GMG Classical Music Forum

And here I was listening to the Sextet only last night, too!

For a long time, I much preferred the original chamber scoring of Appalachian Spring to the 'filled-out' orchestral version.  Michael Tilson Thomas' recording of the full-orchestra version with the SFSO convinced me of the merits of the latter, though.

Very much like the Naxos recording (Jas Judd, Enzedd Symphony) of the Third Symphony. In fact, I am going to slap that one right into the player as we speak . . . .

El Salón México! 'Nuff said!

Wonderful stuff, to be sure. These day I'm learning top play the three pieces from Our Town on the piano (along with The sunken Cathedral). As I've said before, copland's film scores contain soe of his most attractive, unassuming music. The best ones also date from his golden Americana perios, the lae 30s to the mid 40s.

I'll have to check out MTT's version of Appalachian Spring. I, too, have always preferred the original instrument version, which I find has a Baroque drive missing from the cushier big-orchestra scoring. I also like the sections of the ballet that were deleted from the suite.   

Quote from: Joe Barron on April 11, 2007, 08:03:58 AM
Wonderful stuff, to be sure. These day I'm learning top play the three pieces from Our Town on the piano (along with The sunken Cathedral).

You can combine them into an Ivesian fantasy, Our Sunken Town, Joe . . . .

And I should go back to listen to the Piano Sonata and Piano Fantasy again;  I remember just being enraptured by them in Benjamin Pasternack's recording.

MTT has a FANTASTIC Copland DVD out:

http://www.amazon.com/Keeping-Score-Copland-American-Sound/dp/B000JGG888/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3/002-4456605-3214401?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1176323436&sr=1-3

Quote from: hornteacher on April 11, 2007, 12:31:43 PM
MTT has a FANTASTIC Copland DVD out:

http://www.amazon.com/Keeping-Score-Copland-American-Sound/dp/B000JGG888/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3/002-4456605-3214401?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1176323436&sr=1-3

I saw this on PBS and it is indeed marvelous.  MTT has charisma to spare, and the musical portions and other interviews (e.g., with musicians) are all excellent.  I enjoyed the Stravinsky Rite of Spring program even more...an outstanding series.

--Bruce

Quote from: bhodges on April 11, 2007, 12:38:54 PM
I saw this on PBS and it is indeed marvelous.  MTT has charisma to spare, and the musical portions and other interviews (e.g., with musicians) are all excellent.  I enjoyed the Stravinsky Rite of Spring program even more...an outstanding series.

Made me wish he'd examine the Ives Fourth ...

Quote from: bhodges on April 11, 2007, 12:38:54 PM
I saw this on PBS and it is indeed marvelous.  MTT has charisma to spare, and the musical portions and other interviews (e.g., with musicians) are all excellent.  I enjoyed the Stravinsky Rite of Spring program even more...an outstanding series.

--Bruce

I agree. I love MTT. He just comes across as sincere and really love music. When he talks about music he is not showing off what he knows and trying to patronize you but is just sharing some aspect of the music that he finds interesting.

Quote from: Joe Barron on April 11, 2007, 01:33:46 PM
Made me wish he'd examine the Ives Fourth ...

He has recorded it at least once. The balance in the 2nd movement highly favors the piano (the non-quarter tone piano), so that it tends to sound something like a piano concerto.

(http://ec2.images-amazon.com/images/P/B0000026QA.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_V46726606_SS500_.jpg)

Has anyone here ventured down these roads?:

(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B000002AR2.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_AA240_.jpg)

Quote from: karlhenning on April 10, 2007, 05:19:30 AM
For a long time, I much preferred the original chamber scoring of Appalachian Spring ........

What recording(s) do you enjoy here Karl?

And while I am here:

On the MTT Rodeo Hoe Down there is a very short "burst" from a chorus(?)....is this simply MTT garnish, or was that how Copland intended it to be?

Quote from: Bill on April 12, 2007, 07:41:24 PM
What recording(s) do you enjoy here Karl?

If you don't mind me jumping in the conversation, I enjoy the following:


This one by MTT for the entire ballet (including the "Revival" scene)
http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=731

This one for the Symphonic Suite
http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=1409

or this one:  (this was the CD that won all the awards)
http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=268

and this one for a VERY nice version of the suite but played by the reduced chamber instrumentation
http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=141992

Good morning, Bill & hornteacher!

Quote from: Bill on April 12, 2007, 07:17:02 PM
Has anyone here ventured down these roads?:

(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B000002AR2.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_AA240_.jpg)

Viz, Young Pioneers, no, I don't know that at all.  But the Piano Variations, Piano Sonata and Piano Fantasy are all terrific music (I don't know if that exhausts the Copland solo piano oeuvre . . . .

hornteacher: Yes, I used to have that Orpheus Chamber Orchestra recording, and I should restore it to my library someday.

And I wonder if the recordings on that Copland the Populist disc are the same as on a disc I have with different cover art . . . .

Quote from: karlhenning on April 13, 2007, 04:22:12 AM
And I wonder if the recordings on that Copland the Populist disc are the same as on a disc I have with different cover art . . . .

If you mean this one:

http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=96161

Yes they are, I found that out after I purchased.  Oh well.

Quote from: hornteacher on April 13, 2007, 04:37:26 AM
If you mean this one:

http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=96161

Yes, precisamente!

Thank you for all the feedback to my questions.

If you do not have it through the set, this is also a recording that I believe that most of you on this thread would enjoy:

(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B000003G4A.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_V46722837_AA216_.jpg)

Samples to be found here:

http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Modernist-Aaron/dp/B000003G4A/ref=sr_1_2/102-7134284-2880939?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1176471040&sr=8-2

Copland is the kind of composer MTT really does well. The Symphonic Ode is a piece I need to know better.

Let's not forget Mr. Copland himself recorded the conducted the complete Appalachian Spring in the orginal scrong. Still available, with a bonus track of Copland in rehearsal with the orchestra.

Okay, so it's the Short Symphony which is Symphony No. 2, and of which the Sextet is an arrangement.  The Dance Symphony is not numbered, and was a salvage operation of music from an unrealized ballet named Grogh.

Got it.

Quote from: Bill on April 13, 2007, 05:31:36 AM
Thank you for all the feedback to my questions.

If you do not have it through the set, this is also a recording that I believe that most of you on this thread would enjoy:

(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B000003G4A.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_V46722837_AA216_.jpg)

Samples to be found here:

http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Modernist-Aaron/dp/B000003G4A/ref=sr_1_2/102-7134284-2880939?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1176471040&sr=8-2

That is a great disc.  The "Symphonic Ode" was a great recent discovery for me; a wonderfully craggy and inspiriting work.  Symphony 3 (Slatkin RCA) is my favourite work by Copland but also  Quiet City, Music for the Movies and The Red Pony are all scores that I often listen to.  I even have a soft spot for the, often derided, Lincoln Portrait (espec. the Adlai Stevenson/Ormandy version)

Here are my favorite Coplands:

(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B000003CZE.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_SS500_.jpg)(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B00004UDEQ.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_V44327849_SS500_.jpg)

Doráti's is an excellent account of all these works (El salón México, Appalachian Spring (1945 suite), Rodeo, Dance Symphony, Fanfare for the Common Man).  I wonder what lackluster recording WCRB has been playing all these years, to convince me (wrongly) that Appalachian Spring was duller than reading the Orange County phone book . . . .

I have  "Grogh" on an Argo disc. just like the organsymphony a great accomplishment for such a young composer.

(http://content.answers.com/main/content/img/amg/classical_albums/cov200/cl400/l461/l46104i7258.jpg)

Here's the story - from:http://www.answers.com/topic/grogh-ballet-in-1-scene

This almost legendary score was known for years merely as the source from which Aaron Copland later drew his Dance Symphony. It was composed during the period Copland was studying in Paris with Nadia Boulanger. He was gripped by the Expressionist German vampire film "Nosferatu, " which he had seen in 1921 in company with the writer Harold Clurman, whom he asked to write a ballet scenario. The story concerns a sorcerer who brings corpses to life to dance for his pleasure. The macabre subject required the youthful composer to stretch his technique to strange dissonances and rhythms. The music is often very violent. Some aspects of the libretto played to Copland's strength, his Americanness, by including "visions of jazz."

Copland's youth and naivete are also evident in this work -- not in the music itself, for it is remarkably self-assured and accomplished, but in the circumstances of its creation. Simply put, a more experienced composer would not invest the time and effort without an interested ballet company or impresario, choreographer, or even a commission.

The ballet was never staged, nor played in more than its two-piano reduction for nearly seventy years. Fortunately, Copland was able to recoup his investment. He heard of a contest for a new American symphony and quickly extracted parts of the score, soon producing a three-movement work he called Dance Symphony. He won the cash prize with it. Another section had already been published separately as "Cortege funébre." A further part of it was reorchestrated and included in a later ballet, "Hear Ye, Hear Ye!" Copland revised the score of Grohg in 1932. It was then shelved, then lost.

Over fifty years later Copland's assistant Roland Caltabiano conceived the idea of reassembling Grohg from the its separated parts and approached English composer-conductor Oliver Knussen to gather the pieces and provide any needed musical stitching. In researching Copland's music of the period at the Library of Congress in Washington, Knussen discovered the full score of the 1932 version, which had been misfiled. The ballet was finally heard as Copland conceived it in 1992.

This music casts an interesting light on the early, near-radical phase of Copland's career. It is one of the very few works from his pen which seem to have sprung from an emotional well-spring. It is too early a work to have a chance at being ranked as a masterpiece; it has the brashness of youth. It is also one of the few of his pieces where ideas seem to tumble over one another in unrestrained fashion. Altogether, a remarkable accomplishment and highly recommended to the listener who is familiar with the more standard Copland fare. ~ All Music Guide

If you want to hear the original chamber version of the complete ballet, I would highly (highly!) recommend this disc by Hugh Wolff and the St. Paul Chamber Orchestra.

(http://www.arkivmusic.com/graphics/covers/full/41/411794.JPG)

The score is incredibly well recorded with all the detail you could ever want.  It is very delicate and tender, as I believe Copland intended it.  I listen to this version all the time, and it is one of my favorite recordings of anything.  Plus you get a second disc of songs.

Why has Dorati's (allegedly terrific) recording of Symphony 3 never made it to CD?

I demand to know >:(

Quote from: D Minor on April 25, 2007, 11:05:51 AM
Copland, Symphony for Organ and Orchestra (E Power Biggs / Bernstein / NYPO).  Quite good.

I've been curious about this piece . . . pray, say on.

Quote from: karlhenning on April 25, 2007, 11:36:33 AM
I've been curious about this piece . . . pray, say on.

It's currently my favorite piece by Copland . . . . . .

Is it the Organ Symphony which provoked the comment on the order of "If a composer at [ age x. ] writes this, at [ age y. ] he will be ready to commit murder"?

Quote from: karlhenning on April 25, 2007, 11:41:49 AM
Is it the Organ Symphony which provoked the comment on the order of "If a composer at [ age x. ] writes this, at [ age y. ] he will be ready to commit murder"?

from Walter Damrosch, yes.

Quote from: Mark G. Simon on April 12, 2007, 06:36:51 PM
He has recorded it at least once. The balance in the 2nd movement highly favors the piano (the non-quarter tone piano), so that it tends to sound something like a piano concerto.

(http://ec2.images-amazon.com/images/P/B0000026QA.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_V46726606_SS500_.jpg)

Funny you should say that, because it started out as a piano concerto!

I absolutely adore the Copland Piano Sonata. Those five astonishing American piano sonatas from the first half of the twentieth century are never far from my player - Barber, Copland, Carter, and the two numbered sonatas by Ives.

Quote from: Guido on May 31, 2007, 07:00:39 AM
. . . Copland maybe underrated, but he is held in really very high regard, so I'm not entirely convinced.

Karl - generally I prefer the amazing piano sonata to the variations - I think its my favourite piece of Copland. I find alot of the Americana difficult to stomach; not because it's Americanan per se but because it often sounds lazy when compared to many of his contemporaries. My feeling usually when I hear Copland is that he was an extraordinarily talented man, but only rarely did he strive to make the most of those talents. Thats just my own feeling of course.

When I fetched in the Benjamin Pasternack disc, I did enjoy the Variations, but the Sonata and Fantasy even more, yea, nigh unto adoration.

Quote from: James on May 31, 2007, 07:30:29 AM
One of my faves for Copland is Gerard Schwarz's excellently programmed disc with the Piano Concerto, Appalachian Spring & Symphonic Ode...Copland himself rated the Ode among his finest works and i have to agree with that, its just fab...

(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/41W9BB2DCPL._AA240_.jpg)

Same here, a great recent discovery and I have three recordings. the fine Delos and Copland's own recording but, best of all, the Michael Tilson Thomas RCA version in the album "Copland the Modernist".

Karl,
Continued thanks for opening my ears to Copland's chamber music...definitley need to more now for the shelf.  Any recordings suggested here are most welcome.

That piano concerto seems to be to my liking (been visiting the SFSO/MTT website). Recommendendez moi a recording, please?

Quote from: Bogey on June 01, 2007, 05:02:31 AM
Karl,
Continued thanks for opening my ears to Copland's chamber music...definitley need to more now for the shelf.  Any recordings suggested here are most welcome.

Hoy, Bill!

Actually, apart from the Sextet, I am not aware of much Copland chamber music apart from the songs and the piano solo music.  I have an idea he wrote a piano trio named Vitebsk?

There's also a string Nonet from 1961, and I forget if this is actually 12 tone, but it is one of his crunchier works.

Quote from: Valentino on June 04, 2007, 05:48:38 AM
That piano concerto seems to be to my liking (been visiting the SFSO/MTT website). Recommendendez moi a recording, please?

There's a recording with the composer soloing and Bernstein conducting, available on this set http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Early-Orchestral-Works-1922-1935/dp/B0000027J9/ref=sr_1_5/104-2036130-3562369?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1180967148&sr=1-5

as well as others.  I enjoy it.

Quote from: Mark G. Simon on June 04, 2007, 06:21:25 AM
There's also a string Nonet from 1961, and I forget if this is actually 12 tone, but it is one of his crunchier works.

Sounds like it ought to be corn to the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra's sickle . . . .

Quote from: karlhenning on June 04, 2007, 05:51:59 AM
Hoy, Bill!

Actually, apart from the Sextet, I am not aware of much Copland chamber music apart from the songs and the piano solo music.  I have an idea he wrote a piano trio named Vitebsk?

This is the recording you want.  Its all around great.

(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/510T0TM0P6L._AA240_.jpg) (http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Quartet-Vitebsk-study-Jewish/dp/B00004T90D/ref=sr_1_6/102-3116842-2473728?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1182005083&sr=1-6)

This is one of the best records of any american songs I know of, and at giveaway price as well:

(http://www.mdt.co.uk/public/pictures/products/standard/2564620892.jpg)

Review (http://earrelevant.blogspot.com/2007/06/american-dreams.html) of a fairly recent performance of the Third Symphony.

Quote from: karlhenning on June 27, 2007, 06:45:30 AM
Review (http://earrelevant.blogspot.com/2007/06/american-dreams.html) of a fairly recent performance of the Third Symphony.

Little preachy.

Quote from: karlhenning on June 27, 2007, 06:45:30 AM
Review (http://earrelevant.blogspot.com/2007/06/american-dreams.html) of a fairly recent performance of the Third Symphony.

Actually, he doesn't have a single word to say about the performance of the 3rd symphony.

QuoteThe 4th movement, with the musical material that's also used in "Fanfare for the Common Man," went especially well.

More space was devoted to the Danielpour and the Gershwin, to be sure.

Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on April 11, 2007, 05:09:09 PM
I agree. I love MTT. He just comes across as sincere and really love music. When he talks about music he is not showing off what he knows and trying to patronize you but is just sharing some aspect of the music that he finds interesting.

Pity he is such a boring conductor of Mahler.

Not that it matters, who is going to pay over the odds for this stuff, anyway, San Franciscans? :-\

Just a few quick Copland notes:

I'm currently working up Copland's three selections from Our Town on the piano, and I've finally got the first piece down to the point where it actually sounds like something. The music is outwardly very simple, but there are some tricky fingerings and wide chords — C, A, D, that sort of thing — that have required careful practice. And it's so quiet and transparent that any little mistake is magnified tenfold.

Second movement is even trickier, with a lot of hand-over-hand positions. I've made it to the final repeat, and if and when I'v mastered thhat, I'll go on to the last movement, which consists largely of block chords.

Listened to the chamber version of Appalachian Spring yeasterday and it's still with me. Certainly one the of the most fortuitous pieces to have stuck in your head!  :D

Quote from: Joe Barron on June 29, 2007, 08:47:25 AM
Listened to the chamber version of Appalachian Spring yeasterday and it's still with me. Certainly one the of the most fortuitous pieces to have stuck in your head!  :D

Yes, and having heard the chamber version, its hard to go back to the orchestral version.

Quote from: hornteacher on June 29, 2007, 03:01:24 PM
Yes, and having heard the chamber version, its hard to go back to the orchestral version.

Agreed.  ;)

I've got this version of the chamber Appalachian Spring, and I just don't find it grips me. Is it the performance, perhaps? (I do like the performance of the Capricorn Concerto that follows it, though.)

(http://g-ec2.images-amazon.com/images/I/61SN1WYA2VL._SS500_.jpg)

Quote from: edward on June 29, 2007, 06:29:21 PM
I've got this version of the chamber Appalachian Spring, and I just don't find it grips me. Is it the performance, perhaps? (I do like the performance of the Capricorn Concerto that follows it, though.)

I don't know this recording. I do know I love the chamber version of the complete ballet (not juust the suite) that Copland conducted for Columbia. The St. Paul Chamber Symphony version with Dennis Russell Davies is the only chamber version of the suite I know. That's what I listened to the other day, and that's what stayed with me.

Quote from: edward on June 29, 2007, 06:29:21 PM
I've got this version of the chamber Appalachian Spring, and I just don't find it grips me. Is it the performance, perhaps? (I do like the performance of the Capricorn Concerto that follows it, though.)

(http://g-ec2.images-amazon.com/images/I/61SN1WYA2VL._SS500_.jpg)

I am having some difficulty invisioning Hogwood conducting Copland....enjoy them both greatly, but.....

But he seems to pulled off Barber from your account Edward so I guess I need to recognize his range a bit more.

Quote from: edward on June 29, 2007, 06:29:21 PM
I've got this version of the chamber Appalachian Spring, and I just don't find it grips me. Is it the performance, perhaps? (I do like the performance of the Capricorn Concerto that follows it, though.)
[/img]

Get the Michael Tilson Thomas DVD on Copland.  In addition to being a great documentary, it has a complete performance of the chamber version of App Spring as a bonus feature (in high definition and surround sound).  NICE!

http://www.amazon.com/Keeping-Score-Copland-American-Sound/dp/B000JGG888/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3/105-4924212-6205218?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1183223368&sr=1-3

Quote from: Joe Barron on June 29, 2007, 07:05:08 PM
I don't know this recording. I do know I love the chamber version of the complete ballet (not juust the suite) that Copland conducted for Columbia. The St. Paul Chamber Symphony version with Dennis Russell Davies is the only chamber version of the suite I know. That's what I listened to the other day, and that's what stayed with me.

For an outstanding chamber version of Appalachian Spring, look no further than these fine recordings (http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/B000026CPB/102-3185607-7313713?SubscriptionId=0RQSQ0B8CRY7VX2VF3G2) by Wolff.  This recording is honestly in the top 10 things I have in my collection.

The second disc is the one referred to by erato (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,185.msg40635.html#msg40635) above.

So, is all that music we hear in the old Western movies based on Copland's compositions? Or was someone doing it before him?

Copland found a very personal mode of compositionally intersecting musical Americana with various musical lessons learnt from Stravinsky.  So no one had done that at all like Copland, before Copland.

Quote from: karlhenning on October 10, 2007, 07:58:26 AM
Copland found a very personal mode of compositionally intersecting musical Americana with various musical lessons learnt from Stravinsky.  So no one had done that at all like Copland, before Copland.

But you know what I mean?: That Western-sounding music? I was thinking Copland started all that, but then I remembered Dvorak's 9th.

I know the prevalence of American sound in Dvorak's 9th is contentious, but I never thought of the symphony as Americana--certainly not in the same way as Copland's wide open "prairie" textures.

Quote from: scottscheule on October 10, 2007, 09:44:28 AM
I know the prevalence of American sound in Dvorak's 9th is contentious, but I never thought of the symphony as Americana--certainly not in the same way as Copland's wide open "prairie" textures.

Parts of it sound like "Americana" to me, but certainly not the piece as a whole.

Quote from: dtw on October 10, 2007, 09:52:06 AM
Parts of it sound like "Americana" to me, but certainly not the piece as a whole.

Part of that is retro-fit;  the tune from the Largo did get 'adopted' as a spiritual.

Quote from: karlhenning on October 10, 2007, 10:08:44 AM
Part of that is retro-fit;  the tune from the Largo did get 'adopted' as a spiritual.

Dvorak invented Americana! ;)

Shh! The public must never know!

Quote from: karlhenning on October 10, 2007, 07:58:26 AM
Copland found a very personal mode of compositionally intersecting musical Americana with various musical lessons learnt from Stravinsky.  So no one had done that at all like Copland, before Copland.

.......So ......... And ..........

(Mmm. Scrunchily elliptical.)

Before Copland, most movie music was written in the European romantic tradition of Strauss, and many of composers of motion picture music, like Korngold, were transplants, or influenced by transplants. The music was fat in sonority, with dense string textures, full brass, and lots and lots of cymbals. (Compare his scores to say, Max Steiner's music for Gone With the Wind or Casablanca, and you'll see what I mean.) Copland not only added American-sounding themes, but he thinned the textures, both harmonically and instrumentally, and his work really doesn't sound much like Dvorak. Nothing like the Red Pony or Our Town had been written for movies before. What makes his music sound American, even when he is not quoting cowboy music, is that he is American, and his music is unique. Much the same is true of Chalres Ives: He created an American simply sound by being an original.

Quote from: Joe Barron on October 10, 2007, 12:39:52 PM
Much the same is true of Charles Ives: He created an American sound simply by being an original.

I was just preparing to disagree, but perhaps the potential quarrel just hinges on a phrase. Ives was original. The specifically American elements are imported objects;  the original elements (including his manner of employing the importations) sound specific to Ives, and do not necessarily point to a consensus 'American sound.'  But maybe that doesn't directly meet Joe's point . . . .

Very nice new Copland CD.

I love "The Tender Land Suite" and feel that it should be as well known as the Appalachian Spring:

Quote from: vandermolen on May 23, 2008, 05:43:13 AM
I love "The Tender Land Suite" and feel that it should be as well known as the Appalachian Spring:

Yes, the "Promise of Living" is one of my favorite Copland melodies.

Quote from: Joe Barron on October 10, 2007, 12:39:52 PM
What makes his music sound American, even when he is not quoting cowboy music, is that he is American, and his music is unique. Much the same is true of Chalres Ives: He created an American simply sound by being an original.

    Ives, Harris and Copland all sound American when they use folk material from American sources, as they all do. By associating this with the simplified harmony, as well as being composers worthy of notice, they created what became the American sound. Unlike Elgar, whose Britishness is almost entirely retrospective, these composers really did sound American (as Dvorak and...uh, Delius did before them, but less so).

    So the American sound in classical music, if it must be given an American identity for a source, should be traced to Ives first, and was more completely developed by Harris (1920's) and Diamond ('30's) much later (does Hanson sound American? Perhaps now he does, so I guess that's a no. Barber is just not in this group). Copland will always be recognized for producing the most popular as well as the most overtly American-inspired works, so it's only a little unfair that he gets so much credit.

Nadia Boulanger also deserves a big share of the credit, since the whole school of American composers, the ones we think of as sounding "American", that came of age in the 20s and 30s studied with her and reflected her aesthetics in their compositions.

I just picked up this CD:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51GUycfH0yL._SL500_AA280_.jpg)

Chandos released the CD in 2000, but my copy is a later Musical Heritage Society issue. It opens with Copland's "Concerto for Clarinet and String Orchestra, with Harp and Piano" , a piece I was unfamiliar with until now. Even though the work was apparently commissioned for Benny Goodman, it seems less Jazz-influenced to my ears than many of Copland's other compositions. This is the premier recording of the more virtuosic original version, which Copland later revised. I find the short "Cadenza" second movement particularly exhilarating.

Looks very nice, Tony!

Excellent new Copland release (reissue) featuring some of my favourite works in very good performances:

Without a doubt, my very favorite work of Copeland is the Organ Symphony, which did not have much of an "American" sound.  The last two movements have some of the most dynamic work I've heard from him.  The last movement was something that people on my dorm kept confusing with Emerson, Lake and Palmer-- it's rocks out very hard, and is wonderful when you feel the need to make the walls shake.

Quote from: jowcol on April 07, 2009, 09:02:08 AM
Without a doubt, my very favorite work of Copeland is the Organ Symphony, which did not have much of an "American" sound.  The last two movements have some of the most dynamic work I've heard from him.  The last movement was something that people on my dorm kept confusing with Emerson, Lake and Palmer-- it's rocks out very hard, and is wonderful when you feel the need to make the walls shake.

And it was the Organ Symphony that elicited this comment from its conductor Walter Damrosch: ""Ladies and gentlemen, I am sure you will agree that if a gifted young man can write a symphony like this at 23, in five years he will be ready to commit murder." According to Copland, one of the newspapers reviewing the premiere headlined the review "YOUNG COMPOSER TO COMMIT MURDER!"  Critic Claudia Cassidy also blasted the piece: "It begins with a reverie, breaks into a squalling scherzo and ends, screaming like a bewildered banshee which by some twist of locale has found itself at the wailing wall."

It is probably my favorite Copland piece as well, though there are a few others in competition with it.

