A list of composers I want to investigate further:
before 20th century:
Bach
Palestrina
Handel
Scarlatti
Haydn
Beethoven
Schubert
Mendelssohn
Schumann
Tchaikovsky
Satie
Debussy
Bruckner
Chopin
Berlioz
Dvorak
Smetana
Arensky
Gade
Russian, poetic style:
Rimsky-Korsakov
Mussorgsky
Scriabin
Borodin
Medtner
Juon
Rachmaninov
late-romantic:
Mahler
Strauss
Vaughan Williams
Atterberg
Sibelius
Pettersson
Rautavaara
Bax
Nielsen
Rosenberg
Braga Santos
Schmidt
Weingartner
Korngold
Honegger
Bloch
Holmboe
Madetoja
Kokkonen
Rubbra
Bantock
Alwyn
Walton
Dupré
Schmidt
d'Indy
Novak
Suk
Busoni
Arnold
Holmboe
modern:
Shostakovich
Britten
Martinu
Janacek
Tippett
Freitas Branco
Langgaard
Norgard
Heininen
Gorecki
Tansman
Penderecki
Lutoslawski
Ligeti
Kurtag
de Raaff
Manoury
Messiaen
Dutilleux
Jolivet
Donatoni
Petrassi
Stravinsky
Prokofiev
Fedele
Janssen
Top
Anderson
Tabachnik
Birtwistle
Bartok
Boulez
Webern
Berg
Schoenberg
Krenek
Ruders
Gerhard
Lourie
Kabalevsky
Roslavets
Mossolov
Polovinkin
Protopopov
Schnittke
Part
Vivier
Varese
Gudmundsen-Holmgreen
Poulenc
Kabeláč
Ades
Berio
Respighi
Sciarrino
Skalkottas
Xenakis
Maderna
Dallapiccola
Bacri
Lindberg
Lemeland
Mantovani
Cerha
Kaipainen
exotic:
Sculthorpe
Villa Lobos
Takemitsu
Huang Ruo
Akutagawa
Yashiro
Ichiyanagi
Hayasaka
jazzy classical music:
Chesky
Janssen
Rantala
Kapustin
I restrict myself to this list, only keep looking for composers who are still active. Dutch and Italian composers, living and deceased, may become my specialism. The idea is that I want to restrict myself to really enjoy composers, get more familiar with them, keep things clear and don't loose track. For me these are the greatest composers. When I miss composers, composers I would really like, then it's a shame, but the reason I do this is obvious. Maybe after a while I can reflect and revise things.
Henk, you have outlined a lifetime of study! Your list will take hundreds of years to complete! (In the most pleasant way.)
Without recommending anything for the moment, since you mentioned Dutch and Italian composers: are you familiar with Louis Andriessen and Salvatore Sciarrino? The former is sort of a "father of modern minimalism" and the latter, perhaps indebted to Webern, with a penchant for very, very soft sounds. I have had extremely interesting experiences with the music of each. I suspect you might respond to either or both.
--Bruce
Quote from: bhodges on August 07, 2008, 06:28:09 PM
Henk, you have outlined a lifetime of study! Your list will take hundreds of years to complete! (In the most pleasant way.)
I know. I'm not planning to listen to all the music they made. I'll stick to things I like. I really want to re-listen things much. I'm also planning to buy less cd's all along, because where should I leave all those cd's? Also I don't want to have cd's I like but rarely play.
Quote from: bhodges on August 07, 2008, 06:28:09 PM
Without recommending anything for the moment, since you mentioned Dutch and Italian composers: are you familiar with Louis Andriessen and Salvatore Sciarrino? The former is sort of a "father of modern minimalism" and the latter, perhaps indebted to Webern, with a penchant for very, very soft sounds. I have had extremely interesting experiences with the music of each. I suspect you might respond to either or both.
I'm familiar with Andriessen, I like his piano work, though it doesn't bring one very far imo, his more minimalistic opera's I liked less. Sciarrino is a composer I want to investigate. Don't know any of his works. Which work do you recommend?
Quote from: Henk on August 07, 2008, 06:08:41 PM
A list of composers I want to investigate further:
Rosenberg
Who's that? The guy who got tried for high treason against the USA?
