After some searching, I noticed (or, at least, I thought I noticed) that there isn't a dedicated thread to the Dutch composer Louis Andriessen. After hearing De Leeuw lead the Los Angeles Philharmonic in De Staat (1976) and Racconto dell'Inferno (2004) via the iTunes "DG Concerts" set, I've been fairly interested in Andriessen. His music clearly has a broad range of influences, from bebop to Stravinsky to American rock music, but it certainly eschews most establish styles. It might be safest, in my experience, to say Andriessen is post-serialist and post-minimalist.
Here (http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/johntusainterview/andriessen_transcript.shtml) is a BBC Radio 3 interview with Andriessen (John Tusa interviewing).
Here (http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/Namedrill?&name_id=294&name_role=1), too, is a link to some of his recordings.
If you're interested in the iTunes release, despite the plethora of drawbacks with iTMS and iTunes products, you can find it - and iTMS versions of many of the Andriessen recordings, including some OOP ones, at the iTMS.
Some info about Louis Andriessen at the institution for supporting and comproting Dutch contemporary composers Donemus (http://www.donemus.nl/componist.php?id=34).
Q
Oh good, an Andriessen thread! While I have not heard the two pieces you mention, two of his others are very high on my favorites list: Hoketus and Workers Union, both from 1975. The latter, written for "any loud-sounding group of instruments" is absolutely riveting and diabolically difficult to play. I've heard it live twice, once with Bang on a Can (who recorded it) and then with the International Contemporary Ensemble. A friend just bought the score a few weeks ago and has promised to lend it to me when he's had a chance to look it over. Here's the BOAC recording:
(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/31MEBK5NNPL._AA240_.jpg)
I also saw his opera, Writing to Vermeer, as part of the Lincoln Center Festival a few years ago, and it was one of the most astonishing works, visually, I've ever seen. Huge projections of handwritten letters crawled over the set, which was overflowing with some 40,000 gallons of water, rushing over the stage and into a huge trough below. The libretto is by filmmaker Peter Greenaway, who imagines three women in Vermeer's life writing to him while he is away, visiting The Hague.
I have not yet heard the recording, released last year with the same personnel (I believe) which is supposed to be excellent.
(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/51NM22RP4FL._AA240_.jpg)
--Bruce
It might be advisable to add the composer's given name to the thread title, as Louis is not the only Andriessen composer out there (AFAIK). I realize this will somehow impair the alliterative punch but then this is just a suggestion, you may as well ignore me. 0:)
Louis Andriessen comes to Warsaw every now and then, so I have heard some of his music but not enough to form any final opinion. I do find the Bang on a Can recordings that Bruce mentions quite enjoyable but I've also heard some uninteresting music from him (the titles are gone, I'm afraid... ::)).
I have a disc of orchestral music by his brother Jurriaan. Excellent. I understand he is much, much less adventurous than Louie, though.
Quote from: Maciek on June 30, 2007, 04:23:00 PM
It might be advisable to add the composer's given name to the thread title, as Louis is not the only Andriessen composer out there (AFAIK). I realize this will somehow impair the alliterative punch but then this is just a suggestion, you may as well ignore me. 0:)
Despite the break in tradition and alliteration that such an alteration would entail, I have seen the light of your suggestion and have already made the necessary changes.
Over the weekend I listened again to the Bang on a Can versions of Workers Union and Hoketus. While they both require virtuosity that is compelling on its own terms, I think Workers Union will perhaps get more play. Hoketus probably drives some listeners mad with its spare construction: for much of the piece the musicians are rocking back and forth on just two notes (i.e., based on the medieval hocket), making it perhaps for hardcore minimalists only. But Workers Union gets more interesting with each hearing.
--Bruce
Quote from: Lilas Pastia on June 30, 2007, 05:02:50 PM
I have a disc of orchestral music by his brother Jurriaan. Excellent. I understand he is much, much less adventurous than Louie, though.