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41X7T8R2WEL._SL500_AA240_.jpg)

Think I will throw on the above tomorrow morning for the drive into work.

Quote from: Bogey on April 07, 2009, 07:23:47 PM
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41X7T8R2WEL._SL500_AA240_.jpg)

Think I will throw on the above tomorrow morning for the drive into work.

Excellent choice, sir.

I've just now come to this thread, reading it in its entirety.  The comments on the Organ Symphony are the most intriguing as I've just been introduced to it last night.  The following is pasted from "What Are You Listening To?":

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/61w47XKQ%2BfL._SL500_AA240_.jpg) (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41VAG9M3CBL._SL500_AA240_.jpg)
Copland: Music for Films
-The Red Pony;  Our Town;  The Heiress Suite;  Music for Movies Suite: New England Countryside, Barley Wagons, Sunday Traffic, Grovers Corners, Threshing Machines;   Prairie Journal (Music for Radio)
Saint Louis Symphony Orchestra
Leonard Slatkin, cond.
RCA
No one can elicit an unmistakably American nostalgia quite like Aaron Copland. In fact, I've often thought of much of Copland's music as I think that of Vaughan Williams to Britain.  Many music lovers may take exception, but there it is.  All the music here rings familiar, at least to those who've been the least bit exposed to American public radio and the Turner Classic Movies cable channel.  The meltingly nostalgic themes are often stark and cushy, but always memorable -- sigh-inducing in their simplicity and consummate in their expression of a yearning for a bygone era.  In my opinion, this is some of the most wonderful, if persistently and artfully manipulative music ever made for Hollywood. Despite Copland's inimitable way with developing and hammering home his marvelous themes, one still feels that in the wrong hands this can easily turn gooey and irrepressibly maudlin.  Not so here, however, as Leonard Slatkin and the Saint Louis Symphony prove to be every bit inside the idiom as Bernstein ever was, displaying an honest kinship with Copland's equally genuine American ethos and free of any overt Hollywood vulgarity.  I do love and enjoy this, and the recording is just as fabulous.

Copland: Symphony for Organ and Orchestra;  Dance Symphony;  Short Symphony (Symphony No. 2);  Orchestral Variations
Saint Louis Symphony Orchestra
Leonard Slatkin, cond.
RCA
Perhaps surprisingly, this is my introduction to Aaron Copland's Symphony for Organ and Orchestra of 1924, a youthful work composed for his teacher Nadia Boulanger in early 20th century Paris, incorporating many of his now familiar stylistic cross-rhythms and undercurrents of American urban folk music.  Beginning pensively mysterious in the opening movement, becoming redolent of neoclassical Stravinsky in the delightful and often blathering scherzo movement, and finally winding down and driving home in a raucousness seemingly steeped in a distinctly French/Russian modernist vein; it actually presents a starkly moving and full-bodied expression which is ear-catching and original.   

If one is sympathetic with Copland's developing idiom, the Dance Symphony of 1929 and Short Symphony of 1933 are equally delightful and musically pithy.  In the latter work especially, one can hear the marvelous colorations and rhythms that will eventually come to full fruition in his mature ballet and symphonic scores.  Though the Orchestral Variations dates from 1957, it's actually an orchestration of his Piano Variations of three decades earlier.  While Copland may have felt it to be one of the first works where he garnered his own musical voice, this listener was not so easily enamored.   Also, unlike the works earlier on the disc, Slatkin here doesn't seem all that comfortable and confident in his direction, though the playing is committed and intense -- for fans only.

Quote from: moldyoldie on April 18, 2009, 02:50:55 AM
I've just now come to this thread, reading it in its entirety.  The comments on the Organ Symphony are the most intriguing as I've just been introduced to it last night.  The following is pasted from "What Are You Listening To?":

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/61w47XKQ%2BfL._SL500_AA240_.jpg) (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41VAG9M3CBL._SL500_AA240_.jpg)
Copland: Music for Films
-The Red Pony;  Our Town;  The Heiress Suite;  Music for Movies Suite: New England Countryside, Barley Wagons, Sunday Traffic, Grovers Corners, Threshing Machines;   Prairie Journal (Music for Radio)
Saint Louis Symphony Orchestra
Leonard Slatkin, cond.
RCA

Very interesting post. When I was about 16 I remember asking my classical music loving elder brother what Vaughan Williams's music was like, having seen some LPs in a shop, and he said 'like an English Copland' and as I liked my brother's LP of Copland's Third Symphony, I went on to explore Vaughan Williams with great pleasure. I am also a great fan of Copland's Organ Symphony - if you like that you might like Malcolm Williamson's Organ Symphony too.
No one can elicit an unmistakably American nostalgia quite like Aaron Copland. In fact, I've often thought of much of Copland's music as I think that of Vaughan Williams to Britain.  Many music lovers may take exception, but there it is.  All the music here rings familiar, at least to those who've been the least bit exposed to American public radio and the Turner Classic Movies cable channel.  The meltingly nostalgic themes are often stark and cushy, but always memorable -- sigh-inducing in their simplicity and consummate in their expression of a yearning for a bygone era.  In my opinion, this is some of the most wonderful, if persistently and artfully manipulative music ever made for Hollywood. Despite Copland's inimitable way with developing and hammering home his marvelous themes, one still feels that in the wrong hands this can easily turn gooey and irrepressibly maudlin.  Not so here, however, as Leonard Slatkin and the Saint Louis Symphony prove to be every bit inside the idiom as Bernstein ever was, displaying an honest kinship with Copland's equally genuine American ethos and free of any overt Hollywood vulgarity.  I do love and enjoy this, and the recording is just as fabulous.

Copland: Symphony for Organ and Orchestra;  Dance Symphony;  Short Symphony (Symphony No. 2);  Orchestral Variations
Saint Louis Symphony Orchestra
Leonard Slatkin, cond.
RCA
Perhaps surprisingly, this is my introduction to Aaron Copland's Symphony for Organ and Orchestra of 1924, a youthful work composed for his teacher Nadia Boulanger in early 20th century Paris, incorporating many of his now familiar stylistic cross-rhythms and undercurrents of American urban folk music.  Beginning pensively mysterious in the opening movement, becoming redolent of neoclassical Stravinsky in the delightful and often blathering scherzo movement, and finally winding down and driving home in a raucousness seemingly steeped in a distinctly French/Russian modernist vein; it actually presents a starkly moving and full-bodied expression which is ear-catching and original.   

If one is sympathetic with Copland's developing idiom, the Dance Symphony of 1929 and Short Symphony of 1933 are equally delightful and musically pithy.  In the latter work especially, one can hear the marvelous colorations and rhythms that will eventually come to full fruition in his mature ballet and symphonic scores.  Though the Orchestral Variations dates from 1957, it's actually an orchestration of his Piano Variations of three decades earlier.  While Copland may have felt it to be one of the first works where he garnered his own musical voice, this listener was not so easily enamored.   Also, unlike the works earlier on the disc, Slatkin here doesn't seem all that comfortable and confident in his direction, though the playing is committed and intense -- for fans only.

Please forgive me, Vandermolen, but I had to separate your comments from mine lest there be misconstrual or confusion.

Quote from: vandermolen

Quote from: moldyoldieI've just now come to this thread, reading it in its entirety.  The comments on the Organ Symphony are the most intriguing as I've just been introduced to it last night.  The following is pasted from "What Are You Listening To?":

Copland: Music for Films
-The Red Pony;  Our Town;  The Heiress Suite;  Music for Movies Suite: New England Countryside, Barley Wagons, Sunday Traffic, Grovers Corners, Threshing Machines;   Prairie Journal (Music for Radio)
Saint Louis Symphony Orchestra
Leonard Slatkin, cond.
RCA
No one can elicit an unmistakably American nostalgia quite like Aaron Copland. In fact, I've often thought of much of Copland's music as I think that of Vaughan Williams to Britain.  Many music lovers may take exception, but there it is.  All the music here rings familiar, at least to those who've been the least bit exposed to American public radio and the Turner Classic Movies cable channel.  The meltingly nostalgic themes are often stark and cushy, but always memorable -- sigh-inducing in their simplicity and consummate in their expression of a yearning for a bygone era.  In my opinion, this is some of the most wonderful, if persistently and artfully manipulative music ever made for Hollywood. Despite Copland's inimitable way with developing and hammering home his marvelous themes, one still feels that in the wrong hands this can easily turn gooey and irrepressibly maudlin.  Not so here, however, as Leonard Slatkin and the Saint Louis Symphony prove to be every bit inside the idiom as Bernstein ever was, displaying an honest kinship with Copland's equally genuine American ethos and free of any overt Hollywood vulgarity.  I do love and enjoy this, and the recording is just as fabulous.

Copland: Symphony for Organ and Orchestra;  Dance Symphony;  Short Symphony (Symphony No. 2);  Orchestral Variations
Saint Louis Symphony Orchestra
Leonard Slatkin, cond.
RCA
Perhaps surprisingly, this is my introduction to Aaron Copland's Symphony for Organ and Orchestra of 1924, a youthful work composed for his teacher Nadia Boulanger in early 20th century Paris, incorporating many of his now familiar stylistic cross-rhythms and undercurrents of American urban folk music.  Beginning pensively mysterious in the opening movement, becoming redolent of neoclassical Stravinsky in the delightful and often blathering scherzo movement, and finally winding down and driving home in a raucousness seemingly steeped in a distinctly French/Russian modernist vein; it actually presents a starkly moving and full-bodied expression which is ear-catching and original.   

If one is sympathetic with Copland's developing idiom, the Dance Symphony of 1929 and Short Symphony of 1933 are equally delightful and musically pithy.  In the latter work especially, one can hear the marvelous colorations and rhythms that will eventually come to full fruition in his mature ballet and symphonic scores.  Though the Orchestral Variations dates from 1957, it's actually an orchestration of his Piano Variations of three decades earlier.  While Copland may have felt it to be one of the first works where he garnered his own musical voice, this listener was not so easily enamored.   Also, unlike the earlier works on the disc, Slatkin here doesn't seem all that comfortable and confident in his direction, though the playing is committed and intense -- for fans only.

Very interesting post. When I was about 16 I remember asking my classical music loving elder brother what Vaughan Williams's music was like, having seen some LPs in a shop, and he said 'like an English Copland' and as I liked my brother's LP of Copland's Third Symphony, I went on to explore Vaughan Williams with great pleasure. I am also a great fan of Copland's Organ Symphony - if you like that you might like Malcolm Williamson's Organ Symphony too.

Needless to say, it's gratifying that someone shares my assessment of Copland vis-à-vis Vaughan Williams, at least as it pertains to the more pastoral aspects of their respective idioms.   

Is the Williamson composition you reference the Organ Concerto?  I can't seem to find an Organ Symphony.

Quote from: moldyoldie on April 19, 2009, 02:55:28 AM
Please forgive me, Vandermolen, but I had to separate your comments from mine lest there be misconstrual or confusion.
Very interesting post. When I was about 16 I remember asking my classical music loving elder brother what Vaughan Williams's music was like, having seen some LPs in a shop, and he said 'like an English Copland' and as I liked my brother's LP of Copland's Third Symphony, I went on to explore Vaughan Williams with great pleasure. I am also a great fan of Copland's Organ Symphony - if you like that you might like Malcolm Williamson's Organ Symphony too.

Needless to say, it's gratifying that someone shares my assessment of Copland vis-à-vis Vaughan Williams, at least as it pertains to the more pastoral aspects of their respective idioms.   
ue to
Is the Williamson composition you reference the Organ Concerto?  I can't seem to find an Organ Symphony.

Moldyoldie,

I'm the one who should apologise!

Yes, sorry about the uncharacteristic (haha) c--k up on two fronts, due to a) computer illiteracy b) garbled information.

Yes, the Williamson work is the Organ Concerto, dedicated to Boult, whom I saw conduct the work at the Proms - possibly with Williamson on the organ.

Just listened to Quiet City for the first time, and then had to listen again immediately! What a beautiful little piece this is. I've had the recording for ages, but have never got round to listening - I didn't know that he'd composed anything as lovely as Appalaichan Spring, but it turns out he did!

I smell a transcription...

Quote from: Guido on May 27, 2009, 05:14:54 AM
Just listened to Quiet City for the first time, and then had to listen again immediately! What a beautiful little piece this is. I've had the recording for ages, but have never got round to listening - I didn't know that he'd composed anything as lovely as Appalaichan Spring, but it turns out he did!

Quiet City is lovely.

The Corral Nocturne from Rodeo always melts me, too.

Quote from: Guido on May 27, 2009, 05:14:54 AM
Just listened to Quiet City for the first time, and then had to listen again immediately! What a beautiful little piece this is. I've had the recording for ages, but have never got round to listening - I didn't know that he'd composed anything as lovely as Appalaichan Spring, but it turns out he did!

I smell a transcription...

Quiet City is a masterpiece - a most beautiful and affecting score. The suite from The Tender Land is a lesser known favourite of mine.

Love all the above.  "Grovers Corners" from "Our Town" is also gorgeous.

Quote from: hornteacher on May 27, 2009, 05:01:09 PM
Love all the above.  "Grovers Corners" from "Our Town" is also gorgeous.

Yes, it's part of Copland's 'Music for the Movies' which I play a lot.

I'm not a complainin' man, but there just ain't love enow for the Sextet.

Quote from: vandermolen on May 27, 2009, 11:35:59 PM
Yes, it's part of Copland's 'Music for the Movies' which I play a lot.

*ordered* Looks like a very nice CD...

I like the Sextet alot, but for me the Piano Quartet is the mutt's nuts.

Hardly sounds like praise, that expression, does it?  8)

Wry repartee aside, I must seek yon Piano Quartet out . . . .

I was just going to say no one has mentioned my fav Copland yet, the Piano Quartet (on ASV...NOT Nonesuch). It's perfect serial/American. I think it totally stands out in beauty from any other 50s-60s piano/strings work. The ASV collection is absolutely great. The music really reminds me of the cover, a high high view of New York bathed in golden late afternoon.

And talk about no love for the greatest string Nonet OF THE CENTURY!!! Moody, broody, baby! The only other I know is by Diamond (find a third and make a great cd!!!)

And no love for Copland's Schoenberg-meets-Ruggles CONNOTATIONS??? in a word: stentorian. Ugly, craggy, uncompromising, and totally great. Not a favorite of Mrs. Kennedy at the premier, hint hint...great stuff. The Bernstein/Sony is to be preferred, but the later Bernstein/DG is no where near as "bad" as it's made out to be. For me, it works.

And no love for 1969's INSCAPE???, Copland's reeeally gnarly ear splitting work. Perfect 1969!!!

What of Copland's planned 1969 SQ??? Any ideas?

I've gone through all the Sony box sets. NOT a fan of the Organ Symphony/Piano Concerto. I really like the Clarinet Cto., though, Karl ;D

No one has mentioned what is, for me, a very strange/interesting/Hindemith/Stravinsky work, the Dance Panels. Not to mention the even more enigmatic Statements.

And the Symphonic Ode IS in the top 3. Isn't there one more work of this period that I'm missing?

The Sym. No.3 leaves me colder than...any other DG cd! To me, an unholy mix of Harris and DSCH...communist propanganda.

Strange how I'm thinking Copland/Honegger right now...

Piano music...check!

I also like the Music for a New City? (not the "New Theater" piece: like that one too). Grogh. And then there's all those little "fanfares", and "Down a Country Lane?" (something like that), and some little trifles I like (string and flute pieces from 1971).

But the Americana stuff makes me gag... sorry, it will make me say words I don't want to. App.Spr. I can deal with, but it all sounds like propaganda too me. Sorry. :-[ Copland: not my favorite person. >:( ??? :'(

Quote from: snyprrr on May 29, 2009, 11:40:40 PM
And no love for Copland's Schoenberg-meets-Ruggles CONNOTATIONS???

Another piece which has long been on my To-Listen-To list.

Quote from: snyprrrThe Sym. No.3 leaves me colder than...any other DG cd! To me, an unholy mix of Harris and DSCH...communist propanganda.

I like it a lot, though my first listen was "blind", having chanced on it somewhere mid-3rd mvt on the car radio. Don't know what performance that was.

Try the Judd/Ennzedd Phil on Naxos!

Quote from: vandermolen on May 23, 2008, 05:43:13 AM
Very nice new Copland CD.

I love "The Tender Land Suite" and feel that it should be as well known as the Appalachian Spring:

How does the Piano Concerto grab you, Jeffrey?

I've been enjoying this particular Copland disc of late.

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51Si3JeukjL._SS500_.jpg)

Having no alternative readings of these works, I'm not sure how good people would find these performances when up against competition, however. Any opinions?

Quote from: edward on May 31, 2009, 02:53:35 PM
Having no alternative readings of these works, I'm not sure how good people would find these performances when up against competition, however. Any opinions?

The only piece I have a comparison for is Dorati for the Dance Symphony, and with no disrespect for Dorati, Alsop holds her own very nicely here.

The Lincoln Portrait was part of the Boston Pops Fourth of July Gala, and I was surprised how well I liked it.  (I won't take all the blame for the fact that I started the concert predisposed not to like it.)

Apart from the chirpy section which precedes the narration, I really enjoyed practically the whole piece.  The narrator in this case was not any celebrity, and that probably helped, too . . . too often it's sort of a "star turn" for a public figure, and it winds up being as much about that Special Appearance, as about any old cat named Lincoln.

Quote from: Szykniej on October 11, 2008, 02:00:11 PM
I just picked up this CD:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51GUycfH0yL._SL500_AA280_.jpg)

Chandos released the CD in 2000, but my copy is a later Musical Heritage Society issue. It opens with Copland's "Concerto for Clarinet and String Orchestra, with Harp and Piano" , a piece I was unfamiliar with until now. Even though the work was apparently commissioned for Benny Goodman, it seems less Jazz-influenced to my ears than many of Copland's other compositions.

Yes; Copland did not feel obliged to 'compose to type' there.

Quote from: Catison on June 16, 2007, 06:48:27 AM
This is the recording you want.  Its all around great.

(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/510T0TM0P6L._AA240_.jpg) (http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Quartet-Vitebsk-study-Jewish/dp/B00004T90D/ref=sr_1_6/102-3116842-2473728?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1182005083&sr=1-6)

I don't think I've thanked you yet for the suggestion, Brett!

don't know if this has been mentioned in the thread but it looks like EMI has reissued Slatkin's recordings of the complete Appalachian Spring & Billy The Kid in a dirt cheap set:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51O5gglnorL._SS500_.jpg)

It is however, not including the original couplings from the Appalachian Spring disc: Cortege macabre from "Grohg, 3. Letter From Home, 4. John Henry.

It would seem those three tracks are on the following:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/61GXkZ51H0L._SL500_AA280_.jpg)

I might have to pick these up, 4 discs of Copland for $23....

Sweet.

You need to find a way to get Copland's Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.  It has an ethereal magic that will embrace you like a cold London fog. :)

Quote from: DavidW on July 20, 2009, 10:22:11 AM
You need to find a way to get Copland's Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.  It has an ethereal magic that will embrace you like a cold London fog. :)

And the last movement will rock your world....

A Copland "sighting" on the radio a few minutes ago:

Aaron Copland: The Tender Land: Suite
Boston Symphony Orchestra / Aaron Copland
RCA 61505

Quote from: Bogey on August 03, 2009, 08:48:41 AM
A Copland "sighting" on the radio a few minutes ago:

Aaron Copland: The Tender Land: Suite
Boston Symphony Orchestra / Aaron Copland
RCA 61505

One of my favourite works by Copland, which I prefer to the Appalachian Spring. I have this recording on an old RCA LP. I bought it for the Appalachian Spring and I never played The Tender Land Suite until I heard it on the radio whilst on holiday in the Yorkshire Dales. I was delighted to realise that I had the work on disc!

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 30, 2009, 05:14:45 AM
How does the Piano Concerto grab you, Jeffrey?

Karl,

It has only taken me 17 months to answer your question  ::). I like it very much and often play it - just read through the thread again, so apologies for delay. I wonder which recording of Copland's Third Symphony is the favourite of those who (like me) admire this work. Personally I like Eduardo Mata with the Dallas SO in a nice programme including El Salon Mexico and Danzon Cubano - which is a hoot. In the symphony I think that Mata steers an admirable middle course between the reticence of Copland's own recordings with British orchestras and the more extrovert Bernstein recordings on CBS/Sony and DGG.

The Mata has just been reissued in a slightly different programme in EMI's American Classics series.

Thanks, Jeffrey! And that's one of the great things about the thread organization of GMG . . . hardly any answer is genuinely "too late" : )

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on October 30, 2010, 08:12:11 AM
Thanks, Jeffrey! And that's one of the great things about the thread organization of GMG . . . hardly any answer is genuinely "too late" : )

Hi Karl!

There is an even older message from you about Honegger's book 'I am a Composer' which I need to reply to! But I'm off for 5 days in Istanbul tomorrow - so will get back to you when I return.

What's your favourite recording of Copland's Third Symphony?

Jeffrey

Haven't heard all that many, but I really enjoy the Ennzedd Symphony with James Judd.

(http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2003/Mar03/Copland_Appalachian_Naxos.jpg)
(http://images.bizrate.com/resize?sq=300&uid=1014299687)
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51wGo0IeubL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
(http://images.bizrate.com/resize?sq=300&uid=1014303940)

These are the discs that will introduce me to Copland. Might be hard to believe, but I actually do require such an introduction. All have been well reviewed somewhere, at least one was mentioned upthread. And being Naxos they're cheap. Don't cost much either. So what am I getting? Is it large, small, splendid, contrived, reactionary, beautiful? or, as Gollum asked, What is taters?

Of those four discs, I have only the Alsop/Bournemouth Symphony recording of the Dance Symphony/Short Symphony/Symphony № 1.  It's a mighty good disc, and the music is all dead representative of Copland — so you shall know for certain whether you like his music or not! ; )

Another excellent Naxos disc is the Judd/Ennzedd Symphony recording of Billy the Kid & the Symphony № 3.  The latter symphony is meatier, more rhetorically "symphonic" than most of Copland's music . . . but, too, it may well sit at the summit of his oeuvre.  Billy the Kid, of course, is in his classic, Americana ballet mode . . . sort of if Tom Sawyer had whitewashed a Stravinsky score . . . .

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on June 08, 2011, 05:55:31 AM
Of those four discs, I have only the Alsop/Bournemouth Symphony recording of the Dance Symphony/Short Symphony/Symphony № 1.  It's a mighty good disc, and the music is all dead representative of Copland — so you shall know for certain whether you like his music or not! ; )

Thanks. That's the one I'll start with.

I feel like a fish out of water when it comes to any music past The Seasons! But over the years I've run across a few moderny things that I've liked, all of them relatively lyrical. Vaughn Williams' softer stuff, some Hovhaness, some John Adams, December by Michael Torke, Old and Lost Rivers by Tobias Picker and even a bit of Richard Strauss, Metamorphosen. So what I'm looking for (I guess) is the harmonic sophistication and rhythmic freedom of modernity conjoined with a conventional melodic lyricism.

Copland may well be just up your street, then. And, it's just plain strong music.

Quote from: chasmaniac on June 08, 2011, 06:23:51 AM
Thanks. That's the one I'll start with.

I feel like a fish out of water when it comes to any music past The Seasons! But over the years I've run across a few moderny things that I've liked, all of them relatively lyrical. Vaughn Williams' softer stuff, some Hovhaness, some John Adams, December by Michael Torke, Old and Lost Rivers by Tobias Picker and even a bit of Richard Strauss, Metamorphosen. So what I'm looking for (I guess) is the harmonic sophistication and rhythmic freedom of modernity conjoined with a conventional melodic lyricism.

You might try Copland's 'Symphonic Ode' - a little more challenging than his 'populist' scores, but a poerful, granitic, monolithic score which I think very highly of. There are about three recordings - Michael Tilson Thomas is the best.

I listened to Bernstein's first recording of the 3rd last night, and was once again unimpressed (I'm generally not a Lenny fan). I don't think he characterises the episodes as individually as he should, e.g. the first part of the scherzo isn't driven enough, and the following part should be slower. The end of the slow movement has some very atmospheric, atonal-sounding stuff which sounds prosaic here IMO.

I will fish out the Mata recording tonight, though I don't recall that one as expecially persuasive either.

I wonder if anyone has heard and reviewed all the available recorded versions? The reviews on Amazon are useless: they either rave about how "this is the most American-sounding American symphony ever written by an American composer, composing in America! Awesome!" - or else they rave about how great the recording sounds on their hi-fi system (with specs), as though that's all anyone could possibly want to know before purchase.

I think these are all the recordings:

Bernstein Sony
Bernstein DG
Mata
Slatkin
Judd
Jarvi
Levi
Oue
Robert Tomaro [MMC label]
Copland (only one recording?)

How does everybody feel about Copland's Clarinet Concerto? I think it's one of the best for the instrument I've heard along with Lindberg's and Finzi's.

Quote from: eyeresist on September 07, 2011, 07:40:57 PM
I listened to Bernstein's first recording of the 3rd last night, and was once again unimpressed (I'm generally not a Lenny fan). I don't think he characterises the episodes as individually as he should, e.g. the first part of the scherzo isn't driven enough, and the following part should be slower. The end of the slow movement has some very atmospheric, atonal-sounding stuff which sounds prosaic here IMO.

I will fish out the Mata recording tonight, though I don't recall that one as expecially persuasive either.

I wonder if anyone has heard and reviewed all the available recorded versions? The reviews on Amazon are useless: they either rave about how "this is the most American-sounding American symphony ever written by an American composer, composing in America! Awesome!" - or else they rave about how great the recording sounds on their hi-fi system (with specs), as though that's all anyone could possibly want to know before purchase.

