Does anybody have any suggestions for neat minimalist/post-minimalist composers outside of the 5-10 big names? (Glass, Feldman, Andriessen, etc.)
I've been enjoying New World Records' 3 disc retrospective of Julius Eastman for a while. The music is startling because it seems to come from nowhere, but has an engaging punch to it. Its use of the pop style combined with the nagging repetitions of American minimalism prove surprisingly innovative. The Holy Presence of Joan D'Arc sounds startlingly like music by later film composers, except this is a real piece with a long arc rather than a scene painting. It also has the rawness and unrefined nature that can make pop compelling. Very sadly most of the composer's music has been lost.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prfD5o9d-aI (for ten cellos)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_QGQcKq1ik (for four pianos)
(Not embedded because I don't neccesserally want this to become a Youtube thread.)
Did Eastman compose that first piece to be performed for Dreyer's film? Or just use it as inspiration?
Also, thanks for sharing. I'm a minimalist at heart. ;D
Did Eastman composer anything for an orchestra or a chamber orchestra?
Quote from: TheGSMoeller on December 05, 2011, 10:37:02 AM
Did Eastman compose that first piece to be performed for Dreyer's film? Or just use it as inspiration?
The booklet notes have an entry for each piece, but they are quite scanty - they don't mention the film, but do say:
In his introduction, Eastman calls the piece "a reminder to those who think they can destroy liberators by acts of treachery, malice, and murder... [L]ike all organizations, especially governments and religious organizations, they oppress in order to perpetuate themselves. [...]"A lot of his music seems to have a protest or dissident basis to it.
The shouts in the performance of the second linked piece for four pianos, presumably to keep everybody in time or perhaps because the work has an element of aleatory, are quite startling.
Quote from: Mirror Image on December 05, 2011, 10:39:44 AM
Did Eastman composer anything for an orchestra or a chamber orchestra?
Only one piece on the disc is for ensemble (
If You're So Smart, Why Aren't You Rich? (1977) for violin, two french horns, four trumpets, two trombones, tuba, piano, two chimes and two basses). Wikipedia lists a few works for chamber ensemble, and several pieces for unspecified instruments, although knowing how "available" the manuscripts are to record I presume may be an ordeal for anyone involved:
The Moon's Silent Modulation (1970) for dancers, vocalists and chamber ensemble
Femenine (1974) for chamber ensemble
I can't comment on If You're So Smart yet, as I'm infatuated by the multiple piano pieces, and Joan of Arc (the first part of the piece is for solo voice).
Learning for the first time that this is what all organizations do (oppress in order to perpetuate themselves) . . . .
I wish you had gone ahead and named all ten.
Hal Budd
John Luther Adams
Jim Fox
LaMonte Young
Tony Conrad
Sachiko M
John Cage
Eliane Radigue
Simeon Ten Holt
Tom Johnson
M. Behrens
Rosy Parlane
Ellen Fullman
(These are some other minimalists, not the.)
Even though I argue that it has been almost 30 years since he stopped being a, um, minimalist, Louis Andriessen is one of the best out there. I'll leave it at that though, because even he doesn't like being called that, even when referencing pieces like De Staat and Mausoleum, which have obvious repetitive phrases, but with much thornier harmonies than the minimalists we all know and love. I like his brand of minimalism much more than his compatriot Simeon Ten Holt, though, who can bore me to tears with his pieces.
I'll throw in another vote of confidence for Julius Eastman. Unfortunately, I only know his works for multiple pianos. I'll have to check out some of his other works. Has anyone else heard Eastman's performance of Peter Maxwell Davies' Eight Songs for a Mad King, by the way? It's a riot, literally!
Love De Staat!
I was on a major Simeon ten Holt kick a few years ago but the lack of variety in his available compositions has made me tire of his music somewhat.
Ingram Marshall I've recently been tentatively exploring. It's perhaps easy to view as a little new agey (one of the "gamalan guys"), but his soundworld is individual; often when I play a piece of his, it's simultaneously more relaxed, but also more undulating in volume and intensity than I expect, and as a result a piece that I have mentally catalogued as "a quiet one" can surprise me with a swell that rises higher than I expect, or an "intense" work can have a remarkably calm heart to it. Music that is hard to pin down can only be a good thing. He writes very attractively for string quartet too (Evensongs on New Albion), which gives brownie points for me, as it's one of my favourite instrument combinations.
So far a composer such as, say, LaMonte Young, has been more hit and miss for me - he wrote some really creepy and creaky stuff.
I heard an arrangement of Ingram Marshall's Fog Tropes II for brass on a September 11th memorial concert on the 10th anniversary, and it was a pretty neat experience, especially alongside some contrasting works by Golijov (not the typical hyperactive Latin festival music) and Schnittke. Fog Tropes pretty much sums up what I have heard of his. It's nice for certain times, I suppose.
Quote from: Lethe Dmitriyevna Pettersson on December 05, 2011, 10:51:41 AM
Only one piece on the disc is for ensemble (If You're So Smart, Why Aren't You Rich? (1977) for violin, two french horns, four trumpets, two trombones, tuba, piano, two chimes and two basses). Wikipedia lists a few works for chamber ensemble, and several pieces for unspecified instruments, although knowing how "available" the manuscripts are to record I presume may be an ordeal for anyone involved:
The Moon's Silent Modulation (1970) for dancers, vocalists and chamber ensemble
Femenine (1974) for chamber ensemble
I can't comment on If You're So Smart yet, as I'm infatuated by the multiple piano pieces, and Joan of Arc (the first part of the piece is for solo voice).
Interesting, thanks Sara. 8)
Quote from: Lethe Dmitriyevna Pettersson on December 05, 2011, 10:32:58 AM
outside of the 5-10 big names? (Glass, Feldman, Andriessen, etc.)
Quote from: some guy on December 05, 2011, 11:36:21 AM
I wish you had gone ahead and named all ten.
(These are some other minimalists, not the.)
Ack, now you've got me. What ARE 'The 10'?
10 Glass
09 Reich
08 Young
07 Riley
06 Andriessen
05 ten Holt
04 Nyman
03 Bryars
02 Eno/Budd/Oldfield,... really, there AREN'T 10, haha, they do mush a bit, no?
01 Part/Tavener/G,... gulp,
McCarPlease give me the remaiI'll be honest, I have been looking for some primo Minimalism for whatever purpose I have,... and Feldman has no impetus for this. Lethe recommended ten Holt, whom I wilted from, and I'm still searching for that Logan's Run/Dr. Who stuff,... perhaps I do seek it in the OTHER classical realm of minimalism of the time,... Tangerine Dream, haha! No? Someone else? I really liked Goblin, and the
Phantasm sountrack. Perhaps something like Goblin's
Dawn of the Dead sountrack, but smoother, like the intro of
Tubular Bells (yes, I'm OBSESSED with the perfect horror music :o :o). Picture Feldman's
Piano & String Quartet meets Part's
Festina Lente: THAT'S what I want! Amin-F forrever, man! ::)
Something that sounds like 1977!
Don't make me ;__; Urge to make lists... increasing... But yes, I was thinking of names that wouldn't appear on many "X classic minimalism albums" lists, or specifically, perhaps for all the composers who are unlikely to get enough conversation going for a dedicated thread.
David Lang seems to be a name mentioned a lot as a notable post-minimalist, but I've yet to look into him. He does seem to have less of a "err, really?" kind of vibe to him than Michael Gordon, etc.
John Luther Adams, I only know two albums of. Four Thousand Holes is nice, but a bit wooly and sentimental. The shorter piece on that album was the opposite, restrained and almost boring. I must give it another try sometime. The Place We Began was cool, and despite being a Xenakis style (I think) method of overlaying tracks, its sound is much closer to ambient pop like Eno. Not sure that I could listen to it as other than background music, though.
Quote from: Lethe Dmitriyevna Pettersson on December 06, 2011, 04:50:23 AM
David Lang seems to be a name mentioned a lot as a notable post-minimalist, but I've yet to look into him. He does seem to have less of a "err, really?" kind of vibe to him than Michael Gordon, etc.
You should give David Lang a good listen, I have yet to experience a dull piece of his. Lang's
Little Match Girl Passion is one of the best recent compositions I've heard, and his Naxos disc featuring
Pierced is a great compilation of his work.