QuoteTop
"Top?"
hehe
"What are you listening to?"
"Top."
Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on August 08, 2008, 07:22:41 AM
Who's that? The guy who got tried for high treason against the USA?
Hilding Rosenberg
Quote from: GGGGRRREEG on August 08, 2008, 07:27:55 AM
"Top?"
hehe
"What are you listening to?"
"Top."
:). Nice, to say you're listening to "Top", isn't it? Eduard Top is a dutch, very young, composer.
Quote from: Henk on August 08, 2008, 03:59:51 AM
Sciarrino is a composer I want to investigate. Don't know any of his works. Which work do you recommend?
His
Infinito Nero is fascinating:
here (http://www.musicweb-international.com/sandh/2003/July03/sciarrino157.htm) is a review I wrote, hearing it some five years ago (hard to believe). But the recording on Kairos is (inexplicably) almost $60.
His opera,
Lohengrin, is supposed to be wonderful but I haven't heard it yet. I do have the Nocturnes: Complete Piano Works by Nicolas Hodges (no relation to me), and it's quite good. Both covers are below.
--Bruce
Quote from: bhodges on August 08, 2008, 08:15:51 AM
His Infinito Nero is fascinating: here (http://www.musicweb-international.com/sandh/2003/July03/sciarrino157.htm) is a review I wrote, hearing it some five years ago (hard to believe). But the recording on Kairos is (inexplicably) almost $60.
His opera, Lohengrin, is supposed to be wonderful but I haven't heard it yet. I do have the Nocturnes: Complete Piano Works by Nicolas Hodges (no relation to me), and it's quite good. Both covers are below.
--Bruce
Thanks a lot, Bruce. I'll check out the first two album you mention. Although I like the opera-experience I had, I'll not investigate on opera in this part of my life. Simply other priorities. I can't handle all things together. But I look forward to see more opera in another part of my life. Hopefully also in a live setting, but then I will have to move to Amsterdam I think, which I will probably do.
Besides I recently read that opera´s are being showed in cinemas. In some cities in NL you can see opera´s in cinemas performed in NY at the same time. Strong concept I think.
I thought I might get (irritated) reactions because of having an apart, very liminated, category "outside europe". ;D But no reactions at all ???. You are all very sensible people :).
Anderson? As in Leroy?
Quote from: Henk on August 07, 2008, 06:08:41 PM
A list of composers I want to investigate further:
Good luck! But please remember that you also wanted to revolutionize Jazz. Have you started learning to play an instrument yet?
Henk, when we recommend recordings to you, how old can those recordings be? Is mono sound acceptable to you?
Quote from: M forever on August 08, 2008, 03:33:46 PM
Good luck! But please remember that you also wanted to revolutionize Jazz. Have you started learning to play an instrument yet?
That was a bit of a flush :).
Quote from: eyeresist on August 08, 2008, 08:56:50 PM
Henk, when we recommend recordings to you, how old can those recordings be? Is mono sound acceptable to you?
Yes, I don't care much about that.
Try Douglas Lilburn too (New Zealand). There is a v good Naxos CD with his three symphonies on.
Quote from: vandermolen on August 09, 2008, 01:42:37 AM
Try Douglas Lilburn too (New Zealand). There is a v good Naxos CD with his three symphonies on.
Interesting, I'll try. Thanks for the tip.
Quote from: Henk on August 07, 2008, 06:08:41 PM
A list of composers I want to investigate further:
before 20th century:
Bach
Palestrina
Handel
...
You list suggests that up to now you have investigated very few composers, or none at all. 8)
Thomas
Quote from: sound67 on August 09, 2008, 07:57:02 AM
You list suggests that up to now you have investigated very few composers, or none at all. 8)
Thomas
Can you tell how it suggests it, Thomas?
Among other things, the list has two out of the three B's. :o
And I don't mean Bax. ;D
Quote from: sound67 on August 09, 2008, 09:03:39 AM
Among other things, the list has two out of the three B's. :o
And I don't mean Bax. ;D
Ah. How can you have fully investigated a composer you like enough. I don't like Brahms really.
I edited my list, I'm more content with it now. I added many Russian composers (also in the "modern" category), added a category "Russian, poetic style" and renamed the category "outside Europe" into "exotic music".