I think these are all the recordings:

Bernstein Sony
Bernstein DG
Mata
Slatkin
Judd
Jarvi
Levi
Oue
Robert Tomaro [MMC label]
Copland (only one recording?)

I've actually listened to many of them, but never at the same time to compare (as I only own one). In general (of those I heard), I would characterize most of them as being pretty good. At least, that is what I think I remember.

I've been listening to the EMI Gemini set which includes the 3rd symphony conducted by Mata. I did enjoy the Mata, and think it superior to Bernstein. I don't much care for the music on disc 2, except for Quiet City.

Quote from: eyeresist on September 07, 2011, 07:40:57 PM
I listened to Bernstein's first recording of the 3rd last night, and was once again unimpressed (I'm generally not a Lenny fan). I don't think he characterises the episodes as individually as he should, e.g. the first part of the scherzo isn't driven enough, and the following part should be slower. The end of the slow movement has some very atmospheric, atonal-sounding stuff which sounds prosaic here IMO.

I will fish out the Mata recording tonight, though I don't recall that one as expecially persuasive either.

I wonder if anyone has heard and reviewed all the available recorded versions? The reviews on Amazon are useless: they either rave about how "this is the most American-sounding American symphony ever written by an American composer, composing in America! Awesome!" - or else they rave about how great the recording sounds on their hi-fi system (with specs), as though that's all anyone could possibly want to know before purchase.

I think these are all the recordings:

Bernstein Sony
Bernstein DG
Mata
Slatkin
Judd
Jarvi
Levi
Oue
Robert Tomaro [MMC label]
Copland (only one recording?)

I think that I have about all of them.  Copland recorded it twice (Everest and Sony - both with London orchestras).  I like both recordings, but some find them understated (certainly compared with Bernstein!) I especially like the earlier one which was recently (in the UK at least) reissued with Billy the Kid, dirt cheap on the Everest label.  I don't like the earlier Bernstein either and much prefer both Copland versions.  As to my favourites, I like the ones by Mata and Slatkin (saw him conduct it at the Proms - it was great) - the later DGG Bernstein is good and both Copland versions.

The first LP recording was very highly rated - Dorati and the Mineapolis SO. It was never on CD but I pestered a company who do private copies of stuff not available to issue it - which they did (I even get a mention in the blurb). The recording (early-mid 50s I guess) is direct from an LP and is a bit constricted, but the performance is great - here is the link.

http://www.bearacreissues.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=286&category_id=1&keyword=copland&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=12

Thanks, vandermolen. I wonder if you have any knowledge of the recording by Oue? I've read it described as "unusual", but don't know what that might mean exactly.

Quote from: eyeresist on September 10, 2011, 03:27:40 AM
Thanks, vandermolen. I wonder if you have any knowledge of the recording by Oue? I've read it described as "unusual", but don't know what that might mean exactly.

My pleasure - am playing the Oue now (haven't listened to it for ages). It is good - quite a different take on the Third Symphony - less 'epic' at the start and generally a more 'reflective' performance (if that makes any sense). It is several minutes slower than the first Bernstein recording - but all the better for it.  It has a 'sadder' feel to it with less triumphalism.

Intriguing. Thanks again.

Quote from: eyeresist on September 10, 2011, 08:37:25 PM
Intriguing. Thanks again.

I enjoyed listening again to it - thoroughly enjoyed it but it is quite different to any other version I have heard (and that's all of them!) Maybe you would not want it as your only version, but definitely worth having.  Copland's Third is generally well served on CD. I even do not dislike the Jarvi on Chandos as much as others + the Harris No 3 with it is better still. The New Zealanders on Naxos are good too.  If I could only choose one version it would be Slatkin with Mata a close number 2.

I thought I would post this video here. This is an interesting interview with Copland himself:

http://www.youtube.com/v/JnWNjd00_ek

Quote from: edward on May 31, 2009, 02:53:35 PM
I've been enjoying this particular Copland disc of late.

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51Si3JeukjL._SS500_.jpg)

Having no alternative readings of these works, I'm not sure how good people would find these performances when up against competition, however. Any opinions?

Quote from: karlhenning on May 31, 2009, 02:58:36 PM
The only piece I have a comparison for is Dorati for the Dance Symphony, and with no disrespect for Dorati, Alsop holds her own very nicely here.

The corral doors are open!

(http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/collections/copland/images/clarence.jpg)

Listening the fourth time through to the Dance Symphony under the baton of the composer and the LSO and another under Dorati and the Detroit Symphony Orchestra.  My wife walked in during the third movement and asked what soundtrack I was listening to.  I said it was Copland and she was quite surprised that it was not from a movie.  I find that in the first movement he captures more a "metropolitan" feel with the percussion and oboe.  There is some interesting "Sherlockian" fiddling about and also some neat piano when one listens closely.  It is a fantastic piece IMO and I did not tire of it during each subsequent listen.  The third movement has hints of that "western sound" toward the end but is snapped back to a "busy metropolitan sound" with the brass.

As for the two recordings, I believe that the Dorati recording adds a layer of lushness that I find romanticizes the piece in parts a bit too much for my taste.  I would rec the Copland conducted from '67 as the instruments sound a bit more raw.  Nice harp in the Dorati, but the oboe(?) does not keep pace and percussion leaves one wanting.  However, Dorati's second movement is worth the listen and maybe worth having this recording on the shelf just for that.

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51J%2BYyd-TzL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)  (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51b4GQsRqNL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)

Anyone know if there is a Stokowski recording of this piece....I would love to here him take on the second movement!

What band does Doráti lead in the Dance Symphony there, Bill?

Quote from: karlhenning on July 10, 2012, 03:12:39 PM
What band does Doráti lead in the Dance Symphony there, Bill?

Motor City S O, Karl.

Ah, then it may well be the same recording I've got, in a different reissue.  I should revisit it!

Quote from: Bogey on July 10, 2012, 02:50:37 PM(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51b4GQsRqNL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)

All of the sets of the Copland Collection are worth acquiring. I'm getting in the mood for some Copland myself. It's hot outside and the only cure is some Billy the Kid. :D By the way, the Dance Symphony is great! I love the Organ Symphony too. Have you heard this one, Bill?

Quote from: Mirror Image on July 10, 2012, 03:51:11 PM
All of the sets of the Copland Collection are worth acquiring. I'm getting in the mood for some Copland myself. It's hot outside and the only cure is some Billy the Kid. :D By the way, the Dance Symphony is great! I love the Organ Symphony too. Have you heard this one, Bill?

I will make that one my next listen, MI.  Not too familiar with it. The above is my first recording.

Quote from: karlhenning on July 10, 2012, 03:50:15 PM
Ah, then it may well be the same recording I've got, in a different reissue.  I should revisit it!

Compare the two when you can.

Quote from: Bogey on July 10, 2012, 04:11:59 PM
I will make that one my next listen, MI.  Not too familiar with it. The above is my first recording.

The second movement from the Organ Symphony is a blast!

As per MI's lead, rolling out the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.

The first movement I am enjoying considerably.  I love how winds are used in the first movement.  A nice balance to the organ's depth.  It really has that "Copland footboot print at the start and throughout the second, but is that an organ or an accordian I hear with splashes of Peter and the Wolf? ;)  That 5 minute mark truly kicks it in.  The third movement had me looking about our lighting for a swinging phantom at points, but when the organ was absent or subtle I much more enjoyed the music.  In final, I feel that the organ does not blend with the symphony, but rather features.  Much along the lines of the tuba when Jabba appears under John Williams scoring. ;D  Thanks for the point MI....that was fun.

Quote from: Bogey on July 10, 2012, 05:22:50 PM
As per MI's lead, rolling out the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.

The first movement I am enjoying considerably.  I love how winds are used in the first movement.  A nice balance to the organ's depth.  It really has that "Copland footboot print at the start and throughout the second, but is that an organ or an accordian I hear with splashes of Peter and the Wolf? ;)  That 5 minute mark truly kicks it in.  The third movement had me looking about our lighting for a swinging phantom at points, but when the organ was absent or subtle I much more enjoyed the music.  In final, I feel that the organ does not blend with the symphony, but rather features.  Much along the lines of the tuba when Jabba appears under John Williams scoring. ;D  Thanks for the point MI....that was fun.

Glad you enjoyed, Bill. It is a fun work certainly. :)

Quote from: eyeresist on September 10, 2011, 03:27:40 AM
Thanks, vandermolen. I wonder if you have any knowledge of the recording by Oue? I've read it described as "unusual", but don't know what that might mean exactly.

The Oue was the first recording I heard of the Symphony. I think it's great. The only other one I've heard is the Mata, which I don't remember much about.

Connotations
Inscape

Anyone on these two moist dissonant, Modern, and foreboding Copland works? I've always liked the clunky theme of 'Connotations', and the orchestration. 'Inscape' equally has searing moments, and is very thick indeed.

I think we have three 'Connotations': Bernstein/Sony, Bernstein/DG, and, an old NewWorld album (which I hear is the one NOT to get (I'm sure I've heard it from the library but the performance escapes me, though I suspect it had low wattage)). Everybody says the Sony is the only one, and it sure is searing, but the DG isn't bad, even though Bernstein made some cuts AC wasn't pleased with (it's still longer with the cuts than the Sony, so).

Apparently Jackie Kennedy went up to AC after the premiere and asked why the piece was so... 'ascetic'? Or something. I forget what the reply was.


'Inscape' is AC's last Orchestral Work. I think we only have Bernstein/Sony and Botstein/NewWorld. I'll have to go to the library for the Sony, but the new Botstein performance is just fine. I've only listened once so far, but the piece comes off a bit more diffuse than 'Connotations'. I'll admit that I like Copland's 'enigmatic' pieces ('Dance Panels', 'Statements'); I like his 'thoughts' so to speak,... somewhat like Schuman in the Titles ('Credendum', 'Statements').

As far as the older, mid-century generation (Hindemith, DSCH, Bloch, etc.,...), these two pieces seem like the only really Modernist pieces outside of Stravinsky (I'm suuure I'm missing oodles, but I'm not talking Frank Martin). What do you think?

Well, you do make the most interesting posts when I am on duty at the museum....

'Statements' is a work I have recently discovered and like.

Quote from: karlhenning on May 18, 2013, 11:14:03 AM
Well, you do make the most interesting posts when I am on duty at the museum....

I'm sorry, Karl! :D

[from the listening thread]

This...

[asin]B00CE28SR4[/asin]

...is my new first-choice Rodeo. Note, however, that the cover - and back cover - and booklet - are all somehow mistaken about the contents. This isn't the famous "Four Dance Episodes" suite usually heard, but the full ballet, with an extra movement (Ranch House Party), a new introduction to the Nocturne, and a few superfluous extra passages in the Hoe Down.

I used my MusicWeb Twitter powers (https://twitter.com/MusicWebInt/status/340546334115373057) to point out Naxos' mistake, and they responded by splitting the digital download/streaming version into 5 tracks instead of 4, and also changed the cover art, including a new picture for some reason:

(http://cdn.naxosmusiclibrary.com/sharedfiles/images/cds/hires/8.559758.jpg)

So three public service announcements:
1. If you see these two cover images, they're the same CD.
2. This IS a complete, uncut Rodeo performance.
3. It is OUTSTANDING. Slatkin and the Detroit Symphony are fully on-point, the solo work's terrific, there are a lot of touches that make me smile (like the way the cellos really dig into the Hoe Down, or a great trombone solo in Buckaroo Holiday, or the joyous saloon piano in Ranch House Party), and the recorded sound is excellent. I would definitely consider this (after three listens) my favorite Rodeo.

Very nice, Brian.

Quote from: karlhenning on June 08, 2011, 05:55:31 AMAnother excellent Naxos disc is the Judd/Ennzedd Symphony recording of Billy the Kid & the Symphony № 3.  The latter symphony is meatier, more rhetorically "symphonic" than most of Copland's music . . . but, too, it may well sit at the summit of his oeuvre.  Billy the Kid, of course, is in his classic, Americana ballet mode . . . sort of if Tom Sawyer had whitewashed a Stravinsky score . . . .

What great descriptions, "sit at the summit of his oeuvre" and "if Tom Sawyer had whitewashed a Stravinsky score." I just ordered this disc. Thank you, Karl.

Quote from: snyprrr on May 18, 2013, 09:38:52 AM
Connotations
Inscape

Anyone on these two moist dissonant, Modern, and foreboding Copland works? I've always liked the clunky theme of 'Connotations', and the orchestration. 'Inscape' equally has searing moments, and is very thick indeed.

I think we have three 'Connotations': Bernstein/Sony, Bernstein/DG, and, an old NewWorld album (which I hear is the one NOT to get (I'm sure I've heard it from the library but the performance escapes me, though I suspect it had low wattage)). Everybody says the Sony is the only one, and it sure is searing, but the DG isn't bad, even though Bernstein made some cuts AC wasn't pleased with (it's still longer with the cuts than the Sony, so).

Apparently Jackie Kennedy went up to AC after the premiere and asked why the piece was so... 'ascetic'? Or something. I forget what the reply was.


'Inscape' is AC's last Orchestral Work. I think we only have Bernstein/Sony and Botstein/NewWorld. I'll have to go to the library for the Sony, but the new Botstein performance is just fine. I've only listened once so far, but the piece comes off a bit more diffuse than 'Connotations'. I'll admit that I like Copland's 'enigmatic' pieces ('Dance Panels', 'Statements'); I like his 'thoughts' so to speak,... somewhat like Schuman in the Titles ('Credendum', 'Statements').

As far as the older, mid-century generation (Hindemith, DSCH, Bloch, etc.,...), these two pieces seem like the only really Modernist pieces outside of Stravinsky (I'm suuure I'm missing oodles, but I'm not talking Frank Martin). What do you think?

The Botstein just can't compare to the intensity of the Bernstein (Inscape).

Quote from: snyprrr on June 18, 2013, 06:21:10 AM
The Botstein just can't compare to the intensity of the Bernstein (Inscape).

That's what I might have guessed; thanks for the confirmation!

Quote from: Jay F on June 17, 2013, 02:54:02 PM
What great descriptions, "sit at the summit of his oeuvre" and "if Tom Sawyer had whitewashed a Stravinsky score." I just ordered this disc. Thank you, Karl.

Thank you kindly, Jay. It's a while since I listened to that disc, I need to fetch it back out.

Quote from: snyprrr on May 18, 2013, 09:38:52 AM
Connotations
Inscape

Anyone on these two moist dissonant, Modern, and foreboding Copland works? I've always liked the clunky theme of 'Connotations', and the orchestration. 'Inscape' equally has searing moments, and is very thick indeed.

I think we have three 'Connotations': Bernstein/Sony, Bernstein/DG, and, an old NewWorld album (which I hear is the one NOT to get (I'm sure I've heard it from the library but the performance escapes me, though I suspect it had low wattage)). Everybody says the Sony is the only one, and it sure is searing, but the DG isn't bad, even though Bernstein made some cuts AC wasn't pleased with (it's still longer with the cuts than the Sony, so).

Apparently Jackie Kennedy went up to AC after the premiere and asked why the piece was so... 'ascetic'? Or something. I forget what the reply was.


'Inscape' is AC's last Orchestral Work. I think we only have Bernstein/Sony and Botstein/NewWorld. I'll have to go to the library for the Sony, but the new Botstein performance is just fine. I've only listened once so far, but the piece comes off a bit more diffuse than 'Connotations'. I'll admit that I like Copland's 'enigmatic' pieces ('Dance Panels', 'Statements'); I like his 'thoughts' so to speak,... somewhat like Schuman in the Titles ('Credendum', 'Statements').

As far as the older, mid-century generation (Hindemith, DSCH, Bloch, etc.,...), these two pieces seem like the only really Modernist pieces outside of Stravinsky (I'm suuure I'm missing oodles, but I'm not talking Frank Martin). What do you think?

My favorite work of the "modernist" Copland is his Nonet for Strings. Contrary to what some assert it's not a 12-tone work. It does have some dissonances and cluster-like chords, yet there is a strong sense of diatonicism throughout. Copland combines some of the "western" rhythms with a contrapuntal texture and frequent tonal shifts. It sounds 100% American without invoking jazz or folk music (to my knowledge). It can be performed by nine players, or any multiple of nine. My first recording was the Columbia issue that included the Duet for Piano and Flute and the Violin Sonata. I've heard a recording with a full string orchestra as well. Both renditions are great. Several musicians I know were shocked to discover they hadn't heard of the piece. It's unjustly fallen through the cracks.

Quote from: Rons_talking on June 20, 2013, 09:15:15 AM
My favorite work of the "modernist" Copland is his Nonet for Strings. Contrary to what some assert it's not a 12-tone work. It does have some dissonances and cluster-like chords, yet there is a strong sense of diatonicism throughout. Copland combines some of the "western" rhythms with a contrapuntal texture and frequent tonal shifts. It sounds 100% American without invoking jazz or folk music (to my knowledge). It can be performed by nine players, or any multiple of nine. My first recording was the Columbia issue that included the Duet for Piano and Flute and the Violin Sonata. I've heard a recording with a full string orchestra as well. Both renditions are great. Several musicians I know were shocked to discover they hadn't heard of the piece.

(* raises hand *)

Quote from: Rons_talking on June 20, 2013, 09:15:15 AM
My favorite work of the "modernist" Copland is his Nonet for Strings. Contrary to what some assert it's not a 12-tone work. It does have some dissonances and cluster-like chords, yet there is a strong sense of diatonicism throughout. Copland combines some of the "western" rhythms with a contrapuntal texture and frequent tonal shifts. It sounds 100% American without invoking jazz or folk music (to my knowledge). It can be performed by nine players, or any multiple of nine. My first recording was the Columbia issue that included the Duet for Piano and Flute and the Violin Sonata. I've heard a recording with a full string orchestra as well. Both renditions are great. Several musicians I know were shocked to discover they hadn't heard of the piece. It's unjustly fallen through the cracks.

Yea, the Nonet and the Piano Quartet for me!





HEY KARL, WHATEVER HAPPENED TO MI????

Quote from: snyprrr on June 21, 2013, 06:26:15 AM
HEY KARL, WHATEVER HAPPENED TO MI????

Poor fellow, he wouldn't be guided... I don't think he ever recovered from that Delius binge....

And, yes, I pulled the trigger on a recording of the Nonet, knowing how richly gratifying was the experience of playing the Sextet.  Easily helped that the disc also has the chamber version of Appalachian Spring.

Quote from: karlhenning on June 21, 2013, 11:05:05 AM
And, yes, I pulled the trigger on a recording of the Nonet, knowing how richly gratifying was the experience of playing the Sextet.  Easily helped that the disc also has the chamber version of Appalachian Spring.

But those recordings are by Nimbus (?), which, to my ears, made the worst audio recordings that mankind has ever conceived.

Quote from: sanantonio on June 21, 2013, 11:35:57 AM
There's this one -

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/71e0kjiXMsL._SX300_.jpg)

I'm listening right now on MOG

Ok, and "like new" for $0.01, can't beat that (except for the $3.99 shipping). 

Seriously, I usually like recordings a bit on the "wet" side, but the overwhelming reverbertation I hear in the typical Nimbus recording makes it impossible for me.

Quote from: Scarpia on June 21, 2013, 01:04:40 PM
Ok, and "like new" for $0.01, can't beat that (except for the $3.99 shipping). 

Seriously, I usually like recordings a bit on the "wet" side, but the overwhelming reverbertation I hear in the typical Nimbus recording makes it impossible for me.

Ho capito, and in fact, I have only a very few Nimbus discs. Similarly, I reckoned that the calibre of performers, and the price, justified the risk.

Quote from: snyprrr on June 21, 2013, 06:26:15 AM

HEY KARL, WHATEVER HAPPENED TO MI????

I'm right here, snyprrr. :) Thankfully, I recovered from that Delius binge which only lasted two months. I've been in Shostakovich mode since May. Since I'm here on the Copland thread, a work I heard maybe a year or two ago that I revisited and enjoyed a lot was Dance Panels. Has anyone else enjoyed this work?

Quote from: Scarpia on June 21, 2013, 11:28:19 AM
But those recordings are by Nimbus (?), which, to my ears, made the worst audio recordings that mankind has ever conceived.

But isn't that the old Davies recording from MusicMasters (I have it on MusicalHeritage)? Nonet-App. Spr.-2 Pieces ???? If so, that's a fine recording.

Quote from: Mirror Image on June 22, 2013, 06:49:50 AM
I'm right here, snyprrr. :) Thankfully, I recovered from that Delius binge which only lasted two months. I've been in Shostakovich mode since May. Since I'm here on the Copland thread, a work I heard maybe a year or two ago that I revisited and enjoyed a lot was Dance Panels. Has anyone else enjoyed this work?

I'm about to hear Dance Panels this weekend; the new Naxos Rodeo I reviewed at the bottom of the last page comes coupled with it.

Quote from: sanantonio on June 21, 2013, 11:35:57 AM
There's this one -

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/71e0kjiXMsL._SX300_.jpg)

I'm listening right now on MOG

These three Sets were of great interest and very well presented with photos etc. I liked discovering the Carl Sandburg version of the Lincoln Portrait. Much better than the Henry Fonda version in my view.

I listened to the Dance Panels just this past Thursday. Top-shelf Copland.

Quote from: snyprrr on June 22, 2013, 06:58:07 AM
But isn't that the old Davies recording from MusicMasters (I have it on MusicalHeritage)? Nonet-App. Spr.-2 Pieces ???? If so, that's a fine recording.

There's some confusion here.  Now I see that Nimbus has two different recordings of the Nonet, one by Davies, the other by Boughton.   In the past I have been very dissatisfied with Nimbus/Boughton recordings.  Maybe Nimbus recordings with Davies and St. Lukes would suit me better.  The Nimbus Davies seems to be identical with a Musical Heritage Society release, but I thought MHS only re-issued recordings made by other labels, maybe that's not so. 

[asin]B0000064AV[/asin]

[asin]B00165QONK[/asin]

[asin]B000000FN7[/asin]

At this point the only Copland I can recall in my collection is this, which I do not like at all.

[asin]B000NPCMEO[/asin]

I'm with you, I have no appetite for the Boughton/Nimbus disc of Copland. I seem to remember the Britten being all right, though.

Quote from: Brian on June 22, 2013, 07:45:29 AM
I'm about to hear Dance Panels this weekend; the new Naxos Rodeo I reviewed at the bottom of the last page comes coupled with it.

It's certainly a great work, Brian. As Karl said, top-shelf Copland.

Quote from: Scarpia on June 22, 2013, 10:25:59 AM
There's some confusion here.  Now I see that Nimbus has two different recordings of the Nonet, one by Davies, the other by Boughton.   In the past I have been very dissatisfied with Nimbus/Boughton recordings.  Maybe Nimbus recordings with Davies and St. Lukes would suit me better.  The Nimbus Davies seems to be identical with a Musical Heritage Society release, but I thought MHS only re-issued recordings made by other labels, maybe that's not so. 

[asin]B0000064AV[/asin]

[asin]B00165QONK[/asin]

[asin]B000000FN7[/asin]

At this point the only Copland I can recall in my collection is this, which I do not like at all.

[asin]B000NPCMEO[/asin]

Nimbus seems to be Naxos-ing Out! with their reissues. YES, the Davies 'sounds' fine. Many prefer his 'Spring' too.

I, for one, think that the original chamber version of Appalachian Spring is underappreciated.

Quote from: karlhenning on June 24, 2013, 03:09:09 AM
I, for one, think that the original chamber version of Appalachian Spring is underappreciated.

I might agree with you (and sanantonio, with that welcome recording suggestion). Have heard both in the last few years - the chamber music version more recently, and was impressed with how fresh it sounded. The reduced orchestration seems more simpatico with the spirit of the piece.

--Bruce

I'd go with Brahms and Hindemith. It seems they outsmart their own ideas. Something beautiful is often immediately developed out of its original form, never to be heard the same way again.  "wow, that's powerful," I'll say. As soon as I utter this the music is going somewhere else. They're both great composers but they take my dinner to the kitchen before I'm half finished...

Gates have swung open in a few months, so bringing this over:

Thanks to John:

Our Town: conducted by

(http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/collections/copland/images/schuman.jpg)

Quote from: Mirror Image on September 25, 2013, 08:10:39 PM
Thumbs up! A very good work. The best I can remember anyway. By the way, Bill, have you heard Dance Panels? This is one of my favorite new Copland discoveries. Well, I've actually heard it years ago, but only in the last two or three months has it made such a lasting impression on me.

Do not have that one.  Is their a performance you prefer?

Quote from: Bogey on September 26, 2013, 06:41:06 PM

Do not have that one.  Is their a performance you prefer?

Yes, get Copland's performance. It's excellent. I bought those Copland Collections on Sony. There's three sets in all. I'm surprised you don't own these, Bill. I know you're a vinyl man, but these are worth owning on CD.

I have this one.  I was actually listening to Statements when I read your post. ;D

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51hR3B78wVL.jpg)

I have not picked up the others because I had a number of the recordings on other discs.  I always hem and haw when I look at them.  I also noticed that their prices have gone down, so a good time to buy.

Quote from: Rons_talking on June 27, 2013, 03:32:49 PM
I'd go with Brahms and Hindemith. It seems they outsmart their own ideas. Something beautiful is often immediately developed out of its original form, never to be heard the same way again.  "wow, that's powerful," I'll say. As soon as I utter this the music is going somewhere else. They're both great composers but they take my dinner to the kitchen before I'm half finished...

good one

Quote from: Bogey on September 26, 2013, 07:12:01 PM
I have this one.  I was actually listening to Statements when I read your post. ;D

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51hR3B78wVL.jpg)

I have not picked up the others because I had a number of the recordings on other discs.  I always hem and haw when I look at them.  I also noticed that their prices have gone down, so a good time to buy.