Playing the Naxos Pierced disc. I was wrong, I am vaguely recalling the rhythm of this, so I've heard it at some point. It's extremely cool, not just in sounding more asymmetrical than straight minimalism, but in its "shifting" kind of sound, written almost as though the music is rocking side to side. A nice, creaky, chamberish sound too. Like grandma's house on acid ;D
Quote from: Lethe Dmitriyevna Pettersson on December 06, 2011, 05:29:01 AM
Playing the Naxos Pierced disc. I was wrong, I am vaguely recalling the rhythm of this, so I've heard it at some point. It's extremely cool, not just in sounding more asymmetrical than straight minimalism, but in its "shifting" kind of sound, written almost as though the music is rocking side to side. A nice, creaky, chamberish sound too. Like grandma's house on acid ;D
Do I have a percussion piece by him called
Born to be Wild, which, er, is one of those uber-pretentious?...narrating the lyrics over a /Sprockets'-type beat? That David Lang? Oh.
I'll recommend what's on my list:
Lukas Foss SQ No.3 (New World), which is supposedly a more hard edged minimalism. I've only heard the sample, but I'm really interested. It's probably not what I was describing earlier, but it sounds like a requirement.
I was going to suggest David Lang, too, if he wasn't on that top 10 already. Very cool stuff, and the Little Match Girl disc is enthralling. Count this as seconding the above, then.
For multiple pianos, try Graham Fitkin (the double disc of Hook, Cud, Mesh, Log, Line and Loud - the last three are for multiple pianos - is the one you need. Intricate, absorbing music, at its best.)
Quote from: Luke on December 06, 2011, 09:56:26 AM
I was going to suggest David Lang, too, if he wasn't on that top 10 already. Very cool stuff, and the Little Match Girl disc is enthralling. Count this as seconding the above, then.
BTW, the Bryars/Lang collaboration Amjad on GB discs (it's mostly Bryars, too be honest) ticks many, many boxes especially as it is mostly Bryars' own dark,slightly haunted rendering of Swan Lake. Speaking as a 20+disc Bryars completist, I have to admit that this is one of my secret favourites of his, though it shouldn't be a first port-of-call.
*is considering never using the phrase "top 10" again - it's too dangerous*
Quote from: Luke on December 06, 2011, 09:56:26 AM
For multiple pianos, try Graham Fitkin (the double disc of Hook, Cud, Mesh, Log, Line and Loud - the last three are for multiple pianos - is the one you need. Intricate, absorbing music, at its best.)
Are you reading my mind? ;D Music for multiple pianos, ideally 3-5, is rapidly becoming one of my favourite setups - orchestral textures but with a perfect unity of sound. Thanks for the rec!
I've just noticed what I might have found so potent about Eastman's Evil Nigger piece (dude, you wanted a reaction, you got one - I ran out of ways to avoid typing its name ;D) - the main theme, of sorts, which is counted in and acts as a transition between sections sounds very close to Dies Irae - I don't know if it's intentional.
Quote from: Lethe Dmitriyevna Pettersson on December 06, 2011, 10:04:35 AM
Are you reading my mind? ;D
Nothing so spooky, I think I read you mentioning the multiple pianos earlier... But then yes, put the Fitkin at the top of your list, he made a speciality of this sort of piece for a while.
Quote from: Lethe Dmitriyevna Pettersson on December 06, 2011, 10:04:35 AM
Music for multiple pianos, ideally 3-5, is rapidly becoming one of my favourite setups - orchestral textures but with a perfect unity of sound. Thanks for the rec!
Not exactly what you asked for, but try Ravel's tiny 15 bar Frontispice for piano 5 hands (!). It's a weird marvel of a piece, and actually protominimalist in some ways. It builds up an incredibly complex web of cross-rhythms by the accretion of ostinati in standard minimliast fashion, although obviously before-the-fact. It is really Ravel's most intricate, mindboggling piece, in some ways.
(* Jeevesian cough *) (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,92.msg582948.html#msg582948)
Quote from: Luke on December 06, 2011, 10:17:01 AM
Not exactly what you asked for, but try Ravel's tiny 15 bar Frontispice for piano 5 hands (!). It's a weird marvel of a piece, and actually protominimalist in some ways. It builds up an incredibly complex web of cross-rhythms by the accretion of ostinati in standard minimliast fashion, although obviously before-the-fact. It is really Ravel's most intricate, mindboggling piece, in some ways.
Did you link to a score once on a time, or did I imagine it? . . .
Karl's cough (or what it links to) reminds me of Ligeti's Musica Ricercata (which slowly builds up its account of pitches from the A-only first movement IIRC). Ligeti's music is frequently minimalist in essentials, and most obviously so in the harpsichord pieces and the two piano Monument, Selbstporträt and Bewegung (whose middle movement is described as a self portrait with Reich and Riley, and Chopin too). Hear it eg here http://www.classicalarchives.com/work/140671.html Of the piano etudes, many push minimalist buttons, most explicitly Der Zauberlehrling from Book 2
Speaking of protominimalism, anyone else fancy Colin McPhee's music? His Tabuh-Tabuhan has been cited by John Adams as a direct inspiration to his minimalist works. It's a great sort of work that reminds me a bit of Steve Reich, of all people. All of the various keyboard percussion instruments coupled with the two pianos is very much like the sorts of ensembles that he utilizes, with the orchestra behind it.
Harald Weiss Arche(Wergo)
Quote from: Luke on December 06, 2011, 10:17:01 AM
Not exactly what you asked for, but try Ravel's tiny 15 bar Frontispice for piano 5 hands (!). It's a weird marvel of a piece, and actually protominimalist in some ways. It builds up an incredibly complex web of cross-rhythms by the accretion of ostinati in standard minimliast fashion, although obviously before-the-fact. It is really Ravel's most intricate, mindboggling piece, in some ways.
With respect, it can hardly be viewed as
minimalist. Although minimalist seems to be defined very loosely (far too loosely IMO) these days: it seems that just a little bit of repetition is enough to get tarred with the minimalist brush.
Frontispice makes perfect sense if it is remembered that it is piece conceived for
pianola - at a time (just after the end of WW1) when many composers accepted the invitation to write a short piece for the instrument. This is not to downgrade the work - it is a little gem. A few years back, an orchestration by Boulez was broadcast: full of unnecessary contrasts it was and as such seemed to miss the point entirely.
Is nobody aware of the wealth of (real) minimalist music composed in the UK in the period from 1966-75? Hobbs, White, Cardew, Parsons et al?
Quote from: Dax on December 07, 2011, 01:39:17 AM
With respect, it can hardly be viewed as minimalist. Although minimalist seems to be defined very loosely (far too loosely IMO) these days: it seems that just a little bit of repetition is enough to get tarred with the minimalist brush.
Frontispice makes perfect sense if it is remembered that it is piece conceived for pianola - at a time (just after the end of WW1) when many composers accepted the invitation to write a short piece for the instrument. This is not to downgrade the work - it is a little gem. A few years back, an orchestration by Boulez was broadcast: full of unnecessary contrasts it was and as such seemed to miss the point entirely.
Is nobody aware of the wealth of (real) minimalist music composed in the UK in the period from 1966-75? Hobbs, White, Cardew, Parsons et al?
Hmm, I didn't say Frontispice was minimalist, though, I said that the way its ostinati build up (and the web of cross rhythms they create) is a technique the minimalists used also, and that in that sense (and I suppose the fact that the texture is the only real idea, not the background for something else) it could be said to anticipate them. I mentioned it really only because Sara was talking about her interest in multiple-hands-at-the-piano music, and it sprung to mind in both contexts.
BTW, the pianola idea is a theory, and it may well be an accurate theory, but it's not confirmed and probably won't be. See here http://www.maurice-ravel.net/frontisp.htm Of course if Sara is interested in multiple piano music she needs to head for the pianola or similar - for Nancarrow, of course, and for Gann...exploring the latter one will discover many other minimalists
OF whom, btw, please look out William Duckworth. His Time Curve Preludes are an important and attractive work, and available for free download if one searches around the blogosphere. You can hear them here http://www.archive.org/details/P_DUC_WIL_02
And yes, I know the work of Hobbs, White etc. I treasure my copy of the Obscure LP with the two HObbs pieces, the experimental Bryars 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 4 and Adams' American Standard (a piece which he once said had never been played because of the copyright infringement of its Duke Ellington quotation, clearly forgetting this recording!). John White, meanwhile, is a fascinating figure indeed. I' love to have the time to explore those countless piano sonatas more deeply! But thinking of all these guys reminds me of one more...
