on February 07, 2022, 08:05:25 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 07:09:59 AM
Yes, a little googling indicates that relatively lowbrow linear tracking turntables were produced in the 80's. I seem to remember the most widely known one had the cartridge transport built into the cover, but Radio Shack had one with a tonearm on a moving pivot. The design wasn't adopted by the mainstream audiophile manufacturers like Thorens, then the CD deflated the market. At that point anyone who wanted actual good sound rather than a super elegant mechanical contraption went digital. (runs away)

I had one of those 'relatively lowbrow turntables'. It was part of a Philips midi system. The tone arm automatically moved to the correct position on the disc when you pressed play. It had some kind of optical tracking device that told it where to start. It was OK most of the time but I had a few LPs that must have been duller than the rest and there was no way I could get them to start at the beginning, not even by doing it manually. Eventually it became more and more cranky then gave up altogether. The rest of the system was fine for its price.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 07, 2022, 08:09:06 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 12:01:35 AM
The engineering doesn't scare me too much. I would put the tonearm on a pivot, just like a conventional tonearm. But the pivot would be on a linear translation stage with a sensor that determines if the pivot has moved ever so slightly away from a perfect 90 degrees. When a deviation is detected, the pivot scoots over until the pivot angle is restored to 90 degrees. The scooting over has to be very steady and well controlled. If they can make a stage that keeps a read head aligned with a hard disk drive spinning at 9500 RPM, they can easily make a stage that keeps a tonearm aligned with a disk spinning at 33 1/3 RPM. :) 

The picture you attached appears to be along the lines of what I described. The difference is between a lone guru making a prototype and an engineering team developing a design for mass production.

Interesting. Isn't the elephant in the room there is not any physical contact with your disc spinning at 9500 RPM where as at 33 1/3 there is?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 08:40:45 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 07, 2022, 08:09:06 AM
Interesting. Isn't the elephant in the room there is not any physical contact with your disc spinning at 9500 RPM where as at 33 1/3 there is?

You are correct that the requirements are not the same, but I wanted to draw attention to the speed and accuracy which is possible in a device that can be sold for $50. The head is positioned within a fraction of a micrometer (a thousand of a millimeter) with time scales in milliseconds.

Imagine the task. Suppose I gave you a turntable in which I had mounted the tonearm pivot on a linear track and you could move it along the track by turning a little crank. As the record plays you can turn the crank to keep the tonearm parallel to the groove. You could do that by eye. And what if I installed a sensitive optical sensor that detected if the angle between the tonearm and the groove was off by a tenth of a degree or so, and there was a little red light the would turn on if the angle exceeded +0.1 degree and a blue light that went on if the angle went beyond -0.1 degree. You could carefully turn the crank to keep the red and blue lights from going on. Now you just need a little stepper motor to turn the crank and a microprocessor to monitor the red and blue lights and adjust the crank a million times per second. That would be about $5 worth of hardware.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 07, 2022, 09:44:48 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 03:08:19 AM
The interesting discussion above brought to mind a demonstration of a Mag-Lev Audio TT I attended prior to the pandemic. Here are a couple of stock shots:


(https://article-imgs.scribdassets.com/3pajiaymo07pwjdk/images/fileZ7OR9ABY.jpg)


(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR_SydeaMjMp8Cl9TbMpEhAOhP6-Y6BpcBWlA&usqp=CAU)


The platter rises like a UFO and is maintained by the use of magnetic forces.
Amazing! I want one of those!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2022, 10:17:19 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 07, 2022, 09:44:48 AM
Amazing! I want one of those!
Order immediately then...1 left in stock!  https://maglevaudio.com/collections/turntables

I found it interesting to read that you still need to have it on a (hopefully) vibrations-free surface (and obviously level too).

So, which of you gents will create something similar for CDs?  Or, how about one that will flip the LP over (without using an arm)...just using a magnetic field and automatically?  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 10:53:29 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 05:10:10 AM
I think that the expression on this guy's face says it all:Here is a very short YT video which shows how it operates:

https://www.youtube.com/v/Ky0D00iyHAA

One thing I noticed in the video is that when they demonstrating the resilience of the levitation system by giving the spinning turnable a little tap it continues to wobble noticeably for some time, with a frequency that looked like about 2 Hz. I guess I'm supposed to be impressed that it doesn't fly across the room. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 10:56:59 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 03:08:19 AM

(https://article-imgs.scribdassets.com/3pajiaymo07pwjdk/images/fileZ7OR9ABY.jpg)


(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR_SydeaMjMp8Cl9TbMpEhAOhP6-Y6BpcBWlA&usqp=CAU)



Quote from: vandermolen on February 07, 2022, 09:44:48 AM
Amazing! I want one of those!



I would definitely like to be there when you present the argument to your better half of the dire need to own a turntable with a levitated platter, Jeffrey  :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 11:01:03 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 10:56:59 AM
I would definitely like to be there when you present the argument to your better half of the dire need to own a turntable with a levitated platter, Jeffrey  :laugh:

She will agree if in return she gets a magnetically levitated salad spinner.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 07, 2022, 02:04:55 PM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 08:40:45 AM
You are correct that the requirements are not the same, but I wanted to draw attention to the speed and accuracy which is possible in a device that can be sold for $50. The head is positioned within a fraction of a micrometer (a thousand of a millimeter) with time scales in milliseconds.

Imagine the task. Suppose I gave you a turntable in which I had mounted the tonearm pivot on a linear track and you could move it along the track by turning a little crank. As the record plays you can turn the crank to keep the tonearm parallel to the groove. You could do that by eye. And what if I installed a sensitive optical sensor that detected if the angle between the tonearm and the groove was off by a tenth of a degree or so, and there was a little red light the would turn on if the angle exceeded +0.1 degree and a blue light that went on if the angle went beyond -0.1 degree. You could carefully turn the crank to keep the red and blue lights from going on. Now you just need a little stepper motor to turn the crank and a microprocessor to monitor the red and blue lights and adjust the crank a million times per second. That would be about $5 worth of hardware.

I would take out a patent on that if I were you. $5 indeed. ;)

Allow me to digress. A turntable is simplicity itself, a device that revolves at 33 1/3, that's it, nothing else! Yet engineers for over 70 years have wrestled with this seemingly simple task and they still haven't cracked it. Coming up with direct drive, rim drive, belt drive and what have you. A turntable (without arm) can cost $25 rising up to a six figure sum. The problem for designers is that the human ear can detect the tiniest fluctuation of a sound wave. I am tone deaf but can tell in an instant a flat note caused by TT "chugging". Turntables that have the capability to reproduce anything approaching the accuracy of CD in solo piano are few.

Your theory makes sound engineering sense, but.... We agree that a linear tracking arm on paper is superior and yet it has not taken over the market as it should. Why have not SME come up with one? The best and most expensive, including Len's, work with the arm "floating" on air. This raises another issue with noise from a compressor being obtrusive. Going back to my TT example, if designers are unable to get that right, they have little chance of achieving a moving as opposed to a fixed tonearm operating correctly. But just in case I'm wrong take out a patent! ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 04:11:51 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 07, 2022, 02:04:55 PM
I would take out a patent on that if I were you. $5 indeed. ;)

Allow me to digress. A turntable is simplicity itself, a device that revolves at 33 1/3, that's it, nothing else! Yet engineers for over 70 years have wrestled with this seemingly simple task and they still haven't cracked it. Coming up with direct drive, rim drive, belt drive and what have you. A turntable (without arm) can cost $25 rising up to a six figure sum. The problem for designers is that the human ear can detect the tiniest fluctuation of a sound wave. I am tone deaf but can tell in an instant a flat note caused by TT "chugging". Turntables that have the capability to reproduce anything approaching the accuracy of CD in solo piano are few.

Your theory makes sound engineering sense, but.... We agree that a linear tracking arm on paper is superior and yet it has not taken over the market as it should. Why have not SME come up with one? The best and most expensive, including Len's, work with the arm "floating" on air. This raises another issue with noise from a compressor being obtrusive. Going back to my TT example, if designers are unable to get that right, they have little chance of achieving a moving as opposed to a fixed tonearm operating correctly. But just in case I'm wrong take out a patent! ;D

I think the turntable itself is a non-issue. My father had a Thorens TD-124 (Vintage 1960 or so). I took it apart. It had an extremely massive metal platter which rode on a exquisite bearing, a polished stainless steel rod that fit into a precisely machined stainless steel tube with tight tolerance and a ball bearing on the bottom. The silky smoothness of the rotation of that bearing was a thing of beauty in itself. The drive was relatively crude. An electric motor with a rubber idler wheel which rode between a series or wheels of different size on the motor axel and a lip on the inside of the platter. With that bearing and that mass nothing was going to overcome the rotating inertia cause any measurable speed fluctuation. Later turntables I owned, mid-range Japanese table with direct drive and a servo and a very unimpressive belt-drive Thorens from the 1980s were much less impressive.

Based on my knowledge of physic and my experience with these machines, the crux of it is the tracking of the stylus with the groove. High frequency and high volume signal correspond with high acceleration of the stylus as it tracks the groove. The stylus is connected to a transducer (a  magnet or pickup coil) by a cantilever, and both the cantilever and the transducer mean that a substantial mass has to be moved when the stylus moves. in inertia of the cantilever and/or transducer can mean the stylus fails to stay at the bottom of the groove, or the cantilever can bend, or have mechanical resonances, which colors the sound. The Shure V15 Type V was the pinnacle of the technology in it's day, with a very high compliance transducer and a hollow beryllium cantilever with a high strength/mass ratio. The other sensitive issue is the tonearm, which is pushed along by the force the groove exerts on the stylus. It is important that tonearm have a very low friction bearing, so that the force required is minimal. I think the best turntable I had was the 1980's Thorens, because even though the table itself was a bit trashy, the tonearm was good. It had a good bearing and a carbon-fiber shaft with good strength to weight ratio. The tonearm cantilever combination can also have resonances, and the Shure Type V 15 Type V had a hydraulic damper to mitigate that. A good tonearm maintains stable pressure on the groove walls to help the cartridge do it's best.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 08, 2022, 12:46:44 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 04:11:51 PM
I think the turntable itself is a non-issue. My father had a Thorens TD-124 (Vintage 1960 or so). I took it apart. It had an extremely massive metal platter which rode on a exquisite bearing, a polished stainless steel rod that fit into a precisely machined stainless steel tube with tight tolerance and a ball bearing on the bottom. The silky smoothness of the rotation of that bearing was a thing of beauty in itself. The drive was relatively crude. An electric motor with a rubber idler wheel which rode between a series or wheels of different size on the motor axel and a lip on the inside of the platter. With that bearing and that mass nothing was going to overcome the rotating inertia cause any measurable speed fluctuation. Later turntables I owned, mid-range Japanese table with direct drive and a servo and a very unimpressive belt-drive Thorens from the 1980s were much less impressive.

Based on my knowledge of physic and my experience with these machines, the crux of it is the tracking of the stylus with the groove. High frequency and high volume signal correspond with high acceleration of the stylus as it tracks the groove. The stylus is connected to a transducer (a  magnet or pickup coil) by a cantilever, and both the cantilever and the transducer mean that a substantial mass has to be moved when the stylus moves. in inertia of the cantilever and/or transducer can mean the stylus fails to stay at the bottom of the groove, or the cantilever can bend, or have mechanical resonances, which colors the sound. The Shure V15 Type V was the pinnacle of the technology in it's day, with a very high compliance transducer and a hollow beryllium cantilever with a high strength/mass ratio. The other sensitive issue is the tonearm, which is pushed along by the force the groove exerts on the stylus. It is important that tonearm have a very low friction bearing, so that the force required is minimal. I think the best turntable I had was the 1980's Thorens, because even though the table itself was a bit trashy, the tonearm was good. It had a good bearing and a carbon-fiber shaft with good strength to weight ratio. The tonearm cantilever combination can also have resonances, and the Shure Type V 15 Type V had a hydraulic damper to mitigate that. A good tonearm maintains stable pressure on the groove walls to help the cartridge do it's best.

Apart from "turntable a non-issue" (I own a Garrard 401) you have expressed the mechanics of record playing far better then I would hope to and would not take issue with the accuracy of your post. But the subject of the discussion - the viability of a linear tracking tonearm does seem to have been lost though.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 08, 2022, 01:33:40 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 08, 2022, 12:46:44 AM
Apart from "turntable a non-issue" (I own a Garrard 401) you have expressed the mechanics of record playing far better then I would hope to and would not take issue with the accuracy of your post. But the subject of the discussion - the viability of a linear tracking tonearm does seem to have been lost though.

It has! I can only say that I alway remember being frustrated by a clear increase in distortion at the end of a record. And there is the irony that for many pieces of music the end is a very loud passage vulnerable to distortion. There are several possible causes that I can think of. The tone arm geometry is worst at the end of the record, the skate force is largest, and the linear speed of the record surface past the stylus is minimum. Linear tracking would remove the first two, but not the third. I never owned a linear tracking turntable, so I can't say how big a practical improvement it is.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 08, 2022, 02:48:41 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 07, 2022, 10:56:59 AM


I would definitely like to be there when you present the argument to your better half of the dire need to own a turntable with a levitated platter, Jeffrey  :laugh:

Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2022, 11:01:03 AM
She will agree if in return she gets a magnetically levitated salad spinner.

For 4-5,000 euros?!  I'd want a new kitchen!

PD

EDIT:  I did read some other interesting information (from the website)--one which was a very clever feature and another (which I had been wondering about earlier):

"Safety First

In case of power outages, the turntable has been designed with a UPS system, which stores enough power to safely lift the tonearm, stop the record, and return the platter feet to resting position. This way the turntable and record remain in perfect condition even when the unexpected happens.

Illumination

Subtle led lighting, in amber or white, has been added,  giving the turntable a sleek, futuristic feel, and further enhancing the visual effects of levitation even when the lights are off.

** NOTE: Because of the magnetic force used to levitate the platter, those with older pacemakers should not come within 1 metre of it, and magnetic media of all kinds should also be kept at a safe distance. See the User Manual for more details. **
[/b]"   ???

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 08, 2022, 06:31:50 AM
Doing some record cleaning this morning.

Finally got around to cleaning a LP that a friend gave me over Christmas:  Steve Winwood's Arc of a Diver (See non-classical music listening thread).

Also, cleaned a mono highlights from Don Carlos with Stella, Cossotto, etc. with Santini on DG.
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/acMAAOSwkwFgL~gR/s-l1600.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 08, 2022, 07:05:20 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 08, 2022, 02:48:41 AM

Illumination

Subtle led lighting, in amber or white, has been added,  giving the turntable a sleek, futuristic feel, and further enhancing the visual effects of levitation even when the lights are off.

PD

The "subtle lighting" reminded me at the time of something out of Close Encounters of the Third Kind  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 08, 2022, 07:16:59 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 08, 2022, 07:05:20 AM
The "subtle lighting" reminded me at the time of something out of Close Encounters of the Third Kind  ;D
:laugh: ;D

Did you see the part about "those with older pace-makers..."  Gulp!

Listened to Side A of the highlights from Don Carlo....Wow!  I had forgotten how amazingly good some of those singers were (hadn't listened to much opera lately).  And so far impressed with the singers new to me.  Off to fix a cup of tea and then will play Side B.  The LP, by the way, has very nice liner notes (booklet really) that came with it (and was thankfully included by the originally owner).  Not bad for a buck!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Jo498 on February 08, 2022, 07:22:42 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 21, 2022, 12:47:12 AM
Respighi: Pines of Rome.

(https://i.imgur.com/r1JHh2H.jpg)

Great sound. A tulips (edge of label) "Alle Hersteller" recording which has the reputation to be the best sound on DG. My copy is not a first pressing which has a red background to the stereo logo on front cover.
I have this on CD (in a Early Maazel box) and while I admittedly don't much care about these particular pieces, it sure sounds great. The LP also looks great and a beautiful cover. For technical reasons and laziness I never fully got into LPs (as I started listening as a teenager at the fading of the LP era int he late 1980s when CDs were just the thing), but they were and are so much more beautiful and collectible than CDs!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 08, 2022, 08:07:55 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 08, 2022, 07:16:59 AM

Did you see the part about "those with older pace-makers..."  Gulp!

PD

I sure did!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 08, 2022, 08:15:21 AM
I have to say that the levitated turntable seems very cool, but doesn't solve any problems of a conventional turntable and introduces some new ones. In the video, the levitated disc visibly wobbles when it is lightly tapped, as part of the demonstration. It produces dangerous stray magnetic fields, presumably consumes a large amount of energy. The rotation of the platter is controlled by the magnetic field, which seems tenuous, and you have a strong stray field potentially affecting the magnetic transducer in the cartridge. I'll take a heavy platter on a high quality Swiss-made bearing any day. I'll use the money I saved to buy a Tesla. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 08, 2022, 12:52:10 PM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on February 08, 2022, 08:15:21 AM
I have to say that the levitated turntable seems very cool, but doesn't solve any problems of a conventional turntable and introduces some new ones. In the video, the levitated disc visibly wobbles when it is lightly tapped, as part of the demonstration. It produces dangerous stray magnetic fields, presumably consumes a large amount of energy. The rotation of the platter is controlled by the magnetic field, which seems tenuous, and you have a strong stray field potentially affecting the magnetic transducer in the cartridge. I'll take a heavy platter on a high quality Swiss-made bearing any day. I'll use the money I saved to buy a Tesla. :)

Interestingly, once we got over the initial Wow factor and the novelty of it we actually left it alone.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 09, 2022, 01:06:39 AM
Quote from: Jo498 on February 08, 2022, 07:22:42 AM
I have this on CD (in a Early Maazel box) and while I admittedly don't much care about these particular pieces, it sure sounds great. The LP also looks great and a beautiful cover. For technical reasons and laziness I never fully got into LPs (as I started listening as a teenager at the fading of the LP era int he late 1980s when CDs were just the thing), but they were and are so much more beautiful and collectible than CDs!

Being appreciably older then yourself I performed a full circle. Collected LPs, then sold them all for  shining new CDs. Sold them and started collecting LPs. Now I do both which is what I should have done in the first place! ::)

I agree. The Maazel issue is all about sonics and the performances are not too shabby either.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Jo498 on February 09, 2022, 01:58:11 AM
There were about two years ca. 1987-89 when I relied a lot on LPs (and cassettes, incl. precorded ones, so much easier to handle and great in the car, but small, ugly, not great sound) in addition to CDs (which I started buying in winter 1988 as my father bought a CD player for the family before Xmas) but CDs quickly took over, especially as they became more affordable.
I got a little bit into LPs around 2002-06 because of some influence of audiophile friends, nostalgia and cheap LPs on Ebay but eventually I realizied that I lacked the interest and experience (and extra cash) to keep an LP setup. So I got rid of a lot although I still keep around 1 meter of shelf space with them in the vague hope I might get into setting up a turntable again some day.

That sticker in the picture is funny ("Can be removed easily"), I am not sure it it's the original issue from the early 60s or a later one. 24 marks is full price (I think there was a set price until the late 1960s or so) and bloody expensive (considering 1970 or earlier purchasing power). They were still around DM 20 in the 1980s (and CDs were introduced at 30-40 marks in the mid-1980s).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 09, 2022, 02:25:14 AM
Here is another interesting article that I recently came across on Discogs.

I have not owned an automatic TT since the early 1970s so I cannot really comment on it.



In Defense of the Automatic Turntable

Davey Ferchow posted January 31, 2022


Automatic turntables and manual turntables have always been on opposing sides of a vinyl community rivalry. For some, the convenience of an auto-return tonearm is a luxury they can't live without. For others, the deliberate act of dropping the needle in the correct groove makes them feel more deeply connected to the music they are spinning. These experiences can have a huge impact on how you listen to music, but the greatest debate here is centred around how each type of turntable will affect sound.

Those in the manual turntable camp claim that an automatic turntable's extra parts have a negative impact on the overall sound. Automatic turntable detractors often equate these models with beginner turntables as the ease of use makes them a popular option for new collectors.

Defenders of the automatic turntable claim that if the turntable is made with quality materials, listeners won't be able to tell the difference. As someone with both types of turntables, I am speaking out in defence of automatic turntables and celebrating the many advantages they offer.


Automatic turntables can help prevent damage.

With the flick of a switch or push of a button, an automatic record player will find that first groove and drop the stylus right where it's supposed to go. With a manual turntable, there is the possibility that you'll miss the groove or accidentally drop the tonearm. In either scenario, you can potentially damage your stylus or records. Automatic turntables help prevent this from happening.


Automatic turntables sound just as good as manual turntables.

Can an automatic turntable hold its own when it goes head-to-head with similarly priced manual turntables? The answer is yes! Since 1991, Pro-Ject has made a name for itself with turntables like the Debut Carbon and Debut Carbon EVO. These beloved turntables are manual, but Pro-Ject has finally developed a way to make an automatic turntable that captures the quality and affordability of their Debut Line.


(https://blog.discogs.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/A1-Pro-Ject-Automatic-Turntable.jpg)


The new Automat A1 turntable offers much more than an automatic tonearm. The pre-adjusted tracking force and anti-skating mean you won't have to adjust any settings before you plug in and play your first record. This takes the guesswork and careful calculations out of the equation as everything is calibrated for you.

Armed with an aluminium tonearm, integrated amplifier, gold plated RCA connectors, and vibration-absorbing feet, the Automat A1 just may convert some of the automatic naysayers. The resonance-damped wooden chassis, carbon fibre reinforced non-magnetic headshell, and premium semi-symmetrical phono cable ensure that the additional components do not negatively impact the listening experience.


Automatic turntables are ideal for certain environments.

Not having to worry about removing the tonearm once it hits the dead wax comes in handy in certain rooms and situations. If you enjoy listening to music from the comfort of your own bed, you won't have to worry about accidentally dozing off. An automatic record player will prevent your needle from getting locked in the runout groove for hours on end. This is also useful for any record players that may provide musical accompaniment for messy activities like cooking or cleaning. If you're in the zone, it can be nice to have the record player do the work for you when you've reached the end of a side.


Automatic turntables make record collecting accessible.

Like all audio gear, the prices of automatic turntables can range from budget-friendly to bankruptcy-inducing. However, the ease of use has inspired many brands to make entry-level turntables with auto-return arms. Ask a group of collectors what their first turntable was and you'll quickly learn that many of them started with an automatic. That's because choosing the right audio gear can be daunting for the uninitiated. An automatic turntable feels a little more inviting as new vinyl enthusiasts learn how to properly play and care for records.

After they've gotten the hang of it, some collectors begin to climb the gear ladder and invest in pricier turntables. With turntables like the Automat A1, you don't have to spend a lot of money or sacrifice hi-fi sound in the name of convenience.

Published in partnership with Pro-Ject. Images courtesy of Pro-Ject.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 09, 2022, 08:07:00 AM
I see no reason an automatic turntable couldn't be as good as a fully manual turntable, as long as the mechanism fully disengages from the tonearm when the record plays. That wouldn't apply to the ones where you would load a stack of records and it automatically drop and plays them in sequence. In that case the stylus angle would change every time another record was dropped on the platter, which would affect playback quality.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 10, 2022, 12:38:30 AM
Interesting article Fergus, thanks for posting.

The vinyl collecting community are set in their ways so an automatic TT is a hard sell. Hats off to Project for grasping the nettle in designing and marketing one. A progressive company that has brought good quality turntables to a wider market and a main contributor in keeping the vinyl flame burning.

I don't know if a myth or not but there is a deep seated view that simple is best. I loved the big silver fronted Japanese Receiver-Amps of the '70s, they had more switches and knobs then you could throw a stick at! They were very well made, a quality product. Suddenly, seemingly over-night the hi-fi community rejected them and hair-shirt amps sans controls took over. At the time I went from Technics to Sugden. The whole ethos of the two amps were miles apart.
It does depend the market Project are aiming for but to convince serious LP collectors to shun the simplicity mantra and purchase an automatic TT will be difficult, but great they are trying. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 10, 2022, 03:56:06 AM
But you can always get an Accuphase integrated amplifier! They even make a DSP setup moron like me drool.

(https://www.accuphase.com/model/photo/e-280.jpg)

Just remember to get a RIAA slot in board with yours.

..

Indeed kudos to Project. Manual turntables put off many customers now as it did back when LPs were the format to buy. Now LP is the cool format (or maybe it's MCs? Those born around Y2k move so fast...), but a little bit of convenience never hurt anybody.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 10, 2022, 05:03:45 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 10, 2022, 03:56:06 AM
But you can always get an Accuphase integrated amplifier! They even make a DSP setup moron like me drool.

(https://www.accuphase.com/model/photo/e-280.jpg)

Just remember to get a RIAA slot in board with yours.

..

Indeed kudos to Project. Manual turntables put off many customers now as it did back when LPs were the format to buy. Now LP is the cool format (or maybe it's MCs? Those born around Y2k move so fast...), but a little bit of convenience never hurt anybody.
Can't see the photo all that well, but from what I can see, it looks pretty cool!

Whilst typing the above, I remembered that a friend of mine added a special device onto at least one of his turntables; I forget what it's called (I'll ask him within the next few days), but it's something that you mount onto your turntable.  It automatically picks up the arm at the end of a record.  Found one online described as an "automatic tone arm lifter".  I'll ask him later which one he has used.

PD

p.s.  Here are some of the ones that Music Direct has carried or carries now.  https://www.musicdirect.com/analog-accessories/expressimo-audio-the-lift-tonearm-lifter
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 10, 2022, 07:13:23 AM
Found the Audio-Technica on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f42cA_nJULA

I admit I have a soft spot for Audio-Technica, still using their since long discontinued AT-OC10 MC pickup.

Picture search the net for Accuphase. If you're still into passive loudspeakers one of  their integrated amplifiers is the last one you'll buy. Keeping with the topic of this thread they have this absolutely stunning C-47 phono/RIAA amplifier which  lets you connect as many as four tone arms. If you have to ask about the price it's not for you.

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-DD_NjtgrVx0/Xtzw-v_MOWI/AAAAAAADrho/xFDgqoperboT9XBDUnXV-3rhyvrrE6D3gCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Screenshot%2B2020-06-07%2Bat%2B15.43.45.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 10, 2022, 07:45:49 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 10, 2022, 03:56:06 AM
But you can always get an Accuphase integrated amplifier! They even make a DSP setup moron like me drool.

(https://www.accuphase.com/model/photo/e-280.jpg)

Just remember to get a RIAA slot in board with yours.

..

Indeed kudos to Project. Manual turntables put off many customers now as it did back when LPs were the format to buy. Now LP is the cool format (or maybe it's MCs? Those born around Y2k move so fast...), but a little bit of convenience never hurt anybody.

But has it a loudness switch? Got to have one of those.

(https://i.imgur.com/QDSUA5M.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 10, 2022, 12:37:32 PM
Of course it has a loudness switch!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 11, 2022, 12:59:13 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 10, 2022, 12:37:32 PM
Of course it has a loudness switch!

Sorry, I was trying to be ironic. I don't really want a loudness switch.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 11, 2022, 04:54:08 AM
It can be quite brutal. The Yamaha variable loudness control is a better idea.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 04:55:10 AM
How interesting to read the last few posts above. Coincidentally, I was on a HiFi playdate yesterday where a good friend of mine was demonstrating a new pair of speakers for me which he had recently purchased. One of the sources used was a Project 10 TT [not automatic]:


(https://liquidsound.ca/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/extention-10.jpg)


Now he was feeding the TT into two different amplifiers, both of which had a phono stage. One of those amplifiers was an early 1980's [I think] Accuphase E206 which had a killer sound [stock photo below]:


(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/8kzOR35dRPI/maxresdefault.jpg)


The other amplifier that he used in the demonstration was a Sugden A21 which also had a phono stage [stock photo below]:


(https://www.stereophile.com/images/209sug.142442.jpg)


The Sugden also had a great but different sound, which was the whole point of the exercise.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2022, 06:04:28 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 04:55:10 AM
How interesting to read the last few posts above. Coincidentally, I was on a HiFi playdate yesterday where a good friend of mine was demonstrating a new pair of speakers for me which he had recently purchased. One of the sources used was a Project 10 TT [not automatic]:


(https://liquidsound.ca/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/extention-10.jpg)


Now he was feeding the TT into two different amplifiers, both of which had a phono stage. One of those amplifiers was an early 1980's [I think] Accuphase E206 which had a killer sound [stock photo below]:


(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/8kzOR35dRPI/maxresdefault.jpg)


The other amplifier that he used in the demonstration was a Sugden A21 which also had a phono stage [stock photo below]:


(https://www.stereophile.com/images/209sug.142442.jpg)


The Sugden also had a great but different sound, which was the whole point of the exercise.
It's amazing how much different pieces of equipment can effect the overall sound.  Love the wood on the plinth!

What kind of speakers did he buy and how does he like them so far?  And what did you think of them and how they fit into his system?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 07:00:36 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2022, 06:04:28 AM
It's amazing how much different pieces of equipment can effect the overall sound. 



PD

As we all know, a "good" system is all about the synthesis between the various components.



QuoteLove the wood on the plinth!


That particular TT is both a wonderful looking and wonderful sounding piece of Equipment.



QuoteWhat kind of speakers did he buy and how does he like them so far?  And what did you think of them and how they fit into his system?


He bought a pair of Martin Logan ESL 13A speakers. He is very happy with them, and so he should be. They are a very fine pair of speakers.

Here are a couple of stock photos to give you some idea:


(https://www.stereophile.com/images/117mlren.promo_.jpg)


(https://www.stereophile.com/images/117mlren.lifestyle.jpg)

However, like any truly high end component, they are very unforgiving. If you present a rubbish CD or LP to them they will show up all of the faults of a bad recording and throw back rubbish at you.

He offered me CD, Digital Download and Vinyl sources to me. The most successful combination, for me, was the marriage between the vinyl source and the Electro Static speakers. It was truly wonderful but I know that from my own set up.

For his digital downloads he is aiming for a better DAC which will definitely improve his sound in this sound world.

He owns a Primare CDP [I cannot remember the model] but I found it to be very "bright sounding. Another friend of mine also has a Primare CDP and I found the same outcome with that too.

However, he is happy with his choices and that is all that really matters.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2022, 07:58:52 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 07:00:36 AM
As we all know, a "good" system is all about the synthesis between the various components.




That particular TT is both a wonderful looking and wonderful sounding piece of Equipment.




He bought a pair of Martin Logan ESL 13A speakers. He is very happy with them, and so he should be. They are a very fine pair of speakers.

Here are a couple of stock photos to give you some idea:


(https://www.stereophile.com/images/117mlren.promo_.jpg)


(https://www.stereophile.com/images/117mlren.lifestyle.jpg)

However, like any truly high end component, they are very unforgiving. If you present a rubbish CD or LP to them they will show up all of the faults of a bad recording and throw back rubbish at you.

He offered me CD, Digital Download and Vinyl sources to me. The most successful combination, for me, was the marriage between the vinyl source and the Electro Static speakers. It was truly wonderful but I know that from my own set up.

For his digital downloads he is aiming for a better DAC which will definitely improve his sound in this sound world.

He owns a Primare CDP [I cannot remember the model] but I found it to be very "bright sounding. Another friend of mine also has a Primare CDP and I found the same outcome with that too.

However, he is happy with his choices and that is all that really matters.
I've seen electro static speakers before, but never heard anything played using them.  Your friend's are certainly different looking than what I remembered.  Does the sound just come from the bottom part or throughout the whole thing--sorry, dumb question I know, but I don't know how they work.

And, yes, I do well know what you mean about imperfect/badly done/technical limitations recordings that glaringly show all of their short-comings when you put them on a nice system.  Some recordings that I used to enjoy, well, you know the story!  If I really want to listen to them, I'll play them on a different system.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 11, 2022, 08:19:36 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 07:00:36 AM
As we all know, a "good" system is all about the synthesis between the various components.




That particular TT is both a wonderful looking and wonderful sounding piece of Equipment.




He bought a pair of Martin Logan ESL 13A speakers. He is very happy with them, and so he should be. They are a very fine pair of speakers.

Here are a couple of stock photos to give you some idea:


(https://www.stereophile.com/images/117mlren.promo_.jpg)


(https://www.stereophile.com/images/117mlren.lifestyle.jpg)

However, like any truly high end component, they are very unforgiving. If you present a rubbish CD or LP to them they will show up all of the faults of a bad recording and throw back rubbish at you.

He offered me CD, Digital Download and Vinyl sources to me. The most successful combination, for me, was the marriage between the vinyl source and the Electro Static speakers. It was truly wonderful but I know that from my own set up.

For his digital downloads he is aiming for a better DAC which will definitely improve his sound in this sound world.

He owns a Primare CDP [I cannot remember the model] but I found it to be very "bright sounding. Another friend of mine also has a Primare CDP and I found the same outcome with that too.

However, he is happy with his choices and that is all that really matters.

That is the key. Power amp/speaker are crucial match. Ivor Tiefenbrun, of Linn Sondek, argued that the front end is the most important part of any system and where the greatest investment should be made. A manufacturer of a TT would say that, but he has a point. As you say no system has the ability to convert rubbish....... 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 10:30:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2022, 07:58:52 AM
I've seen electro static speakers before, but never heard anything played using them.  Your friend's are certainly different looking than what I remembered.  Does the sound just come from the bottom part or throughout the whole thing--sorry, dumb question I know, but I don't know how they work.

PD

Hi PD,

Electrostatic speakers work differently when compared with "conventional" cone speakers. They are particularly good at reproducing small ensemble acoustic music and the human voice, I find.

As you know, every conventional speaker has a crossover unit which transfers the relevant frequency to the appropriate speaker cone. And so it is here; the top panel basically receives the mid and the treble frequencies whose that "box" below is basically a subwoofer which receives the bass frequencies.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 10:34:24 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 11, 2022, 08:19:36 AM
That is the key. Power amp/speaker are crucial match. Ivor Tiefenbrun, of Linn Sondek, argued that the front end is the most important part of any system and where the greatest investment should be made. A manufacturer of a TT would say that, but he has a point. As you say no system has the ability to convert rubbish.......

I believe that the speaker end ultimately defines the overall sound but that the "voice" of each of the various components has a contribution to make. The "sound" of each individual, overall system is a product of the synthesis of its various components. For me, in yesterday's various setups, the best combination was the vinyl/speaker combination followed by the Digital Download/Speaker combination [I forget what model DAC he has]. The biggest deficit in his otherwise quite fine setup is his CDP which, to my ears, is far too "bright". That is primarily down to that particular component. However, as we all well know, these things are very subjective and every pair of ears are different.

That Project 10 is a cracker, however.   

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 11, 2022, 10:38:31 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 10:34:24 AMThat Project 10 is a cracker, however.

I feel tempted to get a turntable again, until I remember I threw away all of my LPs. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2022, 10:52:07 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 10:30:44 AM
Hi PD,

Electrostatic speakers work differently when compared with "conventional" cone speakers. They are particularly good at reproducing small ensemble acoustic music and the human voice, I find.

As you know, every conventional speaker has a crossover unit which transfers the relevant frequency to the appropriate speaker cone. And so it is here; the top panel basically receives the mid and the treble frequencies whose that "box" below is basically a subwoofer which receives the bass frequencies.
Thanks.  Nice to know that I wasn't going crazy as earlier I was thinking that looks like a subwoofer?!  Just a bit hard for me to imagine how the upper part works--so used to seeing cones!

The electrostatics sound like they would be best (from what you've said) for things like jazz and acoustic music and singing (non-operatic).  Did you try to listen to any "bigger" groups and things like rock, opera and symphonic while you were there?  What kind of music does your friend primarily listen to by the way?  And how tall were they roughly (the speakers--not your friend)?

Hauled out an old LP set today (half-way through it):  "Wings Across America".  I should have cleaned it before putting it on (did a quick look at it), but have done so now.  Despite a few pops (now quieter), it still sounds good--even better than when I first purchased it!  Even though it's a live performance, I can hear a lot more detail in the music than I could before on my younger self's old junky equipment.  :D  Fun to revisit it!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 02:09:12 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2022, 10:52:07 AM

The electrostatics sound like they would be best (from what you've said) for things like jazz and acoustic music and singing (non-operatic).  Did you try to listen to any "bigger" groups and things like rock, opera and symphonic while you were there?  What kind of music does your friend primarily listen to by the way?  And how tall were they roughly (the speakers--not your friend)?

PD

Yes, PD, Jazz, Folk and anything with acoustic instruments and the human voice are the primary forte of electrostatic speakers, in my experience. Anything acoustic that is intimate really shines with this technology.


QuoteDid you try to listen to any "bigger" groups and things like rock, opera and symphonic while you were there? 


Yes to Baroque music, but to a limited degree. We listened to some Bach Cantatas but the CD recording was poor and this was reflected and magnified via the system.
Rock was represented by the Dire Straits' "Brothers In Arms" album. It was illuminating how restricted the bass playing was on the album which is something that I had not previously noticed. To be fair, I will revisit that album and critically analyse the bass playing further as bass playing is something that I pay particular attention to.
No Opera was sampled on the day.

My friend's music of choice are both the genres of Ambient and Electronica and both fared very well through his system. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 11, 2022, 02:14:25 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 11, 2022, 10:52:07 AM

Hauled out an old LP set today (half-way through it):  "Wings Across America".  I should have cleaned it before putting it on (did a quick look at it), but have done so now.  Despite a few pops (now quieter), it still sounds good--even better than when I first purchased it!  Even though it's a live performance, I can hear a lot more detail in the music than I could before on my younger self's old junky equipment.  :D  Fun to revisit it!

PD

I, too, have a copy of the Wings Across America triple vinyl album:


(https://www.beatlesmuseum.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/2019-07-12Fr-ReReleases-1a-LPblack-WingsOverAmerica-CollageA-0040-568x264.jpg)


I am a die hard fan of McCartney and Wings and I treasure this vinyl set. It captures terrific performances of Wings at the zenith of their performing career.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 14, 2022, 02:28:24 AM
Here is another interesting article that I came across on Discogs over the weekend.


The Importance of Isolation and How to Fix Vibration in Your Turntable Set-Up

Jeffrey Lee Puckett posted March 4, 2021


A lot of people dismiss the idea of isolating stereo gear from vibrations with a smirk and two words: snake oil.

Those people clearly don't live in a 100-year-old home with springy wood floors that turn it into a really big bounce house. Maybe they live in a newer home, or more likely in their parents' basement; a concrete floor cures a lot of ills.

But for a lot of people, isolation is a must because we can't walk across the room without making our turntable skip. Others consider isolation crucial no matter the circumstances, believing that even marginal resonances negatively impact the sound.

Maybe those folks do enjoy the occasional shot of snake oil after dinner, but I'm writing this story because I'm the poor sap who lives in a bounce house, and I have a box filled with isolation devices to prove it.

The Discogs down-and-dirty guide to reducing bad vibes will not be a scientific paper but instead a look at practical solutions. We'll discuss cheap fixes, esoteric options, and a couple of products that can perform minor miracles. We may even try and make something involving a serving tray and playground sand.

Let's get started.

We only pick the coolest stuff because we like it. However, when you purchase something through our affiliate links, Discogs may earn a commission.


Isolation v. Vibration

Nothing can get a flame war started quite like a forum thread about putting your turntable and speakers on the same surface. People lose their minds. Those who go hard against the practice are inevitably called "audiophools." Those who are fine with it are often called much worse. The internet even got mad at President Obama for having his turntable and speakers on the same surface, and dude was giving us all quality affordable health care.


Friends, let's take a breath and approach this logically.

A turntable's primary job is to keep the stylus in the groove, because that's where the music is. It's a delicate operation, in some ways a literal balancing act, and vibration can get in the way of that operation. If the stylus isn't getting a smooth ride, you won't get good sound. Meanwhile, a loudspeaker's primary job is to turn a signal into music, and part of that job requires the speaker to vibrate. That's how they reproduce music (see: every video on YouTube showing a pair of woofers pumping during "Bass I Love You").

So, logically, you should keep these two things far apart but: It depends.

It's entirely possible to put a pair of moderately-sized speakers, ones that are well-made and don't generate excessive bass, on the same surface alongside a turntable without problems. I've seen it done, and with great success. A friend with whom I've shared many all-night listening parties has a set-up that, on paper, should be a disaster but it sounds great. That's because his floors are rock solid, the furniture used is old-school solid wood that weighs a ton, and most of his bass is handled by a subwoofer that sits on the floor.

But the "down-and-dirty guide to reducing bad vibes" is for people with vibration issues. These could be from footfalls, speakers that are cranked loud enough to cause occasional skips, and even acoustic feedback. The latter is borderline frightening and occurs when the vibration of your woofers is picked up by your stylus, which creates a loop. The same signal is being amplified twice and all hell breaks loose as the woofers begin pumping like mad while howling. Feedback is an incontrovertible fact, no matter how many dumbass "experiments" you stage to prove that it isn't an issue.

So, let's start with two common scenarios and use those as our baseline. One is my own situation, the vintage bounce house, and the second is for those who are forced to put everything on one surface and aren't as lucky as my friend. Here are some very affordable solutions


Where to Start

There's a common product available under a variety of names but they're all essentially alike. They're heavy-duty isolation pads made with cork and rubber that are often used under heavy equipment in an industrial setting. They come in a variety of sizes and have a layer of cork compressed between two layers of rubber. There's a variant that has an extremely dense layer of blue foam between layers of rubber and they perform just as well.

If you have minor issues with footfalls affecting your turntable, put it on top of three or four of these. If you have more serious issues and are using something similar to an Ikea shelf, you could start by using the pads underneath the cabinet — or under both the shelf and the turntable for a double whammy of isolation. These pads are readily available from industrial supply houses, big box hardware stores, or Amazon, which has the widest variety and best prices. You can get an eight-pack of small ones, which are 2" x 2" x 7/8", for $10. The larger 4" x 4" x 7/8" pads, perfect for under a bigger shelf, are $7 for four.

If your turntable has feet taller than 7/8", then consider making yourself a turntable platform by using an Ikea bamboo chopping board, the Aptitlig, for $10 (thinner) or $20 (thicker, which is better). Place the chopping board on the pads and you have a pretty sharp platform for next to nothing. I use this method for most of my tubed equipment  — tubes don't like to be bounced around — and I don't think it's my imagination that the music has more clarity and focus.

I know for a fact that in many situations, this platform will at least cure your turntable's footfall problems (it worked in a former home but not this one). It might help if you're getting feedback at higher volumes; if you are, it's possible that the easiest and cheapest solution is to move your speakers.

Options, Options, and More Options

I've gone through a lot of isolation crap, some ridiculous, mostly to help with footfalls. There was a brief problem with feedback, however, which I'll get to in a minute.

Here's a list of everything I've tried other than the cork and rubber pads, with varying levels of success:

DIY sand-loaded platform: This is a pandemic project that was cheap and reasonably fun but ultimately wasn't quite good enough. Sand has been used for resonance damping in the audio world for decades; there are a number of speaker stands that can be filled with sand, and even a few speaker designs that have a rear cavity for sand loading.

For an equipment platform, all it took to DIY one was a serving tray, sand, and a cutting board at a total cost of around $25. I glued some thick, laminated paper over the inside of the open handles, lined the tray with plastic, and filled it with sand. The cutting board went on top of the sand, and it was fairly easy to shift the sand around in order to get a level surface. It looks surprisingly good and did a fairly good job — not good enough but it was encouraging. I suspect the tray isn't deep enough at 1.5 inches. A 3-inch tray would let me use around 40-45 pounds of sand, which would likely dampen anything.

Vibrapod isolators and cones: These slick little buddies come in two flavors. One is a vinyl composite pad, and the other is the pad combined with a cone that's topped with a metal ball. It kinda looks like a 1988 Madonna bra. If you have minor footfall issues and are concerned about aesthetics, a set of pads (no cones) placed under a cutting board may be all the isolation your turntable needs. A four-piece of No. 2 isolators will support 24 pounds and cost only $24. The price is the same no matter which version you buy, Nos. 1 through 5.

Sorbothane: This stuff is good for squeezing when you're feeling anxious but it has never solved any problems for me. Your mileage may vary, and it's readily available and pretty cheap unless a brand name is attached.

Spikes: Spikes are fairly controversial considering how they're just spikes, but there's a fundamental misunderstanding about them. They don't isolate your equipment from a surface but instead couple your equipment to a surface. Regardless, some people like the result and some don't. I can take them or leave them, but since I have hardwood floors I mostly leave them. A set of self-adhesive spikes can be had at pretty much all price points, so if you just want to experiment you can without burning too much cash.

Wooden blocks: Many years ago, there was a buzz about these tiny maple blocks meant to be used anywhere you needed isolation. Of course I bought some, even though the cost-to-size ratio seemed way off, and they've been sitting in a box for a decade. While a thick maple butcher's block can be highly effective (and expensive), these little guys did nothing for me. However, because I'm dumb, I bought some much large isolation pads made of birch plywood sandwiched by cork from a carpenter/audiophile who has since retired, or perhaps run out of birch plywood. These were actually pretty good and cleared up some midrange congestion in an old pair of Spendor monitors.

Marble platforms: This seems like such an '80s thing, but there are still people who use marble. I have one marble turntable platform and it doesn't help with footfalls (at my house and with my turntable). I can see where a thick slab under a speaker or subwoofer might do some serious isolating, but marble ain't cheap.

Gingko Audio: My Gingko Audio platform is probably the most embarrassing audiophile thing I own but it is highly effective. It's a three-part isolation system that starts with an acrylic platform, then squash balls are situated on indentations in the platform — yeah, I know — and they're covered by another acrylic piece that hides the fact that you're using squash balls. The thing is, it works, but at a cost — like $500. When I bought a monster pair of floor-standing speakers 10 or so years ago, they overloaded my room with deep bass, which caused violent feedback even though my turntable was four or five feet away and sitting on a wall-mounted shelf. I added the Gingko, which I thankfully found used because these things are way overpriced, and the feedback was solved. So I'm a big fan but still. Squash balls.

Wall-mounted shelves: These steel shelves, made by a variety of manufacturers, all do the same thing and do it well. They aren't that expensive, usually around $150, but they require you to punch six long, heavy-duty screws into your wall, preferably into some studs. It's a highly effective but fairly extreme solution, in terms of effort and overall destruction, and your turntable won't skip even during a B-52's party. After repainting the living room, however, I haven't been able to bring myself to ruin that beautiful wall again. Plus, it's a serious pain in the ass to mount these shelves correctly.

Luckily, out of the blue, an affordable, elegant solution arrived.


The Best (So Far)

Since the early 1990s, I've read reviews of hundreds of audio accessories and tweaks. Some were solid, practical engineering and some were absolute nonsense, like the recommendation that you put photos of yourself in the freezer for improved sound, or anything marketed by PWB Electronics. I've never seen such unanimous praise as I have for products made by IsoAcoustics, many of which are beyond my price range. But as I was formulating this story IsoAcoustics randomly reached out via DM and offered to send review samples of their zaZen I turntable platform ($199) and Iso-Puck Mini ($99 for eight). I was stoked but cautious. Turns out I should have just been stoked.

The zaZen platform replaced an elaborate two-tiered isolation setup involving cork pads, bamboo cutting board, and the crazy squash ball thing — all of which worked but looked insane. The zaZen, with its dense platform and IsoPuck feet, is unobtrusive at 1.5 inches tall, looks elegant, and does a better job.

I took a cautious step. I took a normal step. Then I took an aggressive step — let's just call it a drunk step — and nothing happened except music. No skips.

I was pleasantly shocked. Maybe $199 sounds like a lot of money, but after struggling for years with skips and occasional feedback, it feels like a screaming bargain and I'm buying the review sample.

Excited by the results, I went online and found a used set of eight standard-sized IsoPucks, which are designed for heavier loads, to put under my vintage ADS speakers. They objectively tightened the bass and improved the overall clarity. There was no doubt. None. The ADS are a recent purchase and I love everything about them except for slightly muddy and overemphasised bass. The IsoPucks improved this to a degree that the sound went from really good to holy shit.

The IsoPucks are made of a proprietary material and make clever use of suction. The top half of the IsoPuck melds itself to the bottom of a component and the bottom half does the same with the surface on which the component sits. Inside is a design based on stud isolators used in the flooring of buildings. The ultimate purpose is to decouple the component from a desktop, shelf, speaker stand, or floor.

Decoupling prevents the transfer of vibration-based energy from speaker to surface or from surface to component. Imagine the energy getting trapped in the middle of the pucks, leaving the component free to do its job. The zaZen is a double whammy as the feet and platform work together to isolate.

If you're forced to keep speakers on the same surface as a turntable — and are having issues, of course — I highly recommend the Iso-Puck Mini. I can't imagine them not working. Of course, you absolutely should first explore the cheap alternatives detailed above if money is a problem. Even if the cork and rubber pads don't work, they'll come in handy someday, guaranteed — if you ever have a washer go rogue and start loudly spasming, just slip the pads under that rude boy and enjoy the silence while you listen to "And Justice for All."

And there you have it, one man's journey into isolation, which is pretty appropriate given the current state of the world.

Again, if you feel like you don't have any vibration issues then don't bother. If you think that problems caused by vibration are fake news, then don't bother. This guide is meant to help anyone whose listening is compromised, period, and it isn't based on conjecture but results. Now get out there and crush those lovin' good vibrations under the heel of your cork-and-rubber boots.


                                                                          -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I live in one of those bouncy older houses with wooden floors.
My main rig is housed on a tiered rack and I do not use any isolation for the components on the shelves.
However, my power amplifier sits on the floor directly under the rack and I do use isolation for that component. I use a type of cup that I came across in a hardware shop years ago which are meant to be used for the feet of a clothes washing machine to stand in.
A few years ago I had a Linn Sondek TT sitting on the top of the rack and that was very problematic for me. A bouncy platter in a bouncy room was not an ideal setup. I now have a much heavier TT on the rack so it is no longer a problem.
I do also have my speakers, with spiked feet, sitting on two marble slabs.

In another room I have a secondary system which rests on a set of wooden bookshelves.
I have that CDP sitting on a large wall tile and the TT sits on a glass chopping board. Both solutions work for me.

When I first started using isolation under my components I started with a squash ball cut in half, dome shaped, with the CDP standing on these. This was a good solution but impractical for me due to the necessity to move the CDP to move various input and output cables in and out [as it is also a CD recorder]. Once I moved the CDP it obviously toppled off the squash balls. Now I simply move the tile and the whole unit moves freely.



Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2022, 07:17:52 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 14, 2022, 02:28:24 AM
Here is another interesting article that I came across on Discogs over the weekend.


The Importance of Isolation and How to Fix Vibration in Your Turntable Set-Up

Jeffrey Lee Puckett posted March 4, 2021


A lot of people dismiss the idea of isolating stereo gear from vibrations with a smirk and two words: snake oil.

Those people clearly don't live in a 100-year-old home with springy wood floors that turn it into a really big bounce house. Maybe they live in a newer home, or more likely in their parents' basement; a concrete floor cures a lot of ills.

But for a lot of people, isolation is a must because we can't walk across the room without making our turntable skip. Others consider isolation crucial no matter the circumstances, believing that even marginal resonances negatively impact the sound.

Maybe those folks do enjoy the occasional shot of snake oil after dinner, but I'm writing this story because I'm the poor sap who lives in a bounce house, and I have a box filled with isolation devices to prove it.

The Discogs down-and-dirty guide to reducing bad vibes will not be a scientific paper but instead a look at practical solutions. We'll discuss cheap fixes, esoteric options, and a couple of products that can perform minor miracles. We may even try and make something involving a serving tray and playground sand.

Let's get started.

We only pick the coolest stuff because we like it. However, when you purchase something through our affiliate links, Discogs may earn a commission.


Isolation v. Vibration

Nothing can get a flame war started quite like a forum thread about putting your turntable and speakers on the same surface. People lose their minds. Those who go hard against the practice are inevitably called "audiophools." Those who are fine with it are often called much worse. The internet even got mad at President Obama for having his turntable and speakers on the same surface, and dude was giving us all quality affordable health care.


Friends, let's take a breath and approach this logically.

A turntable's primary job is to keep the stylus in the groove, because that's where the music is. It's a delicate operation, in some ways a literal balancing act, and vibration can get in the way of that operation. If the stylus isn't getting a smooth ride, you won't get good sound. Meanwhile, a loudspeaker's primary job is to turn a signal into music, and part of that job requires the speaker to vibrate. That's how they reproduce music (see: every video on YouTube showing a pair of woofers pumping during "Bass I Love You").

So, logically, you should keep these two things far apart but: It depends.

It's entirely possible to put a pair of moderately-sized speakers, ones that are well-made and don't generate excessive bass, on the same surface alongside a turntable without problems. I've seen it done, and with great success. A friend with whom I've shared many all-night listening parties has a set-up that, on paper, should be a disaster but it sounds great. That's because his floors are rock solid, the furniture used is old-school solid wood that weighs a ton, and most of his bass is handled by a subwoofer that sits on the floor.

But the "down-and-dirty guide to reducing bad vibes" is for people with vibration issues. These could be from footfalls, speakers that are cranked loud enough to cause occasional skips, and even acoustic feedback. The latter is borderline frightening and occurs when the vibration of your woofers is picked up by your stylus, which creates a loop. The same signal is being amplified twice and all hell breaks loose as the woofers begin pumping like mad while howling. Feedback is an incontrovertible fact, no matter how many dumbass "experiments" you stage to prove that it isn't an issue.

So, let's start with two common scenarios and use those as our baseline. One is my own situation, the vintage bounce house, and the second is for those who are forced to put everything on one surface and aren't as lucky as my friend. Here are some very affordable solutions


Where to Start

There's a common product available under a variety of names but they're all essentially alike. They're heavy-duty isolation pads made with cork and rubber that are often used under heavy equipment in an industrial setting. They come in a variety of sizes and have a layer of cork compressed between two layers of rubber. There's a variant that has an extremely dense layer of blue foam between layers of rubber and they perform just as well.

If you have minor issues with footfalls affecting your turntable, put it on top of three or four of these. If you have more serious issues and are using something similar to an Ikea shelf, you could start by using the pads underneath the cabinet — or under both the shelf and the turntable for a double whammy of isolation. These pads are readily available from industrial supply houses, big box hardware stores, or Amazon, which has the widest variety and best prices. You can get an eight-pack of small ones, which are 2" x 2" x 7/8", for $10. The larger 4" x 4" x 7/8" pads, perfect for under a bigger shelf, are $7 for four.

If your turntable has feet taller than 7/8", then consider making yourself a turntable platform by using an Ikea bamboo chopping board, the Aptitlig, for $10 (thinner) or $20 (thicker, which is better). Place the chopping board on the pads and you have a pretty sharp platform for next to nothing. I use this method for most of my tubed equipment  — tubes don't like to be bounced around — and I don't think it's my imagination that the music has more clarity and focus.

I know for a fact that in many situations, this platform will at least cure your turntable's footfall problems (it worked in a former home but not this one). It might help if you're getting feedback at higher volumes; if you are, it's possible that the easiest and cheapest solution is to move your speakers.

Options, Options, and More Options

I've gone through a lot of isolation crap, some ridiculous, mostly to help with footfalls. There was a brief problem with feedback, however, which I'll get to in a minute.

Here's a list of everything I've tried other than the cork and rubber pads, with varying levels of success:

DIY sand-loaded platform: This is a pandemic project that was cheap and reasonably fun but ultimately wasn't quite good enough. Sand has been used for resonance damping in the audio world for decades; there are a number of speaker stands that can be filled with sand, and even a few speaker designs that have a rear cavity for sand loading.

For an equipment platform, all it took to DIY one was a serving tray, sand, and a cutting board at a total cost of around $25. I glued some thick, laminated paper over the inside of the open handles, lined the tray with plastic, and filled it with sand. The cutting board went on top of the sand, and it was fairly easy to shift the sand around in order to get a level surface. It looks surprisingly good and did a fairly good job — not good enough but it was encouraging. I suspect the tray isn't deep enough at 1.5 inches. A 3-inch tray would let me use around 40-45 pounds of sand, which would likely dampen anything.

Vibrapod isolators and cones: These slick little buddies come in two flavors. One is a vinyl composite pad, and the other is the pad combined with a cone that's topped with a metal ball. It kinda looks like a 1988 Madonna bra. If you have minor footfall issues and are concerned about aesthetics, a set of pads (no cones) placed under a cutting board may be all the isolation your turntable needs. A four-piece of No. 2 isolators will support 24 pounds and cost only $24. The price is the same no matter which version you buy, Nos. 1 through 5.

Sorbothane: This stuff is good for squeezing when you're feeling anxious but it has never solved any problems for me. Your mileage may vary, and it's readily available and pretty cheap unless a brand name is attached.

Spikes: Spikes are fairly controversial considering how they're just spikes, but there's a fundamental misunderstanding about them. They don't isolate your equipment from a surface but instead couple your equipment to a surface. Regardless, some people like the result and some don't. I can take them or leave them, but since I have hardwood floors I mostly leave them. A set of self-adhesive spikes can be had at pretty much all price points, so if you just want to experiment you can without burning too much cash.

Wooden blocks: Many years ago, there was a buzz about these tiny maple blocks meant to be used anywhere you needed isolation. Of course I bought some, even though the cost-to-size ratio seemed way off, and they've been sitting in a box for a decade. While a thick maple butcher's block can be highly effective (and expensive), these little guys did nothing for me. However, because I'm dumb, I bought some much large isolation pads made of birch plywood sandwiched by cork from a carpenter/audiophile who has since retired, or perhaps run out of birch plywood. These were actually pretty good and cleared up some midrange congestion in an old pair of Spendor monitors.

Marble platforms: This seems like such an '80s thing, but there are still people who use marble. I have one marble turntable platform and it doesn't help with footfalls (at my house and with my turntable). I can see where a thick slab under a speaker or subwoofer might do some serious isolating, but marble ain't cheap.

Gingko Audio: My Gingko Audio platform is probably the most embarrassing audiophile thing I own but it is highly effective. It's a three-part isolation system that starts with an acrylic platform, then squash balls are situated on indentations in the platform — yeah, I know — and they're covered by another acrylic piece that hides the fact that you're using squash balls. The thing is, it works, but at a cost — like $500. When I bought a monster pair of floor-standing speakers 10 or so years ago, they overloaded my room with deep bass, which caused violent feedback even though my turntable was four or five feet away and sitting on a wall-mounted shelf. I added the Gingko, which I thankfully found used because these things are way overpriced, and the feedback was solved. So I'm a big fan but still. Squash balls.

Wall-mounted shelves: These steel shelves, made by a variety of manufacturers, all do the same thing and do it well. They aren't that expensive, usually around $150, but they require you to punch six long, heavy-duty screws into your wall, preferably into some studs. It's a highly effective but fairly extreme solution, in terms of effort and overall destruction, and your turntable won't skip even during a B-52's party. After repainting the living room, however, I haven't been able to bring myself to ruin that beautiful wall again. Plus, it's a serious pain in the ass to mount these shelves correctly.

Luckily, out of the blue, an affordable, elegant solution arrived.


The Best (So Far)

Since the early 1990s, I've read reviews of hundreds of audio accessories and tweaks. Some were solid, practical engineering and some were absolute nonsense, like the recommendation that you put photos of yourself in the freezer for improved sound, or anything marketed by PWB Electronics. I've never seen such unanimous praise as I have for products made by IsoAcoustics, many of which are beyond my price range. But as I was formulating this story IsoAcoustics randomly reached out via DM and offered to send review samples of their zaZen I turntable platform ($199) and Iso-Puck Mini ($99 for eight). I was stoked but cautious. Turns out I should have just been stoked.

The zaZen platform replaced an elaborate two-tiered isolation setup involving cork pads, bamboo cutting board, and the crazy squash ball thing — all of which worked but looked insane. The zaZen, with its dense platform and IsoPuck feet, is unobtrusive at 1.5 inches tall, looks elegant, and does a better job.

I took a cautious step. I took a normal step. Then I took an aggressive step — let's just call it a drunk step — and nothing happened except music. No skips.

I was pleasantly shocked. Maybe $199 sounds like a lot of money, but after struggling for years with skips and occasional feedback, it feels like a screaming bargain and I'm buying the review sample.

Excited by the results, I went online and found a used set of eight standard-sized IsoPucks, which are designed for heavier loads, to put under my vintage ADS speakers. They objectively tightened the bass and improved the overall clarity. There was no doubt. None. The ADS are a recent purchase and I love everything about them except for slightly muddy and overemphasised bass. The IsoPucks improved this to a degree that the sound went from really good to holy shit.

The IsoPucks are made of a proprietary material and make clever use of suction. The top half of the IsoPuck melds itself to the bottom of a component and the bottom half does the same with the surface on which the component sits. Inside is a design based on stud isolators used in the flooring of buildings. The ultimate purpose is to decouple the component from a desktop, shelf, speaker stand, or floor.

Decoupling prevents the transfer of vibration-based energy from speaker to surface or from surface to component. Imagine the energy getting trapped in the middle of the pucks, leaving the component free to do its job. The zaZen is a double whammy as the feet and platform work together to isolate.

If you're forced to keep speakers on the same surface as a turntable — and are having issues, of course — I highly recommend the Iso-Puck Mini. I can't imagine them not working. Of course, you absolutely should first explore the cheap alternatives detailed above if money is a problem. Even if the cork and rubber pads don't work, they'll come in handy someday, guaranteed — if you ever have a washer go rogue and start loudly spasming, just slip the pads under that rude boy and enjoy the silence while you listen to "And Justice for All."

And there you have it, one man's journey into isolation, which is pretty appropriate given the current state of the world.

Again, if you feel like you don't have any vibration issues then don't bother. If you think that problems caused by vibration are fake news, then don't bother. This guide is meant to help anyone whose listening is compromised, period, and it isn't based on conjecture but results. Now get out there and crush those lovin' good vibrations under the heel of your cork-and-rubber boots.


                                                                          -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I live in one of those bouncy older houses with wooden floors.
My main rig is housed on a tiered rack and I do not use any isolation for the components on the shelves.
However, my power amplifier sits on the floor directly under the rack and I do use isolation for that component. I use a type of cup that I came across in a hardware shop years ago which are meant to be used for the feet of a clothes washing machine to stand in.
A few years ago I had a Linn Sondek TT sitting on the top of the rack and that was very problematic for me. A bouncy platter in a bouncy room was not an ideal setup. I now have a much heavier TT on the rack so it is no longer a problem.
I do also have my speakers, with spiked feet, sitting on two marble slabs.

In another room I have a secondary system which rests on a set of wooden bookshelves.
I have that CDP sitting on a large wall tile and the TT sits on a glass chopping board. Both solutions work for me.

When I first started using isolation under my components I started with a squash ball cut in half, dome shaped, with the CDP standing on these. This was a good solution but impractical for me due to the necessity to move the CDP to move various input and output cables in and out [as it is also a CD recorder]. Once I moved the CDP it obviously toppled off the squash balls. Now I simply move the tile and the whole unit moves freely.
Thanks for that article Fergus.  Are the comments at the bottom yours or are they updates by the original article writer?