Composers I haven't explored too much and would like to investigate further:
Berlioz
Medtner
Mendelssohn
Anyway, right now I am much more into Tangerine Dream and King Crimson. 0:)
Quote from: M forever on August 08, 2008, 03:33:46 PM
Good luck! But please remember that you also wanted to revolutionize Jazz. Have you started learning to play an instrument yet?
I said it was a flush, but now I hear Miles Davis again, I want! And what would become of me if I would not?
Henk
Wagner
Saint-Saens
Bartok
Vaughn Williams
Sibelius
Those would probably be my next 5 targets :)
Excellent list, ChN!
Quote from: ChamberNut on September 02, 2008, 06:18:29 AM
Wagner
Really? I thought you were well into exploring his music. :)
QuoteSaint-Saens
Definitely give those piano concerti (No. 2, No. 5 Egyptian, and the unnumbered 'African' Fantasy) a listen, and the third VC, too. But I'm pretty certain that his chamber works are pretty close to, if not at the top of your list. Those are works I would also like to listen to.
Quote from: opus67 on September 02, 2008, 06:32:23 AM
Really? I thought you were well into exploring his music. :)
Yes, I am indeed, but it is still a work in progress. Now that I have listened to the entire Ring cycle 3 or 4 times, and Parsifal once, I want to do the same for Tristan & Isolde. And then perhaps Die Miestersinger.
Jolivet
d'Indy
Ligeti
Quote from: ChamberNut on September 02, 2008, 06:57:13 AM
Yes, I am indeed, but it is still a work in progress. Now that I have listened to the entire Ring cycle 3 or 4 times, and Parsifal once, I want to do the same for Tristan & Isolde. And then perhaps Die Miestersinger.
OH yes Tristan und Isolde 0:).....such a sublime opera, you know Wagner was one of the last opera composers that I investigated many years ago. Before Wagner I thought Mozart's Don Giovanni and Verdi's Otello were as good as opera got then along came Tristan......and blew those 2 operas away 0:)......oh yes Tristan und Isolde et rien que Tristan und Isolde 0:)....Enjoy!!
marvin
Quote from: Henk on September 02, 2008, 06:14:43 AM
I said it was a flush, but now I hear Miles Davis again, I want! And what would become of me if I would not?
Henk
if you want to, then go do it!
Adams
Berio
Berlioz
Boccherini
Boulez
Brahms
CPE Bach
Carter
Corelli
Feldman
Gesualdo
Gluck
Hindemith
Hummel
Janáček
Josquin
Ligeti
Lindberg
Mahler
Mendelssohn
Monteverdi
Nørgård
Nielsen
Nono
Pärt
Palestrina
Prokofiev
Purcell
Rameau
Rihm
Saint-Saëns
Schütz
Schnittke
Shostakovich
Simpson
Tüür
Tallis
Tchaikovsky
Vivaldi
Wagner
Weber
Webern
Wuorinen
... to name a few.
Quote from: GGGGRRREEG on September 02, 2008, 12:44:24 PM
if you want to, then go do it!
Thanks for the encouraging words, Greg!! I almost don't know what to say.. you really touch me. Tears in my eyes, man :-).
Henk
Quote from: marvinbrown on September 02, 2008, 12:26:05 PM
OH yes Tristan und Isolde 0:).....such a sublime opera, you know Wagner was one of the last opera composers that I investigated many years ago. Before Wagner I thought Mozart's Don Giovanni and Verdi's Otello were as good as opera got then along came Tristan......and blew those 2 operas away 0:)......oh yes Tristan und Isolde et rien que Tristan und Isolde 0:)....Enjoy!!
Hmm . . . bad salesmanship,
Marvin! Enjoy
Wagner as much as you please, by all means; but
Tristan blowing either
Verdi or
Mozart away? Much as I enjoyed an initial listen to
Tristan, I heard no such matter. Where's the need to kick
Verdi and
Mozart under the carpet?
Quote from: karlhenning on September 02, 2008, 02:09:08 PM
Hmm . . . bad salesmanship, Marvin! Enjoy Wagner as much as you please, by all means; but Tristan blowing either Verdi or Mozart away? Much as I enjoyed an initial listen to Tristan, I heard no such matter. Where's the need to kick Verdi and Mozart under the carpet?