What about Howard Skempton?
The British minimalist tradition is full of fine, original, thoughtful and eccentic figures!
It's interesting you mention Nancarrow - I haven't commented on Fitkin because I haven't really come to any opinion on the music other than I like it - but once or twice it made me think of Nancarrow at a less manic pace. It's probably an insane figment of my imagination from being unable to pin down the music in any way ;D
Skempton I found a bit light on content when played in one programme (the Well, Well, Cornelius CD), but it tends to sound better when contrasted with others (Schleiermacher's British! CD).
Quote from: Lethe Dmitriyevna Pettersson on December 07, 2011, 11:12:33 AM
It's interesting you mention Nancarrow - I haven't commented on Fitkin because I haven't really come to any opinion on the music other than I like it - but once or twice it made me think of Nancarrow at a less manic pace. It's probably an insane figment of my imagination from being unable to pin down the music in any way ;D
Skempton I found a bit light on content when played in one programme (the Well, Well, Cornelius CD), but it tends to sound better when contrasted with others (Schleiermacher's British! CD).
There was a sweetly inept attempt to hype Skempton's Lento when it was released as a CD single on NMC - along the lines of 'if this thing takes off, it could get itself a cult following'. Way to sell it! (Well, TBH it worked on me...) This was the time of the first widespread popularity of Part, Gorecki, Tavener etc. It's certainly an attractive and very pure piece which I think
would appeal to those who are interested in music that is in that line - it is an explicit attempt to reproduce the glowing sound of Wagner's Parsifal orchestraion, but in a slow, soft series of heiratic, solemn chords.
And re the Fitkin-Nancarrow - not at all, it's a clear point of comparison. That nexus also includes Ligeti (as mentioned before - he was deeply influenced by Nancarrow of course). And something like Adams' Hallalujah Junction fits right in there too. Odd how such disparate composers can find these point of connection.
Big +1 for Duckworth's Time Curve Preludes.
An important early (ish) figure is David Borden (and his Mother Mallard ensemble). And another name that comes to mind is Mikel Rouse, although I haven't followed his own recent work and can't say it is earlier stuff would hold up for me if I heard it today.
Quote from: Luke on December 07, 2011, 11:03:58 AM
John White, meanwhile, is a fascinating figure indeed. I'd love to have the time to explore those countless piano sonatas more deeply!
In which case, forgive me this utterly shameless (and recently released) plug
(http://www.uhrecordings.co.uk/multimedia/_shop69/albums/UHR/WhiteSonatas_default_1024_1.jpg)
http://www.uhrecordings.co.uk/_shop/albums/UHR/WhiteSonatas.aspx
Quote from: Dax on January 19, 2012, 01:29:26 AM
(http://www.uhrecordings.co.uk/multimedia/_shop69/albums/UHR/WhiteSonatas_default_1024_1.jpg)
The samples sound super. The style reminds me a bit of Glass's etudes, but there is much more of a sense of restless invention with these works (the overly simple, comfortable qualities of the work I compare them to don't bring me back for more).
Edit: the more they go on, the more it sounds like some of Kapustinov's wheezes too - this is really fun!
Quote from: lescamil on December 06, 2011, 01:00:13 PM
Speaking of protominimalism, anyone else fancy Colin McPhee's music? His Tabuh-Tabuhan has been cited by John Adams as a direct inspiration to his minimalist works. It's a great sort of work that reminds me a bit of Steve Reich, of all people. All of the various keyboard percussion instruments coupled with the two pianos is very much like the sorts of ensembles that he utilizes, with the orchestra behind it.
I ADORE McPhee. I must admit the Tabuh-Tabuhan conducted by Hanson (Who I admire) was sort of lame compared to the Canandian disk about a decade ago which has some other great works on them. His 2nd Symphony and Transitions are also very good. And yes, I get the Reich vibe.
Since he's vaguely like John Adams, I'd check out Kamran Ince. The disc with Arches and his 2nd Symphony (Fall of Constantinople) are very good. The latter is almost like a minimalist take on Hanson's Lament for Beowulf, minus the chorus.
Lukas Foss?
Quote from: snyprrr on January 20, 2012, 08:29:39 AM
Lukas Foss?
I'd like to know a bit about him too. As so often, I've seen the name around a lot - enough for me to consider him a noted composer - but I've somehow never read any opinions on him, nor stumbled across his music in any couplings that have passed through my hands.
I like Verbey very much. Padding and Vleggaar also sound interesting to me, but they don't have developed a mature sound yet, and I wonder if they will get to this. All Dutch.
Verbey's music is great imo. A very good example of post-minimalism, better than minimalism.
[asin]B000VOEJDO[/asin]
Quote from: Henk on January 22, 2012, 04:39:08 AM
I like Verbey very much.
This sounds neat, thanks! Each Amazon clip sounds very direct and unfussy in its language.
EDIT: btw, this is exactly the kind of composer that I keep tripping over:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41JzEumwwaL._SL500_AA300_.jpg) (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B003FYNA8C/?tag=goodmusicguideco)
Adams, Glass, Reich and... Heath ???
I got a good compression of "Dave Heath" from this disc, although it is of course impossible to properly assess from one piece. The work on the disc sounds surprisingly Baltic, using the string orchestra to produce all sorts of concerto grosso-style interplay from the sections colliding against each other, shimmering, penetrating the work in typical, almost chaste minimalistic delivery of constant little waymarks, ratcheting the tension up and down as the music itself sways the other direction. Familiar shifts between nagging little pseudo marches, contrasted with "cantabile" parts. I really like this style coming from composers like Tüür (speaking of post-minimalism, I should've mentioned him earlier), and it works well here too, although feels less diffuse than that composer goes for.
A small load of U.S. Experimemtal/Minimalist stuff can be found at
http://incessantnoise.blogspot.com/
of which I've found that the work of Loren Rush is certainly of interest.
Music by Julius Eastman can be found at
http://justmalaise.blogspot.com/2012/02/julius-eastman-unjust-malaise-new-world.html
There is, of course, quite a lot of drone-laden stuff which is fairly underwhelming and tiresome: I've never been a fan of, for instance, Phill Niblock - who is rated by some. Loren Rush's Hard music appears to consist (merely) of 3 pianists hammereing out a D 2 octaves below middle C. Be that as it may, it certainly works.
For purposes of comparison (and greater sophistication) one could do worse than try (an acolyte of La Monte Young) Catherine Christer Hennix's The Electric Harpsichord- there's an excerpt on youtube at
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqCgsN3_4Hc
and the 25 minute work (is that all?) can be found at http://knowyourconjurer.blogspot.com/2011/06/catherine-christer-hennix-electric.html
I mentioned earlier that the word minimalist seems open to misinterpretation these days. As far as the English variety is concerned (quite different from the American), I would hardly think that either Nyman or Bryars would describe anything much they've composed in the last 30 years as minimalist.
But here's an example: John White's Purple passage for 2 percussionists. The recording is from a concert in 1974.
http://www.sendspace.com/file/s537cj
Quote from: Dax on February 26, 2012, 03:37:51 AM
There is, of course, quite a lot of drone-laden stuff which is fairly underwhelming and tiresome: I've never been a fan of,
and the 25 minute work (is that all?)
I mentioned earlier that the word minimalist seems open to misinterpretation these days.
A great point, that all that crappy '60s 'American Experimentalism' drone stuff falls under the... and surely there is sooo much of this corner of the musical universe that newbies would love not to have to navigate.
Personally, when I think the M word, I think Glass, end of story,... and Bryars and Nyman, and Volans, end of story.
I need some really good, minor key, stuff to help me fall asleep, like the opening of
Tubular Bells going on forever, without the changes, something groovy and '70s sounding.
I found this by Costin Miereanu:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxwgeRROx-0
MORE OF THIS PLEASE!!