In any event, I too live in a bouncy house.  Have to be somewhat careful when I'm playing records in my living room.  About a year ago, a friend lent me a spare turntable for upstairs.  I had thought that it would be cool to be able to listen to in my study or when I was in my bedroom.  Alas, my setup there is even bouncier and the record would skip if I did anything other than walk like a mouse.  My walls are plaster and he was reluctant to try and install a shelf for it there.   :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 14, 2022, 08:25:32 AM
What a subject! I came up with the perfect solution, more anon.

Very much horses for courses. The article makes a very important distinction of the floor, in my case uncarpeted concrete with wood parquet covering. I very much agree with thumbs down for Sorbothane, a disaster under my un-sprung TT. I preceded to put them under my speakers with even worse results. Also squash balls are mooted. Loricraft use them (whole, not cut in half) under the top plates of their plinths. My first plinth was designed in this way and they do work. I think it was "Target" who sold wall shelves specifically designed for TTs. They sold well and it makes a lot of sense to isolate the TT from the floor. I think maybe wall shelving more suitable for suspended TTs though. Townsend Audio came up with the Seismic Isolation Platform which is pumped up with a bicycle pump. Incidentally, the owner Max Townsend recently passed away. 

In my situation the best results are mass - more the better. I have used for the last 25 years a slate TT stand manufactured by Slate Audio who ceased to trade in 2000. Very heavy and impossible to lift by a single person. This is spiked to the floor.

We were finding housing equipment and even more so record collection extremely difficult. My wife is understanding but we reached the stage something had to be done or get rid of it all. We were able to build a small extension on the front of our house, only 5x1 1/2 metres approx. All LPs and CDs are shelved at one end which are out of sight and equipment at other. A hole drilled through the connecting wall leading to living/listening area which speaker cables are passed through.

One thing which I believe of great importance and had this demonstrated to me. Never share the same stand with turntable and amps etc.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2022, 11:03:53 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 14, 2022, 08:25:32 AM
What a subject! I came up with the perfect solution, more anon.

Very much horses for courses. The article makes a very important distinction of the floor, in my case uncarpeted concrete with wood parquet covering. I very much agree with thumbs down for Sorbothane, a disaster under my un-sprung TT. I preceded to put them under my speakers with even worse results. Also squash balls are mooted. Loricraft use them (whole, not cut in half) under the top plates of their plinths. My first plinth was designed in this way and they do work. I think it was "Target" who sold wall shelves specifically designed for TTs. They sold well and it makes a lot of sense to isolate the TT from the floor. I think maybe wall shelving more suitable for suspended TTs though. Townsend Audio came up with the Seismic Isolation Platform which is pumped up with a bicycle pump. Incidentally, the owner Max Townsend recently passed away. 

In my situation the best results are mass - more the better. I have used for the last 25 years a slate TT stand manufactured by Slate Audio who ceased to trade in 2000. Very heavy and impossible to lift by a single person. This is spiked to the floor.

We were finding housing equipment and even more so record collection extremely difficult. My wife is understanding but we reached the stage something had to be done or get rid of it all. We were able to build a small extension on the front of our house, only 5x1 1/2 metres approx. All LPs and CDs are shelved at one end which are out of sight and equipment at other. A hole drilled through the connecting wall leading to living/listening area which speaker cables are passed through.

One thing which I believe of great importance and had this demonstrated to me. Never share the same stand with turntable and amps etc.
A couple of questions for you Irons:  So, your have spikes for the slate that goes into your wooden flooring?  Or do you have something underneath them?  And the same for your speakers?

And what is the reasoning behind not having your amp and preamp on the same stand as your turn table?

PD

p.s.  And how close are you to running out of room in that storage/equipemnt room for your LPs (and CDs too??)?  ;)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 14, 2022, 11:12:31 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2022, 07:17:52 AM
Thanks for that article Fergus.  Are the comments at the bottom yours or are they updates by the original article writer?

In any event, I too live in a bouncy house.  Have to be somewhat careful when I'm playing records in my living room.  About a year ago, a friend lent me a spare turntable for upstairs.  I had thought that it would be cool to be able to listen to in my study or when I was in my bedroom.  Alas, my setup there is even bouncier and the record would skip if I did anything other than walk like a mouse.  My walls are plaster and he was reluctant to try and install a shelf for it there.   :(

PD

Yes, those final comments are comments from me PD and refer to my past and present exploits in this area.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 14, 2022, 11:14:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 14, 2022, 08:25:32 AM
What a subject! I came up with the perfect solution, more anon.

Very much horses for courses. The article makes a very important distinction of the floor, in my case uncarpeted concrete with wood parquet covering. I very much agree with thumbs down for Sorbothane, a disaster under my un-sprung TT. I preceded to put them under my speakers with even worse results. Also squash balls are mooted. Loricraft use them (whole, not cut in half) under the top plates of their plinths. My first plinth was designed in this way and they do work. I think it was "Target" who sold wall shelves specifically designed for TTs. They sold well and it makes a lot of sense to isolate the TT from the floor. I think maybe wall shelving more suitable for suspended TTs though. Townsend Audio came up with the Seismic Isolation Platform which is pumped up with a bicycle pump. Incidentally, the owner Max Townsend recently passed away. 

In my situation the best results are mass - more the better. I have used for the last 25 years a slate TT stand manufactured by Slate Audio who ceased to trade in 2000. Very heavy and impossible to lift by a single person. This is spiked to the floor.

We were finding housing equipment and even more so record collection extremely difficult. My wife is understanding but we reached the stage something had to be done or get rid of it all. We were able to build a small extension on the front of our house, only 5x1 1/2 metres approx. All LPs and CDs are shelved at one end which are out of sight and equipment at other. A hole drilled through the connecting wall leading to living/listening area which speaker cables are passed through.

One thing which I believe of great importance and had this demonstrated to me. Never share the same stand with turntable and amps etc.

That is very interesting. It is, however, a luxury that I probably will never possess due to limitations of space.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2022, 11:14:50 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 14, 2022, 11:12:31 AM
Yes, those final comments are comments from me PD and refer to my past and present exploits in this area.
Thanks, I suspected as much but since they were within your quote, I wasn't positive.  I'll reread them.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 15, 2022, 12:36:12 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 14, 2022, 11:03:53 AM
A couple of questions for you Irons:  So, your have spikes for the slate that goes into your wooden flooring?  Or do you have something underneath them?  And the same for your speakers?

And what is the reasoning behind not having your amp and preamp on the same stand as your turn table?

PD

p.s.  And how close are you to running out of room in that storage/equipemnt room for your LPs (and CDs too??)?  ;)

Yes, PD. I have small brass cups which I purchased from a plumbing store but coins do the job just as well.

Terry Sullivan of Loricraft Audio demonstrated to me the importance of isolation of TT from the other equipment. This was with a bomb proof Garrard I dread to think the result with suspended TTs. The problem is that all equipment, far as I'm aware, use transformers and transformers vibrate, sometimes obviously as you can hear and/or feel it. Other pieces of equipment, pre-amps for example, is not detectable and we are unaware but the super-sensitive cartridge stylus isn't! The frame of a hi-fi rack acts as a conduit of the micro-vibration from transformers lower down to the TT which is planted at the top.

I buy less LPs then I did - saying that picked up a lovely mint box set of Saint-Saens violin concertos on Saturday. I do have overflow shelving in another room. CDs are becoming a problem though.

Quote from: aligreto on February 14, 2022, 11:12:31 AM
Yes, those final comments are comments from me PD and refer to my past and present exploits in this area.

Your situation is challenging but fun trying things that may come up with a solution. Air is the area I would explore. Heard stories of TTs sitting on children's swimming rings! Wouldn't go that far, but I would try a heavy board sitting on top of four whole squash balls at corners.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 15, 2022, 02:42:39 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 15, 2022, 12:36:12 AM

Your situation is challenging but fun trying things that may come up with a solution. Air is the area I would explore. Heard stories of TTs sitting on children's swimming rings! Wouldn't go that far, but I would try a heavy board sitting on top of four whole squash balls at corners.

As stated before I did find squash balls were successful, to some extent, for me before. However, and perhaps I am being really stupid here, I cannot get my head around the stability concept of the whole squash ball. I obviously do not want my TT rolling off the top shelf of my rack and crashing onto the floor. That was why I originally cut the squash balls in half, for stability. Does the weight of a heavy board and TT depress the squash balls thereby creating a greater surface for them to "grip" the shelf? Otherwise, surely using something else to stabalise the squash balls and thereby prevent them from rolling will create its own vibration issue?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 15, 2022, 06:05:32 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 15, 2022, 12:36:12 AM
Yes, PD. I have small brass cups which I purchased from a plumbing store but coins do the job just as well.

Terry Sullivan of Loricraft Audio demonstrated to me the importance of isolation of TT from the other equipment. This was with a bomb proof Garrard I dread to think the result with suspended TTs. The problem is that all equipment, far as I'm aware, use transformers and transformers vibrate, sometimes obviously as you can hear and/or feel it. Other pieces of equipment, pre-amps for example, is not detectable and we are unaware but the super-sensitive cartridge stylus isn't! The frame of a hi-fi rack acts as a conduit of the micro-vibration from transformers lower down to the TT which is planted at the top.

I buy less LPs then I did - saying that picked up a lovely mint box set of Saint-Saens violin concertos on Saturday. I do have overflow shelving in another room. CDs are becoming a problem though.

Your situation is challenging but fun trying things that may come up with a solution. Air is the area I would explore. Heard stories of TTs sitting on children's swimming rings! Wouldn't go that far, but I would try a heavy board sitting on top of four whole squash balls at corners.

Quote from: aligreto on February 15, 2022, 02:42:39 AM
As stated before I did find squash balls were successful, to some extent, for me before. However, and perhaps I am being really stupid here, I cannot get my head around the stability concept of the whole squash ball. I obviously do not want my TT rolling off the top shelf of my rack and crashing onto the floor. That was why I originally cut the squash balls in half, for stability. Does the weight of a heavy board and TT depress the squash balls thereby creating a greater surface for them to "grip" the shelf? Otherwise, surely using something else to stabalise the squash balls and thereby prevent them from rolling will create its own vibration issue?
Are you gents sure that that idea for using squash balls wasn't created by a turntable manufacturer--wanting you to have to buy a new t.t.?  ;)

Pd
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 15, 2022, 07:09:26 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 15, 2022, 02:42:39 AM
As stated before I did find squash balls were successful, to some extent, for me before. However, and perhaps I am being really stupid here, I cannot get my head around the stability concept of the whole squash ball. I obviously do not want my TT rolling off the top shelf of my rack and crashing onto the floor. That was why I originally cut the squash balls in half, for stability. Does the weight of a heavy board and TT depress the squash balls thereby creating a greater surface for them to "grip" the shelf? Otherwise, surely using something else to stabalise the squash balls and thereby prevent them from rolling will create its own vibration issue?

I get your point but a slab of marble isn't going anywhere or even that great mainstay of a tweaker, a wood chopping board. The squash ball will be flattened by the weight so won't roll. By cutting the ball in half you are losing the one great advantage of such a system, air. Which is the best decoupler of all.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 15, 2022, 08:40:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 15, 2022, 07:09:26 AM
I get your point but a slab of marble isn't going anywhere or even that great mainstay of a tweaker, a wood chopping board. The squash ball will be flattened by the weight so won't roll. By cutting the ball in half you are losing the one great advantage of such a system, air. Which is the best decoupler of all.

Cheers, Lol. I may check that out some time in the future. If I do I will report back. The squash balls will be no problem but finding an appropriate sized chopping board or slab of marble fot underneath my YY might be an issue. Anyway, I will keep my eyes open.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 15, 2022, 01:19:55 PM
Quote from: aligreto on February 15, 2022, 08:40:31 AM
Cheers, Lol. I may check that out some time in the future. If I do I will report back. The squash balls will be no problem but finding an appropriate sized chopping board or slab of marble fot underneath my YY might be an issue. Anyway, I will keep my eyes open.

May not be the be all and end all Fergus, but you never know until you try. Keep it in mind and if you come across flat and heavy material of roughly the right size and importantly cheap.....
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 15, 2022, 01:31:24 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 15, 2022, 01:19:55 PM
May not be the be all and end all Fergus, but you never know until you try. Keep it in mind and if you come across flat and heavy material of roughly the right size and importantly cheap.....

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=83023;image)


Cheers, Lol. I fully understand the concept of air as the isolator. It is the belief in a non rolling whole squash ball that I have an issue with.  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 16, 2022, 08:03:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 15, 2022, 01:19:55 PM
May not be the be all and end all Fergus, but you never know until you try. Keep it in mind and if you come across flat and heavy material of roughly the right size and importantly cheap.....
Quote from: aligreto on February 15, 2022, 01:31:24 PM
Cheers, Lol. I fully understand the concept of air as the isolator. It is the belief in a non rolling whole squash ball that I have an issue with.  ;D
I wonder how many squash balls have been killed in the quest for a vibrationally-isolated turn table?

But seriously, how are you supposed to use this setup?  What goes on what and where?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 17, 2022, 07:19:51 AM
(http://www.jkwynn.co.uk/Pics/AT33_3.JPG)

Ordered one like this, an Audio-Technica AT33PTG/II (https://www.audio-technica.com/en-gb/at33ptg-ii) to replace my aging AT-OC10. Yes, I stick to the same manufacturer.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 17, 2022, 07:41:04 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 16, 2022, 08:03:11 AM
I wonder how many squash balls have been killed in the quest for a vibrationally-isolated turn table?

But seriously, how are you supposed to use this setup?  What goes on what and where?

PD

The most pertinent question PD is yellow or red dot! I am joking. ;)

Loricraft Audio used squash balls in their plinth for Garrard 301, 401 and their own 501 turntables. The pic below is self explanatory. Four squash balls one in each corner isolate the top plate and platter from the powerful Garrard motor. I used this arrangement for some time before moving over to a high-mass layered plinth. Both concepts have the same goal to isolate a motor that could drive a lawnmower (only a slight exaggeration) from a highly delicate modern cartridge. Completely opposed methods to solve the same problem. Suspension/mass.     
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 17, 2022, 07:53:48 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 17, 2022, 07:19:51 AM
(http://www.jkwynn.co.uk/Pics/AT33_3.JPG)

Ordered one like this, an Audio-Technica AT33PTG/II (https://www.audio-technica.com/en-gb/at33ptg-ii) to replace my aging AT-OC10. Yes, I stick to the same manufacturer.

What I like most of AT cartridges is their ability to ignore surface noise. If I could afford it I would buy a AT-ART 9 tomorrow.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 17, 2022, 08:01:56 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 17, 2022, 07:19:51 AM
(http://www.jkwynn.co.uk/Pics/AT33_3.JPG)

Ordered one like this, an Audio-Technica AT33PTG/II (https://www.audio-technica.com/en-gb/at33ptg-ii) to replace my aging AT-OC10. Yes, I stick to the same manufacturer.
Hope that you enjoy your new cartridge!

Quote from: Irons on February 17, 2022, 07:41:04 AM
The most pertinent question PD is yellow or red dot! I am joking. ;)

Loricraft Audio used squash balls in their plinth for Garrard 301, 401 and their own 501 turntables. The pic below is self explanatory. Four squash balls one in each corner isolate the top plate and platter from the powerful Garrard motor. I used this arrangement for some time before moving over to a high-mass layered plinth. Both concepts have the same goal to isolate a motor that could drive a lawnmower (only a slight exaggeration) from a highly delicate modern cartridge. Completely opposed methods to solve the same problem. Suspension/mass.     
The manufacturer actually used them when they built them?!  :o  I had thought that this was a tweak which later owners came up with.  Interesting!  Did you have to replace them every few years?

So, do you have one of those pretty heavily laminated ones that shine like a grand piano?  :)

I just have the original plinth that came with my Rega RP6.
Quote from: Irons on February 17, 2022, 07:53:48 AM
What I like most of AT cartridges is their ability to ignore surface noise. If I could afford it I would buy a AT-ART 9 tomorrow.
Do you think that it would do better than your Ortofon 2M black?

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 18, 2022, 01:37:33 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 17, 2022, 08:01:56 AM
Hope that you enjoy your new cartridge!
The manufacturer actually used them when they built them?!  :o  I had thought that this was a tweak which later owners came up with.  Interesting!  Did you have to replace them every few years?

So, do you have one of those pretty heavily laminated ones that shine like a grand piano?  :)

I just have the original plinth that came with my Rega RP6.Do you think that it would do better than your Ortofon 2M black?

PD

Yes, PD. Loricraft started out in a workshop in a back garden. The owner recently retired and sold his company to SME. I have not heard of the necessity to change squash balls.
The Rega is not a turntable to be changed in any way.

Obviously I'm not claiming my thoughts on cartridges are particularly insightful, it is just that, thoughts. Anyway, there are so many variables not least matching cartridge to tonearm. What sounds good in my tonearm will sound poor in another and vice versa. I am presently using a refurbished Ortofon Kontrapunkt C but as can be seen below I have others at my disposal in varying states of wear.

The AT-OC9/III and 2M Black could not be more different. Around the same price point the AT is a low priced moving coil and the 2M a high price moving magnet. The presentation is completely opposed with the 2M's amazing ability to extract detail. It's Achilles heel - every cartridge has one - fussy and demanding set up. My only criticism of what is an outstanding cartridge is being unforgiving of surface noise.

The AT-OC9III is entry level to the (expensive) world of moving coil is a nice cartridge to own. Natural, integrated sound that is easy on the ear. Understated but in a good way. As I have mentioned the AT has an uncanny way of producing music out of speakers and leaving surface noise in the groove. Perhaps my setup, but longevity was an issue for me. Some sparkle was lost after a comparatively short time which I put down to wear. Cost restraints of diamond tip?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 18, 2022, 03:46:50 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 18, 2022, 01:37:33 AM

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=83159;image)


Nice collection of carts.  8)

Do you swap them out regularly or on what basis do you rotate them?

Do you have an interchangeable headshell?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 18, 2022, 04:17:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 18, 2022, 01:37:33 AM

The AT-OC9/III and 2M Black could not be more different. Around the same price point the AT is a low priced moving coil and the 2M a high price moving magnet. The presentation is completely opposed with the 2M's amazing ability to extract detail. It's Achilles heel - every cartridge has one - fussy and demanding set up. My only criticism of what is an outstanding cartridge is being unforgiving of surface noise.

The AT-OC9III is entry level to the (expensive) world of moving coil is a nice cartridge to own. Natural, integrated sound that is easy on the ear. Understated but in a good way. As I have mentioned the AT has an uncanny way of producing music out of speakers and leaving surface noise in the groove. Perhaps my setup, but longevity was an issue for me. Some sparkle was lost after a comparatively short time which I put down to wear. Cost restraints of diamond tip?
I cheated and had my audio guy set it up.  But, yes, that would help to explain my frustration at times re surface noise;  if my LP is pristine, it sounds fabulous!

And is that per chance a Sumiko cartridge or a different brand?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 18, 2022, 07:49:58 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 18, 2022, 03:46:50 AM
Nice collection of carts.  8)

Do you swap them out regularly or on what basis do you rotate them?

Do you have an interchangeable headshell?

No, no and no Fergus. I have reached the stage in my life I can't be bothered.

Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 18, 2022, 04:17:44 AM
I cheated and had my audio guy set it up.  But, yes, that would help to explain my frustration at times re surface noise;  if my LP is pristine, it sounds fabulous!

And is that per chance a Sumiko cartridge or a different brand?

PD

Nail squarely on head, PD. With a pristine pressing the Black sounds fabulous. The most detailed and I love detail from a recording I have heard.

The cartridge in the small wooden box is a Koetsu Rosewood.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 18, 2022, 09:14:55 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 18, 2022, 07:49:58 AM
No, no and no Fergus. I have reached the stage in my life I can't be bothered.

Nail squarely on head, PD. With a pristine pressing the Black sounds fabulous. The most detailed and I love detail from a recording I have heard.

The cartridge in the small wooden box is a Koetsu Rosewood.
Oooh!  And I just googled them...ouch!  Almost $4,000.   ???  Why don't you use it anymore?  I bet that it's lovely.  I see that you have two mono cartridges (can't read what is on the red box)--which I know that you aren't currently using that setup.  What do you keep the other (stereo) ones for Irons?  Just curious.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 20, 2022, 04:55:24 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 18, 2022, 07:49:58 AM
No, no and no Fergus. I have reached the stage in my life I can't be bothered.


I am somewhat relieved by that answer because I too reached that zone some time ago. It surely is all about the music at the end of the day.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 20, 2022, 06:57:25 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 18, 2022, 09:14:55 AM
Oooh!  And I just googled them...ouch!  Almost $4,000.   ???  Why don't you use it anymore?  I bet that it's lovely.  I see that you have two mono cartridges (can't read what is on the red box)--which I know that you aren't currently using that setup.  What do you keep the other (stereo) ones for Irons?  Just curious.

PD

Mine is not a "Signature" PD. Perhaps you were looking at that. Koetsu are a thing of beauty, hand crafted from diverse materials with prices off the scale.  The sound is very particular to the brand; Indistinct bass and rolled of treble but a mid-range to die for, the best on the planet. The Koetsu is not an all-rounder. What it does well is special though, a mid-range like a warm blanket to curl up in. :D
The cartridge in the red box is a Nagaoka MP-200 which has a reputation of being a fantastic value for money option. This intrigued me and I purchased one. An excellent cartridge.
Fergus alluded to my problem. My main tonearm is a fixed headshell, swapping a cartridge is so challenging if I achieve this feat without wiping it out I punch the air! I own a second tonearm with a detachable headshell but unfortunately only suitable for moving magnet cartridges. It cannot be overstressed the importance of matching cartridge with tonearm.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 20, 2022, 11:04:58 AM
Koetsus are just beautiful. May I ask why the tone arm with detatchable headshell is suitable only for MMs?

I've made an order for a Humminguru record cleaner. Out of Hong Kong they are all the rage in Norway. https://humminguru.com/
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 20, 2022, 11:50:55 PM
Not the arm but my arm, which is a SME 3009 Improved. A beautiful engineered low mass tonearm designed as the perfect partner for the high compliance Shure V15. Moving coil cartridges with much lower compliance then moving magnet and mated with a 3009 it is a case of the tail wagging the dog. It is said you can use a 3009 for MC by adding mass to the headshell. I have tried this but it didn't work.

Neat record cleaner. Be sure to report back on your findings.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 21, 2022, 03:39:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 20, 2022, 06:57:25 AM


Mine is not a "Signature" PD. Perhaps you were looking at that. Koetsu are a thing of beauty, hand crafted from diverse materials with prices off the scale.  The sound is very particular to the brand; Indistinct bass and rolled of treble but a mid-range to die for, the best on the planet. The Koetsu is not an all-rounder. What it does well is special though, a mid-range like a warm blanket to curl up in. :D
The cartridge in the red box is a Nagaoka MP-200 which has a reputation of being a fantastic value for money option. This intrigued me and I purchased one. An excellent cartridge.
Fergus alluded to my problem. My main tonearm is a fixed headshell, swapping a cartridge is so challenging if I achieve this feat without wiping it out I punch the air! I own a second tonearm with a detachable headshell but unfortunately only suitable for moving magnet cartridges. It cannot be overstressed the importance of matching cartridge with tonearm.
Thank you for your description of the Koetsu Irons.  And, believe it or not (looking at their website) the price for the Koetsu Rosewood is $3,995; the Rosewood Signature is $5,495 and the Rosewood Signature Platinum is $8,495.   Perhaps, if you don't want to keep it, you could sell it? 

Quote from: Valentino on February 20, 2022, 11:04:58 AM
Koetsus are just beautiful. May I ask why the tone arm with detatchable headshell is suitable only for MMs?

I've made an order for a Humminguru record cleaner. Out of Hong Kong they are all the rage in Norway. https://humminguru.com/
Yes, they are gorgeous!

And neat RCM!  Looking forward to hearing how you like it particularly as the ultrasonic cleaners that I've read about are REALLY expensive!  I imagine that they would suggest using distilled water in it?  Curious also as to how it deals with things like fingerprints (in which oils have become imbedded in the records)...if they suggest any other treatment or pre-treatments before using their machine.

By the way, I received a lovely gift from a friend:  a copy of Emmy Lou Harris' album "Red Dirt Girl" [brand new] on a limited-edition red vinyl and am quite curious as to how it sounds overall and compared to my CD of it.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 21, 2022, 04:31:30 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 21, 2022, 03:39:15 AM

By the way, I received a lovely gift from a friend:  a copy of Emmy Lou Harris' album "Red Dirt Girl" [brand new] on a limited-edition red vinyl and am quite curious as to how it sounds overall and compared to my CD of it.  :)

PD

Much better, of course.  :P  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 21, 2022, 01:22:31 PM
Beethoven: 6th Symphony.

(https://i.imgur.com/IqSU9vl.jpg)

A rightly famous recording of "Pastoral" from 1960. ASD 433, my copy is a second label (early large dog) the first (white and gold) are very collectable. The soundstage is wide and deep but what makes this recording special is the Berlin strings which manage to be at the same time soft yet powerful without a hint of glare. What an orchestra!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 21, 2022, 02:10:22 PM
Quote from: Irons on February 21, 2022, 01:22:31 PM
Beethoven: 6th Symphony.

(https://i.imgur.com/IqSU9vl.jpg)

A rightly famous recording of "Pastoral" from 1960. ASD 433, my copy is a second label (early large dog) the first (white and gold) are very collectable. The soundstage is wide and deep but what makes this recording special is the Berlin strings which manage to be at the same time soft yet powerful without a hint of glare. What an orchestra!

Very nice indeed!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 21, 2022, 11:11:53 PM
The term Audio-Technica uses for the AT-OC9/III stylus, Line Contact, is that synonym to elliptical?
I see that the generation X of the AT-OC9 series do not use the term Line Contact, and the letters also mean something:

AT-OC9XEB: Elliptical stylus, Bonded round shank (on Aluminium cantilever)
AT-OC9XEN: Elliptical stylus, Nude square shank (on Aluminium cantilever)
AT-OC9XML: Micro Line contact stylus, nude square shank (on Boron cantilever)
AT-OC9XSH: SHibata stylus, nude square shank (on Boron cantilever)
AT-OC9XSL: Special Line contact stylus, nude square shank (on Boron cantilever)

My incoming AT33PTG/II and the to be put out to pasture (more like in the drawer, actually) AT-OC10 are both Microline on Boron.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 21, 2022, 11:32:43 PM
Quote from: aligreto on February 21, 2022, 02:10:22 PM
Very nice indeed!

A delight for sure.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 21, 2022, 11:44:20 PM
Quote from: Valentino on February 21, 2022, 11:11:53 PM
The term Audio-Technica uses for the AT-OC9/III stylus, Line Contact, is that synonym to elliptical?
I see that the generation X of the AT-OC9 series do not use the term Line Contact, and the letters also mean something:

AT-OC9XEB: Elliptical stylus, Bonded round shank (on Aluminium cantilever)
AT-OC9XEN: Elliptical stylus, Nude square shank (on Aluminium cantilever)
AT-OC9XML: Micro Line contact stylus, nude square shank (on Boron cantilever)
AT-OC9XSH: SHibata stylus, nude square shank (on Boron cantilever)
AT-OC9XSL: Special Line contact stylus, nude square shank (on Boron cantilever)

My incoming AT33PTG/II and the to be put out to pasture (more like in the drawer, actually) AT-OC10 are both Microline on Boron.

I would think not.

Came across a YT upload this morning which may be of interest. A fleeting but positive reference to AT cartridges.

https://youtu.be/5TgORzbwb8o
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 22, 2022, 04:46:26 AM
Seems nice that Nagaoka JT 80BK in the video. Less difficult to set up and also less surfacenoisy than the 2M Blackhe says. But: It is an MM. I tend to shut off then. Old habit. Don't mind me.

Another thing: Being a get more for less kind of guy I am intrigued by the measurements over at ASR of the Cambridge Aura Duo MC/MM RIAA amp:
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-cambridge-audio-duo-phono-preamp.6901/
Those figures at that price seems like a no brainer to me, at least if your MC is an Audio-Technica. They should have dropped the headphone amp for selectable loading of the inputs in my opinion.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 22, 2022, 09:29:10 AM
By the way folks, I tried using my Last stylus cleaner for the first time yesterday (despite having bought a bottle of it ages ago) and i think that it did actually help!  No "putting it under the microscope here", but had listened to a couple of albums (which I had cleaned for a friend) with the second one sounding much better (used the Last in between records).  The first one to me (an old Jethro Tull album--"This Was") sounded rather opaque and somewhat removed in terms of presence; at the time, I just attributed it to the way that it was recorded and released, but I put on one of the track today and I could swear that it sounded a fair bit better!

Has anyone else here had experiences like this?  Note:  I do diligently use my little black brush to manually remove "stuff".

The other album was the '67 one from Paul Revere and The Raiders--cool album from what I heard of it (didn't pay close attention to the lyrics at the time), but enjoyable and I think quite decently recorded.  Alas, his copy has a fair bit of wear on it; it would be nice to find a good copy of it.  It was an old Columbia one.

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 22, 2022, 11:39:52 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 22, 2022, 09:29:10 AM
By the way folks, I tried using my Last stylus cleaner for the first time yesterday (despite having bought a bottle of it ages ago) and i think that it did actually help!  No "putting it under the microscope here", but had listened to a couple of albums (which I had cleaned for a friend) with the second one sounding much better (used the Last in between records).  The first one to me (an old Jethro Tull album--"This Was") sounded rather opaque and somewhat removed in terms of presence; at the time, I just attributed it to the way that it was recorded and released, but I put on one of the track today and I could swear that it sounded a fair bit better!

Has anyone else here had experiences like this?  Note:  I do diligently use my little black brush to manually remove "stuff".

The other album was the '67 one from Paul Revere and The Raiders--cool album from what I heard of it (didn't pay close attention to the lyrics at the time), but enjoyable and I think quite decently recorded.  Alas, his copy has a fair bit of wear on it; it would be nice to find a good copy of it.  It was an old Columbia one.

PD

I honestly do not clean my stylus as often as I know I should.  :-[
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 22, 2022, 11:48:42 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 22, 2022, 11:39:52 AM
I honestly do not clean my stylus as often as I know I should.  :-[
Initially, I think I was doing it every complete LP (or maybe so??).  I felt guilty when Irons mentioned about doing it every side.  For what it's worth, I leave the LP running, but turn down the sound [I had been turning off the whole system first, but then found out that I shouldn't be doing that (I have valve equipment)].  I'm thinking of using the Last cleaning liquid maybe once a week (depending upon how often I'm listening to records?  And using the "little black brush" at the end of every side--or maybe after each album if they seem to be really clean.

How often are you cleaning yours Fergus?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 22, 2022, 01:22:09 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 22, 2022, 11:48:42 AM

How often are you cleaning yours Fergus?

PD

About once every 7-10 days, but that is on washed, clean records.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 22, 2022, 10:13:16 PM
Throwing in this pic from the aftermath of a tune-up session last night. Click to enlarge.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/61ce6073-8b54-4416-b7a9-8ee7601e73c4-jpeg.794019/)

I'd forgotten amongst other things that I own a Shure SFG-2 stylus pressure gauge, thought mine was one of those plastic Ortofon jobs, and that I'd have to go out and buy something proper. Good!
The Well Tempered Tone Arm is a joy to work with. I'd forgotten that too. The RME Digicheck software is super for visualizing the work. I had some 50 Hz. It turned out the grounding wire had fallen off! There is also some 25 Hz which I think comes from our central heating system. Doesn't seem to be the old Sota Sapphire turntable itself.

Btw the Munchlinger Bach concertos record didn't turn into something by the Freiburgers. Still quite measured and rather sedate for my preferences.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 22, 2022, 11:27:24 PM
^ Nice looking TT. I like the wooden plinth.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 22, 2022, 11:52:30 PM
Thanks. The nice oak frame is a fine contrast to the very industrial top side of the thing. It's a Sota Sapphire from the 1980s. Has been upgraded along the way, with new arm board, improved DC power supply, improved subplatter springs etc, and of course this absolute classic of a tone arm. The arm tower was too tall for the original dust cover so this one is made to measure. Newer Sotas also have plinth top plates and electronic covers in wood:

(https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-rdecee92oy/images/stencil/1280x1280/products/22672/1888335/9sottsap-large__14019.1620308666.jpg?c=2)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 22, 2022, 11:59:56 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 22, 2022, 09:29:10 AM
By the way folks, I tried using my Last stylus cleaner for the first time yesterday (despite having bought a bottle of it ages ago) and i think that it did actually help!  No "putting it under the microscope here", but had listened to a couple of albums (which I had cleaned for a friend) with the second one sounding much better (used the Last in between records).  The first one to me (an old Jethro Tull album--"This Was") sounded rather opaque and somewhat removed in terms of presence; at the time, I just attributed it to the way that it was recorded and released, but I put on one of the track today and I could swear that it sounded a fair bit better!

Has anyone else here had experiences like this?  Note:  I do diligently use my little black brush to manually remove "stuff".

The other album was the '67 one from Paul Revere and The Raiders--cool album from what I heard of it (didn't pay close attention to the lyrics at the time), but enjoyable and I think quite decently recorded.  Alas, his copy has a fair bit of wear on it; it would be nice to find a good copy of it.  It was an old Columbia one.

PD

I received a telling-off from the chap at "The Expert Stylus Company" when the tip of my Miyajima cartridge fell off! Not Last, but I overdid the application of a liquid stylus cleaner which over time dissolved the adhesive connecting stylus tip to shank. I now do not use any liquids at all as advised by Expert Sttylus Co, only dry clean with Bergeon. Last is well known and tested but I would proceed with caution and not go OTT with application.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 23, 2022, 12:34:13 AM
From The Absolute Sound, February 2011 issue, on the 30th anniversary of the SOTA Sapphire turntable:

QUOTE

Absolute ANALOG
SOTA Sapphire Series V Turntable
A Classic Revisited
Paul.seydor

The SOTA Sapphire turntable, which will be thirty next year, occupies an important place in audio history. Designed by the estimable David Fletcher (now retired from audio but the auteur of The Arm and the much missed Talisman pickups) and introduced in 1981, it put America on the map again as a manufacturer of state-of-the-art turntables (the acronym gave the company its name). The Sapphire was the first of just two turntables, the other being the Oracle, to challenge the near-decade-long hegemony of the Scottish Linn Sondek LP12 as the putative “best in the world.” No matter that such global pronouncements are unprovable and serve mostly to massage someone or other’s ego, thus began the so called “turntable wars” of the early eighties, the big three combatants the LP12, Oracle Delphi, and SOTA Sapphire. 1 For all the hectoring and acrimony that ensued—more among dealers, consumers, and audio reviewers, it’s worth pointing out, than among the designers themselves, who were friendly and oftener than not amused by the sturm und drang—all three shared two design principles that originated with Edgar Villchur’s Acoustic Research AR XA turntable from the late fifties: belt drive and tuned suspensions as a means of isolating the pickup/stylus interface from acoustic feedback and other environmental disturbances.

Each product had its champions (or defenders) and each had legitimate virtues and shortcomings. Linn, a pioneer in asserting that turntables do in fact affect the sound beyond such obvious matters as rumble and speed accuracy, boasted outstanding speed constancy and resolution, the precision machining of its bearing assembly without equal at the time (and even today bested by only a very few much more expensive competitors). But it also had a suspension that was difficult to set up, easily disturbed, and typically in need of readjustment over time, and a sound that, whatever its “tunefulness,” was moderately colored, especially in the mid and upper bass (in my opinion, in the upper midrange and highs too). The Oracle had an extremely sophisticated suspension system—superior to the LP12’s, though even more notoriously difficult to set up—and exhibited fewer colorations and a beautifully transparent and airy presentation. The Sapphire brought a considerable increase in tonal neutrality, deep bass, and an altogether more balanced presentation; and despite some early speed-regulation teething-problems from the inconsistent Papst DC motors, the design reigned supreme in the areas of suspension tuning, long-term stability, ease of setup, and sheer effectiveness in isolating the turntable from its environment.

After introducing the Sapphire — named for the sapphire thrust-plate of the inverted bearing used in most SOTA turntables — Fletcher and his associate Rodney Herman went on to develop the first vacuum-hold-down platter that actually worked and didn’t damage records. With the record held in intimate contact with a platter that was also heavy and well damped, vinyl resonances were reduced by an order of magnitude and warps were rendered effectively nonexistent. Together these brought huge gains in significantly quieter backgrounds (i.e., suppression of the grunge and surface noises typical of vinyl playback) and much improved tracking. Thus was born the Star, and eventually the Cosmos, which remains SOTA’s flagship suspended turntable. But the start of it all was the Sapphire, which despite two changes of company ownership retains the distinction, I believe, of being the turntable with the greatest product longevity without a change in model designation or fundamental design, and with complete backward compatibility. 2 The current owners, since 1997, are Kirk and Donna Bodinet, who retain Fletcher as a consultant, thus further ensuring product continuity and design expertise.

/QUOTE
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 23, 2022, 03:18:30 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 22, 2022, 10:13:16 PM
Throwing in this pic from the aftermath of a tune-up session last night. Click to enlarge.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/61ce6073-8b54-4416-b7a9-8ee7601e73c4-jpeg.794019/)

I'd forgotten amongst other things that I own a Shure SFG-2 stylus pressure gauge, thought mine was one of those plastic Ortofon jobs, and that I'd have to go out and buy something proper. Good!
The Well Tempered Tone Arm is a joy to work with. I'd forgotten that too. The RME Digicheck software is super for visualizing the work. I had some 50 Hz. It turned out the grounding wire had fallen off! There is also some 25 Hz which I think comes from our central heating system. Doesn't seem to be the old Sota Sapphire turntable itself.

Btw the Munchlinger Bach concertos record didn't turn into something by the Freiburgers. Still quite measured and rather sedate for my preferences.
What do you use the RME Digicheck software for?  Is it something that you often use or just when you think that something is off?

Nice-looking turntable!  :)

Quote from: Irons on February 22, 2022, 11:59:56 PM
I received a telling-off from the chap at "The Expert Stylus Company" when the tip of my Miyajima cartridge fell off! Not Last, but I overdid the application of a liquid stylus cleaner which over time dissolved the adhesive connecting stylus tip to shank. I now do not use any liquids at all as advised by Expert Sttylus Co, only dry clean with Bergeon. Last is well known and tested but I would proceed with caution and not go OTT with application.
Thank you for the warning Irons!  I did some double-checking re reviews before using it as I didn't/don't want to dissolve any adhesives! [I was wondering how the stylus was connected...  :-[ ::) ]  Do you recall them saying anything about Last?

By the way, do folks here have any suggestions as to the best/good way to remove old fingerprints from LPs?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 23, 2022, 03:38:10 AM
RME Digicheck is good for a lot of things digital audio (my gear is DSP controlled, AD conversion after RIAA). For vinyl I check channel phase and balance, and noise spectrum. For example I didn't hear hum yesterday, but I saw it, could find the source for it and I could see that I got rid of it. My turntable picks up this almost infra noise (that 25 Hz peak on the Digicheck display is not Bach). I do not know how it gets transmitted into the system, but it's worthy of investigation.

Thanks for the kind words on the TT. I like the framing of pure industry with wooden craftmanship. For aestetics I probably should have used a nude pickup like a Sumiko BPS or a Lyra, but I like Audio-Technica and the incoming AT33 looks more of a brute than the AT-OC9 series. Getting there!

Cleaning? Kitchen sink. Lukewarm water. Dishwashing soap. Kitchen sponge. Rinse with tap water. Let dry vertically. Or use a Hummingbird...

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 27, 2022, 12:57:07 AM
A historical label from EMI France Références are well worth collecting. I tend to avoid "Enregistrement d'origine 78 tours" instead concentrating on the post 1950's "d'origine mophonique" of which the transfers are excellent. Many of the originals are so rare as to be impossible to find in anything approaching a listenable state. The records are worth buying for the essay by André Tubeuf on the back cover of each issue alone. Prose not notes, a sample: The point of the pick-up has begun to scan the 'Appassionata' which sounds vaguely grumbling, when at the fourteenth beat something like a slap administered by sound has hit us in the face. Something?
No, someone - Beethoven. We thought we were listening to him from our armchair, in our home. And now we were in his home and he was growling like a caged animal ....


Yves Nat: André Charlin les Discophiles Francais recording from 1955.
Haskil/Anda: Walter Legge, Abbey Road from 1956.

(https://i.imgur.com/K7wbHMh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/cNTpIv0.jpg)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 27, 2022, 01:49:03 AM
Wonderful prose indeed. Shall keep my head up for those.

I haven't  really dived into it, but this find looks like a first issue?

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/c711255d-0458-460b-a985-c1773aebc981-jpeg.795481/)

Actually this is the first music my AT33PTG/II has played. Got it up and running last night, tracks +16 dB on the HFN test record (but not the +18 dB) at 2,0 g. Channel balance inside 0,2 dB. Audio-Technica do things properly.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 28, 2022, 05:08:04 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 23, 2022, 03:38:10 AM
RME Digicheck is good for a lot of things digital audio (my gear is DSP controlled, AD conversion after RIAA). For vinyl I check channel phase and balance, and noise spectrum. For example I didn't hear hum yesterday, but I saw it, could find the source for it and I could see that I got rid of it. My turntable picks up this almost infra noise (that 25 Hz peak on the Digicheck display is not Bach). I do not know how it gets transmitted into the system, but it's worthy of investigation.

Thanks for the kind words on the TT. I like the framing of pure industry with wooden craftmanship. For aestetics I probably should have used a nude pickup like a Sumiko BPS or a Lyra, but I like Audio-Technica and the incoming AT33 looks more of a brute than the AT-OC9 series. Getting there!

Cleaning? Kitchen sink. Lukewarm water. Dishwashing soap. Kitchen sponge. Rinse with tap water. Let dry vertically. Or use a Hummingbird...
I gave in recently and filled a small (think travel-size) bottle mostly with distilled water and two small drops of liquid dish soap (one drop didn't seem to work well) and applied some to an LP on my Okki Nokki and let it sit on there for a few minutes (after using one of my Mofi brushes to spread it around.  After sitting for a bit, used the brush again, vacuumed it off and then applied their pure rinse water; it seemed to help.

By the way, how on earth did you manage to get a hummingbird to help you?!  ???

Quote from: Irons on February 27, 2022, 12:57:07 AM
A historical label from EMI France Références are well worth collecting. I tend to avoid "Enregistrement d'origine 78 tours" instead concentrating on the post 1950's "d'origine mophonique" of which the transfers are excellent. Many of the originals are so rare as to be impossible to find in anything approaching a listenable state. The records are worth buying for the essay by André Tubeuf on the back cover of each issue alone. Prose not notes, a sample: The point of the pick-up has begun to scan the 'Appassionata' which sounds vaguely grumbling, when at the fourteenth beat something like a slap administered by sound has hit us in the face. Something?
No, someone - Beethoven. We thought we were listening to him from our armchair, in our home. And now we were in his home and he was growling like a caged animal ....


Yves Nat: André Charlin les Discophiles Francais recording from 1955.
Haskil/Anda: Walter Legge, Abbey Road from 1956.

(https://i.imgur.com/K7wbHMh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/cNTpIv0.jpg)


Thanks for the info and sample prose Irons!  8)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 28, 2022, 05:51:20 AM
You have to train the hummingbird!
Actually it was a slip. Hummingguru is the thing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 28, 2022, 06:12:12 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 28, 2022, 05:51:20 AM
You have to train the hummingbird!
Actually it was a slip. Hummingguru is the thing.
;D

By the way, if you're using the sink, do you use anything to protect your labels?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 28, 2022, 07:46:26 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 27, 2022, 01:49:03 AM
Wonderful prose indeed. Shall keep my head up for those.

I haven't  really dived into it, but this find looks like a first issue?

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/c711255d-0458-460b-a985-c1773aebc981-jpeg.795481/)

Actually this is the first music my AT33PTG/II has played. Got it up and running last night, tracks +16 dB on the HFN test record (but not the +18 dB) at 2,0 g. Channel balance inside 0,2 dB. Audio-Technica do things properly.

Nothing beats sitting back and listening to a newly installed cartridge. The biggest game-changer in a vinyl based system. Enjoy!

Edit: I am unable to make out the date on your Decca recording?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 28, 2022, 08:09:03 AM
I am! Rather nice sounding straight out of the box, and easy to set up. Found a Well Tempered Stevenson protractor somewhere and setup was a breeze except for the somewhat lame counterweight arrangement. It's a relatively light cartridge, an I ended up using a single Aluminium counterweight appx halfway back on the stub.

It's the 1961 release. The engraving on the runouts match:
https://www.discogs.com/release/11598090-Richard-Strauss-Rysanek-Berry-Peerce-Peters-Jurinac-Vienna-Philharmonic-Orchestra-Leinsdorf-Ariadne-

I don't dip the label in when using the sink.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 28, 2022, 08:27:41 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 28, 2022, 05:08:04 AM

Thanks for the info and sample prose Irons!  8)

PD

Very much only a sample, PD. Think you may like this -

Like Fidelo, this great little wisp of a woman taught many music-making gentlemen a powerful and indelebile lesson: she outlawed languor and coquetry. She gave her pupils "pretty fingers" but did so for the sake of greater respect for, and more accurate legibility, of the music they were playing. Not only was her whole life a manifesto of eternal youth. Her career was also a proclamation of clarity, loyalty and health. To some little extent, it is due to her that Fauré is not regarded as hazy, Ravel as a maniac and French music as a pretty garden that is a little past it. She is one of the few performers of whom it can be said that she left a lasting achievement.

André Tubeuf.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 28, 2022, 08:48:05 AM
Excellent!

Throwing in a couple of shots of the ugliest tone arm in the world, The Well Tempered Classic V (playing a dud of an LP). Click to enlarge:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/c5ad007b-0a9b-4fa2-b2ba-0b33e9cb4096-jpeg.795991/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/6cc4aa65-fb1b-4416-8f41-60ec92fc4bd8-jpeg.795992/)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 28, 2022, 09:28:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 28, 2022, 08:27:41 AM
Very much only a sample, PD. Think you may like this -

Like Fidelo, this great little wisp of a woman taught many music-making gentlemen a powerful and indelebile lesson: she outlawed languor and coquetry. She gave her pupils "pretty fingers" but did so for the sake of greater respect for, and more accurate legibility, of the music they were playing. Not only was her whole life a manifesto of eternal youth. Her career was also a proclamation of clarity, loyalty and health. To some little extent, it is due to her that Fauré is not regarded as hazy, Ravel as a maniac and French music as a pretty garden that is a little past it. She is one of the few performers of whom it can be said that she left a lasting achievement.

André Tubeuf.
;D

Quote from: Valentino on February 28, 2022, 08:09:03 AM
I am! Rather nice sounding straight out of the box, and easy to set up. Found a Well Tempered Stevenson protractor somewhere and setup was a breeze except for the somewhat lame counterweight arrangement. It's a relatively light cartridge, an I ended up using a single Aluminium counterweight appx halfway back on the stub.

It's the 1961 release. The engraving on the runouts match:
https://www.discogs.com/release/11598090-Richard-Strauss-Rysanek-Berry-Peerce-Peters-Jurinac-Vienna-Philharmonic-Orchestra-Leinsdorf-Ariadne-

I don't dip the label in when using the sink.


Glad that you are enjoying your new cartridge!  I also suspected that you didn't dunk the label, but still wondering how you manage to keep it from getting wet whilst rotating your LP whilst cleaning it?  :-\

Cleaned one of my opera sets from Wagner's The Ring; boy, did that ever take a while!  Three more operas to go.  ::)  Wish that I had the nicer Decca pressings of the famous Solti set, but rather, I have the Time Life ones--they were free though!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 28, 2022, 01:52:17 PM
Quote from: Valentino on February 27, 2022, 01:49:03 AM


I haven't  really dived into it, but this find looks like a first issue?

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/c711255d-0458-460b-a985-c1773aebc981-jpeg.795481/)



A RCA recording issued in UK under licence by Decca. Dependent on UK release I think your set is a late pressing as if early 1960's it would be wide band (see below).
Going against perceived wisdom I prefer narrow band for listening. Collectors of rare records prefer wide band.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 28, 2022, 01:59:40 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 28, 2022, 09:28:36 AM
;D
Glad that you are enjoying your new cartridge!  I also suspected that you didn't dunk the label, but still wondering how you manage to keep it from getting wet whilst rotating your LP whilst cleaning it?  :-\

Cleaned one of my opera sets from Wagner's The Ring; boy, did that ever take a while!  Three more operas to go.  ::)  Wish that I had the nicer Decca pressings of the famous Solti set, but rather, I have the Time Life ones--they were free though!

PD

The Solti Ring set doubles as a coffee table! ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 28, 2022, 09:52:26 PM
Aha! Are there web resources on these different Decca labels, Irons?
I think I have a wide band somewhere...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 01, 2022, 12:05:13 AM
Yes, Valentino. I have a PDF file of every recording made by Decca engineers of all labels including RCA, Lyrita etc. It includes all relevant information including date, venue, producer, engineer and multiple issues. The only downside is the omission of any search facility and there are one hell of a lot of entries.
You can download the file from here if you are interested. Great Britain ffss 1954-81 from the list is the one to select.

https://charm.rhul.ac.uk/discography/decca.html
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 01, 2022, 03:42:14 AM
Downloaded. Did a string search on "Leinsdorf" in Adobe Reader and found it: (Apr72) 2BB112-14, originally a RCA 1960 release as you said. Thanks again.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 01, 2022, 07:13:35 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 28, 2022, 01:59:40 PM
The Solti Ring set doubles as a coffee table! ;D
:laugh: Or at least as a low end table?  ;)

And that CHARM site is fun to poke around in!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 01, 2022, 08:00:55 AM
On the subject of Decca "wide band" https://youtu.be/s8OWDtdFo2o

As always of great interest. I do not agree with everything, for instance I find Abbado's "Sinfonietta" insipid, although he recorded some great recordings for Decca. Two of my favourites are the Mendelssohn "Scottish" Symphony and a sonically outstanding Prokofiev "Romeo and Juliet".
To make generalisations as he did saying Decca wide band are superior to narrow band due to valve/tube gear in the recording chain is in my opinion a sweeping statement. Firstly, as record companies of the period mostly did not follow a logical pattern, I doubt all wide band are valve and narrow band transistor. Secondly, and of greater importance, Decca introduced around the time of narrow band superior mother cutting lathes which had far more effect but not as sexy as the valve/transistor debate on sound quality.

I do find his videos most enjoyable and interesting though.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 06, 2022, 07:49:26 AM
A pity that I do not have the patience for videos like that. I must read and look at pictures of the artwork!

Sooo, somewhat hot on the trigger I've purchased a slightly used Lindemann Limetree Phono II (https://lindemann-audio.de/products/limetree-series/phono/?lang=en) to replace my Thorens MM 008 ADC.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 07, 2022, 11:36:36 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/YjR2u6U.jpg)

A set that is enjoying some popularity over on the main threads. I have five LP issues on my shelves and picked one at random, The Schoolmaster. A 1976 release the analogue sound is typical Philips of the day, clear and warm but not exceptional. Philips forte of the period was chamber music with solo piano being outstanding.
I like the quirky cover art and of course the canvas is much larger for LP. I have noticed for the first time hidden away in the smallest possible print that the cover illustration is by Bab Siljée. Typically no information of sound engineer or venue.     
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 08, 2022, 01:10:46 AM
Nice! Where would ASMF usually record at the time?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 08, 2022, 02:10:21 AM
Quote from: Valentino on March 06, 2022, 07:49:26 AM
A pity that I do not have the patience for videos like that. I must read and look at pictures of the artwork!

Sooo, somewhat hot on the trigger I've purchased a slightly used Lindemann Limetree Phono II (https://lindemann-audio.de/products/limetree-series/phono/?lang=en) to replace my Thorens MM 008 ADC.
Have you received your new phono stage yet?  If so, how do you like it?  I'm not at all familiar with that company.

PD
Quote from: Irons on March 07, 2022, 11:36:36 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/YjR2u6U.jpg)

A set that is enjoying some popularity over on the main threads. I have five LP issues on my shelves and picked one at random, The Schoolmaster. A 1976 release the analogue sound is typical Philips of the day, clear and warm but not exceptional. Philips forte of the period was chamber music with solo piano being outstanding.
I like the quirky cover art and of course the canvas is much larger for LP. I have noticed for the first time hidden away in the smallest possible print that the cover illustration is by Bab Siljée. Typically no information of sound engineer or venue.     
Glad that you are enjoying it.  Fun cover art too.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 08, 2022, 07:13:06 AM
Still in the mail. Lindemann is a Bavarian producer of high end home audio equipment. The Limetree series is unassuming very small (quarter width) boxes with very good and modern solutions on circuitry.  The original Phono and the Phono II have both received stellar reviews.

Am BTW also in dialogue with SOTA about an upgraded sub chassis and new suspension springs.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 08, 2022, 07:35:47 AM
Quote from: Valentino on March 08, 2022, 01:10:46 AM
Nice! Where would ASMF usually record at the time?

Thanks to a review in Gramophone the Marriner Philips set were recorded at Walthamstow Assembly Halls. I remember the venue as a youngster being brought up a short distance away at Chingford. About the same time Marriner and his band recorded for Argo many recordings at St John's, Smith Square. The sonic difference between the two venues/engineers is astonishing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 08, 2022, 08:45:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 08, 2022, 07:35:47 AM
Thanks to a review in Gramophone the Marriner Philips set were recorded at Walthamstow Assembly Halls. I remember the venue as a youngster being brought up a short distance away at Chingford. About the same time Marriner and his band recorded for Argo many recordings at St John's, Smith Square. The sonic difference between the two venues/engineers is astonishing.
What do you hear differently re the sonics between the two places Irons?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 09, 2022, 12:06:14 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 08, 2022, 08:45:29 AM
What do you hear differently re the sonics between the two places Irons?

PD

(https://i.imgur.com/sn054oF.jpg)

As you can see PD St. John's is a venue with a high ceiling and hard surfaces which makes for  reverberant sound. ASMF made many recordings and the Decca engineers produce excellent sound not because of St. John's but despite of St. John's. Even they cannot mask an undeniable loose and heavy bass sound.

Walthamstow Assembly, a much more modern building is better suited for recording purposes which was recognised by both Mercury and Everest labels who made quite a few recordings there. The Marriner Haydn set for some reason has a slight opaqueness on LP.

Must be loosing it! I had left the TT on and running with the Perspex lid down for a full 24 hours - I did the same thing once with my valve amp. ??? May be my imagination (but I wasn't expecting anything positive from the error) the sound seemed clearer and smoother.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 09, 2022, 03:31:50 AM
Should I recommend this thing or not, that is the question.
https://www.audio-technica.com/en-eu/turntables/accesories/turntable-accessories/at6006r
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 09, 2022, 05:39:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 09, 2022, 12:06:14 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/sn054oF.jpg)

As you can see PD St. John's is a venue with a high ceiling and hard surfaces which makes for  reverberant sound. ASMF made many recordings and the Decca engineers produce excellent sound not because of St. John's but despite of St. John's. Even they cannot mask an undeniable loose and heavy bass sound.

Walthamstow Assembly, a much more modern building is better suited for recording purposes which was recognised by both Mercury and Everest labels who made quite a few recordings there. The Marriner Haydn set for some reason has a slight opaqueness on LP.

Must be loosing it! I had left the TT on and running with the Perspex lid down for a full 24 hours - I did the same thing once with my valve amp. ??? May be my imagination (but I wasn't expecting anything positive from the error) the sound seemed clearer and smoother.
Thank you for the photo and descriptions Irons.  :)  Isn't Walthamstow Assembly near a mutual friend of ours--or perhaps I'm thinking of a different place?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 09, 2022, 06:56:29 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 09, 2022, 05:39:33 AM
Thank you for the photo and descriptions Irons.  :)  Isn't Walthamstow Assembly near a mutual friend of ours--or perhaps I'm thinking of a different place?

PD

No, you are thinking of Watford, PD. An easy mistake to make.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 09, 2022, 08:50:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 09, 2022, 06:56:29 AM
No, you are thinking of Watford, PD. An easy mistake to make.
Ah, I suspected as much!  Isn't there a very good place to enjoy classical music in Watford?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 09, 2022, 11:27:06 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 09, 2022, 08:50:21 AM
Ah, I suspected as much!  Isn't there a very good place to enjoy classical music in Watford?

PD

I don't know but it is often said north of Watford is another country. ;)

Spinning
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 12, 2022, 12:59:38 AM
Spinning.

Poulenc: Concerto for Two Pianos.

A three digit ASD 517 first issued as gold/cream label from 1962. My later copy is dog in postage stamp.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 13, 2022, 12:01:03 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 09, 2022, 11:27:06 PM
I don't know but it is often said north of Watford is another country. ;)

Spinning

Those Mercury Hanson LPs were very special. For some reason Symphony No.4 never made it to commercial CD - something to do with a pitch error or something like that I seem to recall. Coincidentally I've been playing Slatkin's fine recording of the 'Romantic' this morning (EMI CD).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 13, 2022, 12:38:13 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 13, 2022, 12:01:03 AM
Those Mercury Hanson LPs were very special. For some reason Symphony No.4 never made it to commercial CD - something to do with a pitch error or something like that I seem to recall. Coincidentally I've been playing Slatkin's fine recording of the 'Romantic' this morning (EMI CD).

The CD is better value with inclusion of No.1 (Nordic) alongside No.2 (Romantic). I have not and doubt ever will get around to comparing sound between the two formats.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 18, 2022, 05:10:51 AM
The danger of youtube:  How to make a £13,000 turntable.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKFQ8B4cx64

What craftsmanship!   I'm envious!

PD

EDIT:  I should have mentioned earlier when I first posted this is that he shows how he makes his special plinths (the bits about attaching the turntable and arm to the plinth are pretty short (and parts provided by the owner).  It's called the New Yorkshire Workshop.  And, whoopsie!  I added one to many zeros to the price (now corrected).  I should have typed 13,000 pounds!  :-[
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 20, 2022, 01:56:54 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 18, 2022, 05:10:51 AM
The danger of youtube:  How to make a £13,000 turntable.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKFQ8B4cx64

What craftsmanship!   I'm envious!

PD

EDIT:  I should have mentioned earlier when I first posted this is that he shows how he makes his special plinths (the bits about attaching the turntable and arm to the plinth are pretty short (and parts provided by the owner).  It's called the New Yorkshire Workshop.  And, whoopsie!  I added one to many zeros to the price (now corrected).  I should have typed 13,000 pounds!  :-[

WOW :P The time, craftmanship and tools to make something of such beauty makes £13,000 a genuine bargain. If I could afford it I wouldn't hesitate to buy one.
Thanks for posting.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 20, 2022, 04:11:18 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 20, 2022, 01:56:54 AM
WOW :P The time, craftmanship and tools to make something of such beauty makes £13,000 a genuine bargain. If I could afford it I wouldn't hesitate to buy one.
Thanks for posting.
You're welcome!  I hope that the guy making it is charging enough for all of his efforts (plus the materials that he is purchasing).  He mentioned that the tone arm cost about 5,000 pounds and the cartridge the same (Both purchased and supplied by the customer).  That's then only allowing about 3,000 for him--I'm assuming that that includes all of the wood and his other supplies, but I could be wrong.  I know that the cost of wood has gone way up over the past few years, so I hope that he made out alright in the end (looks like it was uploaded in May of 2021).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 22, 2022, 01:27:55 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 18, 2022, 05:10:51 AM
The danger of youtube:  How to make a £13,000 turntable.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKFQ8B4cx64

What craftsmanship!   I'm envious!

PD

EDIT:  I should have mentioned earlier when I first posted this is that he shows how he makes his special plinths (the bits about attaching the turntable and arm to the plinth are pretty short (and parts provided by the owner).  It's called the New Yorkshire Workshop.  And, whoopsie!  I added one to many zeros to the price (now corrected).  I should have typed 13,000 pounds!  :-[

I remember seeing that video before and being awed how the TT turned out in the end. The deep rich colour is quite sumptuous.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 23, 2022, 07:42:13 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 22, 2022, 01:27:55 PM
I remember seeing that video before and being awed how the TT turned out in the end. The deep rich colour is quite sumptuous.
Yes, the color is intense!  The other ones which he quickly showed weren't too shabby looking either.  8)

That guy is really multi-talented too.  He has other videos of how he constructed a metal gate to his Victorian home out of miscellaneous parts to create one that looked like it was hand-forged out of solid wrought iron.  Another one of him making a wooden sink for a bathroom (and installing plumbing, etc. while at it!), etc.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 23, 2022, 08:17:36 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 23, 2022, 07:42:13 AM
Yes, the color is intense!  The other ones which he quickly showed weren't too shabby looking either.  8)

That guy is really multi-talented too.  He has other videos of how he constructed a metal gate to his Victorian home out of miscellaneous parts to create one that looked like it was hand-forged out of solid wrought iron.  Another one of him making a wooden sink for a bathroom (and installing plumbing, etc. while at it!), etc.

PD

That does not surprise me PD. I have always admired talented guys like that who could basically do anything with their hands.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 24, 2022, 12:06:17 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 23, 2022, 08:17:36 AM
That does not surprise me PD. I have always admired talented guys like that who could basically do anything with their hands.

What gets me they seem to do it without effort. I sweat and struggle and it always turns out a bodge-up!

Currently Spinning.

Martinu: 3rd Violin Sonata.

(https://i.imgur.com/8j02YeJ.jpg)

I would not swap the 3rd VS for all his symphonies. A big work of four movements with an infectious Scherzo that for life affirming and unbridled joy challenges Mozart.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 24, 2022, 02:30:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 24, 2022, 08:19:12 AM
I was advised to use Bergeon by The Expert Stylus Company.

(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0139/0434/7193/products/Bergeon6033RodicoCleaningPuttyWatchRepairTool.png?v=1591799510)

One stick lasts a lifetime. Used for cleaning watches it is perfect for styli. Make a pea sized blob and attach to a small stick. With system fired up address the "pea" to styli until a pop through speakers. Job done. I do it after every side. One "pea" lasts six months approx.   

Mine has arrived. I have not tried it yet.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 24, 2022, 05:31:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 24, 2022, 12:06:17 AM
What gets me they seem to do it without effort. I sweat and struggle and it always turns out a bodge-up!

Currently Spinning.

Martinu: 3rd Violin Sonata.

(https://i.imgur.com/8j02YeJ.jpg)

I would not swap the 3rd VS for all his symphonies. A big work of four movements with an infectious Scherzo that for life affirming and unbridled joy challenges Mozart.   
Now I know that that isn't true!  I've seen amazing things that you've done in your allotment gardens for instance.  :P 8)

I don't recall ever hearing Martinu's third violin sonata before now.  I'll have to do some digging through my LPs and CDs later.  Must admit, with all that's been going on in the world lately--particularly in Europe, I haven't felt like listening to much music.   :(  by the way, what is that cover of...it's hard to make out.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 25, 2022, 12:39:40 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 24, 2022, 02:30:14 AM
Mine has arrived. I have not tried it yet.