It's the Wagner personality doing it. ;D
Well, I will investigate almost any composer further, even the most obvious ones, because only of the least I know almost any output. E.g. there's still Bruckner/2 and Bruckner 9 partially or Mahler/10 on my roadmap. Or Sibelius/6.
I'll once try Karl Amadeus Hartmann, heard nothing of him yet. And most of Shostakovich.
Quote from: Don on September 02, 2008, 02:10:53 PM
It's the Wagner personality doing it. ;D
Yes I am in desperate need of therapy......Hi my name is marvin and I'm a Wagnerholic.
PS: For treatment of this sort I heard they charge by the hour :-\.
marvin
Quote from: marvinbrown on September 03, 2008, 05:55:49 AM
Yes I am in desperate need of therapy......Hi my name is marvin and I'm a Wagnerholic.
PS: For treatment of this sort I heard they charge by the hour :-\.
marvin
Yes, it's a steep price, but at the end you'll be a Verdiholic.
That's what's great about being a therapist. One addiction gets replaced by another, and the therapist takes home all the money.
Quote from: James on September 02, 2008, 11:51:43 PM
. . . After Wagner, no one could pretend like he didn't exist.
Sure, and partly because of the hype (and
Wagner was as much hypemeister as
maestro), that was true
of that age.But
Wagner's been dead for a century and a quarter, and Music has moved on (and the whole "music of the future" wheeze was dated at press-time, anyway). In our day,
Wagner is one of a large number of historical artifacts who have been assimilated into the mix; you practically need to be a Wagnerrhoid in our day to claim that his music MUST HAVE a vital impact on any composer working now.
A composer today might, of course, find part of his own inspiration in
Wagner; but overall, no, he isn't the towering figure now that he was a hundred years ago. For most of us, he just doesn't matter all that much; not compared to twenty other, more recent composers.
Quote from: karlhenning on September 03, 2008, 06:17:58 AM
A composer today might, of course, find part of his own inspiration in Wagner; but overall, no, he isn't the towering figure now that he was a hundred years ago. For most of us, he just doesn't matter all that much; not compared to twenty other, more recent composers.
That is, Wagner is not as influential as he was 100 years ago. It would have been pretty much impossible to maintain that intensity of influence. 100 years ago it was said that there were more books about Wagner than about any other figure in history, including Jesus.
That doesn't stop Wagner from being a towering composer today.
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 03, 2008, 06:28:50 AM
That is, Wagner is not as influential as he was 100 years ago. It would have been pretty much impossible to maintain that intensity of influence. 100 years ago it was said that there were more books about Wagner than about any other figure in history, including Jesus.
That doesn't stop Wagner from being a towering composer today.
Sure. But then, there's hardly only one tower in the world, is there?
Quote from: karlhenning on September 03, 2008, 06:30:40 AM
Sure. But then, there's hardly only one tower in the world, is there?
There's Joan. :D
Quote from: James on September 03, 2008, 08:45:11 AM
He's unavoidable.
Oh, none of my composition instructors appeared to think so. They had me study many scores over years of tuition in the art of composition; not once while I was in the composition studio, was I assigned a
Wagner score to study. That was an environment in which there was no need to avoid him: he just wasn't there.
We could go on and on about Wagner's impact, but I think it's fair to say that he's one of the "big four" composers for opera, the others being Mozart, Verdi and Puccini.
Quote from: James on September 03, 2008, 08:59:45 AM
Yeah, well that's you and your experience. But I've asked & read-of many musicians (incl.most big name composers) who have a very different relationship, experience & perspective of his music...
That's fine,
James. But my experience is one example indicating that your use of
unavoidable here is ill-advised. Again: Compositionally,
Wagner means nothing to me; nor is this a matter of laborious avoidance. He just doesn't figure.
It's fine if he figures for other composers; that's their trip. I will be entitled to my own journey, thank you very much.
Quote from: Don on September 03, 2008, 09:01:38 AM
We could go on and on about Wagner's impact, but I think it's fair to say that he's one of the "big four" composers for opera, the others being Mozart, Verdi and Puccini.
What - no Monteverdi? I'd happily change one of your four for him.