Right. In my musical circles, there's little doubt as to the talents that were distributed among the large Andriessen family:
First comes, by a long distance, father Hendrik Andriessen, who is a major composer in his own right. Second comes his eldest son, Jurriaan Andriessen, with some fine works, and btw also a fine film music composer. And third or fourth (there are many more talented Andriessens, like e.g. another Jurriaan and also uncle Willem Andriessen) comes the angry young man of the musical family, Louis. Not so talented perhaps as a composer, but definitely with a succesful PR.
Thanks, Christo. I really like the Jurriaan disc I have (Berkshire symphonies etc, on NMC). What works of Hendrik would you recommend?
Quote from: Lilas Pastia on July 02, 2007, 07:12:39 PM
Thanks, Christo. I really like the Jurriaan disc I have (Berkshire symphonies etc, on NMC). What works of Hendrik would you recommend?
All of them. But if you can find it, the NMC CD with his Miroir de Peine, Couperin Variations, Kuhnau Variations, Chormatic Variations. Otherwise the recently released ETCETERA twofer with his four symphonies (albeit sometimes in historic performances) and other orchestral pieces.
Quote from: bhodges on July 02, 2007, 06:12:13 AM
Over the weekend I listened again to the Bang on a Can versions of Workers Union and Hoketus. While they both require virtuosity that is compelling on its own terms, I think Workers Union will perhaps get more play. Hoketus probably drives some listeners mad with its spare construction: for much of the piece the musicians are rocking back and forth on just two notes (i.e., based on the medieval hocket), making it perhaps for hardcore minimalists only. But Workers Union gets more interesting with each hearing.
There's something about
Hoketus's relentlessness which I've always liked,
Bruce; but then, I don't revisit it all that frequently. Curious about
Worker's Union, and I want to revisit
De Staat, too.
(http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/31MEBK5NNPL._AA240_.jpg)
This disc is terrific!!!
The ever-changing cross-rhythms in these minimalistic pieces are endlessly fascinating. Sort of like an aural kaleidascope.
Quote from: johnQpublic on July 03, 2007, 05:00:16 AM
This disc is terrific!!!
Yes, though the cover art is abysmal.
Fact is, I should have fetched the disc in long ago, were it not for the repellant cover.
Quote from: karlhenning on July 03, 2007, 05:02:03 AM
Yes, though the cover art is abysmal.
Fact is, I should have fetched the disc in long ago, were it not for the repellant cover.
Aww...I like it! Seriously! :'(
Anyway, back to
Workers Union for a second. Apparently the score (which I hope to see soon) has no exact pitch specifications, but asks the performers to choose their own within a range. Here are
notes from the Los Angeles Philharmonic's performance. (http://www.laphil.com/resources/piece_detail.cfm?id=2001)
And totally agree with your characterization of
Hoketus as "relentless."
--Bruce
Quote from: bhodges on July 03, 2007, 06:38:06 AM
Anyway, back to Workers Union for a second. Apparently the score (which I hope to see soon) has no exact pitch specifications, but asks the performers to choose their own within a range. Here are notes from the Los Angeles Philharmonic's performance. (http://www.laphil.com/resources/piece_detail.cfm?id=2001)
You'd think (maybe), as a performer, that I'd like the "let the players choose their notes" gambit. Somehow, that's always struck me as laziness on part of the composer; now, maybe I'll find the score which revises that impression, someday . . . but, meanwhile, I find the composer's role in designating the pitch-content too big a part of The Fun . . . .
How do you like
Writing to Vermeer and/or
Rosa - The Death of a Composer,
Bruce?
Quote from: karlhenning on July 03, 2007, 06:46:18 AM
You'd think (maybe), as a performer, that I'd like the "let the players choose their notes" gambit. Somehow, that's always struck me as laziness on part of the composer; now, maybe I'll find the score which revises that impression, someday . . . but, meanwhile, I find the composer's role in designating the pitch-content too big a part of The Fun . . . .
How do you like Writing to Vermeer and/or Rosa - The Death of a Composer, Bruce?
The thing is, although the pitch specifications are not exact,
the rhythms are, with the ensemble often playing in unison and navigating horrendously tricky meters that they all have to execute very precisely. It was that "spin on a dime" quality that impressed me about the piece, the first time I heard it.