Excellent, Fergus! I have followed the instructions from the Expert Stylus Co for over five years without mishap; with system on and volume set at normal listening levels address a pea sized blob to stylus slowly without dragging until a light crackle is heard through speakers - job done. They advised after every side but I make do with a couple of times each listening session. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 25, 2022, 12:59:28 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 24, 2022, 05:31:16 AM
Now I know that that isn't true!  I've seen amazing things that you've done in your allotment gardens for instance.  :P 8)

I don't recall ever hearing Martinu's third violin sonata before now.  I'll have to do some digging through my LPs and CDs later.  Must admit, with all that's been going on in the world lately--particularly in Europe, I haven't felt like listening to much music.   :(  by the way, what is that cover of...it's hard to make out.

PD

Oh it is, PD. You should have witnessed the state I got in only this week (simply) screwing a light to a fence post!

Supraphon featured contemporary art from Czech artists on LP covers. I like them very much and follow with interest. The cover of the Martinu Violin Sonata is by Stanislav Vajce. Below, another sample of his work. If you are interested I can post some more by other artists.

(https://i.imgur.com/y3J5fkg.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 25, 2022, 02:17:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 25, 2022, 12:39:40 AM
Excellent, Fergus! I have followed the instructions from the Expert Stylus Co for over five years without mishap; with system on and volume set at normal listening levels address a pea sized blob to stylus slowly without dragging until a light crackle is heard through speakers - job done. They advised after every side but I make do with a couple of times each listening session.

Cheers Lol. I used it for the first time yesterday and, I am pleased to report, with success.  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 25, 2022, 05:06:07 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 25, 2022, 12:59:28 AM
Oh it is, PD. You should have witnessed the state I got in only this week (simply) screwing a light to a fence post!

Supraphon featured contemporary art from Czech artists on LP covers. I like them very much and follow with interest. The cover of the Martinu Violin Sonata is by Stanislav Vajce. Below, another sample of his work. If you are interested I can post some more by other artists.

(https://i.imgur.com/y3J5fkg.jpg)
Yes, I would love to see and hear more about the art and the artists--whenever you feel like it.  :)

Quote from: aligreto on March 25, 2022, 02:17:58 AM
Cheers Lol. I used it for the first time yesterday and, I am pleased to report, with success.  :)
Did you do a before and after test to see if you could hear any differences Fergus?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 25, 2022, 05:38:28 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 25, 2022, 05:06:07 AM

Did you do a before and after test to see if you could hear any differences Fergus?

PD

Yes I did PD, and I did not hear any difference really. However, I was not surprised nor did I expect to on my first attempt. The reasons for this are:

1- The vinyl that I was playing is in very good condition itself
2- When I dipped the stylus into the blob there was not a big deposit left so that particular stylus was relatively clean

I bought the Bergeon in the first instance to clean my styli [I have three] obviously.
I prefer the Irons recommendation above brushing because I believe that it will be more efficacious and more safe
I will use it more as a preventative measure in the future.

I do have an older cartridge on another turntable. It will be interesting to see whether or not I remove a lump of gunge from that one.

I am happy that I bought it. I will recommend it to my fellow vinyl lover friends here.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 25, 2022, 07:55:24 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 25, 2022, 02:17:58 AM
Cheers Lol. I used it for the first time yesterday and, I am pleased to report, with success.  :)

Good man. With any other outcome I would be making a swift exit from GMG under the cover of darkness. ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 25, 2022, 08:01:12 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 25, 2022, 07:55:24 AM
Good man. With any other outcome I would be making a swift exit from GMG under the cover of darkness. ;)

Fear not, Lol, for I am very grateful for the recommendation.  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 25, 2022, 10:29:27 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 25, 2022, 05:38:28 AM
Yes I did PD, and I did not hear any difference really. However, I was not surprised nor did I expect to on my first attempt. The reasons for this are:

1- The vinyl that I was playing is in very good condition itself
2- When I dipped the stylus into the blob there was not a big deposit left so that particular stylus was relatively clean

I bought the Bergeon in the first instance to clean my styli [I have three] obviously.
I prefer the Irons recommendation above brushing because I believe that it will be more efficacious and more safe
I will use it more as a preventative measure in the future.

I do have an older cartridge on another turntable. It will be interesting to see whether or not I remove a lump of gunge from that one.

I am happy that I bought it. I will recommend it to my fellow vinyl lover friends here.
Will be happy to hear any future reports from you.  For what its worth, when I've used that little black brush that comes with a stylus for cleaning, I always use a small pen-type flashlight--partly because I don't have the greatest lighting there; however, when I use it, I can see the "dust" [what have you] coming off of the stylus.  :)

That said about lack of light there, I did purchase a small LED light that a friend of mine told me about.  We purchased one for me at an Ikea store.  I believe it was a Jansjo.  I have two of them.  They clamp on to cabinets/shelves; one of them is with my most of my record and CD collection and the other it clamped onto my stereo cabinet.  Their necks are quite flexible.   I'm trying to remember what the difference is with their newer version?  My friend was trying to get ahold of one for another friend, but couldn't find any.  They were quite inexpensive, came in a myriad of colors and work well.

EDIT:  I see that some are for sale on ebay.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 25, 2022, 11:40:59 AM
Yes, PD, I also use a portable LED flashlight to see the dust on the stylus. These are most helpful tools for ageing eyes  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 25, 2022, 12:42:12 PM
Quote from: aligreto on March 25, 2022, 11:40:59 AM
Yes, PD, I also use a portable LED flashlight to see the dust on the stylus. These are most helpful tools for ageing eyes  ;D
Or for dark corners/areas     ;)  :-X  :-\

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 27, 2022, 11:27:24 PM
Happy to report that the HumminGuru record cleaning machine is working wonders.
For example an old 10" Bruch concerto with Oistrach on DGG, which I am taking care of for my father, is now quiet and the ML stylus is finding untouched groove where his conical Philips never has been.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 28, 2022, 04:49:33 AM
Quote from: Valentino on March 27, 2022, 11:27:24 PM
Happy to report that the HumminGuru record cleaning machine is working wonders.
For example an old 10" Bruch concerto with Oistrach on DGG, which I am taking care of for my father, is now quiet and the ML stylus is finding untouched grove where his conical Philips never has been.
Good to hear!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 31, 2022, 11:33:19 PM
Spinning.

Somethin' Else.

(https://i.imgur.com/bPrGM7D.jpg)

Track listing: side 1 Autumn Leaves, Love for Sale. side 2 Somethin' Else, One for Daddy-O, Dancing in the Dark.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 01, 2022, 01:37:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 31, 2022, 11:33:19 PM
Spinning.

Somethin' Else.

(https://i.imgur.com/bPrGM7D.jpg)

Track listing: side 1 Autumn Leaves, Love for Sale. side 2 Somethin' Else, One for Daddy-O, Dancing in the Dark.
I have that album but, alas, only as a digital download.  :(
I like the album, especially the track Autumn Leaves.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 01, 2022, 06:29:14 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 01, 2022, 01:37:14 AM
I have that album but, alas, only as a digital download.  :(
I like the album, especially the track Autumn Leaves.

I listened to John Coltrane's "Blue Train" straight after. Without a doubt Coltrane is a finer sax player then Adderley but I enjoyed Somethin' Else more out of the two.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 01, 2022, 07:00:45 AM
I've ordered the Testament LP release of the Elgar Cello Concerto and Sea Pictures with Du Pré/Baker and Barbirolli. You know, the AAA (re)master done at Abbey Road.
When it gets to me it will be AD/DSP/DAed.  :P
A new Sota Sapphire sub chassis and refurbished cabinet is also on order. It's just money.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 01, 2022, 10:15:57 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 01, 2022, 06:29:14 AM
I listened to John Coltrane's "Blue Train" straight after. Without a doubt Coltrane is a finer sax player then Adderley but I enjoyed Somethin' Else more out of the two.

An interesting comparison. I am not far enough into my Jazz education yet to start comparing different instrumentalists but I am looking forward to doing so at some dtage.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 01, 2022, 11:56:02 PM
Quote from: aligreto on April 01, 2022, 10:15:57 AM
An interesting comparison. I am not far enough into my Jazz education yet to start comparing different instrumentalists but I am looking forward to doing so at some dtage.

I was more going on reputation, Fergus.

Talking of comparisons. Both Boult and Previn recorded The Perfect Fool/Egdon Heath playing back to back my subjective conclusion was not what I expected.

(https://i.imgur.com/MjfK1Bc.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/CFo9Xqp.jpg)

I thought Previn tremendous in "The Perfect Fool" he comes over as inspired by the piece. A performance that takes wing. Sir Adrian seems a tad staid. "Egdon Heath" conversely bored me. Either the conductor or balance engineer are at fault as quiet passages, there are a few, are close to inaudible. Boult comes into his own here. The piece flows and under his baton the work lives up to the reputation as Holst's possibly most important work.
A score draw! What surprised me most was the degree of preference I had for Previn's "The Perfect Fool" and Boult's "Egdon Heath".   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 02, 2022, 03:24:45 AM
Supraphon red label. Must check if I have any. Blues are plenty.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 02, 2022, 03:34:55 AM
Quote from: Irons on April 01, 2022, 11:56:02 PM
I was more going on reputation, Fergus.

Talking of comparisons. Both Boult and Previn recorded The Perfect Fool/Egdon Heath playing back to back my subjective conclusion was not what I expected.

(https://i.imgur.com/MjfK1Bc.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/CFo9Xqp.jpg)

I thought Previn tremendous in "The Perfect Fool" he comes over as inspired by the piece. A performance that takes wing. Sir Adrian seems a tad staid. "Egdon Heath" conversely bored me. Either the conductor or balance engineer are at fault as quiet passages, there are a few, are close to inaudible. Boult comes into his own here. The piece flows and under his baton the work lives up to the reputation as Holst's possibly most important work.
A score draw! What surprised me most was the degree of preference I had for Previn's "The Perfect Fool" and Boult's "Egdon Heath".

A situation made for an A/B comparison. An interesting result, given both of the conductors' reputations, Lol.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 04, 2022, 12:23:19 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 02, 2022, 03:34:55 AM
A situation made for an A/B comparison. An interesting result, given both of the conductors' reputations, Lol.

That is what I thought, Fergus. Coincidently both issues are coupled with vocal works by Holst. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 04, 2022, 12:58:37 AM
Quote from: Valentino on April 02, 2022, 03:24:45 AM
Supraphon red label. Must check if I have any. Blues are plenty.

A label I completely ignored until put to the wise by Len Gregory aka "The Cartridge Man". He was a font of knowledge and friends with members of the recording industry in the Czech Republic. I hung onto his every word.
Stories do get embellished over time but this mostly true, I think. Supraphon ordered  valve/tube  recording equipment from Fisher Electronics in America. They took delivery just as the Soviets brought down the "Iron Curtain" and all such transactions were banned. Supraphon were the only East European company to own state of the art electronics.
The label colours for the valve recordings are blue for mono and red for stereo. Later Supraphon issued recordings using Soviet transistor gear were all blue labels. To be taken with a grain of salt, but all red label stereo Supraphons are claimed to be valve recorded and cut.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 04, 2022, 02:31:09 AM
Found a red one. Bress playing the Schönberg and Stravinsky violin concertos with Prague SO and Rohan. SUA ST 50878 (P)1968.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 08, 2022, 11:31:59 PM
Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/Sj1evgP.jpg)

Supraphon recorded lots of Britten but less so RVW, in fact Concerto Accademico is the only recording I'm aware of. Nora Grumlikova plays as to a manor born and her Britten concerto remains my top choice. Not sure how Peter Maag found himself working behind the "Iron Curtain". Although he is little mentioned today he was a important conductor on Decca's roster.
One of my favourite Supraphon LPs
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 12, 2022, 11:07:01 PM
Spinning.

Liapunov: Rhapsody on Ukrainian Themes.

(https://i.imgur.com/NwIabmq.jpg)

Not the most sophisticated of recordings (Vox 1975) but the bass drum featured in Liapunov's score certainly makes it's presence felt as well as heard!   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 14, 2022, 02:01:34 AM
Mozart: Piano Concerto No. 23 KV 488 [Haskil/Sacher] Post in 33 ⅓ thread.


(https://www.popsike.ch/pix/20131212/181280572907.jpg)


Delving into my 10" collection which is something that I seldom do now, for some reason.

This one was recorded in 1955, I think, but was definitely released in 1956 as part of the Mozart Jubilee Edition 1956 to mark the 200th anniversary of Mozart's birth. The final movement in particular is a sparkling performance by Haskil. The orchestral accompaniment sounds a bit lean in the recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 14, 2022, 02:06:15 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 14, 2022, 02:01:34 AM
Mozart: Piano Concerto No. 23 KV 488 [Haskil/Sacher] Post in 33 ⅓ thread.


(https://www.popsike.ch/pix/20131212/181280572907.jpg)


Delving into my 10" collection which is something that I seldom do now, for some reason.

This one was recorded in 1955, I think, but was definitely released in 1956 as part of the Mozart Jubilee Edition 1956 to mark the 200th anniversary of Mozart's birth. The final movement in particular is a sparkling performance by Haskil. The orchestral accompaniment sounds a bit lean in the recording.
Do you have the specialized 10-inch wand from Okki Nokki?  I have so few 10-inch LPs that I haven't bothered to order one.

Clara Haskil was a fine pianist!  I have some of her recordings--some on LP and some on CD.   :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 14, 2022, 02:09:53 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on April 14, 2022, 02:06:15 AM
Do you have the specialized 10-inch wand from Okki Nokki?  I have so few 10-inch LPs that I haven't bothered to order one.

Clara Haskil was a fine pianist!  I have some of her recordings--some on LP and some on CD.   :)

PD

No, I did consider it, PD, but I would have less than 100 10" so I never bothered.

Agreed on Haskil.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on April 14, 2022, 02:35:19 AM
Quote from: aligreto on April 14, 2022, 02:01:34 AM
Mozart: Piano Concerto No. 23 KV 488 [Haskil/Sacher] Post in 33 ⅓ thread.


(https://www.popsike.ch/pix/20131212/181280572907.jpg)


Delving into my 10" collection which is something that I seldom do now, for some reason.

This one was recorded in 1955, I think, but was definitely released in 1956 as part of the Mozart Jubilee Edition 1956 to mark the 200th anniversary of Mozart's birth. The final movement in particular is a sparkling performance by Haskil. The orchestral accompaniment sounds a bit lean in the recording.

In 2005 DG released what it called an expanded version of its 1956 Mozart Jubilee Edition. It contains performances of K459, recorded in 1955 and K415, recorded in 1960 with Clara Haskil. K415 (No 13 in C major) is accompanied by the Lucerne Festival Strings conducted by Rudolf Baumgartner. The booklet says 'The trend towards reduced orchestral forces culminated in the Festival Strings being pared down to the bone in 1960 to only 13 players...producing a dry sound that is unfashionable today...'

Presumably this was Haskil's preference, I don't know how much it applies to earlier recordings. She had hopes of recording a complete cycle but it never happened.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on April 14, 2022, 04:58:06 AM
Quote from: Biffo on April 14, 2022, 02:35:19 AM
In 2005 DG released what it called an expanded version of its 1956 Mozart Jubilee Edition. It contains performances of K459, recorded in 1955 and K415, recorded in 1960 with Clara Haskil. K415 (No 13 in C major) is accompanied by the Lucerne Festival Strings conducted by Rudolf Baumgartner. The booklet says 'The trend towards reduced orchestral forces culminated in the Festival Strings being pared down to the bone in 1960 to only 13 players...producing a dry sound that is unfashionable today...'

Presumably this was Haskil's preference, I don't know how much it applies to earlier recordings. She had hopes of recording a complete cycle but it never happened.

Thank you very much for that interesting information.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 15, 2022, 01:42:27 AM
Thanks Biffo. Superb info.

...

Glad I ordered the 7" and 10" adaptors with the HumminGuru. A pain to use, but I'm halfway through my 10" now. Getting there.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 21, 2022, 04:44:53 AM
Last night, on the kitchen island, Yup, that's a glass of pilsner beer:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/27a53a7c-0fac-4d09-bb08-90aa5a468e05-jpeg.811141/)

Subchassis swap. The old Series II on the right and the new Series V on the left.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/91540f31-838d-41ce-8f57-fce1c138fcb8-jpeg.804786/)

Also splashed out on a refurbished full oak cabinet. Has been on my wishlist for 15 years. Took the plunge because of the shipment costs across the pond. Now or never, right?

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/17bac391-0a6d-4183-bc26-ec6f8366b0b4-jpeg.811192/)

Click to enlarge.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 28, 2022, 05:37:46 AM
Quote from: Valentino on April 21, 2022, 04:44:53 AM
Last night, on the kitchen island, Yup, that's a glass of pilsner beer:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/27a53a7c-0fac-4d09-bb08-90aa5a468e05-jpeg.811141/)

Subchassis swap. The old Series II on the right and the new Series V on the left.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/91540f31-838d-41ce-8f57-fce1c138fcb8-jpeg.804786/)

Also splashed out on a refurbished full oak cabinet. Has been on my wishlist for 15 years. Took the plunge because of the shipment costs across the pond. Now or never, right?

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/17bac391-0a6d-4183-bc26-ec6f8366b0b4-jpeg.811192/)

Click to enlarge.
Looks great!  What kind of cabinet/table do you have it on top of?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 29, 2022, 06:31:17 AM
It's wall mounted actually. I made the shelf out of the sturdiest supports I could find and a bespoke glass plate.

The cabinet is Montana, a Danish classic, too soft for 20 kg turntable. Actually the floor is too soft as well, even for a suspended Sota.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 29, 2022, 07:23:41 AM
Quote from: Valentino on April 29, 2022, 06:31:17 AM
It's wall mounted actually. I made the shelf out of the sturdiest supports I could find and a bespoke glass plate.

The cabinet is Montana, a Danish classic, too soft for 20 kg turntable. Actually the floor is too soft as well, even for a suspended Sota.
Oh, interesting!  So, you used a (I'm guessing) a thick glass plate as a shelf for the tt?

And you're not alone re floors.   :( The cabinet is, fortunately pretty heavy (particularly with a tube amp and pre-amp in it) which helps somewhat.  So, no doing the jitterbug in the same room with records playing then?  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 29, 2022, 08:59:37 AM
Oh, we can dance. The Sota isolation is legendary. Trouble was that the suspension was moving sideways, plus the Montana cabinet (12mm MDF) couldn't support the weight of the thing. Photo of shelf and supports soon. In the meantime have a look at somebody else's suspension at work:

https://youtu.be/BDZDBY4jZu4 (https://youtu.be/BDZDBY4jZu4)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 29, 2022, 10:43:50 PM
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/f46cb46b-e633-4443-b660-67970036e00d-jpeg.813501/)
As promised. The business side of things don't tend to look good.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 30, 2022, 04:36:16 AM
Quote from: Valentino on April 29, 2022, 08:59:37 AM
Oh, we can dance. The Sota isolation is legendary. Trouble was that the suspension was moving sideways, plus the Montana cabinet (12mm MDF) couldn't support the weight of the thing. Photo of shelf and supports soon. In the meantime have a look at somebody else's suspension at work:

https://youtu.be/BDZDBY4jZu4 (https://youtu.be/BDZDBY4jZu4)
Wow!  Quite impressive!  I thought that I heard the record skip once, but then again, I don't know that recording.  Still, quite something!  So, was something a bit too big in your new setup (as in things were shifting inside)?

Quote from: Valentino on April 29, 2022, 10:43:50 PM
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/f46cb46b-e633-4443-b660-67970036e00d-jpeg.813501/)
As promised. The business side of things don't tend to look good.
It looks fine!  Don't be so hard on yourself!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 30, 2022, 05:30:12 AM
No, nothing too big. Just my house and stereo cabinet bring too soft. I saw the suspension moving about and I didn't want that.

He manages to skip the record in the video, Do not try to do the same with a Rega or a Thorens even. No go.

Have been listening to the Böhm DG box with Mozart symphonies 25-41 lately, working my way through it. Quite entertaining. Böhm knew how to Mozart.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 06, 2022, 11:35:49 PM
Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/pvqpmCC.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/0nxCfLx.jpg)

A magical performance of Norfolk Rhapsody No.1 from Sir Adrian. The opening weirdly had echoes of Mahler's 1st Symphony opening, I thought. My copy is an early large dog label.

Glazer plays Satie straighter then Ciccolini which I prefer. A UK pressing from Decca.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 22, 2022, 01:02:17 AM
Sibelius: 2nd Symphony.

Not Barbirolli's EMI recording but a latter one which was part of the superb set of various works which Charles Gerhardt (producer) and Kenneth Wilkinson (sound engineer) made with the RPO under the best conductors of the day commissioned by Readers Digest.
My copy on Italian pressed RCA is low down in the food chain. Chesky released the whole set on LP at premium prices for the audiophile market. I have a few of the other Chesky releases and although nice pressings I'm not sure they are worth the extra outlay over standard issues.

(https://i.imgur.com/MORKr1X.jpg)   (https://i.imgur.com/Zb7UstM.jpg)

A typical Barbirolli performance being rich, warm and on the slow side.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 28, 2022, 11:29:48 PM
Quote from: Irons on May 06, 2022, 11:35:49 PM
Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/pvqpmCC.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/0nxCfLx.jpg)

A magical performance of Norfolk Rhapsody No.1 from Sir Adrian. The opening weirdly had echoes of Mahler's 1st Symphony opening, I thought. My copy is an early large dog label.

Glazer plays Satie straighter then Ciccolini which I prefer. A UK pressing from Decca.
Lol,
I remember, when I was in the 6th Form at school c.1972/3 asking my 'Musical Appreciation' teacher to play that Boult LP of the 4th Symphony in our lesson (which he kindly agreed to). I think that it's a great performance and because of the superior recording preferable to the earlier Decca version. I don't remember that RCA Gold Seal LP of Barbirolli conducting Sibelius's 2nd Symphony.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 29, 2022, 01:12:30 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/k59edMV.jpg)

I have on my shelves individual copies of the Decca set but I confess I don't play them anymore, Jeffrey. I have read in the past that the younger Boult's RVW and Elgar too (in my view he is the supreme conductor of both) are more dynamic which is probably true. But a lifetime of knowledge and wisdom he brings to the music during his Indian summer more then compensates. Also, as you say, the EMI recordings are far superior. To hear the Decca set at their best CD is probably the best route unless the LPs can be played on a dedicated mono system. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 29, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
Quote from: Irons on May 29, 2022, 01:12:30 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/k59edMV.jpg)

I have on my shelves individual copies of the Decca set but I confess I don't play them anymore, Jeffrey. I have read in the past that the younger Boult's RVW and Elgar too (in my view he is the supreme conductor of both) are more dynamic which is probably true. But a lifetime of knowledge and wisdom he brings to the music during his Indian summer more then compensates. Also, as you say, the EMI recordings are far superior. To hear the Decca set at their best CD is probably the best route unless the LPs can be played on a dedicated mono system.
This was my way into VW's music Lol - arguably my most important classical purchase:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 30, 2022, 08:16:21 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 29, 2022, 12:29:43 PM
This was my way into VW's music Lol - arguably my most important classical purchase:
(//)

Very special then, Jeffrey.

Released in 1954 and only just missed out on being in true stereo. From the official Decca discography -
Decca made its first stereo recordings in Geneva on 13th May 1954. The new technology was used in Rome from July 1954 and Vienna from April 1955. In London it was used experimentally in December in December 1954 but mono persisted there for three years, with stereo only becoming the norm at Kingsway Hall from December 1955 and at West Hampstead from February 1958.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 31, 2022, 05:05:40 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 30, 2022, 08:16:21 AM
Very special then, Jeffrey.

Released in 1954 and only just missed out on being in true stereo. From the official Decca discography -
Decca made its first stereo recordings in Geneva on 13th May 1954. The new technology was used in Rome from July 1954 and Vienna from April 1955. In London it was used experimentally in December in December 1954 but mono persisted there for three years, with stereo only becoming the norm at Kingsway Hall from December 1955 and at West Hampstead from February 1958.
Indeed Lol - I think that only Symphony No.8 (from the original Boult/Decca cycle) was recorded in stereo, although I assume that No.9 was recorded in stereo by Everest. No.6 had VW's speech of thanks to Boult and the orchestra at the end of the disc and Boult made a spoken tribute to VW (who had died a few hours before the recording session) at the start of the Everest LP.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 31, 2022, 07:44:41 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on May 31, 2022, 06:14:36 AM
The Everest 9th is definitely in stereo.

I hadn't realised quite how close we'd come to a mono version of Peter Grimes, though (1958)!
Still upsets me that Turn of the Screw was mono, when from the above discussion it seems Decca could have done a stereo in 1955 if they'd pulled finger... (I realise nearly 70 years have elapsed and I should be over it by now!!)

John Culshaw in his autobiography "Putting the Record Straight" gives some insight in the quandary Decca producers felt at the time.

Stereo continued to be the main issue at the studio, and management at last seemed ready to accept the inevitable but uncomfortable decision. If they had no stereo material available and the system proved a success they stood to lose a lot of money; similarly, if they invested in stereo and the system flopped (as, some twenty years later, did quadraphony), they would again lose money. Another fear was that the artists, once they heard about stereo , would demand more money.

You mention Peter Grimes.

... and the obvious way to make a start was with Peter Grimes, which, since since its first performance in London in 1945, had won acclaim all over the world. It also struck me as a work that would be effective in stereo - the storm, the off-stage church service, the drum-led procession to Grime's hut and the final "mad scene" could be conveyed in aural terms .......Lewis said little, but worried about the costs; I don't think Rosengarten had ever heard the piece, and Farkas said that he might be able to give away six copies in the United States.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 01, 2022, 03:06:23 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on May 31, 2022, 06:14:36 AM
The Everest 9th is definitely in stereo.

I hadn't realised quite how close we'd come to a mono version of Peter Grimes, though (1958)!
Still upsets me that Turn of the Screw was mono, when from the above discussion it seems Decca could have done a stereo in 1955 if they'd pulled finger... (I realise nearly 70 years have elapsed and I should be over it by now!!)
Thanks Re: Everest No.9
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 01, 2022, 06:35:16 AM
Released under license in the UK by the subscription only World Record Club. As mostly always the WRC credit Everest on the label.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 05, 2022, 12:12:01 AM
Spinning

(https://i.imgur.com/oB8hizY.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/DwOcv5D.jpg)

The cover notes include a flowery Oistrakh tribute from the pen of Evgeni Svetlanov.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 07, 2022, 08:27:51 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 01, 2022, 06:35:16 AM
Released under license in the UK by the subscription only World Record Club. As mostly always the WRC credit Everest on the label.
With that great LP cover:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 08, 2022, 06:53:56 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 07, 2022, 08:27:51 AM
With that great LP cover:


That's the one! ;D Followed the recent "chat" on the RVW thread with interest. Many good points made.

(https://i.imgur.com/ny6d8eV.jpg)

Also a WRC release. That and RVW conducting his own 4th Symphony in probably the most electric performance of the work.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 08, 2022, 11:56:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 08, 2022, 06:53:56 AM
That's the one! ;D Followed the recent "chat" on the RVW thread with interest. Many good points made.

(https://i.imgur.com/ny6d8eV.jpg)

Also a WRC release. That and RVW conducting his own 4th Symphony in probably the most electric performance of the work.
Ah yes, VW with his gigantic hearing aid which apparently emitted a high-pitched whistle during some of the Decca recordings!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 10, 2022, 07:09:50 AM
Strauss: Der Rosenkavalier [von Karajan]
There are many iterations of this version of this wonderful work. This is the LP version that I own:


(https://cdn10.bigcommerce.com/s-62bdpkt7pb/product_images/uploaded_images/richard-strauss-der-rosenkavalier-elisabeth-schwarzkopf-christa-ludwig-teresa-stich-randall-otto-edelmann-eberhard-w-chter-nicolai-gedda-philharmonia-chorus-philharmonia-orchestra-h-1-.jpg)    (https://cdn10.bigcommerce.com/s-62bdpkt7pb/product_images/uploaded_images/richard-strauss-der-rosenkavalier-elisabeth-schwarzkopf-christa-ludwig-teresa-stich-randall-otto-edelmann-eberhard-w-chter-nicolai-gedda-philharmonia-chorus-philharmonia-orchestra-.jpg)    (https://cdn10.bigcommerce.com/s-62bdpkt7pb/product_images/uploaded_images/richard-strauss-der-rosenkavalier-elisabeth-schwarzkopf-christa-ludwig-teresa-stich-randall-otto-edelmann-eberhard-w-chter-nicolai-gedda-philharmonia-chorus-philharmonia-orchestra-3-.jpg)

I have liked this work since I first heard it many years ago. I particularly like this version of the work. What I like about the von Karajan version is how it marries a particularly lightness of tone with a rather poignant subject matter. I also particularly like the way von Karajan portrays both the lyricism and the dramatic elements of this work. I also like the intensity of the delivery here.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 10, 2022, 11:54:46 PM
Quote from: aligreto on June 10, 2022, 07:09:50 AM
Strauss: Der Rosenkavalier [von Karajan]
There are many iterations of this version of this wonderful work. This is the LP version that I own:


(https://cdn10.bigcommerce.com/s-62bdpkt7pb/product_images/uploaded_images/richard-strauss-der-rosenkavalier-elisabeth-schwarzkopf-christa-ludwig-teresa-stich-randall-otto-edelmann-eberhard-w-chter-nicolai-gedda-philharmonia-chorus-philharmonia-orchestra-h-1-.jpg)    (https://cdn10.bigcommerce.com/s-62bdpkt7pb/product_images/uploaded_images/richard-strauss-der-rosenkavalier-elisabeth-schwarzkopf-christa-ludwig-teresa-stich-randall-otto-edelmann-eberhard-w-chter-nicolai-gedda-philharmonia-chorus-philharmonia-orchestra-.jpg)    (https://cdn10.bigcommerce.com/s-62bdpkt7pb/product_images/uploaded_images/richard-strauss-der-rosenkavalier-elisabeth-schwarzkopf-christa-ludwig-teresa-stich-randall-otto-edelmann-eberhard-w-chter-nicolai-gedda-philharmonia-chorus-philharmonia-orchestra-3-.jpg)

I have liked this work since I first heard it many years ago. I particularly like this version of the work. What I like about the von Karajan version is how it marries a particularly lightness of tone with a rather poignant subject matter. I also particularly like the way von Karajan portrays both the lyricism and the dramatic elements of this work. I also like the intensity of the delivery here.

Good to see you back, Fergus.

The Germany sourced Teldec pressings are whisper quiet, I love them. I doubt you would be able to hear the opera in a better light, LP or any other format. I notice from the back cover photo that for this recording Christopher Parker worked with Walter Legge. Something I have not been aware of before.

For my own current listening Stravinsky has featured strongly.

The Firebird on Ace of Diamonds with striking cover art.

(https://i.imgur.com/uFyrYx1.jpg)

and Danses Concertantes from L'Oiseau-Lyre.

(https://i.imgur.com/soi1kE8.jpg)



Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 12, 2022, 03:12:31 PM
Quote from: Irons on June 10, 2022, 11:54:46 PM

(https://cdn10.bigcommerce.com/s-62bdpkt7pb/product_images/uploaded_images/richard-strauss-der-rosenkavalier-elisabeth-schwarzkopf-christa-ludwig-teresa-stich-randall-otto-edelmann-eberhard-w-chter-nicolai-gedda-philharmonia-chorus-philharmonia-orchestra-3-.jpg)

The Germany sourced Teldec pressings are whisper quiet, I love them. I doubt you would be able to hear the opera in a better light, LP or any other format. I notice from the back cover photo that for this recording Christopher Parker worked with Walter Legge. Something I have not been aware of before.


Cheers Lol.

I have long admired this particular version of this work.
I am glad to be of help with the recording details.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: geralmar on June 15, 2022, 09:43:16 AM
(https://i.postimg.cc/HnRqS4cY/51-Fmo-Xu-E93-L-AC-SY350.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Ravel: Bolero; Nutcracker Suite; ca.1955. U.S.

My introduction to classical music.  The Tchaikovsky made no impression; but I was mesmerized by the Bolero, conducted by the possibly pseudonymous "Walter Bauer". 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 16, 2022, 11:49:46 PM
An intriguing purchase from last week as Gottfried von Einem is a name unknown to me. I have only listened to his 1st SQ the once so in no position to comment on the piece. But the Alban Berg SQ play with commitment and the Stravinsky pieces are outstanding.
As with aligreto's Strauss issue above a DMM Teldec pressing.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 17, 2022, 07:38:40 AM
Bruggen playing music by Vivaldi, Naudot, Telemann and JS Bach


(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/91ka3PvckSL._SL1500_.jpg)


Long before he became a renowned director, Bruggen was, as an instrumentalist, one of the earliest influences in my conversion to HIP in Baroque music.
Some rather illustrious names appear on this album.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 18, 2022, 03:35:57 AM
Mozart: Clarinet Concerto [Eichler/Bottcher]


(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71HCd4zunhL._SL1000_.jpg)


This is a very fluid and lyrical version of this superlative work; an admirable one even, particularly from the clarinettist. It was released in 1967 on the Concert Hall label.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 18, 2022, 05:33:10 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 18, 2022, 03:35:57 AM
Mozart: Clarinet Concerto [Eichler/Bottcher]


(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71HCd4zunhL._SL1000_.jpg)


This is a very fluid and lyrical version of this superlative work; an admirable one even, particularly from the clarinettist. It was released in 1967 on the Concert Hall label.

Recorded in Konzerhaus Vienna.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 18, 2022, 09:07:08 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 18, 2022, 05:33:10 AM

Recorded in Konzerhaus Vienna.

Do you own it?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 18, 2022, 11:46:59 PM
Quote from: aligreto on June 18, 2022, 09:07:08 AM
Do you own it?

Unfortunately not. I looked it up.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 19, 2022, 07:37:38 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 18, 2022, 11:46:59 PM
Unfortunately not. I looked it up.

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=87943;image)


Nice!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 21, 2022, 07:00:27 AM
Spinning

Fauré: Violin Sonatas 1&2.

A well packaged French pressing. Ferras and Barbizet made an earlier recording of the 1st Sonata coupled with the Franck sonata. 

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 22, 2022, 01:17:58 PM
Back to back.

(https://i.imgur.com/cax9gX3.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/B6ncJWV.jpg)

Five years separate Alwyn's 1st Symphony and 1st String Quartet. I enjoyed the quartet more which has a melody in the third movement to die for, heartfelt and beautiful. I had difficulty following the symphony, finding it a bit diffuse. I'm sure repeated plays will reveal itself to me.

The sleeve illustration of Chandos LP, The Torrents of Spring is by William Alwyn.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 22, 2022, 01:24:33 PM
Quote from: Irons on June 22, 2022, 01:17:58 PM
Back to back.

(https://i.imgur.com/cax9gX3.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/B6ncJWV.jpg)

Five years separate Alwyn's 1st Symphony and 1st String Quartet. I enjoyed the quartet more which has a melody in the third movement to die for, heartfelt and beautiful. I had difficulty following the symphony, finding it a bit diffuse. I'm sure repeated plays will reveal itself to me.

The sleeve illustration of Chandos LP, The Torrents of Spring is by William Alwyn.

Very nice indeed.
I am not at all familiar with the Alwyn String Quartets.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 23, 2022, 06:57:07 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 22, 2022, 01:24:33 PM
Very nice indeed.
I am not at all familiar with the Alwyn String Quartets.

I find Alwyn a conundrum. But interested enough in planning next month to visit his grave at the Suffolk village of Blythburgh.

The Adagio of the 1st SQ. It starts to get interesting at 3.45.   https://youtu.be/hfbiZxnewx4?t=3

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 23, 2022, 01:19:35 PM
Back to back.

(https://i.imgur.com/yww9jtP.jpg)

Sparer then the 1st Symphony. Two movements, which simply put are search and found. The restless agitation of the opening movement is particularly thrilling.

(https://i.imgur.com/B6ncJWV.jpg)

The title of the second string quartet "Spring Waters" is misleading. This is not a jolly romp by a stream but inspired by Turgenev's novel of the same title. Composed when Alwyn reached his 70th  year - "My careless years, My precious days" I found Alwyn's quartet extremely profound, written with the insight of a composer in his eighth decade. Although the Turgenev quote above made me stop and think, one from Alwyn himself even more so ...... "and the work ends on a triumphant note - death is not defeat".   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 24, 2022, 09:51:01 AM
The Classical Mandoline: Music by Beethoven & Hummel


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/rjAAAOSwVe1fDa5B/s-l500.jpg)


This is music scored for the mandolin and fortepiano. Both of the sonorities work well together.  In terms of the quality of the musical compositions Beethoven has it by a long head here although both works are interesting in their own right.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 24, 2022, 09:51:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 23, 2022, 06:57:07 AM
I find Alwyn a conundrum. But interested enough in planning next month to visit his grave at the Suffolk village of Blythburgh.

The Adagio of the 1st SQ. It starts to get interesting at 3.45.   https://youtu.be/hfbiZxnewx4?t=3

Thank you. I will listen to that later.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 24, 2022, 09:52:32 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 23, 2022, 01:19:35 PM
Back to back.

(https://i.imgur.com/yww9jtP.jpg)

Sparer then the 1st Symphony. Two movements, which simply put are search and found. The restless agitation of the opening movement is particularly thrilling.

(https://i.imgur.com/B6ncJWV.jpg)

The title of the second string quartet "Spring Waters" is misleading. This is not a jolly romp by a stream but inspired by Turgenev's novel of the same title. Composed when Alwyn reached his 70th  year - "My careless years, My precious days" I found Alwyn's quartet extremely profound, written with the insight of a composer in his eighth decade. Although the Turgenev quote above made me stop and think, one from Alwyn himself even more so ...... "and the work ends on a triumphant note - death is not defeat".

Great artwork on both albums!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 24, 2022, 02:34:18 PM
Music for the Musical Clock [Soni Ventorum Wind Quintet]


(https://i.discogs.com/i4S53hXdUptmzgE7ih-COp6_rKHW5iFWbYyG_r_Qi4Q/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTEwNzI2/NjAxLTE1MDU3NTEz/MzMtNDI2NS5qcGVn.jpeg)   (https://i.discogs.com/ECpfK-kpUvyYD8gZoLVVqwZ2tbaqwCGw8F25JCKQr1Y/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTEwNzI2/NjAxLTE1MTM2MjQw/NDEtODY1My5qcGVn.jpeg)   (https://i.discogs.com/Si-QcQcgLwzXg3FOnPMLMKbo2rjuQsWKGzHYX8fbHQM/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTEwNzI2/NjAxLTE1MTM2MjQw/NTQtOTEzMS5qcGVn.jpeg)


This is music written by both Haydn and Beethoven for the cutting edge of mechanical technology of the time. This is beguiling music from both composers appropriately transposed for a Wind Quintet.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 24, 2022, 02:38:51 PM
Quote from: Irons on June 23, 2022, 06:57:07 AM
I find Alwyn a conundrum. But interested enough in planning next month to visit his grave at the Suffolk village of Blythburgh.

The Adagio of the 1st SQ. It starts to get interesting at 3.45.   https://youtu.be/hfbiZxnewx4?t=3

Yes, it certainly does. What a wonderful piece of String Quartet writing this entire movement is.
Thank you for posting the link.
Enjoy your planned visit.
Perhaps a photo or two for the Alwyn thread?  ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 25, 2022, 08:59:12 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 24, 2022, 02:38:51 PM
Yes, it certainly does. What a wonderful piece of String Quartet writing this entire movement is.
Thank you for posting the link.
Enjoy your planned visit.
Perhaps a photo or two for the Alwyn thread?  ;)

Delighted you liked the piece, Fergus. I found the Blythburgh connection here -

http://landofllostcontent.blogspot.com/2022/06/william-alwyn-movements-for-piano-1961.html

Which is a stone's throw from Aldborough where I will be staying.

Keep the interesting vinyl posts coming. Each so far is not on my shelves. Oryx I find particularly interesting. A label, your post a typical example, prepared to explore repertoire the majors for commercial reasons would not.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on June 26, 2022, 09:10:25 AM
Anyone have experience with record cleaning machines? Been meaning to invest in some because surface noise just kills the listening experience in a way it doesn't with say, rock.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 26, 2022, 02:11:48 PM
Quote from: fbjim on June 26, 2022, 09:10:25 AM
Anyone have experience with record cleaning machines? Been meaning to invest in some because surface noise just kills the listening experience in a way it doesn't with say, rock.

For a committed collector of the LP record a RCM is a great investment. But it is possible that something else is going on if surface noise is such a problem for you. It never ceases to amaze how well looked after pre-loved classical records are down the years, I think this is down to the type of buyer who purchased the record in the first place. I use a RCM (Loricraft) but I would be able to enjoy my collection without one. Excessive surface noise can be a pointer to an imbalance in the system, for example simply a poor earthing setup of TT/tonearm/cartridge can amplify surface noise. Also a mismatch of tonearm and cartridge. Or simply the cartridge itself. I would disconnect all cables and clean the plugs, experiment with the system's earth paying special attention to the TT as you may be hearing vinyl static.
Before making a not small investment on a RCM make sure all is well otherwise you may be in for a disappointment.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Archaic Torso of Apollo on June 26, 2022, 06:12:00 PM
Quote from: fbjim on June 26, 2022, 09:10:25 AM
Anyone have experience with record cleaning machines? Been meaning to invest in some because surface noise just kills the listening experience in a way it doesn't with say, rock.

A few years ago, I got a Spin-Clean which is the cheapo option (about $60). It's made a huge difference. I tested it on some records I was planning to throw out due to surface noise. After a spin in the Spin-Clean, that surface noise was gone. An excellent investment, and proof that audio doesn't have to bankrupt you to be effective.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 27, 2022, 03:43:48 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 23, 2022, 01:19:35 PM
Back to back.

(https://i.imgur.com/yww9jtP.jpg)

Sparer then the 1st Symphony. Two movements, which simply put are search and found. The restless agitation of the opening movement is particularly thrilling.

(https://i.imgur.com/B6ncJWV.jpg)

The title of the second string quartet "Spring Waters" is misleading. This is not a jolly romp by a stream but inspired by Turgenev's novel of the same title. Composed when Alwyn reached his 70th  year - "My careless years, My precious days" I found Alwyn's quartet extremely profound, written with the insight of a composer in his eighth decade. Although the Turgenev quote above made me stop and think, one from Alwyn himself even more so ...... "and the work ends on a triumphant note - death is not defeat".
Most interesting Lol. Can we have a photograph of Alwyn's grave please. The 2nd Symphony is arguably the best and IMO Alwyn's is the best performance on disc. I hardly know the SQs, so, I need to rectify that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 27, 2022, 03:48:53 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 25, 2022, 08:59:12 AM
Delighted you liked the piece, Fergus. I found the Blythburgh connection here -

http://landofllostcontent.blogspot.com/2022/06/william-alwyn-movements-for-piano-1961.html

Which is a stone's throw from Aldborough where I will be staying.

Keep the interesting vinyl posts coming. Each so far is not on my shelves. Oryx I find particularly interesting. A label, your post a typical example, prepared to explore repertoire the majors for commercial reasons would not.   
That's a really interesting website of which I was unaware - thanks for alerting us to it Lol.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 27, 2022, 07:11:03 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 27, 2022, 03:43:48 AM
Most interesting Lol. Can we have a photograph of Alwyn's grave please. The 2nd Symphony is arguably the best and IMO Alwyn's is the best performance on disc. I hardly know the SQs, so, I need to rectify that.

I don't know why Jeffrey but I seem drawn to graves, as long as it is not my own I guess OK. :o
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 27, 2022, 07:18:07 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 27, 2022, 07:11:03 AM
I don't know why Jeffrey but I seem drawn to graves, as long as it is not my own I guess OK. :o
My brother went to visit the grave of Bax when he was on holiday in Ireland.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 28, 2022, 01:40:28 AM
Quote from: fbjim on June 26, 2022, 09:10:25 AM
Anyone have experience with record cleaning machines? Been meaning to invest in some because surface noise just kills the listening experience in a way it doesn't with say, rock.

Yes, I use an Okki Nokki cleaning machine.


(https://www.goldminemag.com/.image/ar_1:1%2Cc_fill%2Ccs_srgb%2Cfl_progressive%2Cq_auto:good%2Cw_1200/MTY4MzU0OTk5MTQ2NjUzMTQ1/okki6.jpg)


Yes, it does make a real difference with a dirty record.
However, it is only one part of a vinyl regime, as you will be aware, that includes handling, storage and stylus care.
The Okki Nokki is an effective vacuum record cleaner and comes in at an entry level price for this type of machine.
It also comes in black if that is your preference.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 28, 2022, 07:13:46 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 27, 2022, 07:18:07 AM
My brother went to visit the grave of Bax when he was on holiday in Ireland.

County Cork a perfect resting place for Arnold.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 28, 2022, 02:17:24 PM
Ivan Moravec: Live


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/~jYAAOSwuDBfpo-B/s-l1600.jpg)


Excellent and passionate playing from Moravec.


Supraphon was always a label that I admired for the interesting and engaging music and musicians which they issued.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 29, 2022, 02:26:58 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 28, 2022, 02:17:24 PM
Ivan Moravec: Live


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/~jYAAOSwuDBfpo-B/s-l1600.jpg)


Excellent and passionate playing from Moravec.


Supraphon was always a label that I admired for the interesting and engaging music and musicians which they issued.

PD where are you? (watching tennis I expect). She is a big Moravec fan.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 29, 2022, 04:52:48 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 29, 2022, 02:26:58 AM
PD where are you? (watching tennis I expect). She is a big Moravec fan.

I am certainly no expert on pianism but he is one that I particularly like to listen to, not that I have much of his work in my collection.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 30, 2022, 12:22:32 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 29, 2022, 04:52:48 AM
I am certainly no expert on pianism but he is one that I particularly like to listen to, not that I have much of his work in my collection.

I'm no expert either but to paraphrase what someone said "I like the sound it makes".

(https://i.imgur.com/YfeXtIF.jpg)

I have only two LP issues by Moravec, a double album on Supraphon and solo piano pieces of Debussy and Ravel on Connoisseur Society.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 30, 2022, 07:48:44 AM
I do not actively search for LPs like I once did but the vinyl Gods smiled down to me. Passing a charity shop at Kingston Upon Thames today I spied an assistant filling a LP bin. I waited until she finished - WOW

Paganini/Saint-Saens: Violin Concertos 2 & 1. Ricci, Cincinnati SO Rudolf. Brunswick SXA 4529.

Glazunov: The Seasons & Concert Waltzes. Ansermet, Suisse Romande. Decca (wide band) SXL 6269.

Britten: Four Sea Interludes & Young Person's Guide. Giulini, Philharmonia. SAX 2555.

Lalo/Saint Saens: Cello Concertos. Fournier, Orchestra Lamoureux, Martinon. DG (Tulips, red box stereo) 138669 SLPM.

Rachmaninov/Tscherepnin: Paganini Rhapsody & 10 Bagatelles. Weber RSOB Fricsay. (Tulips, red box stereo) 138710 SLPM.

Schumann: Symphonies 1&4. Krips, LSO. Decca (wide band) SXL 2223.

Haydn: Symphonies 82 & 86. Ansermet, Suisse Romande. Decca(wide band) SXL 6020.

Miaskovsky: 27th Symphony. Svetlanov, USSR ASO. Melodiya C10-14677-78.

Goldmark/Sarsate: VC No.1 & Zigeunerweisen. Perlman, Pittsburgh SO Previn. EMI ASD 3408.

Schumann: 2nd Symphony. Szell, Cleveland. Columbia (blue and silver) SAX 2496.

Dvorak: 3rd Symphony & Hussite. Kertesz, LSO. Decca (wide band) SXL 6290.

Kalliwoda/Tomasek (neither have I!) 1st Symphony & 1st Piano Concerto. Toperczer, Prague SO Rohan. Vox STGBY 677.

Weber: Piano Sonatas. D'Arco. L'Oiseau-Lyre. SOL 271.

Rimasky-Korsakov: 3rd Symphony & Piano Concerto. Zhukov, MRSO Rozhdestvensky.

(https://i.imgur.com/1nNGTre.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/VEw4a77.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/37izhai.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/pIP0gbC.jpg)

All from a single collection. Unfortunately each has the date of purchase written in biro on the back cover. This will detract from the ultimate selling price not that I intend on selling them.   

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 30, 2022, 09:01:07 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 30, 2022, 07:48:44 AM
I do not actively search for LPs like I once did but the vinyl Gods smiled down to me. Passing a charity shop at Kingston Upon Thames today I spied an assistant filling a LP bin. I waited until she finished - WOW

Paganini/Saint-Saens: Violin Concertos 2 & 1. Ricci, Cincinnati SO Rudolf. Brunswick SXA 4529.

Glazunov: The Seasons & Concert Waltzes. Ansermet, Suisse Romande. Decca (wide band) SXL 6269.

Britten: Four Sea Interludes & Young Person's Guide. Giulini, Philharmonia. SAX 2555.

Lalo/Saint Saens: Cello Concertos. Fournier, Orchestra Lamoureux, Martinon. DG (Tulips, red box stereo) 138669 SLPM.

Rachmaninov/Tscherepnin: Paganini Rhapsody & 10 Bagatelles. Weber RSOB Fricsay. (Tulips, red box stereo) 138710 SLPM.

Schumann: Symphonies 1&4. Krips, LSO. Decca (wide band) SXL 2223.

Haydn: Symphonies 82 & 86. Ansermet, Suisse Romande. Decca(wide band) SXL 6020.

Miaskovsky: 27th Symphony. Svetlanov, USSR ASO. Melodiya C10-14677-78.

Goldmark/Sarsate: VC No.1 & Zigeunerweisen. Perlman, Pittsburgh SO Previn. EMI ASD 3408.

Schumann: 2nd Symphony. Szell, Cleveland. Columbia (blue and silver) SAX 2496.

Dvorak: 3rd Symphony & Hussite. Kertesz, LSO. Decca (wide band) SXL 6290.

Kalliwoda/Tomasek (neither have I!) 1st Symphony & 1st Piano Concerto. Toperczer, Prague SO Rohan. Vox STGBY 677.

Weber: Piano Sonatas. D'Arco. L'Oiseau-Lyre. SOL 271.

Rimasky-Korsakov: 3rd Symphony & Piano Concerto. Zhukov, MRSO Rozhdestvensky.

(https://i.imgur.com/1nNGTre.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/VEw4a77.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/37izhai.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/pIP0gbC.jpg)

All from a single collection. Unfortunately each has the date of purchase written in biro on the back cover. This will detract from the ultimate selling price not that I intend on selling them.

That is a great haul. What a spot of luck with your timing  8)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on June 30, 2022, 09:22:47 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 30, 2022, 09:01:07 AM
That is a great haul. What a spot of luck with your timing  8)

Yes, lucky that the poor bloke died just in time for you to spot his LP collection at the charity shop!  ???
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on June 30, 2022, 01:59:28 PM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on June 30, 2022, 09:22:47 AM
Yes, lucky that the poor bloke died just in time for you to spot his LP collection at the charity shop!  ???


Quote from: Irons on June 30, 2022, 07:48:44 AM
I do not actively search for LPs like I once did but the vinyl Gods smiled down to me. Passing a charity shop at Kingston Upon Thames today I spied an assistant filling a LP bin. I waited until she finished - WOW



Who mentioned anyone dying?

You are seeing things that are not there and not seeing things that are there.  ::)

I have donated many, many albums to charity shops without being dead.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on July 01, 2022, 04:58:13 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 30, 2022, 01:59:28 PMI have donated many, many albums to charity shops without being dead.

Of course, you are quite right. In 2015 I put my entire LP collection at the curb to be picked up by the trash collectors. Well over a hundred LPs. :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: DavidW on July 01, 2022, 05:55:27 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on July 01, 2022, 04:58:13 AM
Of course, you are quite right. In 2015 I put my entire LP collection at the curb to be picked up by the trash collectors. Well over a hundred LPs. :)

Man you could have given it to Goodwill.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 01, 2022, 08:14:18 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 30, 2022, 09:01:07 AM
That is a great haul. What a spot of luck with your timing  8)

I choose CDs and LPs choose me. I had no intention of going to Kingston on Thursday which I recall only the second visit this year. The old antenna twitched, which is finely honed after decades of collecting vinyl seeing those records being put out.

I often think of past owners of records on my shelves. Looking at this small collection - is there more! Not in anyway typical, although the musical choice holds no surprises, all are first pressings without tell-tale marks around centre hole or, what I always look for, a crease in jacket from repeated removal. Most odd though are the dates in the lower right hand corner of back cover - as written, Dec 1963, Dec 1963, Dec, 1965, Xmas, 1967, April 1968, Nov 1970, March, 1982 and Jany (sic) 1985. The rest not dated but with the exception of possibly the Vox LP probably same source. Over twenty years from first to last of at most fourteen LPs.     
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on July 01, 2022, 01:34:16 PM
Quote from: DavidW on July 01, 2022, 05:55:27 AM
Man you could have given it to Goodwill.

I gave a pile of books to goodwill. Then I realized that I had given them a book that I had intended to keep. I went back and asked what became of those books. Was my book in a store where I could find it and buy it back? Naw, I was told. Books get sold for pulp. Hard time imagine LPs meet a more dignified fate.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: DavidW on July 01, 2022, 03:26:30 PM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on July 01, 2022, 01:34:16 PM
I gave a pile of books to goodwill. Then I realized that I had given them a book that I had intended to keep. I went back and asked what became of those books. Was my book in a store where I could find it and buy it back? Naw, I was told. Books get sold for pulp. Hard time imagine LPs meet a more dignified fate.

Well actually they probably would have sold them (lps) online.  I think selling books for pulp is a better fate than having it sit unloved in the store front or sitting in a landfill.  But that being said, except during quarantine, I always donate books to the public library instead.  They are either put them in circulation or sold at the biannual book sell.

Probably the best thing you could have done was send it to a gmg poster.  But then again, I offered a brand new sealed Simpson's 5th and 6th cd with no takers (btw that offer is still open).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on July 01, 2022, 09:03:41 PM
Quote from: DavidW on July 01, 2022, 03:26:30 PM
Well actually they probably would have sold them (lps) online.  I think selling books for pulp is a better fate than having it sit unloved in the store front or sitting in a landfill.  But that being said, except during quarantine, I always donate books to the public library instead.  They are either put them in circulation or sold at the biannual book sell.

I did take some to the library, but they had limited drop-off to 2 boxes. I didn't have time for that.

I guess I should not mention the time I threw 2,000 classical CDs in a dumpster. They were ripped. I wasn't going to pay United Van Lines to move them just so I would have to rent a storage unit for them when I arrived.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 02, 2022, 12:25:30 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 30, 2022, 07:48:44 AM
I do not actively search for LPs like I once did but the vinyl Gods smiled down to me. Passing a charity shop at Kingston Upon Thames today I spied an assistant filling a LP bin. I waited until she finished - WOW

Paganini/Saint-Saens: Violin Concertos 2 & 1. Ricci, Cincinnati SO Rudolf. Brunswick SXA 4529.

Glazunov: The Seasons & Concert Waltzes. Ansermet, Suisse Romande. Decca (wide band) SXL 6269.

Britten: Four Sea Interludes & Young Person's Guide. Giulini, Philharmonia. SAX 2555.

Lalo/Saint Saens: Cello Concertos. Fournier, Orchestra Lamoureux, Martinon. DG (Tulips, red box stereo) 138669 SLPM.

Rachmaninov/Tscherepnin: Paganini Rhapsody & 10 Bagatelles. Weber RSOB Fricsay. (Tulips, red box stereo) 138710 SLPM.

Schumann: Symphonies 1&4. Krips, LSO. Decca (wide band) SXL 2223.

Haydn: Symphonies 82 & 86. Ansermet, Suisse Romande. Decca(wide band) SXL 6020.

Miaskovsky: 27th Symphony. Svetlanov, USSR ASO. Melodiya C10-14677-78.

Goldmark/Sarsate: VC No.1 & Zigeunerweisen. Perlman, Pittsburgh SO Previn. EMI ASD 3408.

Schumann: 2nd Symphony. Szell, Cleveland. Columbia (blue and silver) SAX 2496.

Dvorak: 3rd Symphony & Hussite. Kertesz, LSO. Decca (wide band) SXL 6290.

Kalliwoda/Tomasek (neither have I!) 1st Symphony & 1st Piano Concerto. Toperczer, Prague SO Rohan. Vox STGBY 677.

Weber: Piano Sonatas. D'Arco. L'Oiseau-Lyre. SOL 271.

Rimasky-Korsakov: 3rd Symphony & Piano Concerto. Zhukov, MRSO Rozhdestvensky.

(https://i.imgur.com/1nNGTre.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/VEw4a77.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/37izhai.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/pIP0gbC.jpg)

All from a single collection. Unfortunately each has the date of purchase written in biro on the back cover. This will detract from the ultimate selling price not that I intend on selling them.
Great haul Lol. Seeing that LP of NYM Symphony 27 was a great nostalgia trip for me as the LP was my first encounter with that noble work. Thumbs up for the Ansermet Glazunov disc as well. Happy Listening!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 02, 2022, 02:40:00 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 02, 2022, 12:25:30 AM
Great haul Lol. Seeing that LP of NYM Symphony 27 was a great nostalgia trip for me as the LP was my first encounter with that noble work. Thumbs up for the Ansermet Glazunov disc as well. Happy Listening!

Thanks, Jeffrey. I have collected over time most of Miaskovsky's string quartets but this is the first time I have set eyes on a Svetlanov LP of the composer.

BTW. A terrific performance with sound to match (circa 1960) from Margrit Weber and Fricsay of Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 06, 2022, 12:15:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 01, 2022, 08:14:18 AM
I choose CDs and LPs choose me. I had no intention of going to Kingston on Thursday which I recall only the second visit this year. The old antenna twitched, which is finely honed after decades of collecting vinyl seeing those records being put out.

I often think of past owners of records on my shelves. Looking at this small collection - is there more! Not in anyway typical, although the musical choice holds no surprises, all are first pressings without tell-tale marks around centre hole or, what I always look for, a crease in jacket from repeated removal. Most odd though are the dates in the lower right hand corner of back cover - as written, Dec 1963, Dec 1963, Dec, 1965, Xmas, 1967, April 1968, Nov 1970, March, 1982 and Jany (sic) 1985. The rest not dated but with the exception of possibly the Vox LP probably same source. Over twenty years from first to last of at most fourteen LPs.     

Enjoy your good fortune and, of course, the music.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 07, 2022, 07:02:45 AM
Quote from: aligreto on July 06, 2022, 12:15:26 AM
Enjoy your good fortune and, of course, the music.

Thanks, Fergus.

(https://i.imgur.com/knDE1CJ.jpg)

The only non-orchestral of the group that crept up on me. I have no idea of the qualities or otherwise of Weber. The 3rd Sonata I found particularly impressive with a Beethoven-esque  opening which suddenly softens - don't know the pianistic term but made me sit up and listen as totally unexpected.

A 1964 recording of which Annie D'Arco performs admirably, my only slight criticism is the piano sound which is a bit clangerly (is that a word ???).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on July 07, 2022, 10:22:52 AM
So I threw out the 1987 American and got myself a 1973 German.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/cca6e97a-835e-4c83-883f-fb62db135a0f-jpeg.831154/)
(open in a new window for larger pic)

Thorens TD 125 Mk. II with SME Series II Improved arm (fixed HS version), and for the time being a rather worn Denon DL-304 cartridge. The console/plinth is original teak veneer but it has been deep cleaned and oiled, stiffened inside with 21 mm Baltic birch plywood, and put on some fat sorbothane feet. I have retained the original bottom plate and feet, so it can be put back to original looks. Corian arm board, a brand new electronics control board that swaps 16 2/3 rpm for 78, and a Denon DL-301II are on order.

Celebrated with an expensive pressing of Richters reworked rework of Vivaldi. I think I like this new one better than the first one.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 08, 2022, 06:57:01 AM
Quote from: Valentino on July 07, 2022, 10:22:52 AM
So I threw out the 1987 American and got myself a 1973 German.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/cca6e97a-835e-4c83-883f-fb62db135a0f-jpeg.831154/)
(open in a new window for larger pic)

Thorens TD 125 Mk. II with SME Series II Improved arm (fixed HS version), and for the time being a rather worn Denon DL-304 cartridge. The console/plinth is original teak veneer but it has been deep cleaned and oiled, stiffened inside with 21 mm Baltic birch plywood, and put on some fat sorbothane feet. I have retained the original bottom plate and feet, so it can be put back to original looks. Corian arm board, a brand new electronics control board that swaps 16 2/3 rpm for 78, and a Denon DL-301II are on order.

Celebrated with an expensive pressing of Richters reworked rework of Vivaldi. I think I like this new one better than the first one.

I like the clean lines of your Thorens preferring it to the famous 124. Similar to the Garrard 301 - 401 there is little difference, if any, in performance. I have never owned a Denon DL-304 which in the vinyl fraternity is unusual. I am surprised your SME 3009 Improved can handle a moving coil cartridge, my (detachable headshell) could not. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 08, 2022, 07:08:51 AM
Dvorak 3rd Symphony.

Reading posts on GMG quite often one sticks in the old memory bank. Only a couple of weeks ago, forgive me I didn't note the member's name, made the point that it does not make sense that the Dvorak early symphonies are not held in the esteem of the later although every bit as good. My repeated playing of the 3rd confirms this. A symphony musical to it's fingertips!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on July 08, 2022, 08:53:48 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 08, 2022, 06:57:01 AM
I like the clean lines of your Thorens preferring it to the famous 124. Similar to the Garrard 301 - 401 there is little difference, if any, in performance. I have never owned a Denon DL-304 which in the vinyl fraternity is unusual. I am surprised your SME 3009 Improved can handle a moving coil cartridge, my (detachable headshell) could not.
The DL-304 (if you can find one anymore) and the DL-301II are reportedly doing fine in the Improved, and I can attest to that for the 304. Both are quite high compliant (14 @100 Hz, say 23 @10 Hz), and tracking 90 um at 1,2 g. So pretty soft and not too much energy to the arm. I am going to cheat and soft mount it with an Origin Live Cartridge Enabler to see if there is a chance to calm it down a wee bit more. If not I'll have to bite the bullet: Ortofon 2M Black or the unsung, cheaper and just as good Super OM40. Other options could be a Soundsmith tipped Grace or a Soundsmith. We'll see. I'd have to get another phono amp for Grace and Soundsmith. My MM is fixed at 40 dB gain and 150 pF load, perfect for Ortofons but not much else.