My experience with Karel Husa was that he never introduced pre-20th century music into his classes. He felt that was for other teachers to teach, and that 20th century composers should be studying 20th century scores. It would be a rare composition class today that had Wagner as a subject of study. But music history surveys and form and anaylsis classes are required of composition students, and it's there that they study Wagner.
My undergraduate teacher, John Boda, spoke of Wagner frequently (he had a picture on his office of himself feeding a swan with the caption "rehearsing the swan for his entrance in Lohengrin"). I could never string four ascending chromatic notes in a row without him saying I must be quoting Tristan.
Quote from: erato on September 03, 2008, 09:05:51 AM
What - no Monteverdi? I'd happily change one of your four for him.
I wasn't talking about what you or I prefer but general popularity.
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 03, 2008, 09:07:49 AM
My experience with Karel Husa was that he never introduced pre-20th century music into his classes. He felt that was for other teachers to teach, and that 20th century composers should be studying 20th century scores. It would be a rare composition class today that had Wagner as a subject of study. But music history surveys and form and anaylsis classes are required of composition students, and it's there that they study Wagner.
And in music history surveys,
James's adjective
unavoidable is just.
Wagner is one of a number of important, and therefore unavoidable, figures (
Monteverdi being another,
erato).
Apart from
Wuorinen in Buffalo (who, actually, did not assign me any score study), each of my composition instructors had me study some piece(s) or other from before the 20th century. (
Rimsky-Korsakov's Sheherazade and the
Chopin Preludes spring to recollection. Hmm, the
Beethoven Fourth Symphony, too!)
Quote from: MarkMy undergraduate teacher, John Boda, spoke of Wagner frequently (he had a picture on his office of himself feeding a swan with the caption "rehearsing the swan for his entrance in Lohengrin"). I could never string four ascending chromatic notes in a row without him saying I must be quoting Tristan.
"Pardon me, boys [
est-ce que c'est le Tchou-Tchou Tchattanougah?]"
Quote from: James on September 03, 2008, 09:16:43 AM
It's not just relegated to Opera Don, Wagner's importance & greatness is so much more than that. (as I've stated earlier)
Right, but I was just referring to popularity.
Quote from: James on September 03, 2008, 09:23:08 AM
Monteverdi, are you serious?
No, of course, not,
James. No one who has any opinion at variance with yours could be
serious, could he?
Quote from: James on September 03, 2008, 09:27:28 AM
You would seriously put Monteverdi on the same plain as Bach or Wagner? Gotta say, that's a take I've never heard before.
You have a knack for wilful misreading,
James, which makes discussion with you a wearisome prospect.
So . . . where did you study music, and yet learn nothing of
Monteverdi?
I should add that only a small fraction of what I know about music literature was gained in a classroom. I spent my college years sitting in the music library with recordings and scores of all kinds of music. My first attempt to assimilate the Ring was only partly successful (there's a lot to assimilate). For one thing, I wanted to know what the singers were singing about, and the score I was reading from only had German. So I would read the libretto booklet for the English translation until I got to the indication end of side one. Then I'd listen to side one. Then I'd read the English translation for what happened on side 2, then I'd listen to side 2, etc. I found Rheingold thoroughly engrossing, but my attention flagged by the time I got to Götterdämmerung. It wasn't until I was out of college that I took the time to take the LPs and listen to side 1 over and over until the music sunk in. Then I'd listen to side 2 over and over until the music sunk in, and so on. By the time I got through Rheingold in this manner I was hooked. Then I went on to Götterdämmerung and discovered that was even greater.
I think any musician, especially an aspiring composer, needs to take it into his/her own hand to become acquainted with a large quantity of music, even that which he thinks he's not going to like (I didn't like Wagner until I decided to delve into him).
KANCHELI, WAGNER
Looking into these guys at the moment for very different reasons.
KANCHELI because I'vebeen reading about how explosive he can be, and WAGNER because it's lazyness keeping me from his Operas.
And Rangstrom.
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 03, 2008, 09:33:40 AM
I should add that only a small fraction of what I know about music literature was gained in a classroom. . . .