Yeah, if you can get them cheap then go for it. You won't be sorry. I, too, already owned some performances in these sets, but I got rid of the duplicates to accommodate room for these three sets. :)

Indeed.  I like how Bernstein or Copland is in charge of the performances.  As it should be, but MTT also had a nice run with his music.

(http://morganreynoldspublishing.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/bernstein-and-copland.jpg?w=470&h=403)  (http://morganreynoldspublishing.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/bernstein-and-copland-2.jpg?w=470&h=360)  (http://library.buffalo.edu/music/exhibits/smit/img/lsaclb.jpg)

Nice pictures, Bill. Bernstein knew Copland's music better than any other conductor, but I do agree that MTT has done some fine work with this music.

This one has been on my radar. Anyone here have a copy?

[asin]B000003GJ4[/asin]

Here is what it has to offer:


Notes and Editorial Reviews
This CD also contains a conversation between Aaron Copland, Donald L. Leavitt, and Leo Smit.
REVIEWS:
Billboard (11/27/99) - Recommended
Works on This Recording
1. Old American Songs, Set 2: Zion's Walls by Aaron Copland
Performer:  Leo Smit (Piano), Jan DeGaetani (Mezzo Soprano)
Period: 20th Century
Written: 1952; USA
Date of Recording: 11/14/1981
Venue:  Live  Coolidge Auditorium, Library of Congress
Length: 2 Minutes 14 Secs.

2. Old American Songs, Set 2: At the River by Aaron Copland
Performer:  Leo Smit (Piano), Jan DeGaetani (Mezzo Soprano)
Period: 20th Century
Date of Recording: 11/14/1981
Venue:  Live  Coolidge Auditorium, Library of Congress
Length: 2 Minutes 49 Secs.

3. Old American Songs, Set 1: Simple Gifts by Aaron Copland
Performer:  Jan DeGaetani (Mezzo Soprano), Leo Smit (Piano)
Period: 20th Century
Written: 1950; USA
Date of Recording: 11/14/1981
Venue:  Live  Coolidge Auditorium, Library of Congress
Length: 1 Minutes 52 Secs.

4. Three Moods by Aaron Copland
Performer:  Leo Smit (Piano)
Period: 20th Century
Written: 1920-1921; Paris, France
Date of Recording: 11/14/1981
Venue:  Live  Coolidge Auditorium, Library of Congress
Length: 4 Minutes 29 Secs.

5. Night Thoughts "Hommage to Ives" by Aaron Copland
Performer:  Leo Smit (Piano)
Period: 20th Century
Written: 1972; USA
Date of Recording: 11/14/1981
Venue:  Live  Coolidge Auditorium, Library of Congress
Length: 8 Minutes 16 Secs.

6. Poems (12) of Emily Dickinson by Aaron Copland
Performer:  Leo Smit (Piano), Jan DeGaetani (Mezzo Soprano)
Period: 20th Century
Written: 1949-1950; USA
Date of Recording: 11/14/1981
Venue:  Live  Coolidge Auditorium, Library of Congress
Length: 32 Minutes 13 Secs.
Notes: Jan DeGaetani provides a spoken introduction to this song cycle.

7. Old American Songs, Set 2: The Little Horses by Aaron Copland
Performer:  Leo Smit (Piano), Jan DeGaetani (Mezzo Soprano)
Period: 20th Century
Written: 1952; USA
Date of Recording: 11/14/1981
Venue:  Live  Coolidge Auditorium, Library of Congress
Length: 2 Minutes 33 Secs.

At a glance, it looks like the same performances from the first, 3cd volume of the Sony COPLAND COLLECTION (1936-48) will be repackaged with a couple discs (?) of piano music (Leo Smit) in that forthcoming Sony budget box:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41ANMPDJ6QL.jpg)(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/7113hNAV7ZL._AA1500_.jpg)

It's a pity Sony didn't include the other two volumes (four discs) in this new COLLECTION box.  It will be nice to hear the piano music, though.

Quote from: Bogey on September 26, 2013, 07:33:49 PM
This one has been on my radar. Anyone here have a copy?

No, but it must be charming, Bill.

Alert: Copland binge approaching.

Quote from: Octave on September 26, 2013, 08:36:41 PM
At a glance, it looks like the same performances from the first, 3cd volume of the Sony COPLAND COLLECTION (1936-48) will be repackaged with a couple discs (?) of piano music (Leo Smit) in that forthcoming Sony budget box:
  (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/7113hNAV7ZL._AA1500_.jpg)

It's a pity Sony didn't include the other two volumes (four discs) in this new COLLECTION box.  It will be nice to hear the piano music, though.

I have had this on preorder for some time and been puzzled why they didn't, too.

Quote from: karlhenning on September 27, 2013, 02:51:13 AM
Alert: Copland binge approaching.

Little did I realize that my binge would focus simply on Appalachian Spring . . . .

Quote from: Bogey on September 26, 2013, 07:12:01 PM
I have this one.  I was actually listening to Statements when I read your post. ;D

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51hR3B78wVL.jpg)

Bill, you remind me that I've not heard the Pf Cto at all, at all.  And this volume has the Lenny/E. Power Biggs recording of the Organ Symphony, too.

I've listened to a few this morning, and will listen to some more later in the day.  Taking a nap to rest up from this cold flu.

Listened to 'Fanfare for the Common Man', 'Quiet City' and 'Music for Movies'.

On deck for later today:  'Lincoln Portrait', 'Appalachian Spring Suite', 'Ceremonial Fanfare', 'El salon Mexico', 'Dance Symphony' and 'Four Dance Episodes from Rodeo'

I will skip the 'Five "Old American Songs"'.  Not my thing.  :D  I particularly cringe at "I Bought Me a Cat".  :laugh: >:D :)

Mend quickly, Ray!

Seeing how this thread's sudden popularity, I am reminded that it has been 10 years since I last listened to Dance Panels. I will pick it out now...

Letting this one run:

(http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_400/MI0001/100/MI0001100524.jpg?partner=allrovi.com)

Quote from: Bogey on September 28, 2013, 08:50:51 AM
Letting this one run:

(http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_400/MI0001/100/MI0001100524.jpg?partner=allrovi.com)

That was the recording which rekindled my affection for the piece,  Bill.

Quote from: karlhenning on September 28, 2013, 01:30:52 PM
That was the recording which rekindled my affection for the piece,  Bill.

Its clarity is stunning to say the least, Karl.

Radio saturation had soured me on the piece.  And maybe some time had passed, to clear the ear's palate (to suggest improbable anatomy).  And one slow evening in the Exhibition Shop (which exhibit? Perhaps Hopper, though it were hard to say why the disc would be apt for it) the disc played (one of five in the changer, so it was not my doing) and I heard it again for the first time. I was transfixed.

And let the three princes of Serendip be praised!

that is the one I just posted on the Purchases thread, is it not (with different cover)?  I have it on the CD player now.

Clarity is certainly one adjective that can be applied.

Quote from: Jeffrey Smith on September 28, 2013, 06:52:41 PM
And let the three princes of Serendip be praised!

that is the one I just posted on the Purchases thread, is it not (with different cover)?  I have it on the CD player now.

Clarity is certainly one adjective that can be applied.

Yes, the cover featured above is the reissue of the recording you bought, which yours is the original release.

Quote from: ChamberNut on September 27, 2013, 06:47:17 AM
I've listened to a few this morning, and will listen to some more later in the day.  Taking a nap to rest up from this cold flu.

Listened to 'Fanfare for the Common Man', 'Quiet City' and 'Music for Movies'.

On deck for later today:  'Lincoln Portrait', 'Appalachian Spring Suite', 'Ceremonial Fanfare', 'El salon Mexico', 'Dance Symphony' and 'Four Dance Episodes from Rodeo'

I will skip the 'Five "Old American Songs"'.  Not my thing.  :D  I particularly cringe at "I Bought Me a Cat".  :laugh: >:D :)

Sorry that the Sony box doesn't include 'Symphonic Ode' one of my favourite of the more craggy Copland scores. I have joined the cold/flu fraternity  ??? Hope you get better soon.

Quote from: vandermolen on September 28, 2013, 11:19:21 PM
Sorry that the Sony box doesn't include 'Symphonic Ode' one of my favourite of the more craggy Copland scores. I have joined the cold/flu fraternity  ??? Hope you get better soon.

Take two Alexandre Desplats and call me in the morning. 

Feel better.

Quote from: Bogey on September 29, 2013, 06:39:16 AM
Take two Alexandre Desplats and call me in the morning. 

Feel better.

:)

Quote from: vandermolen on September 28, 2013, 11:19:21 PM
Sorry that the Sony box doesn't include 'Symphonic Ode' one of my favourite of the more craggy Copland scores. I have joined the cold/flu fraternity  ??? Hope you get better soon.

Yeah, that's a cool work, Jeffrey. I need to revisit it myself at some point. All of those Copland Collections on Sony are essential acquisitions for the Copland fan IMHO.

Quote from: Mirror Image on September 29, 2013, 10:56:52 AM
Yeah, that's a cool work, Jeffrey. I need to revisit it myself at some point. All of those Copland Collections on Sony are essential acquisitions for the Copland fan IMHO.

Totally agree  :)

Agree with Jeffrey about the "craggy grandeur" of the Symphonic Ode. It's one of Copland's most underrated works I think.

Decades ago I noted a very, gripping, powerful and dramatic piece of music which featured in a TV documentary 'Brother can you spare a Dime' about the USA during the Great Depression'. I had subsequently looked out for it. Then I heard it on the radio a few months ago and discovered it was the third section ('Dogmatic') of Aaron Copland's 'Statements' for Orchestra (1934-35).

Quote from: vandermolen on September 29, 2013, 01:31:05 PM
Decades ago I noted a very, gripping, powerful and dramatic piece of music which featured in a TV documentary 'Brother can you spare a Dime' about the USA during the Great Depression'. Then I heard it on the radio a few months ago and discovered it was the third section ('Dogmatic') of Aaron Copland's 'Statements' for Orchestra (1934-35).

Interesting, Jeffrey! It's been a while since I've heard Statements.

For those interested, I thought I'd mention that Naxos very recently issued a Blu-Ray audio edition of the Copland/Slatkin/Motown disc that Brian sang praises for on page 7 of the thread.  If this was mentioned elsewhere GMG, I missed it.  It is here:

[asin]B00E3ISIFY[/asin]

His comments on the Slatkin disc quoted below for convenience.  I know not everyone is sold on the BRA format (I wish I could get my BRAs from BRO), but I really thought I could detect a fidelity jump in the Janacek/Wit BRA I got from Naxos.  (Though I wasn't enthusiastic about those performances.) 
The problem is that I am unlikely to buy recordings in two formats just to compare.

Quote from: Brian on June 17, 2013, 01:35:26 PM
[from the listening thread]

This...

[asin]B00CE28SR4[/asin]

...is my new first-choice Rodeo. Note, however, that the cover - and back cover - and booklet - are all somehow mistaken about the contents. This isn't the famous "Four Dance Episodes" suite usually heard, but the full ballet, with an extra movement (Ranch House Party), a new introduction to the Nocturne, and a few superfluous extra passages in the Hoe Down.

I used my MusicWeb Twitter powers (https://twitter.com/MusicWebInt/status/340546334115373057) to point out Naxos' mistake, and they responded by splitting the digital download/streaming version into 5 tracks instead of 4, and also changed the cover art, including a new picture for some reason:

(http://cdn.naxosmusiclibrary.com/sharedfiles/images/cds/hires/8.559758.jpg)

So three public service announcements:
1. If you see these two cover images, they're the same CD.
2. This IS a complete, uncut Rodeo performance.
3. It is OUTSTANDING. Slatkin and the Detroit Symphony are fully on-point, the solo work's terrific, there are a lot of touches that make me smile (like the way the cellos really dig into the Hoe Down, or a great trombone solo in Buckaroo Holiday, or the joyous saloon piano in Ranch House Party), and the recorded sound is excellent. I would definitely consider this (after three listens) my favorite Rodeo.

Am I the only one here that is a fan of Copland's works that use serial and/or 12 tone techniques? I've listened to the piano/orchestral variations, Connotations, Inscape, and the Piano Fantasy lately. Definitely not the easiest going Copland works, but there's still that expressive voice at work behind all of the hard-edged-ness. I also have a soft spot for the Piano Concerto and Organ Symphony, two early works that don't get a whole lot of attention.

Quote from: lescamil on November 03, 2013, 08:53:43 PM
Am I the only one here that is a fan of Copland's works that use serial and/or 12 tone techniques?

Certainly not!

http://www.youtube.com/v/i1-vIw_M-Qg

Quote from: lescamil on November 03, 2013, 08:53:43 PM
Am I the only one here that is a fan of Copland's works that use serial and/or 12 tone techniques? I've listened to the piano/orchestral variations, Connotations, Inscape, and the Piano Fantasy lately. Definitely not the easiest going Copland works, but there's still that expressive voice at work behind all of the hard-edged-ness. I also have a soft spot for the Piano Concerto and Organ Symphony, two early works that don't get a whole lot of attention.

Quote from: North Star on November 03, 2013, 09:17:24 PM
Certainly not!

http://www.youtube.com/v/i1-vIw_M-Qg

Likewise!

In fact, I'm listening to Connotations today.

Quote from: Wiki wacky wooComposers David Diamond and Carlos Chavez were confused initially about what musical form Connotations would take as the work's title seemed to give no clear indication. Chavez in fact told Copland that he found the title too abstract.

"Well, Carlos, just have a Coke and a smile."

I bought this set earlier today:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/511D1y4xggL.jpg)

Do any of you guys own it? What do you think of the music? I haven't one performance of any Copland chamber work in my collection unless we count the original version of Appalachian Spring. :)

Quote from: Mirror Image on September 28, 2014, 03:25:25 PM
I bought this set earlier today:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/511D1y4xggL.jpg)

Do any of you guys own it? What do you think of the music? I haven't one performance of any Copland chamber work in my collection unless we count the original version of Appalachian Spring. :)

Ummm, John? You own it. We are awaiting a report from you.

Quote from: Ken B on September 28, 2014, 03:31:36 PM
Ummm, John? You own it. We are awaiting a report from you.

I don't own it yet. I just bought it today, so it should be shipped out soon. :)

Quote from: Mirror Image on September 28, 2014, 03:25:25 PM
I bought this set earlier today:

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/511D1y4xggL.jpg)

Do any of you guys own it? What do you think of the music? I haven't one performance of any Copland chamber work in my collection unless we count the original version of Appalachian Spring. :)

Yes John I have that one, I absolutely enjoy and dearly love Copland's chamber music, this is a real fine disk, essential even!

Quote from: Leo K. on September 28, 2014, 07:19:16 PM
Yes John I have that one, I absolutely enjoy and dearly love Copland's chamber music, this is a real fine disk, essential even!

A Leo sighting! Great to hear. I hope all is well with you. I haven't seen you around for quite some time. I see you still have the Sessions avatar. :)

Quote from: Mirror Image on September 28, 2014, 07:54:46 PM
A Leo sighting! Great to hear. I hope all is well with you. I haven't seen you around for quite some time. I see you still have the Sessions avatar. :)

Thanks John! Everything is well! I wish the same for you, I look forward to hearing your thoughts about Copland's chamber music, I'll have to pull my copy out to hear again :)

Quote from: Catison on April 18, 2007, 01:47:27 PM
If you want to hear the original chamber version of the complete ballet, I would highly (highly!) recommend this disc by Hugh Wolff and the St. Paul Chamber Orchestra.

(http://www.arkivmusic.com/graphics/covers/full/41/411794.JPG)

The score is incredibly well recorded with all the detail you could ever want.  It is very delicate and tender, as I believe Copland intended it.  I listen to this version all the time, and it is one of my favorite recordings of anything.  Plus you get a second disc of songs.

I bought the original single-disc release (http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Music-Theater-Aaron/dp/B000000SD0) of the Wolff Appalachian Spring, and love it. So I'll second that vote.

(http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae102/peterpowerpop/Copland-AppalachianSpringWolff.jpg) (http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Music-Theater-Aaron/dp/B000000SD0)

I think I might also need to buy the companion disc (http://www.amazon.com/Copland-American-Songs-Dawn-Upshaw/dp/B000000SHU) that makes up the second part of that double-disc set (http://www.amazon.com/Appalachian-Spring-Quiet-City-Ultima/dp/B000026CPB).

American Songs, here we come!

(http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae102/peterpowerpop/Copland-AmericanSongsWolff.jpg) (http://www.amazon.com/Copland-American-Songs-Dawn-Upshaw/dp/B000000SHU)

I bought that Wolff set tonight and have heard nothing but great things about it.

Quote from: Leo K. on September 30, 2014, 04:11:04 PM
Thanks John! Everything is well! I wish the same for you, I look forward to hearing your thoughts about Copland's chamber music, I'll have to pull my copy out to hear again :)

Kudos, Leo. BTW, what some of your top 5 Copland works? And this question goes for every Copland fan here as well. I'll have to come back to this question as I'm still not familiar with his chamber output.

Quote from: Mirror Image on September 30, 2014, 05:50:48 PM
I bought that Wolff set tonight and have heard nothing but great things about it.

Excellent.

Quote from: Peter Power Pop on September 30, 2014, 06:24:00 PM
Excellent.

Interestingly enough, Hugh Wolff is featured in some commentary in the documentary Copland: A Fanfare For America. I need to pick this documentary up at some point, which in Mirror Image language it means right now! :)

Come on everybody! What are your Top 5 Copland works?

Even though I said I wasn't going to participate, I'll go ahead just for the sake of getting the ball rolling...

1. Appalachian Spring (love both arrangements)
2. Billy the Kid
3. Clarinet Concerto
4. Symphony No. 3
5. Dance Panels

*This list is always subject to change.

Sextet
Symphony № 3
Billy the Kid
Piano Fantasy
Connotations
Inscape

Quote from: karlhenning on October 01, 2014, 07:28:49 AM
Sextet
Symphony № 3
Billy the Kid
Piano Fantasy
Connotations
Inscape

Sweet, Karl! I can't wait to re-listen to Sextet as it's been years. Haven't heard Piano Fantasy unfortunately. :( Connotations and Inscape are two very good works indeed. I was just listening to them last night actually.

It seems Copland's Piano Concerto doesn't get much love around here as I think it should. Another work I really enjoy is Music For A Great City, which I listened to last night. It's been awhile since I had heard that work. Orchestral Variations is of course another favorite. I love how Copland could be downright confrontational in tone but always seem to maintain some kind of accessibility and, most of all, a purpose in direction.

Symphony 3
Symphonic Ode
Quiet City
Lincoln Portrait (OK, I know it verges on kitsch and the narration is full of non-sequiturs but it always moves me)
The Tender Land (Orchestral Suite)

Quote from: vandermolen on October 01, 2014, 08:42:32 AM
Symphony 3
Symphonic Ode
Quiet City
Lincoln Portrait (OK, I know it verges on kitsch and the narration is full of non-sequiturs but it always moves me)
The Tender Land (Orchestral Suite)

Bonus=Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 01, 2014, 07:24:42 AM
Come on everybody! What are your Top 5 Copland works?

Even though I said I wasn't going to participate, I'll go ahead just for the sake of getting the ball rolling...

1. Appalachian Spring (love both arrangements)
2. Billy the Kid
3. Clarinet Concerto
4. Symphony No. 3
5. Dance Panels

*This list is always subject to change.

For me:

1. Appalachian Spring (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appalachian_Spring) (any version)
http://www.youtube.com/v/rI4DkYyIoDE


2. Quiet City
http://www.youtube.com/v/s_MxTZlYL14


3. Three Piano Excerpts from Our Town (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Our_Town_(1940_film))
http://www.youtube.com/v/iJFOnhX5rwQ


4. An Outdoor Overture
http://www.youtube.com/v/6AhdFW6QWEM


5. The Red Pony (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Red_Pony_(Copland))
http://www.youtube.com/v/EHmWiWfg9zE


Honorary No. 5:

Clarinet Concerto (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarinet_Concerto_(Copland))
http://www.youtube.com/v/PmMFL1zZ-tU


Another honorary No. 5:

Lincoln Portrait (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincoln_Portrait)
http://www.youtube.com/v/Cs6cIi_mKfg

Off the top of my head!

Symphony No.3
Connotations
Rodeo
Red Pony
Lincoln Portrait

Quote from: vandermolen on October 01, 2014, 08:42:32 AM
Symphony 3
Symphonic Ode
Quiet City
Lincoln Portrait (OK, I know it verges on kitsch and the narration is full of non-sequiturs but it always moves me)
The Tender Land (Orchestral Suite)

Nice list, Jeffrey. I love The Tender Land Suite. Absolutely gorgeous. Symphonic Ode is also a great one.

Quote from: Peter Power Pop on October 01, 2014, 02:08:01 PM
For me:

1. Appalachian Spring (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appalachian_Spring) (any version)
http://www.youtube.com/v/rI4DkYyIoDE


2. Quiet City
http://www.youtube.com/v/s_MxTZlYL14


3. Three Piano Excerpts from Our Town (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Our_Town_(1940_film))
http://www.youtube.com/v/iJFOnhX5rwQ


4. An Outdoor Overture
http://www.youtube.com/v/6AhdFW6QWEM


5. The Red Pony (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Red_Pony_(Copland))
http://www.youtube.com/v/EHmWiWfg9zE


Honorary No. 5:

Clarinet Concerto (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarinet_Concerto_(Copland))
http://www.youtube.com/v/PmMFL1zZ-tU


Another honorary No. 5:

Lincoln Portrait (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincoln_Portrait)
http://www.youtube.com/v/Cs6cIi_mKfg

Very nice list indeed. Got to love the Clarinet Concerto.

Quote from: Leo K. on October 01, 2014, 04:12:07 PM
Off the top of my head!

Symphony No.3
Connotations
Rodeo
Red Pony
Lincoln Portrait

Man, this is the third vote for Lincoln Portrait. I've got to re-listen to this work. I usually don't care for works with some kind of spoken narration but we'll see how it goes. Love Rodeo and Red Pony.

This is what I like most (boring list I'm afraid):
Danzon Cubana
El Salon Mexico
Billy the Kid
Rodeo
Symphony No. 3

Quote from: mc ukrneal on October 01, 2014, 06:22:15 PM
This is what I like most (boring list I'm afraid):
Danzon Cubana
El Salon Mexico
Billy the Kid
Rodeo
Symphony No. 3

Nonsense, Neal! All great pieces. :)

Organ Symphony
Symphonic Ode
Other symphonies

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 01, 2014, 06:15:04 PM
Very nice list indeed. Got to love the Clarinet Concerto.

I wouldn't have minded the list being a top ten. Then I could sneak in a few more.

Quote from: Peter Power Pop on October 01, 2014, 08:20:12 PM
I wouldn't have minded the list being a top ten. Then I could sneak in a few more.

Well, I enjoy making it as difficult as possible for people. ;) :D

Piano Fantasy
Piano Variations
Piano Sonata
Piano Concerto
Pian Dance Symphony

Organ Symphony might be #6. I haven't listened to it in a while. I could then round out a top 10 with the Sextet, Piano Quartet, and possibly Statements or something.

Does anybody have a recording of William Masselos playing the Piano Variations?

Quote from: Ken B on October 01, 2014, 06:57:14 PM
Organ Symphony
Symphonic Ode
Other symphonies

I see that I "cheated" by listing six pieces.  I need to get to know the Organ Symphony better.

This disconnect brought to you by The Friends of snypsss . . . .

Quote from: amw on October 01, 2014, 09:10:37 PM
Piano Fantasy
Piano Variations
Piano Sonata
Piano Concerto
Pian Dance Symphony

Organ Symphony might be #6. I haven't listened to it in a while. I could then round out a top 10 with the Sextet, Piano Quartet, and possibly Statements or something.

Nice list!  No idea why I seem not to know the Pf Cto at all, at all . . . .

Quote from: karlhenning on October 02, 2014, 04:18:43 AM
Nice list!  No idea why I seem not to know the Pf Cto at all, at all . . . .

The Piano Concerto is a very cool work. Check out the Bernstein performance. It features none other than the composer himself at the piano. Great stuff.

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 02, 2014, 06:12:47 AM
The Piano Concerto is a very cool work. Check out the Bernstein performance. It features none other than the composer himself at the piano. Great stuff.

Fans of the Pno Cto should check out Lou Harrison's.

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 01, 2014, 06:13:51 PM
Nice list, Jeffrey. I love The Tender Land Suite. Absolutely gorgeous. Symphonic Ode is also a great one.

Thank you John.  :)

I also have a soft spot for Danzon Cubano and Old American Songs.

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 01, 2014, 06:26:08 PM
Nonsense, Neal! All great pieces. :)

I agree.

Quote from: Ken B on October 02, 2014, 06:46:21 AM
Fans of the Pno Cto should check out Lou Harrison's.

I like Harrison's Piano Concerto, but does it really have that much of a connection to Copland's?

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 02, 2014, 05:35:08 PM
I like Harrison's Piano Concerto, but does it really have that much of a connection to Copland's?

Only in being better.  :)

Quote from: Ken B on October 02, 2014, 05:50:47 PM
Only in being better.  :)

::)

Quote from: vandermolen on October 02, 2014, 12:01:49 PM
Thank you John.  :)

I also have a soft spot for Danzon Cubano and Old American Songs.

No problem, Jeffrey. :) I can't say that I've heard the Old American Songs but will remedy this soon. I really like Danzon Cubano of course. 8)

The piano concerto is fantastic, I also love Dance Panels and inscape :)

Quote from: Leo K. on October 02, 2014, 06:29:43 PM
The piano concerto is fantastic, I also love Dance Panels and inscape :)

Dance Panels is a highly underrated work I think. It was in my top five. I like Inscape a lot as well.

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 02, 2014, 05:35:08 PM
I like Harrison's Piano Concerto, but does it really have that much of a connection to Copland's?