The TD 125 superseded the TD124 Mk. II. I love the looks of this simple straight sided plinth. I've thought that Tandberg must have used the same designer for their receivers at the time, e.g. the TR2075 (https://www.google.com/search?q=tr2075&rlz=1C1GCEU_noNO820NO820&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjev5fw3en4AhVyQ_EDHTzKDjIQ_AUoAnoECAEQBA&biw=1920&bih=937&dpr=1). It's also a better, quieter turntable than the 124. Get a TD125 Mk. II before people find out how good it is and prices soar. Mechanically it's just about indestructible. I'm of course on the lookout for a J-shaped SME with detachable headshell.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/54614a17-624c-490b-9d9e-12292c79e3ad-jpeg.828875/)

This pic shows what's done to the plinth/cabinet. The glued birch ply along the sides support the original chassis mounting blocks, and the  large corner braces are screwed on. Fat sorbothane feet. I've given it a new mains cable since this shot.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/598fb6d5-2d2b-4a37-b307-b7689c953b77-jpeg.829889/)

I like the optics a lot. A domestic machine.

- Finally they've made a machine that's useful.
(Robert Redford in Out of Africa, presenting a gramophone playing Mozart as a gift to  Meryl Streep.)

Making a note on the virtues of early Dvorak symphonies. Thanks.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 11, 2022, 02:56:27 AM
Quote from: Valentino on July 08, 2022, 08:53:48 AM
The DL-304 (if you can find one anymore) and the DL-301II are reportedly doing fine in the Improved, and I can attest to that for the 304. Both are quite high compliant (14 @100 Hz, say 23 @10 Hz), and tracking 90 um at 1,2 g. So pretty soft and not too much energy to the arm. I am going to cheat and soft mount it with an Origin Live Cartridge Enabler to see if there is a chance to calm it down a wee bit more. If not I'll have to bite the bullet: Ortofon 2M Black or the unsung, cheaper and just as good Super OM40. Other options could be a Soundsmith tipped Grace or a Soundsmith. We'll see. I'd have to get another phono amp for Grace and Soundsmith. My MM is fixed at 40 dB gain and 150 pF load, perfect for Ortofons but not much else.

The TD 125 superseded the TD124 Mk. II. I love the looks of this simple straight sided plinth. I've thought that Tandberg must have used the same designer for their receivers at the time, e.g. the TR2075 (https://www.google.com/search?q=tr2075&rlz=1C1GCEU_noNO820NO820&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjev5fw3en4AhVyQ_EDHTzKDjIQ_AUoAnoECAEQBA&biw=1920&bih=937&dpr=1). It's also a better, quieter turntable than the 124. Get a TD125 Mk. II before people find out how good it is and prices soar. Mechanically it's just about indestructible. I'm of course on the lookout for a J-shaped SME with detachable headshell.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/54614a17-624c-490b-9d9e-12292c79e3ad-jpeg.828875/)

This pic shows what's done to the plinth/cabinet. The glued birch ply along the sides support the original chassis mounting blocks, and the  large corner braces are screwed on. Fat sorbothane feet. I've given it a new mains cable since this shot.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/598fb6d5-2d2b-4a37-b307-b7689c953b77-jpeg.829889/)

I like the optics a lot. A domestic machine.

- Finally they've made a machine that's useful.
(Robert Redford in Out of Africa, presenting a gramophone playing Mozart as a gift to  Meryl Streep.)

Making a note on the virtues of early Dvorak symphonies. Thanks.

I guess the versatility of Denon cartridges is what made them so popular. Tweakable too with a wooden body conversion available on eBay I recall. I have an Ortofon 2M Black but would not recommend as a purchase. Works a treat in my SME 3009 and the most detailed cartridge, MM or MC I have heard, but, and it is a big but, surface noise is also the most highlighted I have come across. Switching, I'm shocked at the increase.
I'm coming over as right old curmudgeon but I would not let Sorbothane  anywhere near my TT. I purchased four large pucks which under my Garrard killed the sound stone dead. Waste not, want not, I put them under my Tannoys and again poor results. You have gone to a lot of trouble making your table stiff, strong and firm to eliminate vibrations and then placing it on a wobbly base.

BTW. SME manufacture a stock part to add mass to their 3009 tonearms. I cannot vouch for it's effectiveness as not tried the tweak.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on July 11, 2022, 03:55:45 AM
I have a wobbly house... The idea is to swallow as much wobble as possible before it reaches a stiff cabinet that supports the sprung 10 kg of the TD 125. Your Garrard is a real old school 301/401? In that case very different, more like a TD 124.

Have seen body conversions of the DL-103 with variants, not the 300 series.

Have read other reports of high surface noise from the 2M Black. As of now I'll use the DL-301II with this Origin Live Cartridge Enabler and no rubber cushions on the SME base, and a Corian arm board.

As for the general killing of sound my stereo is full of such things. DSP, Class D, SMPS. Speakers on soft feet, and bitumen damped driver baskets.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 11, 2022, 04:51:50 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 08, 2022, 07:08:51 AM
Dvorak 3rd Symphony.

Reading posts on GMG quite often one sticks in the old memory bank. Only a couple of weeks ago, forgive me I didn't note the member's name, made the point that it does not make sense that the Dvorak early symphonies are not held in the esteem of the later although every bit as good. My repeated playing of the 3rd confirms this. A symphony musical to it's fingertips!

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=88545;image)


I agree wholeheartedly with all of that and I would also dare to suggest that Kertesz helps quite a lot in this regard here. He is one conductor that I have long admired and appreciated.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 11, 2022, 06:18:32 AM
The Melodiya label is one that I like to explore.

Russian Sacred Choral Music [Arkhipova/Polyansky]


(https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/melimg/2015/03_03_15/ARKHI%201_resize.jpg)


I have always found Eastern European and Russian Orthodox sacred music to be wonderfully engaging and very emotionally meaningful and rewarding. When presented properly it can portray a deep sense of devotion. It is certainly presented in the best possible way on this recording. Irina Arkhipova has a wonderful voice and the USSR Ministry of Culture Chamber Choir is excellent.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 11, 2022, 06:21:28 AM
I came across this article recently while searching for something. To a seasoned collector all of this will be perfectly obvious. However, just in case there is someone lurking here who is starting a vinyl collection or augmenting one they just might glean some useful information from it.


Why You Should Double-Sleeve Your Record Collection
Davey Ferchow posted July 5, 2022

Accumulating, organising, and maintaining a record collection can be quite the investment, but if you're in it for the long haul, double-sleeving your records is the only way to go. Double-sleeving is the use of both protective inner and outer record sleeves. Inner sleeves house your vinyl and easily slide inside your record covers. Outer sleeves slide over your record jackets and protect all the contents within.

Companies like Music Record Shop produce various types of inner and outer sleeves that help protect your collection. Using both types of sleeves is an inexpensive and simple way to make sure your records always look and sound great. Below, you'll learn more about the ways these slim plastic wonders can make a world of difference.


Double-Sleeving Prevents Unnecessary Wear to Your Vinyl:

Outer sleeves may seem like a no-brainer, but inner sleeves are also essential if you're looking to keep your vinyl in pristine condition. Without inner sleeves, your records could suffer from scuffs and scratches as you slide them in and out of their jackets. Most new records come with a paper inner sleeve and these are better than having no sleeve at all. However, if you are looking to take an additional step to prevent scuffs, you may want to upgrade to a poly-lined paper sleeve or an anti-static plastic sleeve.

Inner and Outer Sleeves Keep Dust from Getting in Grooves:

In addition to scratches and other blemishes, dust can have a negative impact on the way your records sound. If you use inner and outer sleeves, you have two lines of defence as dust tries to infiltrate your record collection. If you're looking to take things a step further, a classic 3mil sleeve or extra thick 4mil sleeve will provide you with additional peace of mind.

Record Jackets Are Best Protected with Both Types of Sleeves:

Outer sleeves obviously protect your record jackets, but inner sleeves also help. The edges of your records can cause wear and tear and may eventually cause seam splits if you play your records a lot or move often. Housing your vinyl in inner sleeves will provide an additional layer of protection for your record covers.

Inner and Outer Sleeves Provide More Storage Options:

If your vinyl is protected by inner sleeves, it opens up another storage possibility. Instead of keeping every record inside its jacket, you can store your records outside of their jackets, but inside their plastic outer sleeves. This allows you to quickly access your vinyl and helps keep your record covers from developing ring wear. This is also a great option if you are planning a big move and want to make sure your record covers don't get damaged in transit.

Records Retain Value When You Double-Sleeve:

Taking care of your records provides a better listening experience and, visually, few things are as pleasing to the eye as a near-mint record. You can derive a great sense of pride from a clean record collection, and double sleeving is one of the most efficient ways to maintain your vinyl's current grading. If you ever find yourself in a pinch, you know you can sell your double-sleeved records at prices that prove your passion was actually a wise investment. This is also a great point to raise if you are trying to justify your collecting habits to significant others or family members.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 11, 2022, 07:04:48 AM
Quote from: aligreto on July 11, 2022, 06:18:32 AM
The Melodiya label is one that I like to explore.

Russian Sacred Choral Music [Arkhipova/Polyansky]


(https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/melimg/2015/03_03_15/ARKHI%201_resize.jpg)


I have always found Eastern European and Russian Orthodox sacred music to be wonderfully engaging and very emotionally meaningful and rewarding. When presented properly it can portray a deep sense of devotion. It is certainly presented in the best possible way on this recording. Irina Arkhipova has a wonderful voice and the USSR Ministry of Culture Chamber Choir is excellent.

On a guided tour of St Petersburg our group were shuffled into a church. Not having a religious bone in my body I was not expecting much. We were directed to sit down on benches and a small male choir walked out in front of our group. They sung a cappella and it was the most beautiful sounds I have heard in my life. Never to be forgotten.

Quote from: aligreto on July 11, 2022, 06:21:28 AM
I came across this article recently while searching for something. To a seasoned collector all of this will be perfectly obvious. However, just in case there is someone lurking here who is starting a vinyl collection or augmenting one they just might glean some useful information from it.


Why You Should Double-Sleeve Your Record Collection
Davey Ferchow posted July 5, 2022

Accumulating, organising, and maintaining a record collection can be quite the investment, but if you're in it for the long haul, double-sleeving your records is the only way to go. Double-sleeving is the use of both protective inner and outer record sleeves. Inner sleeves house your vinyl and easily slide inside your record covers. Outer sleeves slide over your record jackets and protect all the contents within.

Companies like Music Record Shop produce various types of inner and outer sleeves that help protect your collection. Using both types of sleeves is an inexpensive and simple way to make sure your records always look and sound great. Below, you'll learn more about the ways these slim plastic wonders can make a world of difference.


Double-Sleeving Prevents Unnecessary Wear to Your Vinyl:

Outer sleeves may seem like a no-brainer, but inner sleeves are also essential if you're looking to keep your vinyl in pristine condition. Without inner sleeves, your records could suffer from scuffs and scratches as you slide them in and out of their jackets. Most new records come with a paper inner sleeve and these are better than having no sleeve at all. However, if you are looking to take an additional step to prevent scuffs, you may want to upgrade to a poly-lined paper sleeve or an anti-static plastic sleeve.

Inner and Outer Sleeves Keep Dust from Getting in Grooves:

In addition to scratches and other blemishes, dust can have a negative impact on the way your records sound. If you use inner and outer sleeves, you have two lines of defence as dust tries to infiltrate your record collection. If you're looking to take things a step further, a classic 3mil sleeve or extra thick 4mil sleeve will provide you with additional peace of mind.

Record Jackets Are Best Protected with Both Types of Sleeves:

Outer sleeves obviously protect your record jackets, but inner sleeves also help. The edges of your records can cause wear and tear and may eventually cause seam splits if you play your records a lot or move often. Housing your vinyl in inner sleeves will provide an additional layer of protection for your record covers.

Inner and Outer Sleeves Provide More Storage Options:

If your vinyl is protected by inner sleeves, it opens up another storage possibility. Instead of keeping every record inside its jacket, you can store your records outside of their jackets, but inside their plastic outer sleeves. This allows you to quickly access your vinyl and helps keep your record covers from developing ring wear. This is also a great option if you are planning a big move and want to make sure your record covers don't get damaged in transit.

Records Retain Value When You Double-Sleeve:

Taking care of your records provides a better listening experience and, visually, few things are as pleasing to the eye as a near-mint record. You can derive a great sense of pride from a clean record collection, and double sleeving is one of the most efficient ways to maintain your vinyl's current grading. If you ever find yourself in a pinch, you know you can sell your double-sleeved records at prices that prove your passion was actually a wise investment. This is also a great point to raise if you are trying to justify your collecting habits to significant others or family members.




All sensible, Fergus. I use Covers 33 which I have found to be a reliable Company.

https://www.covers33.co.uk/ 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 11, 2022, 09:25:19 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 11, 2022, 07:04:48 AM

All sensible, Fergus. I use Covers 33 which I have found to be a reliable Company.

https://www.covers33.co.uk/

Thank you for that link. I will investigate it later.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 12, 2022, 05:52:52 AM
Spinning

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 12, 2022, 06:20:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 12, 2022, 05:52:52 AM
Spinning

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=88659;image)


I have not heard Klemperer M7.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 13, 2022, 12:12:30 AM
Quote from: aligreto on July 12, 2022, 06:20:16 AM
I have not heard Klemperer M7.

A tad controversial reading I believe, but as always Klemperer is a law to himself.

Spinning
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 13, 2022, 03:17:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 13, 2022, 12:12:30 AM
A tad controversial reading I believe, but as always Klemperer is a law to himself.


Perhaps a good enough reason in itself to get a listen to it  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 13, 2022, 07:05:28 AM
Quote from: aligreto on July 13, 2022, 03:17:05 AM
Perhaps a good enough reason in itself to get a listen to it  ;D

Spot on. Have you heard his Berlioz's Symphonic Fantastique? Not a type of work to associate with old Klemps but in fact very good.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 14, 2022, 04:44:00 AM
Song of the Birds and other pieces


(https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/133686707839_/Song-of-the-Birds-etc-Pablo-Casals.jpg)


This is a pleasant selection of works played by Pablo Casals. The accompaniment ranges from full orchestra to piano.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 14, 2022, 04:44:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 13, 2022, 07:05:28 AM
Have you heard his Berlioz's Symphonic Fantastique? Not a type of work to associate with old Klemps but in fact very good.

I have not. Another one to add to the list!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 14, 2022, 11:56:44 PM
Quote from: aligreto on July 14, 2022, 04:44:00 AM
Song of the Birds and other pieces


(https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/133686707839_/Song-of-the-Birds-etc-Pablo-Casals.jpg)


This is a pleasant selection of works played by Pablo Casals. The accompaniment ranges from full orchestra to piano.

Iconic cover image of Casals complete with trilby in hand.

Spinning

Another evocative cover.

(https://i.imgur.com/6jZ5CiR.jpg)

E. J. and Peers enjoying a view from what is likely to be Hergest Ridge.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 15, 2022, 03:14:53 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 14, 2022, 11:56:44 PM

(https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/133686707839_/Song-of-the-Birds-etc-Pablo-Casals.jpg)

Iconic cover image of Casals complete with trilby in hand.


Yes it is. Here is a better reproduction of it for those who may not be familiar with it


(https://i.discogs.com/Q674r3oSaiFVVk-hca8tQzDSduhtEfNHqod_kVze4Oo/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:596/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTc0MTg5/MzctMTQ0NDIzNTc1/My00ODY1LmpwZWc.jpeg)


Interestingly, here is another shot most likely from the same photoshoot


(https://images.fineartamerica.com/images/artworkimages/mediumlarge/2/pablo-casals-tom-hollyman.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 15, 2022, 03:15:54 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 14, 2022, 11:56:44 PM

Another evocative cover.

(https://i.imgur.com/6jZ5CiR.jpg)

E. J. and Peers enjoying a view from what is likely to be Hergest Ridge.

Yes, I do like that one also. Quite atmospheric!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 15, 2022, 04:40:15 AM
Four Concertos of the Neapolitan School


(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81isQj75HYL._AC_SX679_.jpg)


From another series that I would like to collect more of.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 15, 2022, 07:42:43 AM
Quote from: aligreto on July 15, 2022, 04:40:15 AM
Four Concertos of the Neapolitan School


(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81isQj75HYL._AC_SX679_.jpg)


From another series that I would like to collect more of.

Fascinating history behind L'Oiseau-Lyre.   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89ditions_de_l%27Oiseau-Lyre

Edit: There is a story not included in the Wiki page that Hanson-Dyer produced cash from her handbag to pay musicians off after a recording session. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 15, 2022, 08:25:54 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 14, 2022, 11:56:44 PM
Iconic cover image of Casals complete with trilby in hand.

Spinning

Another evocative cover.

(https://i.imgur.com/6jZ5CiR.jpg)

E. J. and Peers enjoying a view from what is likely to be Hergest Ridge.
Despite the less than perfect playing that recording is easily the most moving of Moeran's Cello Concerto.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 15, 2022, 08:41:34 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 15, 2022, 07:42:43 AM
Fascinating history behind L'Oiseau-Lyre.   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89ditions_de_l%27Oiseau-Lyre

Edit: There is a story not included in the Wiki page that Hanson-Dyer produced cash from her handbag to pay musicians off after a recording session.

Thank you for the link.
The history is indeed interesting particularly the association with names such as Moroney, Gilbert and Hogwood.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 16, 2022, 02:10:33 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 15, 2022, 08:25:54 AM
Despite the less than perfect playing that recording is easily the most moving of Moeran's Cello Concerto.

Agreed. The middle movement never fails to bring a lump to my throat.

Spinning

(https://i.imgur.com/0grAYLw.jpg)

An interesting twosome. I liked both works although not detecting any similarities. The symphony is late Romanticism but never cloying in fact quite sinewy. Beautiful slow movement.
The Violin Concerto is altogether softer and gentler. Full of good tunes but again never saccharine. I was reminded of Walton's concerto in the first movement. As Alwyn when listening to Korngold I do not feel I'm listening to a composer of films. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on July 23, 2022, 06:05:24 AM
Local shop's got their own T-shirt, so I bought one; Vinyl & Kaffe, Hamar.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/d1ae6e04-b65e-4155-9996-d94bf7b32ec8-jpeg.835095/)

R. Strauss/Arabella. Keilberth.
Karajan LvB 60's set in the 1970 box.
Janacek Sinfonietta and Taras Bulba with Ancerl (on Turnabout, I guess some Supraphon licence)
Bartok/Bluebeard. Fricsay
Mahler/Knaben Wunderhorn.  Schwarzkopf/FiDi/Szell. My first EMI Angel I think.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on July 23, 2022, 06:15:45 AM
Quote from: Valentino on July 23, 2022, 06:05:24 AM
Local shop's got their own T-shirt; Vinyl & Kaffe, Hamar.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/d1ae6e04-b65e-4155-9996-d94bf7b32ec8-jpeg.835095/)

The ones that are difficult to read:
Karajan LvB 60's set in the 1970 box.
Janacek Sinfonietta and Taras Bulba with Ancerl (on Turnabout, I guess some Supraphon licence)

Ha, I had to read your post twice; here in Copenhagen we also have a shop/cafe called "Sort Kaffe & Vinyl" ("Black Coffee and Vinyl").
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2022, 09:09:48 AM
Quote from: aligreto on June 28, 2022, 02:17:24 PM
Ivan Moravec: Live


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/~jYAAOSwuDBfpo-B/s-l1600.jpg)


Excellent and passionate playing from Moravec.


Supraphon was always a label that I admired for the interesting and engaging music and musicians which they issued.
Yep!  On both accounts.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 24, 2022, 09:11:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 29, 2022, 02:26:58 AM
PD where are you? (watching tennis I expect). She is a big Moravec fan.
Still alive and kicking!  And guilty on both accounts....though I have been trying to tame/keep up with garden [In vain, but still trying.].

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on July 24, 2022, 09:14:16 AM
Good to see you back  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: premont on July 24, 2022, 01:26:19 PM
Quote from: MusicTurner on July 24, 2022, 09:14:16 AM
Good to see you back  :)

+1
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 25, 2022, 02:02:27 AM
Thanks!  :)

Need to hit the garden now before it gets hot...

PD

p.s.  I need a summertime stereo setup; tubes are too hot!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 25, 2022, 02:25:21 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on July 24, 2022, 09:14:16 AM
Good to see you back  :)

Definitely.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 25, 2022, 07:41:59 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 25, 2022, 02:25:21 AM
Definitely.
:) ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 27, 2022, 06:22:11 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/ODWVXfg.jpg)

Vol.1 (4 LPs)
Also Sprach Zarathustra.
Don Juan.
Alpine Symphony.
Le Bourgeois Gentilhomme
Schlagobers
Metamorphosen
Macbeth.

Vol.2 (3 LPs)
Ein Heldenleben.
Don Quixote with Paul Tortelier.
Rosenkavalier Waltzes.
Death and Transfiguration.
Couperin Suite.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 27, 2022, 07:33:42 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 27, 2022, 06:22:11 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/ODWVXfg.jpg)

Vol.1 (4 LPs)
Also Sprach Zarathustra.
Don Juan.
Alpine Symphony.
Le Bourgeois Gentilhomme
Schlagobers
Metamorphosen
Macbeth.

Vol.2 (3 LPs)
Ein Heldenleben.
Don Quixote with Paul Tortelier.
Rosenkavalier Waltzes.
Death and Transfiguration.
Couperin Suite.

Unfortunately I only have Vol. 1 on the original vinyl.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 27, 2022, 11:09:38 PM
Quote from: aligreto on July 27, 2022, 07:33:42 AM
Unfortunately I only have Vol. 1 on the original vinyl.

That is the one to have. I only had 2 and been on the lookout for 1 for some time. A work I enjoy very much from 2 is the Couperin Suite.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on July 28, 2022, 04:59:37 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 27, 2022, 11:09:38 PM
That is the one to have. I only had 2 and been on the lookout for 1 for some time. A work I enjoy very much from 2 is the Couperin Suite.

Cheers, Lol. I have significant amounts of his music on CD but, being something of a completionist, there are certain things that one would like to have on vinyl.  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 29, 2022, 03:02:40 AM
Quote from: aligreto on July 28, 2022, 04:59:37 AM
Cheers, Lol. I have significant amounts of his music on CD but, being something of a completionist, there are certain things that one would like to have on vinyl.  :)

Finding time to play (some) is my problem, Fergus.

I like EMI's mid-price Greensleeve label. A recent find is a compilation of Holst recordings stretching from 1958 to 1984, unusually a mix of orchestral and choral works. Steuart Bedford conducting ECO in Brook Green Suite was a new one for me, an excellent rendition. As a young man I worked in Brook Green so the work has a special relevance. But the piece that knocked me sideways is Psalm 86. with Imogen conducting again the ECO. I'm no authority of the voice but love the sound of Ian Partridge, a voice akin to brushed velvet. If ever a work proves less is more then Psalm 86 is it. The simplicity is magnificent.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 31, 2022, 10:51:08 PM
Quote from: Irons on July 29, 2022, 03:02:40 AM
Finding time to play (some) is my problem, Fergus.

I like EMI's mid-price Greensleeve label. A recent find is a compilation of Holst recordings stretching from 1958 to 1984, unusually a mix of orchestral and choral works. Steuart Bedford conducting ECO in Brook Green Suite was a new one for me, an excellent rendition. As a young man I worked in Brook Green so the work has a special relevance. But the piece that knocked me sideways is Psalm 86. with Imogen conducting again the ECO. I'm no authority of the voice but love the sound of Ian Partridge, a voice akin to brushed velvet. If ever a work proves less is more then Psalm 86 is it. The simplicity is magnificent.
Another nostalgia trip - that was a very fine release Lol.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 01, 2022, 06:49:20 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 31, 2022, 10:51:08 PM
Another nostalgia trip - that was a very fine release Lol.

Yes Jeffrey a good-un. I have Sargent's Beni Mora on a Concert Classics release. Steuart Bedford in Holst is a first.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 03, 2022, 04:55:03 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 01, 2022, 06:49:20 AM
Yes Jeffrey a good-un. I have Sargent's Beni Mora on a Concert Classics release. Steuart Bedford in Holst is a first.
This one I guess Lol, although I never owned it myself. Concert Classics were a source of some great discoveries for me such as Walton's 1st Symphony (Sargent) and Miaskovsky's Cello Concerto (Rostropovich/Sargent). I really liked the Walton LP sleeve design image:

(//)
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 03, 2022, 06:42:57 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 03, 2022, 04:55:03 AM
This one I guess Lol, although I never owned it myself. Concert Classics were a source of some great discoveries for me such as Walton's 1st Symphony (Sargent) and Miaskovsky's Cello Concerto (Rostropovich/Sargent). I really liked the Walton LP sleeve design image:


(//)

You guessed correctly, Jeffrey. A record I like a lot. Lots of repertoire on Concert Classics which is more mainstream then a later sister label, Greensleeve. But interesting releases too, including the classic Miaskovsky Cello Concerto and my favourite recording of my favourite Bloch work.

(https://i.imgur.com/Zz3SJxt.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 03, 2022, 10:08:23 PM
Quote from: Irons on August 03, 2022, 06:42:57 AM
You guessed correctly, Jeffrey. A record I like a lot. Lots of repertoire on Concert Classics which is more mainstream then a later sister label, Greensleeve. But interesting releases too, including the classic Miaskovsky Cello Concerto and my favourite recording of my favourite Bloch work.

(https://i.imgur.com/Zz3SJxt.jpg)
On second thoughts Lol I think that I did own the Beni Mora CD. Holst wrote some very fine proto-minimalist works like Beni Mora and parts of The Cloud Messenger. That is a great performance of Bloch's VC, which I have on CD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 04, 2022, 03:25:33 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 03, 2022, 10:08:23 PM
On second thoughts Lol I think that I did own the Beni Mora CD. Holst wrote some very fine proto-minimalist works like Beni Mora and parts of The Cloud Messenger. That is a great performance of Bloch's VC, which I have on CD.

Out of interest Jeffrey I looked up Sargent's Holst discography. I have him with "The Perfect Fool" but a mono recording. Also St. Paul's Suite and The Hymn of Jesus are listed and not forgetting you know what! :D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 04, 2022, 08:53:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 04, 2022, 03:25:33 AM
Out of interest Jeffrey I looked up Sargent's Holst discography. I have him with "The Perfect Fool" but a mono recording. Also St. Paul's Suite and The Hymn of Jesus are listed and not forgetting you know what! :D
Interesting Lol. His CFP Planets was one of the best. He was underrated as a conductor. I know no better Sibelius Symphony No.5 (BBC SO) which I think has a unique atmosphere. I prefer his Walton Symphony No.1 to the much more highly regarded Previn/LSO version and I say this as a great admirer of André Previn.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 04, 2022, 01:01:54 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 04, 2022, 08:53:11 AM
Interesting Lol. His CFP Planets was one of the best. He was underrated as a conductor. I know no better Sibelius Symphony No.5 (BBC SO) which I think has a unique atmosphere. I prefer his Walton Symphony No.1 to the much more highly regarded Previn/LSO version and I say this as a great admirer of André Previn.

Sargent hit the bullseye with Walton 1. The pacing, the way he builds tension at the opening has the tingle factor. We are blessed to have Previn too, but like you I prefer Sir Malcom.
Another recording deserves mention. I have heard a ton of Elgar's "Enigma" but Sargant's recording C/W RVW Fantasia again on Concert Classics is and always has been my first choice. If I recall correctly Jeffrey I have on my shelves a LP of Sargent conducting Sibelius Tone Poems. Must dig it out.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 05, 2022, 04:25:59 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 04, 2022, 01:01:54 PM
Sargent hit the bullseye with Walton 1. The pacing, the way he builds tension at the opening has the tingle factor. We are blessed to have Previn too, but like you I prefer Sir Malcom.
Another recording deserves mention. I have heard a ton of Elgar's "Enigma" but Sargant's recording C/W RVW Fantasia again on Concert Classics is and always has been my first choice. If I recall correctly Jeffrey I have on my shelves a LP of Sargent conducting Sibelius Tone Poems. Must dig it out.
I agree Lol - that was a fine recording of both works:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 05, 2022, 07:41:43 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 05, 2022, 04:25:59 AM
I agree Lol - that was a fine recording of both works:
(//)

Any idea of the cover view, Jeffrey? No mention in the cover notes. Surrey Hills is my guess.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 05, 2022, 02:59:59 PM
Quote from: Irons on August 05, 2022, 07:41:43 AM
Any idea of the cover view, Jeffrey? No mention in the cover notes. Surrey Hills is my guess.
Not sure Lol - looks a bit Worcester-ish?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 06, 2022, 02:33:52 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on August 06, 2022, 12:42:01 AM
Looks quite Malvern-y to me!
The Elgar association, I expect.

The Elgar link makes sense but is it hilly enough for Malvern?

Below a view from Box Hill.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 06, 2022, 02:43:03 AM
Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/VIGafkp.jpg)

Holst: Japanese Dance.

Ceremonial Dance
Dance of the Marionette
Interlude-Song of the Fisherman
Dance under the Cherry Tree
Finale-Dance of the Wolves
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 06, 2022, 09:43:19 PM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on August 06, 2022, 04:29:26 AM
I take your point, but below is the view from St Wulstan's Church in Little Malvern, on the eastern edge of the Malvern Hills, where Sir Edward Elgar is buried. I think it looks a pretty good fit, hill-shape-wise.

Edited to add: I've now flipped the original photo I posted... and I think it's an exact match for the LP cover! I think we're looking across Colwall.

I enjoy the occasional geo-location game!
That looks right to me - great piece of detective work!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 07, 2022, 01:01:58 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on August 06, 2022, 04:29:26 AM
I take your point, but below is the view from St Wulstan's Church in Little Malvern, on the eastern edge of the Malvern Hills, where Sir Edward Elgar is buried. I think it looks a pretty good fit, hill-shape-wise.

Edited to add: I've now flipped the original photo I posted... and I think it's an exact match for the LP cover! I think we're looking across Colwall.

I enjoy the occasional geo-location game!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 07, 2022, 01:11:57 AM
Well done Bach!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 07, 2022, 01:43:26 AM
Yes, an interesting little bit of detective work above!  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 13, 2022, 01:42:48 AM
Not so long ago I would not touch digital recordings on LP with a barge pole. For two reasons, one being historically they will be early digital which I found to be unpleasant and secondly, if digital then surely CD is the preferable format. My analysis in practice has proved to be wrong. Time and time again digital LPs I have found produce excellent sound, the latest example a Classics for Pleasure LP of Handley conducting Delius. Hearing it here  https://youtu.be/5mCwIQAhtX8  I ordered a copy.

(https://i.imgur.com/nea3ey2.jpg)

Outstanding sound which is an important consideration for Delius. Handley proves to be an excellent conductor for this composer. A purchase I am most pleased with.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 16, 2022, 03:00:56 AM
Spinning.

Schubert: Death and the Maiden String Quartet.

Recorded 1955.

(https://i.imgur.com/qqeUwDX.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 16, 2022, 03:21:34 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 16, 2022, 03:00:56 AM
Spinning.

Schubert: Death and the Maiden String Quartet.

Recorded 1955.

(https://i.imgur.com/qqeUwDX.jpg)

I like the slightly macabre artwork on that cover.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 16, 2022, 06:11:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 16, 2022, 03:00:56 AM
Spinning.

Schubert: Death and the Maiden String Quartet.

Recorded 1955.

(https://i.imgur.com/qqeUwDX.jpg)
I hadn't heard of that quartet before now Irons.  Interesting history!  How did you like the recording?

Quote from: aligreto on August 16, 2022, 03:21:34 AM
I like the slightly macabre artwork on that cover.
"slightly"?!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 16, 2022, 07:18:02 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 16, 2022, 06:11:20 AM

"slightly"?!

PD

>:D  >:D  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 16, 2022, 07:38:44 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 16, 2022, 03:21:34 AM
I like the slightly macabre artwork on that cover.

I like it, as if death is creeping up on the maiden.

Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 16, 2022, 06:11:20 AM
I hadn't heard of that quartet before now Irons.  Interesting history!  How did you like the recording?


PD

Hi PD. Trust you are keeping well and good to see you back. The Koeckert Quartet has featured a few times in the last couple of days in the What are you listening 2 now? thread which inspired me to give this a spin. The recording is dry but for chamber works I don't mind that. As for the performance, inspired.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 16, 2022, 07:48:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 16, 2022, 07:38:44 AM
I like it, as if death is creeping up on the maiden.

Hi PD. Trust you are keeping well and good to see you back. The Koeckert Quartet has featured a few times in the last couple of days in the What are you listening 2 now? thread which inspired me to give this a spin. The recording is dry but for chamber works I don't mind that. As for the performance, inspired.
Thanks!

Trying to get yard work done and keeping up with veggie/herb garden (plus getting some other things done) is keeping me busy.

Well, I'll have to make a mental note re the name of this quartet and keep an eye out for their recordings.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 18, 2022, 06:23:16 AM
Spinning: More Schubert.

(https://i.imgur.com/fdXCosR.jpg)

As always with Quartetto Italiano playing that is beautifully executed but not the last word in rhythmic energy. The first movement seemed long (repeats?) but never outstayed it's welcome. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 19, 2022, 04:51:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 18, 2022, 06:23:16 AM
Spinning: More Schubert.

(https://i.imgur.com/fdXCosR.jpg)

As always with Quartetto Italiano playing that is beautifully executed but not the last word in rhythmic energy. The first movement seemed long (repeats?) but never outstayed it's welcome.
On a hot summer's night, did you have some sherbet with your Schubert?

I'll run away now!   :D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 19, 2022, 05:51:38 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 19, 2022, 04:51:36 AM
On a hot summer's night, did you have some sherbet with your Schubert?

I'll run away now!   :D

PD

Back with you to your veggies PD  $:)  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 19, 2022, 06:46:14 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 19, 2022, 05:51:38 AM
Back with you to your veggies PD  $:)  ;D

I'm not so sure. PD is a honorary Brit but is she up with cockney slang?  And yes I did have a sherbet while listening to my Schubert in the form of a finger of Bells whisky. Can't handle more because keeps me up all night! ::)   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 19, 2022, 07:41:50 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 19, 2022, 06:46:14 AM
PD is a honorary Brit but is she up with cockney slang?   

An innate or very acquired skill indeed.  :)



QuoteAnd yes I did have a sherbet while listening to my Schubert in the form of a finger of Bells whisky. Can't handle more because keeps me up all night! ::)


May I humbly suggest more practice to hone your art  ;)  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 19, 2022, 09:23:20 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 19, 2022, 06:46:14 AM
I'm not so sure. PD is a honorary Brit but is she up with cockney slang?  And yes I did have a sherbet while listening to my Schubert in the form of a finger of Bells whisky. Can't handle more because keeps me up all night! ::)
I just found out what a *sherbet dab is and that sherbet can also mean an alcoholic drink in both Britain and in Australia, so I inadvertently hit the nail on the head (though I was thinking of the frozen dessert at the time)!  :laugh: :)

And I'm done with the garden for the moment (too hot out now)...perhaps a bit more around sunset?  ;D

*So, do people wave and yell "Oh, dabbie!" when they need a cab?  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 20, 2022, 12:22:25 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on August 19, 2022, 10:06:58 AM
When I were a lad, a sherbet dab was what you see here:

(https://img2.thejournal.ie/article/2795972/river/?height=400&version=2796021)

I don't remember the 'dip' bit of the name, and that's why my car soft-toy mascot is known as plain Herbert Dab. :)

The sherbet frosting on the confectionery effect is presumably why certain varieties of marijuana are also known as sherbet dabs.

(https://www.marijuanaseeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/Sherbert-Dab-min-3.jpg)

It is apparently now Cockney Rhyming slang for 'taxi cab', but I think that's fairly new (1990s, I think). I'm more used to it being a "Smash and Grab" or a "Flounder and Dab".

Sherbet always was a refreshing drink, of course, courtesy of the Persians, though they might more properly call it a Sharbat. Perhaps that's why it got associated with alcoholic drinks in the UK (and, by extension, Australia)?

I have not heard the taxi connection before. Brought up in the East End of London a sherbet was always a boozy drink. I was quite puzzled when PD used the word - how on earth? :D As can be the case with cockney slang I had no idea of the origin which is apparently Sherbet dip = sip.

Current listening.

(https://i.imgur.com/5LZkzMF.jpg)

First recording and in my book may as well be the last.

Coincidently Rostropovich's recordings of both Shostakovich's cello concertos are with American orchestras. The 2nd is my all time favourite DSCH recording.

(https://i.imgur.com/t58qXf6.jpg)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 20, 2022, 02:54:49 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on August 19, 2022, 10:06:58 AM
When I were a lad, a sherbet dab was what you see here:

(https://img2.thejournal.ie/article/2795972/river/?height=400&version=2796021)

I don't remember the 'dip' bit of the name, and that's why my car soft-toy mascot is known as plain Herbert Dab. :)

The sherbet frosting on the confectionery effect is presumably why certain varieties of marijuana are also known as sherbet dabs.

(https://www.marijuanaseeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/Sherbert-Dab-min-3.jpg)

It is apparently now Cockney Rhyming slang for 'taxi cab', but I think that's fairly new (1990s, I think). I'm more used to it being a "Smash and Grab" or a "Flounder and Dab".

Sherbet always was a refreshing drink, of course, courtesy of the Persians, though they might more properly call it a Sharbat. Perhaps that's why it got associated with alcoholic drinks in the UK (and, by extension, Australia)?
Quite interesting how we have such different childhood memories of what sherbet was/is.  :)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 20, 2022, 02:56:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 20, 2022, 12:22:25 AM
I have not heard the taxi connection before. Brought up in the East End of London a sherbet was always a boozy drink. I was quite puzzled when PD used the word - how on earth? :D As can be the case with cockney slang I had no idea of the origin which is apparently Sherbet dip = sip.

Current listening.

(https://i.imgur.com/5LZkzMF.jpg)

First recording and in my book may as well be the last.

Coincidently Rostropovich's recordings of both Shostakovich's cello concertos are with American orchestras. The 2nd is my all time favourite DSCH recording.

(https://i.imgur.com/t58qXf6.jpg)
I love that No. 1 recording; don't recall having heard the No. 2 though with Ozawa...will have to do some double-checking (digging) in a bit.  Off to work in garden for a bit.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: staxomega on August 21, 2022, 03:48:07 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 16, 2022, 03:21:34 AM
I like the slightly macabre artwork on that cover.

Death and the Maiden often had great art to go with it :)

Quote from: Irons on August 18, 2022, 06:23:16 AM
Spinning: More Schubert.

(https://i.imgur.com/fdXCosR.jpg)

As always with Quartetto Italiano playing that is beautifully executed but not the last word in rhythmic energy. The first movement seemed long (repeats?) but never outstayed it's welcome.

I've had the Italians in my heavy rotation with the Warner box that came out a couple of years ago. Very addicting, some nights where I want to hear just one more performance then before I know it's into the early AM.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 22, 2022, 03:20:53 AM
Quote from: hvbias on August 21, 2022, 03:48:07 AM
Death and the Maiden often had great art to go with it :)

I've had the Italians in my heavy rotation with the Warner box that came out a couple of years ago. Very addicting, some nights where I want to hear just one more performance then before I know it's into the early AM.

Addictive. :)

Skeletons do often feature with Schubert's masterpiece.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 04:31:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 22, 2022, 03:20:53 AM
Addictive. :)

Skeletons do often feature with Schubert's masterpiece.


(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=90193;image)



I find that top one much more disconcerting


(https://i.imgur.com/qqeUwDX.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 05:48:22 AM
I gave these two a spin earlier today:


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/yrwAAOSwuppgAg~a/s-l500.jpg)   


(https://merchbar.imgix.net/product/vinylized/upc/61/8808678161106.jpg?quality=60&auto=compress,format&w=1280&h=1280)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Papy Oli on August 22, 2022, 06:02:21 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 05:48:22 AM
I gave these two a sin earlier today:

:o   :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 07:34:54 AM
Quote from: Papy Oli on August 22, 2022, 06:02:21 AM
:o   :laugh:

:laugh:  :laugh:

I blame paint and white spirit fumes for that one  ::)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Papy Oli on August 22, 2022, 07:40:09 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 07:34:54 AM
:laugh:  :laugh:

I blame paint and white spirit fumes for that one  ::)

I shall not be tempted into a "stripper" joke, no Sir...  :blank:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 07:41:46 AM
Quote from: Papy Oli on August 22, 2022, 07:40:09 AM
I shall not be tempted into a "stripper" joke, no Sir...  :blank:

:laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 22, 2022, 07:42:05 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 05:48:22 AM
I gave these two a sin earlier today:


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/yrwAAOSwuppgAg~a/s-l500.jpg)   


(https://merchbar.imgix.net/product/vinylized/upc/61/8808678161106.jpg?quality=60&auto=compress,format&w=1280&h=1280)

When you posted the Turnabout issue on main thread I thought it familiar so probably vinyl. Introduction and Allegro one of my favourite pieces. An interesting LP, thanks for posting.

Unlike Turnabout I have not come across the Fournier release on my travels. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 01:25:47 PM
Quote from: Irons on August 22, 2022, 07:42:05 AM
When you posted the Turnabout issue on main thread I thought it familiar so probably vinyl. Introduction and Allegro one of my favourite pieces. An interesting LP, thanks for posting.


That is a fine album with some really wonderful music on it. Most enjoyable altogether.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on August 22, 2022, 10:11:23 PM
I just noted that this new release (of an old Teldec recording) is LP only AFAIK.
The 6th was generally considered the highlight of Andrew Davis's cycle:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 23, 2022, 07:21:44 AM
Quote from: aligreto on August 22, 2022, 01:25:47 PM
That is a fine album with some really wonderful music on it. Most enjoyable altogether.

Thanks. Although not in the slightest connection with vinyl I thought this may of interest to you, Fergus.

http://landofllostcontent.blogspot.com/2022/08/the-fair-hills-of-eire-irish-airs-and.html
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 23, 2022, 07:27:55 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 22, 2022, 10:11:23 PM
I just noted that this new release (of an old Teldec recording) is LP only AFAIK.
The 6th was generally considered the highlight of Andrew Davis's cycle:
(//)

Warner releasing LP's! I picked up a CD from Andrew Davis's cycle, I can't remember which one and being underwhelmed, Jeffrey.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 23, 2022, 07:30:23 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on August 22, 2022, 10:11:23 PM
I just noted that this new release (of an old Teldec recording) is LP only AFAIK.
The 6th was generally considered the highlight of Andrew Davis's cycle:
(//)

Quote from: Irons on August 23, 2022, 07:27:55 AM
Warner releasing LP's! I picked up a CD from Andrew Davis's cycle, I can't remember which one and being underwhelmed, Jeffrey.
I found a listing for it here....ouch!

https://www.vinyl.com.au/tasmin-bbc-symp-little-vaughan-williams-the-lark-a

PD

EDIT:  Don't know what the exchange rate of Australian dollars is to US or British pounds, but I suspect that it might be better here (and closer for many of you in terms of ordering):  https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/products/9364711--vaughan-williams-the-lark-ascending
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 24, 2022, 12:03:59 AM
For a new LP £34 is not too bad. Production costs for short runs are high.

Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/GavsqSN.jpg)

Good sound but evocation of Spain in Nights in the Gardens of Spain are minimal. Saint-Saens PC No.2 is much better. Cover art very 1970's flower power.

(https://i.imgur.com/FkaQhne.jpg)

The final of K 331 "Alla Turca" always makes me think of the Keystone Cops!

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on August 24, 2022, 01:17:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 23, 2022, 07:21:44 AM
Thanks. Although not in the slightest connection with vinyl I thought this may of interest to you, Fergus.

http://landofllostcontent.blogspot.com/2022/08/the-fair-hills-of-eire-irish-airs-and.html

Thank you for that Lol. I will have a look at it soon.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 24, 2022, 06:06:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 24, 2022, 12:03:59 AM
For a new LP £34 is not too bad. Production costs for short runs are high.

Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/GavsqSN.jpg)

Good sound but evocation of Spain in Nights in the Gardens of Spain are minimal. Saint-Saens PC No.2 is much better. Cover art very 1970's flower power.

(https://i.imgur.com/FkaQhne.jpg)

The final of K 331 "Alla Turca" always makes me think of the Keystone Cops!
Yes, and actually it's for a 2-LP set.  The Australian price (even with conversion) was quite high for a new LP.

I like how the artist created the woman's head out of the background (negative space?) and the flowing water from what I think is a fountain.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 24, 2022, 06:37:02 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 24, 2022, 06:06:14 AM
Yes, and actually it's for a 2-LP set.  The Australian price (even with conversion) was quite high for a new LP.

I like how the artist created the woman's head out of the background (negative space?) and the flowing water from what I think is a fountain.

PD

The artist is Frederic Marvin. Another example of his work -
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 24, 2022, 09:49:57 AM
Thanks!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 31, 2022, 12:31:48 AM
Prokofiev: The Prodigal Son.

(https://i.imgur.com/LpsqhPj.jpg)

A test pressing which turn up every so often.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Wanderer on August 31, 2022, 03:57:34 AM
Out of nowhere, these LP's came recently into my possession the usual unfortunate way (someone - a friend's relative - died). They seem to be in mint condition. Many are Melodiya issues (with Russian-only texts) and apparently they were bought directly from the source, during trips behind the Iron Curtain. Unfortunately, my turntable has been out of commission for years, so it may be some time before any of this gets played.

Rachmaninov: Piano Concerto No. 4 & Prokofiev: Piano Concerto No. 3 (Petrov/Moscow Radio Large[?] Symphony Orchestra/Rozhdestvensky) - Melodiya

*ALL IN RUSSIAN* (State Russian Choir/Sveshnikov) - Melodiya

Bellini: Norma (Callas/Corelli/Ludwig/Zaccaria/de Palma/Vincenzi/Teatro alla Scala/Serafin) - EMI Columbia (a handsome boxset)

Beethoven: Piano Sonatas Opp. 13, 27/2 & 57 (Serebryakov) - Melodiya

Haydn: Symphony No. 104 & Beethoven: Symphony No. 8 (?? Orchestra/Markevitch) - Melodiya

Haydn: Symphonies Nos. 88 & 100 (Hungarian State Orchestra/Adam Fischer) - Hungaroton

Beethoven: Piano Concerto No. 4 (Gilels/Cleveland Symphony Orchestra/Szell) - Melodiya

Dvořák: Violin Concerto & Romance, Op. 11 (Suk/Czech Philharmonic Orchestra/Ančerl) - Supraphon

"The Bells of the Alexander Nevski Memorial Church" and other music for a cappella choir by Hristov, Chesnokov & Bortnyanski ("S. Obretenov" Bulgarian A Cappella Choir et al.) - Balkanton

Beethoven: Violin Concerto (Kogan/USSR Radio Symphony Orchestra/Svetlanov) - Melodiya

An 8-LP collection of Tchaikovsky - another handsome boxset {Piano Concerto No. 1 with Wild/RPO/Fistoulari, Violin Concerto with Perlman/LSO/Wallenstein, Symphony No. 5 with the New Philharmonia Orchestra/Horenstein, Symphony No. 6 with the London Festival Orchestra/Gibson, Suites from The Nutcracker (New Symphony Orchestra of London/Boult), Swan Lake (New Symphony Orchestra of London/Boult) and The Sleeping Beauty (RPO/Gamley), Francesca da Rimini (RPO/Münch) and other paraphernalia (Capriccio Italien, Romeo & Juliet Overture, the ubiquitous 1812 Overture, Marche Slave, Waltz & Polonaise from Eugene Onegin and a few more bits and pieces)}
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 31, 2022, 09:44:59 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 31, 2022, 12:31:48 AM
Prokofiev: The Prodigal Son.

(https://i.imgur.com/LpsqhPj.jpg)

A test pressing which turn up every so often.
Pretty cool find there Irons!  :)

Any idea looking at the notations on the label as to where in the lineup this pressing fell?

Quote from: Wanderer on August 31, 2022, 03:57:34 AM
Out of nowhere, these LP's came recently into my possession the usual unfortunate way (someone - a friend's relative - died). They seem to be in mint condition. Many are Melodiya issues (with Russian-only texts) and apparently they were bought directly from the source, during trips behind the Iron Curtain. Unfortunately, my turntable has been out of commission for years, so it may be some time before any of this gets played.

Rachmaninov: Piano Concerto No. 4 & Prokofiev: Piano Concerto No. 3 (Petrov/Moscow Radio Large[?] Symphony Orchestra/Rozhdestvensky) - Melodiya

*ALL IN RUSSIAN* (State Russian Choir/Sveshnikov) - Melodiya

Bellini: Norma (Callas/Corelli/Ludwig/Zaccaria/de Palma/Vincenzi/Teatro alla Scala/Serafin) - EMI Columbia (a handsome boxset)

Beethoven: Piano Sonatas Opp. 13, 27/2 & 57 (Serebryakov) - Melodiya

Haydn: Symphony No. 104 & Beethoven: Symphony No. 8 (?? Orchestra/Markevitch) - Melodiya

Haydn: Symphonies Nos. 88 & 100 (Hungarian State Orchestra/Adam Fischer) - Hungaroton

Beethoven: Piano Concerto No. 4 (Cleveland Symphony Orchestra/Szell) - Melodiya

Dvořák: Violin Concerto & Romance, Op. 11 (Suk/Czech Philharmonic Orchestra/Ančerl) - Supraphon

"The Bells of the Alexander Nevski Memorial Church" and other music for a cappella choir by Hristov, Chesnokov & Bortnyanski ("S. Obretenov" Bulgarian A Cappella Choir et al.) - Balkanton

Beethoven: Violin Concerto (Kogan/USSR Radio Symphony Orchestra/Svetlanov) - Melodiya

An 8-LP collection of Tchaikovsky - another handsome boxset {Piano Concerto No. 1 with Wild/RPO/Fistoulari, Violin Concerto with Perlman/LSO/Wallenstein, Symphony No. 5 with the New Philharmonia Orchestra/Horenstein, Symphony No. 6 with the London Festival Orchestra/Gibson, Suites from The Nutcracker (New Symphony Orchestra of London/Boult), Swan Lake (New Symphony Orchestra of London/Boult) and The Sleeping Beauty (RPO/Gamley), Francesca da Rimini (RPO/Münch) and other paraphernalia (Capriccio Italien, Romeo & Juliet Overture, the ubiquitous 1812 Overture, Marche Slave, Waltz & Polonaise from Eugene Onegin and a few more bits and pieces)}
Wow!  I'm sorry (first of all) to hear of your friend's loss.

That was quite a nice gift that he/she gave to you.  I hope that this incentivizes you to get your TT fixed and soon.

Perhaps when you do get it fixed, you can invite your friend over for a drink/coffee/meal and listen to some of them together?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on August 31, 2022, 12:35:48 PM
That's both sad and wonderful, Wanderer. PD has two very good ideas there.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 22, 2022, 10:11:23 PM
I just noted that this new release (of an old Teldec recording) is LP only AFAIK.
The 6th was generally considered the highlight of Andrew Davis's cycle:
Thanks for the tip. Put it on order at imusic.dk. They say release date is 23 September.

On the technical side I've replaced the original electronics board of my 49 years old Thorens TD 125 Mk. II with a modern one that swaps 16 2/3 for 78 rpm. I have on order an Alfred Bokrand AS-230 tone arm to replace the SME 3009 Improved. The Bokrand is medium heavy. It can balance an Ortofon SPU and tame a Denon DL-103. And I'm going to get a cartridge for 78s for fun.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Wanderer on September 02, 2022, 09:10:58 AM
Quote from: Valentino on August 31, 2022, 12:35:48 PM
That's both sad and wonderful, Wanderer. PD has two very good ideas there.

Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 31, 2022, 09:44:59 AM
Wow!  I'm sorry (first of all) to hear of your friend's loss.

That was quite a nice gift that he/she gave to you.  I hope that this incentivizes you to get your TT fixed and soon.

Perhaps when you do get it fixed, you can invite your friend over for a drink/coffee/meal and listen to some of them together?

Thank you, both.

They are very close friends. I'm sure they partly intended these as an (unneeded) thank you for legal advice regarding the inheritance (unfortunately, the deceased left things needlessly complicated for the heirs). They also know I listen to classical music (they don't, despite my so far efforts) and probably thought who better to get the "classical stuff" off their hands. Regardless, next time they visit, they will be amply wined and dined. Greek style!

Refurbishing/fixing the old TT has always been at the back of my mind. Maybe even getting a new one eventually. I'll be sure to ask the knowledgeable people here for tips when the time comes. 😎

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on September 03, 2022, 12:52:36 AM
Quote from: Valentino on August 31, 2022, 12:35:48 PM
That's both sad and wonderful, Wanderer. PD has two very good ideas there.
Thanks for the tip. Put it on order at imusic.dk. They say release date is 23 September.

On the technical side I've replaced the original electronics board of my 49 years old Thorens TD 125 Mk. II with a modern one that swaps 16 2/3 for 78 rpm. I have on order an Alfred Bokrand AS-230 tone arm to replace the SME 3009 Improved. The Bokrand is medium heavy. It can balance an Ortofon SPU and tame a Denon DL-103. And I'm going to get a cartridge for 78s for fun.
I'd be interested to know what you think of the VW LP when it appears.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 05, 2022, 01:20:36 AM
Quote from: Wanderer on August 31, 2022, 03:57:34 AM
Out of nowhere, these LP's came recently into my possession the usual unfortunate way (someone - a friend's relative - died). They seem to be in mint condition. Many are Melodiya issues (with Russian-only texts) and apparently they were bought directly from the source, during trips behind the Iron Curtain. Unfortunately, my turntable has been out of commission for years, so it may be some time before any of this gets played.

Rachmaninov: Piano Concerto No. 4 & Prokofiev: Piano Concerto No. 3 (Petrov/Moscow Radio Large[?] Symphony Orchestra/Rozhdestvensky) - Melodiya

*ALL IN RUSSIAN* (State Russian Choir/Sveshnikov) - Melodiya

Bellini: Norma (Callas/Corelli/Ludwig/Zaccaria/de Palma/Vincenzi/Teatro alla Scala/Serafin) - EMI Columbia (a handsome boxset)

Beethoven: Piano Sonatas Opp. 13, 27/2 & 57 (Serebryakov) - Melodiya

Haydn: Symphony No. 104 & Beethoven: Symphony No. 8 (?? Orchestra/Markevitch) - Melodiya

Haydn: Symphonies Nos. 88 & 100 (Hungarian State Orchestra/Adam Fischer) - Hungaroton

Beethoven: Piano Concerto No. 4 (Gilels/Cleveland Symphony Orchestra/Szell) - Melodiya

Dvořák: Violin Concerto & Romance, Op. 11 (Suk/Czech Philharmonic Orchestra/Ančerl) - Supraphon

"The Bells of the Alexander Nevski Memorial Church" and other music for a cappella choir by Hristov, Chesnokov & Bortnyanski ("S. Obretenov" Bulgarian A Cappella Choir et al.) - Balkanton

Beethoven: Violin Concerto (Kogan/USSR Radio Symphony Orchestra/Svetlanov) - Melodiya

An 8-LP collection of Tchaikovsky - another handsome boxset {Piano Concerto No. 1 with Wild/RPO/Fistoulari, Violin Concerto with Perlman/LSO/Wallenstein, Symphony No. 5 with the New Philharmonia Orchestra/Horenstein, Symphony No. 6 with the London Festival Orchestra/Gibson, Suites from The Nutcracker (New Symphony Orchestra of London/Boult), Swan Lake (New Symphony Orchestra of London/Boult) and The Sleeping Beauty (RPO/Gamley), Francesca da Rimini (RPO/Münch) and other paraphernalia (Capriccio Italien, Romeo & Juliet Overture, the ubiquitous 1812 Overture, Marche Slave, Waltz & Polonaise from Eugene Onegin and a few more bits and pieces)}

Not the best of circumstances for the receipt of such a thank you gift. Best of luck with refurbishing/fixing the old TT if you decide to go that way. It may be worth it just to hear those recordings.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on September 05, 2022, 05:00:37 AM
I certainly shall, vandermolen.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 06, 2022, 02:53:08 AM
Bach: 2nd Partita.

Interestingly, I have just noticed the cover notes are by Claude Helffer. In French so no idea what they say. :-[
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on September 06, 2022, 09:02:54 AM
Quote from: Valentino on September 05, 2022, 05:00:37 AM
I certainly shall, vandermolen.
:)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 06, 2022, 10:30:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 06, 2022, 02:53:08 AM
Bach: 2nd Partita.

Interestingly, I have just noticed the cover notes are by Claude Helffer. In French so no idea what they say. :-[
I found the liner notes for a Columbia release (Marketed for the English-speaking countries?) here, but they are different I suspect than yours as I just found out that Claude Helffer was a student of RC.  For what it's worth, here's a link to the Columbia ones (on eBay):  https://www.ebay.com/itm/273238703248

*ML5446

Perhaps if you posted another picture, but this time of the back cover/liner notes, I or others here could help figure it out for you?  :)  I'd be happy to try in any event.

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 06, 2022, 11:02:27 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 06, 2022, 10:30:04 AM
I found the liner notes for a Columbia release (Marketed for the English-speaking countries?) here, but they are different I suspect than yours as I just found out that Claude Helffer was a student of RC.  For what it's worth, here's a link to the Columbia ones (on eBay):  https://www.ebay.com/itm/273238703248

*ML5446

Perhaps if you posted another picture, but this time of the back cover/liner notes, I or others here could help figure it out for you?  :)  I'd be happy to try in any event.

PD

Thanks PD. $75 is a "meaty" price, I paid 9 quid. I also have another release from the same series,  will post an image of that and liner notes from Bach in the morning. I was unaware Hellfer was a pupil of Casadesus.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 07, 2022, 05:48:35 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 06, 2022, 11:02:27 AM
Thanks PD. $75 is a "meaty" price, I paid 9 quid. I also have another release from the same series,  will post an image of that and liner notes from Bach in the morning. I was unaware Hellfer was a pupil of Casadesus.
Yeah, I thought that seemed like a crazy price (I don't know what others were selling it for); I just linked to it because there was a a photo showing the liner notes.

And, ah the power of googling!  How to become an instant expert (lol, no really, of course); I didn't recognize the name.  :-[  Looks like some works were dedicated to him and that he made some recordings (in addition to performing) too.  :)  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_Helffer

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 07, 2022, 12:55:07 PM
Cross posts from the Classical Music Listening Thread


Russian Rarities:


(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0657/8937/products/P1010615_59e02bc7-59ef-4829-8977-717fb7f632db_1024x1024.jpg?v=1658750223)


This album features the following works:

Gliere: Concerto for Harp and Orchestra Op. 74 This is a fine, substantial work and it is very well presented here.
Gliere: Concerto For Coloratura and Orchestra, Op. 82 This is, inherently, a fine work but, for me, it would have been better served by setting it to words. I am not a fan of vocalise in any genre.
Stravinsky: Pastorale This is, once again, a vocalise work. It is, inherently, a fine piece of music.
Cui: Ici Bas This is a short but atmospheric and dramatic song.
Gretchaninov: Lullaby I like this song and it is well presented here.



Toscanini:

(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0566/5105/5295/products/701025.jpg?v=1649341713)


The following works are features on this LP:

Brahms: Variations on a Theme by Haydn, Op. 56a This is a terrific performance despite sub standard sonics.
Rossini: Barber of Seville - Overture This is a very fine, animated performance of this Overture.
Mozart: Symphony No. 36 [Haffner] This is a sonically challenged but absolutely terrific presentation of this wonderful work.
Mendelssohn: Scherzo from "Midsummer Night's Dream" This is fast but wonderfully smooth and electrically charged.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 07, 2022, 05:07:39 PM
Quote from: aligreto on September 07, 2022, 12:55:07 PM
Cross posts from the Classical Music Listening Thread


Russian Rarities:


(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0657/8937/products/P1010615_59e02bc7-59ef-4829-8977-717fb7f632db_1024x1024.jpg?v=1658750223)


This album features the following works:

Gliere: Concerto for Harp and Orchestra Op. 74 This is a fine, substantial work and it is very well presented here.
Gliere: Concerto For Coloratura and Orchestra, Op. 82 This is, inherently, a fine work but, for me, it would have been better served by setting it to words. I am not a fan of vocalise in any genre.
Stravinsky: Pastorale This is, once again, a vocalise work. It is, inherently, a fine piece of music.
Cui: Ici Bas This is a short but atmospheric and dramatic song.
Gretchaninov: Lullaby I like this song and it is well presented here.



Toscanini:

(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0566/5105/5295/products/701025.jpg?v=1649341713)


The following works are features on this LP:

Brahms: Variations on a Theme by Haydn, Op. 56a This is a terrific performance despite sub standard sonics.
Rossini: Barber of Seville - Overture This is a very fine, animated performance of this Overture.
Mozart: Symphony No. 36 [Haffner] This is a sonically challenged but absolutely terrific presentation of this wonderful work.
Mendelssohn: Scherzo from "Midsummer Night's Dream" This is fast but wonderfully smooth and electrically charged.
Interesting.  I've never seen that album before.  How is Joan in that repertoire?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 08, 2022, 02:31:32 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 07, 2022, 05:48:35 AM
Yeah, I thought that seemed like a crazy price (I don't know what others were selling it for); I just linked to it because there was a a photo showing the liner notes.

And, ah the power of googling!  How to become an instant expert (lol, no really, of course); I didn't recognize the name.  :-[  Looks like some works were dedicated to him and that he made some recordings (in addition to performing) too.  :)  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_Helffer

PD

Claude Helffer made many recordings during the vinyl era. Strong on French composers but his repertoire spread far beyond that including Schoenberg.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 08, 2022, 02:32:59 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 07, 2022, 05:07:39 PM
Interesting.  I've never seen that album before.  How is Joan in that repertoire?

PD

Stepping up for hubby. :-*
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: ritter on September 08, 2022, 02:46:51 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 07, 2022, 05:48:35 AM

...
And, ah the power of googling!  How to become an instant expert (lol, no really, of course); I didn't recognize the name.  :-[  Looks like some works were dedicated to him and that he made some recordings (in addition to performing) too.  :)  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_Helffer

PD

Quote from: Irons on September 08, 2022, 02:31:32 AM
Claude Helffer made many recordings during the vinyl era. Strong on French composers but his repertoire spread far beyond that including Schoenberg.
Claude Helffer is one of my very favourite pianists ever. Very strong in 20th century (mainly French) repertoire, but for instance his Albéniz Iberia is top-notch (one of my preferred recordings of that work). Sadly. many of his recordings were either never transferred to CD or, if so, in limited pressings hat now are OOP and difficult to find.

It's barely legible on the cover Irons posted, but those Bartók and Prokofiev concertos are conducted by none other than Bruno Maderna!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 08, 2022, 05:30:19 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 08, 2022, 02:31:32 AM
Claude Helffer made many recordings during the vinyl era. Strong on French composers but his repertoire spread far beyond that including Schoenberg.
Thanks for the photo.  What label is that?  I'm having a hard time reading it....something Classique.

Quote from: ritter on September 08, 2022, 02:46:51 AM
Claude Helffer is one of my very favourite pianists ever. Very strong on 20th century (many French) repertoire, bit for Instance his Albéniz Iberia is top-notch (one of my preferred recordings of that work). Sadly. many of his recordings were either never transferred to CD or, if so, in limited pressings hat now are OOP and difficult to find.