Ditto. Peculiarly, perhaps, one of the first scores I went to a music library to find was
Monteverdi's L'Orfeo . . . at a campus of Fairleigh Dickinson when I was in jr high? High school? Don't remember.
John, I owe you thanks for the attempt at restoring the topic!
Langgaard
Holmboe
Berg (still need to dig into Lulu)
Right now, I'm particularly interested in hearing more Tippett. I've been a bit short on listening time of late, but I've really been enjoying the 2nd & 4th symphonies, and the concerto for orchestra.
I see Naxos is doing a cycle of the five quartets: I guess this will be one of my next ports of call.
On the subject of British composers: I'd like to find out if there's any more Arnold that's of the quality of (say) the 5th & 7th symphonies. But that's probably something for another thread.
Quote from: edward on September 03, 2008, 10:08:37 AM
Right now, I'm particularly interested in hearing more Tippett.
Hear, hear. I went through a phase of initial acquaintance with a small pile of
Tippett discs, but I need to go back and visit some more.
Quote from: edward on September 03, 2008, 10:08:37 AM
Right now, I'm particularly interested in hearing more Tippett. I've been a bit short on listening time of late, but I've really been enjoying the 2nd & 4th symphonies, and the concerto for orchestra.
I see Naxos is doing a cycle of the five quartets: I guess this will be one of my next ports of call.
On the subject of British composers: I'd like to find out if there's any more Arnold that's of the quality of (say) the 5th & 7th symphonies. But that's probably something for another thread.
Tippetts 2nd quartet, particularly the haunting first movement, is a particular favorite. There's (or maybe there used to be) an absolutely splendid cheap ASV double with the Lindsay quartet in all 5 that I cherish.
And re Arnold: Number Nine (as dear departed John Winston used to say)
Quote from: edward on September 03, 2008, 10:08:37 AM
Right now, I'm particularly interested in hearing more Tippett. I've been a bit short on listening time of late, but I've really been enjoying the 2nd & 4th symphonies, and the concerto for orchestra.
Tippett is one of my favorites of the late 20th century. He wrote some wonderful orchestral music, including the four symphonies and the
Triple Concerto for string trio with orchestra, and his extraordinary final work
The Rose Lake.
Quote
I see Naxos is doing a cycle of the five quartets: I guess this will be one of my next ports of call.
The first three quartets are from the early 1940s, and are polite examples of English neo-classicism. They don't have the real Tippett personality in them (though I wouldn't argue with Erato's advocacy of the 2nd). The fourth quartet, from 1978, suffers from an overabundance of unplayable double stops, and is bound to be more effective in its string orchestra arrangement, called
Water out of Sunlight. The 5th Quartet, from 1990, is to my ears the most satisfying of his quartets.
Watch out for his operas. He wrote his own librettos, and they're rather..... peculiar.
The Midsummer Marriage has some beautiful music in it, including the
Ritual Dances which are sometimes performed separately.
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 03, 2008, 10:51:33 AM
Watch out for his operas. He wrote his own librettos, and they're rather..... peculiar.
Most diplomatic,
Mark! 8)
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 03, 2008, 10:51:33 AM
and his extraordinary final work The Rose Lake.
Oh, yes! I forgot to mention that one: I was immediately taken by the piece when I heard the world premiere live on Radio 3 (at a time when I didn't have all that much interest in new music) and have both the Davis and Hickox recordings. Thanks for the comments regarding the quartets--do you know if the string orchestra version of the 4th has ever been recorded commercially?
Need to spend more time with Janáček's and Britten's operas, too.
Quote from: karlhenning on September 03, 2008, 11:07:25 AM
Need to spend more time with Janáček's and Britten's operas, too.
Now that's something I can second wholeheartedly.
Quote from: edward on September 03, 2008, 11:01:24 AM
-do you know if the string orchestra version of the 4th has ever been recorded commercially?
Not that I know of.
I forgot to mention another Tippett favorite of mine, the
Fantasia concertante on a theme of Corelli, a very beautiful and complex work for string orchestra. There's one episode about 17 minutes into that just glows! A lot of music that Tippett wrote in the 1950s has the same radiance, including the Piano Concerto.
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 03, 2008, 11:19:18 AM
I forgot to mention another Tippett favorite of mine, the Fantasia concertante on a theme of Corelli, a very beautiful and complex work for string orchestra.