I can definitely like some minimalism. But I think that some of the more famous composers in this area can put people off at times when it sounds too cold and mechanical. I like it with more feeling and an interesting characterful idea with which it is based off, alongside some subtle development through a piece. Rhythm when used as a very dominating factor over these other elements is hard to convince me with.
Quote from: starrynight on March 05, 2012, 11:47:06 AM
I can definitely like some minimalism. But I think that some of the more famous composers in this area can put people off at times when it sounds too cold and mechanical. I like it with more feeling and an interesting characterful idea with which it is based off, alongside some subtle development through a piece. Rhythm when used as a very dominating factor over these other elements is hard to convince me with.
So which "minimalist" composers and which particular pieces do you like?
I want something of the expectant atmosphere of a Cronenberg film,... I do like Glass's soundtrack to The Thin Blue Line, but I'd like something long, process oriented, and definitely minor key (like I keep asking for: The 'Exorcist' part of Tubular Bells played as an organic process).
waaah :'(, nobody cares :'(
This thread has gone on too long. ;)
Quote from: Bogey on March 05, 2012, 07:04:32 PM
This thread has gone on too long. ;)
Insert minimal joke! :D
Quote from: UB on March 05, 2012, 03:20:48 PM
So which "minimalist" composers and which particular pieces do you like?
I can like many different composers and pieces, no particular favourites. There is certainly good lesser known stuff. Someone mentioned the cd with the Dave Heath piece, I probably preferred that to the pieces by the other more hyped composers on that disc. Quite a lot of Nyman I probably don't like, though Decay Music is interesting. Most of Philip Glass I probably don't like either though his Solo Piano cd from 1989 is more to my taste. Of course minimalism isn't just strictly classical, it has filtered over into popular music (into progressive, jazz influenced or electronica as well). The Anatidae album by David Borden and the New Mother Mallard Band interests me, more so than the first Mother Mallard's Portable Masterpiece Company album (though I liked the first track of that). As always though people tend to concentrate on what came first as if that is more important.
Quote from: starrynight on March 06, 2012, 11:32:45 PM
As always though people tend to concentrate on what came first as if that is more important.
QFT
I just triggered an old LSD flackback when I accidentally happened upon Jean Michel Jarre's Oxygen. Why doesn't anyone mention Tangerine Dream and all this type of stuff? The Jarre was...mm... well, I LOVE to hear some modern, slightly less cheesy, version of this kind of stuff.
Quote from: starrynight on March 05, 2012, 11:47:06 AM
I can definitely like some minimalism. But I think that some of the more famous composers in this area can put people off at times when it sounds too cold and mechanical. I like it with more feeling and an interesting characterful idea with which it is based off, alongside some subtle development through a piece. Rhythm when used as a very dominating factor over these other elements is hard to convince me with.
I feel the same way. I sometimes become tired when I hear Glass's music or Reich's some later works (although I love
Music for 18 Musicians,
Octet,
Music for a Large Ensemble, etc.) which have ostensive, persistent repeating rhythm patterns. I prefer more subtle, sparse, quiet music with minimal elements. I think the term "minimal music," which is commonly used to describe music of Glass, Reich, etc., is misleading.
Thanks to GMG members, I found really good "minimal" music that I like so much.
Dennis Johnson's
November is one of the best recent findings for me. The pianist,
R. Andrew Lee recorded some nice minimal piano works.
Jürg Frey's
pianist, alone (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-bsqg_V4AY) is excellent. His other recordings such as
Tom Johnson's
An Hour for Piano,
William Duckworth's
The Time Curve Preludes are not so impressive after hearing some of the samples, but probably I need to listen to them more carefully.
Quote from: snyprrr on March 07, 2012, 06:54:52 AM
I just triggered an old LSD flackback when I accidentally happened upon Jean Michel Jarre's Oxygen. Why doesn't anyone mention Tangerine Dream and all this type of stuff? The Jarre was...mm... well, I LOVE to hear some modern, slightly less cheesy, version of this kind of stuff.
Well I for one, to the consternation of friends and family, like Tangerine Dream. And Jarre.
Minimal Piano Collection Volume I-IX
Jeroen van Veen (piano)
[asin]B000QCQ7MW[/asin]
Adams, J: China Gates
Borstlap: Avatâra
Cage: In a Landscape
Glass, P: same as 3-CD set Glass Solo Piano
Holt, Simeon: Solodevilsdance IV
Johnson, T: An Hour for Piano
Mertens: Struggle for Pleasure
Micháns: Three Minimal Preludes
Nietzsche: Das Fragment an sich
Nyman: Big My Secret, etc.
Pärt: Für Alina, Variations for the Healing of Arinushka
Riley: In C
Satie: Vexations
Tiersen: Comptine d'Un Autre Été: l'après-midi, etc.
Veen: 12 Minimal Preludes for piano, Book I & II
Veldhuis: Postnuclear Winterscenario No. 1
Vries: Toccata Americana, Echo
This is an enjoyable set of minimal music for solo piano, although it is not that I like all of them. It contains the works of "the other minimalists."
Volume X-XX (which I don't have) is a collection of minimal music for 2-6 pianos. It seems interesting, too.
QuoteThe composers on this new box are John Adams, Jurriaan Andriessen, Louis Andriessen, Marcel Bergmann, William Duckworth, Julius Eastman, Douwe Eisenga, Morton Feldman, Graham Fitkin, Joep Franssens, Kyle Gann, Philip Glass, Gabriel Jackson, Tom Johnson, Simeon ten Holt, David Lang, Colin McPhee, Chiel Meijering, Wim Mertens, John Metcalf, Carlos Michans, Meredith Monk, Arvo Pärt, Michael Parsons, Alexander Rabinovitch, Steve Reich, Frederic Rzewski, Tim Seddon, Jeroen van Veen, Jacob ter Veldhuis and Kevin Volans.
Quote from: torut on May 19, 2014, 09:28:27 PM
Volume X-XX (which I don't have) is a collection of minimal music for 2-6 pianos. It seems interesting, too.
I have that in digital form. The only pieces that I can recall at all from it are ten Holt's
Canto Ostinato, Eastman's
Gay Guerrilla, and the Feldman stuff, for whatever reason.
Not much in Vol I-IX sounds like my "thing" though I am sort of curious about
An Hour for Piano.
Charlemagne Palestine
Quote from: amw on May 20, 2014, 12:57:59 AM
Not much in Vol I-IX sounds like my "thing" though I am sort of curious about An Hour for Piano.
I tried
An Hour for Piano again, but gave up after about 20 min. I am not sure why, but probably it was because of the melody repeated.
Quote from: 7/4 on May 20, 2014, 02:45:33 AM
Charlemagne Palestine
Yes!
Strumming for Bosendorfer Piano is really nice. It is quite repetitious, but somehow it is very comfortable. It reminded me of Reich's works (especially
Music for 18 Musicians) which I like.
Charlemagne Palestine – From Etude to Cataclysms for the Doppio Borgato
http://harmonicsdb.wordpress.com/2014/02/28/charlemagne-palestine-from-etude-to-cataclysms-for-the-doppio-borgato/ (http://harmonicsdb.wordpress.com/2014/02/28/charlemagne-palestine-from-etude-to-cataclysms-for-the-doppio-borgato/)
old review.
Quote from: 7/4 on May 21, 2014, 04:12:39 AM
Charlemagne Palestine – From Etude to Cataclysms for the Doppio Borgato
http://harmonicsdb.wordpress.com/2014/02/28/charlemagne-palestine-from-etude-to-cataclysms-for-the-doppio-borgato/ (http://harmonicsdb.wordpress.com/2014/02/28/charlemagne-palestine-from-etude-to-cataclysms-for-the-doppio-borgato/)
old review.
That double piano is amazing. I just heard the 1st half of
From Etudes to Cataclysms. It sounds more experimental. Really good.