Better still of course is Glass's piano concerto.

Quote from: Ken B on October 02, 2014, 09:22:15 PM
Better still of course is Glass's piano concerto.

It's not as good as Stockhausen's.

Received the Wolff/St. Paul Chamber Orchestra two-disc set on Teldec today. I'm really loving these performances so far. Listening to Appalachian Spring (Original Version) now and loving it. I love the intimacy of the original arrangement, but sometimes I'll get the hankering for that large orchestra sound and I'll opt for that arrangement. Anyway, it's a masterpiece any way you hear it.

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 04, 2014, 08:02:15 PM
Received the Wolff/St. Paul Chamber Orchestra two-disc set on Teldec today. I'm really loving these performances so far. Listening to Appalachian Spring (Original Version) now and loving it. I love the intimacy of the original arrangement, but sometimes I'll get the hankering for that large orchestra sound and I'll opt for that arrangement. Anyway, it's a masterpiece any way you hear it.

I agree, I like both versions but prefer the orch. arrangement :) I once went backstage to get Hugh Wolff's autograph - I'm a big fan of his! He is a nice guy. Aces!

Quote from: Leo K. on October 05, 2014, 08:46:26 AM
I agree, I like both versions but prefer the orch. arrangement :) I once went backstage to get Hugh Wolff's autograph - I'm a big fan of his! He is a nice guy. Aces!

Cool, Leo. 8) Sure, yeah, the orchestral arrangement packs a much larger wallop. If push comes to shove, I probably prefer it as well. It's a shame Hugh Wolff isn't more well-known than he is because all of the recording I own with his conducting have highly enjoyable.

Quote from: Mirror Image on October 05, 2014, 09:19:30 AM
Cool, Leo. 8) Sure, yeah, the orchestral arrangement packs a much larger wallop. If push comes to shove, I probably prefer it as well. It's a shame Hugh Wolff isn't more well-known than he is because all of the recording I own with his conducting have highly enjoyable.

Despite having seen Copland conduct the later arrangement I characteristically prefer the original.

John, do you wish Messiaen had arranged it for 500 with a quartet of Ondes Martinots?  >:D

Quote from: Ken B on October 05, 2014, 09:28:29 AM
Despite having seen Copland conduct the later arrangement I characteristically prefer the original.

John, do you wish Messiaen had arranged it for 500 with a quartet of Ondes Martinots?  >:D

Well, it's the music itself that's most important. Not the arrangement per se. I think we all can agree that Appalachian Spring is a gem. As for the Messiaen, how shall I put this? Ummm...HELL NO!!! ;D

So, what's the verdict on Copland's Organ Symphony? I have been enjoying this work more and more. It is one of those craggy works, like the Symphonic Ode, which appeals to me as representing a kind of synthesis between the more populist works (like Symphony 3, Billy the Kid, both of which I love) and the more abstract/modernist works ('Connotations' etc):
I have been greatly enjoying the CD below:
[asin]B000003FYL[/asin]

Quote from: vandermolen on December 22, 2014, 02:31:17 AM
So, what's the verdict on Copland's Organ Symphony? I have been enjoying this work more and more. It is one of those craggy works, like the Symphonic Ode, which appeals to me as representing a kind of synthesis between the more populist works (like Symphony 3, Billy the Kid, both of which I love) and the more abstract/modernist works ('Connotations' etc):
I have been greatly enjoying the CD below:
[asin]B000003FYL[/asin]

I love the Organ Symphony. My favorite performance, however, is the E. Power Biggs/Bernstein performance. It's quite thrilling.

Quote from: vandermolen on December 22, 2014, 02:31:17 AM
So, what's the verdict on Copland's Organ Symphony? I have been enjoying this work more and more. It is one of those craggy works, like the Symphonic Ode, which appeals to me as representing a kind of synthesis between the more populist works (like Symphony 3, Billy the Kid, both of which I love) and the more abstract/modernist works ('Connotations' etc):
I have been greatly enjoying the CD below:
[asin]B000003FYL[/asin]

Your "synthesis" idea is musically sound, though the chronology is somewhat otherwise . . . the Organ Symphony is from early on, before he explored his more "populist vein" — but of course, the "populist move" was not any volte-face, the elements were already there in his work.

I've not answered your question yet!  I do like the Organ Symphony very well  :)

Has anyone heard the MTT/SFSO performance of Organ Symphony? This one certainly shoots straight to the top as well.

Quote from: Mirror Image on December 22, 2014, 05:29:37 AM
I love the Organ Symphony. My favorite performance, however, is the E. Power Biggs/Bernstein performance. It's quite thrilling.

Oh yes, that is a great CD, with the Third Symphony too, although Bernstein's is not my favourite version of it. I prefer the later DGG release and, best of all in my view, Copland's LSO Everest version, despite its age.

Quote from: karlhenning on December 22, 2014, 06:50:04 AM
Your "synthesis" idea is musically sound, though the chronology is somewhat otherwise . . . the Organ Symphony is from early on, before he explored his more "populist vein" — but of course, the "populist move" was not any volte-face, the elements were already there in his work.

I've not answered your question yet!  I do like the Organ Symphony very well  :)

Thanks Karl.

Quote from: vandermolen on December 22, 2014, 10:58:53 AM
Oh yes, that is a great CD, with the Third Symphony too, although Bernstein's is not my favourite version of it. I prefer the later DGG release and, best of all in my view, Copland's LSO Everest version, despite its age.

I like both of Bernstein's performances of Copland's 3rd, but I'm quite partial to his first one. I also like Copland's later performance with the LSO on Columbia. What do you think about Dance Panels, Jeffrey? Are you familiar with this work? It doesn't get discussed much, but I think it's another feather in Copland's hat. He certainly excelled in ballet music.

Quote from: Mirror Image on December 22, 2014, 11:03:55 AM
I like both of Bernstein's performances of Copland's 3rd, but I'm quite partial to his first one. I also like Copland's later performance with the LSO on Columbia. What do you think about Dance Panels, Jeffrey? Are you familiar with this work? It doesn't get discussed much, but I think it's another feather in Copland's hat. He certainly excelled in ballet music.

Don't know it John but think its on a recent Naxos CD I purchased, so will get back to you on this.

Quote from: vandermolen on December 22, 2014, 11:31:07 AM
Don't know it John but think its on a recent Naxos CD I purchased, so will get back to you on this.

Cool, Jeffrey. It's certainly an enjoyable work.

My colleagues at work could not believe that the Organ symphony was written by a 23-year old composer. And the last movement (which builds up tension relentlesly) left them...speachless.  It is a great work that I'd love to hear in a concert hall.

I have both the classic Bernstein/Power Biggs and the MTT/San Francisco recordings + a BBC magazine recording (Wayne Marshall / BBC SO / Slatkin).

In France

(http://i.prs.to/t_200/solsticesocd198.jpg)

Jean Claude Casadesus also has performed the symphony with his Lille Orchestra . Copland conducted the symphony ( version without organ) with the French Nat. O.

I love the combination organ - orchestra. Frank Martin's Erasmi monumentum and Wallingford Riegger's Fantasy and Fugue are other favorites.

(https://www.dustygroove.com/images/products/r/rieggermcph_fantasyfu_101b.jpg)

Another work that I enjoyed discovering many years ago:

(http://www.apesound.de/out/pictures/generated/product/1/665_665_75/chaynes.jpg)

Quote from: pjme on December 25, 2014, 05:14:11 AM
My colleagues at work could not believe that the Organ symphony was written by a 23-year old composer. And the last movement (which builds up tension relentlesly) left them...speachless.  It is a great work that I'd love to hear in a concert hall.

I have both the classic Bernstein/Power Biggs and the MTT/San Francisco recordings + a BBC magazine recording (Wayne Marshall / BBC SO / Slatkin).

In France

(http://i.prs.to/t_200/solsticesocd198.jpg)

Jean Claude Casadesus also has performed the symphony with his Lille Orchestra . Copland conducted the symphony ( version without organ) with the French Nat. O.

I love the combination organ - orchestra. Frank Martin's Erasmi monumentum and Wallingford Riegger's Fantasy and Fugue are other favorites.

(https://www.dustygroove.com/images/products/r/rieggermcph_fantasyfu_101b.jpg)

Another work that I enjoyed discovering many years ago:

(http://www.apesound.de/out/pictures/generated/product/1/665_665_75/chaynes.jpg)

Thanks very much for this. I only know the Power-Biggs/Bernstein and RCA Slatkin version. Those other works by Frank Martin etc sound well worth exploring. Malcolm Williamson's Organ Concerto which I gave actually seen live, conducted by its dedicatee, Adrian Boult is also worth hearing; a powerful and cogent work.

Thanks Vandermolen for the reaction.

Just a little warning: Wallingford Riegger can be called a "Schoenbergian" and Charles Chaynes ( albeit not a Messiaen , nor a Boulez) writes mostly atonal music ( think of his colleagues André Jolivet, Jacques Castérède or Jacques Charpentier).

And (my mistake) it is Simon Preston who is at the organ in that 1996 performance ( Proms/Royal Albert Hall), not Wayne Marshall.

Peter

Quote from: pjme on December 25, 2014, 11:53:04 PM
Thanks Vandermolen for the reaction.

Just a little warning: Wallingford Riegger can be called a "Schoenbergian" and Charles Chaynes ( albeit not a Messiaen , nor a Boulez) writes mostly atonal music ( think of his colleagues André Jolivet, Jacques Castérède or Jacques Charpentier).

And (my mistake) it is Simon Preston who is at the organ in that 1996 performance ( Proms/Royal Albert Hall), not Wayne Marshall.

Peter

Many thanks Peter. I think that I have some Riegger in my collection. I do like some more 'challenging' music like the symphonies of Blomdahl, although they are more approachable than some! Jeffrey

I greatly enjoyed this new recording of Symphony 3 as well as the Piston work (The Incredible Flautist). I have read mixed reviews of the Performance of the Copland work but in my view it has great urgency and power and is one of the most exciting versions:
[asin]B00CZ9CN4A[/asin]

Quote from: vandermolen on March 08, 2015, 01:27:10 AM
I greatly enjoyed this new recording of Symphony 3 as well as the Piston work (The Incredible Flautist). I have read mixed reviews of the Performance of the Copland work but in my view it has great urgency and power and is one of the most exciting versions:
[asin]B00CZ9CN4A[/asin]

I'll look forward to hearing it. I've been pleased to see the Copland 3 getting more performances. His works should sound exciting...he's the Stravinsky of American music!

Quote from: Rons_talking on March 08, 2015, 03:58:56 PM
I'll look forward to hearing it. I've been pleased to see the Copland 3 getting more performances. His works should sound exciting...he's the Stravinsky of American music!

Yes, I agree. I have a number of interesting CDs performed by the excellent Oregon SO under the late James Du Priest including a fine version of the Korngold Symphony and Ronald Lo Presti's wonderful 'The Masks'.

Anyone know anything about this? No CD release as far as I can see:
http://filmscoreclicktrack.com/2010/01/cd-review-of-mice-and-men-our-town/

Just FYI - the Library of Congress recently put-up on their website a varied and interesting selection of material from their Aaron Copland Collection.  Well worth the visit :

http://www.loc.gov/collections/aaron-copland/

Quote from: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on October 07, 2015, 10:28:57 AM
Just FYI - the Library of Congress recently put-up on their website a varied and interesting selection of material from their Aaron Copland Collection.  Well worth the visit :

http://www.loc.gov/collections/aaron-copland/

What a great online resource! Not just the letters but also the photos. Thanks very much for the link. I have been looking at the correspondence to Carlos Chavez and Benjamin Britten and will enjoy looking at more material in due course.  :)

I've read many of these letters and have always been impressed with both the composer's humility as well as his interest in other composer's music. I spent one night reading the published letters to Bernstein. They were facinating to me and befitting of America's leading composer. He seemed to be welcome anywhere in the world!

Here is the sequence from last night's The Late Show with Stephen Colbert, with Gustavo Dudamel and members of the Los Angeles Philharmonic in Copland's Fanfare for the Common Man:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8jjhHmbmkU

--Bruce

Quote from: Rons_talking on October 09, 2015, 05:17:03 PM
befitting of America's leading composer

Whoa, Dobbin!  I admire a lot of his music, but that's quite a statement, what with Samuel Barber and a couple others out there!   ???

Quote from: Peter Power Pop on September 30, 2014, 05:31:37 PM
I bought the original single-disc release (http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Music-Theater-Aaron/dp/B000000SD0) of the Wolff Appalachian Spring, and love it. So I'll second that vote.

(http://i962.photobucket.com/albums/ae102/peterpowerpop/Copland-AppalachianSpringWolff.jpg) (http://www.amazon.com/Copland-Music-Theater-Aaron/dp/B000000SD0)

Interesting enough the earlier recording of Appalachian Spring also the chamber version with the St. Paul Chamber Orchestra conducted by Dennis Russel Davies:

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/A1p%2BhmkNJ%2BL._SX425_.jpg)

won grammophone chamber record of the year back in 1980 and is one of the earliest DDD recordings made. You can listen to it on youtube as it is one of the finest versions out there. Everything is right with the recording, close and intimate, tempo just right, rhythms are taut yet flexible and spendidly played and recorded. DRD must have this music in him innately as he also recorded again later with the equally impressive Orch of St. Lukes as someone already mentioned.

Anyway it is pretty much criminal that the St. Paul/DRD version is OOP.

A new BIS release contains the following:

Aaron Copland (1900-1990): Orchestral Works, Vol. 2

Symphony for Organ and Orchestra *
Symphonic Ode
Short Symphony (Symphony No. 2)
Orchestral Variations

Jonathan Scott (organ) *
BBC Philharmonic / John Wilson

Seems very promising!

Quote from: The new erato on July 30, 2016, 12:52:38 AM
A new BIS release contains the following:

Aaron Copland (1900-1990): Orchestral Works, Vol. 2

Symphony for Organ and Orchestra *
Symphonic Ode
Short Symphony (Symphony No. 2)
Orchestral Variations

Jonathan Scott (organ) *
BBC Philharmonic / John Wilson

Seems very promising!

Great news and thanks for posting. What an interesting release. I love the craggy Symphonic Ode and the Organ Symphony. More depleted financial resources.  ::)

At least with Brexit you will avoid VAT from Europe...... >:D

Quote from: The new erato on July 30, 2016, 12:52:38 AM
A new BIS release contains the following:

Aaron Copland (1900-1990): Orchestral Works, Vol. 2

Symphony for Organ and Orchestra *
Symphonic Ode
Short Symphony (Symphony No. 2)
Orchestral Variations

Jonathan Scott (organ) *
BBC Philharmonic / John Wilson

Seems very promising!

Wouldn't this be a Chandos release? Chandos released the first volume already.

[asin]B018HGUKSK[/asin]

Quote from: Mirror Image on July 30, 2016, 10:59:36 AM
Wouldn't this be a Chandos release? Chandos released the first volume already.

[asin]B018HGUKSK[/asin]

It might be a great recording but is there a point to this? The market is flooded with good Copland of every sort from major orchestras and chamber orchestras in the US and also the UK like the London SO. Is this suppose to compete with the new series from the Detroit Symphony Orchestra? You would think in this day and age of limited resources you won't see such a superfluous release.

Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on July 30, 2016, 02:07:08 PM
It might be a great recording but is there a point to this? The market is flooded with good Copland of every sort from major orchestras and chamber orchestras in the US and also the UK like the London SO. Is this suppose to compete with the new series from the Detroit Symphony Orchestra? You would think in this day and age of limited resources you won't see such a superfluous release.

First of all, it wasn't my intention to promote or even hint at my interest in this new Copland recording, because, honestly, I'm not interested in hearing or owning it nor am I particularly interested in anyone's opinion of this recording. Second, what's wrong with a label putting out another Copland recording? Labels dish out Beethoven and Mozart recordings by the truckloads, but Copland doesn't deserve the same kind of treatment? And, last, I only posted the recording above for erato's benefit with hopes to clear up some possible confusion. That is all.

Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on July 30, 2016, 02:07:08 PM
It might be a great recording but is there a point to this? The market is flooded with good Copland of every sort from major orchestras and chamber orchestras in the US and also the UK like the London SO. Is this suppose to compete with the new series from the Detroit Symphony Orchestra? You would think in this day and age of limited resources you won't see such a superfluous release.

They are counting on OCCDCD (or whatever it is).  If it was a Shostakovich release that was put out on shelf at ye local record shoppe a half-hour before opening, the store clerks would be nervously watching M.I. as he pushed against the mall-security-bars, waiting for them to rise at 10 a.m.  ....   ;D

Quote from: Scion7 on July 30, 2016, 07:53:48 PM
They are counting on OCCDCD (or whatever it is).  If it was a Shostakovich release that was put out on shelf at ye local record shoppe a half-hour before opening, the store clerks would be nervously watching M.I. as he pushed against the mall-security-bars, waiting for them to rise at 10 a.m.  ....   ;D

:P

Quote from: Mirror Image on July 30, 2016, 10:59:36 AM
Wouldn't this be a Chandos release? Chandos released the first volume already.

Yes, you're absolutely right.

Quote from: The new erato on July 30, 2016, 01:37:42 AM
At least with Brexit you will avoid VAT from Europe...... >:D

:)

I have to say upon listening to Bernstein's performance of Symphony No. 3 on DG, I have to concur with Jeffrey (Vandermolen) that this is the best recorded performance of this symphony I've heard. Far surpassing Bernstein's first go-around on Columbia (Sony). Slatkin's on RCA with the St. Louis SO is also quite good. I'd love to hear an Andrew Litton performance with the Colorado Symphony Orchestra as his performances of Billy the Kid, An Outdoor Overture, and Rodeo on BIS were top-notch. It would be nice to hear Tilson Thomas conduct this work as well with the San Francisco SO, especially on their house label.

I've got to say that hearing Copland conduct his own music on all of these classic Columbia recordings has been just outstanding. I'll also say he was quite a good conductor in his own right.

Copland Classics -

Billy the Kid (1938)

(http://img.huffingtonpost.com/asset/crop_646_123_921_856,scalefit_630_noupscale/561e10d11200002e007e50f3.jpeg)

It was ballet impresario Lincoln Kirstein who had the inspiration to bring together composer Aaron Copland and choreographer Eugene Loring to create a work based on the legend of Billy the Kid. Kirstein was particularly drawn to Walter Noble Burns' 1925 best-seller The Saga of Billy the Kid, a mix of lore, fantasy, and historical research. As related by Burns, Billy, a gambler, cattle rustler, and vigilante frontiersman, made his claim to fame in having killed a man for each of his 21 years. Loring devised a scenario which calls for four principals, along with "pioneers, men, women, Mexicans, and Indians." Much of the ballet's action, form, and mood reflects Burns' Saga, particularly the grotesque celebration which follows a central shoot-out scene.

Copland, having already composed works evocative of the American west and Mexico like El Salon Mexico (1933-1936) and Saga of the Prairies (1937), was well prepared for this "cowboy ballet." The composer provided period flavor by incorporating six cowboy tunes into the score: "Great Granddad," "Git Along Little Dogie," "The Old Chisholm Trail," "Goodbye, Old Paint," "The Dying Cowboy," and "Trouble for the Range Cook."

Copland's score provides a vivid sonic depiction of prairie life. An opening processional is distinguished by Copland's trademark widely spaced "open" harmonies in the woodwinds, followed by a bass figure centered on a syncopated two-note motive. This plodding bass moves dramatically from pianissimo to a triple-forte climax, suggesting the laborious trudging of the settlers. The music of the processional brings the ballet full circle with its reappearance as the coda. "Street in a Frontier Town" moves from pastoral innocence to mechanistic violence, incorporating several cowboy tunes along the way. The rest of Billy's story moves unfolds in short vignettes, including "Card Game at Night" (also known as "Prairie Night"), which draws upon the familiar image of the lone cowboy, including snatches of "The Dying Cowboy." "Gun Battle" is dominated by violent percussion, the sounds of gunfire represented by snare and bass drums. In "Celebration After Billy's Capture" Copland neatly transforms the trudging bass of the opening processional into a dissonant "oompah" figure that underpins a crude bitonal melody, while a waltz section transforms "Trouble for the Range Cook" into an ironic ditty with solos in the trombone and bassoon. "Billy's Death" is a solemn epilogue for strings, harp, and winds.

Billy the Kid was first performed by the Ballet Caravan in Chicago in a two-piano version on October 6, 1938. The familiar version for full orchestra was premiered in New York on May 24, 1939, to critical and popular raves. In 1940 Copland extracted a concert suite from the ballet, the form in which the music is today most frequently heard.

[Article taken from All Music Guide]

Here's an enjoyable video on Billy the Kid that breaks down the work and it's inspiration:

https://www.youtube.com/v/OrWdp6MjdT8

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What can I say? I LOVE Billy the Kid. It's one of my favorite pieces of music ever. One of the reasons I love it so much may have to do with sentimental reasons as I remember hearing an arrangement of this work on the Bill Frisell album Have A Little Faith where he actually rearranges several American classical works like Ives' The "St. Gaudens" in Boston Common from his Three Places in New England for example. Anyway, it was upon this initial listen that Copland's sound-world hit my eardrums. I was enthralled from beginning to end. Several years later, I actually heard the piece properly through Leonard Bernstein's performance, but this time I was just blown away. This is what I was supposed to be listening to all along not some jazz guitarist's arrangement! ;) But, I suppose you have to start somewhere, right? Bernstein's, Copland's, and Tilson Thomas' remain my go-to performances of this ballet, but Litton has a great one on BIS that's worth hearing. What do you guys think of this work and do you have any favorite performances or memories of the first-time you heard it?

Where are my fellow Coplandites? We need to keeping this thread going!

I listened to some of his choral music recently.

Quote from: Ken B on August 03, 2016, 02:53:34 PM
I listened to some of his choral music recently.

Like the choral version of Old American Songs and the Motets? I've heard Old American Songs for baritone and orchestra, but I haven't heard the choral version. The only recording I know of this version is MTT's on Sony. Anyway, what did you think? Upon finishing the Old American Songs the other night, I thought they were merely 'okay.' Nothing too special. 8 Poems of Emily Dickinson (arr. from 12 Poems of Emily Dickinson), however, was much more compelling and to my own taste.

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 01, 2016, 06:46:07 PM
I have to say upon listening to Bernstein's performance of Symphony No. 3 on DG, I have to concur with Jeffrey (Vandermolen) that this is the best recorded performance of this symphony I've heard. Far surpassing Bernstein's first go-around on Columbia (Sony). Slatkin's on RCA with the St. Louis SO is also quite good. I'd love to hear an Andrew Litton performance with the Colorado Symphony Orchestra as his performances of Billy the Kid, An Outdoor Overture, and Rodeo on BIS were top-notch. It would be nice to hear Tilson Thomas conduct this work as well with the San Francisco SO, especially on their house label.

I don't think that the Bernstein Sony recording was nearly as good as Copland's own first recording on Everest. Interesting that Copland recorded so much with British orchestras. I saw him conduct at the Proms once - a not-very-good performance of Roy Harris's Third Symphony. Paradoxically Bernstein on Sony is supreme in that fine work.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 04, 2016, 09:40:12 AM
I don't think that the Bernstein Sony recording was nearly as good as Copland's own first recording on Everest. Interesting that Copland recorded so much with British orchestras. I saw him conduct at the Proms once - a not-very-good performance of Roy Harris's Third Symphony. Paradoxically Bernstein on Sony is supreme in that fine work.

Please note that I'm talking about Bernstein's recording of the 3rd on DG, which gets my vote for the best I've heard so far.

By the way, Jeffrey, I agree with you about Symphonic Ode. What a piece. Totally awesome.

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 04, 2016, 12:24:51 PM
Please note that I'm talking about Bernstein's recording of the 3rd on DG, which gets my vote for the best I've heard so far.

Hi John - yes, I realised that - it is a truly great and very moving performance. I like the Slatkin too and was lucky enough to see him perform the work live at the London Proms some years ago.

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 04, 2016, 12:51:12 PM
By the way, Jeffrey, I agree with you about Symphonic Ode. What a piece. Totally awesome.

It is one of my favourites - a great craggy, monolithic score.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 04, 2016, 01:00:41 PM
It is one of my favourites - a great craggy, monolithic score.

It certainly is, but it also contains some gorgeous lyrical sections.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 04, 2016, 12:59:54 PMHi John - yes, I realised that - it is a truly great and very moving performance. I like the Slatkin too and was lucky enough to see him perform the work live at the London Proms some years ago.

Wow, I bet that was a great performance. Slatkin must be counted as one of America's great conductors. His willingness to perform and affection for music of his homeland and how he brings those qualities to European audiences is enough to commend him here, but, unfortunately, the US is too busy putting the latest pop star up on a pedestal and gearing up for a nasty election. Oh happy days are here again. ;D

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 04, 2016, 01:16:48 PM
It certainly is, but it also contains some gorgeous lyrical sections.

Wow, I bet that was a great performance. Slatkin must be counted as one of America's great conductors. His willingness to perform and affection for music of his homeland and how he brings those qualities to European audiences is enough to commend him here, but, unfortunately, the US is too busy putting the latest pop star up on a pedestal and gearing up for a nasty election. Oh happy days are here again. ;D

It certainly was a great performance John and his RCA recording is very fine too. I also like his recording of Bernstein's 'Jeremiah' Symphony on Chandos.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 04, 2016, 01:54:20 PM
It certainly was a great performance John and his RCA recording is very fine too. I also like his recording of Bernstein's 'Jeremiah' Symphony on Chandos.

Slatkin's got three great RCA recordings of Copland and, yep, they're very fine. I have his Jeremiah somewhere.

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 04, 2016, 02:04:21 PM
Slatkin's got three great RCA recordings of Copland and, yep, they're very fine. I have his Jeremiah somewhere.