(* pounds the table! *)
Quote from: karlhenning on September 03, 2008, 11:25:15 AM
(* pounds the table! *)
Why do you do that when you'd rather log on somewhere and buy this ridiculously cheap and glorious disc:
(http://www.mdt.co.uk/public/pictures/products/standard/4767960.jpg)
This last page has been one after my own heart. Tippett and Janacek, eh? Doesn't get much better than that.
Mark, do you know if Water out of Sunlight has been recorded? (Stupid me, I could just look, and I will!) You are quite right about the 4th quartet being almost unplayable - it looks so luscious on the page but comes off as a bit of a struggle in performance. It's contemporary with the Triple Concerto, of course - in fact, it shares quite a bit of some of that work's most striking material - and the Triple Concerto is Tippett at his most gorgeously lyrical. I want more of that sort of thing.
'Tippett at his most lyrical' BTW means, to me -
Double Concerto
A Child of Our Time
Correlli Fantasy
(throw in the Handel Fantasy too, though it's nowhere near such a fine work)
Midsummer Marriage - one of the great operas of the century, with such a special soundworld
Piano Concerto - an offshoot of the above opera, and my favourite British PC by some distance
Triple Concerto
Rose Lake
and odds and ends like the Four Horn Sonata. These pieces ought to win anyone over, but they aren't the end of the story as far as Tippett is concerned
Quote from: erato on September 03, 2008, 11:30:58 AM
Why do you do that . . . .
I like the sound, chiefly.
Maxwell-Davies, string quartets (Naxos quartets). I wasn't sure if the composer hadn't lost his edge in recent years, but the quartets 3 & 4 (2003, I think) are masterful music of great finesse. Also, a quite timeless modernity that binds itself neither to tonality, atonality or modality, but finds some middleground floating in between. I am looking forward to more of those quartets.
Quote from: karlhenning on September 03, 2008, 11:48:49 AM
I like the sound, chiefly.
Perhaps you are working on a
Sonata for Clarinet and Desktop?
Quote from: eyeresist on September 03, 2008, 08:16:29 PM
Perhaps you are working on a Sonata for Clarinet and Desktop?
No, that combination does not appeal to me, somehow.
A sonata for clarinet and laptop would be a possibility. Some music departments are teaching laptop as a musical instrument.
http://plork.cs.princeton.edu/
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 04, 2008, 04:36:38 AM
A sonata for clarinet and laptop would be a possibility. Some music departments are teaching laptop as a musical instrument.
http://plork.cs.princeton.edu/
Computerised music as performance is silly. There's no need for all those PCs on stage when one would suffice, and once the music is written there's no need for a human pressing the buttons (and if you want aleatoric music, the PC can do that too.)
That said, I used to be a big techno fan, and can understand the
emotional appeal of retaining the human element on stage.
I followed the link and...well...just absurd.
I don't think you guys appreciate what's going on in that picture. Those laptops are running interactive software that allows them to alter the programming in real time, while the program is running. Those people are not just sitting there playing MIDI files.
Also, each key on the keypad can be programmed to play a certain sound or sequence of sounds every time it is hit. That potentially gives each laptop player a lot of sounds to play with, and they can be played in whatever rhythm the composer specifies. The laptop has serious potential as a musical instrument.
I, myself have played a composition for clarinet and laptop, as a matter of fact. In 2004 I performed at Colgate University a piece called Tephillah for clarinet and electronics by Howard Sandroff. Basically this was a clarinet solo in which the clarinet is miked and the signal sent into the computer where various sound processing modules sustained, echoed, altered and otherwise manipulated the clarinet sounds to produce more colors and textures than would have been possible with a clarinet by itself. The sound processing was operated by a performer at the laptop.
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 08, 2008, 03:24:29 PM
I, myself have played a composition for clarinet and laptop, as a matter of fact. In 2004 I performed at Colgate University a piece called Tephillah for clarinet and electronics by Howard Sandroff. Basically this was a clarinet solo in which the clarinet is miked and the signal sent into the computer where various sound processing modules sustained, echoed, altered and otherwise manipulated the clarinet sounds to produce more colors and textures than would have been possible with a clarinet by itself. The sound processing was operated by a performer at the laptop.