HENRY FLYNT & CATHERINE CHRISTER HENNIX - stereo piano (1978) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVUsZNY-Jfo)
https://www.youtube.com/v/KkAb_l8S4Ug
https://www.youtube.com/v/gaC-stgdcuc
https://www.youtube.com/v/c9PtaAYqiQw
Jon Hassell news (http://harmonicsdb.wordpress.com/2014/07/09/jon-hassell-news//)
Re-listened to Canto Ostinato from the Minimal Piano box. I actually really like this piece, hard to express why—something about the continual shifts in harmony, texture and emphasis. It's not the kind of thing I would have expected to like from the premise, and I imagine most people who share my tastes in contemporary music won't like it, but whatever. >.> Doesn't sound like just two pianos playing; I am interested to hear the original, which I believe is for a larger number of pianos (5 or 10?) I was wrong, there's actually no specified instrumentation. I'll definitely try out one of the ones w/electric organ or similar
Quote from: amw on May 21, 2014, 10:37:19 PM
Re-listened to Canto Ostinato from the Minimal Piano box. I actually really like this piece, hard to express why—something about the continual shifts in harmony, texture and emphasis. It's not the kind of thing I would have expected to like from the premise, and I imagine most people who share my tastes in contemporary music won't like it, but whatever. >.> Doesn't sound like just two pianos playing; I am interested to hear the original, which I believe is for a larger number of pianos (5 or 10?) I was wrong, there's actually no specified instrumentation. I'll definitely try out one of the ones w/electric organ or similar
E-e-excellent.
There are versions for 4 pianos.
You can sample short (10 minute) sections from other ten Holt multi piano pieces on youtube. I heartily recommend the box on Brilliant.
Also look for the canto and whirling dervish on youtube ... (no joke)
Check the lists in this article. 8)
MINIMAL MUSIC, MAXIMAL IMPACT (http://www.newmusicbox.org/articles/minimal-music-maximal-impact/)
By Kyle Gann on November 1, 2001
New Music Box
Quote from: 7/4 on June 05, 2014, 11:00:32 AM
Check the lists in this article. 8)
MINIMAL MUSIC, MAXIMAL IMPACT (http://www.newmusicbox.org/articles/minimal-music-maximal-impact/)
By Kyle Gann on November 1, 2001
New Music Box
A very interesting list. Thanks.
I recently listened to Music by Phill Niblock (Five More String Quartets & Early Winter), which is also mentioned in the Gann's book. An extreme minimalism, and I like it.
Quote from: torut on June 06, 2014, 11:11:04 PM
A very interesting list. Thanks.
I recently listened to Music by Phill Niblock (Five More String Quartets & Early Winter), which is also mentioned in the Gann's book. An extreme minimalism, and I like it.
It's great, I've heard Phils music live a few times. Guitar groups and lot's of playbacks of recordings over loud PA....he turns it up as the evening goes on. It's been a long time since I've been to anything at Experimental Intermedia. I think I went to a Niblock evening at Roulette when it was still in Tribecca.
I wonder what it would be like to hear Niblock live. :)
I read Gann's web article. It is a great guide to minimalism, postminimalism and totalism. A lot of composers I have not heard the music of. Also it helped clarifying my confusion about the term "minimalism." I wish he will write the book about postminimalism he mentioned in the article.
Kyle Gann
Fugitive Objects (2007) for keyboard sampler
https://www.youtube.com/v/LlFmJEQzGPI
Quote from: GannFugitive Objects is a work for keyboard sampler, actually a virtual retuned electric piano. [...] The piece uses a peculiar just-intonation scale
Very strange tuning.
Long Night (1980-1) for 3 pianos
[asin]B0007X9TSY[/asin]
Quote from: Gannthe most successful piece from my early, Brian-Eno-influenced, ambient period, a variable-length piece for three nonsynchronized pianos at different tempos.
Extremely beautiful.
Long Night Again, After 25 Years (http://www.artsjournal.com/postclassic/2005/03/long_night_again_after_25_year.html)
March 19, 2005 by Kyle Gann
Long Night – the Postclassic Review (http://www.artsjournal.com/postclassic/2005/06/long_night_the_postclassic_rev.html)
June 17, 2005 by Kyle Gann
Reviewer Reviewed (http://www.artsjournal.com/postclassic/2005/03/reviewer_reviewed.html)
March 25, 2005 by Kyle Gann
I am playing Long Night right now with two other pianists, and this is some of the most fun I've had collaborating with a pianist in a long time. It really seems like one of those pieces where there is no pressure and all enjoyment, and it is beautiful to just be a part of.
Quote from: lescamil on June 11, 2014, 06:23:29 AM
I am playing Long Night right now with two other pianists, and this is some of the most fun I've had collaborating with a pianist in a long time. It really seems like one of those pieces where there is no pressure and all enjoyment, and it is beautiful to just be a part of.
That sounds wonderful. I guess it must be difficult, because the pianists need to play at different tempos. The CD was recorded by one pianist using over dubbing, which seems easier. As suggested by the instruction, did you use silent metronomes?
Kyle Gann's web site (http://kylegann.com/) is very nice. For most of the works, except that are released on official CDs, there are mp3 clips and scores
http://kylegann.com/Gannmusic.html (http://kylegann.com/Gannmusic.html).
Quote from: torut on June 11, 2014, 08:45:26 PM
That sounds wonderful. I guess it must be difficult, because the pianists need to play at different tempos. The CD was recorded by one pianist using over dubbing, which seems easier. As suggested by the instruction, did you use silent metronomes?
We each have our own metronome that we play with, with a headphone connected and in one ear. The harder thing is to coordinate when each pianist is to move to the next section, and in what order.
Quote from: lescamil on June 11, 2014, 10:39:27 PM
We each have our own metronome that we play with, with a headphone connected and in one ear. The harder thing is to coordinate when each pianist is to move to the next section, and in what order.
Thanks. The music is nice to listen to, but it is interesting to hear how performers feel whileplaying this kind of work.
I think Lutosławski said about his SQ that he wanted each performer to play independent, not to hear other parts. I wonder if performing like that would be fun.
Someone already mentioned Ellen Fullman...I'm currently listening to Body Music (Experimental Intermedia).
The music tends to be slow and minimal because it's performed on the Long String Instrument. It's also microtonal.
Years ago I heard three shows at Columbia University with the Deep Listening Band. I kept going because I was looking for differences between the concerts...where is the composition and where is the improvisation!
A review I wrote a while ago: Ellen Fullman and Monique Buzzarté (http://harmonicsdb.wordpress.com/2013/11/05/ellen-fullman-and-monique-buzzarte/)
Fluctuations (Deep Listening DL 38-2007) (http://harmonicsdb.wordpress.com/2013/11/05/ellen-fullman-and-monique-buzzarte/)
and the composer's website: http://www.ellenfullman.com/ (http://www.ellenfullman.com/)
the Long String Instrument.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-4L7YUkorGpU/UjXJE1Z8-OI/AAAAAAAAG2o/ggIbOA85CIc/s1600/Ellen_Fullman_4478.jpg)
Eliane Radigue - I'm really blown away by her epic droning analog synth compositions. Slowly developing pieces, so not strict minimalism. Trilogie de la Morte, Adnos I-III - for example.
Quote from: 7/4 on June 16, 2014, 10:36:52 AM
the Long String Instrument.
Very interesting. I listened to Body Music today and it was mesmerizing. I sometimes hear subtle, nice melodies but cannot catch it for sure. I had similar experience while listening to Charlemagne Palestine's music.
An article about her mentioned Harry Partch and Alvin Lucier's Music on a Long Thin Wire, which I have been curious about for some time. I heard it on youtube, and it felt like an acoustic experiment. Fullman's works are more musical.
I am also interested in Eliane Radique's music since I saw it somewhere in this forum. I need to check it.
Quote from: 7/4 on June 16, 2014, 10:36:52 AM
the Long String Instrument.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-4L7YUkorGpU/UjXJE1Z8-OI/AAAAAAAAG2o/ggIbOA85CIc/s1600/Ellen_Fullman_4478.jpg)
Wow! That is so cool!
https://www.youtube.com/v/Uq9AFRMWLTU
(I like the commenter: "play freebird!")
I'm just sampling this:
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-Tl3zu2Ezsss/Te4aoY00D6I/AAAAAAAABcY/HkQyIJHUYW4/s1600/R-400885-1197496709.jpg)
people should know. ;D
Quote from: 7/4 on June 30, 2014, 11:08:48 AM
people should know. ;D
This makes me want to go out and buy some wire! These will be my next purchases!
I am finding amazing stuff in the Gann's list.