Is one of those the film (movie) music? I love that disc.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 04, 2016, 02:34:02 PM
Is one of those the film (movie) music? I love that disc.

Yep, Music for Films. A great disc indeed. I especially love the seldom heard Prairie Journal, which never gets mentioned even amongst Copland fans.

Cross-posted from the 'Purchases' thread -

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 05, 2016, 11:41:47 AM
Just bought:

(http://resources.wimpmusic.com/images/60f62fe3/056e/4f25/a274/e36d5322b0b0/1280x1280.jpg)

I remember hearing Gould's Billy the Kid years ago (on LP I believe) and I remember being completely knocked out by the realism of the audio quality and just the brilliance of Gould's interpretation. I never heard a Billy the Kid that has affected me in the same way as Gould's. Okay, so Gould doesn't have the New York Philharmonic or Cleveland Orchestra as his disposal. So what! The playing is never less than committed and this performance has guts.

Does anyone feel the same I do about Gould's performances of Billy the Kid and Rodeo? It seems there something magical in these performances. I can't quite put my finger on it, but he managed to catch the energy and rawness of these ballets better than most IMHO.

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 05, 2016, 11:57:20 AM
Cross-posted from the 'Purchases' thread -

Does anyone feel the same I do about Gould's performances of Billy the Kid and Rodeo? It seems there something magical in these performances. I can't quite put my finger on it, but he managed to catch the energy and rawness of these ballets better than most IMHO.

I don't have that CD but I just bought the Morton Gould Chicago SO boxed set which is great. My first Vaughan Williams LP c.1971/72 was Morton Gould and His Orchestra conducting the Tallis Fantasia and English Folksong Suite. I have never seen it on CD.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 05, 2016, 12:30:07 PM
I don't have that CD but I just bought the Morton Gould Chicago SO boxed set which is great. My first Vaughan Williams LP c.1971/72 was Morton Gould and His Orchestra conducting the Tallis Fantasia and English Folksong Suite. I have never seen it on CD.

Very nice, Jeffrey. Gould was an excellent conductor. You may have to add this Copland recording to your collection. It's THAT good. 8)

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 05, 2016, 01:47:31 PM
Very nice, Jeffrey. Gould was an excellent conductor. You may have to add this Copland recording to your collection. It's THAT good. 8)

Yes, I can see that John! I like your Copland quote too.
:)

Quote from: vandermolen on August 05, 2016, 03:02:11 PM
Yes, I can see that John! I like your Copland quote too.
:)

Thanks, Jeffrey. 8)

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 02, 2016, 11:14:17 AM
I've got to say that hearing Copland conduct his own music on all of these classic Columbia recordings has been just outstanding. I'll also say he was quite a good conductor in his own right.

I agree. I grew up listening to Copland Conducts Copland on Columbia with the  London Symphony performing Ap Spring (I'm not even going to try to spell it), the Lincoln Portrait (w/Henry Fonda) and the Fanfare. I may be biased but Copland's recordings really bring out the warmth and soul of the music. I don't know whether or not he conducted other composer's music but I seem to recall his working with Carlos Chavez; they were good friends. Two late works I really like are Dance Panels and the Nonet for Strings.

Quote from: Rons_talking on August 06, 2016, 05:39:31 AM
I agree. I grew up listening to Copland Conducts Copland on Columbia with the  London Symphony performing Ap Spring (I'm not even going to try to spell it), the Lincoln Portrait (w/Henry Fonda) and the Fanfare. I may be biased but Copland's recordings really bring out the warmth and soul of the music. I don't know whether or not he conducted other composer's music but I seem to recall his working with Carlos Chavez; they were good friends. Two late works I really like are Dance Panels and the Nonet for Strings.

Copland is of course the way to go when hearing his own music, but, thankfully, his own performances aren't the final word on the subject. There are many fine Copland conductors: Bernstein, Tilson Thomas, Dennis Russell Davies, Slatkin, Gould (!!!), and the Naxos series of Copland had some good conductors that were showcased that seem to understand his musical vernacular (Alsop, Falletta, Judd, etc.).

I LOVE Dance Panels, too. What an underrated work. Speaking of late Copland, I also love Music for a Great City. I'm less crazy about works like Connotations and Inscape, but will freely admit that they have an unrelenting power to them that I find quite impressive.

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 06, 2016, 05:47:44 AM
Copland is of course the way to go when hearing his own music, but, thankfully, his own performances aren't the final word on the subject. There are many fine Copland conductors: Bernstein, Tilson Thomas, Dennis Russell Davies, Slatkin, Gould (!!!), and the Naxos series of Copland had some good conductors that were showcased that seem to understand his musical vernacular (Alsop, Falletta, Judd, etc.).

I LOVE Dance Panels, too. What an underrated work. Speaking of late Copland, I also love Music for a Great City. I'm less crazy about works like Connotations and Inscape, but will freely admit that they have an unrelenting power to them that I find quite impressive.

I agree about Copland conducts Copland. I really liked his movingly restrained second recording of his Third Symphony.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 06, 2016, 06:57:30 AM
I agree about Copland conducts Copland. I really liked his movingly restrained second recording of his Third Symphony.

I'll have to revisit that one tonight. Thanks for the reminder, Jeffrey. 8)

I have been listening to Ormandy's full orchestral version of Appalachian Spring here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNHWcHEMy-Q (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNHWcHEMy-Q)

What stunning virtuosity by the Fabulous Philadelphians

Does anyone know whether there is a CD incarnation of this?

Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on August 08, 2016, 12:08:22 PM
I have been listening to Ormandy's full orchestral version of Appalachian Spring here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNHWcHEMy-Q (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNHWcHEMy-Q)

What stunning virtuosity by the Fabulous Philadelphians

Does anyone know whether there is a CD incarnation of this?

Maybe this recording?

[asin]B00001R3MR[/asin]

Edit: Sorry, I see the YT video you posted was Ormandy from 1955 whereas the recording I linked above is from 1969.

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 08, 2016, 02:17:50 PM
Maybe this recording?

[asin]B00001R3MR[/asin]

Edit: Sorry, I see the YT video you posted was Ormandy from 1955 whereas the recording I linked above is from 1969.

The timings do not match either...The Youtube is the full version over 30 minutes while the CD at 25 or so is just the suite. The Youtube version is conducted incredibly fast as most full ballet versions last 34-35minutes. I would think the dancers would have a hard time if that is actually the tempo.

Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on August 08, 2016, 02:56:20 PM
The timings do not match either...The Youtube is the full version over 30 minutes while the CD at 25 or so is just the suite. The Youtube version is conducted incredibly fast as most full ballet versions last 34-35minutes. I would think the dancers would have a hard time if that is actually the tempo.

Imagine trying to dance to Bernstein's NY Phil. performance of Stravinsky's Le sacre du printemps. Choreographer to ballet dancers "Okay...that's one....two...three...one...two....three....ah that's it! Go home everyone! This is pointless!" ;D

This is a completely sensational disc! It contains nearly all my favourite lesser-known Copland orchestral scores in incredibly vivid recordings and in great performances by John Wilson. I played the CD right through and then had to repeat the experience. I already loved the craggy Symphonic Ode and Organ Symphony and I have never heard a better performance of the former, much as I have a soft spot for the old Bernstein/E.Power Biggs Sony recording. The revelation to me is the Orchestral Variations and Second ('Short') Symphony. These works suddenly came alive for me. Altogether a wonderful CD which no Copland admirer should be without:
[asin]B01HSFG6DO[/asin]

A bump for his 116th Birthday. On PBS, I saw his 80th B-day concert. He narrated the "Lincoln Portrait"...it was awesome!

Quote from: Rons_talking on November 15, 2016, 04:30:07 AM
A bump for his 116th Birthday. On PBS, I saw his 80th B-day concert. He narrated the "Lincoln Portrait"...it was awesome!

Excellent!

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 15, 2016, 04:35:30 AM
Excellent!

+1  :)

Quote from: Rons_talking on November 15, 2016, 04:30:07 AM
A bump for his 116th Birthday. On PBS, I saw his 80th B-day concert. He narrated the "Lincoln Portrait"...it was awesome!

Ok, so who is the best narrator of Lincoln Portrait?

One of the few questions I was able to get right on 'Brain of Britain' on the radio the other day was to identify the narrator of 'Lincoln Portrait' (Gregory Peck). The contestant mistakenly identified the voice as that of Charlton Heston (who also narrated Lincoln Portrait). My favourite is the Adlai Stevenson narration with Eugene Ormandy conducting. I may be influenced as it was my first discovery of the piece on LP. It was a great old CBS LP as 'Three Places in New England' by Charles Ives was on the other side of the LP and a fine photo of the Lincoln Memorial was on the front of the LP. I have no desire to hear the version narrated by Margaret Thatcher which might put me off the work for ever. I like the Koussevitsky version narrated by Melvyn Douglas. Any favourites?

Music for A Great City

This is quite nicely sandwiched between 'Connotations' and 'Inscape' as the "3rd" work of High Modernism by Copland. Of course, it's "Abstraction" is wholly beholden to a programme, but, I believe we hear here what happens when the subjective becomes objective- postWWII, modern, skyscapers, jets, computers, space- the music for 'Great City' is so... so... "modern" that it is Modernity itself that is being written about, perhaps not necessarily NYC, though, of course, it is.

For some reason, the music sounds like a sequel to Shostakovich's 1st Symphony? Black, stark... 60s vs 20s... mmm...

Quote from: snyprrr on February 04, 2017, 04:06:23 PM
Music for A Great City

This is quite nicely sandwiched between 'Connotations' and 'Inscape' as the "3rd" work of High Modernism by Copland. Of course, it's "Abstraction" is wholly beholden to a programme, but, I believe we hear here what happens when the subjective becomes objective- postWWII, modern, skyscapers, jets, computers, space- the music for 'Great City' is so... so... "modern" that it is Modernity itself that is being written about, perhaps not necessarily NYC, though, of course, it is.

For some reason, the music sounds like a sequel to Shostakovich's 1st Symphony? Black, stark... 60s vs 20s... mmm...

The movement Night Thoughts from this work is absolutely sublime.

Quote from: snyprrr on February 04, 2017, 04:06:23 PM
Music for A Great City

This is quite nicely sandwiched between 'Connotations' and 'Inscape' as the "3rd" work of High Modernism by Copland. Of course, it's "Abstraction" is wholly beholden to a programme, but, I believe we hear here what happens when the subjective becomes objective- postWWII, modern, skyscapers, jets, computers, space- the music for 'Great City' is so... so... "modern" that it is Modernity itself that is being written about, perhaps not necessarily NYC, though, of course, it is.

For some reason, the music sounds like a sequel to Shostakovich's 1st Symphony? Black, stark... 60s vs 20s... mmm...

That's a nice description of the work. I've only heard these movements a few times. A bit rugged at times, but there is still the lyricism, rhythm and colour of AC not far from the surface. I now can truly enjoy Copland's "modern" works of the 50s-60s. Music for a Great City seems to have the urgency of the modern era yet is true to the composer. From time to time Copland uses jazzy scoring that renders a 1920s vibe. Those were his formative years but the music sounds little like his 1920s efforts. I'm going to have to revisit his other late works. I used to think Connotations and Inscape were so wild but now I hear the master's voice through the modernism.

Quote from: Rons_talking on February 09, 2017, 11:49:27 AM
That's a nice description of the work. I've only heard these movements a few times. A bit rugged at times, but there is still the lyricism, rhythm and colour of AC not far from the surface. I now can truly enjoy Copland's "modern" works of the 50s-60s. Music for a Great City seems to have the urgency of the modern era yet is true to the composer. From time to time Copland uses jazzy scoring that renders a 1920s vibe. Those were his formative years but the music sounds little like his 1920s efforts. I'm going to have to revisit his other late works. I used to think Connotations and Inscape were so wild but now I hear the master's voice through the modernism.

And they all only sound right on SONY performances.

Don't dare listen to the other recordings of 'Inscape'!

Quote from: snyprrr on February 09, 2017, 03:21:51 PM
And they all only sound right on SONY performances.

Don't dare listen to the other recordings of 'Inscape'!

You are a reliable hoot!

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Heads-up, Coplandites!

Quote from: Mirror Image on February 12, 2017, 07:32:19 PM
Just bought:

(http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_1080/MI0000/960/MI0000960812.jpg?partner=allrovi.com)

Hopefully, this will be my last purchase for quite some time as The Tender Land is an opera I've had my eyes on for years and felt it to be a hole in my Copland collection since I'm really admirer of the orchestral suite from it.

Anyone here a fan of Copland's The Tender Land? I remember hearing bits and pieces from it via YT years ago and being thoroughly enchanted by it. Some gorgeous music herein if his orchestral suite is any indication.

The Tender Land, Opera in Three Acts

(http://topalski.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Wheat-Field.jpg)

Though he essayed any number of musical genres with remarkable results -- chamber music, symphonies, ballets -- Aaron Copland only rarely ventured into the realm of opera in the 50-plus years of his compositional career. Copland's first such foray, the rarely heard "school opera" The Second Hurricane (1936), is of relatively little musical interest. It wasn't until the 1950s, in fact, that Copland made his first and only important contribution to the repertory with his two-act opera (revised from three acts) The Tender Land, completed in 1954.

One of the last works Copland wrote wholly in his characteristically lyrical "American" style (epitomized by works from the previous decade like Appalachian Spring and the Symphony No. 3), The Tender Land dramatizes a story that is well complemented by the spaciousness and elegant simplicity of Copland's music. Inspired by photographs in James Agee and Walker Evans' timeless account of Depression-era America, Let Us Now Praise Famous Men, Copland and librettist Horace Everett fashioned a drama centered around a farm girl on the verge of womanhood. On the eve of her graduation from high school, Laurie Moss is faced with life-defining choices regarding love, family ties, and independence. The theme of outsiders -- groundlessly accused of wrongdoing -- invading the peaceful world of rural America mirrors certain contemporaneous social concerns, not the least of which was the witch hunt for Communists under the direction of Senator Joseph McCarthy. Copland himself had been called to testify at the notorious congressional hearings.

The Tender Land underwent much revision both before and after its initial production at the New York City Opera on April 1, 1954. Though the work has never attained the popularity of other American operas of the same period like Douglas Moore's The Ballad of Baby Doe (1956) or Carlisle Floyd's Susannah (1955), it enjoyed something of a renaissance in the 1990s with numerous productions and the first-ever recording of the entire work.

[Article taken from All Music Guide]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Since this Copland work seems to get very little attention (for whatever reason), I decided it might be high-time it received it's own little sub-section. :) I haven't heard the opera in it's entirety, but plan to very soon.

Quote from: Mirror Image on February 12, 2017, 07:41:08 PM
Heads-up, Coplandites!

Anyone here a fan of Copland's The Tender Land? I remember hearing bits and pieces from it via YT years ago and being thoroughly enchanted by it. Some gorgeous music herein if his orchestral suite is any indication.

I don't know the opera although I may well have a CD of it  ::)
The Suite is wonderful.

Quote from: vandermolen on February 13, 2017, 01:00:35 AM
I don't know the opera although I may well have a CD of it  ::)
The Suite is wonderful.

I love that suite from The Tender Land as well. Even if I didn't know the music's subject matter or if it had a different title altogether, the music would still bring to mind a wide-open landscape where you can see rolling hills and pastures for miles and miles.

For those interested, this is a great documentary on Copland:

https://www.youtube.com/v/9WDYa8T83A4

Looks like a wonderful documentary having just watched the opening section with Copland and the young musicians. He comes across as a very endearing character. Thanks for posting this.

Quote from: vandermolen on February 13, 2017, 01:45:47 PM
Looks like a wonderful documentary having just watched the opening section with Copland and the young musicians. He comes across as a very endearing character. Thanks for posting this.

I hope you enjoy it, Jeffrey. I've always had tremendous respect for Copland not only as a composer of incredible music, but as the person he came across as being. Affable is an adjective that Bernstein used to describe what it was like meeting Copland for the first-time, but as you mentioned he was quite endearing, but also thoughtful, perspicuous, confident (not in an egotistical way of course), and displayed a certain humility to throw in some more adjectives. :)

For those interested, here's a list of Copland's oeuvre:

http://www.coplandhouse.org/aaron-copland/list-of-works/

Connotations

I was just comparing the SONY and DG. The former is still the reigning champion, and with its vintage sound, really has that Ruggles feel to it. The latter, though derided as was much late Bernstein, came off today as crisp and clear in its pristine DG sound. It certainly didn't have the frisson of the SONY, but I heard it in a more modern light.

The word "stentorian" has universally been used to describe this hectoring, clanging mass of sizzling dissonances. It certainly does lurch forward, like some monstrous unified being, though not quite in the Xenakis mold. Still, the music defies melodies and just keeps going and going. It really does sound like the spirit of Ruggles in the blazing colors of sunlight.

Quote from: Rons_talking on February 09, 2017, 11:49:27 AM
That's a nice description of the work. I've only heard these movements a few times. A bit rugged at times, but there is still the lyricism, rhythm and colour of AC not far from the surface. I now can truly enjoy Copland's "modern" works of the 50s-60s. Music for a Great City seems to have the urgency of the modern era yet is true to the composer. From time to time Copland uses jazzy scoring that renders a 1920s vibe. Those were his formative years but the music sounds little like his 1920s efforts. I'm going to have to revisit his other late works. I used to think Connotations and Inscape were so wild but now I hear the master's voice through the modernism.

I only found the Slatkin and Copland recordings of this work. Any others?

Sounds a little like Ruggles though, no wonder conductors avoid it like the plague.

https://www.youtube.com/v/CkQ_C40hCSQ

Sixten Ehrling

https://www.youtube.com/v/3PDMKV2pdxk

Leon Botstein

Music for a great city? Afaik: no other recordings....

Copland recorded the work in London a little more than two weeks after the premiere, as part of his comprehensive series of recordings of his own music for American Columbia (today's Sony Classical), and twenty-five years later Leonard Slatkin recorded it with the Saint Louis Symphony Orchestra for RCA Victor (today the partner of its longtime rival in constituting SonyBMG), but there have been very few other performances.
see: https://www.kennedy-center.org/artist/composition/4099

This is apparently Copland with the Boston So in 1965: https://youtu.be/CfJx-gScGPs



P.

New release:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Copland-Symphony-American-Sketches-Orchestra/dp/B071YCY3WL/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1496755194&sr=1-1&keywords=Copland+Naxos

Aha! My website blocking software in operation. I clicked on the link........temptation averted!! ??? :( ;D

Quote from: cilgwyn on June 06, 2017, 06:33:21 AM
Aha! My website blocking software in operation. I clicked on the link........temptation averted!! ??? :( ;D

You have more will power that I do!  8)

No willpower.......just clever software,I fear!! :(  The password is in the attic. There's some asbestos up there,somewhere (it has it's uses) and it's niffy for some reason (a dead bat or bird?). I haven't bought a cd or dvd for over a week!!!!!! :( :( :( A dislike of ladders,heights and having to put on that dust mask helps!!

PS: Don't tell your wife or she might install it on your pc!!

I stocked up with a lot of Copland cd's a few months ago,having been shocked,looking through the thread here,at how little Copland I really knew,besides the more obvious works. Amongst some other cds,I bought this one. I noticed some grumbling on Amazon about Sony filling up the final two cds in the box with piano music. They may be right? But for the price it seemed very good value so I bought it. Also,not knowing any of his piano music,I thought it might be interesting to hear a less familiar aspect of his output. Which reminds to have a proper listen to it. Perhaps next? It will be a bit different after Rutland Boughton's Bethlehem.........in June!! ::) ;D

(http://i.imgur.com/Gcgm0z0.jpg)  (http://i.imgur.com/ExjMJxW.jpg)

Amongst other works I added to my collection and heard for the first time:

Dance Panels
Music for the theatre
Music for Movies
Quiet City
Our Town
Lincoln Portrait
Eight Poems of Emily Dickinson
Old American Songs

And I thought I knew Copland's music!!! :-[ ;D

I quite like the piano discs with Leo Smit in that box. Big modernist works such as the Variations and Fantasy, but plenty in the populist style, too.

Quote from: cilgwyn on June 06, 2017, 07:32:12 AM
No willpower.......just clever software,I fear!! :(  The password is in the attic. There's some asbestos up there,somewhere (it has it's uses) and it's niffy for some reason (a dead bat or bird?). I haven't bought a cd or dvd for over a week!!!!!! :( :( :( A dislike of ladders,heights and having to put on that dust mask helps!!

PS: Don't tell your wife or she might install it on your pc!!

I stocked up with a lot of Copland cd's a few months ago,having been shocked,looking through the thread here,at how little Copland I really knew,besides the more obvious works. Amongst some other cds,I bought this one. I noticed some grumbling on Amazon about Sony filling up the final two cds in the box with piano music. They may be right? But for the price it seemed very good value so I bought it. Also,not knowing any of his piano music,I thought it might be interesting to hear a less familiar aspect of his output. Which reminds to have a proper listen to it. Perhaps next? It will be a bit different after Rutland Boughton's Bethlehem.........in June!! ::) ;D

(http://i.imgur.com/Gcgm0z0.jpg)  (http://i.imgur.com/ExjMJxW.jpg)

Amongst other works I added to my collection and heard for the first time:

Dance Panels
Music for the theatre
Music for Movies
Quiet City
Our Town
Lincoln Portrait
Eight Poems of Emily Dickinson
Old American Songs

And I thought I knew Copland's music!!! :-[ ;D

I have that boxed set too ( ::)). I like Copland's self-effacing performance of Symphony 3 with the New Philharmonia Orch. (I think). The LP had a great cover image I recall. My one objection to these cheapo Sony boxes is the complete lack of booklet notes - even Brilliant provide them in their boxed sets. I like the Lincoln Portrait. It is, to some extent, a piece of kitsch complete with a narration full of non-sequiturs 'Abe Lincoln was six feet tall and this is what he said.....' I still love it and have versions with probably at least  ten different narrators (I resisted the ones narrated by Margaret Thatcher and Norman Schwarzkopf). Other favourites include Danzon Cubanon a wonderfully in spiriting and catchy work and the poetic Quiet City.

Here's a Copland choral piece I've grown quite fond of:

https://youtu.be/Tovh5FpwAho (https://youtu.be/Tovh5FpwAho)

Quote from: millionrainbows on June 06, 2017, 10:48:02 AM
Here's a Copland choral piece I've grown quite fond of:

https://youtu.be/Tovh5FpwAho (https://youtu.be/Tovh5FpwAho)

I've never heard this one before. Jazzy rhythms from the 30s.

Was delighted to hear the Lincoln Portrait live at the Proms in London last night. It's first performance at the Proms sine the original one in 1943! (Adrian Boult/Burgess Meredith narrator). Last night it was the excellent Cincinnati Symphony Orchestror conducted by Louis Langree. The narrator was Charles Dance the British actor. He delivered the lines very eloquently and with great passion. The only thing I didn't like was the fact that he adopted a sort-of American accent. I felt it would have been better had he used his normal voice or, maybe better still, they had used an American narrator. Still, it was a great experience to hear it live.

The Short Symphony is growing on me. This disc also has the smaller, original version of Appalachian Spring.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/A1p%2BhmkNJ%2BL._SX425_.jpg)

https://youtu.be/ok8oR51Y6Wg (https://youtu.be/ok8oR51Y6Wg)

Just listened to Statements for Orchestra for the first time (LSO/Copland). Really enjoyable listen, with Copland's orchestral mastery very much in evidence. Also, the ending with that quiet tam-tam strike was an unexpected touch.

Quote from: Maestro267 on August 29, 2017, 11:04:27 AM
Just listened to Statements for Orchestra for the first time (LSO/Copland). Really enjoyable listen, with Copland's orchestral mastery very much in evidence. Also, the ending with that quiet tam-tam strike was an unexpected touch.

That's a great work (the best I can remember). I believe this was from Copland's early Modernist period, correct?

Quote from: millionrainbows on August 29, 2017, 08:48:48 AM
The Short Symphony is growing on me. This disc also has the smaller, original version of Appalachian Spring.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/A1p%2BhmkNJ%2BL._SX425_.jpg)

https://youtu.be/ok8oR51Y6Wg (https://youtu.be/ok8oR51Y6Wg)

A great disc. Dennis Russell Davies' performance of all of those works is quite good. I think I may prefer Hugh Wolff's performance (w/ the St. Paul Chamber Orch. on Teldec) a bit more for the original version of Appalachian Spring, though.

Quote from: Mirror Image on August 31, 2017, 05:50:27 PM
That's a great work (the best I can remember). I believe this was from Copland's early Modernist period, correct?

I believe so, yes. It was on a two-disc set containing early works, including all the symphonies apart from No. 3 (ie. Short, Dance and Organ), the Piano Concerto, and a couple of shorter works too.

Quote from: Maestro267 on September 01, 2017, 12:23:06 AM
I believe so, yes. It was on a two-disc set containing early works, including all the symphonies apart from No. 3 (ie. Short, Dance and Organ), the Piano Concerto, and a couple of shorter works too.

Ah, okay. I, too, have that set (a Sony compilation).

(https://img.discogs.com/r_G_C6Dyux_RQ7Mq7DFXgFZB0m4=/fit-in/600x510/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-3221688-1321106850.jpeg.jpg)

I used to show my students studying American History a really good video entitled 'Brother, can you spare a dime?' About the depression of the 1930s and FDR. There was no commentary as such and it was a kind of collage of news film, movie clips and music. For years I wanted to know what the very powerful and memorable opening music was and then, one day, luckily, when I was listening to the radio I heard it broadcast. It was the third movement 'Dogmatic' - the shortest of the movements of Copland's 'Statements for Orchestra' - I was so pleased to suddenly know where it came from. I had a similar experience with a BBC School's History programme - years later I realised the music came from the opening of Britten's Violin Concerto.
Listening to 'Statements' now - on an old Everest CD with Antheil's 4th Symphony. Copland conducting the LSO in 'Statements' - he often recorded with British orchestras.