It's barely legible on the cover Irons posted, but those Bartók and Prokofiev concertos are conducted y none other than Bruno Maderna!
Interesting!  I'll have to keep an eye out for them.  And yet another new-to-me name:  Bruno Maderna!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 08, 2022, 07:56:28 AM
Quote from: ritter on September 08, 2022, 02:46:51 AM
Claude Helffer is one of my very favourite pianists ever. Very strong in 20th century (mainly French) repertoire, but for instance his Albéniz Iberia is top-notch (one of my preferred recordings of that work). Sadly. many of his recordings were either never transferred to CD or, if so, in limited pressings hat now are OOP and difficult to find.

It's barely legible on the cover Irons posted, but those Bartók and Prokofiev concertos are conducted by none other than Bruno Maderna!

I was unaware that many Helffer's recordings unavailable on CD. A shame. I have a fair few but none sadly of Spanish repertoire. Below I have pulled two from my shelves.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 08, 2022, 08:02:59 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 08, 2022, 05:30:19 AM
Thanks for the photo.  What label is that?  I'm having a hard time reading it....something Classique.
Interesting!  I'll have to keep an eye out for them.  And yet another new-to-me name:  Bruno Maderna!

PD

Festival Classique a French label, obviously. I know next to nothing about them but think they were heavily into re-releases as an extensive catalogue of who's who in French artists.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 08, 2022, 08:27:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 08, 2022, 08:02:59 AM
Festival Classique a French label, obviously. I know next to nothing about them but think they were heavily into re-releases as an extensive catalogue of who's who in French artists.
I did a bit of looking on Discogs' website.  If accurate, your copy was released in 1977.  I see several listings of it from 1971 by Guilde International du Disque.

Guilde Internationale du Disque is the local French subsidiary of the Musical Masterpiece Society label, founded in 1953, operated mainly by correspondence, with the first subscription series in 1954, but also through a ~25 retail outlets in the country, with the last one closing in the early 80s.
Merged in 1986 with Edition Atlas.


I'm not seeing any other listings for those works on their website.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 09, 2022, 03:13:00 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 07, 2022, 05:07:39 PM
Interesting.  I've never seen that album before.  How is Joan in that repertoire?

PD

I am no expert, PD, but I found little to complain of.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 09, 2022, 03:20:23 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 08, 2022, 07:56:28 AM
I was unaware that many Helffer's recordings unavailable on CD. A shame. I have a fair few but none sadly of Spanish repertoire. Below I have pulled two from my shelves.

I have the Ravel LP box (Harmonia Mundi) and some contemporary stuff with Helffer, but never saw the Debussy set. Interesting. The Schoenberg can sometimes be seen here.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 09, 2022, 04:25:31 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 09, 2022, 03:20:23 AM
I have the Ravel LP box (Harmonia Mundi) and some contemporary stuff with Helffer, but never saw the Debussy set. Interesting. The Schoenberg can sometimes be seen here.
How do you like the Ravel MT?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 09, 2022, 10:04:54 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 09, 2022, 04:25:31 AM
yHow do you like the Ravel MT?

PD

Generally, I haven't found him extremely spectacular there; I did a check now of the Alborada (6:30), and even though it is quite light in the playing at times, it doesn't have the bouncing quality and superbly phrased, varied accents heard for example with Lipatti. There were some passages in the slower sections that became interesting, however; and the next piece of Miroirs, the Vallee des Cloches (5:24), also had more atmosphere. The set has a whole pamphlet on Ravel's piano works, 14 pages and several chapters, dealing with different aspects, written in French by Helffer himself, in 1970. I can provide a copy, if someone is interested. As regards how to play Ravel, Helffer uses a lot of the common words - a certain objectivity in the style, clock-mechanisms, yet also detailed, requested expressivity and pastiches of romanticism; but he doesn't really say anything radical.

However, overall, it's probably not in the top selection for me.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 09, 2022, 01:18:59 PM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 09, 2022, 10:04:54 AM
Generally, I haven't found him extremely spectacular there; I did a check now of the Alborado (6:30), and even though it is quite light in the playing at times, it doesn't have the bouncing quality and superbly phrased, varied accents heard for example with Lipatti. There were some passages in the slower sections that became interesting, however; and the next piece of Miroirs, the Vallee des Cloches (5:24), also had more atmosphere. The set has a whole pamphlet on Ravel's piano works, 14 pages and several chapters, dealing with different aspects, written in French by Helffer himself, in 1970. I can provide a copy, if someone is interested. As regards how to play Ravel, Helffer uses a lot of the common words - a certain objectivity in the style, clock-mechanisms, yet also detailed, requested expressivity and pastiches of romanticism; but he doesn't really say anything radical.

However, overall, it's probably not in the top selection for me.
Thank you for your detailed review!  That was very kind of you.  :)

I'll see whether or not I can find some samples on youtube....again, thanks.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 12, 2022, 03:16:03 AM
Spinning: Brahms.

(https://i.imgur.com/5KpkAxo.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/3xwMAjU.jpg)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 12, 2022, 03:44:42 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 12, 2022, 03:16:03 AM
Spinning: Brahms.

(https://i.imgur.com/5KpkAxo.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/3xwMAjU.jpg)
Those both look like yummy albums.  :)  How do you like the sound on the Philips one?  And guessing that it was pressed in the Netherlands?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 12, 2022, 08:32:53 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 12, 2022, 03:44:42 AM
Those both look like yummy albums.  :)  How do you like the sound on the Philips one?  And guessing that it was pressed in the Netherlands?

PD

Actually UK pressing PG (although the cover was printed in Holland). Numbered SAL 6500 137, I was under the impression for some time that SAL signifies a UK pressing but someone far more knowledgeable then me said SAL pressings can come out from Holland. Record companies never make it easy! As you can see the label clearly (not so clearly, rubbish photo!) states "Made in England" but more often then not no such information is given with this label. After years of handling Philips records I think I can accurately come up with the correct country of pressing without label informed.

I like Phillips sound very much, warm but detailed. Ideal for Brahms. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 12, 2022, 09:19:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 12, 2022, 08:32:53 AM
Actually UK pressing PG (although the cover was printed in Holland). Numbered SAL 6500 137, I was under the impression for some time that SAL signifies a UK pressing but someone far more knowledgeable then me said SAL pressings can come out from Holland. Record companies never make it easy! As you can see the label clearly (not so clearly, rubbish photo!) states "Made in England" but more often then not no such information is given with this label. After years of handling Philips records I think I can accurately come up with the correct country of pressing without label informed.

I like Phillips sound very much, warm but detailed. Ideal for Brahms.
Nice!  And thanks for the info.  :)

Managing to listen to some music (albeit not perfectly) whilst doing some KP duties.  Too much "stuff" in the kitchen!  That and doing things like washing off and spinning dry some lettuce that I had purchased yesterday; a huge and glorious head of lettuce.  Not certain of the exact variety, but it looks something like this:

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/da/06/e1/da06e14a3bede781e5341881ffe7f7c0.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 12, 2022, 10:59:23 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 12, 2022, 09:19:02 AM
Nice!  And thanks for the info.  :)

Managing to listen to some music (albeit not perfectly) whilst doing some KP duties.  Too much "stuff" in the kitchen!  That and doing things like washing off and spinning dry some lettuce that I had purchased yesterday; a huge and glorious head of lettuce.  Not certain of the exact variety, but it looks something like this:

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/da/06/e1/da06e14a3bede781e5341881ffe7f7c0.jpg)

PD

Salad for me too. Wife at an Elvis tribute concert and salad about as far my cookery skills take me!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 12, 2022, 11:02:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 12, 2022, 10:59:23 AM
Salad for me too. Wife at an Elvis tribute concert and salad about as far my cookery skills take me!
Enjoy!  And hope that she has a fun time!  :)

And I suspect, unlike mine, that everything in it will be from your own fine allotments.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 13, 2022, 05:52:52 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 12, 2022, 11:02:28 AM
Enjoy!  And hope that she has a fun time!  :)

And I suspect, unlike mine, that everything in it will be from your own fine allotments.

PD

She did. The show was of all places at Windsor! She could not get over the size of the castle. The carpet of floral tributes sent up a heady scent.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 13, 2022, 07:52:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 13, 2022, 05:52:52 AM
She did. The show was of all places at Windsor! She could not get over the size of the castle. The carpet of floral tributes sent up a heady scent.
Wow!

I've been wondering here as to whether or not anyone of our contributors here has or is planning to try and view the casket or any of various funeral or memorial events.  Perhaps will post this elsewhere.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 13, 2022, 11:38:20 PM
Spinning.

Beethoven: Trio No.6 "Archduke".

(https://i.imgur.com/RNX8RVt.jpg)

Intense music-making. Notes included details of the recording, all trios set down in long takes. 0p.70 No.2 recorded complete in one session.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 14, 2022, 01:39:34 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on September 13, 2022, 11:52:02 PM
Was going to try, but ultimately think that a 30 hour queue is a bit beyond my staying powers...
We remain ready to pounce on (say) Sunday night, should it be announced that the queue is shorter than anticipated.
I'm wondering whether or not emergency services will need to be called to assist people who experience health problems from/whilst waiting in line? 🙁

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 15, 2022, 11:47:20 PM
Bought these some days ago, for a very reasonable price, at an antiquarian sale.

The old LP with Danish piano music is very rare, I never saw it before, the cover is slightly damaged however.

Rarity also applies to the 2LP with 20th century lieder by Reimann, Bialas, Schoenberg, Britten, Dallapiccola etc., released by a German foundation, the Franz Wirth Stiftung. There isn't a label or record number on the cover, but the LPs say GEMA 2834-35.

Some of the fine CPE Bach flute concertos were released on Brilliant CDs, but this is the complete set.

A lot of the Neue Wiener Schule 4LP recordings I haven't heard, I only owned a download CD of the famous Schoenberg String Trio, and I've heard almost none of those Menuhin 4LP recordings. He tends to be uneven I think, but he also has character ...

The Shchedrin /Petrov was rather redundant, but I didn't have the Petrov work.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 16, 2022, 01:26:50 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 15, 2022, 11:47:20 PM
Bought these some days ago, for a very reasonable price, at an antiquarian sale.

The old LP with Danish piano music is very rare, I never saw it before, the cover is slightly damaged however.

The same applies to the 2LP with 20th century lieder by Reimann, Bialas, Schoenberg, Britten, Dallapiccola etc., released by a German foundation, the Franz Wirth Stiftung. There isn't a label or record number on the cover, but the LPs say GEMA 2834-35.

Some of the fine CPE Bach flute concertos were released on Brilliant CDs, but this is the complete set.

A lot of the Neue Wiener Schule 4LP recordings I haven't heard, I only owned a download CD of the famous Schoenberg String Trio, and I've heard almost none of those Menuhin 4LP recordings. He tends to be uneven I think, but he also has character ...

The Shchedrin /Petrov was rather redundant, but I didn't have the Petrov work.
Oh, how fun!  Was it an an auction or an estate sale?  I haven't been to either in a while, but they can be awfully fun poking around.  Years ago, I bought some old mono Pablo Casals 33's, alas when I brought them home and went to clean them, I couldn't get the smell of the mold out of the labels!  I used my Okki Nokki on the LPs, which worked well, but the labels still wreaked of it, so I ended up tossing them.

I hadn't heard of Franz Wirth before, so quickly googled and found this:  http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/179523.html

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 16, 2022, 01:33:54 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on September 13, 2022, 11:52:02 PM
Was going to try, but ultimately think that a 30 hour queue is a bit beyond my staying powers...
We remain ready to pounce on (say) Sunday night, should it be announced that the queue is shorter than anticipated.
Last I heard (yesterday I believe), the line waiting time was between 2-3 hours.  And, I just checked the official website...not looking so good (currently):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJxDwDzAwEs

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 01:44:33 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 16, 2022, 01:26:50 AM
Oh, how fun!  Was it an an auction or an estate sale?  I haven't been to either in a while, but they can be awfully fun poking around.  Years ago, I bought some old mono Pablo Casals 33's, alas when I brought them home and went to clean them, I couldn't get the smell of the mold out of the labels!  I used my Okki Nokki on the LPs, which worked well, but the labels still wreaked of it, so I ended up tossing them.

I hadn't heard of Franz Wirth before, so quickly googled and found this:  http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/179523.html

PD

Thanks for the Wirth piano maker information, that's completely new to me. Given that he belongs to around 1900 and the factory closed in 1929, the foundation must have supported quite a lot of projects during its existence, one would think.

The sales happen regularly in an old church hall in central Copenhagen, it's an antiqurian book seller and butterfly expert, likely more of a pensioner now, who buys up stuff and sells it about every 2 months or so, having rented the hall and selling according to what we call the 'Dutch principle', meaning that prices go down during the sale. The record and CD section is usually not that interesting, and stuff even tends to re-appear due to not being sold, but this time he seems to have gotten some interesting stuff ... the LP surfaces were fine. But especially the book sections tends to be good. He's married to a Chinese (Tibetan?) and had a butterfly species on Crete named after him, so an interesting fellow.

What are the LP buying options at your place then?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 16, 2022, 02:01:18 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 15, 2022, 11:47:20 PM
Bought these some days ago, for a very reasonable price, at an antiquarian sale.

The old LP with Danish piano music is very rare, I never saw it before, the cover is slightly damaged however.

Rarity also applies to the 2LP with 20th century lieder by Reimann, Bialas, Schoenberg, Britten, Dallapiccola etc., released by a German foundation, the Franz Wirth Stiftung. There isn't a label or record number on the cover, but the LPs say GEMA 2834-35.

Some of the fine CPE Bach flute concertos were released on Brilliant CDs, but this is the complete set.

A lot of the Neue Wiener Schule 4LP recordings I haven't heard, I only owned a download CD of the famous Schoenberg String Trio, and I've heard almost none of those Menuhin 4LP recordings. He tends to be uneven I think, but he also has character ...

The Shchedrin /Petrov was rather redundant, but I didn't have the Petrov work.

Is that Petrov the pianist?

The Menuhin box contains some excellent recordings from him. Bloch, Berkeley and Walton are outstanding.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 02:06:40 AM
Yes, by Menuhin I only had the Berkeley, am listening to the surprisingly early recording of the Lekeu sonata now (1938), the sound is more like in the 1940s ...

It's another Petrov, not very important: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrey_Petrov
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 16, 2022, 02:11:54 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 01:44:33 AM
Thanks for the Wirth piano maker information, that's completely new to me. Given that he belongs to around 1900 and closed in 1929, the foundation must have supported quite a lot of projects during its existence, one would think.

The sales happen regularly in an old church hall in central Copenhagen, it's an antiqurian book seller and butterfly expert, likely more of a pensioner now, who buys up stuff and sells it about every 2 months or so, having rented the hall and selling according to what we call the 'Ducth principle', meaning that prices go down during the sale. The record and CD section is usually not that interesting, and stuff even tends to re-appear due to not being sold, but this time he seems to have gotten some interesting stuff ... the LP surfaces were fine. But especially the book sections tends to be good. He's married to a Chinese (Tibetan?) and had a butterfly species on Crete named after him, so an interesting fellow.

What are the LP buying options at your place then?
He does sound like an interesting fellow!  There are some occasional ephemera shows in the area (sometimes including other things), sometimes estate sales or tag sales (tag as in yard sales).  Sometimes local books stores (used books) have LPs for sale; booksellers sometimes also have the opportunity to purchase LPs and/or other things from people wanting to either get rid of their collections (or a deceased relative's).  Kind of hit or miss.  Haven't visited a flea market in ages, so I don't know whether or not there are still any record vendors there.  As I'm sure that you have also discovered, LP condition is often lousy.  I used to also visit charity places like Salvation Army or Goodwill, but they seem to have turned into the dumping ground for collectors or record store owners/resellers--bringing their unwanted and/or damaged copies there for a tax write-off (or unwilling to pay for the cost to dispose of them themselves). 

Also, occasionally there are some record fairs in the area (small ones), but again, I haven't been to them in awhile.  I'm lucky in that there are a few stores around that sell LPs, but again, you have to be in a very patient mood and be willing to dig and examine them in good light.  Classical, alas, is often on the floor and/or in a hard-to-get-to bin!  Sigh....

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 16, 2022, 02:22:54 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 02:06:40 AM


It's another Petrov, not very important: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrey_Petrov

Thanks.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 02:28:06 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 16, 2022, 02:11:54 AM
He does sound like an interesting fellow!  There are some occasional ephemera shows in the area (sometimes including other things), sometimes estate sales or tag sales (tag as in yard sales).  Sometimes local books stores (used books) have LPs for sale; booksellers sometimes also have the opportunity to purchase LPs and/or other things from people wanting to either get rid of their collections (or a deceased relative's).  Kind of hit or miss.  Haven't visited a flea market in ages, so I don't know whether or not there are still any record vendors there.  As I'm sure that you have also discovered, LP condition is often lousy.  I used to also visit charity places like Salvation Army or Goodwill, but they seem to have turned into the dumping ground for collectors or record store owners/resellers--bringing their unwanted and/or damaged copies there for a tax write-off (or unwilling to pay for the cost to dispose of them themselves). 

Also, occasionally there are some record fairs in the area (small ones), but again, I haven't been to them in awhile.  I'm lucky in that there are a few stores around that sell LPs, but again, you have to be in a very patient mood and be willing to dig and examine them in good light.  Classical, alas, is often on the floor and/or in a hard-to-get-to bin!  Sigh....

PD

Well, that does seem to be quite a varied range, and pretty unpredictable as regards any future discoveries ... but I agree that especially at charity shops, they usually don't check the condition of LP surfaces enough, often with no qualified people around among the volunteer staff. I'm pretty sure that the selection in the US is quite different from the one here, since you'd see American labels and releases, maybe Canadian and Latin-South American ones too, that are extremely rare here - and vice versa. When seeing such stuff here in Denmark, it always results in looking one more time, to check it out a bit extra.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 16, 2022, 02:54:18 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 02:28:06 AM
Well, that does seem to be quite a varied range, and pretty unpredictable as regards any future discoveries ... but I agree that especially at charity shops, they usually don't check the condition of LP surfaces enough, often with no qualified people around among the volunteer staff. I'm pretty sure that the selection in the US is quite different from the one here, since you'd see American labels and releases, maybe Canadian and Latin-South American ones too, that are extremely rare here - and vice versa. When seeing such stuff here in Denmark, it always results in looking one more time, to check it out a bit extra.
I don't recall having seen any Latin-South American ones before.  Perhaps one might run across them in major cities?  A couple of times, I've run across a classical album manufactured in Canada or for the Canadian market.  I do run across (fairly often) records manufactured in the UK and once in a blue moon, ones made in France.  And there are situations, like with Decca, in which the covers were made in the US, but the records were made in England.  Then there are Dutch pressings on Philips (quite common).  Also, once in a blue moon, I'll run across albums pressed in Italy.

Personally, I'm envious of all of those lovely Decca and EMI pressings that folks like Irons keep running across!  :)  I suspect that you often run across BIS LPs?  Once in a blue moon, I'll come across some of them--but not often enough!  I want to get ahold of more of that Sibelius Edition!  :D  Which labels do you often come across MT?  Dacapo?  Others?  Do tell!  ;D

Oh, and I often run across German pressings too--fairly often anyway.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 09:46:27 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 16, 2022, 02:54:18 AM
I don't recall having seen any Latin-South American ones before.  Perhaps one might run across them in major cities?  A couple of times, I've run across a classical album manufactured in Canada or for the Canadian market.  I do run across (fairly often) records manufactured in the UK and once in a blue moon, ones made in France.  And there are situations, like with Decca, in which the covers were made in the US, but the records were made in England.  Then there are Dutch pressings on Philips (quite common).  Also, once in a blue moon, I'll run across albums pressed in Italy.

Personally, I'm envious of all of those lovely Decca and EMI pressings that folks like Irons keep running across!  :)  I suspect that you often run across BIS LPs?  Once in a blue moon, I'll come across some of them--but not often enough!  I want to get ahold of more of that Sibelius Edition!  :D  Which labels do you often come across MT?  Dacapo?  Others?  Do tell!  ;D

Oh, and I often run across German pressings too--fairly often anyway.

PD

There's a lot of stuff here, I'd rather mention some LP labels that I don't see that often, or rarely (there are some BIS at times, but they're not abundant):

European labels:
- Wergo (German)
- Deutscher Musikrat (German)
- Donemus Amsterdam (Dutch)
- Ensayo (Spanish)
- Amadeo (Austrian)
- Balkanton (Bulgarian)
- Jugoton (former Yugoslavia)
- Cybele, Accord, REM, Musidisc (French)
- Paula, Point, Wilhelm Hansen (Danish)
- Musique en Wallonie (Belgian)
- Caprice (Swedish)
- Simax (Norwegian)
- Lyrita (British)
- Chandos (British)
- Genesis
- Pearl (British)

Overseas/US labels:
- Louisville
- American Recording Society
- International Piano Archives
- United Artists Records
- Telarc
- New World Records
- Mercury, the stereo LPs
- CRI Composers Recordings
- Desto
- Orion
- World Record Club
- Arabesque
- Connoisseur Society
- Marco Polo

(I'm sure I forgot some :) )
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 16, 2022, 10:23:06 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 09:46:27 AM
There's a lot of stuff here, I'd rather mention some LP labels that I don't see that often, or rarely (there are some BIS at times, but they're not abundant):

European labels:
- Wergo (German)
- Deutscher Musikrat (German)
- Donemus Amsterdam (Dutch)
- Ensayo (Spanish)
- Amadeo (Austrian)
- Balkanton (Bulgarian)
- Jugoton (former Yugoslavia)
- Cybele, Accord, REM, Musidisc (French)
- Paula, Point, Wilhelm Hansen (Danish)
- Musique en Wallonie (Belgian)
- Caprice (Swedish)
- Simax (Norwegian)
- Lyrita (British)
- Chandos (British)
- Genesis
- Pearl (British)

Overseas/US labels:
- Louisville
- American Recording Society
- International Piano Archives
- United Artists Records
- Telarc
- New World Records
- Mercury, the stereo LPs
- CRI Composers Recordings
- Desto
- Orion
- World Record Club
- Arabesque
- Connoisseur Society
- Marco Polo

(I'm sure I forgot some :) )
Oh, boy, there are a bunch of labels that I've never heard of before!   ???  Like:  Orion, Desto, Louisville, Genesis, and others.

I do also sometimes stumble upon Lyrita and Chandos (the latter more frequently of the two).  Connoisseur Society--on occasion though with that label condition is everything!  Particularly in solo piano music.  Trying to find copies in good shape of Moravec's is a challenge!

Finlandia is another label that I'd love to get ahold of more of whether it's CD or LP.  I do have some CDs of theirs.

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 10:46:29 AM
Yes, for quite a few labels, CDs are easier to find nowadays, partly because of more stuff being released on CD, and better options of buying CDs on the internet, of course. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 17, 2022, 05:27:56 AM
Horslips: Drive The Cold Winter Away


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/QysAAOSwTb1iPKCF/s-l1600.jpg)


I was given a gift of this LP recently. It needs a bit of TLC but it has come to a good home.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 17, 2022, 05:29:36 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 13, 2022, 11:38:20 PM
Spinning.

Beethoven: Trio No.6 "Archduke".

(https://i.imgur.com/RNX8RVt.jpg)

Intense music-making. Notes included details of the recording, all trios set down in long takes. 0p.70 No.2 recorded complete in one session.

Du Pré was a Force of Nature!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 17, 2022, 05:31:19 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 15, 2022, 11:47:20 PM
Bought these some days ago, for a very reasonable price, at an antiquarian sale.

The old LP with Danish piano music is very rare, I never saw it before, the cover is slightly damaged however.

Rarity also applies to the 2LP with 20th century lieder by Reimann, Bialas, Schoenberg, Britten, Dallapiccola etc., released by a German foundation, the Franz Wirth Stiftung. There isn't a label or record number on the cover, but the LPs say GEMA 2834-35.

Some of the fine CPE Bach flute concertos were released on Brilliant CDs, but this is the complete set.

A lot of the Neue Wiener Schule 4LP recordings I haven't heard, I only owned a download CD of the famous Schoenberg String Trio, and I've heard almost none of those Menuhin 4LP recordings. He tends to be uneven I think, but he also has character ...

The Shchedrin /Petrov was rather redundant, but I didn't have the Petrov work.

(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28678.0;attach=91162;image)


Nice haul! I am sure that you will thoroughly enjoy them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 19, 2022, 12:20:53 AM
Quote from: MusicTurner on September 16, 2022, 09:46:27 AM
There's a lot of stuff here, I'd rather mention some LP labels that I don't see that often, or rarely (there are some BIS at times, but they're not abundant):

European labels:
- Wergo (German)
- Deutscher Musikrat (German)
- Donemus Amsterdam (Dutch)
- Ensayo (Spanish)
- Amadeo (Austrian)
- Balkanton (Bulgarian)
- Jugoton (former Yugoslavia)
- Cybele, Accord, REM, Musidisc (French)
- Paula, Point, Wilhelm Hansen (Danish)
- Musique en Wallonie (Belgian)
- Caprice (Swedish)
- Simax (Norwegian)
- Lyrita (British)
- Chandos (British)
- Genesis
- Pearl (British)

Overseas/US labels:
- Louisville
- American Recording Society
- International Piano Archives
- United Artists Records
- Telarc
- New World Records
- Mercury, the stereo LPs
- CRI Composers Recordings
- Desto
- Orion
- World Record Club
- Arabesque
- Connoisseur Society
- Marco Polo

(I'm sure I forgot some :) )

The only labels I'm not familiar with on your European list are Deutscher Musikrat, Donemus and Paula, Point, Wilhelm Hansen.

I picked up an Etcetera LP this weekend which I'm pretty excited about.

(https://i.imgur.com/kq66FW4.jpg)

I was convinced Etcetera a US label but think I must be confusing with a label of a similar name which specialised in Blues music.
This Hindemith LP released in 1983 includes the following information: The Etcetera Record Company, Keizergracht 518, 1017 EK, Amsterdam.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: MusicTurner on September 19, 2022, 01:35:27 AM
Yes, Etcetera is often very good stuff, and that one looks great. I also hope to find the Cage Sonatas & Interludes with Fremy one day, at a not too expensive price, for example - maybe the most attractive recording of those works (?), at least as I seem to remember it from bygone days.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on September 21, 2022, 01:21:27 AM
While waiting for the RVW I found Pablo Casals directing the Marlborough Festival Orchestra in Haydn Symphonies 94 (Bam!) and 95, used at the hefty price of NOK 20. Damn fine music making it is!
What I've also done is to put in a preorder for the refurbished Solti Ring. On 3+5+5+6 LPs. But why? Well, I like spinning black gold, and the packaging looks promising. The price is in a different league of course, but not significantly more than the hybrid SACD set.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 23, 2022, 12:38:34 AM
I have paid way too much for some LPs in the far-off days as a hard-nosed collector. Low budget is more fun. I shuddered with embarrassment on discovering when seeing the price sticker affixed to the inner-sleeve at £50! A fool and his money.........

(https://i.imgur.com/iVZM9TL.jpg)

Ticks all right boxes though being a first edition wide band with both record and cover being pristine.
More importantly I liked Honegger's 4th Symphony very much. Coincidently, "Deliciae Basilienses" is a work by a Swiss composer, conducted by a Swiss conductor, recorded in Geneva with a subject of another Swiss city, Basel.

Edit: and a Swiss orchestra.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 23, 2022, 01:30:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 23, 2022, 12:38:34 AM
I have paid way too much for some LPs in the far-off days as a hard-nosed collector. Low budget is more fun. I shuddered with embarrassment on discovering when seeing the price sticker affixed to the inner-sleeve at £50! A fool and his money.........

(https://i.imgur.com/iVZM9TL.jpg)

Ticks all right boxes though being a first edition wide band with both record and cover being pristine.
More importantly I liked Honegger's 4th Symphony very much. Coincidently, "Deliciae Basilienses" is a work by a Swiss composer, conducted by a Swiss conductor, recorded in Geneva with a subject of another Swiss city, Basel.

Edit: and a Swiss orchestra.

Swiss prices for a Swiss treat!  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on September 23, 2022, 05:16:28 AM
Quote from: aligreto on September 23, 2022, 01:30:47 AM
Swiss prices for a Swiss treat!  ;D
I remember ironically playing Honegger's charming and eloquent Symphony 'Delights of Basle' to myself after Switzerland beat England in a 1982 World Cup qualifying match (in Basle).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 23, 2022, 05:49:33 AM
Quote from: aligreto on September 23, 2022, 01:30:47 AM
Swiss prices for a Swiss treat!  ;D
Quote from: Irons on September 23, 2022, 12:38:34 AM
I have paid way too much for some LPs in the far-off days as a hard-nosed collector. Low budget is more fun. I shuddered with embarrassment on discovering when seeing the price sticker affixed to the inner-sleeve at £50! A fool and his money.........

(https://i.imgur.com/iVZM9TL.jpg)

Ticks all right boxes though being a first edition wide band with both record and cover being pristine.
More importantly I liked Honegger's 4th Symphony very much. Coincidently, "Deliciae Basilienses" is a work by a Swiss composer, conducted by a Swiss conductor, recorded in Geneva with a subject of another Swiss city, Basel.

Edit: and a Swiss orchestra.
Glad that you are enjoying it as that's what matters in the end.  :)  Perhaps treat yourself to some really good Swiss chocolate to accompany it?

Speaking of things Swiss, I'm currently catching bits of the Laver Cup going on for the next three days in London.  Roger's last match tonight (your time), so probably won't be getting in much music listening today.  That and trying to come up with some ways to use up my tomatoes and eggplants and peppers!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 23, 2022, 05:55:11 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on September 23, 2022, 05:16:28 AM
I remember ironically playing Honegger's charming and eloquent Symphony 'Delights of Basle' to myself after Switzerland beat England in a 1982 World Cup qualifying match (in Basle).

Something of a masochistic compensation on your part at the time, Jeffrey.  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 23, 2022, 07:09:14 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 23, 2022, 05:49:33 AM
Glad that you are enjoying it as that's what matters in the end.  :)  Perhaps treat yourself to some really good Swiss chocolate to accompany it?

Speaking of things Swiss, I'm currently catching bits of the Laver Cup going on for the next three days in London.  Roger's last match tonight (your time), so probably won't be getting in much music listening today.  That and trying to come up with some ways to use up my tomatoes and eggplants and peppers!

PD

It is the good lady of the house birthday today, PD. So no music, tennis or indeed Swiss chocolate tonight, but maybe a beer or two.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 23, 2022, 07:13:08 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on September 23, 2022, 05:16:28 AM
I remember ironically playing Honegger's charming and eloquent Symphony 'Delights of Basle' to myself after Switzerland beat England in a 1982 World Cup qualifying match (in Basle).

I don't remember that, Jeffrey. The cover image of Ansermet's recording is a nice shot of Basle. Looks a nice city.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 23, 2022, 07:42:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 23, 2022, 07:09:14 AM
It is the good lady of the house birthday today, PD. So no music, tennis or indeed Swiss chocolate tonight, but maybe a beer or two.
Please wish her a happy birthday from me and "the cat chat group".  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 24, 2022, 05:51:09 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 23, 2022, 07:42:28 AM
Please wish her a happy birthday from me and "the cat chat group".  ;)

PD

;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Wanderer on September 25, 2022, 05:40:31 AM
Quote from: Wanderer on August 31, 2022, 03:57:34 AM
Out of nowhere, these LP's came recently into my possession the usual unfortunate way (someone - a friend's relative - died). They seem to be in mint condition. Many are Melodiya issues (with Russian-only texts) and apparently they were bought directly from the source, during trips behind the Iron Curtain. Unfortunately, my turntable has been out of commission for years, so it may be some time before any of this gets played.

Rachmaninov: Piano Concerto No. 4 & Prokofiev: Piano Concerto No. 3 (Petrov/Moscow Radio Large[?] Symphony Orchestra/Rozhdestvensky) - Melodiya

*ALL IN RUSSIAN* (State Russian Choir/Sveshnikov) - Melodiya

Bellini: Norma (Callas/Corelli/Ludwig/Zaccaria/de Palma/Vincenzi/Teatro alla Scala/Serafin) - EMI Columbia (a handsome boxset)

Beethoven: Piano Sonatas Opp. 13, 27/2 & 57 (Serebryakov) - Melodiya

Haydn: Symphony No. 104 & Beethoven: Symphony No. 8 (?? Orchestra/Markevitch) - Melodiya

Haydn: Symphonies Nos. 88 & 100 (Hungarian State Orchestra/Adam Fischer) - Hungaroton

Beethoven: Piano Concerto No. 4 (Gilels/Cleveland Symphony Orchestra/Szell) - Melodiya

Dvořák: Violin Concerto & Romance, Op. 11 (Suk/Czech Philharmonic Orchestra/Ančerl) - Supraphon

"The Bells of the Alexander Nevski Memorial Church" and other music for a cappella choir by Hristov, Chesnokov & Bortnyanski ("S. Obretenov" Bulgarian A Cappella Choir et al.) - Balkanton

Beethoven: Violin Concerto (Kogan/USSR Radio Symphony Orchestra/Svetlanov) - Melodiya

An 8-LP collection of Tchaikovsky - another handsome boxset {Piano Concerto No. 1 with Wild/RPO/Fistoulari, Violin Concerto with Perlman/LSO/Wallenstein, Symphony No. 5 with the New Philharmonia Orchestra/Horenstein, Symphony No. 6 with the London Festival Orchestra/Gibson, Suites from The Nutcracker (New Symphony Orchestra of London/Boult), Swan Lake (New Symphony Orchestra of London/Boult) and The Sleeping Beauty (RPO/Gamley), Francesca da Rimini (RPO/Münch) and other paraphernalia (Capriccio Italien, Romeo & Juliet Overture, the ubiquitous 1812 Overture, Marche Slave, Waltz & Polonaise from Eugene Onegin and a few more bits and pieces)}

More from where these came from:

Beethoven: Piano Concerto No. 3 (Gilels/Moscow Radio Symphony Orchestra/Kondrashin) - Melodiya

Tchaikovsky: Piano Concerto No. 1 (Milena Mollova/Symphonic Orchestra of the Committee for Television & Radio/Vassil Stefanov) - Balkanton

Kodály: Psalmus Hungaricus & "The Peacock" - Variations on a Hungarian Folk Song (József Simándy/Budapest Chorus/Children's Chorus of the Hungarian Radio & Television/Hungarian State Orchestra/Antal Doráti) - Hungaroton

Tchaikovsky: Piano Concerto No. 1 (Richter/Wiener Symphoniker/Karajan) - Deutsche Grammophon

Beethoven: Symphony No. 3 (Berliner Philharmoniker/Karajan) - Deutsche Grammophon (11/1965)

Tchaikovsky: Capriccio Italien, Op. 45 - The Voyevoda, Op. 78 - Francesca da Rimini, Op. 32 (Russian State Symphony Orchestra/Konstantin Ivanov) - Melodiya

Mozart: Don Giovanni (Fischer-Dieskau/Kohn/Kreppel/Jurinac/E.Haefliger/Stader/Sardi/Seefried/RSO Berlin/RIAS-Kammerchor/Ferenc Fricsay) - Deutsche Grammophon Privilege (boxset with libretto - 😎)

Tchaikovsky: Swan Lake (Moscow Radio Large Symphony Orchestra/Rozhdestvensky) - Melodiya (boxset)

Sakellaridis: O Vaftistikós (The Godson) (Ο Βαφτιστικός : Γαλανίδης/Καραβουσάνου/Κουλουμπής/Κονταξή/Κολάσης/Ριτσιάρδης) - EMI/His Master's Voice (perhaps the most beloved Greek operetta, I was incidentally watching its film version the other day on TV)

Theodorakis: To Axion Esti (Το Άξιον Εστί : Μπιθικώτσης/Κατράκης/Δημήτριεφ/Μικρή Ορχήστρα Αθηνών/Μικτή Χορωδία Θάλειας Βυζαντίου/Θεοδωράκης) - EMI/His Master's Voice (An iconic work of modern Greek music, setting - parts of - the poem by the same name of Greek Nobel laureate Odysseas Elytis. Theodorakis called it "A People's Oratorio", endeavoring a synthesis of western art and Greek traditional music - his efforts were deemed successful and the formidable verses of Elytis thus clad in music have entered the collective Greek psyche like few works before or since.)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 25, 2022, 05:45:24 AM
Quote from: Wanderer on September 25, 2022, 05:40:31 AM
More from where these came from:

Beethoven: Piano Concerto No. 3 (Gilels/Moscow Radio Symphony Orchestra/Kondrashin) - Melodiya

Tchaikovsky: Piano Concerto No. 1 (Milena Mollova/Symphonic Orchestra of the Committee for Television & Radio/Vassil Stefanov) - Balkanton

Kodály: Psalmus Hungaricus & "The Peacock" - Variations on a Hungarian Folk Song (József Simándy/Budapest Chorus/Children's Chorus of the Hungarian Radio & Television/Hungarian State Orchestra/Antal Doráti) - Hungaroton

Tchaikovsky: Piano Concerto No. 1 (Richter/Wiener Symphoniker/Karajan) - Deutsche Grammophon

Beethoven: Symphony No. 3 (Berliner Philharmoniker/Karajan) - Deutsche Grammophon (11/1965)

Tchaikovsky: Capriccio Italien, Op. 45 - The Voyevoda, Op. 78 - Francesca da Rimini, Op. 32 (Russian State Symphony Orchestra/Konstantin Ivanov) - Melodiya

Mozart: Don Giovanni (Fischer-Dieskau/Kohn/Kreppel/Jurinac/E.Haefliger/Stader/Sardi/Seefried/RSO Berlin/RIAS-Kammerchor/Ferenc Fricsay) - Deutsche Grammophon Privilege (boxset with libretto - 😎)

Tchaikovsky: Swan Lake (Moscow Radio Large Symphony Orchestra/Rozhdestvensky) - Melodiya (boxset)

Sakellaridis: O Vaftistikós (The Godson) (Ο Βαφτιστικός : Γαλανίδης/Καραβουσάνου/Κουλουμπής/Κονταξή/Κολάσης/Ριτσιάρδης) - EMI/His Master's Voice (perhaps the most beloved Greek operetta, I was incidentally watching its film version the other day on TV)

Theodorakis: To Axion Esti (Το Άξιον Εστί : Μπιθικώτσης/Κατράκης/Δημήτριεφ/Μικρή Ορχήστρα Αθηνών/Μικτή Χορωδία Θάλειας Βυζαντίου/Θεοδωράκης) - EMI/His Master's Voice (An iconic work of modern Greek music, setting - parts of - the poem by the same name of Greek Nobel laureate Odysseas Elytis. Theodorakis called it "A People's Oratorio", endeavoring a synthesis of western art and Greek traditional music - his efforts were deemed successful and the formidable verses of Elytis thus clad in music have entered the collective Greek psyche like few works before or since.)
Cool beans!  8)

So, now have you found a repair shop for your turntable?  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on September 25, 2022, 06:25:38 AM
Quote from: Wanderer on September 25, 2022, 05:40:31 AM
More from where these came from:

Beethoven: Piano Concerto No. 3 (Gilels/Moscow Radio Symphony Orchestra/Kondrashin) - Melodiya

Tchaikovsky: Piano Concerto No. 1 (Milena Mollova/Symphonic Orchestra of the Committee for Television & Radio/Vassil Stefanov) - Balkanton

Kodály: Psalmus Hungaricus & "The Peacock" - Variations on a Hungarian Folk Song (József Simándy/Budapest Chorus/Children's Chorus of the Hungarian Radio & Television/Hungarian State Orchestra/Antal Doráti) - Hungaroton

Tchaikovsky: Piano Concerto No. 1 (Richter/Wiener Symphoniker/Karajan) - Deutsche Grammophon

Beethoven: Symphony No. 3 (Berliner Philharmoniker/Karajan) - Deutsche Grammophon (11/1965)

Tchaikovsky: Capriccio Italien, Op. 45 - The Voyevoda, Op. 78 - Francesca da Rimini, Op. 32 (Russian State Symphony Orchestra/Konstantin Ivanov) - Melodiya

Mozart: Don Giovanni (Fischer-Dieskau/Kohn/Kreppel/Jurinac/E.Haefliger/Stader/Sardi/Seefried/RSO Berlin/RIAS-Kammerchor/Ferenc Fricsay) - Deutsche Grammophon Privilege (boxset with libretto - 😎)

Tchaikovsky: Swan Lake (Moscow Radio Large Symphony Orchestra/Rozhdestvensky) - Melodiya (boxset)

Sakellaridis: O Vaftistikós (The Godson) (Ο Βαφτιστικός : Γαλανίδης/Καραβουσάνου/Κουλουμπής/Κονταξή/Κολάσης/Ριτσιάρδης) - EMI/His Master's Voice (perhaps the most beloved Greek operetta, I was incidentally watching its film version the other day on TV)

Theodorakis: To Axion Esti (Το Άξιον Εστί : Μπιθικώτσης/Κατράκης/Δημήτριεφ/Μικρή Ορχήστρα Αθηνών/Μικτή Χορωδία Θάλειας Βυζαντίου/Θεοδωράκης) - EMI/His Master's Voice (An iconic work of modern Greek music, setting - parts of - the poem by the same name of Greek Nobel laureate Odysseas Elytis. Theodorakis called it "A People's Oratorio", endeavoring a synthesis of western art and Greek traditional music - his efforts were deemed successful and the formidable verses of Elytis thus clad in music have entered the collective Greek psyche like few works before or since.)

A good variety of music there to be enjoyed.
I am sure that you will cherish them as much as their previous owner did.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 26, 2022, 12:24:30 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 25, 2022, 05:45:24 AM
Cool beans!  8)

So, now have you found a repair shop for your turntable?  ;)

PD

Yes indeed. Get TT fixed. ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 26, 2022, 06:17:30 AM
Record haul from LA. Not me, sadly.

Stunning film extract of Horowitz playing Scarlatti in Russia.

https://youtu.be/k9CHq8YbHW0
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 26, 2022, 08:00:39 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 26, 2022, 06:17:30 AM
Record haul from LA. Not me, sadly.

Stunning film extract of Horowitz playing Scarlatti in Russia.

https://youtu.be/k9CHq8YbHW0
Neat!  Thanks for sharing that.

I want to visit that record shop in LA!!!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 26, 2022, 09:07:11 AM
Irons,

That same store in Los Angeles has some albums listed on eBay.  I'd love a copy of this record, but not at the price that they are offering it for!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/195027614106?hash=item2d688d399a:g:VucAAOSwhUNictlf

Fly away little Eagles....  :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 27, 2022, 12:21:14 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 26, 2022, 09:07:11 AM
Irons,

That same store in Los Angeles has some albums listed on eBay.  I'd love a copy of this record, but not at the price that they are offering it for!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/195027614106?hash=item2d688d399a:g:VucAAOSwhUNictlf

Fly away little Eagles....  :(

PD

A lot of money PD but in many respects worth it. A sealed copy on Mobile Fidelity, to quote our Karl "nice".

That store in LA looks nice too. In Part.1 of above video Mark includes a picture of it. Since the demise of Classical Exchange due to flooding next to nothing left in London for classical vinyl. I miss my visits to Notting Hill.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 28, 2022, 03:33:33 AM
Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/7HmaheF.jpg)

Not got to listen to PC yet as very taken with Rubbra's Violin Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/e7Qp5AX.jpg)

Spirited account of Elgar's String Quartet. I have a problem with the lovely Delius SQ. The Fidelio Quartet play the piece beautifully on an old Pye Golden Guinea LP. Every recording that I have heard since, including Brodsky's, sound too driven and rushed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on September 30, 2022, 04:41:20 AM
I'll have to revisit Elgar's quartet & piano quintet soon as it's been a while.

Yesterday I ran across this treat:

(https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/releaseimages/3/2/3/8/6/3/3/img01.jpg)

Bach's Christmas Oratorio with some of my faves like Wunderlich, Janowitz and Ludwig.  Conducted by the one and only Karl Richter.  It included the big libretto booklet and the original filing card too.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on September 30, 2022, 11:46:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on September 28, 2022, 03:33:33 AM
Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/7HmaheF.jpg)

Not got to listen to PC yet as very taken with Rubbra's Violin Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/e7Qp5AX.jpg)

Spirited account of Elgar's String Quartet. I have a problem with the lovely Delius SQ. The Fidelio Quartet play the piece beautifully on an old Pye Golden Guinea LP. Every recording that I have heard since, including Brodsky's, sound too driven and rushed.
The Rubbra Ireland disc looks great Lol. I love the dreamy and reflective Rubbra work.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: ritter on September 30, 2022, 11:54:30 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on September 30, 2022, 04:41:20 AM
....

Yesterday I ran across this treat:

(https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/releaseimages/3/2/3/8/6/3/3/img01.jpg)

Bach's Christmas Oratorio with some of my faves like Wunderlich, Janowitz and Ludwig.  Conducted by the one and only Karl Richter.  It included the big libretto booklet and the original filing card too.  :)

PD
Nice! We had that set in my parents'  house when I was young. It was my introduction to Bach. Fond memories.... :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 01, 2022, 02:54:46 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on September 30, 2022, 11:46:05 AM
The Rubbra Ireland disc looks great Lol. I love the dreamy and reflective Rubbra work.

I love the Rubbra concerto, Jeffrey. Usually, I will have a stab at describing why I like a piece but for Rubbra I just do and don't know why. I think you have hit nail squarely on head with "reflective".
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 01, 2022, 03:46:02 AM
Quote from: ritter on September 30, 2022, 11:54:30 AM
Nice! We had that set in my parents'  house when I was young. It was my introduction to Bach. Fond memories.... :)
Hi Ritter!

Cool!  8)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 04, 2022, 10:20:52 PM
Quote from: Irons on October 01, 2022, 02:54:46 AM
I love the Rubbra concerto, Jeffrey. Usually, I will have a stab at describing why I like a piece but for Rubbra I just do and don't know why. I think you have hit nail squarely on head with "reflective".
Thanks, Lol. I think that Rubbra's Piano Concerto has a similar quality.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 05, 2022, 06:07:23 AM
Here is a short article from Discogs which I came across recently featuring the stylus which I thought might be of interest to new entrants into the vinyl world. I put it here for reference.


The Different Types of Record Player Needles

August 21, 2018

If you thought a stylus was a stylus was a stylus, think again. There are several different types of record player needles.

There are four main stylus shapes, excluding a stylus for 78 RPM records. As the grooves of 78s are about 3-4 times wider than a typical 33 1/3 record and require a stylus designed specifically for these grooves. A standard microgroove spherical stylus will ride very low in the groove, producing a noisy signal and greatly accelerating wear on your stylus.

Why does stylus shape matter?

If you're a casual vinyl record enthusiast, the truth is, you probably don't need to lose that much sleep over it. That said, the shape (and construction) of the stylus, contributes to how well it replicates sound from your record, due to the access it has to the surface area of the grooves. It can also contribute to the wear and tear of your vinyl records over time. And of course, both of these things will affect the price of the stylus. So if you value high-end audio and have a bit of extra cash to put into your turntable setup, it's worth knowing about the different types of styli and the benefits of each type. You may also want to be more selective about your stylus depending on whether you're using it for DJing or playing records at home.

Stylus Construction

Before we get into the differences of turntable styli, let's take a step back to the shank construction. The stylus sits at the end of the cantilever within the turntable's cartridge, which is connected to the tonearm. The stylus attached to the cantilever will be a nude diamond or a tipped diamond. With a tipped diamond, it's just that – the very tip of the stylus is diamond while the rest is metal – as opposed to nude diamond where the stylus is a whole diamond that's glued to the cantilever. Unsurprisingly, the latter is the premium option as it has a lower mass and tracks more accurately.

Stylus Types

Spherical

Spherical, or conical, is the most common stylus type and are the least expensive. It looks a bit like the tip of a ballpoint pen up close. Because of their relatively large radius, spherical styli trace less of the smaller groove modulations that represent higher frequencies. Some claim spherical styli produce the most wear on records because the contact area of the diamond is restricted to two specific points, while contenders claim that this actually produces less wear.

Elliptical

The next most common stylus type is elliptical, or bi-radial. Elliptical makes contact across a larger area of the groove wall due to its dual radii. This allows for more precise tracking, improved frequency response (especially highs), improved phase response, and lower distortion, particularly in hard-to-track inner grooves. These types of styli usually wear a bit faster, and you'll need to pay attention to the cartridge and tonearm alignment for best results.

Hyperelliptical

Hyperelliptical, also known as shibata, fine line, or stereohedron. As the name suggests, this type is the next stage of evolution of the elliptical stylus, sharpening the design to make greater contact with the record grooves. When properly aligned, this stylus offers excellent high-frequency performance, longer tip life, improved tracking, and lower record wear. Due to their advanced design and difficulty to manufacture, they're more expensive than the elliptical stylus.

Micro-ridge

The micro-ridge, or microline stylus is the most advanced of the four styli types. The computer designed tip comes close to the shape of a cutting stylus used to produce master discs. Their multilevel "ridge" shape allows this stylus to give the best high-frequency performance with extended record and stylus life (when aligned correctly). They're very difficult to manufacture and very expensive.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 05, 2022, 08:45:10 AM
I've got two cartridges these days.
One is a very old Audio-Technica AT-OC10, which 'm keeping for reference as my current tonearm cannot handle it properly. It's a low output moving coil with a MicroLine (TM) also known as microridge or SAS stylus on a Boron cantilever.
The other one is a Denon DL-301II  low output moving coil with a "special elliptical" stylus on a tapered aluminium cantilever. I guess it's actually a Shibata due to the very extended frequency response that no elliptical stylus can.

...

I promised listening impressions on the "new" RVW double album.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/d935eb89-f255-4f49-8eec-72f1928d3b57-jpeg.852804/)

The symphony got me afraid, and the last movement desolate.
It's all very good, but since I don't know my RVW it's wetted my appetite for more. That's something, isn't it?
Not the most quiet pressing, I'm afraid.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 05, 2022, 11:54:20 PM
Quote from: Valentino on October 05, 2022, 08:45:10 AM
I've got two cartridges these days.
One is a very old Audio-Technica AT-OC10, which 'm keeping for reference as my current tonearm cannot handle it properly. It's a low output moving coil with a MicroLine (TM) also known as microridge or SAS stylus on a Boron cantilever.
The other one is a Denon DL-301II  low output moving coil with a "special elliptical" stylus on a tapered aluminium cantilever. I guess it's actually a Shibata due to the very extended frequency response that no elliptical stylus can.

...

I promised listening impressions on the "new" RVW double album.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/d935eb89-f255-4f49-8eec-72f1928d3b57-jpeg.852804/)

The symphony got me afraid, and the last movement desolate.
It's all very good, but since I don't know my RVW it's wetted my appetite for more. That's something, isn't it?
Not the most quiet pressing, I'm afraid.
Thanks v much for the VW feedback. There are two recent VW LPs that I'd like if I ever get a decent turntable (Hichox's recording of the 1913 version of A London Symphony and the one that you are reporting back on). If you want to explore more VW I'd recommend the Hickox recording:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 06, 2022, 03:39:32 AM
What's a decent turntable The way you see it?

Was at a friend yesterday and was impressed by a 1968 Thorens TD 150 Mk. I with a 1985 SME Series III tonearm and a 2022  Ortofon 2M Bronze cartridge.
Pretty little package.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 06, 2022, 10:10:25 PM
I just mean not the cheapo portable one that I have at the moment. I quite like the look of a Pro-Ject one, and they are not too expensive. I used to have a Dual turntable with an Ortofen cartridge.
(//)
The main problem is getting my wife to agree to have it in the living room!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 07, 2022, 03:07:01 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 06, 2022, 10:10:25 PM
I just mean not the cheapo portable one that I have at the moment. I quite like the look of a Pro-Ject one, and they are not too expensive. I used to have a Dual turntable with an Ortofen cartridge.
(//)
The main problem is getting my wife to agree to have it in the living room!

Many would understand your problem regarding the living room. While the Project is a good TT I think that your choice would need to look more like "a piece of furniture" for enhanced success.  ;)  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 07, 2022, 03:25:20 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 06, 2022, 10:10:25 PM
I just mean not the cheapo portable one that I have at the moment. I quite like the look of a Pro-Ject one, and they are not too expensive. I used to have a Dual turntable with an Ortofen cartridge.
(//)
The main problem is getting my wife to agree to have it in the living room!
If I'm recalling correctly (and I could be misremembering here), you have your components spread out over a table or kind of sideboard?  If so, do you think that she would agree to a decent-looking stereo cabinet (that would fit in stylistically-wise with the rest of your furniture)?  I don't know about the various Project turntables (other than recalling that they have a good brand).  This model comes in various colors and finishes too:  https://www.fanthorpes.co.uk/hi-fi-separates/turntables-and-accessories/turntables/project-debut-carbon-evo-turntable/ The hunter green is quite nice...wonder what the blue one looks like (they don't have a photo of it there).  :)  Perhaps bring her along when you go to audition them, so that she too can hear the differences between the models.  And bring along some favorite records of hers too!  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 14, 2022, 04:41:41 AM
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/XYUAAOSwovBbeSVn/s-l1600.jpg)    (https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=29166.0;attach=92249;image)    (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/sq8AAOSwJdFiW-fv/s-l1600.jpg)



I posted these three LPs on the Listening Thread earlier today. I do believe that they are the first vinyl purchases by me this year. They all came from a recent find at a local charity shop. The covers are slightly less than perfect but still good and all of the vinyl itself is in terrific condition.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 14, 2022, 04:57:31 AM
Haven't heard of Fischer before now.  Is he new to you too?

Hope that you enjoy them!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 14, 2022, 05:42:52 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 14, 2022, 04:57:31 AM
Haven't heard of Fischer before now.  Is he new to you too?

Hope that you enjoy them!

PD

Yes, PD, my first exposure to the music of Fischer.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 14, 2022, 11:40:20 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 07, 2022, 03:25:20 AM
If I'm recalling correctly (and I could be misremembering here), you have your components spread out over a table or kind of sideboard?  If so, do you think that she would agree to a decent-looking stereo cabinet (that would fit in stylistically-wise with the rest of your furniture)?  I don't know about the various Project turntables (other than recalling that they have a good brand).  This model comes in various colors and finishes too:  https://www.fanthorpes.co.uk/hi-fi-separates/turntables-and-accessories/turntables/project-debut-carbon-evo-turntable/ The hunter green is quite nice...wonder what the blue one looks like (they don't have a photo of it there).  :)  Perhaps bring her along when you go to audition them, so that she too can hear the differences between the models.  And bring along some favorite records of hers too!  ;)

PD
Many thanks PD for the advice which is much appreciated. Your plan is very thoughtful but not viable here, I think. My wife thinks that I should be 'downloading' and 'streaming' my music 'LIKE EVERYONE ELSE DOES!'
;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 14, 2022, 11:41:50 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 07, 2022, 03:07:01 AM
Many would understand your problem regarding the living room. While the Project is a good TT I think that your choice would need to look more like "a piece of furniture" for enhanced success.  ;)  ;D
Thanks Fergus - I suspect that you are right.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 14, 2022, 01:51:08 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 14, 2022, 11:40:20 AM
Many thanks PD for the advice which is much appreciated. Your plan is very thoughtful but not viable here, I think. My wife thinks that I should be 'downloading' and 'streaming' my music 'LIKE EVERYONE ELSE DOES!'
;D
Ummm....hmmm.  Well, not EVERYONE does that.....particularly a lot of music nuts.  :(  (Though I think that those who normally only like to listen to newer recordings might be more inclined to do so.  You could do a poll here Jeffrey).   Regarding streaming, can one read your wonderful liner notes from (if the recordings are available online) the various labels?  If not, support the hubby and the income flow!  ;).  And do bring her to an audio shop and let her also hear the difference--you might be surprised?   :)  In any event, hang in there!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 14, 2022, 02:05:17 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 14, 2022, 11:41:50 AM
Thanks Fergus - I suspect that you are right.

Best of luck, Jeffrey  ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on October 15, 2022, 04:13:03 PM
(https://i.discogs.com/HQjV1g8cJx24K0OuHS4ruEbQnZBrMQivfFnhVZWVijk/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:588/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTI1Mzcy/OTgtMTUxODAyNDk4/NC05NjIxLmpwZWc.jpeg)   (https://www.picclickimg.com/27oAAOSwo~lhHRoB/The-Music-of-Arnold-Schoenberg-Volume-Two-Craft.jpg)   (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/LPcAAOSwdM5jLi9J/s-l1600.jpg)


These three vinyl albums also came from a recent find at a local charity shop. The covers are very good and all of the vinyl itself is in terrific condition.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 16, 2022, 12:34:10 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 15, 2022, 04:13:03 PM
(https://i.discogs.com/HQjV1g8cJx24K0OuHS4ruEbQnZBrMQivfFnhVZWVijk/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:588/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTI1Mzcy/OTgtMTUxODAyNDk4/NC05NjIxLmpwZWc.jpeg)   (https://www.picclickimg.com/27oAAOSwo~lhHRoB/The-Music-of-Arnold-Schoenberg-Volume-Two-Craft.jpg)   (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/LPcAAOSwdM5jLi9J/s-l1600.jpg)


These three vinyl albums also came from a recent find at a local charity shop. The covers are very good and all of the vinyl itself is in terrific condition.
Excellent Fergus! I like the VW performances very much. I thought highly of the original LP with its nice painting of London by Oskar Kokoschka. I used to go to school on the Embankment and live not too far away, so I find it very nostalgic (both the music and the image):
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 17, 2022, 07:58:23 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 06, 2022, 10:10:25 PM
I just mean not the cheapo portable one that I have at the moment. I quite like the look of a Pro-Ject one, and they are not too expensive. I used to have a Dual turntable with an Ortofen cartridge.
(//)
The main problem is getting my wife to agree to have it in the living room!

I like the clean lines of the Pro-Ject TT. The wife factor is always a consideration I agree but sans lid makes it even more acceptable in a living environment I think. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 17, 2022, 08:09:07 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 17, 2022, 07:58:23 AM
I like the clean lines of the Pro-Ject TT. The wife factor is always a consideration I agree but sans lid makes it even more acceptable in a living environment I think.
Thanks, Lol. I agree. We shall see...
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 18, 2022, 03:16:40 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 17, 2022, 07:58:23 AM
I like the clean lines of the Pro-Ject TT. The wife factor is always a consideration I agree but sans lid makes it even more acceptable in a living environment I think.
I agree; I hate the look of a lid, but it does help with keeping the dust off of the critter.  Do you use a lid yourself or have you found that you use it so often that it's pretty easy to keep it clean?  If so, how do you dust it off?  The tone arm in particular?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 18, 2022, 05:58:02 AM
There are some turntables with lid that look very good. Transcriptor, J.A. Mitchell, B&O.

But I really cannot see much aesthetic harm in any clear lid.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 18, 2022, 07:56:04 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 18, 2022, 03:16:40 AM
I agree; I hate the look of a lid, but it does help with keeping the dust off of the critter.  Do you use a lid yourself or have you found that you use it so often that it's pretty easy to keep it clean?  If so, how do you dust it off?  The tone arm in particular?

PD

I believe Jeffrey an owner of a cat which may prove problematic.

The lid on my TT, or rather the hinges, which I can name the day of purchase due to outside events. I had the plinth made to order to fit an acrylic lid. But like a stylus guard an unfixed lid can be more prone to accidents then no lid at all! I took myself off to a huge car-boot sale seeking a TT, any TT, with friction hinges. I found one that fitted the bill, rubbish TT but a good pair of hinges. Binned the TT which cost next to nothing and the friction hinges have worked perfectly to this day from purchase 31 August 1997 which was the same day Diana died in Paris. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 18, 2022, 08:04:19 AM
First time I've heard of a plinth made to fit a lid.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 18, 2022, 08:27:51 AM
Quote from: Valentino on October 18, 2022, 08:04:19 AM
First time I've heard of a plinth made to fit a lid.

Yes, a layered plinth made to order from a chap in Ireland. Much easier to have a plinth made to a specified size then an acrylic lid which far as I know is impossible. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 18, 2022, 08:49:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 18, 2022, 07:56:04 AM
I believe Jeffrey an owner of a cat which may prove problematic.

The lid on my TT, or rather the hinges, which I can name the day of purchase due to outside events. I had the plinth made to order to fit an acrylic lid. But like a stylus guard an unfixed lid can be more prone to accidents then no lid at all! I took myself off to a huge car-boot sale seeking a TT, any TT, with friction hinges. I found one that fitted the bill, rubbish TT but a good pair of hinges. Binned the TT which cost next to nothing and the friction hinges have worked perfectly to this day from purchase 31 August 1997 which was the same day Diana died in Paris.
True!  I had forgotten that part re cat!  Thankfully, I don't believe mine ever tried to hop on top of my t.v. cabinet (top of is where I have some stereo components including turntable and outboard motor).  And yes, I know what you mean.  You have to be careful opening lid and closing it so as to not accidentally pull the hinge out of its sleeve(?) and thereby possibly causing a nasty bit of destruction! 

Did you give him the hinges to work with at the same time and a lid for him to fit them onto?  I would think that the chances would be high if you were to try and take the old ones off of your then current lid?

By the way, I had to look up what a friction hinge was as I hadn't heard of them before now.  In any event, that was very clever of you to think of that!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 18, 2022, 11:54:41 AM
I had one made for a Sota once.

Anyway: Your turntable looks the business. I really like plinths that aren't overdone. They often are for those classic 401/301/124s. Too much bling for me.

I love this:

(https://stereo-magazine.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Thorens_TD_124_aufm_web.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 19, 2022, 06:30:40 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 18, 2022, 08:49:02 AM
True!  I had forgotten that part re cat!  Thankfully, I don't believe mine ever tried to hop on top of my t.v. cabinet (top of is where I have some stereo components including turntable and outboard motor).  And yes, I know what you mean.  You have to be careful opening lid and closing it so as to not accidentally pull the hinge out of its sleeve(?) and thereby possibly causing a nasty bit of destruction! 

Did you give him the hinges to work with at the same time and a lid for him to fit them onto?  I would think that the chances would be high if you were to try and take the old ones off of your then current lid?

By the way, I had to look up what a friction hinge was as I hadn't heard of them before now.  In any event, that was very clever of you to think of that!  :)

PD

All my own work PD 8). Lined up where the holes should go and then taped up the area. After a short prayer out came the drill ??? Hinges have worked a dream ever since. I have many DIY disasters but this not one of them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 19, 2022, 06:53:57 AM
Quote from: Valentino on October 18, 2022, 11:54:41 AM
I had one made for a Sota once.

Anyway: Your turntable looks the business. I really like plinths that aren't overdone. They often are for those classic 401/301/124s. Too much bling for me.