Arnold Dreyblatt (http://www.dreyblatt.de/index.php) - Propellers In Love
https://www.youtube.com/v/5ZPYf9IO98U
The styles are very different, but the idea about the string sound reminded me of Ellen Fullman.
Arnold Dreyblatt talks about his instrument, excited strings.
https://www.youtube.com/v/cZ83d5gbJng
Quote from: torut on July 09, 2014, 11:42:46 PM
I am finding amazing stuff in the Gann's list.
Arnold Dreyblatt (http://www.dreyblatt.de/index.php) - Propellers In Love
https://www.youtube.com/v/5ZPYf9IO98U
The styles are very different, but the idea about the string sound reminded me of Ellen Fullman.
Arnold Dreyblatt talks about his instrument, excited strings.
https://www.youtube.com/v/cZ83d5gbJng
sounds great!
Quote from: torut on July 09, 2014, 11:42:46 PM
I am finding amazing stuff in the Gann's list.
The styles are very different, but the idea about the string sound reminded me of Ellen Fullman.
The techniques are very different. The LSI is bowed and the Excited Strings are percussion instruments? (I don't have time to watch the video.)
Quote from: 7/4 on July 10, 2014, 05:14:46 AM
The techniques are very different. The LSI is bowed and the Excited Strings are percussion instruments? (I don't have time to watch the video.)
Yes, it is played by hitting the wire strung on a double bass with a bow. The orchestra sometimes sounds like gamelan.
This video shows how the instrument is actually played.
http://vimeo.com/15385126 (http://vimeo.com/15385126)
Stephen Scott - New Music For Bowed Piano
[asin]B00002EPNE[/asin]
Rainbows I, for bowed piano
https://www.youtube.com/v/itINrvadrAQ
The rhythmic parts recall Steve Reich's music to me. Very beautiful.
I have not watched it in full, but this video contains a performance of the bowed piano. The performers look very busy. ;D
https://www.youtube.com/v/pyH16IzZz8c
Glenn Branca -
Symphony No. 3 (Gloria) Music for the first 127 intervals of the harmonic series
[asin]B0000060P4[/asin]
Part III
https://www.youtube.com/v/W5nzkk4yuhQ
http://www.glennbranca.com/ (http://www.glennbranca.com/)
This is the first time I listened to Branca's music. I chose Symphony No. 3 because of its subtitle. After the drums enter, the music eventually reaches a very loud climax, but the beginning and the 3rd movement are quite beautiful. It does not sound like a guitar ensemble.
Allmusic review
Quote from: Brian Olewnick[...] his musicians were for the most part no longer utilizing traditional (though retuned) electric guitars. Instead, homemade instruments had been created, wherein guitar strings and pickups were attached to two-by-fours that were laid in banks horizontally and played with small sticks or mallets. In performance, one interesting effect of this technique was that, through amplification, an enormous volume of sound was capable of being produced by very slight and gentle tapping of the strings.
I read this interview with interest. He talked about the influence of minimalist composers.
http://media.hyperreal.org/zines/est/intervs/branca.html (http://media.hyperreal.org/zines/est/intervs/branca.html)
In the other thread (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,22961.msg795299.html#msg795299), Octave mentioned John Cage's dismissal of Glenn Branca's Indeterminate Activity Of Resultant Masses.
Quote"My feelings were disturbed ... I found in myself a willingness to connect the music with evil and with power. I don't want such a power in my life. If it was something political it would resemble fascism" (John Cage, 1982).
Quote from: Brian DuguidCage's main objection to the music is the way in which the band of musicians are required rigorously to follow the will of the composer / conductor (Branca) in order to produce music which appears to consist of a sustained climax, an overwhelming statement of pure, awesome power, which the audience can only submit themselves to.
It is interesting that Boulez criticized John Cage's chance operation and anti-art attitude, claiming that it will lead the society to fascism, in an interview in the early 1970s. In any case, it seems that the musical goal of Branca is the opposite to that of Cage.
Quote"I love La Monte Young and I think what he's doing is incredibly important and his music will be listened to for hundreds of years. But he concentrated his energies completely on the tuning system and on demonstrating that system. It's very beautiful, but what I'm concentrating on is what I think of as rigorous composition. This is the point that I am selling, and that I try to get every young composer I meet to understand. Maybe the trend now is in that direction and doesn't need any more help from me. I don't think we've heard rigorous composition since the beginning of the century. It was dropped for effects, and for systems, and for processes - everything but composition. It's such hard work, and I'm certainly not patting myself on the back, I don't think I've come anywhere near to achieving it."
Who was Harley Gaber? I'm wondering whether to go to this concert tomorrow.
http://cafeoto.co.uk/apartment-house-harley-gaber-the-winds-rise-in-the-north.shtm
I like the microtonal Branca, I had #3 for a long time before I heard the other symphonies. It took me a while to get used to the drums, but they work for me now.
Not sure, but I think he gave up microtonality because it was too much trouble.
Quote from: 7/4 on July 13, 2014, 05:27:05 AM
I like the microtonal Branca, I had #3 for a long time before I heard the other symphonies. It took me a while to get used to the drums, but they work for me now.
Not sure, but I think he gave up microtonality because it was too much trouble.
How does a guitar guy get into microtonality? Isn't it difficult on the guitar?
Quote from: milk on July 13, 2014, 05:29:21 AM
How does a guitar guy get into microtonality? Isn't it difficult on the guitar?
Bending, tuning, or more practically with microtonal frets or fretless guitars.
Quote from: North Star on July 13, 2014, 05:37:37 AM
Bending, tuning, or more practically with microtonal frets or fretless guitars.
custom instruments with frets placed for the tunings
open strings only
slide
fretless
Quote from: 7/4 on July 13, 2014, 06:00:02 AM
custom instruments with frets placed for the tunings
open strings only
slide
fretless
I saw some youtube videos with specially fretted instruments. Well, I have to check out the symphony stuff. I'm curious if he's got a whole ensemble with special instruments or what. But I will check it out.
Quote from: milk on July 13, 2014, 06:38:08 AM
I saw some youtube videos with specially fretted instruments. Well, I have to check out the symphony stuff. I'm curious if he's got a whole ensemble with special instruments or what. But I will check it out.
I think Branca was an instrument builder for his symphonies.
Quote from: 7/4 on July 13, 2014, 09:35:45 AM
I think Branca was an instrument builder for his symphonies.
That makes it much more interesting in a way. How do you like the music?
Quote from: milk on July 13, 2014, 02:33:52 PM
That makes it much more interesting in a way. How do you like the music?
Love his microtonal music! Too bad he gave it up AFAIK (see previous comments).
Quote from: 7/4 on July 13, 2014, 06:12:49 PM
Love his microtonal music! Too bad he gave it up AFAIK (see previous comments).
Symphony No. 14 for symphony orchestra (work in progress) uses harmonic series intervals, according to this article. I don't know about other works.
http://www.newmusicbox.org/articles/glenn-branca-where-my-ears-want-to-go/ (http://www.newmusicbox.org/articles/glenn-branca-where-my-ears-want-to-go/)
Quote from: Glenn BrancaI actually use the harmonic series with symphony orchestras often. I've created an analog of the series that can be played by orchestral musicians who have been familiar with microtonality for many decades now. In fact the first movement of a new orchestral piece I'm writing, Symphony No. 14 (The Harmonic Series), uses entirely harmonic series intervals and has already been performed by The St. Louis Symphony Orchestra.
Quote from: torut on July 13, 2014, 07:00:58 PM
Symphony No. 14 for symphony orchestra (work in progress) uses harmonic series intervals, according to this article. I don't know about other works.
http://www.newmusicbox.org/articles/glenn-branca-where-my-ears-want-to-go/ (http://www.newmusicbox.org/articles/glenn-branca-where-my-ears-want-to-go/)
Good news! I thought he gave it up.
Unfortunately, with N. 3 at least, I can't stand the cymbal bashing drum style. I like what he's doing otherwise but the drum style there is a deal breaker.
Quote from: milk on July 15, 2014, 04:00:06 AM
Unfortunately, with N. 3 at least, I can't stand the cymbal bashing drum style. I like what he's doing otherwise but the drum style there is a deal breaker.
It took me years to get used to the drums, but the sound of the orchestra is amazing.