Cross-posted from the 'Purchases' thread:

Quote from: Mirror Image on December 10, 2017, 08:37:04 PM
Being a huge Copland fan, I couldn't let these slip past me any longer:

(https://www.chandos.net/artwork/NA9844.jpg) (https://d27t0qkxhe4r68.cloudfront.net/t_900/636943980620.jpg?1511173378)

(https://d27t0qkxhe4r68.cloudfront.net/t_900/636943975824.jpg?1401982553)

Of particular interest is the ballet Hear Ye! Hear Ye!, which I'll have to read up on, but it's apparently about a court trial (?). Utterly fascinating, not because of the story itself, but because only Copland would compose something like this.

Has anyone here heard these Slatkin recordings? The reviews are excellent and Symphony No. 3 is given a 'definitive' performance since it's Copland's original score performed here for the first-time.

Quote from: Mirror Image on December 11, 2017, 06:09:58 AM
Cross-posted from the 'Purchases' thread:

Has anyone here heard these Slatkin recordings? The reviews are excellent and Symphony No. 3 is given a 'definitive' performance since it's Copland's original score performed here for the first-time.

I have the two white covered albums but haven't heard Symphony 3 yet - will try to listen in the next 24 hours. I love Danzon Cubano and enjoyed the 'Rodeo' album. I also have the highest opinion of Slatkin's RCA recording of Copland's Third Symphony and saw him conduct a wonderful performance of it at the London Proms some years ago.

Quote from: vandermolen on December 11, 2017, 09:33:17 AM
I have the two white covered albums but haven't heard Symphony 3 yet - will try to listen in the next 24 hours. I love Danzon Cubano and enjoyed the 'Rodeo' album. I also have the highest opinion of Slatkin's RCA recording of Copland's Third Symphony and saw him conduct a wonderful performance of it at the London Proms some years ago.

Excellent, Jeffrey. I heard Slatkin outdoes himself or, at least, the MusicWeb reviewer, Dan Morgan (?), mentioned this. I wonder if you've heard the ballet Hear Ye! Hear Ye! before? It's suppose to be quite a raucous work filled with jazz-isms and a roaring 20s type of vibe. Can't wait to hear it. I have the Knussen performance of it and thought it was decent, but I believe Slatkin will deliver the goods more than Knussen.

These two releases look interesting, but what's held me back from buying them, and rightfully so, is the fact that conductor John Wilson uses the BBC Philharmonic, which is an orchestra I've never been crazy about.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81XFe03qTkL._SL1398_.jpg) (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81NMCZbzzuL._SL1461_.jpg)

One of my main motives for buying the Slatkin Naxos releases is this conductor has had a long-standing affection for Copland's music and, of course, being a praised interpreter of his music, so this attraction and my own curiosity in hearing him in newer performances are reasons as to why I bought the new Slatkin recordings.

Quote from: Mirror Image on December 11, 2017, 11:12:18 AM
These two releases look interesting, but what's held me back from buying them, and rightfully so, is the fact that conductor John Wilson uses the BBC Philharmonic, which is an orchestra I've never been crazy about.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81XFe03qTkL._SL1398_.jpg) (https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81NMCZbzzuL._SL1461_.jpg)

One of my main motives for buying the Slatkin Naxos releases is this conductor has had a long-standing affection for Copland's music and, of course, being a praised interpreter of his music, so this attraction and my own curiosity in hearing him in newer performances are reasons as to why I bought the new Slatkin recordings.

You are being too picky.  These are on spotify so I checked them out and found them very solid.   

Quote from: relm1 on December 11, 2017, 04:23:35 PM
You are being too picky.  These are on spotify so I checked them out and found them very solid.

Nah, I don't believe I'm being picky at all, just being honest about how I feel about this orchestra in general.

The Symphonic Ode is one of my favourite Copland works - just the sort of craggy, monolithic score that I like. I enjoyed the Chandos CD. The other more populist one was in a sale in a local music shop so I bought it for my daughter but haven't listened to it.

Quote from: vandermolen on December 11, 2017, 11:45:51 PM
The Symphonic Ode is one of my favourite Copland works - just the sort of craggy, monolithic score that I like.

Indeed, I think it a stronger (or, in some cases, an even stronger) orchestral work than the symphonies per se.

I finally got round to hearing Slatkin's new (Naxos) recording of Symphony 3 with the Detroit SO. John (MI) is right - it is a sensational performance in all respects - the best I have heard. In eschewing the heart-on-sleeve characteristics of Bernstein's CBS/Sony version, which I never liked, his version reminds me more of Copland's own Everest recording with the LSO which had a revelatory impact on my teenage self when I was discovering classical music (my older brother had the LP). The new Slatkin is, of course, much better recorded and has a depth and sense of inevitability which had me gripped from beginning to end. Talking of which the symphony has a DIFFERENT ENDING  :o ??? :). Apparently, according to Leonard Slatkin's note in the booklet Copland made some cuts after a discussion with Leonard Bernstein. Here the original ending is restored. It was very weird to hear a work with which I am so familiar ending unusually. I had to play the 'new' ending three times to get my head round it and I like the original ending very much. I can't say that it is 'better' that the more familiar version but it was so exciting to hear it. As with the 1913 or 1920 version of Vaughan Williams's 'London Symphony' (with much more extensive cuts than the Copland) I suspect that it is this version that I will be returning to.

Quote from: vandermolen on January 14, 2018, 01:58:25 PM
I finally got round to hearing Slatkin's new (Naxos) recording of Symphony 3 with the Detroit SO. John (MI) is right - it is a sensational performance in all respects - the best I have heard. In eschewing the heart-on-sleeve characteristics of Bernstein's CBS/Sony version, which I never liked, his version reminds me more of Copland's own Everest recording with the LSO which had a revelatory impact on my teenage self when I was discovering classical music (my older brother had the LP). The new Slatkin is, of course, much better recorded and has a depth and sense of inevitability which had me gripped from beginning to end. Talking of which the symphony has a DIFFERENT ENDING  :o ??? :). Apparently, according to Leonard Slatkin's note in the booklet Copland made some cuts after a discussion with Leonard Bernstein. Here the original ending is restored. It was very weird to hear a work with which I am so familiar ending unusually. I had to play the 'new' ending three times to get my head round it and I like the original ending very much. I can't say that it is 'better' that the more familiar version but it was so exciting to hear it. As with the 1913 or 1920 version of Vaughan Williams's 'London Symphony' (with much more extensive cuts than the Copland) I suspect that it is this version that I will be returning to.

Bravo, Jeffrey! Couldn't have said it any better myself. I'm glad you enjoyed it as much as I did. This recording has a special atmosphere that I have not heard in a performance of this symphony in quite some time. This is my new reference for this symphony. My previous reference (and it's still a splendid performance in many regards) was Bernstein's on DG.

Quote from: Mirror Image on January 14, 2018, 02:10:01 PM
Bravo, Jeffrey! Couldn't have said it any better myself. I'm glad you enjoyed it as much as I did. This recording has a special atmosphere that I have not heard in a performance of this symphony in quite some time. This is my new reference for this symphony. My previous reference (and it's still a splendid performance in many regards) was Bernstein's on DG.

Thank you John!  I agree about the DGG Bernstein version, which I much prefer to the CBS/Sony. Another performance I like is that conducted by the sadly short-lived conductor Eduardo Mata with the Dallas SO. He steers IMHO a 'middle path' between the more extrovert Bernstein recordings and the self-effacing Copland version with the Philharmonia Orchestra. I'm still on a high after listening to that terrific Slatkin CD, so I had to listen to some more American music - this time William Schuman's poetic and visionary Sixth Symphony - to calm me down before bed-time!  :)

Quote from: vandermolen on January 14, 2018, 02:26:25 PM
Thank you John!  I agree about the DGG Bernstein version, which I much prefer to the CBS/Sony. Another performance I like is that conducted by the sadly short-lived conductor Eduardo Mata with the Dallas SO. He steers IMHO a 'middle path' between the more extrovert Bernstein recordings and the self-effacing Copland version with the Philharmonia Orchestra. I'm still on a high after listening to that terrific Slatkin CD, so I had to listen to some more American music - this time William Schuman's poetic and visionary Sixth Symphony - to calm me down before bed-time!  :)

I must hear the Mata (a conductor I admire very much). I just bought Copland's own performance of his 3rd on Everest (coupled with Billy the Kid (Suite). I think I'll listen to some Schuman later as well. Enjoy!

Quote from: Mirror Image on January 14, 2018, 02:29:26 PM
I must hear the Mata (a conductor I admire very much). I just bought Copland's own performance of his 3rd on Everest (coupled with Billy the Kid (Suite). I think I'll listen to some Schuman later as well. Enjoy!

Will be very interested to hear what you think of Copland's Everest recording John. Just ordered a CD of Ormandy conducting William Schuman's Third Symphony which I hadn't been aware of before.  :)

Quote from: vandermolen on January 14, 2018, 03:01:02 PM
Will be very interested to hear what you think of Copland's Everest recording John. Just ordered a CD of Ormandy conducting William Schuman's Third Symphony which I hadn't been aware of before.  :)

Very nice. Love Schuman's 3rd. Certainly one of those great American third symphonies.

Quote from: Mirror Image on January 14, 2018, 04:43:32 PM
Very nice. Love Schuman's 3rd. Certainly one of those great American third symphonies.

Oh yes, along with those by Copland, Harris, Hanson and Diamond IMHO.

For 2nd symphonies I'd include those by Creston and Piston as great ones.

Quote from: vandermolen on January 15, 2018, 12:49:03 AM
Oh yes, along with those by Copland, Harris, Hanson and Diamond IMHO.

For 2nd symphonies I'd include those by Creston and Piston as great ones.

I've recently become a quite a fan of Hanson's 3rd, so, yes, I believe it goes on that list as well.

Quote from: Mirror Image on January 15, 2018, 06:00:08 AM
I've recently become a quite a fan of Hanson's 3rd, so, yes, I believe it goes on that list as well.

Koussevitsky's performance is sensational.

For Christmas I was given Annegret Fauser's book on Appalachian Spring...it's one of those 150-page Oxford keynotes. It documents the history of the ballet and the collaboration between Martha Graham and AC. As I was reading, I searched for and found the (mostly)original players and choreography in a video produced in 1959. There is some additional music that is unfortunately excluded form the suite we all have heard. But what startled me was the choreography itself, which is more modern dance than ballet. Graham, at 64 still looks great as the "young" bride, but the stark set and often severe movements looks better suited for Les Noces or something of that ilk.

Nonetheless it's an interesting study of the New York WW2 artistic climate since this is the copywrited choreography.

See what you think if this is new to you.

Part One of Appalachian Spring:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmgaKGSxQVw

A couple of interesting new releases.
I find it difficult to resist new releases of Copland's Third Symphony and this one (Copland conducts the Berlin PO in 1970) is no exception ( ::)). The programme itself looks very appealing. Also I loved the new Naxos recording of Leonard Slatkin conducting with the original coda, not heard on any other recording. Although only a few bars I guess it was a bit like hearing the 1920 or 1913 version of Vaughan Williams's 'A London Symphony' for the first time and hearing the music which the composer decided to excise.
Also there is a new, very inexpensive, box set of Slatkin conducting the music of American composers which features three CDs (out of 13) of his excellent Copland recordings. His Symphony No.3 is one of my favourites. It also features Copland's film music and the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra which I like very much:
[asin]B079J83PPD[/asin]
See below - don't know why the image is there twice.

Quote from: vandermolen on April 29, 2018, 11:51:31 PM
A couple of interesting new releases.
I find it difficult to resist new releases of Copland's Third Symphony and this one (Copland conducts the Berlin PO in 1970) is no exception ( ::)). The programme itself looks very appealing. Also I loved the new Naxos recording of Leonard Slatkin conducting with the original coda, not heard on any other recording. Although only a few bars I guess it was a bit like hearing the 1920 or 1913 version of Vaughan Williams's 'A London Symphony' for the first time and hearing the music which the composer decided to excise.
Also there is a new, very inexpensive, box set of Slatkin conducting the music of American composers which features three CDs (out of 13) of his excellent Copland recordings. His Symphony No.3 is one of my favourites. It also features Copland's film music and the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra which I like very much:
[asin]B079J83PPD[/asin]
See below - don't know why the image is there twice.

Those look great, Jeffrey. Of course, the Slatkin box I already own well over half of it's contents in their original issues. Copland conducting the Berliners is an interesting prospect, but I'm not sure if I'd really want to hear it. Like you, I own several fine performances of that glorious third symphony.

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 01, 2018, 01:39:34 PM
Those look great, Jeffrey. Of course, the Slatkin box I already own well over half of it's contents in their original issues. Copland conducting the Berliners is an interesting prospect, but I'm not sure if I'd really want to hear it. Like you, I own several fine performances of that glorious third symphony.

Thank John, I have the same issue with the Slatkin box although I'd like to hear the Corigliano Symphony, which was, at one time at least, rated very highly. I'll report back on Copland and the Berliners in due course.
:)

The Symphonic Ode:  Copland's very best score?

Quote from: vandermolen on May 02, 2018, 03:21:16 AM
Thank John, I have the same issue with the Slatkin box although I'd like to hear the Corigliano Symphony, which was, at one time at least, rated very highly. I'll report back on Copland and the Berliners in due course.
:)

Sounds like a plan, Jeffrey. 8)

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 02, 2018, 04:32:02 AMThe Symphonic Ode:  Copland's very best score?

It's certainly one of many, Karl, but I wouldn't claim it's his very best when Appalachian Spring, 12 Poems of Emily Dickinson, Symphony No. 3, the Clarinet Concerto, or Billy the Kid are just as strong contenders IMHO.

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 02, 2018, 04:32:02 AM
The Symphonic Ode:  Copland's very best score?

It certainly is one of my favourites Karl due to its craggy/monolithic qualities. The Organ Symphony is another one of his more 'modernist' scores which I like along with 'Statements'.

However maybe Symphony 3 is best of all?

Quote from: vandermolen on May 02, 2018, 11:25:32 AMHowever maybe Symphony 3 is best of all?

There are some tough contenders when talking about Copland's oeuvre in general. I don't think I could possibly pick just one work that's an absolute favorite as he's a composer, like Debussy, Ravel, Barber, or Vaughan Williams, for me, that has composed so many personal favorites for different reasons that narrowing it down would somehow be unfair to the other works which I hold so dear.

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 02, 2018, 06:16:52 PM
There are some tough contenders when talking about Copland's oeuvre in general. I don't think I could possibly pick just one work that's an absolute favorite as he's a composer, like Debussy, Ravel, Barber, or Vaughan Williams, for me, that has composed so many personal favorites for different reasons that narrowing it down would somehow be unfair to the other works which I hold so dear.

Yes, I largely agree with this. Some of his shorter works like 'Quiet City' mean a lot to me. So, for that matter, does the 'Lincoln Portrait' despite all its non-sequiturs! I'm not a great fan of the Henry Fonda version however and, as a matter of principle, I have refused to listed to the version narrated by Mrs Thatcher. My first experience of it was with Adlai Stevenson and Eugene Ormandy and that remains my favourite version.

Quote from: vandermolen on May 02, 2018, 09:40:36 PM
Yes, I largely agree with this. Some of his shorter works like 'Quiet City' mean a lot to me. So, for that matter, does the 'Lincoln Portrait' despite all its non-sequiturs! I'm not a great fan of the Henry Fonda version however and, as a matter of principle, I have refused to listed to the version narrated by Mrs Thatcher. My first experience of it was with Adlai Stevenson and Eugene Ormandy and that remains my favourite version.

I'm quite fond of this recording of Lincoln Portrait (narrated by Charlton Heston):

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/518B4bHc80L.jpg)

I don't care if I sound like a simpleton or 'poser' but I absolutely adore Copland's 'Populist' works. There, I said it. :)

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 03, 2018, 07:34:33 AM
I'm quite fond of this recording of Lincoln Portrait (narrated by Charlton Heston):

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/518B4bHc80L.jpg)

I don't care if I sound like a simpleton or 'poser' but I absolutely adore Copland's 'Populist' works. There, I said it. :)

Me too! I like those old Vanguard CDs and prefer Charlton Heston's narration to Henry Fonda's.

Quote from: vandermolen on May 03, 2018, 07:43:02 AM
Me too! I like those old Vanguard CDs and prefer Charlton Heston's narration to Henry Fonda's.

The sound on this particular recording will knock you out! Great stuff. Powerful in the climaxes.

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 03, 2018, 07:44:26 AM
The sound on this particular recording will knock you out! Great stuff. Powerful in the climaxes.

I'd have added David Diamondvto the list of favourites.

Lincoln Portrait is a wonderful work. I love the version narrated by James Earl Jones (aka the voice of Darth Vader) with Gerard Schwarz and that with the frail-sounding but indomitable Katharine Hepburn - with Kunzel. I also have the Fonda-Copland but can't remember what it sounds like. Must not have made a huge impression, I'm afraid  ::)

Quote from: André on May 03, 2018, 01:10:10 PM
Lincoln Portrait is a wonderful work. I love the version narrated by James Earl Jones (aka the voice of Darth Vader) with Gerard Schwarz and that with the frail-sounding but indomitable Katharine Hepburn - with Kunzel. I also have the Fonda-Hepburn but can't remember what it sounds like. Must not have made a huge impression, I'm afraid  ::)

Darth Vader is good and I also like the historic recordings narrated by Carl Sandburg and Melvyn Douglas.

Quote from: vandermolen on May 03, 2018, 02:47:26 PM
Darth Vader is good and I also like the historic recordings narrated by Carl Sandburg and Melvyn Douglas.

Narrators in Lincoln Portrait are either actors (Gregory Peck, Henry Fonda, Charlton Heston) or politicians/military (Adlai Stevenson, Genl H. Norman Schwarzkopf, Margaret Thatcher). I prefer the former category  :D.

Quote from: vandermolen on May 03, 2018, 12:23:25 PM
I'd have added David Diamondvto the list of favourites.

I'm sorry, but what did you add, Jeffrey? A David Diamond work?

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 03, 2018, 06:39:43 PM
I'm sorry, but what did you add, Jeffrey? A David Diamond work?

Hi John,

No, I just meant that I'd add Diamond to your list of favourite American composers, who are also my favourite American composers, actually amongst my favourite composers of any nationality.
:)

Quote from: vandermolen on May 03, 2018, 09:49:54 PM
Hi John,

No, I just meant that I'd add Diamond to your list of favourite American composers, who are also my favourite American composers, actually amongst my favourite composers of any nationality.
:)

Ah, okay. ;) Well, when I'm making a collage such as this one, it's difficult to fit in more than four composers. :)

Revisiting Dance Panels. What a wonderful work this is! This is Copland's last ballet and it has such a gorgeous lyricism. I view this ballet as 'Copland-lite' in that there's really not a lot of the heavier rhythms like those found in Billy the Kid or Rodeo for example. I'm not sure what work I can compare this to in Copland's oeuvre or any other composer's, but, I will say that at some moments, I detect (perhaps superficially on my part) a nod to Stravinsky's Orpheus or Prokofiev's On the Dnieper.

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 04, 2018, 06:24:50 AM
Revisiting Dance Panels. What a wonderful work this is! This is Copland's last ballet and it has such a gorgeous lyricism. I view this ballet as 'Copland-lite' in that there's really not a lot of the heavier rhythms like those found in Billy the Kid or Rodeo for example. I'm not sure what work I can compare this to in Copland's oeuvre or any other composer's, but, I will say that at some moments, I detect (perhaps superficially on my part) a nod to Stravinsky's Orpheus or Prokofiev's On the Dnieper.

Interesting - must give this a listen to. I think I have a Naxos recording.

Quote from: vandermolen on May 05, 2018, 12:53:58 AM
Interesting - must give this a listen to. I think I have a Naxos recording.

If you have the Naxos recording then you own Slatkin's (w/ the Detroit SO), which is a fine performance. I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

https://www.youtube.com/v/nrXo8pjnJ9A

This is so gorgeous and so simple, but, for me, that's what makes it special. It's not about elaborate harmonies or melodies, this is music that's straight from the heart. Appalachian Spring continues to have personal significance for me more and more as the years go by and Copland's own playing here only solidifies the fact that I believe him to be a true master and someone whose optimistic spirit lives on through his music.

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 15, 2018, 07:36:05 PM
https://www.youtube.com/v/nrXo8pjnJ9A

This is so gorgeous and so simple, but, for me, that's what makes it special. It's not about elaborate harmonies or melodies, this is music that's straight from the heart. Appalachian Spring continues to have personal significance for me more and more as the years go by and Copland's own playing here only solidifies the fact that I believe him to be a true master and someone whose optimistic spirit lives on through his music.

What a lovely clip! Thanks so much for posting it John. Aaron Copland comes across as very nice and I really liked the haunting end of Appalachian Spring on the piano. I wish there were a piano version of the complete ballet. It comes across freshly as performed by the great man himself.
:)

Quote from: vandermolen on May 15, 2018, 09:55:39 PM
What a lovely clip! Thanks so much for posting it John. Aaron Copland comes across as very nice and I really liked the haunting end of Appalachian Spring on the piano. I wish there were a piano version of the complete ballet. It comes across freshly as performed by the great man himself.
:)

You're welcome, Jeffrey. In every interview I've seen with Copland, he's always been thoughtful, considerate, and kind. I once read a fascinating article on Copland's compositional process and he basically wrote music in sections and rarely, if ever, composed a piece all the way through from start to finish. He once remarked: "I don't compose. I assemble materials." You'd hardly know he composed in this manner given the seamless quality of the music. He also composed everything on the piano much like Stravinsky did.

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 16, 2018, 05:33:01 AM
You're welcome, Jeffrey. Every interview I've seen with Copland, he's always been thoughtful, considerate, and kind. I once read a fascinating article on Copland's compositional process and he basically wrote music in sections and rarely, if ever, composed a piece all the way through from start to finish. He once remarked: "I don't compose. I assemble materials." You'd hardly know he composed in this manner given the seamless quality of the music. He also composed everything on the piano much like Stravinsky did.

That's very interesting about his compositional approach John and, as you rightly say, you would never have guessed that from the music itself.

Quote from: vandermolen on May 16, 2018, 05:41:18 AM
That's very interesting about his compositional approach John and, as you rightly say, you would never have guessed that from the music itself.

Indeed, Jeffrey. 8)

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 16, 2018, 05:50:53 AM
Indeed, Jeffrey. 8)

I like the Copland quote attached to your postings.

Quote from: vandermolen on May 16, 2018, 05:55:34 AM
I like the Copland quote attached to your postings.

Thank you, Jeffrey. Yes, a meaningful and inspiring quote for sure.

Quote from: Mirror Image on May 05, 2018, 05:21:25 AM
If you have the Naxos recording then you own Slatkin's (w/ the Detroit SO), which is a fine performance. I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

Just listened to this CD right through - such fun!
Dance Panels should be much better known. Oddly enough, it occasionally reminded me of Symphony 2 by the Estonian composer Lepo Sumera.
Great performances by Slatkin and the fine Detroit SO.
Another reason I like this disc is because it features one of my very favourite shorter works by Copland - Danzon Cubano - a wonderfully life-affirming work which I could, and often do, listen to again and again:

Quote from: vandermolen on May 16, 2018, 12:51:38 PM
Just listened to this CD right through - such fun!
Dance Panels should be much better known. Oddly enough, it occasionally reminded me of Symphony 2 by the Estonian composer Lepo Sumera.
Great performances by Slatkin and the fine Detroit SO.
Another reason I like this disc is because it features one of my very favourite shorter works by Copland - Danzon Cubano - a wonderfully life-affirming work which I could, and often do, listen to again and again:

Indeed. A fun work and a work, I feel, that goes unnoticed or just not as celebrated as the populist ballets (Appalachian Spring, Rodeo, etc.).

Anyone out there who finds the Piano Fantasy as fascinating as I do?  It combines the monumental and the introspective sides of Copland's personality very successfully across a vast canvas.

Quote from: Mahlerian on June 05, 2018, 10:04:02 AM
Anyone out there who finds the Piano Fantasy as fascinating as I do?  It combines the monumental and the introspective sides of Copland's personality very successfully across a vast canvas.

I should say yes, only the fact that it is some years since last I listened to it might be a drawback  8)

Quote from: Mahlerian on June 05, 2018, 10:04:02 AM
Anyone out there who finds the Piano Fantasy as fascinating as I do?  It combines the monumental and the introspective sides of Copland's personality very successfully across a vast canvas.

Yes.

Quote from: Mahlerian on June 05, 2018, 10:04:02 AM
Anyone out there who finds the Piano Fantasy as fascinating as I do?  It combines the monumental and the introspective sides of Copland's personality very successfully across a vast canvas.

Must listen to it!

A very fine CD especially for the craggy Symphonic Ode and the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra:
[asin]B01HSFG6DO[/asin]

Interestingly (well, for me anyway  :P) the performance of Copland's Third Symphony on BBC Radio 3 last night used the original coda (which first appeared in Slatkins's recent Naxos/Detroit SO recording) instead of the usual version which included cuts, erroneously in my view, suggested by Leonard Bernstein. It was a bit like listening to the ending of the 1920 version of A London Symphony by Vaughan Williams as both works featured a moving section at end which was later, misguidedly IMHO, excised by the composer.

Just out of the blue had an urge to listen to Appalachian Spring. This is why I'm glad I've got this music, for times like this when I fancy spinning it.

On the subject of Rodeo, it's somewhat surprising to read that the only difference between the concert suite and the complete ballet score is the insertion of an interlude for honky-tonk piano.