I love this:

(https://stereo-magazine.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Thorens_TD_124_aufm_web.jpg)

Possibly not your cup of tea but I like slate plinths. High mass ideal for Garrard TTs. I promised myself a slate plinth from Peter Soper's Slate Audio one day. My TT sits on a slate stand made by him and got to know Peter. Unfortunately he went out of business twenty years ago. Today they are rare but one did turn up for sale last year, but for a 301 damn it. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 19, 2022, 07:04:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 19, 2022, 06:30:40 AM
All my own work PD 8). Lined up where the holes should go and then taped up the area. After a short prayer out came the drill ??? Hinges have worked a dream ever since. I have many DIY disasters but this not one of them.
Nice!  I would have been nervous about drilling into that acrylic.  Did you also have to drill holes into the plinth?

By the way, your person in Ireland did a lovely job!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 19, 2022, 07:35:03 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 19, 2022, 07:04:58 AM
Nice!  I would have been nervous about drilling into that acrylic.  Did you also have to drill holes into the plinth?

By the way, your person in Ireland did a lovely job!

PD

His name, if anyone interested is Neil Hollow.

https://www.theanalogdept.com/neil_hollow.htm
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 19, 2022, 07:37:37 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 19, 2022, 06:53:57 AM
Possibly not your cup of tea but I like slate plinths. High mass ideal for Garrard TTs. I promised myself a slate plinth from Peter Soper's Slate Audio one day. My TT sits on a slate stand made by him and got to know Peter. Unfortunately he went out of business twenty years ago. Today they are rare but one did turn up for sale last year, but for a 301 damn it.

Wow!  Does that require two people to move it?!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 19, 2022, 08:51:25 AM
Indeed not my cup of tea but well executed though.
Stumbled actross this at my local used classical record pusher the other day. There's about NOK 10 in € 1:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/53b7717b-1799-4bfd-9dc4-b379e358337d-jpeg.859369/)

Yup, that SME plinth is not my cup of tea either.

Been spinning the below, a barn sale find at NOK 20 in excellent playing condition. I like rhapsodys. Nice folk themes in big arrangements make for easy listening hifi spectaculars:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/8ba0ddc5-44d1-404e-8a6b-4da2271c0a7c-jpeg.859327/)

EO conducts Philly. German CBS release.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 19, 2022, 09:25:51 AM
Quote from: Valentino on October 19, 2022, 08:51:25 AM
Indeed not my cup of tea but well executed though.
Stumbled actross this at my local used classical record pusher the other day. There's about NOK 10 in € 1:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/53b7717b-1799-4bfd-9dc4-b379e358337d-jpeg.859369/)

Yup, that SME plinth is not my cup of tea either.

Been spinning the below, a barn sale find at NOK 20 in excellent playing condition. I like rhapsodys. Nice folk themes in big arrangements make for easy listening hifi spectaculars:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/8ba0ddc5-44d1-404e-8a6b-4da2271c0a7c-jpeg.859327/)

EO conducts Philly. German CBS release.
;D  Did you succumb to any temptations there?

And good acquisition!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 19, 2022, 09:52:54 AM
Nah!  ;D
I have my quite domestic 49 years old Thorens TD 125 Mk. II with an original plinth stiffened on the inside, a corian arm board by Konne in Germany and a new electronics board that makes it 78 rpm capable (instead of 16 2/3).

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/cca6e97a-835e-4c83-883f-fb62db135a0f-jpeg.831154/)

Yeah, I splashed out a bit on that record!

In production is an Alfred Bokrand AB-230 based on the ancient Ortofon AS-212 to replace the SME 3009 Series II Improved. Should be here in four weeks time at most. Waiting for it is a couple of good Audio-Technica headshells and an SME armbase.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/s-l1600cr-jpg.842179/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/15a0ccb9-dd94-4fa2-9c5d-0213a7bfc406-jpeg.843355/)

Will also need a cartridge for 78 shellac. I guess I'll end up with the Audio-Technica AT-VM95SP (https://www.audio-technica.com/en-gb/at-vm95sp).


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 19, 2022, 10:11:19 AM
Quote from: Valentino on October 19, 2022, 09:52:54 AM
Nah!  ;D
I have my quite domestic 49 years old Thorens TD 125 Mk. II with an original plinth stiffened on the inside, a corian arm board by Konne in Germany and a new electronics board that makes it 78 rpm capable (instead of 16 2/3).

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/cca6e97a-835e-4c83-883f-fb62db135a0f-jpeg.831154/)

Yeah, I splashed out a bit on that record!

In production is an Alfred Bokrand AB-230 based on the ancient Ortofon AS-212 to replace the SME 3009 Series II Improved. Should be here in four weeks time at most. Waiting for it is a couple of good Audio-Technica headshells and an SME armbase.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/s-l1600cr-jpg.842179/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/15a0ccb9-dd94-4fa2-9c5d-0213a7bfc406-jpeg.843355/)

Will also need a cartridge for 78 shellac. I guess I'll end up with the Audio-Technica AT-VM95SP (https://www.audio-technica.com/en-gb/at-vm95sp).
Cool!  Do you have any old 78's around?  I ended up getting rid of the few that I had.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 19, 2022, 10:46:51 AM
Yes, I have some. Most are rubbish, but not all. Must admit that my reason for setting the Thorens up for 78s is to be able to play the records for my father in law who dumped them and a terrible acoustic HMV cabinet without a functioning wind-up on me.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 19, 2022, 11:39:51 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 19, 2022, 07:37:37 AM
Wow!  Does that require two people to move it?!

PD

Slate Audio also manufactured enclosures for Tannoy speakers. You would need a crane to shift those!

Quote from: Valentino on October 19, 2022, 08:51:25 AM
Indeed not my cup of tea but well executed though.
Stumbled actross this at my local used classical record pusher the other day. There's about NOK 10 in € 1:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/53b7717b-1799-4bfd-9dc4-b379e358337d-jpeg.859369/)

Yup, that SME plinth is not my cup of tea either.

Been spinning the below, a barn sale find at NOK 20 in excellent playing condition. I like rhapsodys. Nice folk themes in big arrangements make for easy listening hifi spectaculars:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/8ba0ddc5-44d1-404e-8a6b-4da2271c0a7c-jpeg.859327/)

EO conducts Philly. German CBS release.

SME Garrard plinths were very badly designed. The last thing a beast of a motor which the Garrard is are springs. Mass is the way to tame it, not bouncing around suspended on springs. Linn Sondek they are not.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 20, 2022, 07:51:15 AM
Indeed. Here's a pretty solution with mass (open pic in new tab for size).

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/garrard1-jpg.859701/)

It really is a pity that Jelco is out of business. New pretty and reasonably priced arms with Ortofon/JIS/SME headshell connector are scarce. Korf has by the way started to take orders for his 9": https://korfaudio.com/ta-sf9
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 20, 2022, 11:51:00 PM
Quote from: Valentino on October 20, 2022, 07:51:15 AM
Indeed. Here's a pretty solution with mass (open pic in new tab for size).

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/garrard1-jpg.859701/)

It really is a pity that Jelco is out of business. New pretty and reasonably priced arms with Ortofon/JIS/SME headshell connector are scarce. Korf has by the way started to take orders for his 9": https://korfaudio.com/ta-sf9

Surprised Jelco have gone. The Company had a large following for their good quality tonearms at sensible prices. I have not heard of Korf.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 21, 2022, 12:04:31 AM
Quote from: aligreto on October 15, 2022, 04:13:03 PM
(https://i.discogs.com/HQjV1g8cJx24K0OuHS4ruEbQnZBrMQivfFnhVZWVijk/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:588/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTI1Mzcy/OTgtMTUxODAyNDk4/NC05NjIxLmpwZWc.jpeg)   (https://www.picclickimg.com/27oAAOSwo~lhHRoB/The-Music-of-Arnold-Schoenberg-Volume-Two-Craft.jpg)   (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/LPcAAOSwdM5jLi9J/s-l1600.jpg)


These three vinyl albums also came from a recent find at a local charity shop. The covers are very good and all of the vinyl itself is in terrific condition.

A follow-up on the EMI Eminence issue. This time a reissue of a 1958 The Planets. Considering the vintage sonics are excellent, so much so I jumped out of my skin with the entry of tubular bells (?) in "Saturn"!

(https://i.imgur.com/L91lGwL.jpg)

Followed by another orchestral blockbuster "The Three Cornered Hat".

(https://i.imgur.com/kfBz0Gq.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 21, 2022, 12:30:19 AM
^Korf is rather refreshing. Started out as a blog about turntable tech, and now has three products. Worth the time.
Site: http://korfaudio.com/
Blog posts per subject: http://korfaudio.com/blog#!/tab/140152181-2
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 21, 2022, 01:57:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 19, 2022, 06:53:57 AM
Possibly not your cup of tea but I like slate plinths. High mass ideal for Garrard TTs. I promised myself a slate plinth from Peter Soper's Slate Audio one day. My TT sits on a slate stand made by him and got to know Peter. Unfortunately he went out of business twenty years ago. Today they are rare but one did turn up for sale last year, but for a 301 damn it.
Irons,

Have you heard of these folks?  Lots of slate there!  :)  https://www.northwestanalogue.com/plinths-slate-racks-and-record-pucks.html

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 21, 2022, 07:43:44 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 21, 2022, 01:57:02 AM
Irons,

Have you heard of these folks?  Lots of slate there!  :)  https://www.northwestanalogue.com/plinths-slate-racks-and-record-pucks.html

PD

Oh yes, PD. They refurbished my Ortofon Kontrapunkt C cartridge. I'm aware that from your neck of the woods you would laugh at distances within where I'm from, but Northwest Audio are about far away as it is possible to be in England from my location. Husband and wife team, I have spoken to both over the phone and they are very nice. I would love to visit their listening rooms.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 21, 2022, 09:17:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 21, 2022, 07:43:44 AM
Oh yes, PD. They refurbished my Ortofon Kontrapunkt C cartridge. I'm aware that from your neck of the woods you would laugh at distances within where I'm from, but Northwest Audio are about far away as it is possible to be in England from my location. Husband and wife team, I have spoken to both over the phone and they are very nice. I would love to visit their listening rooms.
I've have the feeling that car traffic has become even worse over the years; is that why you're reluctant to visit them?  Or perhaps you could take a train and then either get a cab/bus or rent a car for the last bit?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 22, 2022, 12:13:29 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 21, 2022, 09:17:43 AM
I've have the feeling that car traffic has become even worse over the years; is that why you're reluctant to visit them?  Or perhaps you could take a train and then either get a cab/bus or rent a car for the last bit?

PD

A nine hour round trip and what with price of fuel. Train strikes a regular occurrence, ticket price I dread to think. Not feasible, PD.

Current spinning.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 22, 2022, 01:58:09 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 22, 2022, 12:13:29 AM
A nine hour round trip and what with price of fuel. Train strikes a regular occurrence, ticket price I dread to think. Not feasible, PD.

Current spinning.
Well, perhaps when the price of petrol goes down and you decide that you're ready to treat yourself to a slate plinth--and want to see their slate samples and handiwork and get an estimate?  And perhaps make an overnight trip of it (and check out some local attractions)?

And more Supraphon....yummm!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 22, 2022, 07:07:00 PM
Just purchased this (£8.50 including P and P). I wonder why Mercury never released this on CD:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 23, 2022, 01:17:06 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on October 22, 2022, 07:07:00 PM
Just purchased this (£8.50 including P and P). I wonder why Mercury never released this on CD:
(//)

Is it a Pye release for the UK Jeffrey or an original US issue? I have the Barber work on Mercury/EMI.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 23, 2022, 12:52:23 PM
Spinning Stravinsky.

(https://i.imgur.com/idLTmLG.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/ovG557n.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 24, 2022, 02:01:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 23, 2022, 12:52:23 PM
Spinning Stravinsky.

(https://i.imgur.com/idLTmLG.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/ovG557n.jpg)
That one on the right (or should I say "rite") has quite the cover!  How did you find the recording to be?  And did Mrs. Irons also enjoy it?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 24, 2022, 03:37:18 AM
I have only two LPs featuring Eduardo Mata (the other music of De Falla) PD and both outstanding. A  few "Rites" on my shelves (haven't we all) with far more illustrious names but Mata is far and away the best performance. I fully intend to expand my collection of Eduardo Mata recordings on either CD or LP.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on October 24, 2022, 06:36:09 AM
Quote from: Irons on October 23, 2022, 01:17:06 AM
Is it a Pye release for the UK Jeffrey or an original US issue? I have the Barber work on Mercury/EMI.
I'll let you know when it turns up Lol.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 28, 2022, 11:12:18 PM
Spinning: Previn.

(https://i.imgur.com/JBRPcyB.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/gs2oFSp.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 01, 2022, 11:56:22 PM
Bliss: Violin Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/v9usmkm.jpg)

A fine recording from 1955 at Kingsway Hall. The Ace of Clubs issue uses 1969 matrices which produce clear dynamic sound.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 05:39:58 AM
I don't usually buy LPs but two (one boxed set) arrived today. I'm just playing Howard Hanson's 'Sinfonia Sacra' Symphony No.5 and I'm most impressed by the immediacy of the sound, even on my cheapo Ion record player with built in speakers. It is a Mercury LP and seems in remarkably good condition in view of its age:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 05:46:15 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 05:39:58 AM
I don't usually buy LPs but two (one boxed set) arrived today. I'm just playing Howard Hanson's 'Sinfonia Sacra' Symphony No.5 and I'm most impressed by the immediacy of the sound, even on my cheapo Ion record player with built in speakers. It is a Mercury LP and seems in remarkably good condition in view of its age:
You've given in to the power of The Force, Luke....er "Jeffrey".  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 05:47:55 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 01, 2022, 11:56:22 PM
Bliss: Violin Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/v9usmkm.jpg)

A fine recording from 1955 at Kingsway Hall. The Ace of Clubs issue uses 1969 matrices which produce clear dynamic sound.
I'll have to check online to see whether or not I can find a recording of that to sample as I don't know it.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 05:57:43 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 05:46:15 AM
You've given in to the power of The Force, Luke....er "Jeffrey".  :)

PD

HAHA  ;D I think that it's more likely the influence of your good self and Lol!

PS I'm now playing Samuel Barber's Symphony No.1 on the same LP - also a fabulous performance and immediate recording - am most impressed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 06:47:41 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 01, 2022, 11:56:22 PM
Bliss: Violin Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/v9usmkm.jpg)

A fine recording from 1955 at Kingsway Hall. The Ace of Clubs issue uses 1969 matrices which produce clear dynamic sound.
Found a recording on youtube uploaded by Addiodelpassato:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apagJNE7nHQ

Am enjoying it!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 06:55:12 AM
This is how I originally encountered it:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 07:19:15 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 06:55:12 AM
This is how I originally encountered it:
(//)
Ah!  That explains where that picture on youtube (minus the details) came from! lol

Really enjoyed the work and Campoli's performance!  Don't recall of hearing of Alfredo Campoli before now.  Wow!  And the youtube upload comes across great too.  Very happy that I listened to it.  :)  And thanks Lol for mentioning this recording!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 07:28:36 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 07:19:15 AM
Ah!  That explains where that picture on youtube (minus the details) came from! lol

Really enjoyed the work and Campoli's performance!  Don't recall of hearing of Alfredo Campoli before now.  Wow!  And the youtube upload comes across great too.  Very happy that I listened to it.  :)  And thanks Lol for mentioning this recording!

PD

I was of the 'Decca Eclipse' LP generation which replaced 'Ace of Clubs' (Mono) and 'Ace of Diamonds' (Stereo) LPs.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 07:39:33 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 07:28:36 AM
I was of the 'Decca Eclipse' LP generation which replaced 'Ace of Clubs' (Mono) and 'Ace of Diamonds' (Stereo) LPs.
Ah, so the Eclipse pressings came about later.  Does anyone here know if it is also available (and was recorded) in a stereo version?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 07:51:39 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 07:39:33 AM
Ah, so the Eclipse pressings came about later.  Does anyone here know if it is also available (and was recorded) in a stereo version?

PD

Some of the Eclipse releases are in a kind of 'fake-stereo' which was controversial. I'm sure that Lol will know more about it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 07:55:23 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 07:51:39 AM
Some of the Eclipse releases are in a kind of 'fake-stereo' which was controversial. I'm sure that Lol will know more about it.
I try and avoid purchasing ones that say something along the line of "simulated stereo".  Do the Eclipse ones say anything to indicate if they've done something like this to the recordings?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 07:59:54 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 07:55:23 AM
I try and avoid purchasing ones that say something along the line of "simulated stereo".  Do the Eclipse ones say anything to indicate if they've done something like this to the recordings?

PD

Yes AFAIK PD. I think that if the inner wrapper was pink it was mono and if in blue it might be a simulated stereo. The older Decca Ace of Clubs was Mono and Ace of Diamonds was stereo and many preferred this.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 02, 2022, 09:05:27 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 07:55:23 AM
I try and avoid purchasing ones that say something along the line of "simulated stereo".  Do the Eclipse ones say anything to indicate if they've done something like this to the recordings?

PD

Yes they do PD, printed on the outside edge of back cover. You are right, the fake stereo are to be avoided. Unlike other unscrupulous labels Decca were upfront and honest. Far as I am aware Eclipse was the only sub-label that Decca issued  and I quote "Stereo - Mono recording electronically reprocessed to give stereo effect on stereo equipment". Not all Eclipse were fake stereo, some were true stereo, for example the famous Borodin SQ of Borodin 2 & Shostakovich 8. I have all three, Decca, Ace of Diamonds and Eclipse I always play the Eclipse because it has the nicest cover image. 8)

Pleased you enjoyed the VC. Thanks for taking the time to listen.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 02, 2022, 09:11:10 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 07:59:54 AM
Yes AFAIK PD. I think that if the inner wrapper was pink it was mono and if in blue it might be a simulated stereo. The older Decca Ace of Clubs was Mono and Ace of Diamonds was stereo and many preferred this.

Correct, Jeffrey. I do not have an aversion to mono recordings, in fact I quite like them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 09:15:03 AM
Thank you both for the information!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 02, 2022, 09:15:14 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 05:39:58 AM
I don't usually buy LPs but two (one boxed set) arrived today. I'm just playing Howard Hanson's 'Sinfonia Sacra' Symphony No.5 and I'm most impressed by the immediacy of the sound, even on my cheapo Ion record player with built in speakers. It is a Mercury LP and seems in remarkably good condition in view of its age:

I love Mercury sound. I listened to the CD of Hanson's 4th Symphony after your recommendation recently. Excellent.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 09:34:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 02, 2022, 09:15:14 AM
I love Mercury sound. I listened to the CD of Hanson's 4th Symphony after your recommendation recently. Excellent.
I think that we're getting to Jeffrey; he's now ordering LPs!  Yippee!  Wait, on second thought, that means another collector to contend with!   ???  ::)  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 09:38:54 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 02, 2022, 09:05:27 AM
Yes they do PD, printed on the outside edge of back cover. You are right, the fake stereo are to be avoided. Unlike other unscrupulous labels Decca were upfront and honest. Far as I am aware Eclipse was the only sub-label that Decca issued  and I quote "Stereo - Mono recording electronically reprocessed to give stereo effect on stereo equipment". Not all Eclipse were fake stereo, some were true stereo, for example the famous Borodin SQ of Borodin 2 & Shostakovich 8. I have all three, Decca, Ace of Diamonds and Eclipse I always play the Eclipse because it has the nicest cover image. 8)

Pleased you enjoyed the VC. Thanks for taking the time to listen.
Love the avatar image Lol. I think that VW's 8th Symphony (Decca Ace of Diamonds) was genuine stereo. I loved those old Eclipse covers and was amused by the Lake District in snow standing in for the Antarctic in VW's 7th Symphony.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 09:40:51 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 02, 2022, 09:15:14 AM
I love Mercury sound. I listened to the CD of Hanson's 4th Symphony after your recommendation recently. Excellent.

Hi Lol,
It's Koussevitzky's recording of Howard Hanson's 3rd Symphony which is super-special.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on November 02, 2022, 09:44:17 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 07:59:54 AM
Yes AFAIK PD. I think that if the inner wrapper was pink it was mono and if in blue it might be a simulated stereo. The older Decca Ace of Clubs was Mono and Ace of Diamonds was stereo and many preferred this.

In the U.S. Decca was "London" and old recordings were reissued in the "Stereo Treasure Series." I wonder if this corresponded to Ace of Diamonds. There was also a series of Mono reissues on the London label, but I don't recall what they were called.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2022, 10:40:29 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on November 02, 2022, 09:44:17 AM
In the U.S. Decca was "London" and old recordings were reissued in the "Stereo Treasure Series." I wonder if this corresponded to Ace of Diamonds. There was also a series of Mono reissues on the London label, but I don't recall what they were called.
Yes, thank you for the reminder.  I do have some of the "Stereo Treasure Series".

I did quickly find one older mono LP, but it was also released in stereo.  It's of highlights from Sylvia & Coppelia with Ansermet.  The record was made in England.  It says London Records (with logo) in the upper right-hand corner  with CM 9046 in the corner.  The label on the record is burgundy. The logo is also in a black rectangle and the cover is yellow with a photo of Dame Margot Fonteyn on the cover.  I can't find a photo online showing the exact same cover.

PD

EDIT:  Found it! (https://i.discogs.com/PMjKJJJEUZv6RoZKhSgnnG_xfuJbbkCpJ8x5vPJFLeU/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:450/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTEwNjc3/NDk2LTE1MDIyMTU5/NTEtNzA0Mi5qcGVn.jpeg)

(https://i.discogs.com/TG2FJvSVMrtuBuHaThI4ts59P_L67MgTO7YU8Be1HjU/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:450/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTEwNjc3/NDk2LTE1MDIyMTU5/NTQtOTI4OS5qcGVn.jpeg)
And thank you Discogs.  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 02, 2022, 12:48:03 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2022, 09:40:51 AM
Hi Lol,
It's Koussevitzky's recording of Howard Hanson's 3rd Symphony which is super-special.

Got it wrong, Jeffrey. Hanson's recording of his 3rd Symphony not 4th.

Edit. Yes, RVW 8th was indeed stereo.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 05, 2022, 01:36:13 AM

Spinning: Nielsen.

Tone Poems taken from big box (8 LPs) of Nielsen works including symphonies Biomstedt recorded with Danish Radio SO for EMI.
The tone poems may not be as good overall as Sibelius but I thought Pan and Syrinx along with Saga-Drom outstanding.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 05, 2022, 03:06:57 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 05, 2022, 01:36:13 AM
Spinning: Nielsen.

Tone Poems taken from big box (8 LPs) of Nielsen works including symphonies Biomstedt recorded with Danish Radio SO for EMI.
The tone poems may not be as good overall as Sibelius but I thought Pan and Syrinx along with Saga-Drom outstanding.
That's a fine LP which I have/had somewhere in my collection. Great cover art.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 06, 2022, 11:20:29 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 05, 2022, 03:06:57 PM
That's a fine LP which I have/had somewhere in my collection. Great cover art.

Illuminating background to each piece in the notes by the expert on Scandinavian music, the late Robert Layton.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 07, 2022, 01:14:34 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 06, 2022, 11:20:29 PM
Illuminating background to each piece in the notes by the expert on Scandinavian music, the late Robert Layton.
Yes, he was very good and wrote an excellent 'Master Musicians' biography of Sibelius. However, I didn't agree with him about Pettersson ('rampant self-pity') or with his negative assessment of Nystroem's 'Sinfonia del Mare' which I have just been playing and consider to be a beautiful work.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 07, 2022, 01:20:56 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 05, 2022, 01:36:13 AM
Spinning: Nielsen.

Tone Poems taken from big box (8 LPs) of Nielsen works including symphonies Biomstedt recorded with Danish Radio SO for EMI.
The tone poems may not be as good overall as Sibelius but I thought Pan and Syrinx along with Saga-Drom outstanding.
Looks like a cool set!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 07, 2022, 01:37:55 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 07, 2022, 01:20:56 AM
Looks like a cool set!

PD
+1
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on November 07, 2022, 01:47:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 05, 2022, 01:36:13 AM
Spinning: Nielsen.

Tone Poems taken from big box (8 LPs) of Nielsen works including symphonies Biomstedt recorded with Danish Radio SO for EMI.
The tone poems may not be as good overall as Sibelius but I thought Pan and Syrinx along with Saga-Drom outstanding.

A fine set: at the time I bought it the Schmidt cycle was reckoned by many to be better but I went for Blomstedt because it had the concertos and tone poems (and it was in the shop!)

Saga- Drom is one of my favourites. I first acquired it as a fill-up to Symphony No 5 from Horenstein/Philharmonia - my all-time favourite Nielsen disc.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 07, 2022, 06:55:00 AM
Quote from: Biffo on November 07, 2022, 01:47:06 AM
A fine set: at the time I bought it the Schmidt cycle was reckoned by many to be better but I went for Blomstedt because it had the concertos and tone poems (and it was in the shop!)

Saga- Drom is one of my favourites. I first acquired it as a fill-up to Symphony No 5 from Horenstein/Philharmonia - my all-time favourite Nielsen disc.

I enjoyed Saga-Drom very much.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 07, 2022, 07:15:29 AM
How are his first two symphonies?  I haven't heard those nor his tone poems.  I have this 2-CD set plus a few other ones (some of which include other symphonies of his).

(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/41OniglGZIL._SY498_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg)

(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51+va4ivY7L.jpg)

PD

p.s.  Sorry, I don't have any vinyl with Bloomstedt/Nielsen.  :(
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 07, 2022, 08:11:27 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 07, 2022, 07:15:29 AM
How are his first two symphonies?  I haven't heard those nor his tone poems.  I have this 2-CD set plus a few other ones (some of which include other symphonies of his).

(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/41OniglGZIL._SY498_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg)

(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51+va4ivY7L.jpg)

PD

p.s.  Sorry, I don't have any vinyl with Bloomstedt/Nielsen.  :(

I am in a minority (of possibly one) for Blomstedt not being first choice for Nielsen, PD. There is not a dud in all the symphonies. On vinyl first choice for the 1st is straightforward, Previn on RCA. The second is a more crowded field but I have not heard a recording on LP or CD of "The Four Temperaments" that compares with Thomas Jensen's 1947 recording. For Nielsen enthusiasts Keith Hardwick's remastering from 1985 of 2 (Jenson) 4 (Grondahl) 5 (Tuxen) and Clarinet Concerto which is a masterpiece, should not be missed. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 07, 2022, 10:38:45 AM
Thank you for your thoughts Lol, I'll see if I can find some samples on youtube.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 07, 2022, 10:58:13 AM
Quote from: Biffo on November 07, 2022, 01:47:06 AM
A fine set: at the time I bought it the Schmidt cycle was reckoned by many to be better but I went for Blomstedt because it had the concertos and tone poems (and it was in the shop!)

Saga- Drom is one of my favourites. I first acquired it as a fill-up to Symphony No 5 from Horenstein/Philharmonia - my all-time favourite Nielsen disc.
+1 for that Nielsen Horenstein CD, with a particularly anarchic side-drummer I recall.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 10, 2022, 11:27:14 PM
Kabalevsky on Melodiya: 3rd Piano Sonata & 2nd Cello Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/p8sA86E.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/EKqskxV.jpg)

Alexei Skavronsky performing the sonata and for the concerto Danil Shafran cello, conducted by the composer.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 11, 2022, 01:12:48 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 10, 2022, 11:27:14 PM
Kabalevsky on Melodiya: 3rd Piano Sonata & 2nd Cello Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/p8sA86E.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/EKqskxV.jpg)

Alexei Skavronsky performing the sonata and for the concerto Danil Shafran cello, conducted by the composer.
Have heard of him, but I don't know any of his music.

Went on a bit of a road trip with a friend today to a new-to-us record store and came back with a few albums.

[img size=500]https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/A1rvOWt9J-L._AC_SL1500_.jpg[/img]

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/A1EgrfUxR4L._SY355_.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/NB4AAOSwNvViBkpf/s-l1600.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/CI0AAOSwTZ1Xls67/s-l640.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/VisAAOSwKaRjJo93/s-l300.jpg)

The top one which isn't appearing at my end is of Michael Tippett on Loiseau Lyre of his string quartets 1-3 with the Lindsays.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 12, 2022, 12:58:49 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 11, 2022, 01:12:48 PM
Have heard of him, but I don't know any of his music.

Went on a bit of a road trip with a friend today to a new-to-us record store and came back with a few albums.

[img size=500]https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/A1rvOWt9J-L._AC_SL1500_.jpg[/img]

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/A1EgrfUxR4L._SY355_.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/NB4AAOSwNvViBkpf/s-l1600.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/CI0AAOSwTZ1Xls67/s-l640.jpg)

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/VisAAOSwKaRjJo93/s-l300.jpg)

The top one which isn't appearing at my end is of Michael Tippett on Loiseau Lyre of his string quartets 1-3 with the Lindsays.

PD

Brilliant haul PD. The Stravinsky stands out for me, I will look out for that one. I have the Lindsays SQ. If I recall correctly the cover depicts them along with Sir Michael laying in long grass, obviously none of the group suffer Hay Fever!

So you also now have that rarest of Nielsen works, Lille Suite.   ;)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 12, 2022, 04:59:07 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 12, 2022, 12:58:49 AM
Brilliant haul PD. The Stravinsky stands out for me, I will look out for that one. I have the Lindsays SQ. If I recall correctly the cover depicts them along with Sir Michael laying in long grass, obviously none of the group suffer Hay Fever!

So you also now have that rarest of Nielsen works, Lille Suite.   ;)
Thanks!

I found another image of the Tippett one:

(https://img.discogs.com/R36CctLGxZyGqc2ll0k7HZVkuWw=/fit-in/458x445/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-1722890-1239240045.jpeg.jpg)  And, yup, you are remembering correctly; the back cover shows the lot of them sitting on the ground in what looks like a field (with some tall grasses around).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 13, 2022, 11:13:48 PM
Spinning Bruckner.

(https://i.imgur.com/9RGEFgc.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/DmCBLu8.jpg)

The popularity of the 4th is well earned and I rate Bohm's highly with the wonderful Vienna Phil. Bruckner's 3rd does not quite do it for me. It doesn't help that the 2nd movement is spread over two sides. You would think old Anton would be more accommodating of time restraints of LP format when writing movements of his symphony. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 13, 2022, 11:36:20 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 10, 2022, 11:27:14 PM
Kabalevsky on Melodiya: 3rd Piano Sonata & 2nd Cello Concerto.

(https://i.imgur.com/p8sA86E.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/EKqskxV.jpg)

Alexei Skavronsky performing the sonata and for the concerto Danil Shafran cello, conducted by the composer.
Good Morning Lol.
Kabalevsky's 2nd Cello Concerto is his masterpiece and that performance with Daniel Shafran and Kabalevsky conducting is the best by far IMO. I have both the LP and the CD. The 2nd Cello Concerto belies the suggestion that Kabalevsky's music was effectively constructed but lacking the depth. The 1st PC, 1st SQ and 4th Symphony are other favourites. I think that he is a far more interesting composer than has often been suggested.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 14, 2022, 07:44:39 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 13, 2022, 11:36:20 PM
Good Morning Lol.
Kabalevsky's 2nd Cello Concerto is his masterpiece and that performance with Daniel Shafran and Kabalevsky conducting is the best by far IMO. I have both the LP and the CD. The 2nd Cello Concerto belies the suggestion that Kabalevsky's music was effectively constructed but lacking the depth. The 1st PC, 1st SQ and 4th Symphony are other favourites. I think that he is a far more interesting composer than has often been suggested.

Wholeheartedly agree, Jeffrey. Listening to his 2nd Cello Concerto I had the thought it compares favourably with the Shostakovich 1st for the same instrument. Sacrilege I know, but as my daughter is fond of saying "it is what it is". He wrote a lot of piano music for young people which is something he cared about, but directly he writes a "serious" piece the accusation is made that the influence of Prokofiev is overly strong. Kabalevsky's teacher Miaskovsky was very close to Prokofiev so of course influence will filter down. The 3rd Sonata is a terrific piece, just listen to the third movement it takes off like a rocket! Must be fiendishly difficult to play at that speed.

(https://i.imgur.com/uoZXymk.jpg)

I would add this to your list of worthwhile pieces Jeffrey with depth aplenty.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 15, 2022, 04:38:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 14, 2022, 07:44:39 AM
Wholeheartedly agree, Jeffrey. Listening to his 2nd Cello Concerto I had the thought it compares favourably with the Shostakovich 1st for the same instrument. Sacrilege I know, but as my daughter is fond of saying "it is what it is". He wrote a lot of piano music for young people which is something he cared about, but directly he writes a "serious" piece the accusation is made that the influence of Prokofiev is overly strong. Kabalevsky's teacher Miaskovsky was very close to Prokofiev so of course influence will filter down. The 3rd Sonata is a terrific piece, just listen to the third movement it takes off like a rocket! Must be fiendishly difficult to play at that speed.

(https://i.imgur.com/uoZXymk.jpg)

I would add this to your list of worthwhile pieces Jeffrey with depth aplenty.
Thanks Lol - I remember that LP but don't think that I ever owned it. I will look out for a recording. I like 'it is what it is'  :)
PS If it's the same work as features here I do have it and agree that it is a work of considerable depth:
(//)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 15, 2022, 07:53:48 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 15, 2022, 04:38:26 AM
Thanks Lol - I remember that LP but don't think that I ever owned it. I will look out for a recording. I like 'it is what it is'  :)
PS If it's the same work as features here I do have it and agree that it is a work of considerable depth:
(//)

Rostropovich with Kabalevsky as pianist take the opening to another level (of depth).

First movement of the Kabalevsky Cello Sonata https://youtu.be/_Xt-3VkuTC8

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 16, 2022, 12:33:03 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 15, 2022, 07:53:48 AM
Rostropovich with Kabalevsky as pianist take the opening to another level (of depth).

First movement of the Kabalevsky Cello Sonata https://youtu.be/_Xt-3VkuTC8
Thanks Lol. At work but I'll listen later.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 17, 2022, 11:39:16 PM
Shostakovich: 2nd Piano Concerto.
Bartok: 3rd Piano Concerto.

Acquisition from early this week. I loved both works but Bartok just shaded it, I think. Surprising that he wrote such a warm and uncomplicated piece at the end of his life after the hard-edged uncompromising works that proceeded it. John Ogdon plays superbly, good sound too.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 20, 2022, 12:28:57 AM
But wouldn't they have to print somewhere the name of their (Testament's) label and/or other info?  And when were they doing this?
PD.

Comparing the back covers of Previn/Rach 2 of the original EMI and Testament issues they are identical. The word "Testament" is nowhere to be found on cover or LP.

LPs were initially released one every three months and offered for sale through as it was called then "International Classical Record Collector" around the mid-1990's.

Edit: Photos below poor so to quote the leaflet - Revived from the original EMI master tapes, cut on to lacquer at EMI's Abbey Road Studios and mastered using full analogue techniques throughout production, these LPs are hand-pressed on top-quality 180gm virgin vinyl at EMI's Hayes pressing plant, individually inspected and hand-packed in original-design sleeve artwork.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 20, 2022, 02:58:21 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 20, 2022, 12:28:57 AM
But wouldn't they have to print somewhere the name of their (Testament's) label and/or other info?  And when were they doing this?
PD.

Comparing the back covers of Previn/Rach 2 of the original EMI and Testament issues they are identical. The word "Testament" is nowhere to be found on cover or LP.

LPs were initially released one every three months and offered for sale through as it was called then "International Classical Record Collector" around the mid-1990's.

Edit: Photos below poor so to quote the leaflet - Revived from the original EMI master tapes, cut on to lacquer at EMI's Abbey Road Studios and mastered using full analogue techniques throughout production, these LPs are hand-pressed on top-quality 180gm virgin vinyl at EMI's Hayes pressing plant, individually inspected and hand-packed in original-design sleeve artwork.
So, other than that one difference on that EMI/HMV LP, there's no way to tell those various records apart?

And thank you for the pics and extra info!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2022, 04:10:25 AM
O.k., so I decided to take another look at what I thought was a suspicious "union" between a sleeve and an LP; I had assumed that it was a mismatch, but am thinking now perhaps not?  Would love you vinyl experts' feedback.

The sleeve is an EMI with square logo in upper left-hand corner in black and white with Nipper & gramophone and "His Master's Voice" underneath.  It's Sibelious' Sym. No. 5 & Finlandia with Philharmonia Orch. and HvK.  On the back (bottom right) it says printed in Belgium by ....

The record label, however, is all in Italian.  It has the logo in color this time and in the logo box, it says "La Voce Del Pardon".  Everything on it is in Italian except for an additional "Made in Italy". 

So, now I'm thinking that it was along the same lines as I've run across in the US in which I'll often finds that the record was manufactured in Italy and the sleeve was printed elsewhere (in this case Belgium).  Whose market then was this one geared for?

I have run across other instances in which the cover was a different edition than the LP though (I swear that I have!).  Has anyone else here experienced this?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 21, 2022, 05:28:32 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2022, 04:10:25 AM
O.k., so I decided to take another look at what I thought was a suspicious "union" between a sleeve and an LP; I had assumed that it was a mismatch, but am thinking now perhaps not?  Would love you vinyl experts' feedback.

The sleeve is an EMI with square logo in upper left-hand corner in black and white with Nipper & gramophone and "His Master's Voice" underneath.  It's Sibelious' Sym. No. 5 & Finlandia with Philharmonia Orch. and HvK.  On the back (bottom right) it says printed in Belgium by ....

The record label, however, is all in Italian.  It has the logo in color this time and in the logo box, it says "La Voce Del Pardon".  Everything on it is in Italian except for an additional "Made in Italy". 

So, now I'm thinking that it was along the same lines as I've run across in the US in which I'll often finds that the record was manufactured in Italy and the sleeve was printed elsewhere (in this case Belgium).  Whose market then was this one geared for?

I have run across other instances in which the cover was a different edition than the LP though (I swear that I have!).  Has anyone else here experienced this?

PD
I know what you mean PD but I'm not sure of the answer. Lol (Irons) may be able to clarify the situation.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2022, 06:06:16 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2022, 04:10:25 AM
O.k., so I decided to take another look at what I thought was a suspicious "union" between a sleeve and an LP; I had assumed that it was a mismatch, but am thinking now perhaps not?  Would love you vinyl experts' feedback.

The sleeve is an EMI with square logo in upper left-hand corner in black and white with Nipper & gramophone and "His Master's Voice" underneath.  It's Sibelious' Sym. No. 5 & Finlandia with Philharmonia Orch. and HvK.  On the back (bottom right) it says printed in Belgium by ....

The record label, however, is all in Italian.  It has the logo in color this time and in the logo box, it says "La Voce Del Pardon".  Everything on it is in Italian except for an additional "Made in Italy". 

So, now I'm thinking that it was along the same lines as I've run across in the US in which I'll often finds that the record was manufactured in Italy and the sleeve was printed elsewhere (in this case Belgium).  Whose market then was this one geared for?

I have run across other instances in which the cover was a different edition than the LP though (I swear that I have!).  Has anyone else here experienced this?

PD
EDIT:  I had meant to say that the sleeve was made in one country whilst the LP was pressed elsewhere--I'll often run across records manufactured in England whilst the sleeve was made in the US.

Quote from: vandermolen on November 21, 2022, 05:28:32 AM
I know what you mean PD but I'm not sure of the answer. Lol (Irons) may be able to clarify the situation.
Thanks!  I'm sure that someone here has the answer and has seen something like this re other countries and pressings and markets.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 21, 2022, 08:17:04 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2022, 04:10:25 AM
O.k., so I decided to take another look at what I thought was a suspicious "union" between a sleeve and an LP; I had assumed that it was a mismatch, but am thinking now perhaps not?  Would love you vinyl experts' feedback.

The sleeve is an EMI with square logo in upper left-hand corner in black and white with Nipper & gramophone and "His Master's Voice" underneath.  It's Sibelious' Sym. No. 5 & Finlandia with Philharmonia Orch. and HvK.  On the back (bottom right) it says printed in Belgium by ....

The record label, however, is all in Italian.  It has the logo in color this time and in the logo box, it says "La Voce Del Pardon".  Everything on it is in Italian except for an additional "Made in Italy". 

So, now I'm thinking that it was along the same lines as I've run across in the US in which I'll often finds that the record was manufactured in Italy and the sleeve was printed elsewhere (in this case Belgium).  Whose market then was this one geared for?

I have run across other instances in which the cover was a different edition than the LP though (I swear that I have!).  Has anyone else here experienced this?

PD

Interesting. EMI Germany and France LP issues are plentiful and excellent pressings. I do not recall EMI Italy but checking Discogs indeed they are. I have come across many Italian pressings licensed from Supraphon but not EMI. I would guess your record is for the Italian market.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2022, 09:03:51 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 21, 2022, 08:17:04 AM
Interesting. EMI Germany and France LP issues are plentiful and excellent pressings. I do not recall EMI Italy but checking Discogs indeed they are. I have come across many Italian pressings licensed from Supraphon but not EMI. I would guess your record is for the Italian market.
One other thing that I thought seemed a bit strange:  the label on the record says stereo, but there's nothing about that on the cover.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 22, 2022, 12:07:57 AM
Looked it up in John Hunt's label discography.

Recorded in Kingsway Hall, London on 20-23 September 1960 and 5-6 January 1959 respectively. Producer Walter Legg. Published 1961. LP matrix numbers XAX 23O1-2302.
Karajan Philharmonia.
Symphony no.5 LP SAX 2392/SAXQ 7328/WC 558/C 70480/STC 70480
other LP issues: angel 35922/emi SXLP 30430/1C05323/1C05303791
CD:emi CDM 566 5992.

Finlandia LP SAX 2392/SAXQ 7328
other LP issues: angel 35922/37232/emi SLS5019/1C053 00523/1C181 25307-25311
CD:emi CDM769 4672/CZS252 1592/royal classics ROY6475/discy DCL 705 872/HR 700 O62
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 22, 2022, 02:53:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 22, 2022, 12:07:57 AM
Looked it up in John Hunt's label discography.

Recorded in Kingsway Hall, London on 20-23 September 1960 and 5-6 January 1959 respectively. Producer Walter Legg. Published 1961. LP matrix numbers XAX 23O1-2302.
Karajan Philharmonia.
Symphony no.5 LP SAX 2392/SAXQ 7328/WC 558/C 70480/STC 70480
other LP issues: angel 35922/emi SXLP 30430/1C05323/1C05303791
CD:emi CDM 566 5992.

Finlandia LP SAX 2392/SAXQ 7328
other LP issues: angel 35922/37232/emi SLS5019/1C053 00523/1C181 25307-25311
CD:emi CDM769 4672/CZS252 1592/royal classics ROY6475/discy DCL 705 872/HR 700 O62

Thank you for the further information.  That was very kind of you to look that up and type it out for me!  :)  Interestingly, on the cover (again printed in Belgium) the number starts off with a 4 rather than a one.  As in, outside but next to the box is a 4 followed by (inside the box) C053-00523.  And on the label, instead of a 4 it starts with a 3.  I suspect that has something to do with either the market and/or licensing?

Anyway, thanks again!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 22, 2022, 06:59:23 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 22, 2022, 02:53:33 AM
Thank you for the further information.  That was very kind of you to look that up and type it out for me!  :)  Interestingly, on the cover (again printed in Belgium) the number starts off with a 4 rather than a one.  As in, outside but next to the box is a 4 followed by (inside the box) C053-00523.  And on the label, instead of a 4 it starts with a 3.  I suspect that has something to do with either the market and/or licensing?

Anyway, thanks again!

PD

Out of interest PD would you post the matrix on the dead wax of your LP?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 22, 2022, 11:57:50 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 22, 2022, 06:59:23 AM
Out of interest PD would you post the matrix on the dead wax of your LP?


Listed in the runout groove:

Is  00523-A   YAX 659-5
     00523-B   YAX 660-1 (Side 2) also has (what I'm guessing is the date?  Is it of the pressing?  Or the recording)?

What do these numbers and letters tell us Lol?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 23, 2022, 01:03:05 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 22, 2022, 11:57:50 AMListed in the runout groove:

Is  00523-A   YAX 659-5
     00523-B   YAX 660-1 (Side 2) also has (what I'm guessing is the date?  Is it of the pressing?  Or the recording)?

What do these numbers and letters tell us Lol?

PD

I cannot be certain PD as a foreign issue makes it awkward. What is certain, an original Columbia recording released by EMI Italy under licence. I have from the same set on mono Columbia matrix XAX 827-3N as you can see the matrix are similar. 00523 is the number designated to this recording. YAX is I guess Italian Columbia, the three digits are the lacquer and -5 -1 the stamper. This can vary between sides as the mastering engineer will discard a stamper if he is not happy with it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 23, 2022, 04:02:42 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 22, 2022, 11:57:50 AMListed in the runout groove:

Is  00523-A  YAX 659-5
    00523-B  YAX 660-1 (Side 2) also has (what I'm guessing is the date?  Is it of the pressing?  Or the recording)?

What do these numbers and letters tell us Lol?

PD

Quote from: Irons on November 23, 2022, 01:03:05 AMI cannot be certain PD as a foreign issue makes it awkward. What is certain, an original Columbia recording released by EMI Italy under licence. I have from the same set on mono Columbia matrix XAX 827-3N as you can see the matrix are similar. 00523 is the number designated to this recording. YAX is I guess Italian Columbia, the three digits are the lacquer and -5 -1 the stamper. This can vary between sides as the mastering engineer will discard a stamper if he is not happy with it.
Interesting...thank you for deciphering that for me!  :D I had meant to add that the date on Side 2 is 20-11-61.  No date on Side 1.

Is the ending "..AX" used exclusively for Columbia recordings?

As a side note, it's interesting that your example of an EMI Italian recording shows the cover being in Italian and with the same logo that is on my label, but not the cover.  Was that Bruckner example also originally released on Columbia?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 23, 2022, 07:24:26 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 23, 2022, 04:02:42 AMInteresting...thank you for deciphering that for me!  :D I had meant to add that the date on Side 2 is 20-11-61.  No date on Side 1.

Is the ending "..AX" used exclusively for Columbia recordings?

As a side note, it's interesting that your example of an EMI Italian recording shows the cover being in Italian and with the same logo that is on my label, but not the cover.  Was that Bruckner example also originally released on Columbia?

PD

Yes, SAX recordings are famous. UK Columbia stereo are very collectable, especially blue and silver label.

I have not checked but doubtful the Bruckner was an original Columbia release. British Columbia was Walter Legge's fiefdom. He produced fabulous records with the Philharmonia at Kingsway Hall with many conductors including Karajan.

What I find slightly odd your cover does not have a red border. The French and German issues in my experience always do. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 23, 2022, 02:28:14 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 23, 2022, 04:02:42 AMInteresting...thank you for deciphering that for me!  :D I had meant to add that the date on Side 2 is 20-11-61.  No date on Side 1.

Is the ending "..AX" used exclusively for Columbia recordings?

As a side note, it's interesting that your example of an EMI Italian recording shows the cover being in Italian and with the same logo that is on my label, but not the cover.  Was that Bruckner example also originally released on Columbia?

PD
Yes, thanks, I know that about SAX recordings.  :)  I don't think that you understood my question:  what I was wondering was whether all (at least during a certain time period perhaps?) were given a "x" AX designation with the "x" meaning some letter--not necessarily "S" as you had mentioned earlier and the difference in the lettering as you had mentioned.

And regarding the red border and cover...that's why I was thinking that the cover didn't "fit" the album (maybe not the border?  I don't know)...due to the differences in logo and colors, not mentioning that it was a stereo recording, etc.  At some point in time, I'll try googling a bit further about this album.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 23, 2022, 11:25:37 PM
I don't know PD but certain it is not a time thing, location more likely or stereo/mono. Record companies were secretive with their coding. Columbia mono blue and gold label (UK) are 33CX.

Currently spinning Rubbra.

(https://i.imgur.com/0J4D4S2.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/UvjPRbp.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 24, 2022, 10:04:30 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 23, 2022, 11:25:37 PMI don't know PD but certain it is not a time thing, location more likely or stereo/mono. Record companies were secretive with their coding. Columbia mono blue and gold label (UK) are 33CX.

Currently spinning Rubbra.

(https://i.imgur.com/0J4D4S2.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/UvjPRbp.jpg)
Two fine Rubbra discs! I've been listening to the 10th Symphony recently.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 24, 2022, 11:02:45 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 24, 2022, 10:04:30 PMTwo fine Rubbra discs! I've been listening to the 10th Symphony recently.

It was your post that nudged me to play it, Jeffrey.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 26, 2022, 01:38:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 24, 2022, 11:02:45 PMIt was your post that nudged me to play it, Jeffrey.
Excellent Lol!
Interesting that the Rubbra 10th LP was partly to commemorate the Silver Jubilee of the Late HM in 1977. I remember the LP well with its nice photo of Rubbra on the sleeve.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 27, 2022, 01:38:21 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 26, 2022, 01:38:28 AMExcellent Lol!
Interesting that the Rubbra 10th LP was partly to commemorate the Silver Jubilee of the Late HM in 1977. I remember the LP well with its nice photo of Rubbra on the sleeve.

A photo which makes me think of Col Sanders, Jeffrey. :)

A couple of things of interest, beside the music of course which is superb, although released by RCA, an early Chandos production with Brian Couzens as sound engineer. Also sponsored by Harvey's.

This album of music by Edmund Rubbra is the second disc in the Harveys of Bristol English series. A new and exciting collaboration between industry and the arts, the series will combine both the better and lesser-known British composers and works. Devoted to the lovers of English music, it will be played throughout by the Bournemouth Sinfonietta.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 02, 2022, 11:16:09 PM
Spinning Kodaly.

(https://i.imgur.com/ottLv67.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/CQHD00g.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 03, 2022, 01:17:24 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 27, 2022, 01:38:21 AMA photo which makes me think of Col Sanders, Jeffrey. :)

A couple of things of interest, beside the music of course which is superb, although released by RCA, an early Chandos production with Brian Couzens as sound engineer. Also sponsored by Harvey's.

This album of music by Edmund Rubbra is the second disc in the Harveys of Bristol English series. A new and exciting collaboration between industry and the arts, the series will combine both the better and lesser-known British composers and works. Devoted to the lovers of English music, it will be played throughout by the Bournemouth Sinfonietta.   
Makes me think that I should have a mid-morning glass of sherry later!  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Papy Oli on December 03, 2022, 01:26:47 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 03, 2022, 01:17:24 AMMakes me think that I should have a mid-morning glass of sherry later!  ;D

It'll soon be Christmas... you're allowed.  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 03, 2022, 02:10:59 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 02, 2022, 11:16:09 PMSpinning Kodaly.

(https://i.imgur.com/ottLv67.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/CQHD00g.jpg)
I'm envious of you Lol.  I'm sure those are excellent albums!.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 04, 2022, 12:42:02 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 03, 2022, 02:10:59 AMI'm envious of you Lol.  I'm sure those are excellent albums!.

PD

If I recall correctly you are an admirer of his Cello Sonata, PD.

Don't feel down about your team in the footie. They exceeded all expectations and gave England a scare as well.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 04, 2022, 02:02:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 04, 2022, 12:42:02 AMIf I recall correctly you are an admirer of his Cello Sonata, PD.

Don't feel down about your team in the footie. They exceeded all expectations and gave England a scare as well.
A Big fan!  ;D

And thanks!  :-*  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 06, 2022, 11:26:12 PM
Patterson: Concerto for Orchestra.

A late Teldec pressing - still pressing records in 1987 - side 2 includes both Missa brevis and Europhony with timing total at 34.32! Complete with the smallest run-out groove I have ever seen. Thanks to DMM (Direct Metal Mastering) technology without loss in dynamics or sound quality.

Not 100% sure but think Patterson is the only living Classical composer featuring on LP record on my shelves. Have a lot of dead people though. :D 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2022, 05:25:04 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 06, 2022, 11:26:12 PMPatterson: Concerto for Orchestra.

A late Teldec pressing - still pressing records in 1987 - side 2 includes both Missa brevis and Europhony with timing total at 34.32! Complete with the smallest run-out groove I have ever seen. Thanks to DMM (Direct Metal Mastering) technology without loss in dynamics or sound quality.

Not 100% sure but think Patterson is the only living Classical composer featuring on LP record on my shelves. Have a lot of dead people though. :D
I was going to suggest Birtwhistle, but I see that he died in April of this year.

I'll bet that some of the contemporary composers have released some recordings on LP.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 07, 2022, 08:03:02 AM
I dare say they have, PD. I was referring to LPs I own. Came up with a few, Michael Berkeley for one and  Alexander Goehr is still with us aged 90 also at 86 David Blake.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2022, 08:32:38 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 07, 2022, 08:03:02 AMI dare say they have, PD. I was referring to LPs I own. Came up with a few, Michael Berkeley for one and  Alexander Goehr is still with us aged 90 also at 86 David Blake.
So, you haven't purchased any contemporary British composer's music (yet?) on LP?  All CDs?

But good digging/sleuthing at your end!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on December 07, 2022, 09:23:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 02, 2022, 11:16:09 PMSpinning Kodaly.

(https://i.imgur.com/ottLv67.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/CQHD00g.jpg)

The Dorati/Decca looks so so cool!
I will use the cover art for my album on iPod.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2022, 09:43:08 AM
Quote from: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on December 07, 2022, 09:23:33 AMThe Dorati/Decca looks so so cool!
I will use the cover art for my album on iPod.
It is a great cover.  Love the painting and the use of color and print in the cover design.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 08, 2022, 12:32:55 AM
Quote from: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on December 07, 2022, 09:23:33 AMThe Dorati/Decca looks so so cool!
I will use the cover art for my album on iPod.

Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2022, 09:43:08 AMIt is a great cover.  Love the painting and the use of color and print in the cover design.  :)

PD

Agreed. The artist is Caesar Kunwald. The LP above is Vol.1. I also own Vol.3 featuring a cover by the same artist.

(https://i.imgur.com/MkQ2lB1.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2022, 06:45:17 AM
I'm curious here to know if anyone else has heard and/or has recordings by the Lithunian String Quartet?

I ran across an upload on youtube (when I was trying to find any recordings by the Beethoven String Quartet) of B's No. 5.  It was on a 10-inch LP on Melodiya.  Apparently, they went through several name iterations (minor variances)--or maybe this was due more to the production at the label's end?  In any event, I quite enjoyed it.  Discogs has some info about the group there.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 08, 2022, 08:44:15 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2022, 06:45:17 AMI'm curious here to know if anyone else has heard and/or has recordings by the Lithunian String Quartet?

I ran across an upload on youtube (when I was trying to find any recordings by the Beethoven String Quartet) of B's No. 5.  It was on a 10-inch LP on Melodiya.  Apparently, they went through several name iterations (minor variances)--or maybe this was due more to the production at the label's end?  In any event, I quite enjoyed it.  Discogs has some info about the group there.

PD

My guess this is the Vilnius Quartet as Vilnius is the capital of Lithuania. They used the Ciurlionis art gallery in Vilnius as a recording venue. Ciurlionis was both an artist and composer and a very good one too.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2022, 09:01:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 08, 2022, 08:44:15 AMMy guess this is the Vilnius Quartet as Vilnius is the capital of Lithuania. They used the Ciurlionis art gallery in Vilnius as a recording venue. Ciurlionis was both an artist and composer and a very good one too.

I tried googling the name on the upload and had it translated to english.  Apparently the Valst. is short for Government but I couldn't find out what Nusip (which is an abbreviation ) means.  Any idea?

And, yes, Discogs does say that the group was founded in Vilnius (I had quoted them on the "What are you listening to now" thread).  Here's a copy of that and a link:  https://www.discogs.com/artist/1373305-Lietuvos-Kvartetas

"Lietuvos Kvartetas
Lietuvos Kvartetas
More Images

Real Name:
Lietuvos Kvartetas
Profile:
Lietuvos Kvartetas (Lithuanian Quartet) was a string quartet founded in Vilnius in 1945. It specialized in chamber music and played works of both classical and contemporary composers. The quartet was among the prize winners of international music festivals in Budapest, Hungary (1959) and Liège, Belgium (1964). Lietuvos Kvartetas ceased to exist in 1997.

Former members:
First Violin - Eugenijus Paulauskas (1946 – 1978 and 1981 – 1997)
Second Violin - Kornelija Kalinauskaitė (1946 - 1981)
Viola - Jurgis Fledžinskas (1946 - 1981)
Cello - Michail Šenderov (1952 – 1961)
Cello - Romualdas Kulikauskas (1962 - 1990)
More
Members:
Ernestas Bertovskis, Eugenijus Paulauskas, Jurgis Fledžinskas, Kornelija Kalinauskaitė, Michailas Šenderovas, Romualdas Kulikauskas
Variations:
Viewing All | Lietuvos Kvartetas
LTSR Nusip. Kol. Valst. Filharmonijos Styg. Kvartetas, LTSR Nusip. Valst. Styginis Kvartetas, LTSR Nusipelnes Meno Kolekt. Valst. Kvartetas, LTSR Nusipelnęs Valstybinis Kvartetas, LTSR Valst. Filharmonijos Kvartetas, LTSR Valst. Filharmonijos Styg. Kvartetas, LTSR Valst. Kvartetas, Leedu Keelpillikvartett, Lietuvos Styginių Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Nusip. Valst. Styginis Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Nusip. Valstybinis Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Valst. Filharmonijos Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Valst. Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Valst. Styginis Kvartetas, Lietuvos Valst. Filharmonijos Kvartetas, Lietuvos Valstybinis Kvartetas, Lithuanian Quartet, Lithuanian State Philharmonic Society Quartet, Lithuanian State Quartet, Quartet Of Lithuanian State Philharmonic Society, Styg. Kvartetas, Гос. Квартет Литовской ССР, Квартет Гос. Филармонии Литовской ССР, Квартет Лит. Гос. Филарм., Квартет Литовской Гос. Филармонии, Литовский Квартет"

Have you heard any of their recordings Irons?

I do have a couple of things by Ciurlionis.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 09, 2022, 12:29:02 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2022, 09:01:43 AMI tried googling the name on the upload and had it translated to english.  Apparently the Valst. is short for Government but I couldn't find out what Nusip (which is an abbreviation ) means.  Any idea?

And, yes, Discogs does say that the group was founded in Vilnius (I had quoted them on the "What are you listening to now" thread).  Here's a copy of that and a link:  https://www.discogs.com/artist/1373305-Lietuvos-Kvartetas

"Lietuvos Kvartetas
Lietuvos Kvartetas
More Images

Real Name:
Lietuvos Kvartetas
Profile:
Lietuvos Kvartetas (Lithuanian Quartet) was a string quartet founded in Vilnius in 1945. It specialized in chamber music and played works of both classical and contemporary composers. The quartet was among the prize winners of international music festivals in Budapest, Hungary (1959) and Liège, Belgium (1964). Lietuvos Kvartetas ceased to exist in 1997.

Former members:
First Violin - Eugenijus Paulauskas (1946 – 1978 and 1981 – 1997)
Second Violin - Kornelija Kalinauskaitė (1946 - 1981)
Viola - Jurgis Fledžinskas (1946 - 1981)
Cello - Michail Šenderov (1952 – 1961)
Cello - Romualdas Kulikauskas (1962 - 1990)
More
Members:
Ernestas Bertovskis, Eugenijus Paulauskas, Jurgis Fledžinskas, Kornelija Kalinauskaitė, Michailas Šenderovas, Romualdas Kulikauskas
Variations:
Viewing All | Lietuvos Kvartetas
LTSR Nusip. Kol. Valst. Filharmonijos Styg. Kvartetas, LTSR Nusip. Valst. Styginis Kvartetas, LTSR Nusipelnes Meno Kolekt. Valst. Kvartetas, LTSR Nusipelnęs Valstybinis Kvartetas, LTSR Valst. Filharmonijos Kvartetas, LTSR Valst. Filharmonijos Styg. Kvartetas, LTSR Valst. Kvartetas, Leedu Keelpillikvartett, Lietuvos Styginių Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Nusip. Valst. Styginis Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Nusip. Valstybinis Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Valst. Filharmonijos Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Valst. Kvartetas, Lietuvos TSR Valst. Styginis Kvartetas, Lietuvos Valst. Filharmonijos Kvartetas, Lietuvos Valstybinis Kvartetas, Lithuanian Quartet, Lithuanian State Philharmonic Society Quartet, Lithuanian State Quartet, Quartet Of Lithuanian State Philharmonic Society, Styg. Kvartetas, Гос. Квартет Литовской ССР, Квартет Гос. Филармонии Литовской ССР, Квартет Лит. Гос. Филарм., Квартет Литовской Гос. Филармонии, Литовский Квартет"

Have you heard any of their recordings Irons?

I do have a couple of things by Ciurlionis.  :)

PD

That settles it, my theory is wrong as members of Vilnius Quartet are A. Vainiunate, P. Kuntsa, D. Katkus and A. Vasiliauskas. I will listen to the upload of Lithunian SQ on YouTube with interest.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 15, 2022, 11:24:30 PM
Hindemith: Symphonic Metamorphoses on Themes by Weber.

(https://i.imgur.com/DgqQE7M.jpg)

Hindemith is sometimes portrayed as a dry composer. "Metamorphoses" is anything but, in fact a hoot.

(https://i.imgur.com/iMUlpLw.jpg)

Not much to choose between Abbado and Ormandy. Slightly clearer recording in the former but Ormandy brings a touch more swagger.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 22, 2022, 01:36:25 PM
Current listening inspired by discussions on other threads.

(https://i.imgur.com/8spedCF.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/9Tq72Ap.jpg)

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 22, 2022, 11:23:46 PM
Quote from: Irons on December 22, 2022, 01:36:25 PMCurrent listening inspired by discussions on other threads.

(https://i.imgur.com/8spedCF.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/9Tq72Ap.jpg)


Two great LPs!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 23, 2022, 11:49:54 PM
A couple of early Lyrita recordings made by Richard Itter in his home studio. The sound is dry but the ear soon adjusts.
Gordon Jacob's Piano Sonata - his only large scale work for solo piano - surprised me. I had Jacob down as a conservative composer. I need to revise that as this at times fiery sonata is a tour de force.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 23, 2022, 11:58:54 PM
Quote from: Irons on December 23, 2022, 11:49:54 PMA couple of early Lyrita recordings made by Richard Itter in his home studio. The sound is dry but the ear soon adjusts.
Gordon Jacob's Piano Sonata - his only large scale work for solo piano - surprised me. I had Jacob down as a conservative composer. I need to revise that as this at times fiery sonata is a tour de force.
Interesting Lol. Jacob is an interesting composer. I've been waiting for decades for his Concerto for Two Pianos (three hands) to be released on CD. It was left out when its LP companions by Bliss and Arnold were transferred to CD.
Happy Christmas
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 26, 2022, 12:36:42 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 23, 2022, 11:58:54 PMInteresting Lol. Jacob is an interesting composer. I've been waiting for decades for his Concerto for Two Pianos (three hands) to be released on CD. It was left out when its LP companions by Bliss and Arnold were transferred to CD.
Happy Christmas

And a happy New Year to you, Jeffrey.