Quote from: 7/4 on July 16, 2014, 03:18:32 AM
It took me years to get used to the drums, but the sound of the orchestra is amazing.
I'm hooked on all this stuff that plays around with intonation and harmonics and tunings. I need to find out more. Branca built instruments for this? Am I going to end up listening to Sonic Youth again?
Quote from: milk on July 16, 2014, 04:50:56 AM
I'm hooked on all this stuff that plays around with intonation and harmonics and tunings. I need to find out more. Branca built instruments for this? Am I going to end up listening to Sonic Youth again?
If Sonic Youth did anything with microtones, none of the microtonalists are talking about it. I don't think they're Just Intonation guys.
Quote from: 7/4 on July 16, 2014, 06:38:00 AM
If Sonic Youth did anything with microtones, none of the microtonalists are talking about it. I don't think they're Just Intonation guys.
No. But they played around with tunings and were influenced by Branca. What is it called? "Beating"? I think they achieve that effect sometimes. They also played around with screw drivers. But I never read about what they were trying to do. It just sounded "cool" to me when I was listening to it. Microtones should be the next thing for indie rock. Sampling some other Branca stuff I see he's sometimes a kind of rock band.
Quote from: 7/4 on July 16, 2014, 03:18:32 AM
It took me years to get used to the drums, but the sound of the orchestra is amazing.
Which symphonies are your favorites? I like Symphony No. 3 a lot, but I am hesitating over which one to try next. Some of them (No. 1, 5, 13) sound really rockish. However, Symphony No. 7 (for orchestra) sounds like Steve Reich's large ensemble work. (I just heard short clips of those.)
Quote from: amw on May 21, 2014, 10:37:19 PM
Re-listened to Canto Ostinato from the Minimal Piano box. I actually really like this piece, hard to express why—something about the continual shifts in harmony, texture and emphasis. It's not the kind of thing I would have expected to like from the premise, and I imagine most people who share my tastes in contemporary music won't like it, but whatever. >.> Doesn't sound like just two pianos playing; I am interested to hear the original, which I believe is for a larger number of pianos (5 or 10?) I was wrong, there's actually no specified instrumentation. I'll definitely try out one of the ones w/electric organ or similar
Quote from: Ken B on May 22, 2014, 08:43:50 AM
E-e-excellent.
There are versions for 4 pianos.
You can sample short (10 minute) sections from other ten Holt multi piano pieces on youtube. I heartily recommend the box on Brilliant.
Also look for the canto and whirling dervish on youtube ... (no joke)
I just started listening to this 12-CD Canto Ostinato set ($8.99 for download). As far as I heard, it is excellent. The set contains versions for solo piano, for 2 pianos, for 4 pianos, for 3 pianos & organ, for organ, for 2 pianos & 2 marimbas, for multi-track marimbas, for 2 prepared pianos (!), and for synthesizers. At this moment, I am listening to the marimbas version, and I love it.
Ten Holt: Canto Ostinato XL, Jeroen van Veen and friends[asin]B00HE0F88S[/asin]
I listened to all the versions of Canto Ostinato XL set. I was surprised that I didn't get bored or tired of it at all. There might be a common basis that makes Reich's music (particularly Music for 18 Musicians) not boring? The melody of each section is attractive, the transitions between sections are always beautifully done, and there are even moments of climax that are moving. An interesting thing is that performers can repeat each section as many times as they like. I guess that performers' decision would affect whether the music can keep listeners' attention. The performance of Jeroen van Veen & Friends is excellent.
The 1/2/4 piano(s) versions are beautiful. The soft sounds of organ or marimbas fit the music very well. At first, I had reserved feelings about the prepared pianos version and synthesizers version, suspecting that the instruments do not match with the music, but as I kept listening to it, I ended up liking them a lot. Especially, synthesizers versions is very interesting, with many variations of tone colors and sound effects. It's quite different from the simplistic beauty of piano(s) versions.
The 12-CD set was not enough for Jeroen van Veen.
Canto Ostinato XXL (4-CD set), 4 pianos & organ
https://www.youtube.com/v/S4Mwotkkb9M
Quote from: torut on July 21, 2014, 09:58:02 PM
I listened to all the versions of Canto Ostinato XL set. I was surprised that I didn't get bored or tired of it at all. There might be a common basis that makes Reich's music (particularly Music for 18 Musicians) not boring? The melody of each section is attractive, the transitions between sections are always beautifully done, and there are even moments of climax that are moving. An interesting thing is that performers can repeat each section as many times as they like. I guess that performers' decision would affect whether the music can keep listeners' attention. The performance of Jeroen van Veen & Friends is excellent.
The 1/2/4 piano(s) versions are beautiful. The soft sounds of organ or marimbas fit the music very well. At first, I had reserved feelings about the prepared pianos version and synthesizers version, suspecting that the instruments do not match with the music, but as I kept listening to it, I ended up liking them a lot. Especially, synthesizers versions is very interesting, with many variations of tone colors and sound effects. It's quite different from the simplistic beauty of piano(s) versions.
The 12-CD set was not enough for Jeroen van Veen.
Canto Ostinato XXL (4-CD set), 4 pianos & organ
https://www.youtube.com/v/S4Mwotkkb9M
I listened to the two and prepared piano sections today and I was blown away. A few months ago I bought Kees Wieringa & Polo De Haas and was not inspired by it at all (but it may have been me and not them). But the Van Veen so far is fantastic. Actually I was interested in the prepared pianos right away and and just totally hooked on it. I really recommend people check it out. Granted Holt's score is open-ended regarding instruments but this is the first time I've heard of prepared pianos being chosen by performers to interpret a work not specifically for them. I'm in love with it. I don't know how to describe it technically. Maybe it's harmonics and tone. Anyway, it really inspired me.
By the way, I found a John Cage prepared piano app for ipad. It's really fun!
http://johncage.org/cagePiano.html
Quote from: milk on July 22, 2014, 08:23:41 AM
I listened to the two and prepared piano sections today and I was blown away. A few months ago I bought Kees Wieringa & Polo De Haas and was not inspired by it at all (but it may have been me and not them). But the Van Veen so far is fantastic. Actually I was interested in the prepared pianos right away and and just totally hooked on it. I really recommend people check it out. Granted Holt's score is open-ended regarding instruments but this is the first time I've heard of prepared pianos being chosen by performers to interpret a work not specifically for them. I'm in love with it. I don't know how to describe it technically. Maybe it's harmonics and tone. Anyway, it really inspired me.
That is the most unique version I heard. The focus is more on the rhythm and the sound than the melodic sweetness. Although I will probably return to the pianos/marimbas versions more often, that version (and the synthesizers version) revealed another attractive aspects of the piece.
Quote
By the way, I found a John Cage prepared piano app for ipad. It's really fun!
http://johncage.org/cagePiano.html
OT: also, I recommend 4'33" app (http://johncage.org/4_33.html). I had really interesting experiences with it.
Quote from: torut on July 22, 2014, 08:37:46 PM
That is the most unique version I heard. The focus is more on the rhythm and the sound than the melodic sweetness. Although I will probably return to the pianos/marimbas versions more often, that version (and the synthesizers version) revealed another attractive aspects of the piece.
OT: also, I recommend 4'33" app (http://johncage.org/4_33.html). I had really interesting experiences with it.
Thanks! Today I enjoyed the synth version very much. I like the 4'33 app. I'd like to get my students more interested in it. It's a cool idea.
I just learned that the piano duo version by Sandra and Jeroen van Veen is the composer's choice.
http://www.jeroenvanveen.com/cd/page35/page35.html (http://www.jeroenvanveen.com/cd/page35/page35.html)
Simeon ten Holt: 'The best recording ever'
The van Veen's web site has photos of the prepared piano used for the Canto Ostinato recording.
http://www.jeroenvanveen.com/cd/page37/page37.html (http://www.jeroenvanveen.com/cd/page37/page37.html)
(http://www.jeroenvanveen.com/cd/page37/files/img_1394.jpg)
Marc Mellits - Tight Sweater (2005)
https://www.youtube.com/v/FTVnvY1Q5vc
Marc Mellits - String Quartet No. 2 (2004)
I: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf0eJoYeyh8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf0eJoYeyh8)
II: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEiP4cuNvh0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEiP4cuNvh0)
III: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25w-OE866dk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25w-OE866dk)
IV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F56bGgHso-w (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F56bGgHso-w)
There are strong influences of Reich and Nyman (particularly in SQ No. 2 IV.) Enjoyable.