The forthcoming release of his Third Symphony (John Wilson, Chandos) uses the original ending which I now much prefer to  the version which incorporates the cuts suggested by Leonard Bernstein. The recent release on Naxos (Slatkin) was the first to perform the original coda.

Quote from: vandermolen on September 20, 2018, 09:12:34 AM
The forthcoming release of his Third Symphony (John Wilson, Chandos) uses the original ending which I now much prefer to  the version which incorporates the cuts suggested by Leonard Bernstein. The recent release on Naxos (Slatkin) was the first to perform the original coda.

And it is a fabulous CD in every respect! The performance of Symphony 3 is as good as any I have heard and the recording best of all. I heard so much more instrumental detail, especially in the second movement. The performance is very fine, rather slow at the start but of great cumulative slumbering power and I was delighted to hear the original coda, which I now prefer, which has only been recorded once before by Skatkin with the Detrois SO on a fine recent Naxos release. I must have 15 recordings of Copland's Third Symphony ( ::)) but this is my favourite. The icing on the cake is the other works, the craggy 'Connotations', the 'Letter from Home' which I don't recall hearing before and which reminded me, at the start of Elmer Bernstein's wonderful score for 'To Kill a Mockingbird'. The short 'Down a Country Lane' is an eloquent close to a terrific CD. One of my discs of the year I suspect.
[asin]B07HGBM68Z[/asin]

I've been listening to Copland's later CBS/Sony recording of Symphony No 3 with the Philharmonia Orchestra. I think it is underrated because it is understated (nice rhyme  :)). It has a unique warmth to it, unlike any other performance I know and it has been really good to hear it again (I had the LP). In the Sony boxed set it is accompanied by Henry Fonda's rather disappointing version of the 'Lincoln Portrait'. Still, even that was better than hearing Charles Dance narrating it in a fake American accent at the Proms earlier this year:
[asin]B00EC0VWYW[/asin]

Quote from: vandermolen on November 03, 2018, 07:21:16 AM
And it is a fabulous CD in every respect! The performance of Symphony 3 is as good as any I have heard and the recording best of all. I heard so much more instrumental detail, especially in the second movement. The performance is very fine, rather slow at the start but of great cumulative slumbering power and I was delighted to hear the original coda, which I now prefer, which has only been recorded once before by Skatkin with the Detrois SO on a fine recent Naxos release. I must have 15 recordings of Copland's Third Symphony ( ::)) but this is my favourite. The icing on the cake is the other works, the craggy 'Connotations', the 'Letter from Home' which I don't recall hearing before and which reminded me, at the start of Elmer Bernstein's wonderful score for 'To Kill a Mockingbird'. The short 'Down a Country Lane' is an eloquent close to a terrific CD. One of my discs of the year I suspect.
[asin]B07HGBM68Z[/asin]

All 4 volumes are free to download if you have an Amazon Prime account if I might add. I think kudos to Chandos for featuring these fabulous and nicely filled CDs. I don't think there are too many Copland discs featuring non-American conductor and band despite Copland's reputation and popularity.

Of these I particularly enjoy this one:

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61hNXaAYlYL._SS500.jpg)

just a crazy good Symphony No. 1 and a dazzling Statements.

Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on December 29, 2018, 12:29:25 PM
All 4 volumes are free to download if you have an Amazon Prime account if I might add. I think kudos to Chandos for featuring these fabulous and nicely filled CDs. I don't think there are too many Copland discs featuring non-American conductor and band despite Copland's reputation and popularity.

Of these I particularly enjoy this one:

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61hNXaAYlYL._SS500.jpg)

just a crazy good Symphony No. 1 and a dazzling Statements.

I've enjoyed this whole series and totally agree about 'Statements'.

Isn't the Symphony No.1 just the Organ Symphony sans organ?

Quote from: Maestro267 on January 05, 2019, 09:44:15 AM
Isn't the Symphony No.1 just the Organ Symphony sans organ?

The organ part more or less got absorbed by other instruments. I think it sounds better without the organ anyway.

An interesting new release coupling, uniquely I think, Copland's Third Symphony with Sinfonia India by Chavez. It also incorporates the original ending of Copland's Third Symphony:
(//)

Quote from: vandermolen on August 17, 2019, 12:15:24 AM
An interesting new release coupling, uniquely I think, Copland's Third Symphony with Sinfonia India by Chavez. It also incorporates the original ending of Copland's Third Symphony:
(//)

The "original ending" thing about Copland 3 is a bit of a red herring.  I think Bernstein was absolutely right to suggest the - brief - cut.  All the original is is an extension of an already somewhat extended final peroration.  To my mind this is a perfect example of folk looking for a 'special'/unusual selling point to promote their new recording as something different.  Of course this is now about the 3rd (4th?) recording to use these extra bars so not that USP any more anyway.

My favourite example of a pointless USP was the Chandos recording of the Elgar violin concerto using a different version of the cadenza Elgar wrote (pragmatically) for a recording when he knew the existing tech wouldn't pick up the detail of what he'd already written.  Never in a million years did Elgar consider that an alternative for regular use.

Quote from: Roasted Swan on August 17, 2019, 12:28:15 AM
The "original ending" thing about Copland 3 is a bit of a red herring.  I think Bernstein was absolutely right to suggest the - brief - cut.  All the original is is an extension of an already somewhat extended final peroration.  To my mind this is a perfect example of folk looking for a 'special'/unusual selling point to promote their new recording as something different.  Of course this is now about the 3rd (4th?) recording to use these extra bars so not that USP any more anyway.

My favourite example of a pointless USP was the Chandos recording of the Elgar violin concerto using a different version of the cadenza Elgar wrote (pragmatically) for a recording when he knew the existing tech wouldn't pick up the detail of what he'd already written.  Never in a million years did Elgar consider that an alternative for regular use.

Must respectfully disagree with you RS about the original ending of Copland's Third Symphony which I find even more moving and spine-tingling  than the more familiar version. I think it's great, like the 1920 ending of A London Symphony by Vaughan Williams. I think it must be the third recording, the others being by Slatkin on Naxos and Wilson on Chandos. Also, as for USP, the original ending is not mentioned anywhere in the booklet or on the CD cover as far as I can see.

Quote from: vandermolen on August 17, 2019, 12:40:55 AM
Must respectfully disagree with you RS about the original ending of Copland's Third Symphony which I find even more moving and spine-tingling  than the more familiar version. I think it's great, like the 1920 ending of A London Symphony by Vaughan Williams. I think it must be the third recording, the others being by Slatkin on Naxos and Wilson on Chandos. Also, as for USP, the original ending is not mentioned anywhere in the booklet or on the CD cover as far as I can see.

We agree on far more than we don't - so I concur about agreeing to disagree here!  I had a quick listen comparing Wilson with Bernstein's last recording and unless I'm missing something the "cut" really is just a couple of the repeated thwacks on the bass drum - about 15 seconds in all.  I agree absolutely about the RVW/London symphony extended epilogue (and the other excisions from the final revision) but this reinstatement doesn't do it for me.

Quote from: Roasted Swan on August 18, 2019, 02:23:10 AM
We agree on far more than we don't - so I concur about agreeing to disagree here!  I had a quick listen comparing Wilson with Bernstein's last recording and unless I'm missing something the "cut" really is just a couple of the repeated thwacks on the bass drum - about 15 seconds in all.  I agree absolutely about the RVW/London symphony extended epilogue (and the other excisions from the final revision) but this reinstatement doesn't do it for me.

Thinking about it a bit more I think it can be argued that the 'cuts' in both works strengthen the structural integrity of the music but perhaps reduce the emotional impact. I agree that this is more significant in the VW work than the Copland.

Interesting looking new release (download only):
(//)
Interesting review as well. I can't tell from the review if MTT uses the original or the revised ending. One thing that I liked about the review is praise for the hitherto derided Jarvi/Detroit CD on Chandos which I've always thought highly of:
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2020/Mar/Copland_sym3_SFS0078.htm

Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on January 05, 2019, 10:01:49 AM
The organ part more or less got absorbed by other instruments. I think it sounds better without the organ anyway.

??? ??? ??? ???This terrific work should only be performed WITH the organ, of course!  >:D

I'm not much of a Copland guy, but I'm over my phase of strongly disliking his music. They say growing up as a music student in Finland, you are going to hate Sibelius as part of a "rebellion" against the music that is constantly shoved down your throat, and perhaps it is the same story here in America with Copland.

I have the Bernstein Century disc with Appalachian Spring, Rodeo, and Billy the Kid. Listening to Appalachian Spring now. I'm enjoying it, and as it is a beautiful early springtime here in the Appalachian Piedmont, I can't help but hearing extramusical associations in the music—even though, of course, Copland named the piece only after its completion.  ;D

Anyway, I ought to give more of his music a fair chance. I have heard some of those BBC Philharmonic Copland recordings on Chandos and liked what I heard, I might want to get my hands on one of those CDs, or maybe something on Naxos. It seems they have recorded a lot of his orchestral music under fine conductors, Slatkin, Alsop, Judd, etc.

What other Copland is worth listening to? I remember really enjoying the early Piano Concerto back when I was first getting into classical music.

This is a great recording!

https://www.youtube.com/v/vC3qQpyp4rI

Quote from: vers la flamme on March 26, 2020, 03:24:56 AM
I'm not much of a Copland guy, but I'm over my phase of strongly disliking his music. They say growing up as a music student in Finland, you are going to hate Sibelius as part of a "rebellion" against the music that is constantly shoved down your throat, and perhaps it is the same story here in America with Copland.

I have the Bernstein Century disc with Appalachian Spring, Rodeo, and Billy the Kid. Listening to Appalachian Spring now. I'm enjoying it, and as it is a beautiful early springtime here in the Appalachian Piedmont, I can't help but hearing extramusical associations in the music—even though, of course, Copland named the piece only after its completion.  ;D

Anyway, I ought to give more of his music a fair chance. I have heard some of those BBC Philharmonic Copland recordings on Chandos and liked what I heard, I might want to get my hands on one of those CDs, or maybe something on Naxos. It seems they have recorded a lot of his orchestral music under fine conductors, Slatkin, Alsop, Judd, etc.

What other Copland is worth listening to? I remember really enjoying the early Piano Concerto back when I was first getting into classical music.

Having also gone through (and grown out of) a similar phase, I can say that I think Copland wrote a great deal of fine music.  In addition to the more famous works, be sure to listen to:

- Short Symphony
- 12 Poems of Emily Dickinson
- Clarinet Concerto
- Piano Fantasy
- Inscape (but not Bernstein's recording, alas--we need a new one)

Quote from: vers la flamme on March 26, 2020, 03:24:56 AM
I'm not much of a Copland guy, but I'm over my phase of strongly disliking his music. They say growing up as a music student in Finland, you are going to hate Sibelius as part of a "rebellion" against the music that is constantly shoved down your throat, and perhaps it is the same story here in America with Copland.

I have the Bernstein Century disc with Appalachian Spring, Rodeo, and Billy the Kid. Listening to Appalachian Spring now. I'm enjoying it, and as it is a beautiful early springtime here in the Appalachian Piedmont, I can't help but hearing extramusical associations in the music—even though, of course, Copland named the piece only after its completion.  ;D

Anyway, I ought to give more of his music a fair chance. I have heard some of those BBC Philharmonic Copland recordings on Chandos and liked what I heard, I might want to get my hands on one of those CDs, or maybe something on Naxos. It seems they have recorded a lot of his orchestral music under fine conductors, Slatkin, Alsop, Judd, etc.

What other Copland is worth listening to? I remember really enjoying the early Piano Concerto back when I was first getting into classical music.

Well, I'd recommend

Billy the Kid (complete ballet)
Symphonic Ode (a more modernistic, monolithic type of work)
Danzon Cubanon (great fun)
Statements for Orchestra
Symphony for Organ and Orchestra

Been enjoying some Copland lately, mostly the Bernstein recordings on DG and Columbia/Sony. The 3rd symphony is pretty impressive. There's still a good deal of his music I have yet to hear; the Dance Symphony, Organ Symphony, Short Symphony and all that other good stuff.

Just out of curiosity, why did Naxos record so much Copland?! They've recorded Appalachian Spring at least 3 or 4 times.

Quote from: vers la flamme on November 09, 2020, 03:06:33 AM
Been enjoying some Copland lately, mostly the Bernstein recordings on DG and Columbia/Sony. The 3rd symphony is pretty impressive. There's still a good deal of his music I have yet to hear; the Dance Symphony, Organ Symphony, Short Symphony and all that other good stuff.

Just out of curiosity, why did Naxos record so much Copland?! They've recorded Appalachian Spring at least 3 or 4 times.

The Organ Symphony is a particular favourite. You should try the craggy 'Symphonic Ode' as well. I think that the Appalachian Spring is very popular (like Vaughan Williams's 'The Lark Ascending') so that is probably why it is often recorded.

Quote from: vers la flamme on November 09, 2020, 03:06:33 AM
Been enjoying some Copland lately, mostly the Bernstein recordings on DG and Columbia/Sony. The 3rd symphony is pretty impressive. There's still a good deal of his music I have yet to hear; the Dance Symphony, Organ Symphony, Short Symphony and all that other good stuff.

Just out of curiosity, why did Naxos record so much Copland?! They've recorded Appalachian Spring at least 3 or 4 times.

No idea but they do have an 'American Classics' series that has much more than Copland.

Quote from: vandermolen on November 09, 2020, 03:12:07 AM
The Organ Symphony is a particular favourite. You should try the craggy 'Symphonic Ode' as well. I think that the Appalachian Spring is very popular (like Vaughan Williams's 'The Lark Ascending') so that is probably why it is often recorded.

That was just an example; beyond Appalachian Spring, there's about a dozen or more Copland Naxos discs in general, with a bunch of different conductors: Gunzenhauser, Schwarz, Alsop, Judd, Falletta, etc... They really put a lot of effort into their Copland series. I suppose they see him as a central part of their "American Classics" series.

Quote from: vers la flamme on November 09, 2020, 03:06:33 AM
Been enjoying some Copland lately, mostly the Bernstein recordings on DG and Columbia/Sony. The 3rd symphony is pretty impressive. There's still a good deal of his music I have yet to hear; the Dance Symphony, Organ Symphony, Short Symphony and all that other good stuff.

Just out of curiosity, why did Naxos record so much Copland?! They've recorded Appalachian Spring at least 3 or 4 times.

Quote from: vers la flamme on November 09, 2020, 02:29:51 PM
That was just an example; beyond Appalachian Spring, there's about a dozen or more Copland Naxos discs in general, with a bunch of different conductors: Gunzenhauser, Schwarz, Alsop, Judd, Falletta, etc... They really put a lot of effort into their Copland series. I suppose they see him as a central part of their "American Classics" series.

You answered your own question. ;) For me and I can't speak as to why Naxos has recorded what they have (or even feel the need to try to understand it), but I look at Copland as one of the great American composers. He created a sound-world that was completely his own and, in this regard, he has one of the most characteristic and unmistakable musical voices in all of classical music. Those wide-open vistas of sound, the galloping rhythms and even in his more Modernist works there's a certain approach in the harmony that can only be classified as 'Copland-esque'. When you listen to a work like Prairie Journal and then turn around and listen to Connotations, you're never in question of who the composer is and I think that is one of his many achievements.

Quote from: vers la flamme on November 09, 2020, 02:29:51 PM
That was just an example; beyond Appalachian Spring, there's about a dozen or more Copland Naxos discs in general, with a bunch of different conductors: Gunzenhauser, Schwarz, Alsop, Judd, Falletta, etc... They really put a lot of effort into their Copland series. I suppose they see him as a central part of their "American Classics" series.

I suspect that when Naxos got Slatkin to sign a deal with them part of the agreement was to allow him to record several Copland discs given this is something of an omission in his discography to that date

I don't much care for the "American Idyll" (or "populist") music but there is a different side (or more or some music that could be classified as in between) to Copland I find more interesting. Tilson Thomas accordingly has one album calls "the modernist" (which I recommend), one "the populist" (which I have not heard).

[asin]B000003G4A[/asin] [asin]B00004SSDL[/asin]

Quote from: Jo498 on November 10, 2020, 12:28:32 AM
I don't much care for the "American Idyll" (or "populist") music but there is a different side (or more or some music that could be classified as in between) to Copland I find more interesting. Tilson Thomas accordingly has one album calls "the modernist" (which I recommend), one "the populist" (which I have not heard).

[asin]B000003G4A[/asin] [asin]B00004SSDL[/asin]

That MTT Copland 'Modernist' disc is one of my favourites, uniquely I think, it includes both the Symphonic Ode and the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.

I ordered the Modernist disc. Thanks, Jo. "American Idyll" is a good way to put it. Copland's music from the 1940s is not unlike an American equivalent to the "English Idyllics" like Finzi, Delius etc.

Quote from: Mirror Image on November 09, 2020, 03:22:04 PM
He created a sound-world that was completely his own and, in this regard, he has one of the most characteristic and unmistakable musical voices in all of classical music.

When you listen to a work like Prairie Journal and then turn around and listen to Connotations, you're never in question of who the composer is and I think that is one of his many achievements.

Well said. I think this development of a very unique individual voice is a trait he shares with Stravinsky, and few others.

This interview may be of interest:

Part 1 -

https://www.youtube.com/v/JiK5C6OJDjk

Part 2 -

https://www.youtube.com/v/UO18NxUaIgk

In my mind, Copland is the equivalent of Sibelius in Finland as he's done that much for American music. He's a national treasure, but, unfortunately, he's unknown to a large percentage of Americans nowadays and it does feel his reputation is a bit in decline. I truly hope this man's music continues to thrive and flourish.

Wouldn't Ives be a closer analogue to Sibelius as "pioneering beginner of serious classical music in cultural backwater x"? The big difference is of course that Sibelius became a national musical hero rather quickly whereas Ives remained mostly obscure. But Copland does seem very late for a "pioneer" even regardless of Ives.

I remember that when I first came across an LP by Vaughan Williams I asked my classical-music loving elder brother what his music was like and he replied 'a bit like a British Copland'. That intrigued me as I already liked Copland's music. Their music, of course, sounds different but I know what he meant.

Quote from: Jo498 on January 12, 2021, 01:39:16 AM
Wouldn't Ives be a closer analogue to Sibelius as "pioneering beginner of serious classical music in cultural backwater x"? The big difference is of course that Sibelius became a national musical hero rather quickly whereas Ives remained mostly obscure. But Copland does seem very late for a "pioneer" even regardless of Ives.

I think it's important to remember that before Copland, the US didn't have a national musical voice or someone they could turn to when there was a national crisis to move everyone with their music. Copland's Populist period is what gave him the national and international recognition. Ives never achieved this nor did any other American composer at this time. I have a special relationship with Copland's music as I remember watching a commercial on TV when I was around 5 or 6 yrs. old for US beef that featured the Hoe-Down movement from Rodeo and this has stuck in my mind throughout my entire life. I suppose you could say this was first exposure to any kind of classical music.

Quote from: vandermolen on January 12, 2021, 01:53:35 AM
I remember that when I first came across an LP by Vaughan Williams I asked my classical-music loving elder brother what his music was like and he replied 'a bit like a British Copland'. That intrigued me as I already liked Copland's music. Their music, of course, sounds different but I know what he meant.

That is interesting, Jeffrey. I think the Populist period of Copland does have nods to Vaughan Williams' pastoralism. I'm thinking here of works like Quiet City, Down a Country Road, Letter From Home, Our Town, etc. Of course, as you pointed out, the differences between the two composers couldn't be more apparent outside of the afore mentioned works.

I was recently introduced to Aaron Copland's a cappella Four Motets (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsw02xHjLK2yVfQI3VhNoyu3XM8AnNX9d) from 1921, composed during his Boulanger studies. He mentions an influence of Mussorgsky in crafting these, although I am not sure I can sense that aspect.

QuoteNadia Boulanger required her pupils to learn to compose traditional forms, among them the motet. Written under her instruction, Copland's motets make use of biblical texts for an a capella chorus of mixed voices. He wrote, "I think of these as student pieces that show some influence of Moussorgsky, whom I admired. I agreed to their publication with mixed emotions. While they have a certain curiosity value — perhaps people want to know what I was doing as a student — the style is not yet really mine." Vivian Perlis

I was really taken by them though, and am surprised (and regretful) I haven't crossed paths with them before. I hope to be able to perform them at some point in the future.

VS

https://www.youtube.com/v/MzkKqpf5PFk&ab_channel=VariousArtists-Topic

As someone who loves, values, and obsesses over every single piece Copland ever wrote, it pains me that there is literally just one (one!) canonical work that Copland wrote that has still never yet been recorded: his incidental music for a televised play in 1957 titled The World of Nick Adams, based on a Hemingway story.  Copland rather famously wrote two scores for film adaptations of John Steinbeck novels (Of Mice and Men and The Red Pony), but it's rather less known that he also wrote music for a story by that other American literary giant, Hemingway!

In 2001, the actor Paul Newman staged a charity performance of the play, complete with Copland's score performed live.  It was performed a few more times, but as far as I know none of those performances were filmed, nor has the music ever been recorded.  The unpublished manuscript score is of course held in the Copland Collection at the Library of Congress, although since it was performed live in this century a conductor's score and parts are obviously floating around somewhere out there.

Someday I hope to be able to hear this, the only Copland piece I have never heard.

Quote from: Stu on August 17, 2022, 05:12:53 AM
As someone who loves, values, and obsesses over every single piece Copland ever wrote, it pains me that there is literally just one (one!) canonical work that Copland wrote that has still never yet been recorded, his incidental music for a televised play in 1957 titled The World of Nick Adams, based on a Hemingway story.  Copland rather famously wrote two scores for film adaptations of John Steinbeck novels (Of Mice and Men and The Red Pony), but it's rather less known that he also wrote music for a story by that other American literary giant, Hemingway!

In 2001, the actor Paul Newman staged a charity performance of the play, complete with Copland's score performed live.  It was performed a few more times, but as far as I know none of those performances were filmed, nor has the music ever been recorded.  The unpublished manuscript score is of course held in the Copland Collection at the Library of Congress, although since it was performed live in this century a conductor's score and parts are obviously floating around somewhere out there.

Someday I hope to be able to hear this, the only Copland piece I have never heard.

Most interesting! I had no inkling.

Here's an interesting article on Paul Newman's revival of the play:

https://library.wustl.edu/hotch-at-100-the-world-of-nick-adams/

Thanks! Really interesting news.

For the public radio station here, WRTI (and to coincide with Election Day), I wrote an article on Copland's Lincoln Portrait, touching on a bit of history, context, and of course, versions worth hearing. (There are a lot of them!)

https://www.wrti.org/wrti-spotlight/2022-11-07/album-of-the-week-aaron-coplands-lincoln-portrait

-Bruce

Quote from: Brewski on November 07, 2022, 12:36:34 PM
For the public radio station here, WRTI (and to coincide with Election Day), I wrote an article on Copland's Lincoln Portrait, touching on a bit of history, context, and of course, versions worth hearing. (There are a lot of them!)

https://www.wrti.org/wrti-spotlight/2022-11-07/album-of-the-week-aaron-coplands-lincoln-portrait

-Bruce

Excellent article Bruce.
I was fascinated to see Copland narrating himself with Bernstein conducting - a most moving and much-needed performance. I wish that there was a CD recording.

Am enjoying this newly-released boxed set of Copland's own CBS/Sony recordings (20 CDs including a couple conducted by Bernstein):

Quote from: vandermolen on February 20, 2024, 01:01:46 AMAm enjoying this newly-released boxed set of Copland's own CBS/Sony recordings (20 CDs including a couple conducted by Bernstein):

Looks great - but too expensive with too much duplication from earlier Sony boxes for me sadly......

Quote from: Roasted Swan on February 20, 2024, 05:05:14 AMLooks great - but too expensive with too much duplication from earlier Sony boxes for me sadly......

Yes, I take your point. I have the old 3 volume Copland Sony sets from years ago but this is much better presented with a glossy illustrated booklet of almost 80 pages. Also, most of the chamber music CDs were new to me and I love having the original LP covers in mini versions.

My only disappointment with the fabulous new 'Copland conducts Copland' boxed set (see above) is that it doesn't contain the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra - a great work. And then I remembered that it was Bernstein who conducted the recording. Having said that the set does contain a couple of Bernstein recordings, so why couldn't they include that one as well?

Quote from: vandermolen on February 20, 2024, 08:44:47 AMMy only disappointment with the fabulous new 'Copland conducts Copland' boxed set (see above) is that it doesn't contain the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra - a great work. And then I remembered that it was Bernstein who conducted the recording. Having said that the set does contain a couple of Bernstein recordings, so why couldn't they include that one as well?

Jeffrey,

If you have this set (or are tempted to get it), it includes the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.

(https://static.qobuz.com/images/covers/52/36/0088697683652_600.jpg)

(https://pixhost.icu/avaxhome/33/67/007c6733.jpg)

PD

p.s.  Warning:  It's a roughly LP-sized box!

Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2024, 12:34:31 PMJeffrey,

If you have this set (or are tempted to get it), it includes the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.

(https://static.qobuz.com/images/covers/52/36/0088697683652_600.jpg)

(https://pixhost.icu/avaxhome/33/67/007c6733.jpg)

PD

p.s.  Warning:  It's a roughly LP-sized box!

Yes, a ginormous box.

Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on February 20, 2024, 12:34:31 PMJeffrey,

If you have this set (or are tempted to get it), it includes the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra.

(https://static.qobuz.com/images/covers/52/36/0088697683652_600.jpg)

(https://pixhost.icu/avaxhome/33/67/007c6733.jpg)

PD

p.s.  Warning:  It's a roughly LP-sized box!

Thanks PD although I can't afford that one as well  :o
I have one of those Japanese re-mastering CDs featuring Copland's 3rd Symphony conducted by Bernstein (I prefer Copland's own recording) and the Symphony for Organ and Orchestra - so, I will stick with that.  :)