Doesn't Boulez do the exact same thing in Repons?
Morton Subotnick did something similar in the 1970s with a tape containing a "ghost score" rather than sounds. The live instruments would be miked and the signal sent into a multi-effect box (I think you had to rent it from the publisher in order to play the pieces) which would alter the sounds according to instructions encoded on the tape.
Quote from: James on September 08, 2008, 04:59:56 PM
that work and other works like Dialogue de l'ombre double
That's the one I meant to write, not Repons. (i have the disc with both of those on it, so that's why i got them confused).
There are so many composers I want to hear more of.
One would be Jon Leifs of Iceland (1899-1068). I heard one CD on Chandos and was intrigued. Leifs might be called the Bartok of Iceland.
From what I have heard about it, his music is imbued with the traditions, history, legends and folk music of this intriguing island nation.
BIS and Chandos have recorded some of his music, including Hekla, a
portait of the Icelandic volcano said to be the loudest music ever written, and the Edda, based on Icelandic folklore and creation myths, among other things. According to reports, Leifs actually uses rocks as percussion instruments ! The composer lived in Germany for many years, and his wife was Jewish. I have to hear more of his music.
QuoteAccording to reports, Leifs actually uses rocks as percussion instruments !
'Hekla' is an absolute monster of a piece! Great fun to listen to, but it might upset the neighbours as it really isn't a piece you can listen to quietly.
The inlay notes on the excellent BIS recording (of which 'Hekla' is just one of a variety of Leifs' works one the disc) include a section by the Iceland SO's principle tympanist in which he lists the more eccentric percussion and how these were used and recorded. They include tuned steel tubing to represent low-pitched anvils; stones (large and small); ships chains; plate bells; a wooden device similar to a Mahler hammer; sirens...
Leifs' orchestral pieces 'Dettifoss' which depicts an Icelandic waterfall, and 'Geysir' which is an orchestral representation of the natural phenomenon, are in a similar vein.
Meanwhile, some composers I intend investigating further include Britten, Bax and Brian.
Paul Zukovsky was a great violinist (he has done the best recording of the Will Schumann vn concerto among other fine stuff). He disappeared from the scene and resurfaced as musical director of some Icelandic music society which among other stuff, did a complete recording of Leifs oratorio Baldr in 92 on the cp2 label owned by Musical Observations Inc of New York. This was before BIS picked up the Leifs torch.
I have this recording but know nothing about the companuy, the label or Zukovskys fate. Anybody know something?
Leifs is a fantastically interesting composer in my opinion!
I suppose that it is partly because I spent two glorious weeks in Iceland last summer that I respond so enthusiastically to his depictions of the amazing natural phenomena of that wonderful, amazing country :)
Works like 'Hekla', 'Dettifoss', 'Geysir' and 'Haifs' evoke such memories of the dramatic scenery on the island :)
The Saga Symphony and the Organ Concerto are also favourites of mine.
But he is very loud :) :) You would not want to play too many pieces in succession without running the risk of a headache :)
The BIS series makes up a splendid collection and is strongly recommended.
Dmitri Shostakovich!
Quote from: Mark G. Simon on September 08, 2008, 03:24:29 PMI don't think you guys appreciate what's going on in that picture. Those laptops are running interactive software that allows them to alter the programming in real time, while the program is running. Those people are not just sitting there playing MIDI files.
Something like Ableton Live or such?
Mauler!
:D
Symphony No. 2 is definitely in. I'll be downloading a few more of his symphonies in the very near future for test-listens.
Quote from: opus67 on October 03, 2008, 08:41:39 AM
Mauler!
:D
Symphony No. 2 is definitely in. I'll be downloading a few more of his symphonies in the very near future for test-listens.
Excellent! :) No. 2 was a wonderful recent "rediscovery" for me as well. And so was No. 6
Mauser?
Hammer. Not Gun.
Sibelius 0:)! For some reason during the past years I have ignored this fine composer. I recently bought 2 sets of Sibelius' symphonies (Maazel and Blomstedt) and am listening to this set at the moment:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/415dkb3WBNL._SS500_.jpg)
Afterwards I think I'll go for the tone poems and see what else this fine composer wrote.
marvin