Most interesting to read your comments on the Jacob Concerto. Had a look in the usual places and the recording you mention is readily available on LP. I noted also available on the reissue "Greensleeves" label. Little confidence in the Royal Mail at present but will possibly look in obtaining a copy in the new year.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 26, 2022, 10:42:53 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 26, 2022, 12:36:42 AMAnd a happy New Year to you, Jeffrey.

Most interesting to read your comments on the Jacob Concerto. Had a look in the usual places and the recording you mention is readily available on LP. I noted also available on the reissue "Greensleeves" label. Little confidence in the Royal Mail at present but will possibly look in obtaining a copy in the new year.
Thank you Lol - and to you too.
Yes, that's a fine LP (all three works) - a pity that the Jacob got left out in the cold. It's a very catchy work. The other favourite is his First Symphony, especially the very moving slow movement in memory of his brother killed in the First World War.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 30, 2022, 12:08:48 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 26, 2022, 10:42:53 AMThank you Lol - and to you too.
Yes, that's a fine LP (all three works) - a pity that the Jacob got left out in the cold. It's a very catchy work. The other favourite is his First Symphony, especially the very moving slow movement in memory of his brother killed in the First World War.

Thanks Jeffrey I have ordered the LP. Arnold conducting Jacob is an added attraction.

Spinning.Copland conducts Copland in the CBS 'Meet the Composer' series.

(https://i.imgur.com/rM6uIcN.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/0t63FA0.jpg)

Copland is a very consistent composer. I have yet to hear a dud.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 30, 2022, 03:29:12 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 30, 2022, 12:08:48 AMThanks Jeffrey I have ordered the LP. Arnold conducting Jacob is an added attraction.

Spinning.Copland conducts Copland in the CBS 'Meet the Composer' series.

(https://i.imgur.com/rM6uIcN.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/0t63FA0.jpg)

Copland is a very consistent composer. I have yet to hear a dud.
Nice!  :) Glad that you are enjoying his music.

In a few minutes, CBS This Morning (a nationally televised t.v. show) will be doing a segment on Abbey Road and Paul McCartney which I'm looking forward to watching.

EDIT:  It was actually an interview with Mary McCartney who directed a documentary about Abbey Road studios called "If These Walls Could Sing" and included interviews with some of the artists who recorded there (and not just rock musicians).  Apparently, it's currently streaming on Disney+.  Not certain how you can watch it otherwise.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 30, 2022, 06:12:28 AM
Hit 90 pages. Ten more to go and I will sit back and light a cigar (not really). 8)

Rate Copland highly, PD. Every piece has his stamp - how do composers do that? A recognisable string sound.

I do not have the Disney channel which is a shame as the programme sounds interesting.

BTW Happy New Year. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 30, 2022, 07:09:37 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 30, 2022, 06:12:28 AMHit 90 pages. Ten more to go and I will sit back and light a cigar (not really). 8)

Rate Copland highly, PD. Every piece has his stamp - how do composers do that? A recognisable string sound.

I do not have the Disney channel which is a shame as the programme sounds interesting.

BTW Happy New Year. 
;D

There's a trailer for it here:  https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=if+these+walls+could+sing

Doing a quick bit of googling, it looks like Hulu (at least in the US) has a free month streaming trial (which includes Disney+ ).

Perhaps there's something similar that you could try in the UK?  Or possibly just sign up for one month then cancel it?  https://thestreamable.com/uk/news/how-to-watch-abbey-road-documentary-if-these-walls-could-sing

I did also run across this article which it says that it will be released in the UK on January 6th.  https://whatsondisneyplus.com/how-to-watch-if-these-walls-could-sing/

And a very Happy New Year to you too!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 31, 2022, 03:46:44 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 30, 2022, 12:08:48 AMThanks Jeffrey I have ordered the LP. Arnold conducting Jacob is an added attraction.

Spinning.Copland conducts Copland in the CBS 'Meet the Composer' series.

(https://i.imgur.com/rM6uIcN.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/0t63FA0.jpg)

Copland is a very consistent composer. I have yet to hear a dud.
I remember having to smuggle that 'Outdoor Overture' LP past my parents!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 31, 2022, 03:57:06 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 31, 2022, 03:46:44 AMI remember having to smuggle that 'Outdoor Overture' LP past my parents!
Past your parents?  Why?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 31, 2022, 05:21:38 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 31, 2022, 03:57:06 AMPast your parents?  Why?

PD
Like my wife they complained about me buying LPs (or in her case CDs)
I had a clever strategy which involved sneaking round to my ground-floor bedroom through the communal garden, throwing the LP onto the floor through the opening left in the window for out cats to go in and out, before appearing, all innocent looking, at the front door of our flat (apartment) a few moments later.  ::)  >:D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 01, 2023, 12:54:48 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 31, 2022, 05:21:38 AMLike my wife they complained about me buying LPs (or in her case CDs)
I had a clever strategy which involved sneaking round to my ground-floor bedroom through the communal garden, throwing the LP onto the floor through the opening left in the window for out cats to go in and out, before appearing, all innocent looking, at the front door of our flat (apartment) a few moments later.  ::)  >:D

A best kept secret how much I spent over the years (for my own sanity I keep it from myself!) But these days of cashless society that has gone. One mouse click and immediate notification to the better half. :o
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 01, 2023, 11:57:41 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 31, 2022, 05:21:38 AMLike my wife they complained about me buying LPs (or in her case CDs)
I had a clever strategy which involved sneaking round to my ground-floor bedroom through the communal garden, throwing the LP onto the floor through the opening left in the window for out cats to go in and out, before appearing, all innocent looking, at the front door of our flat (apartment) a few moments later.  ::)  >:D
Hard to think of parents complaining about a kid buying classical LPs.  :D

Quote from: Irons on January 01, 2023, 12:54:48 AMA best kept secret how much I spent over the years (for my own sanity I keep it from myself!) But these days of cashless society that has gone. One mouse click and immediate notification to the better half. :o
Oopsie!  But I bet that that didn't (necessarily) include purchases from charity shops and/or record stores?  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 01, 2023, 11:27:50 PM
Even charity shop prefer card payment these days, PD.

Managed to find a nice copy of the Cyril Smith & Phyllis Sellick LP that Jeffrey recommended above. Unless desperate for a particular LP I only purchase on eBay from trusted sellers. To paraphrase the Queen near mint may vary. York Records have a huge stock but I had to go elsewhere for this one. Delighted with the service from Marks Records. They don't use Royal Mail which is a good start, the record and cover are pristine and as well as cleaned by the seller a rice paper inner sleeve for protection is included. I will use Marks Records again in the future. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 02, 2023, 02:37:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 01, 2023, 11:27:50 PMEven charity shop prefer card payment these days, PD.

Managed to find a nice copy of the Cyril Smith & Phyllis Sellick LP that Jeffrey recommended above. Unless desperate for a particular LP I only purchase on eBay from trusted sellers. To paraphrase the Queen near mint may vary. York Records have a huge stock but I had to go elsewhere for this one. Delighted with the service from Marks Records. They don't use Royal Mail which is a good start, the record and cover are pristine and as well as cleaned by the seller a rice paper inner sleeve for protection is included. I will use Marks Records again in the future.
You would think that the fees charged to them by the credit card processing companies would make them prefer cash payments?  Though at least in the early days of Covid, more vendors of smaller purchases (like at the farmers' markets) had themselves set up to use credit/debit cards.  It does cut down quite a bit on physical contact to be sure.

Glad that you are happy with your recent purchase!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 02, 2023, 04:13:30 AM
Frohes Neujahr!
Was given (!) some 500 LPs just before Christmas. Lots of opera with about one foot each of Verdi and Wagner. Nice recordings, most of them. Have washed (people used to smoke cigarettes, remember?) the VPO/Solti Tannhaüser - Paris version today and given it a listen. Sounds excellent and energetic, the Decca and Solti way. Very pleased.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/f9149583-c4a1-4c75-891d-6e42036e055d-jpeg.881277/)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 02, 2023, 05:33:47 AM
Quote from: Valentino on January 02, 2023, 04:13:30 AMFrohes Neujahr!
Was given (!) some 500 LPs just before Christmas. Lots of opera with about one foot each of Verdi and Wagner. Nice recordings, most of them. Have washed (people used to smoke cigarettes, remember?) the VPO/Solti Tannhaüser - Paris version today and given it a listen. Sounds excellent and energetic, the Decca and Solti way. Very pleased.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/f9149583-c4a1-4c75-891d-6e42036e055d-jpeg.881277/)
500 LPs!  Wow!  Who was the kind benefactor?  And how are you going to store all of them?  I suspect in boxes for the time being.  :)

In any event, enjoy!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 02, 2023, 06:36:25 AM
Thanks!
I walked into my local used vinyl pusher and asked him if he could give me a call next time he received a classic collection. He pointed at the boxes mid floor and said:
- Do you want those?
Thing is there is very little money in used classical LPs (gems are far between) and he does not know classical music and how to price it.

The wife was not amused..., but I have a nice old IKEA shelf (similar to Kallax, but discontinued) with just the right dimensions for LPs in the home office. Lots ogf books there that will fit in the boxes!
...

Must say that these latest reissues of the Solti Ring are nice. So far Rheingold and Walküre. Great sounding LPs, and the Rheingold remaster is unbelievably good. Smart move by Culshaw and the Decca boys not to use noise reduction on the master tapes back in 1958.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 02, 2023, 11:04:59 AM
Quote from: Valentino on January 02, 2023, 06:36:25 AMThanks!
I walked into my local used vinyl pusher and asked him if he could give me a call next time he received a classic collection. He pointed at the boxes mid floor and said:
- Do you want those?
Thing is there is very little money in used classical LPs (gems are far between) and he does not know classical music and how to price it.

The wife was not amused..., but I have a nice old IKEA shelf (similar to Kallax, but discontinued) with just the right dimensions for LPs in the home office. Lots ogf books there that will fit in the boxes!
...
 :o
Must say that these latest reissues of the Solti Ring are nice. So far Rheingold and Walküre. Great sounding LPs, and the Rheingold remaster is unbelievably good. Smart move by Culshaw and the Decca boys not to use noise reduction on the master tapes back in 1958.
Wow, so he gave them to you for free?!  And that included the Solti reissues?!!! If I'm recalling correctly, those latest pressings were quite expensive?

Hope that they are all in good shape.

PD

 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 02, 2023, 01:07:47 PM
Ah, no. Those Solti Ring reissues are new and not free at all, at something like €130 each. https://www.soltiring.com/
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on January 03, 2023, 12:23:28 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 01, 2023, 11:27:50 PMEven charity shop prefer card payment these days, PD.

Managed to find a nice copy of the Cyril Smith & Phyllis Sellick LP that Jeffrey recommended above. Unless desperate for a particular LP I only purchase on eBay from trusted sellers. To paraphrase the Queen near mint may vary. York Records have a huge stock but I had to go elsewhere for this one. Delighted with the service from Marks Records. They don't use Royal Mail which is a good start, the record and cover are pristine and as well as cleaned by the seller a rice paper inner sleeve for protection is included. I will use Marks Records again in the future.
Great to hear Lol. I'm a fan of every work on that disc. A pity that the Jacob never made it to CD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 03, 2023, 03:25:53 AM
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/30c9aa57-c8c6-412d-92a8-f1b50dc9365f-jpeg.881577/)

The Franck piece here seems very good (I haven't heard it before) and the blue label Supraphon sound is good too. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 03, 2023, 03:35:19 AM
Quote from: Valentino on January 03, 2023, 03:25:53 AM(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/30c9aa57-c8c6-412d-92a8-f1b50dc9365f-jpeg.881577/)

The Franck piece here seems very good (I haven't heard it before) and the blue label Supraphon sound is good too.
Who is playing the pieces?

And, sorry, you had confused me earlier by switching your posting to the Solti Ring remasters; I had thought that you had been given those as part of the 500 freebies from your record dealer (still a great, great deal...you owe him one for that!  ;)  :)  ).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 03, 2023, 07:24:37 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 03, 2023, 03:35:19 AMWho is playing the pieces?


PD

You are not asking me but the Foerster Trio, PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 03, 2023, 07:35:01 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 03, 2023, 07:24:37 AMYou are not asking me but the Foerster Trio, PD.
Thanks!  :)

Do you know that album Lol?  I know that you have a lot of Supraphon LPs.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 03, 2023, 09:38:41 AM
^Sorry PD. Forgot that I had cut the band name from that pic. Of course it is the Foerster Trio playing. Irons is on the ball as usual.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 03, 2023, 11:34:52 PM
Quote from: Valentino on January 03, 2023, 09:38:41 AM^Sorry PD. Forgot that I had cut the band name from that pic. Of course it is the Foerster Trio playing. Irons is on the ball as usual.

Interested to hear your view. After a good start (first movement) I felt inspiration fell away a bit. Nothing wrong with either performance or recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 04, 2023, 12:28:58 AM
I'm not alone then. I thought the funeral march or maybe here comes your terrible fate-like first movement was the most interesting of the three. Mind you, this is based on one spin, and I was moving about too, so well executed ideas might have slipped by.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 05, 2023, 11:29:46 PM
Spinning.

Brahms: Piano Quintet in F Minor.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 09, 2023, 11:50:01 PM
Impressed with this review of an affordable turntable. I would expect to pay much more for the build quality and inclusion of cartridge and phono-pre.

https://youtu.be/z2gPRLgJVOw
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 10, 2023, 02:50:16 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 09, 2023, 11:50:01 PMImpressed with this review of an affordable turntable. I would expect to pay much more for the build quality and inclusion of cartridge and phono-pre.

https://youtu.be/z2gPRLgJVOw
Thanks for that link.  Enjoyed watching and listening to his review of it.  Good to hear that there are folks out there trying to design things that aren't all budget-breakers and/or pieces of garbage.  I'll keep it in mind if I run into someone who is looking for an inexpensive but decent turntable.

PD

p.s.  Nice to see that it also has a removable head shell too!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 10, 2023, 07:56:15 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 10, 2023, 02:50:16 AMThanks for that link.  Enjoyed watching and listening to his review of it.  Good to hear that there are folks out there trying to design things that aren't all budget-breakers and/or pieces of garbage.  I'll keep it in mind if I run into someone who is looking for an inexpensive but decent turntable.

PD

p.s.  Nice to see that it also has a removable head shell too!

My thoughts exactly.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on January 10, 2023, 09:41:07 AM
I purchased a cheap Technics from the 70s (one of their lower end belt-drive models) and love it. With the build quality I'd put it with any of the "entry audiophile" tables from Pro-Ject and the like.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on January 10, 2023, 09:55:16 AM
Also pop record prices remain through the roof due to collectors but $20 still goes a long way at the classical section

(https://i.imgur.com/8RDnZpT.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 10, 2023, 12:01:49 PM
Quote from: fbjim on January 10, 2023, 09:55:16 AMAlso pop record prices remain through the roof due to collectors but $20 still goes a long way at the classical section

(https://i.imgur.com/8RDnZpT.jpg)
Nice!  Hope that you enjoy that Janacek one in particular.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 10, 2023, 11:58:50 PM
Quote from: fbjim on January 10, 2023, 09:41:07 AMI purchased a cheap Technics from the 70s (one of their lower end belt-drive models) and love it. With the build quality I'd put it with any of the "entry audiophile" tables from Pro-Ject and the like.

The Technics SL-1200 series of turntables must be the most famous ever made. Introduced in the 1970's as a mass-produced TT. DJ's of the period took it up due to its robust build quality, followed by the audiophile fraternity because it sounded so good. The series was reintroduced a few years ago and sells well. The only snag a budget TT of the 70's now sells for nearly £2000.  
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: fbjim on January 12, 2023, 09:29:29 AM
The Janacek is great - I also have a London Digital recording of Mackerras doing Taras Bulba and the Sinfonietta that I adore.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 12, 2023, 10:02:08 AM
Quote from: fbjim on January 12, 2023, 09:29:29 AMThe Janacek is great - I also have a London Digital recording of Mackerras doing Taras Bulba and the Sinfonietta that I adore.


Mackerras and Czech music in general was brilliant! You're in good hands with his recordings. If/or when you can swing it, I'd suggest that you check out (sorry, no pun intended) his "Life With Czech Music" CDs (There are two sets).  There's also a wonderful dvd of him performing Janacek on Supraphon.  Also, he recorded a number of Janacek's operas too.

By the way, if you didn't already know, he was (at one point in time) president (I believe was his official title?) of the British Dvorak Society for Czech and Slovak Music....he had spent time studying in Czechoslovakia when he was younger and made it a mission to bring the music to the British people conducting a lot of premiere performances there.  :)  https://www.dvorak-society.org/?s=Mackerras

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 14, 2023, 12:18:53 AM
Spinning.

Nystroem: Sinfonia del mare.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 15, 2023, 11:25:19 PM
Spinning the local hero.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/fd83e3e6-ce5f-4d85-bf21-6393cacfe6e9-jpeg.884948/)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 16, 2023, 12:11:34 AM
Quote from: Valentino on January 15, 2023, 11:25:19 PMSpinning the local hero.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/fd83e3e6-ce5f-4d85-bf21-6393cacfe6e9-jpeg.884948/)

Interesting. Didn't know of the release so looked it up. A double album by a top artist on new vinyl at not an outrageous price. Thanks for bringing it to attention.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 16, 2023, 02:17:05 AM
Quote from: Valentino on January 15, 2023, 11:25:19 PMSpinning the local hero.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/fd83e3e6-ce5f-4d85-bf21-6393cacfe6e9-jpeg.884948/)

How do you like the work and the performance?  I don't recall ever hearing it before now.

And how do you find the recording quality and sound to be?

Quote from: Irons on January 16, 2023, 12:11:34 AMInteresting. Didn't know of the release so looked it up. A double album by a top artist on new vinyl at not an outrageous price. Thanks for bringing it to attention.
Lol,

Have you heard any recordings/performances of this work yourself?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 16, 2023, 07:48:33 AM
I am aware Dvorak wrote for piano PD only through coming across a Supraphon LP occasionally. That is about as far as I know.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 16, 2023, 08:15:52 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 16, 2023, 07:48:33 AMI am aware Dvorak wrote for piano PD only through coming across a Supraphon LP occasionally. That is about as far as I know.
I have some of his smaller works with I want to say Firkusny--maybe Kvapil?  And have a couple of recordings of his piano concerto, but I think that one of them is going to be either donated or used as credit at local record shop.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 17, 2023, 12:48:31 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 16, 2023, 08:15:52 AMI have some of his smaller works with I want to say Firkusny--maybe Kvapil?  And have a couple of recordings of his piano concerto, but I think that one of them is going to be either donated or used as credit at local record shop.

PD

I forgot about PC. Richter was an advocate and I have his recording on LP but I cannot recall anything about the work. In fact think it likely I have not played it. :-[
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 17, 2023, 12:38:26 PM
These Dvorak pieces are quite charming. Andsnes' playing is his usual good. Whe works have not been recorded much, but IIRC they're (or have been) in the Supraphon catalogue with Chech players.

The Andsnes' recording is brilliant. Quite explosive at times. The usual cheating of using close and distant miking. Nice sound check for any record player if you're into that sort of thing (as I am).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 25, 2023, 11:55:47 PM
Spinning: Ravel.

(https://i.imgur.com/E7cTVIo.jpg)

Le Tombeau de Couperin.

(https://i.imgur.com/IXtX7Aa.jpg)

Concerto for Left Hand.  Alica De Larrocha with Lawrence Foster and LPO.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 26, 2023, 07:58:35 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 25, 2023, 11:55:47 PMSpinning: Ravel.

(https://i.imgur.com/E7cTVIo.jpg)

Le Tombeau de Couperin.

(https://i.imgur.com/IXtX7Aa.jpg)

Concerto for Left Hand.  Alica De Larrocha with Lawrence Foster and LPO.
Nice!  I haven't heard those particular recordings but I do appreciate Ms. de Larrocha's playing.  I've heard of Francois before but don't recall having heard any of his recordings before now.

I decided to do a bit of digging through my LPs (don't have much Ravel) and pulled out an Andre Previn one.  Alas it hit a repetitive skip on Side 2, so that will have to get a better cleaning!   :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 26, 2023, 11:52:03 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 26, 2023, 07:58:35 AMNice!  I haven't heard those particular recordings but I do appreciate Ms. de Larrocha's playing.  I've heard of Francois before but don't recall having heard any of his recordings before now.

I decided to do a bit of digging through my LPs (don't have much Ravel) and pulled out an Andre Previn one.  Alas it hit a repetitive skip on Side 2, so that will have to get a better cleaning!   :(

PD

Previn, one of my favourite conductors, unaware Ravel part of his repertoire. Had a look and he has recorded lots.

To stop a stylus in its tracks is usually a piece of crud. I examine the vinyl under a strong light and pick off the hard blob with a fingernail. Always works for me.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 27, 2023, 02:53:15 AM
In other news my next tonearm has boarded a flight from Spain.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2023, 03:46:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 26, 2023, 11:52:03 PMPrevin, one of my favourite conductors, unaware Ravel part of his repertoire. Had a look and he has recorded lots.

To stop a stylus in its tracks is usually a piece of crud. I examine the vinyl under a strong light and pick off the hard blob with a fingernail. Always works for me.
Thanks, I'll take a look at it (after some coffee).  This is the album that I own:

(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0657/8937/products/P1011609_dcf159eb-d3e2-47e8-9dd9-55a6e28c7c84_large.JPG?v=1556950260)

Quote from: Valentino on January 27, 2023, 02:53:15 AMIn other news my next tonearm has boarded a flight from Spain.
Cool.  Hope that you enjoy it!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 27, 2023, 07:01:09 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2023, 03:46:33 AMThanks, I'll take a look at it (after some coffee).  This is the album that I own:

(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0657/8937/products/P1011609_dcf159eb-d3e2-47e8-9dd9-55a6e28c7c84_large.JPG?v=1556950260)
Cool.  Hope that you enjoy it!

PD

A new one on me, PD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2023, 07:31:51 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 27, 2023, 07:01:09 AMA new one on me, PD.
What?!  There's an album that you haven't seen?!  :o

Just kidding...though have you done a recent count of how many LPs you do own?  :)

In any event, it was recorded in 1986 and the one that I have was pressed in Germany.  And it's off to take a spin on my Okki Nokki in a few minutes (I desperately need a break from sorting through and disposing of some old paperwork).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 28, 2023, 12:59:10 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 27, 2023, 07:31:51 AMWhat?!  There's an album that you haven't seen?!  :o

Just kidding...though have you done a recent count of how many LPs you do own?  :)

In any event, it was recorded in 1986 and the one that I have was pressed in Germany.  And it's off to take a spin on my Okki Nokki in a few minutes (I desperately need a break from sorting through and disposing of some old paperwork).

PD

I am always amazed how many records I have not seen. My wife voices a more accurate count on my shelves with too many!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 29, 2023, 12:48:26 AM
Only one bricks and mortar source remaining for vinyl in my neck of the woods. An Oxfam media store, CDs are cheap at £2 a pop but LPs prices are steadily rising. Shocked at what  they are asking for some of my donations! Visiting yesterday I purchased the four below, particularly pleased with the rare Alwyn issue.

(https://i.imgur.com/jeC0RFK.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/34TujhD.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/CeATqGB.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/9JTVwLt.jpg)



 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2023, 05:21:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 29, 2023, 12:48:26 AMOnly one bricks and mortar source remaining for vinyl in my neck of the woods. An Oxfam media store, CDs are cheap at £2 a pop but LPs prices are steadily rising. Shocked at what  they are asking for some of my donations! Visiting yesterday I purchased the four below, particularly pleased with the rare Alwyn issue.

(https://i.imgur.com/jeC0RFK.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/34TujhD.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/CeATqGB.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/9JTVwLt.jpg)
 
I know (re price increases)!  Well, like everyone, they have learned that vinyl is hot again--though looking at the condition of a number of LPs that I've examined at a local charity shop, the condition of many of them are not very good and/or they often have not the best selection in terms of things that I or most people would want to buy to begin with.  :(

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 29, 2023, 11:58:55 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 29, 2023, 05:21:58 AMI know (re price increases)!  Well, like everyone, they have learned that vinyl is hot again--though looking at the condition of a number of LPs that I've examined at a local charity shop, the condition of many of them are not very good and/or they often have not the best selection in terms of things that I or most people would want to buy to begin with.  :(

PD

This particular store caters for media only i.e. books, sheet music, CDs and LPs. Handily there are a couple of easy chairs by the shop front windows. After making a selection I make myself comfortable and cast a beady eye over my protentional purchases (CDs too). I rejected due to condition DSCH 5th Symphony, Rozhdestvensky, Rite of Spring, Colin Davis and a third that escapes my memory. Not full-proof but through experience I know what to look for regarding vinyl condition.

Fuzzy pic from inside the store. As can be seen not many LPs for sale, on some occasions I leave empty-handed.     
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 30, 2023, 04:33:31 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 29, 2023, 11:58:55 PMThis particular store caters for media only i.e. books, sheet music, CDs and LPs. Handily there are a couple of easy chairs by the shop front windows. After making a selection I make myself comfortable and cast a beady eye over my protentional purchases (CDs too). I rejected due to condition DSCH 5th Symphony, Rozhdestvensky, Rite of Spring, Colin Davis and a third that escapes my memory. Not full-proof but through experience I know what to look for regarding vinyl condition.

Fuzzy pic from inside the store. As can be seen not many LPs for sale, on some occasions I leave empty-handed.     
Oh, nice!  The place that I sometimes visit (the charity shop one) has a combo of almost everything:  clothing, books, LPs, CDs, as well as kitchen items and "artwork"....  No place to sit alas.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 06, 2023, 12:23:07 PM
^It's quite enjoyable, yes.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/30ac4a84-7827-4e82-ba02-aba2596a045c-jpeg.888617/)

Actually the Denon DL-301II pictured is not quite happy, the arm is probably too heavy for it. I've put my old Audio-Technica AT-OC10 in, and it is marvellous. I put a picture with it in the System thread, which is quite fun now with the kontrapunkt between antiquated vinyl and hypermodern streaming playback.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 07, 2023, 05:03:41 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 06, 2023, 12:23:07 PM^It's quite enjoyable, yes.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/30ac4a84-7827-4e82-ba02-aba2596a045c-jpeg.888617/)

Actually the Denon DL-301II pictured is not quite happy, the arm is probably too heavy for it. I've put my old Audio-Technica AT-OC10 in, and it is marvellous. I put a picture with it in the System thread, which is quite fun now with the kontrapunkt between antiquated vinyl and hypermodern streaming playback.
How can you tell that an arm is too heavy for a system?  Couldn't you just adjust the counterweight?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 07, 2023, 05:13:16 AM
It's inertia, so equivalent tonearm mass. A Rega or modern SME arm is something like 11 g, this one is maybe 26 g with the headshells I have.
Balancing it is not a problem, it's the suspension that's almost bottoming out due to excessive low frequency stylus movement.
Vinyl is fun! Sold the Denon today btw.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2023, 05:23:39 AM
Curiosity got the better of me (even though I threw out all of my LPs a decade ago) and looked up turntables on Crutchfield. They all seem to have built in pre-amps and even blue tooth output. I'm guess that would be considered heresy in this thread. :)

(I've already made my fantasy selection, Audio-Technica AT-LP3XBT.)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 07, 2023, 05:35:43 AM
Nah, but if you're not into tinkering or have some records that are unobtainium in other formats why bother with LPs? Digital almost always sounds better.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on February 07, 2023, 05:41:50 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 07, 2023, 05:35:43 AMNah, but if you're not into tinkering of have some records that are unobtainium in other formats why bother with LPs? Digital almost always sounds better.

I threw out one LP, unavailable on CD, that I thought I had copied to audio files, then found out that I somehow lost the audio file. I was tempted to get a turntable and buy that one record on eBay. But I just found out my new hometown has a record shop, and one of the services they offer is copying LPs to digital files. Might go for it.

(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/gpUAAOSwVtJiaWIV/s-l1600.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 07, 2023, 11:19:38 PM
Spinning.

Elgar: Falstaff - Symphonic Study.

(https://i.imgur.com/T6PCTwT.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/j3YBs3u.jpg)

For me Adrian Boult is the supreme Elgarian so it came as some surprise that I preferred Handley. Boult's Falstaff came over as a plodder where as with Handley clownish.
One area that the EMI recording scored was bass. Boult shook the floor, CFP did not.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 13, 2023, 03:58:19 AM
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/3511ba67-d906-4d2f-aeab-122292b54b8a-jpeg.892546/)

This Solti Paris Tannhäuser (note the scratch right across) was basically unplayable with the Denon DL301II. With the AT33PTG/II I cannot hear it. Get yourself a MicroLine/Microridge/SAS stylus and be happy.

Great recording btw.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 14, 2023, 01:38:13 PM
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/beba6357-6a64-4f63-923b-46b3a881a2c6-jpeg.892877/)

The op. 80 sonata is a new find for me, and these two play it rather well too I think. Audiophile label, 1970.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 17, 2023, 11:28:58 PM
Beethoven: Violin Sonata 'Spring'.

(https://i.imgur.com/YLDDUM0.jpg)

Recorded at Finchcocks the stately home of Richard Burnett and his large collection of historical keyboards.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 18, 2023, 03:42:12 AM
How is that? To me unknown performers and label.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 18, 2023, 05:32:30 AM
I have not posted here in some time but I picked up a wonderful set in a Charity Shop yesterday


(https://www.picclickimg.com/scYAAOSw0qFfPmED/D6D-7-Dvorak-The-Nine-Symphonies-Kertesz.webp)


It looks to be in superb condition.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 19, 2023, 01:24:35 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 18, 2023, 03:42:12 AMHow is that? To me unknown performers and label.

Amon Ra are an offshoot of Saydisc records. The label was founded in the early 1980's concentrating on HIP chamber music. Most, if not all the recordings were made with the superb acoustics of Finchcocks and I heartily recommend them on CD or LP.   
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 19, 2023, 01:31:56 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 18, 2023, 05:32:30 AMI have not posted here in some time but I picked up a wonderful set in a Charity Shop yesterday


(https://www.picclickimg.com/scYAAOSw0qFfPmED/D6D-7-Dvorak-The-Nine-Symphonies-Kertesz.webp)


It looks to be in superb condition.
A famous old set and very highly rated - looks like a great find Fergus.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 19, 2023, 02:52:48 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 19, 2023, 01:31:56 AMA famous old set and very highly rated - looks like a great find Fergus.

Cheers Jeffrey, I have the set on CD but I was not going to walk past a vinyl set in good condition  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2023, 09:36:09 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 18, 2023, 05:32:30 AMI have not posted here in some time but I picked up a wonderful set in a Charity Shop yesterday


(https://www.picclickimg.com/scYAAOSw0qFfPmED/D6D-7-Dvorak-The-Nine-Symphonies-Kertesz.webp)


It looks to be in superb condition.
Oh, nice!  I can't see the image, but I did see that it was of Dvorak and Kertesz.  :)   Enjoy!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 20, 2023, 10:46:36 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2023, 09:36:09 AMOh, nice!  I can't see the image, but I did see that it was of Dvorak and Kertesz.  :)   Enjoy!

PD

Cheers PD. I still cannot resist a good vinyl bargain  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 21, 2023, 12:32:30 AM
I say! Quite interesting!

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/c8f26cd7-dc55-4d50-a640-f8b04eacf8d7-jpeg.894968/)

Britten conducting Britten and Culshaw making sure it gets on tape properly. Lots of unusual noises from the orchestra. Damn good show, alas.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 21, 2023, 06:17:40 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 21, 2023, 12:32:30 AMI say! Quite interesting!

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/c8f26cd7-dc55-4d50-a640-f8b04eacf8d7-jpeg.894968/)

Britten conducting Britten and Culshaw making sure it gets on tape properly. Lots of unusual noises from the orchestra. Damn good show, alas.

How is tonearm, sorted OK?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 21, 2023, 06:51:44 AM
Yes, all fine.
New birch ply arm board at 228 mm p2s drilled for the Bokrand arm base, nulls at 61 and 117 mm. Splurged on a Korf ceramic headshell for the AT33PTG/II. Sounds great, really.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 21, 2023, 08:43:19 AM
Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 21, 2023, 10:28:15 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 21, 2023, 06:51:44 AMYes, all fine.
New birch ply arm board at 228 mm p2s drilled for the Bokrand arm base, nulls at 61 and 117 mm. Splurged on a Korf ceramic headshell for the AT33PTG/II. Sounds great, really.
Did you do all the work yourself?  Impressive!

Wish that I knew how to do those kind of things.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 21, 2023, 11:38:03 PM
Spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/jQxkC4O.jpg)

Not a conductor or orchestra associated with the composer. They go for it, which is the only way that works for Nielsen. The side drum is suitably wild and after doing his bit sulks off exit right, also impressed my the wailing woodwind. What a symphony! Cover notes by Robert Simpson.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 22, 2023, 12:30:22 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 21, 2023, 11:38:03 PMSpinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/jQxkC4O.jpg)

Not a conductor or orchestra associated with the composer. They go for it, which is the only way that works for Nielsen. The side drum is suitably wild and after doing his bit sulks off exit right, also impressed my the wailing woodwind. What a symphony! Cover notes by Robert Simpson.


That looks rather tasty indeed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 22, 2023, 06:00:28 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on February 21, 2023, 08:57:04 AMI meant to say, also: your copy looks absolutely spotless and pristine. Don't know how you managed that, after all these years. Am impressed!
Not me. I was given a collection, appx. six book, cases just before Christmas. This Midsummer and Billy Budd were the only Britten works in it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 22, 2023, 06:55:34 AM
Quote from: aligreto on February 22, 2023, 12:30:22 AMThat looks rather tasty indeed.

No one blows the cobwebs away like Nielsen.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 22, 2023, 10:58:34 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 22, 2023, 06:55:34 AMNo one blows the cobwebs away like Nielsen.

That is true but I would particularly like to hear that Kletzki presentation.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 22, 2023, 11:25:00 PM
Quote from: aligreto on February 22, 2023, 10:58:34 AMThat is true but I would particularly like to hear that Kletzki presentation.

Far as I am aware the only example of a Kletzki Nielsen recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on February 23, 2023, 02:06:35 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 22, 2023, 11:25:00 PMFar as I am aware the only example of a Kletzki Nielsen recording.

Yes, I suspected so but was not sure. Hence my original keen interest.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 24, 2023, 11:57:46 PM
Spinning.

Arnold Bax.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on February 25, 2023, 03:48:08 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 24, 2023, 11:57:46 PMSpinning.

Arnold Bax.
Best performance!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 26, 2023, 12:04:51 AM
Last night's spin. Nice sounds, great singing, but I guess somewhat let down by the Decca Ace of Diamonds issue.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/86a9ce23-c21d-48b3-919b-c6b285611126-jpeg.896439/)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 26, 2023, 01:24:31 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on February 25, 2023, 03:48:08 AMBest performance!

Manny years ago I attended a Leppard concert at Dorking Halls. A conductor best known for Baroque repertoire and yet takes to Bax like a duck to water. Not given a fair crack of the whip by record companies, sadly. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 26, 2023, 01:25:41 AM
Quote from: Valentino on February 26, 2023, 12:04:51 AMLast night's spin. Nice sounds, great singing, but I guess somewhat let down by the Decca Ace of Diamonds issue.

(http://86a9ce23-c21d-48b3-919b-c6b285611126.jpeg)

I can't see an image. Is there one?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on February 27, 2023, 02:49:50 AM
Now there is one. For some weird reason only the filename part of the url was included.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 01, 2023, 08:20:27 AM
Michael Fremer's listening room  https://youtu.be/8cKO9VdMAkg

Long, but worth it for the Brian Wilson anecdote alone.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 05, 2023, 09:24:00 PM
This one is also from the big gift I receiverd just before Christmas:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/4271ffeb-4087-430e-ad33-efa6de045d13-jpeg.898005/)

Probably my preferable recording of the Brahms op. 34. Sachlichkeit is good for Brahms.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 16, 2023, 09:14:58 AM
Famous Violin Encores played by Nora Grumlíková


(https://www.picclickimg.com/GBsAAOSw5FljqkKl/Nora-Grumlikova-Jaroslav-Kolar-Famous-Violin-Encores-Supraphon.webp)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 17, 2023, 11:57:00 AM
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/75f12176-a84f-4e34-ba57-74c6a4013e18-jpeg.902735/)

Fitting cover art, but I do prefer Czech PO and Ancerl on Supraphon in this.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 19, 2023, 09:59:43 AM
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/OBEAAOSwo~lZevwj/s-l1600.jpg)


I am making my way slowly through this album. I quite like it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 19, 2023, 01:50:46 PM
Haydn: String Quartet No. 63 Op.76/4 [Quartetto Italiano] 


(https://www.picclickimg.com/TKoAAOSwyXBjQKwn/1976-Haydn-String-Quartets-Quartetto-Italiano-Vinyl-LP.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on March 20, 2023, 12:46:25 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 19, 2023, 09:59:43 AM(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/OBEAAOSwo~lZevwj/s-l1600.jpg)


I am making my way slowly through this album. I quite like it.
My auntie had that LP! A happy reminder of Vox/Turnabout - an inexpensive label which introduced me to much great music (Bruckner's 7th and 8th symphonies, Copland's 'Rodeo' etc).
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 20, 2023, 04:16:49 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on March 20, 2023, 12:46:25 AMMy auntie had that LP! A happy reminder of Vox/Turnabout - an inexpensive label which introduced me to much great music (Bruckner's 7th and 8th symphonies, Copland's 'Rodeo' etc).
Another stroll down memory lane, Jeffrey. Nice  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 20, 2023, 09:48:43 AM
Haydn: String Quartet No. 63 Op.76/4 [Orlando Quartet]


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/Xo0AAOSwHkpjh90h/s-l1600.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 21, 2023, 08:03:57 AM
Dipping into this vinyl release....


(https://i.discogs.com/3Ob2wOQ4cUoef4pXlxdf3ZbvBrXYI09cegL0vfvJE2c/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:593/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTc1ODgx/NTctMTQ0NDY0MzA1/MS0yMjUzLmpwZWc.jpeg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 22, 2023, 07:16:58 AM
Contemporary Music from Sweden


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/P1gAAOSwyQtVoCsO/s-l500.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 23, 2023, 02:56:03 AM
Renaissance Suite [David Munrow]


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/OHsAAOSwAFpiuvTj/s-l1600.jpg)


I have the utmost admiration for the talent, dedication and achievements of the late David Munrow. He was immeasurably talented and he had a vision which he pursued and imposed on the musical world. This imposition, I believe, was instrumental in transforming the thinking around the performance and presentation of Early Music. I believe that he shook up the then perceived musical establishment and changed the way of looking at and thinking about Early Music forever. I believe that we owe him a great debt. He was such a tragic loss to the world of Music.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 24, 2023, 01:23:22 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 16, 2023, 09:14:58 AMFamous Violin Encores played by Nora Grumlíková


(https://www.picclickimg.com/GBsAAOSw5FljqkKl/Nora-Grumlikova-Jaroslav-Kolar-Famous-Violin-Encores-Supraphon.webp)

Grumlikova is a fabulous violinist. My favourite recording of Britten's VC is by her and again on Supraphon.

(https://i.imgur.com/Sj1evgP.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 24, 2023, 02:57:32 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 24, 2023, 01:23:22 AMGrumlikova is a fabulous violinist. My favourite recording of Britten's VC is by her and again on Supraphon.

(https://i.imgur.com/Sj1evgP.jpg)
I hadn't heard of her before Aligreto mentioned her; I'll have to keep an eye out for her recordings!  And like you, I'm a sucker for Supraphon records.   ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: aligreto on March 24, 2023, 04:57:38 AM
Yes, the Supraphons had many a gem among them.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 28, 2023, 05:26:20 AM
I shall be eternally grateful to Jeffrey for introducing this work to me.
We are blessed with two outstanding recordings; on a Chandos double CD Philharmonia conducted by Mathias Bambert and for LP this https://youtu.be/Sf2qJGD7RbE
I would not be without either.

(https://i.imgur.com/eNtKuwM.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Szykneij on March 28, 2023, 03:44:11 PM
I received this message in an email from an audio supply company I occasionally do business with. Very interesting if the data is correct.

EXTRA EXTRA! read all about it:  We have ALL been vindicated! After 16 consecutive years of vinyl sales increases we can now report VINYL IS BACK!  According to the Recording Industry Association of America's (RIAA) annual revenue report, vinyl records outsold CDs in the US last year for the first time since 1987, selling 41 million units against 33 million for CD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Iota on March 29, 2023, 03:06:27 AM
A really rather extraordinary turn of events when all is said and done. I shipped my many hundreds of classical and rock LPs collected over decades off to dealers, just before the pandemic and haven't regretted it for an instant, though I kept a dozen or so which would have been like ripping little bits out of my soul to let go. But clearly love for the format is not just nostalgia, as Gen Z and millennials are all over them too.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 29, 2023, 04:23:28 AM
Quote from: Szykneij on March 28, 2023, 03:44:11 PMI received this message in an email from an audio supply company I occasionally do business with. Very interesting if the data is correct.

EXTRA EXTRA! read all about it:  We have ALL been vindicated! After 16 consecutive years of vinyl sales increases we can now report VINYL IS BACK!  According to the Recording Industry Association of America's (RIAA) annual revenue report, vinyl records outsold CDs in the US last year for the first time since 1987, selling 41 million units against 33 million for CD.
Wow!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Szykneij on March 29, 2023, 04:47:48 AM
Quote from: Iota on March 29, 2023, 03:06:27 AMA really rather extraordinary turn of events when all is said and done. I shipped my many hundreds of classical and rock LPs collected over decades off to dealers, just before the pandemic and haven't regretted it for an instant, though I kept a dozen or so which would have been like ripping little bits out of my soul to let go. But clearly love for the format is not just nostalgia, as Gen Z and millennials are all over them too.

Yes, I'm seeing more offerings for record players and it looks like the number of vinyl releases is increasing. Like you, there are albums I have I couldn't bear to part with, but I have thousands of lps that I'll eventually need to find a home for. Storage space is definitely an issue.

If I was a writer, one of my novels would be of a post-apocalyptic world where music is kept alive by the surviving protagonist with a huge vinyl collection and a restored Victrola.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 29, 2023, 05:44:25 AM
Quote from: Szykneij on March 29, 2023, 04:47:48 AMYes, I'm seeing more offerings for record players and it looks like the number of vinyl releases is increasing. Like you, there are albums I have I couldn't bear to part with, but I have thousands of lps that I'll eventually need to find a home for. Storage space is definitely an issue.

If I was a writer, one of my novels would be of a post-apocalyptic world where music is kept alive by the surviving protagonist with a huge vinyl collection and a restored Victrola.
;D

PD

p.s.  I do know what you mean about being storage space being an issue though.  :(
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 02, 2023, 12:41:48 AM
Quote from: Irons on March 28, 2023, 05:26:20 AMI shall be eternally grateful to Jeffrey for introducing this work to me.
We are blessed with two outstanding recordings; on a Chandos double CD Philharmonia conducted by Mathias Bambert and for LP this https://youtu.be/Sf2qJGD7RbE
I would not be without either.

(https://i.imgur.com/eNtKuwM.jpg)
I'm delighted that you enjoy Hadley's 'The Trees So High' Lol - his masterpiece I think (although recently I've been enjoying 'The Hills'). I agree that both recordings of The Trees So High are fabulous and with the Chandos twofer you get Sainton's 'Nadir' and 'The Island' included which are both fine works. I've seen The Trees So High referred to, disparagingly, as like 'Vaughan Williams with water'. I totally disagree with this view as, for all its great beauty, VW's music has a curiously impersonal quality to it, whereas Hadley's 'The Trees So High' is an intimate and personal work (for all the stylistic influences of VW) dealing with the transience of human existence.
I owe the GMG Forum some great discoveries as well, especially Kabelac's magnificent 'Mystery of Time' and Fricker's 'Vision of Judgment'.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 02, 2023, 12:46:30 AM
Quote from: aligreto on March 22, 2023, 07:16:58 AMContemporary Music from Sweden


(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/P1gAAOSwyQtVoCsO/s-l500.jpg)
A fine old Turnabout LP - part of my introduction to Rosenberg.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 10, 2023, 07:52:15 AM
After a hiatus since March 8th back spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/52aOo2Z.jpg)

The "flawed" 1st Symphony is my favourite of the three by a margin.

(https://i.imgur.com/RQu3HLo.jpg)

Rachmaninov's chamber works are small in number with the Cello Sonata a masterpiece.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 10, 2023, 12:56:03 PM
Quote from: Irons on April 10, 2023, 07:52:15 AMAfter a hiatus since March 8th back spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/52aOo2Z.jpg)

The "flawed" 1st Symphony is my favourite of the three by a margin.

(https://i.imgur.com/RQu3HLo.jpg)

Rachmaninov's chamber works are small in number with the Cello Sonata a masterpiece.


Yay!  You're back spinning!  Hurrah!  ;D

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on April 10, 2023, 02:41:51 PM
Quote from: Irons on April 10, 2023, 07:52:15 AMAfter a hiatus since March 8th back spinning.

(https://i.imgur.com/52aOo2Z.jpg)

The "flawed" 1st Symphony is my favourite of the three by a margin.

(https://i.imgur.com/RQu3HLo.jpg)

Rachmaninov's chamber works are small in number with the Cello Sonata a masterpiece.


Love the cover art of the Rachmaninov 1st Symphony Lol. It's also my favourite of the three. Robert Simpson in his chapter on Rachmaninov in the Penguin Book of the Symphony), Vol.2 'Elgar to the Present Day' regretted that Rachmaninov had not persevered down the path of the 1st Symphony.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 11, 2023, 12:56:18 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on April 10, 2023, 02:41:51 PMLove the cover art of the Rachmaninov 1st Symphony Lol. It's also my favourite of the three. Robert Simpson in his chapter on Rachmaninov in the Penguin Book of the Symphony), Vol.2 'Elgar to the Present Day' regretted that Rachmaninov had not persevered down the path of the 1st Symphony.

Good to know I am not alone thinking that, Jeffrey.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 12, 2023, 08:09:07 AM
Britten: Sinfonietta.

Members of the Vienna Octet: Werner Tripp-Flute. Karl Mayrhofer-Oboe. Alfred Boskovsky-Clarinet. Ernst Pamperi-Bassoon. Josef Veleba-Horn. Anton Fietz & Philipp Matheis-Violin. Gunther Breitenbach-Viola. Emanuel Brabec-Cello. Otto Ruhm-Double Bass.

(https://i.imgur.com/Oi7w9zV.jpg)

Vaughan Williams: Songs of Travel.

Robert Tear with Philip Ledger (piano)

(https://i.imgur.com/lkOXNu2.jpg)

The Schubertian Songs of Travel are at least as good as On Wenlock Edge IMO. An outstanding collection of nine songs, with one, Youth and Love as beautiful as anything from RVW.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 13, 2023, 05:18:56 AM
Quote from: absolutelybaching on April 12, 2023, 09:14:04 AMThat was an early LP buy for me, the Britten/Hindemith one. Fond memories of borrowing from the library and being wowed by the only then-current recording of Britten's Opus 1. Thank you for the trip down memory lane...

You are most welcome. Sound is most impressive BTW.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 14, 2023, 05:21:22 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/RvUSnC9.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/PQVV4qL.jpg)

Ida Haendel refrains from indulgence. Straight and clear which is so right for this composer. 

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 19, 2023, 11:45:15 PM
Pardon me if this has been covered in my absence.
Deutsche Grammophon The Original Source, for the audiophile in you:
https://www.the-original-source.com/

I like the idea of newfangled oldfashioness and I have on order the Schubert Trout quintet.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on April 20, 2023, 03:23:53 AM
Quote from: Valentino on April 19, 2023, 11:45:15 PMPardon me if this has been covered in my absence.
Deutsche Grammophon The Original Source, for the audiophile in you:
https://www.the-original-source.com/

I like the idea of newfangled oldfashioness and I have on order the Schubert Trout quintet.
Oooh!  Where do they list what they will be releasing (or did I miss it?)?

Ah, never mind, the "list" is here (click on arrows on the sides to advance or to go back):  Just click on "home" (top of page) to see the images of upcoming releases.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on April 20, 2023, 10:37:59 AM
The Kleiber LvB7 was listed as sold out for a while but not any more. I don't know how they've made more available. Did they cut one more "positive" on the lathe, did they decide to press more from the original negatives, or did they produce additional negatives from the original positive? Audiophile me ground loops!
Apart from that I have the "Originals" CD coupling with no. 5 so I was fine with it being sold out.
Looking forward to further releases.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 25, 2023, 06:57:09 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/s3ODFhf.jpg)

A 1960 British pressing from EMI. Not quite as dynamic as the US original but still impressive.

(https://i.imgur.com/hLgQHOr.jpg)

An audiophile pressing by Classic Records released in 2010.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on April 30, 2023, 12:19:56 AM
Concert Classics Series a mid-price EMI label. Some interesting information on Discogs including the fact of a total 517 reissues.
SXLP 30126 features Sargent conducting Warlock and Holst (St. Paul's Suite) from 1966 with Elgar and Holst again (Beni Mora) from 1971. I was particularly impressed with Sargent's rendition of both Holst's works.

(https://i.imgur.com/FMeHhfi.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/iyzuAo8.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 07, 2023, 04:04:25 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/Bv8QMh3.jpg)

All planets aligned for this recording of Prokofiev's 1st Violin Concerto. Do not know much of Erick Friedman but he is a man inspired in this rendition along with Leinsdorf and his Boston orchestra. Absolutely first class.

(https://i.imgur.com/GnqQRAH.jpg)

Again soloist and support are first class here but the Symphony-Concerto is a work I am less familiar with.

Both recordings are produced by Richard Mohr and engineered by the legendary Lewis Layton. RCA produced many great records in the 1960's with this team.
Both are Decca pressings and although the Dynagroove inscription on the cover is retained they chose to omit the process during mastering, a wise decision. It is said without RCA's permission, my guess Decca didn't tell them.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: André Le Nôtre on May 07, 2023, 08:57:19 PM
Record stores in Madrid? Barcelona? (Granada? San Sebastian?)

One in Barcelona is mentioned in a guide book--Casa Beethoven

Any others?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on May 08, 2023, 02:20:10 AM
Three new titles announced in the DG The Original Source series, so there's now seven available for preorder.
https://store.deutschegrammophon.com/p30-i3200?onChangeLanguage=1&language_id=EN
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 11, 2023, 12:03:18 AM
A couple of Prokofiev ballets.

(https://i.imgur.com/g54iFj8.jpg)

A late Melodiya recording licensed to EMI.

(https://i.imgur.com/Hn24bh3.jpg)

Out of the two I enjoyed the rustic The Stone Flower the most.

My copy a Decca wide band.



Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 13, 2023, 02:37:40 PM
Purchased some used classical LPs today (along with 2 new non-c albums; if interested, check out the Diner).

Bartok's string quartets on DG Gesellschaft with the "Ungarisches Streichquartett" (in mono).
Also on same label:  Emil Gilels playing Mozart piano sonatas (in stereo) 2530 061
Same label:  Janacek:  The Diary of One Who Vanished with Kay Griffel, Ernst Haefliger & Kubelik (Stereo)
Same label:  Sibelius' Sym. Nos. 6 & 7 with HvK and Berlin (Stereo)
Dvorak piano works with Kvapil (Supraphon 1 11 0865 in stereo)
Lastly:  a combo of various Swedish composers (Nystroem, Rangström and Johanson) on a new-to-me label called Caprice CAP 1109 (in stereo).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 14, 2023, 12:53:34 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 13, 2023, 02:37:40 PMPurchased some used classical LPs today (along with 2 new non-c albums; if interested, check out the Diner).

Bartok's string quartets on DG Gesellschaft with the "Ungarisches Streichquartett" (in mono).
Also on same label:  Emil Gilels playing Mozart piano sonatas (in stereo) 2530 061
Same label:  Janacek:  The Diary of One Who Vanished with Kay Griffel, Ernst Haefliger & Kubelik (Stereo)
Same label:  Sibelius' Sym. Nos. 6 & 7 with HvK and Berlin (Stereo)
Dvorak piano works with Kvapil (Supraphon 1 11 0865 in stereo)
Lastly:  a combo of various Swedish composers (Nystroem, Rangström and Johanson) on a new-to-me label called Caprice CAP 1109 (in stereo).

PD

Nice haul, PD.

The Caprice issue caught my eye. I like Rangstrom's symphonies a lot but not heard the piece featured on your LP.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 14, 2023, 03:09:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 14, 2023, 12:53:34 AMNice haul, PD.

The Caprice issue caught my eye. I like Rangstrom's symphonies a lot but not heard the piece featured on your LP.
Thanks!  Will be interesting to see what all I like from the lot.  My guess (and I could be wrong here) is that those Bartok quartet recordings weren't available in stereo by that same group at the time.  The LPs looked to be in great shape--the cover (from that set rather less so).  I didn't know the names of any of the musicians in that quartet--just went on my gut-level feeling there at the time.

Did you perchance check out my new LP purchases?  :) If so, thoughts?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 15, 2023, 12:41:14 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 13, 2023, 02:37:40 PMPurchased some used classical LPs today (along with 2 new non-c albums; if interested, check out the Diner).

Bartok's string quartets on DG Gesellschaft with the "Ungarisches Streichquartett" (in mono).
Also on same label:  Emil Gilels playing Mozart piano sonatas (in stereo) 2530 061
Same label:  Janacek:  The Diary of One Who Vanished with Kay Griffel, Ernst Haefliger & Kubelik (Stereo)
Same label:  Sibelius' Sym. Nos. 6 & 7 with HvK and Berlin (Stereo)
Dvorak piano works with Kvapil (Supraphon 1 11 0865 in stereo)
Lastly:  a combo of various Swedish composers (Nystroem, Rangström and Johanson) on a new-to-me label called Caprice CAP 1109 (in stereo).

PD
Nice looking haul PD although don't know the Dvorak.
When I was at university in the North on England in the 1970s I purchased a two LP set of Janacek's piano music 'On the Overgrown Path'. It was the most amazing bargain ever at 25pence for a double LP DGG set (even in those far-off days). Apparently it was from a record shop in Belfast which had been damaged by a bomb blast (during that dark period in N Ireland's history). For £1.00 I bought the Janacek double LP set, Sibelius conducted by Beecham, Prokofiev's Classical Symphony with Shostakovich's 1st Symphony and Stravinsky's 'Firebird'.
If you don't know it PD you must listen to Sinfonia del Mare by Nystroem - a most beautiful work which I'm sure you'd enjoy.
 :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 15, 2023, 12:42:26 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 14, 2023, 03:09:14 AMThanks!  Will be interesting to see what all I like from the lot.  My guess (and I could be wrong here) is that those Bartok quartet recordings weren't available in stereo by that same group at the time.  The LPs looked to be in great shape--the cover (from that set rather less so).  I didn't know the names of any of the musicians in that quartet--just went on my gut-level feeling there at the time.

Did you perchance check out my new LP purchases?  :) If so, thoughts?

PD

I am aware that the Hungarian Quartet recorded a complete set of Beethoven Quartets twice, mono and stereo. For Bartok not so sure. I have the complete stereo Bartok set (3LPs) on DG 138650/52 ST33 SLPM. To be honest it would not bother me one jot if a string quartet recording is mono or stereo. The Hungarian Quartet were one of the best and most famous of their day.

I looked up your Caprice LP on Discogs. A most interesting release for anyone liking Scandinavian music. Let us know what you think of the Rangstrom piece.

I recall Karajan's Sibelius 6th receiving good reviews but I have not heard the recording. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 15, 2023, 08:16:19 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 15, 2023, 12:41:14 AMNice looking haul PD although don't know the Dvorak.
When I was at university in the North on England in the 1970s I purchased a two LP set of Janacek's piano music 'On the Overgrown Path'. It was the most amazing bargain ever at 25pence for a double LP DGG set (even in those far-off days). Apparently it was from a record shop in Belfast which had been damaged by a bomb blast (during that dark period in N Ireland's history). For £1.00 I bought the Janacek double LP set, Sibelius conducted by Beecham, Prokofiev's Classical Symphony with Shostakovich's 1st Symphony and Stravinsky's 'Firebird'.
If you don't know it PD you must listen to Sinfonia del Mare by Nystroem - a most beautiful work which I'm sure you'd enjoy.
 :)
I remember your story Jeffrey (though not the specific LPs that you had purchased).  Was it Kvapil who was playing the Janacek works?  I suspect that at the time that you has purchased those LPs, that they hadn't been recorded much--sorry, not trying to make you (us) feel old here!  And thanks for the Nystroem suggestion!

Quote from: Irons on May 15, 2023, 12:42:26 AMI am aware that the Hungarian Quartet recorded a complete set of Beethoven Quartets twice, mono and stereo. For Bartok not so sure. I have the complete stereo Bartok set (3LPs) on DG 138650/52 ST33 SLPM. To be honest it would not bother me one jot if a string quartet recording is mono or stereo. The Hungarian Quartet were one of the best and most famous of their day.

I looked up your Caprice LP on Discogs. A most interesting release for anyone liking Scandinavian music. Let us know what you think of the Rangstrom piece.

I recall Karajan's Sibelius 6th receiving good reviews but I have not heard the recording.
I suspected as much (re the Hungarian Quartet).  Many of the albums that I was flipping through the other day seemed to have come from one person's private library (judging by the stickers with numbers that I saw on many of them)...and they treated them well.

And, well, I succumbed again to some music purchases yesterday [Err...cough....cough].  Here we go!

Bernard Hermann Conducting the National Philharmonic Orchestra:  Music from Great Shakespearean Films (SPC 21132).  A Phase 4 recording imported from England (hope that the sound is OK as I've heard mixed things about the Phase 4 records).

Elgar's Violin Concerto with Kyung-Wha Chung/Solti on Decca (SXL 6842).  Not one of the "wide band" ones.  I paid $20 for it.  Hope that that was a decent price?  The LP appeared to be in great shape.  Cover as well though one crease in the top right-hand corner.  I don't often run across Decca LPs here in the States.

Also, bought a few CDs (which I'll list elsewhere).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 15, 2023, 09:11:29 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 15, 2023, 08:16:19 AMI remember your story Jeffrey (though not the specific LPs that you had purchased).  Was it Kvapil who was playing the Janacek works?  I suspect that at the time that you has purchased those LPs, that they hadn't been recorded much--sorry, not trying to make you (us) feel old here!  And thanks for the Nystroem suggestion!
I suspected as much (re the Hungarian Quartet).  Many of the albums that I was flipping through the other day seemed to have come from one person's private library (judging by the stickers with numbers that I saw on many of them)...and they treated them well.

And, well, I succumbed again to some music purchases yesterday [Err...cough....cough].  Here we go!

Bernard Hermann Conducting the National Philharmonic Orchestra:  Music from Great Shakespearean Films (SPC 21132).  A Phase 4 recording imported from England (hope that the sound is OK as I've heard mixed things about the Phase 4 records).

Elgar's Violin Concerto with Kyung-Wha Chung/Solti on Decca (SXL 6842).  Not one of the "wide band" ones.  I paid $20 for it.  Hope that that was a decent price?  The LP appeared to be in great shape.  Cover as well though one crease in the top right-hand corner.  I don't often run across Decca LPs here in the States.

Also, bought a few CDs (which I'll list elsewhere).

PD
Hi PD - No worries (HAHAHA)  ;D
Here is the CD version of the Janacek disc:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 15, 2023, 10:20:16 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 15, 2023, 09:11:29 AMHi PD - No worries (HAHAHA)  ;D
Here is the CD version of the Janacek disc:

That's a great set!  I have that one too--on both LP and CD.  Found the LP maybe about 8 years ago (from a record store that is alas no longer in business).  Purchased it for a decent price (though not nearly as great as yours).  Think that it was 10 bucks?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 16, 2023, 06:47:27 AM
PD, after SXL 6449 all first labels are narrow band so your SXL 6842 is well past that. A Dutch or UK pressing? Excellent performance.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 16, 2023, 08:47:59 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 16, 2023, 06:47:27 AMPD, after SXL 6449 all first labels are narrow band so your SXL 6842 is well past that. A Dutch or UK pressing? Excellent performance.
Thanks for the info (not at all surprised that you knew that!).  It's made in England.

I've loved other performances of hers and enjoy the work which is why I splurged on it.  :)

(https://img.discogs.com/dTXcYWNJPXfp4zEv_FV--OfD0I8=/fit-in/600x595/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-3416086-1372950205-6748.jpeg.jpg)

This is an image of the other one that I purchased then:

(https://images.eil.com/large_image/BERNARD_HERRMANN_MUSIC%2BFROM%2BGREAT%2BSHAKESPEAREAN%2BFILMS-584413.jpg)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 18, 2023, 02:59:51 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 16, 2023, 08:47:59 AMThanks for the info (not at all surprised that you knew that!).  It's made in England.

I've loved other performances of hers and enjoy the work which is why I splurged on it.  :)

(https://img.discogs.com/dTXcYWNJPXfp4zEv_FV--OfD0I8=/fit-in/600x595/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-3416086-1372950205-6748.jpeg.jpg)

This is an image of the other one that I purchased then:

(https://images.eil.com/large_image/BERNARD_HERRMANN_MUSIC%2BFROM%2BGREAT%2BSHAKESPEAREAN%2BFILMS-584413.jpg)

PD
I like the Herrmann/Shakespeare cover!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 22, 2023, 06:40:19 AM
Honegger: Symphonie Liturgique.

Listened to little else recently then this LP, R/S too. The first movement of "Liturgique" is the best thing I have heard in ages. Although nothing to back it up I have the feeling the polish of Karajan and his Berlin Phil does Honegger no harm.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 23, 2023, 01:45:40 PM
Quote from: Irons on May 22, 2023, 06:40:19 AMHonegger: Symphonie Liturgique.

Listened to little else recently then this LP, R/S too. The first movement of "Liturgique" is the best thing I have heard in ages. Although nothing to back it up I have the feeling the polish of Karajan and his Berlin Phil does Honegger no harm.
It's the greatest performance of that fine symphony. The birdsong ending is unmatched in any other recording - absolutely magical (and I am no great fan of Karajan). I prefer the original LP cover:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 25, 2023, 06:40:35 AM
More Honegger.

The Cello Concerto is an amazing piece. A single movement opening with a heart-warming pastoral theme which reappears at the coda. Honegger over just shy of 15 minutes explores many themes and styles which flow seamlessly into each other. Along with du Pré/Elgar and Rostropovich/DSCH 2 my favourite cello concerto recording.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 25, 2023, 07:02:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 25, 2023, 06:40:35 AMMore Honegger.

The Cello Concerto is an amazing piece. A single movement opening with a heart-warming pastoral theme which reappears at the coda. Honegger over just shy of 15 minutes explores many themes and styles which flow seamlessly into each other. Along with du Pré/Elgar and Rostropovich/DSCH 2 my favourite cello concerto recording.
Thumbs up for Honegger!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 26, 2023, 06:38:09 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 25, 2023, 07:02:43 AMThumbs up for Honegger!