Quote from: torut on September 26, 2014, 04:10:19 PM
Marc Mellits - Tight Sweater (2005)
https://www.youtube.com/v/FTVnvY1Q5vc
Marc Mellits - String Quartet No. 2 (2004)
I: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf0eJoYeyh8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf0eJoYeyh8)
II: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEiP4cuNvh0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEiP4cuNvh0)
III: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25w-OE866dk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25w-OE866dk)
IV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F56bGgHso-w (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F56bGgHso-w)
There are strong influences of Reich and Nyman (particularly in SQ No. 2 IV.) Enjoyable.
Very cool, thanks for sharing,
torut. I have the disc of Real Quiet performing Tight Sweater, and a few other discs featuring the music of Marc Mellits, some real groovy stuff for sure. I've never heard his String Quartet's before, very enjoyable!
Quote from: TheGSMoeller on September 26, 2014, 05:06:01 PM
Very cool, thanks for sharing, torut. I have the disc of Real Quiet performing Tight Sweater, and a few other discs featuring the music of Marc Mellits, some real groovy stuff for sure. I've never heard his String Quartet's before, very enjoyable!
I agree, TheGSMoeller. As far as I found, his works are very nice. Although I still don't know his music enough to understand the originality, I enjoyed Black (I like bass clarinets duo version), Spam, Broken Glass, etc. Paranoid Cheese is really beautiful.
Youuu + Mee = Weee
Charlemagne Palestine, Rhys Chatham
[asin]B00P8H2GDY[/asin]
I pre-ordered this album (the release date is December 9.) The excerpts sound very nice.
https://soundcloud.com/rhys-chatham/charlemagne-palestine-rhys-chatham-sub-rosa-cd-set-excerpt (https://soundcloud.com/rhys-chatham/charlemagne-palestine-rhys-chatham-sub-rosa-cd-set-excerpt)
https://soundcloud.com/rhys-chatham/charlemagne-palestine-rhys-chatahm-sr-cd2-excerpt (https://soundcloud.com/rhys-chatham/charlemagne-palestine-rhys-chatahm-sr-cd2-excerpt)
MM/DD/YY - Selected Music of Kenneth Kirschner / Volume 1-3
https://tokafi.bandcamp.com/album/mm-dd-yy-selected-music-of-kenneth-kirschner-volume-1 (https://tokafi.bandcamp.com/album/mm-dd-yy-selected-music-of-kenneth-kirschner-volume-1)
https://tokafi.bandcamp.com/album/mm-dd-yy-selected-music-of-kenneth-kirschner-volume-2 (https://tokafi.bandcamp.com/album/mm-dd-yy-selected-music-of-kenneth-kirschner-volume-2)
https://tokafi.bandcamp.com/album/mm-dd-yy-selected-music-of-kenneth-kirschner-volume-3 (https://tokafi.bandcamp.com/album/mm-dd-yy-selected-music-of-kenneth-kirschner-volume-3)
(https://f1.bcbits.com/img/a0729776521_7.jpg) (https://f1.bcbits.com/img/a0339469337_7.jpg) (https://f1.bcbits.com/img/a0625852118_7.jpg)
These are collections of Kenneth Kirschner's excellent works (available from http://kennethkirschner.com/ (http://kennethkirschner.com/).) The pieces in volume 1 were selected by tokafi, which are "shorter, more accessible", some of them are quite reminiscent of works of Reich or Feldman. The works in Volume 2 & 3, selected by the composer, are more original and adventurous. I don't know if he is called a minimalist, but I think the works compiled in these volumes are examples of superb minimal music. Every piece is worth listening, imo.
Finally I received my copy of Youuu + Mee = Weeee today (though I pre-ordered it), and now I am listening to the third disc. On disc 1, Palestine strums Bösendorfer piano and Chatham plays long tones on trumpet. Next, Palestine plays continuous chords on Yamaha organ and Chatham strums his guitar. Then, on disc 3, Palestine keeps organ drones and Chatham plays trumpet. The result is amazing. Each combination generates a phenomenal soundscape. A great encounter.
Recently I was very moved by Southam's music. Her works have different aspects, but there is a consistent beauty in them. The Canadian Encyclopedia's article (http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/ann-southam-emc/) seems a good introduction to her music.
electroacoustic - She abandoned electroacoustic compositions in the 1990s. I have not heard any of them.
minimalism - Glass Houses (piano pieces) and orchestra/chamber works in The Music of Ann Southam display the influences of Riley and Reich. Every piece is very nice.
"lyrical atonal" - Simple Lines of Enquiry and Soundings for a New Piano sound abstract, yet there is a sensitive lyricism within the music. Beautiful.
http://recordings.irritablehedgehog.com/album/ann-southam-soundings-for-a-new-piano (http://recordings.irritablehedgehog.com/album/ann-southam-soundings-for-a-new-piano)
Southam's 1986 "Soundings for a New Piano" is one of many works founded on the composer's everlasting 12-tone row. [...] She subtitles the work "12 meditations on a Twelve Tone Row," and meditations they are. [...] Southam ignores Schoenberg's rules at every opportunity. Notes repeat frequently, and it is only towards the end of many of the movements that the twelve-tone row is fully stated. Hers is serialism through the lens of Philip Glass's technique of additive process, in which each repeating phrase accumulates an extra note or notes.
Simple Lines of Enquiry
[asin]B002YOJC2M[/asin]
Soundings of a New Piano
[asin]B005HP9P6S[/asin]
Glass Houses - The Music of Ann Southam
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51NYItpO0YL._SS280.jpg)
Sarah Cahill plays Glass Houses No 7
https://www.youtube.com/v/FpceFeyHEd4
Phill Niblock turns 82 today.
(https://musicakaleidoscope.files.wordpress.com/2015/09/cropped-mk2.png)
Happy Birthday Phill (https://musicakaleidoscope.wordpress.com/2015/10/02/happy-birthday-phill/)
Phill Niblock is a New York-based minimalist composer and multi-media musician and director of Experimental Intermedia, a foundation born in the flames of 1968's barricade-hopping. He has been a maverick presence on the fringes of the avant garde ever since. In the history books Niblock is the forgotten Minimalist. That's as maybe: no one ever said the history books were infallible anyway.
Bio, news and audio clips can be found here. (https://musicakaleidoscope.wordpress.com/2015/10/02/happy-birthday-phill/)
I was going to just make a new thread entitled, "minimalism," but then I decided just to go with this one. I do like to see some wide discussion and examples of minimalism.
I might ask: is this a genre? Is it going anywhere? And, isn't glass (no pun) made to be broken?
Anyway, I find this recording to be, well, lovely, vulnerable, fragile...
it's worth a listen if your in that minimalist mood:
(https://img.discogs.com/33vpHQswNcSfHOu15kElUpEuOXU=/fit-in/600x594/filters:strip_icc():format(webp):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-6887121-1468241664-4874.jpeg.jpg)
(https://img.discogs.com/d7uuv8XasFgIjcUnV5lJ857bDnA=/fit-in/600x601/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-5760994-1401909985-2528.jpeg.jpg)
Have a listen to the duos on this release, no idea who's playing them. Duo II is lovely.
https://www.discogs.com/Otomo-Yoshihide-Sachiko-M-Evan-Parker-Tony-Marsh-John-Edwards-John-Butcher-Quintet-Sextet-Duos/release/5760994
Quote from: Mandryka on April 08, 2021, 12:51:55 AM
(https://img.discogs.com/d7uuv8XasFgIjcUnV5lJ857bDnA=/fit-in/600x601/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-5760994-1401909985-2528.jpeg.jpg)
Have a listen to the duos on this release, no idea who's playing them. Duo II is lovely.
https://www.discogs.com/Otomo-Yoshihide-Sachiko-M-Evan-Parker-Tony-Marsh-John-Edwards-John-Butcher-Quintet-Sextet-Duos/release/5760994
Those frequencies are a little rough-going for me. maybe I need to be in a different mood.
How about this?
https://www.youtube.com/v/_qKa6OkvdAY