I'm with you there, Jeffrey. Some time ago on another forum I was recommended this particular recording by a poster with a huge collection of both LP and CD as the best CC recording he had heard. He was not far wrong.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on May 26, 2023, 11:31:39 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 25, 2023, 06:40:35 AMMore Honegger.

The Cello Concerto is an amazing piece. A single movement opening with a heart-warming pastoral theme which reappears at the coda. Honegger over just shy of 15 minutes explores many themes and styles which flow seamlessly into each other. Along with du Pré/Elgar and Rostropovich/DSCH 2 my favourite cello concerto recording.
Thanks for posting this.  Thanks to Supraphon (who have uploaded this recording on youtube), I'm able to listen to it.  :)  Here, for anyone who doesn't own the LP,  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZFs4MlURac

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 27, 2023, 12:17:12 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 26, 2023, 11:31:39 AMThanks for posting this.  Thanks to Supraphon (who have uploaded this recording on youtube), I'm able to listen to it.  :)  Here, for anyone who doesn't own the LP,  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZFs4MlURac

PD

Thanks to you PD for posting link.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on May 31, 2023, 11:30:04 PM
A couple of late Lyrita's which command surprisingly high prices on the second-hand market.

(https://i.imgur.com/7SSEebK.jpg)

Walter Leigh was killed in action at Tobruk in 1942.

As always with Lyrita sleeve design by Keith Hensby. For this cover the painting "The Stream at Lolham Hill" also by Hensby.

(https://i.imgur.com/ysssAmf.jpg)

Off the top of my head I can't think of any other issues of Malcolm Arnold's music on (SRCS) Lyrita.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on May 31, 2023, 11:56:50 PM
Quote from: Irons on May 31, 2023, 11:30:04 PMA couple of late Lyrita's which command surprisingly high prices on the second-hand market.

(https://i.imgur.com/7SSEebK.jpg)

Walter Leigh was killed in action at Tobruk in 1942.

As always with Lyrita sleeve design by Keith Hensby. For this cover the painting "The Stream at Lolham Hill" also by Hensby.

(https://i.imgur.com/ysssAmf.jpg)

Off the top of my head I can't think of any other issues of Malcolm Arnold's music on (SRCS) Lyrita.


Here you go  :)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 01, 2023, 03:31:59 AM
Quote from: Irons on May 31, 2023, 11:30:04 PMA couple of late Lyrita's which command surprisingly high prices on the second-hand market.

(https://i.imgur.com/7SSEebK.jpg)

Walter Leigh was killed in action at Tobruk in 1942.

As always with Lyrita sleeve design by Keith Hensby. For this cover the painting "The Stream at Lolham Hill" also by Hensby.

(https://i.imgur.com/ysssAmf.jpg)

Off the top of my head I can't think of any other issues of Malcolm Arnold's music on (SRCS) Lyrita.


I like his paintings--particularly his landscapes and ones with owls in them.  "The Murdering Diva" is rather amusing too.  :)  https://www.peterbarkerfineart.co.uk/products/the-murdering-diva-by-keith-hensby

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 01, 2023, 07:28:30 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 31, 2023, 11:56:50 PMHere you go  :)


Was that released on LP, Jeffrey?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 01, 2023, 07:34:58 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 01, 2023, 03:31:59 AMI like his paintings--particularly his landscapes and ones with owls in them.  "The Murdering Diva" is rather amusing too.  :)  https://www.peterbarkerfineart.co.uk/products/the-murdering-diva-by-keith-hensby

PD

If I had a listening room which sadly I have not, for £300 a Hensby painting ticks a lot of boxes.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 01, 2023, 08:21:43 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 01, 2023, 07:28:30 AMWas that released on LP, Jeffrey?
I'm not sure Lol - maybe not.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 02, 2023, 04:31:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 01, 2023, 07:34:58 AMIf I had a listening room which sadly I have not, for £300 a Hensby painting ticks a lot of boxes.
Do you think that "the missus" might not just enjoy the artwork for what it is?

I'm on the lookout for an old "statue" [or whatever you call it] of Nipper.  :) I have an inexpensive magnet of "His Master's Voice" on my fridge....and I'm a cat person!  ;D

PD

EDIT:  Decided I would do a quick google to get an idea what statues of Nipper are going for these days and ran across this article.  Had no idea that such things existed!  Will have to see if I can see this "little fella" next time that I head out towards Albany.

https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/the-worlds-largest-terrier-mascot-menands-new-york
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Biffo on June 02, 2023, 05:46:51 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on May 15, 2023, 09:11:29 AMHi PD - No worries (HAHAHA)  ;D
Here is the CD version of the Janacek disc:


That really was a bargain; I bought the same album at full price and still have the LPs.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 02, 2023, 07:30:22 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 02, 2023, 04:31:26 AMDo you think that "the missus" might not just enjoy the artwork for what it is?

I'm on the lookout for an old "statue" [or whatever you call it] of Nipper.  :) I have an inexpensive magnet of "His Master's Voice" on my fridge....and I'm a cat person!  ;D

PD

EDIT:  Decided I would do a quick google to get an idea what statues of Nipper are going for these days and ran across this article.  Had no idea that such things existed!  Will have to see if I can see this "little fella" next time that I head out towards Albany.

https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/the-worlds-largest-terrier-mascot-menands-new-york

You mention statues, PD.

(https://i.imgur.com/lH8lQWh.jpg)

Many years ago, at least thirty, I used a rat-run to avoid rush hour traffic in Putney High Street. In the back streets I passed a shop selling old stuff and in the window I spied Schubert. On my half day I tracked back to see if I could make a purchase. I had no idea how much Schubert would cost and asking the assistant how much, stunned to silence as much less then I was expecting. He misread my reaction and cut the price thinking I was not prepared to pay the asking price. I am useless at haggling but that day a master. ;D   

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 02, 2023, 08:15:06 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 02, 2023, 07:30:22 AMYou mention statues, PD.

(https://i.imgur.com/lH8lQWh.jpg)

Many years ago, at least thirty, I used a rat-run to avoid rush hour traffic in Putney High Street. In the back streets I passed a shop selling old stuff and in the window I spied Schubert. On my half day I tracked back to see if I could make a purchase. I had no idea how much Schubert would cost and asking the assistant how much, stunned to silence as much less then I was expecting. He misread my reaction and cut the price thinking I was not prepared to pay the asking price. I am useless at haggling but that day a master. ;D   


lol.  Good job there!  And are those individual shelving units for your CDs?

By the way, the mother of a friend of mine loved Beethoven so much that (many years ago) she had a bronze bust made of him.  ;D

What did you think of the huge Nipper?  Here are some photos of him for those who don't feel like reading the article:

(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.2YpK_6FIgL9jbk5TLoUC5gHaEK%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=e57458456e7888d1eaa664728762ea3335cdbe80b653a5ef00d7eb460307ccd2&ipo=images)
(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.h90KLhB9oi3pmFaWUA1-3AHaE6%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=b4182ed978cdc7616b763be3118a653ad75d8b401aa8f9c64069b45b2fb2a39c&ipo=images)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 03, 2023, 12:03:34 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 02, 2023, 08:15:06 AMlol.  Good job there!  And are those individual shelving units for your CDs?

By the way, the mother of a friend of mine loved Beethoven so much that (many years ago) she had a bronze bust made of him.  ;D

What did you think of the huge Nipper?  Here are some photos of him for those who don't feel like reading the article:

(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.2YpK_6FIgL9jbk5TLoUC5gHaEK%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=e57458456e7888d1eaa664728762ea3335cdbe80b653a5ef00d7eb460307ccd2&ipo=images)
(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.h90KLhB9oi3pmFaWUA1-3AHaE6%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=b4182ed978cdc7616b763be3118a653ad75d8b401aa8f9c64069b45b2fb2a39c&ipo=images)

PD

I notice in the link that Nipper is staring down the throat of a different machine then the original painting. Sad that a great company like RCA are "defunct".

(https://i.imgur.com/YUGVFzk.jpg)

PD, I'm no carpenter, so my workmanship is well hidden with floating CDs.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 12:33:47 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 02, 2023, 07:30:22 AMYou mention statues, PD.

(https://i.imgur.com/lH8lQWh.jpg)

Many years ago, at least thirty, I used a rat-run to avoid rush hour traffic in Putney High Street. In the back streets I passed a shop selling old stuff and in the window I spied Schubert. On my half day I tracked back to see if I could make a purchase. I had no idea how much Schubert would cost and asking the assistant how much, stunned to silence as much less then I was expecting. He misread my reaction and cut the price thinking I was not prepared to pay the asking price. I am useless at haggling but that day a master. ;D   


I like your CD arranging by labels Lol. One of the old London record shops (Imhoffs?) arranged their LPs like that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 03, 2023, 04:30:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 03, 2023, 12:03:34 AMI notice in the link that Nipper is staring down the throat of a different machine then the original painting. Sad that a great company like RCA are "defunct".

(https://i.imgur.com/YUGVFzk.jpg)

PD, I'm no carpenter, so my workmanship is well hidden with floating CDs.
It sounds like, from the article, that he painted that theme several times.  Personally, I'll pass on purchasing a 28 foot tall Nipper--too big for my living room.

Quote from: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 12:33:47 AMI like your CD arranging by labels Lol. One of the old London record shops (Imhoffs?) arranged their LPs like that.
I had thought that that was what he had done (arranging by label)!  Problem though is what do you do if you don't either have the original release (and now "x" label is now part of "y" company--feel free to insert "Sony" here for "y")?  That, or you buy it as part of a boxed set which has been licensed from the original company?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 05:16:05 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 03, 2023, 04:30:14 AMIt sounds like, from the article, that he painted that theme several times.  Personally, I'll pass on purchasing a 28 foot tall Nipper--too big for my living room.
I had thought that that was what he had done (arranging by label)!  Problem though is what do you do if you don't either have the original release (and now "x" label is now part of "y" company--feel free to insert "Sony" here for "y")?  That, or you buy it as part of a boxed set which has been licensed from the original company?

PD
Good point PD but they look nice colour-coded as in Lol's collection.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 03, 2023, 09:29:45 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 05:16:05 AMGood point PD but they look nice colour-coded as in Lol's collection.
I know!  ;D

I have put some things together by label...like the EMI Icon sets that I have, DG's Original Masters, etc.  Individual ones are sorted differently though.  Mind you, my system is far from perfect and I really need more shelving!

Bye the way Lol, how much of the living room have you overtaken with your LPs, etc.?  If I'm recalling correctly, come to think of it, you have your equipment and music collection in a different room (separated by an arch?)?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 04, 2023, 06:31:13 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 03, 2023, 09:29:45 AMI know!  ;D

I have put some things together by label...like the EMI Icon sets that I have, DG's Original Masters, etc.  Individual ones are sorted differently though.  Mind you, my system is far from perfect and I really need more shelving!

Bye the way Lol, how much of the living room have you overtaken with your LPs, etc.?  If I'm recalling correctly, come to think of it, you have your equipment and music collection in a different room (separated by an arch?)?

PD

I have an understanding missus PD but that does not stop her having an occasional moan "can't you listen like normal people through a laptop and headphones?!"

Yes, that is how we got around the problem. Something had to be done, we had an annex built next to our dining/listening room. One end houses records and CD's and the other, Hi-Fi, with a hole drilled through the wall for speaker cable leading to speakers in the main room.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2023, 07:07:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 04, 2023, 06:31:13 AMI have an understanding missus PD but that does not stop her having an occasional moan "can't you listen like normal people through a laptop and headphones?!"

Yes, that is how we got around the problem. Something had to be done, we had an annex built next to our dining/listening room. One end houses records and CD's and the other, Hi-Fi, with a hole drilled through the wall for speaker cable leading to speakers in the main room.
Ah, nice to know that my memory hasn't totally failed me--yet, anyway!

By the way, how much room do you have left (to fill)?  :)  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 05, 2023, 06:29:42 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 04, 2023, 07:07:02 AMAh, nice to know that my memory hasn't totally failed me--yet, anyway!

By the way, how much room do you have left (to fill)?  :)  ;)

PD

Not a lot!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 05, 2023, 06:31:00 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 05, 2023, 06:29:42 AMNot a lot!
Uh oh!!  :o

Annex No. 2 coming up!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 10, 2023, 03:17:59 AM
Spinning Shostakovich.

(https://i.imgur.com/6Sg43Ay.jpg)

Recorded at Snape Maltings in great sound. Outstanding contribution from John Wilbraham (trumpet).

(https://i.imgur.com/mQlXq3x.jpg)

Weller made some excellent recordings, both orchestral and string quartet. Although he does not receive credit due.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on June 10, 2023, 05:09:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 10, 2023, 03:17:59 AMSpinning Shostakovich.

(https://i.imgur.com/6Sg43Ay.jpg)

Recorded at Snape Maltings in great sound. Outstanding contribution from John Wilbraham (trumpet).

(https://i.imgur.com/mQlXq3x.jpg)

Weller made some excellent recordings, both orchestral and string quartet. Although he does not receive credit due.
I remember that Weller LP! Nice nostalgia trip.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on June 13, 2023, 09:16:31 AM
It's nicely packaged, the new AAA-mix is very well done and the vinyl is of superb quality. DG The Original Source:

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/img_4097-jpeg.927640/)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 17, 2023, 12:35:35 AM
Tend to shy away from the Second Viennese School but purchased this issue mainly for Agon. As it turned out I enjoyed Berg's Chamber Concerto even going as far as to follow up with the same composer's Four Pieces for Clarinet and Piano (Gervase De Peyer/Lamar Crowson). 

(https://i.imgur.com/TV056Yh.jpg)

Recording up to Kenneth Wilkinson's high standards made at Walthamstow Town Hall in 1980.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 28, 2023, 07:02:17 AM
Janacek: Concertino.

Any recording featuring Lamar Crowson should be snapped up without a second thought.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 28, 2023, 09:19:58 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 28, 2023, 07:02:17 AMJanacek: Concertino.

Any recording featuring Lamar Crowson should be snapped up without a second thought.
Haven't heard of him before now.  Have enjoyed what I've heard of the Melos though.  I have high standards for my Janacek (  ;)  ), so what can you tell me about him, Irons?  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 29, 2023, 01:01:26 AM
Crowson will blow your mind in Janacek's Concertino, PD. My cartridge was hanging on to his chords by fingertips! Explosive playing.
His discography is far larger then Discogs list. Although he did feature as a soloist in concerti - Arthur Benjamin for example, Crowson's forte was as an accompanist in chamber music. Very much the house pianist for the Melos. If a piano featured in a Melos recording then so did Lamar Crowson.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on June 29, 2023, 03:44:59 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 29, 2023, 01:01:26 AMCrowson will blow your mind in Janacek's Concertino, PD. My cartridge was hanging on to his chords by fingertips! Explosive playing.
His discography is far larger then Discogs list. Although he did feature as a soloist in concerti - Arthur Benjamin for example, Crowson's forte was as an accompanist in chamber music. Very much the house pianist for the Melos. If a piano featured in a Melos recording then so did Lamar Crowson.
Thanks for the info!  Will check it out.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on June 30, 2023, 06:27:19 AM
Spinning: Rawsthorne, Divertimento and 1st Symphony.

(https://i.imgur.com/2sf2x5K.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/U7zqiOu.jpg)

A standout feature of Rawsthorne's music is the energy. Michael Kennedy in his notes for the Divertimento wrote The exquisite central Lullaby is a superb example of tenderness which Rawsthorne tended to suppress for fear (unjustified) of sentimentality.



Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on July 03, 2023, 12:00:41 PM
Recommended read:
https://trackingangle.com/features/rewriting-history-deutsche-grammophon-s-groundbreaking-original-source-vinyl-reviewed
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 04, 2023, 12:26:09 AM
Quote from: Valentino on July 03, 2023, 12:00:41 PMRecommended read:
https://trackingangle.com/features/rewriting-history-deutsche-grammophon-s-groundbreaking-original-source-vinyl-reviewed

More power to their elbow! The choice of repertoire is a bit safe for my tastes although I would possibly invest in the Abbado Stravinsky and Debussy/Ravel.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on July 04, 2023, 06:57:15 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 30, 2023, 06:27:19 AM(https://i.imgur.com/U7zqiOu.jpg)

My lord, I'm imaging that grotesque cover art in a 12" printed format!

Nowadays that trimmed photograph would have been made by an incompetent user of Photoshop. I guess in those days they used scissors and rubber cement to compose the image.  ;D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 04, 2023, 07:11:35 AM
Quote from: Spotted Horses on July 04, 2023, 06:57:15 AMMy lord, I'm imaging that grotesque cover art in a 12" printed format!

Nowadays that trimmed photograph would have been made by an incompetent user of Photoshop. I guess in those days they used scissors and rubber cement to compose the image.  ;D

Ah progress! Just goes to show how old school I am that I posted that cover because it is so good. :D
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on July 04, 2023, 07:34:59 AM
^So far I've bought the Schubert and ordered the Mahler   (Must get going on the 5, I have Sinopoli and a download of  Barshai just landed so a "controversial" Karajan is fine), and the Verdi. I'll get a couple from the third batch when they come available in a voec compliant shop.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 04, 2023, 11:57:33 AM
Quote from: Irons on June 30, 2023, 06:27:19 AMSpinning: Rawsthorne, Divertimento and 1st Symphony.

(https://i.imgur.com/2sf2x5K.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/U7zqiOu.jpg)

A standout feature of Rawsthorne's music is the energy. Michael Kennedy in his notes for the Divertimento wrote The exquisite central Lullaby is a superb example of tenderness which Rawsthorne tended to suppress for fear (unjustified) of sentimentality.




I remember that Rawsthorne Symphonic Studies LP with much nostalgic affection and was sorry that they did not keep that coupling for the CD release. The same can be said for Lennox Berkeley's 1st Symphony and Concerto for Two Pianos:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 04, 2023, 11:37:04 PM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 04, 2023, 11:57:33 AMI remember that Rawsthorne Symphonic Studies LP with much nostalgic affection and was sorry that they did not keep that coupling for the CD release. The same can be said for Lennox Berkeley's 1st Symphony and Concerto for Two Pianos:


I recall the late Len Gregory aka The Cartridge Man telling me off as I owned a Nimbus pressing (still do) not Decca of the Rawsthorne recording. Odd how small things like that stick in the mind.

It was you Jeffrey that alerted me that I didn't have Berkeley 1st and Concerto recording on my shelves.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 04, 2023, 11:46:43 PM
Quote from: Irons on July 04, 2023, 11:37:04 PMI recall the late Len Gregory aka The Cartridge Man telling me off as I owned a Nimbus pressing (still do) not Decca of the Rawsthorne recording. Odd how small things like that stick in the mind.

It was you Jeffrey that alerted me that I didn't have Berkeley 1st and Concerto recording on my shelves.
Did you find a copy of the Berkeley disc Lol? It was a favourite Lyrita LP in my collection (although one of many!)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 05, 2023, 12:04:22 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 04, 2023, 11:46:43 PMDid you find a copy of the Berkeley disc Lol? It was a favourite Lyrita LP in my collection (although one of many!)

Yes, Jeffrey. Very fine it is too. As you said at the time Concerto for Two Pianos is outstanding.

I have most of the Lyrita LPs deciding to give the "Pops" albums a miss. One glaring omission is that man Rawsthorne again.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 05, 2023, 12:13:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 05, 2023, 12:04:22 AMYes, Jeffrey. Very fine it is too. As you said at the time Concerto for Two Pianos is outstanding.

I have most of the Lyrita LPs deciding to give the "Pops" albums a miss. One glaring omission is that man Rawsthorne again.
I don't have the 'Lyrita Lollipops' or that Rawsthorne LP either Lol. I remember finding the Rawsthorne 2nd Piano Concerto on a Decca Eclipse LP at a record shop near South Kensington underground station. It was interestingly coupled with Samuel Barber's Cello Concerto - two legendary performances.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 05, 2023, 06:40:15 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 05, 2023, 12:13:14 AMI don't have the 'Lyrita Lollipops' or that Rawsthorne LP either Lol. I remember finding the Rawsthorne 2nd Piano Concerto on a Decca Eclipse LP at a record shop near South Kensington underground station. It was interestingly coupled with Samuel Barber's Cello Concerto - two legendary performances.

Rawsthorne and Barber a strange coupling, Jeffrey. I have the Barber but was not aware that Curzon recorded Rawsthorne.
 

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 05, 2023, 02:17:51 PM
Quote from: Irons on July 05, 2023, 06:40:15 AMRawsthorne and Barber a strange coupling, Jeffrey. I have the Barber but was not aware that Curzon recorded Rawsthorne.
 


That's a nice Ace of Clubs disc Lol coupling Barber's fine Cello Concerto and Symphony No.2.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 13, 2023, 12:18:48 AM
Interesting choice although each can be classed as safe. Klemperer and Martinon each selected twice.

Twelve amazing Classical records.     https://youtu.be/FfpG3APdw_c
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 13, 2023, 01:43:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 13, 2023, 12:18:48 AMInteresting choice although each can be classed as safe. Klemperer and Martinon each selected twice.

Twelve amazing Classical records.    https://youtu.be/FfpG3APdw_c
Interesting that he picked Michelangeli for Debussy.  I haven't heard his recordings of it before now.  I did like what I heard of it.  :) And that Brahms was quite striking!

Which of the recordings do you have, Lol?  Or perhaps I should "Which of them do you not own?"?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 13, 2023, 07:14:17 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 13, 2023, 01:43:26 AMInteresting that he picked Michelangeli for Debussy.  I haven't heard his recordings of it before now.  I did like what I heard of it.  :) And that Brahms was quite striking!

Which of the recordings do you have, Lol?  Or perhaps I should "Which of them do you not own?"?

PD

Klemperer and Brahms go hand to glove. It has to be said sound is muddy which has always puzzled me as his Beethoven set has superior sonics and yet recorded before the Brahms with I think same venue, engineers etc.

I do own the Michelangeli and think it great.

The Mendelssohn SQ segment made me sit up. Lovely.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on July 13, 2023, 07:48:11 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 13, 2023, 07:14:17 AMKlemperer and Brahms go hand to glove. It has to be said sound is muddy which has always puzzled me as his Beethoven set has superior sonics and yet recorded before the Brahms with I think same venue, engineers etc.

I do own the Michelangeli and think it great.

The Mendelssohn SQ segment made me sit up. Lovely.
I'll have to revisit that one (I have the set.).  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 14, 2023, 01:22:42 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 13, 2023, 07:48:11 AMI'll have to revisit that one (I have the set.).  :)

PD

That's good. I don't, but had a Mendelssohn evening anyway. Probably being thick but find numbering of his string quartets confusing. I took pot luck with the Orford SQ who I think are Canadian.

(https://i.imgur.com/s1xxSqr.jpg)

Followed this with a classic recording - Mendelssohn in Scotland.

(https://i.imgur.com/w6UNcyX.jpg)

 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on July 27, 2023, 11:28:54 PM
Bax: Legend-Sonata for cello and piano.

Florence Hooton - cello.
Wilfred Parry - piano.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on July 31, 2023, 09:50:05 AM
Quote from: Irons on July 27, 2023, 11:28:54 PMBax: Legend-Sonata for cello and piano.

Florence Hooton - cello.
Wilfred Parry - piano.
Looks like a classic recording Lol.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 01, 2023, 06:21:25 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on July 31, 2023, 09:50:05 AMLooks like a classic recording Lol.

A second issue too, Jeffrey.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 05, 2023, 12:57:43 AM
One of the strangest Supraphon issues I have come across.

(https://i.imgur.com/sCCLG3P.jpg)

Henry Eccles: Sonata in G minor.
Britten: Lacrymae.
Rebecca Clarke: Sonata.

The Clarke piece which I listened to yesterday is very good. RVW an obvious influence.
Josef Kodousek, violist, a member of the original Vlach SQ.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on August 05, 2023, 12:48:15 PM
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/img_4222-jpeg.940588/)
I am very impressed by the work of Emile Berliner Studios on this Mahler 5 with BP and HvK.
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/img_4220-jpeg.940589/)
Here's a tech sales pitch video of what they do to these old 4 track tapes compared to what was done back in the days:

So far I've received two of these new audiophile releases. More on the way.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 08, 2023, 01:05:40 AM
 :P

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on August 08, 2023, 06:11:35 AM
Glorious mono!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 08, 2023, 06:58:25 AM
Quote from: Valentino on August 08, 2023, 06:11:35 AMGlorious mono!

Yes, but how does it measure?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on August 08, 2023, 11:56:31 AM
Three times better because it has three engines!
I'm always amused by these in-room recordings of hifi, or rather of people making sonic assesments based on such.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 09, 2023, 12:05:40 AM
I want to get myself a head dress like that fella wore for cartridge installation. 8) 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: AnotherSpin on August 09, 2023, 12:45:19 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 08, 2023, 06:58:25 AMYes, but how does it measure?

It is impossible to measure audio quality.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on August 09, 2023, 04:44:45 AM
Please go to the impossible thread with that.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: AnotherSpin on August 09, 2023, 05:24:40 AM
Quote from: Valentino on August 09, 2023, 04:44:45 AMPlease go to the impossible thread with that.

If you strain a little, you can see that my remark was in response to a question. Perhaps your complaint is misdirected?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on August 09, 2023, 05:46:31 AM
Quote from: AnotherSpin on August 09, 2023, 05:24:40 AMIf you strain a little, you can see that my remark was in response to a question. Perhaps your complaint is misdirected?
I suspect that @Irons "question" was meant sarcastically and in response to all of the recent and rather caustic debate [which is why that discussion was moved elsewhere].  ;)

Best wishes,

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: AnotherSpin on August 09, 2023, 06:28:14 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on August 09, 2023, 05:46:31 AMI suspect that @Irons "question" was meant sarcastically and in response to all of the recent and rather caustic debate [which is why that discussion was moved elsewhere].  ;)

Best wishes,

PD

And yet. Every question implies an answer. Don't like the answers, don't ask questions.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on August 09, 2023, 07:03:32 AM
Quote from: AnotherSpin on August 09, 2023, 06:28:14 AMAnd yet. Every question implies an answer. Don't like the answers, don't ask questions.

Couldn't care less, Another Spin. But a rhetorical question does not require an answer. Just so you know. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: AnotherSpin on August 09, 2023, 08:09:52 AM
Quote from: Irons on August 09, 2023, 07:03:32 AMCouldn't care less, Another Spin. But a rhetorical question does not require an answer. Just so you know. 

That the question was rhetorical is not obvious. Next time make a note so that no one bothers to reply.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Mandryka on August 09, 2023, 08:12:36 AM
Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

What is the sound of one hand clapping?

How many roads must a man walk down before you can all him a man?

Who lives in a pineapple under the sea?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on September 25, 2023, 11:41:10 PM
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 06, 2023, 10:16:25 AM
Quote from: Valentino on August 05, 2023, 12:48:15 PM(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/img_4222-jpeg.940588/)
I am very impressed by the work of Emile Berliner Studios on this Mahler 5 with BP and HvK.
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/img_4220-jpeg.940589/)
Here's a tech sales pitch video of what they do to these old 4 track tapes compared to what was done back in the days:

So far I've received two of these new audiophile releases. More on the way.


Have you ordered any more of these releases lately Valentino?  Or have they released any recently?

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on October 07, 2023, 06:34:53 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on October 06, 2023, 10:16:25 AMHave you ordered any more of these releases lately Valentino?  Or have they released any recently?

PD

Well, I can't think of a better person to take Thirty three and a third over the line to a 100 pages. ;D
First sign of madness and all that, it has been a struggle getting thus far - who would believe it! :o 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: DavidW on October 07, 2023, 06:49:38 AM
I liked that video that Valentino linked.  That is impressive that they had to sit with a score in hand and manually cut and splice in the right places.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 07, 2023, 06:40:22 PM
Quote from: Irons on September 25, 2023, 11:41:10 PM

Oh, there's so much "magic" that we do (as in different views/ways of cleaning our records).  Which ways are better?  ;D I did enjoy watching it though for ideas.  Thank you for sharing it with us Irons!  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 14, 2023, 07:13:16 AM
Sorry for my delayed reply. Here's my TG TOS collection as of now:
(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=106167;image)
I haven't really understood how great a recording venue the Boston Symphony Hall is before now. It certainly gives Decca's famous Sofiensaal a run for it's Apfelstrudeln.

A couple of these discs can be used as tracking test records. There has been complaints about the trackability of side three of the Brahms Gilels (not by me, mind you). It has a rather narrow runout with minor modulated radius 52 mm, perfect for a Stevenson DIN alignment with the inner null at 57.5 mm (Picture from Tracking Angle (https://trackingangle.com/features/emil-berliner-swing-for-the-fences-with-anothr-batch-of-original-source-titles)'s review of the second release batch):

(https://trackingangle.com/assets/img_3688reduced.JPG)

In 2024 there should be releases of a Steinberg and Boston 3LP-box with Holst, Hindemith, Strauss (and maybe Ligeti?), and Strauss 4 letzte Lieder with Janowitz/Karajan.

PD: Here's what has been released so far and what's left in stock at DG:
https://store.deutschegrammophon.com/p30-i3200
You may be luckier over at Discogs.


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 14, 2023, 01:16:43 PM
Quote from: Valentino on October 14, 2023, 07:13:16 AMSorry for my delayed reply. Here's my TG TOS collection as of now:
(https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=106167;image)
I haven't really understood how great a recording venue the Boston Symphony Hall is before now. It certainly gives Decca's famous Sofiensaal a run for it's Apfelstrudeln.

A couple of these discs can be used as tracking test records. There has been complaints about the trackability of side three of the Brahms Gilels (not by me, mind you). It has a rather narrow runout with minor modulated radius 52 mm, perfect for a Stevenson DIN alignment with the inner null at 57.5 mm (Picture from Tracking Angle (https://trackingangle.com/features/emil-berliner-swing-for-the-fences-with-anothr-batch-of-original-source-titles)'s review of the second release batch):

(https://trackingangle.com/assets/img_3688reduced.JPG)

In 2024 there should be releases of a Steinberg and Boston 3LP-box with Holst, Hindemith, Strauss (and maybe Ligeti?), and Strauss 4 letzte Lieder with Janowitz/Karajan.

PD: Here's what has been released so far and what's left in stock at DG:
https://store.deutschegrammophon.com/p30-i3200
You may be luckier over at Discogs



What's the one that has no words on the cover?

I do have a pressing of Ma Vlast...not certain about the others.  The prices with shipping are up there though...tempting!

Glad to hear that you are enjoying them!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 14, 2023, 09:47:07 PM
Upper right? The Persian carpet.  8)
I have a DG Resonance pressing of the Ma Vlast and an original German pressing of the Ravel Debussy.
You would not believe the improvement in sound quality before hearing it.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on October 15, 2023, 12:00:54 PM
Quote from: Valentino on October 14, 2023, 09:47:07 PMUpper right? The Persian carpet.  8)
I have a DG Resonance pressing of the Ma Vlast and an original German pressing of the Ravel Debussy.
You would not believe the improvement in sound quality before hearing it.
I had missed noticing the narrow border of the carpet by the other ones.  lol  And these days, with so many albums with nothing other than a picture on the cover, I had assumed it was another one.  ;D

In any event, pleased to hear that you are enjoying them.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on October 23, 2023, 12:28:24 PM
DG have announced the next batch for preorder (open the pic in a new tab for readable size):
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/1697776235543-png.962194/)
I've ordered the Steiberg box and the Janowitz from Presto Music in the UK. Nice VOEC compliant source for classical and jazz.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 01, 2023, 01:42:14 AM
A limited edition that will sell out in no time.

https://www.theelectricrecordingco.com/news/2023-10-31-erc100-mozart-les-sonates-pour-piano-et-violin-par-lili-kraus-et-willi-boskovsky

If I had the money (and I don't) I would still feel uncomfortable spending nearly three thousand pounds on a set of LPs.

Not too much of a hardship 'making do' with the French Refereces set.

(https://i.imgur.com/u8nrwJs.jpg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 01, 2023, 02:55:14 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 01, 2023, 01:42:14 AMA limited edition that will sell out in no time.

https://www.theelectricrecordingco.com/news/2023-10-31-erc100-mozart-les-sonates-pour-piano-et-violin-par-lili-kraus-et-willi-boskovsky

If I had the money (and I don't) I would still feel uncomfortable spending nearly three thousand pounds on a set of LPs.

Not too much of a hardship 'making do' with the French Refereces set.

(https://i.imgur.com/u8nrwJs.jpg)
Youch!  :o Glad that you have that other set.  What sort of money do they go for these days Lol?  Their names are vaguely familiar to me.  I'll have to see if I can find some of their recordings online.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 01, 2023, 07:41:18 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 01, 2023, 02:55:14 AMYouch!  :o Glad that you have that other set.  What sort of money do they go for these days Lol?  Their names are vaguely familiar to me.  I'll have to see if I can find some of their recordings online.

PD

Prompted by your post PD I have had a quick look on eBay and somewhat surprised at the sums involved. I paid nothing like that. I recall purchasing Volume 1 at sadly demised Classical Record Exchange and after liking what I heard locating Volume 2 on eBay.

Out of interest the set was recorded in Vienna and Paris by the legendary sound engineer André Charlin.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 01, 2023, 02:54:06 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 01, 2023, 07:41:18 AMPrompted by your post PD I have had a quick look on eBay and somewhat surprised at the sums involved. I paid nothing like that. I recall purchasing Volume 1 at sadly demised Classical Record Exchange and after liking what I heard locating Volume 2 on eBay.

Out of interest the set was recorded in Vienna and Paris by the legendary sound engineer André Charlin.
Thanks.  :) It's hard to figure out where to look for LPs....it's been a while since I've ordered from it, but I tend to avoid eBay (in terms of prices).  I'll have to google André Charlin (new to me too.  And, boy, you know so much!  ;)  :)  ).

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 02, 2023, 01:34:36 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 01, 2023, 02:54:06 PMThanks.  :) It's hard to figure out where to look for LPs....it's been a while since I've ordered from it, but I tend to avoid eBay (in terms of prices).  I'll have to google André Charlin (new to me too.  And, boy, you know so much!  ;)  :)  ).

PD

Absolutely not - although very nice of you to say so. ;)

If I gave the impression of knowing the final sentence, then that is misleading. I simply relayed the info from the set notes. I am fully aware of the excellence of André Charlin as collected his recordings for years.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 02, 2023, 07:06:56 AM
Now playing: Batock's Hebridean Symphony
First ever recording
Like those early Havergal Brian LP releases from the Leicestershire Schools SO  this is most impressive and very atmospheric:
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2023, 08:56:26 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 02, 2023, 01:34:36 AMAbsolutely not - although very nice of you to say so. ;)

If I gave the impression of knowing the final sentence, then that is misleading. I simply relayed the info from the set notes. I am fully aware of the excellence of André Charlin as collected his recordings for years.
I see that there's an official website dedicated to his recordings.  They've released some of them for sale on both CD and vinyl.  You can also listen to samples there.

It's here:  https://en.andrecharlin.com/ecouter

Interesting to read on Wiki about his upbringing and all of the audio equipment he invented (and patented), etc.

PD

EDIT:  Looks like I had an older copied link at first.  I corrected it.  And currently am enjoying Willi Boskovsky & Lili Kraus - Mozart : Violin Sonata B-Dur K.378 (1954) via youtube.  Lovely!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 02, 2023, 02:04:28 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 02, 2023, 08:56:26 AMI see that there's an official website dedicated to his recordings.  They've released some of them for sale on both CD and vinyl.  You can also listen to samples there.

It's here:  https://en.andrecharlin.com/ecouter

Interesting to read on Wiki about his upbringing and all of the audio equipment he invented (and patented), etc.

PD

EDIT:  Looks like I had an older copied link at first.  I corrected it.  And currently am enjoying Willi Boskovsky & Lili Kraus - Mozart : Violin Sonata B-Dur K.378 (1954) via youtube.  Lovely!

Me too; Side 5 of Volume 1. K 301 & K 302.

As listening I could not help thinking that we are all guilty of taking for granted the miracle of recorded sound. Kraus and Boskovsky are there in my listening room in sound fresh as new paint demonstrating artistry from another age.

Thanks for Charlin link. Will investigate.

PD, If you find the time take a look at the life of Lili Kraus. To say interesting and eventful an understatement.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 03, 2023, 07:55:07 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 02, 2023, 07:06:56 AMNow playing: Batock's Hebridean Symphony
First ever recording
Like those early Havergal Brian LP releases from the Leicestershire Schools SO  this is most impressive and very atmospheric:


Not the first time I have set eyes on the cover, Jeffrey. A strange one as Gough and Davy Records is a new one on me and a fairly late release from 1978. Liner notes by Raymond Bantock, relation?

https://www.discogs.com/release/13479346-Sir-Granville-Bantock-City-Of-Hull-Youth-Orchestra-Geoffrey-Heald-Smith-Hebridean-Symphony
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on November 03, 2023, 10:25:02 AM
Quote from: Irons on November 03, 2023, 07:55:07 AMNot the first time I have set eyes on the cover, Jeffrey. A strange one as Gough and Davy Records is a new one on me and a fairly late release from 1978. Liner notes by Raymond Bantock, relation?

https://www.discogs.com/release/13479346-Sir-Granville-Bantock-City-Of-Hull-Youth-Orchestra-Geoffrey-Heald-Smith-Hebridean-Symphony
'Raymond Robert Marcus Bantock was the second son of Granville Bantock, the composer and conductor. He was born in 1900. He served in the Navy at the end of the First World War, and then obtained a Government Grant and went to New College, Oxford to read English. He spent three years in Japan as professor of English at Tokyo University and later returned to Birmingham, initially taking employment as a private coach. He married Margaret More (known as Peggy), a composer of orchestral music whose talents had been fostered by Josef Holbrooke, and whom he met at Harlech. They had six children. Raymond lived for many years at Grey Cottage, Barnt Green. He wrote the words for two songs that his father composed: Three Nocturnes for Voice and Piano , c 1925, and The Nightmare Giant , 1928. He also edited Six Great Modern One Act Plays , Tokyo 1924, and wrote Children of the Stage and The Slumberer: two plays 1929.'
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 04, 2023, 12:55:53 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on November 03, 2023, 10:25:02 AM'Raymond Robert Marcus Bantock was the second son of Granville Bantock, the composer and conductor. He was born in 1900. He served in the Navy at the end of the First World War, and then obtained a Government Grant and went to New College, Oxford to read English. He spent three years in Japan as professor of English at Tokyo University and later returned to Birmingham, initially taking employment as a private coach. He married Margaret More (known as Peggy), a composer of orchestral music whose talents had been fostered by Josef Holbrooke, and whom he met at Harlech. They had six children. Raymond lived for many years at Grey Cottage, Barnt Green. He wrote the words for two songs that his father composed: Three Nocturnes for Voice and Piano , c 1925, and The Nightmare Giant , 1928. He also edited Six Great Modern One Act Plays , Tokyo 1924, and wrote Children of the Stage and The Slumberer: two plays 1929.'

Thanks, Jeffrey. A life well lived!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: CelluloidBiker on November 17, 2023, 03:34:52 PM
Hi all, I'm new to the forum; I was inspired to join because I'm in the midst of a Bach vinyl kick, mainly keyboard works. I've acquired the following LP sets in the last few weeks, and they've all been on heavy rotation (all on harpsichord unless otherwise noted):

The Well-Tempered Clavier 1 & 2 - Helmut Walcha (Archiv 1978, rec. 1973-74) (https://www.discogs.com/release/7872953-JS-Bach-Helmut-Walcha-Das-Wohltemperierte-Klavier-I-II-The-Well-Tempered-Clavier-Le-Clavier-Bien-Tem)
The Well-Tempered Clavier Book 1 - Ralph Kirkpatrick, clavichord (Archiv 1959) (https://www.discogs.com/release/4722661-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Ralph-Kirkpatrick-Das-Wohltemperierte-Klavier-1Teil)
The Well-Tempered Clavier Book 2 - Ralph Kirkpatrick, clavichord (Archiv 1967) (https://www.discogs.com/release/18029407-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Ralph-Kirkpatrick-Das-Wohltemperierte-Clavier-IITeil-Bwv-870-893)
The Art of Fugue - Gustav Leonhardt (Harmonia Mundi 1974, rec. 1969) (https://www.discogs.com/release/1622198-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Cembalo-Gustav-Leonhardt-Die-Kunst-Der-Fuge)
Goldberg Variations - Trevor Pinnock (Archiv 1980) (https://www.discogs.com/release/8679917-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Trevor-Pinnock-Goldberg-Variationen)

All phenomenal, near-silent pressings of brilliant performances. But beyond the sound quality, another reason I love listening to this music on vinyl is that, unlike digital formats, it forces one to listen in smaller sidelong doses. For me this is the ideal way to take in these dense, lengthy collections of keyboard pieces. I also appreciate that used classical records tend to be in excellent condition far more often than in other genres of music. A culture of fastidiousness and respect for the art and its representation. I love it.

Apart from Leonhardt's Kunst der Fuge, I was quite familiar with these recordings digitally before tracking them down on vinyl, and since doing so I've come to appreciate them even more. I could rhapsodize about each of them, but for now I just want to shout out Ralph Kirkpatrick's WTC Book 2 on Archiv, which might be my single favorite Bach keyboard recording. Kirkpatrick's clavichord has a mystical, shimmering quality, and his performances are extraordinarily thoughtful. Each side of vinyl has four sets of preludes and fugues, which feels to me like the perfect "dosage" for one sitting. Which is not to say I never plow through all three LPs back-to-back, but it feels right to give my ears and brain a bit of a rest between sides. Kirkpatrick also wrote some great liner notes that expound on the unique advantages of the clavichord and analyze each prelude and fugue as though they were sketches for works of a greater scale. His Book 1 on clavichord is an equally brilliant performance, but the recording has a relatively anemic quality compared to his Book 2.

Current dilemma: I'm considering buying a vinyl copy of Trevor Pinnock's recording of the 6 Partitas (Archiv 1985) from a local record store, but the fact that it's a digital recording is giving me pause. I did a few quick needledrops at the store's listening station, and it sounded as good as the other (excellent) Archiv vinyl I've heard. I know what matters most is my subjective satisfaction with the sound quality, but even if these records sound amazing, I'm wondering if CD might be the way to go for digitally recorded music.

So my question for the fine folks of this thread is: should I go for it? And why?/why not?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on November 18, 2023, 05:51:04 AM
Quote from: CelluloidBiker on November 17, 2023, 03:34:52 PMHi all, I'm new to the forum; I was inspired to join because I'm in the midst of a Bach vinyl kick, mainly keyboard works. I've acquired the following LP sets in the last few weeks, and they've all been on heavy rotation (all on harpsichord unless otherwise noted):

The Well-Tempered Clavier 1 & 2 - Helmut Walcha (Archiv 1978, rec. 1973-74) (https://www.discogs.com/release/7872953-JS-Bach-Helmut-Walcha-Das-Wohltemperierte-Klavier-I-II-The-Well-Tempered-Clavier-Le-Clavier-Bien-Tem)
The Well-Tempered Clavier Book 1 - Ralph Kirkpatrick, clavichord (Archiv 1959) (https://www.discogs.com/release/4722661-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Ralph-Kirkpatrick-Das-Wohltemperierte-Klavier-1Teil)
The Well-Tempered Clavier Book 2 - Ralph Kirkpatrick, clavichord (Archiv 1967) (https://www.discogs.com/release/18029407-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Ralph-Kirkpatrick-Das-Wohltemperierte-Clavier-IITeil-Bwv-870-893)
The Art of Fugue - Gustav Leonhardt (Harmonia Mundi 1974, rec. 1969) (https://www.discogs.com/release/1622198-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Cembalo-Gustav-Leonhardt-Die-Kunst-Der-Fuge)
Goldberg Variations - Trevor Pinnock (Archiv 1980) (https://www.discogs.com/release/8679917-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Trevor-Pinnock-Goldberg-Variationen)

All phenomenal, near-silent pressings of brilliant performances. But beyond the sound quality, another reason I love listening to this music on vinyl is that, unlike digital formats, it forces one to listen in smaller sidelong doses. For me this is the ideal way to take in these dense, lengthy collections of keyboard pieces. I also appreciate that used classical records tend to be in excellent condition far more often than in other genres of music. A culture of fastidiousness and respect for the art and its representation. I love it.

Apart from Leonhardt's Kunst der Fuge, I was quite familiar with these recordings digitally before tracking them down on vinyl, and since doing so I've come to appreciate them even more. I could rhapsodize about each of them, but for now I just want to shout out Ralph Kirkpatrick's WTC Book 2 on Archiv, which might be my single favorite Bach keyboard recording. Kirkpatrick's clavichord has a mystical, shimmering quality, and his performances are extraordinarily thoughtful. Each side of vinyl has four sets of preludes and fugues, which feels to me like the perfect "dosage" for one sitting. Which is not to say I never plow through all three LPs back-to-back, but it feels right to give my ears and brain a bit of a rest between sides. Kirkpatrick also wrote some great liner notes that expound on the unique advantages of the clavichord and analyze each prelude and fugue as though they were sketches for works of a greater scale. His Book 1 on clavichord is an equally brilliant performance, but the recording has a relatively anemic quality compared to his Book 2.

Current dilemma: I'm considering buying a vinyl copy of Trevor Pinnock's recording of the 6 Partitas (Archiv 1985) from a local record store, but the fact that it's a digital recording is giving me pause. I did a few quick needledrops at the store's listening station, and it sounded as good as the other (excellent) Archiv vinyl I've heard. I know what matters most is my subjective satisfaction with the sound quality, but even if these records sound amazing, I'm wondering if CD might be the way to go for digitally recorded music.

So my question for the fine folks of this thread is: should I go for it? And why?/why not?

Welcome. Delighted a new voice joining vinyl thread. The extra warmth of the LP record lends itself very well for harpsichord music. Not a genre that takes a prominent part of my listening time but even so would not be without harpsichord recordings on my shelves.
Helmut Walcha recorded WTC complete for The HMV Baroque Library. I picked up the whole set cheaply. I'm certain I can learn more from you of the most desirable recordings but will give a shout for Heguette Dreyfus who's recordings I enjoy.
Personally I would not worry that Pinnock's is in the digital domain on LP. For a long time I took the view horses for courses - digital CD and analogue LP. I have since broken the habit purchasing many digital LPs in great sound. Why deprive yourself of a performance or music on LP?
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: atardecer on November 18, 2023, 02:03:38 PM
Another thing to perhaps consider, is I have heard of 'CD rot' where CDs somehow go bad over time and become unplayable, (thankfully this has not happened to me thus far). But considering I have never heard of 'LP rot', that is a possible advantage to purchasing digital recordings on LP over CD.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: CelluloidBiker on November 19, 2023, 09:10:00 AM
^Excellent point. As far as I know, vinyl is the most stable format for the long-term preservation of sound recordings, as long as it's cared for properly.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 05, 2023, 05:27:48 AM
I ran across this LP in excellent shape for 50 cents.

(https://i.discogs.com/d-84ULT2bDW99q-j8VldfisdlzL8CiiRj-O3b69mBuc/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:593/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIxMzg1/ODctMTQxNTk4ODQy/MS00MzcxLmpwZWc.jpeg)

It was pressed in Germany.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: ritter on December 05, 2023, 08:44:58 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 05, 2023, 05:27:48 AMI ran across this LP in excellent shape for 50 cents.

(https://i.discogs.com/d-84ULT2bDW99q-j8VldfisdlzL8CiiRj-O3b69mBuc/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:593/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIxMzg1/ODctMTQxNTk4ODQy/MS00MzcxLmpwZWc.jpeg)

It was pressed in Germany.

PD
Looks great!

And the cover art, Rousseau's The Snake Charmer, brings fond memories to me, as it was also on the cover of Monteux's recording of The Rite of Spring, which was in parents' collection:

(https://i.discogs.com/RHD1-e5xItO6efZaDIOoVQORCzZYNlxNMSom2HeIWV8/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:590/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTc3NTg3/NTctMTQ5MzYzNTM4/Ny02ODMyLmpwZWc.jpeg)
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 05, 2023, 08:52:09 AM
Quote from: ritter on December 05, 2023, 08:44:58 AMLooks great!

And the cover art, Rousseau's The Snake Charmer, brings fond memories to me, as it was also on the cover of Monteux's recording of The Rite of Spring, which was in parents' collection:

(https://i.discogs.com/RHD1-e5xItO6efZaDIOoVQORCzZYNlxNMSom2HeIWV8/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:590/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTc3NTg3/NTctMTQ5MzYzNTM4/Ny02ODMyLmpwZWc.jpeg)
I knew that I had seen that artwork before!  :)   Alas, some of the plastic(?) covering to the LP jacket is a bit bubbled (separated), but the LP (the most important part) looked to be in pristine shape.  I don't know how MTT is regarded in terms of Debussy, but at that price, I couldn't say no.  ;)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 08, 2023, 07:43:34 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 05, 2023, 05:27:48 AMI ran across this LP in excellent shape for 50 cents.

(https://i.discogs.com/d-84ULT2bDW99q-j8VldfisdlzL8CiiRj-O3b69mBuc/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:593/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTIxMzg1/ODctMTQxNTk4ODQy/MS00MzcxLmpwZWc.jpeg)

It was pressed in Germany.

PD
I remember listening to that LP in the university music library in my student days.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2023, 07:53:13 AM
Quote from: vandermolen on December 08, 2023, 07:43:34 AMI remember listening to that LP in the university music library in my student days.
How did you like it Jeffrey?

PD

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Scion7 on December 08, 2023, 08:08:52 AM
Quote from: CelluloidBiker on November 17, 2023, 03:34:52 PMHi all, I'm new to the forum; I was inspired to join because I'm in the midst of a Bach vinyl kick, ........

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 08, 2023, 08:23:21 AM
Very good. Same recording, I would think.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: vandermolen on December 09, 2023, 12:31:39 AM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2023, 07:53:13 AMHow did you like it Jeffrey?

PD


Very nice PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on December 14, 2023, 10:25:32 PM
I bought Víkingur Olafsson's sensational Goldberg Variations on vinyl. Not a bad idea to be forced out of the chair three times in the duration!
Please note that it is not a natural piano sound. Lots of microphones, lots of PEQ, lots pro tools plugins. But the playing though!
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: CelluloidBiker on December 15, 2023, 01:12:18 PM
Quote from: Irons on November 18, 2023, 05:51:04 AMI'm certain I can learn more from you of the most desirable recordings but will give a shout for Heguette Dreyfus who's recordings I enjoy.
Personally I would not worry that Pinnock's is in the digital domain on LP. For a long time I took the view horses for courses - digital CD and analogue LP. I have since broken the habit purchasing many digital LPs in great sound. Why deprive yourself of a performance or music on LP?

Thanks for the Huguette Dreyfus rec! I checked out her Goldberg Variations today and thought it was lovely. Excited to hear more of her recordings.

I ended up buying the Pinnock Partitas LP set and am very satisfied with the sound quality. Since then, however, I've heard several other harpsichord recordings of the Partitas for the first time, and Leonhardt's first set on Harmonia Mundi has become an instant favorite. So, in an extremely anal record collector move, I ordered a copy of this BASF/Harmonia Mundi pressing (https://www.discogs.com/release/7467218-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Gustav-Leonhardt-Clavier-%C3%9Cbung-1Teil-6-Partiten-BWV-825-830) to match this pressing of Leonhardt's Art of Fugue (https://www.discogs.com/release/1622198-Johann-Sebastian-Bach-Cembalo-Gustav-Leonhardt-Die-Kunst-Der-Fuge) I already have. They're not first pressings, but the sound quality is stunning, and I love the aesthetics of the artwork on this particular mid-70s run of reissues.

Comparing the vinyl pressings of the Leonhardt and Pinnock Partitas, the Leonhardt is a 3-LP set with one partita on each side, while the Pinnock is a 2-LP set with the partitas arranged partially out of order and two of them broken up across sides. This makes the Pinnock set an awkward listening experience. My theory is that Archiv in 1985 saw the advent of the compact disc and decided to divert resources away from vinyl and into the new format, hence squeezing the Partitas onto two LPs, when three LPs/one Partita per side is the most obvious and natural arrangement imaginable, since each Partita is approximately 20 minutes long.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on December 19, 2023, 12:18:04 AM
Greek Audiophile Society. :o

https://youtu.be/Z07gTWyyiM0?si=eXrFq97jYOd9dFUZ
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on December 19, 2023, 03:51:25 AM
Quote from: Irons on December 19, 2023, 12:18:04 AMGreek Audiophile Society. :o

https://youtu.be/Z07gTWyyiM0?si=eXrFq97jYOd9dFUZ
Oh, my!

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Spotted Horses on December 19, 2023, 12:28:31 PM
Quote from: CelluloidBiker on November 17, 2023, 03:34:52 PMCurrent dilemma: I'm considering buying a vinyl copy of Trevor Pinnock's recording of the 6 Partitas (Archiv 1985) from a local record store, but the fact that it's a digital recording is giving me pause. I did a few quick needledrops at the store's listening station, and it sounded as good as the other (excellent) Archiv vinyl I've heard. I know what matters most is my subjective satisfaction with the sound quality, but even if these records sound amazing, I'm wondering if CD might be the way to go for digitally recorded music.

A vinyl pressing of a good digital recording should sound have just as much "vinyl sound." The unique sound of an LP is due to distortion of the signal. A good digital recording is indistinguishable from the original signal. So it doesn't make any difference if you make an analog recording of the original signal or of a digital reproduction of the signal. I might have some reservation about a 1985 digital recording, because that was before the really good ADCs were introduced.

Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 09, 2024, 02:42:21 AM
A rarity in more ways then one. A Mexican pianist performing Brahms behind Iron Curtain. Unable to find details of recording dates. However, blue and gold label Supraphons are rare and early. Three Intermezzos are beautiful and Kahan performs them excellently, comparing well with other recordings of the pieces.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 09, 2024, 11:47:29 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 09, 2024, 02:42:21 AMA rarity in more ways then one. A Mexican pianist performing Brahms behind Iron Curtain. Unable to find details of recording dates. However, blue and gold label Supraphons are rare and early. Three Intermezzos are beautiful and Kahan performs them excellently, comparing well with other recordings of the pieces.
I'm trying to find out some more information on him.  I did find this:

This was from a youtube channel [On the top of Damavand forever]:  José Kahan (1931-1986). Nació en la Ciudad de México. Discípulo de Pablo Castellanos, se graduó en el Conservatorio Nacional. Estudió en el Instituto Curtis de Filadelfia con Isabelle Vengerova. Con un impresionante repertorio que abarcaba desde la escuela preclásica hasta la contemporánea y moderna, hizo diversas giras de conciertos por Estados Unidos, Sudamérica, Europa, Israel, Japón e India. Estrenó los conciertos para piano de Blas Galindo y Armando Lavalle en Europa y Estados Unidos. Fue profesor de piano en el Conservatorio Nacional y en la Escuela Nacional de Música. Grabó recitales en discos, y en 1980 realizó una serie de programas de televisión donde grabó 365 miniconciertos didácticos sin repeticiones durante un año entero como un significativo esfuerzo para llevar la cultura musical a la población mexicana. Poco después de su fallecimiento, su familia donó su amplio acervo de partituras a la Escuela Nacional de Música.

Google translate:  Joseph Kahan (1931-1986). He was born in Mexico City. A disciple of Pablo Castellanos, he graduated from the National Conservatory. She studied at the Curtis Institute in Philadelphia with Isabelle Vengerova. With an impressive repertoire ranging from the pre-classical school to the contemporary and modern, he made several concert tours in the United States, South America, Europe, Israel, Japan and India. He premiered the piano concertos of Blas Galindo and Armando Lavalle in Europe and the United States. He was a piano teacher at the National Conservatory and the National School of Music. He recorded recitals on discs, and in 1980 he made a series of television programs where he recorded 365 didactic mini-concerts without repetitions for an entire year as a significant effort to bring musical culture to the Mexican population. Shortly after his death, his family donated his extensive collection of sheet music to the National School of Music.

I also found this (haven't read it all);  here you go...https://www.wilsoncenter.org/publication/mexican-soviet-relations-1958-1964-the-limits-engagement

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on January 09, 2024, 11:03:30 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on January 09, 2024, 11:47:29 AMI'm trying to find out some more information on him.  I did find this:

This was from a youtube channel [On the top of Damavand forever]:  José Kahan (1931-1986). Nació en la Ciudad de México. Discípulo de Pablo Castellanos, se graduó en el Conservatorio Nacional. Estudió en el Instituto Curtis de Filadelfia con Isabelle Vengerova. Con un impresionante repertorio que abarcaba desde la escuela preclásica hasta la contemporánea y moderna, hizo diversas giras de conciertos por Estados Unidos, Sudamérica, Europa, Israel, Japón e India. Estrenó los conciertos para piano de Blas Galindo y Armando Lavalle en Europa y Estados Unidos. Fue profesor de piano en el Conservatorio Nacional y en la Escuela Nacional de Música. Grabó recitales en discos, y en 1980 realizó una serie de programas de televisión donde grabó 365 miniconciertos didácticos sin repeticiones durante un año entero como un significativo esfuerzo para llevar la cultura musical a la población mexicana. Poco después de su fallecimiento, su familia donó su amplio acervo de partituras a la Escuela Nacional de Música.

Google translate:  Joseph Kahan (1931-1986). He was born in Mexico City. A disciple of Pablo Castellanos, he graduated from the National Conservatory. She studied at the Curtis Institute in Philadelphia with Isabelle Vengerova. With an impressive repertoire ranging from the pre-classical school to the contemporary and modern, he made several concert tours in the United States, South America, Europe, Israel, Japan and India. He premiered the piano concertos of Blas Galindo and Armando Lavalle in Europe and the United States. He was a piano teacher at the National Conservatory and the National School of Music. He recorded recitals on discs, and in 1980 he made a series of television programs where he recorded 365 didactic mini-concerts without repetitions for an entire year as a significant effort to bring musical culture to the Mexican population. Shortly after his death, his family donated his extensive collection of sheet music to the National School of Music.

I also found this (haven't read it all);  here you go...https://www.wilsoncenter.org/publication/mexican-soviet-relations-1958-1964-the-limits-engagement

PD

Thanks! Apparently he enjoyed an extensive and full career. Just going by that Brahms recording Kahan was a gifted pianist. Still puzzled how he came to record for Supraphon though.

The Wilson Centre link didn't work for me unfortunately. 
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on January 10, 2024, 05:57:54 AM
Quote from: Irons on January 09, 2024, 11:03:30 PMThanks! Apparently he enjoyed an extensive and full career. Just going by that Brahms recording Kahan was a gifted pianist. Still puzzled how he came to record for Supraphon though.

The Wilson Centre link didn't work for me unfortunately. 
Interesting!  I just tried clicking on it and it didn't work for me either.  Try this one:
https://www.wilsoncenter.org/publication/mexican-soviet-relations-1958-1964-the-limits-engagement

Oh, I think I see why--"go...https:", etc. were also showing as part of that link.

PD

p.s.  If you scroll down, there is quite a lengthy article--though it does also say that much is still not known.   I couldn't find any info on Discogs re the recording date of that album.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 11, 2024, 07:30:36 AM
Tracking Angle on the Tchaikovsky and R. Strauss from the new release batch from DG The Original Source:
https://trackingangle.com/features/emil-berliner-studios-mines-more-sonic-gold-from-the-deutsche-grammophon-back-catalogue-the-original-source-series-batch-4
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on January 30, 2024, 12:19:40 PM
I bought this new audiophile Boston SO Steinberg box, and the Karajan/Janowitz Vier letzte Lieder and Tod und Verklärung. Terrific music making and sonic bliss.

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/img_4640-jpeg.987785/)

(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/img_4646-jpeg.988108/)

Tracking Angle just put up an entry about the next DG TOS batch plus a digitally recorded box set with Giulini in Bruckner 7-9:
https://trackingangle.com/features/deutsche-grammophon-announces-four-major-new-titles-in-its-original-source-vinyl-series-plus-a-major-bruckner-vinyl-release


Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 28, 2024, 07:10:00 AM
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 28, 2024, 09:38:10 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 28, 2024, 07:10:00 AM

Do you own that one Lol?  Or tempted to purchase a copy of it?

Hadn't heard of Impex (sp?) before now.

Alas, most of the time when I run across mono recordings, they aren't shall we say in the best of shape.  I'll keep an eye out for it though.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on February 28, 2024, 11:19:14 PM
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 28, 2024, 09:38:10 AMDo you own that one Lol?  Or tempted to purchase a copy of it?

Hadn't heard of Impex (sp?) before now.

Alas, most of the time when I run across mono recordings, they aren't shall we say in the best of shape.  I'll keep an eye out for it though.

PD

I had not heard of Impex either, PD. Looking on eBay their catalogue is mainly jazz and popular. Prices are far too rich for me! I do not doubt the recordings are meticulously transferred by Impex but £59 is ridiculous for a single LP.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on February 29, 2024, 06:35:45 AM
Quote from: Irons on February 28, 2024, 11:19:14 PMI had not heard of Impex either, PD. Looking on eBay their catalogue is mainly jazz and popular. Prices are far too rich for me! I do not doubt the recordings are meticulously transferred by Impex but £59 is ridiculous for a single LP.
Wow!  That is a lot!  :( I wonder what their runs are?  Looking at their website, I see that the Heifetz/Piatigorsky one that he also mentioned is listed for $39.99 USD (though God knows what their shipping charges are); it is sold out though.

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 07, 2024, 10:15:33 PM
From the expensive to the cheap. NOK 20 (Appx USD 2) at the local used anything store, between James Last's Classics Up To Date 3 and  HiFi Karajan 2:
(https://www.hifisentralen.no/forumet/attachments/img_4734-jpeg.1003641/)
It's Brüggen, Leonhardt and Bylsma playing hardcore trailblazing HIP Telemann recorder sonatas. That gold and black Telefunken label is beautiful. Just a few small clicks left after a turn in the HumminGuru. VFM indeed.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Pohjolas Daughter on March 15, 2024, 09:49:19 AM
Had a great time listening to an old Mercury 35mm LP earlier today (cross-posted in What are you Listening to thread).  Initial ticking sounds had me worried at first that there could be a long scratch on the Side 1, but it quickly quieted down.  Great performance/work/sound.

Byron Janis playing Prokofiev's third p.c.  :)

PD
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Valentino on March 15, 2024, 01:51:46 PM
What stylus do you use, PD?
I've found that the Microridge/MicroLine/SAS shape excels in setting belowsurfave scratches.
I've seen scratches that I thought were not playable that were as good as inaudible. Not so with a conical or elliptical.
Title: Re: Thirty three and a third.
Post by: Irons on March 16, 2024, 12:52:02 AM
Quote from: Valentino on March 15, 2024, 01:51:46 PMWhat stylus do you use, PD?
I've found that the Microridge/MicroLine/SAS shape excels in setting belowsurfave scratches.
I've seen scratches that I thought were not playable that were as good as inaudible. Not so with a conical or elliptical.

I find Mercury LPs have such a wide dynamic range and cut at a high level that any surface imperfections are masked by the music.