I thought
Writing to Vermeer was gorgeous, although I've only heard it once. (Another recording on the "to get" list.) But I confess my impressions may have been influenced by the production, which was not only one of the most complex I've ever seen, but also one of the most beautiful. (I tried to find a good photo online...the one below is not bad but doesn't quite do it justice. But it gives you an idea.)
I haven't yet heard
Rosa, but friends who have say it's one of his best works.
--Bruce
What? He's written something called Rosa? :o Now they tell me! >:(
Now, calm down, Maciek . . . .
;D
Here is the LOOS Ensemble playing Hout in Buenos Aires in 1995 (two parts). (Andriessen wrote it for them in 1990.) Quality is pretty good...the piece will either mesmerize you or drive you bonkers, but it's a very good example of his style. ;D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Qtlq_PCqOE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eh_l4ueSj18
--Bruce
Does anyone know of a recording of his piece La Voce for solo cellist? The cellist is also required to speak and sing. I remember hearing it a few years ago - it's a really beautiful piece.
The Los Angeles PhO recently premiered Andriessen's concerto for two piano's and orchestra "The Hague Hacking". Indeed a symphonic orchestra and not an ensemble...It's Andriessens first work for (fairly) normal orchestra in 30 or 40 years!The Labèque sisters (dressed very sharply) were glittering as always and the work was ,apparently, well received. During the rehearsals Andriessen had the strings reduced by half...Esa Pekka Salonen obliged.
Andriessen turns 70 this year. There will be plenty of concerts later - including the Dutch premiere of The Hague Hacking .
Orchestration :Orchestration: 3 flutes (all = piccolo), 2 oboes, 2 clarinets, bass clarinet, contrabass clarinet, 4 horns, 3 trumpets, 2 trombones, timpani, percussion (brake drums, cymbals, glockenspiel, guiro, rototoms, snare drum, suspended cymbals, tom-toms, triangles, tubular bells, vibraphone, and xylophone), harp, synthesizer, cimbalom, electric guitar, bass guitar, strings, and 2 solo pianos
From Louis Andriessen:
The opening of The Hague Hacking refers to an existing piece, which was in my mind while composing, but could not be tracked down immediately. I called a composer friend and sang the melody to him. 'Liszt!' he said and, after some thinking, 'Hungarian Rhapsody No.2'. I did not know the Liszt piano piece but, when one evening I watched some early Tom and Jerry cartoons again, I saw and heard my true source: The Cat Concerto. In the cartoon Tom is the piano virtuoso accompanied by an invisible orchestra.
In The Hague Hacking the orchestra starts to play, in very slow note values, yet another melody: a once popular sing-along song about the city of The Hague. The whole work, which we could call a Toccata, has been composed with the material of these two melodies.
At the end of the piece, as a kind of triumphant denouement, the sing-along song is totally deconstructed by all the musicians. The material for this 'de-composition' had been first created in 2003 for my friends, the piano duo of Gerard Bouwhuis and Cees van Zeeland, as an encore for the concert on the occasion of their 25th anniversary.
The Hague Hacking was written for the matchless pianists Katia and Marielle Labèque. Like the group Hoketus, which I founded in the seventies, they manage to make the hocketing (interlocking) sound as if it is being played by one person.
(http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/culturemonster/images/2009/01/18/marielle_labeque_left_and_katia_lab.jpg)
Thanks for all the comments, Peter. I just found out that the American Composer's Orchestra will do the New York premiere of The Hague Hacking at Carnegie Hall in 2010! Details here (http://www.carnegiehall.org/article/box_office/events/evt_13396.html?selecteddate=04092010).
This is part of a series with a number of Andriessen's works played by the ASKO Ensemble with Reinbert de Leeuw, including Zilver, Dances, La Commedia and De Staat. (The ACJW Ensemble will perform the last one.)
--Bruce
Peter, thanks from a report from this premiere. I look forward very much to hearing the piece eventually!
I think it's really great the LA Phil has given weight to his work in the last few years. Like the original poster, I also became introduced to Andriessen from their iTunes release of De Staat and Racconto and have enjoyed exploring more of his work since.
I really need to get back to looking up more of his pieces. I am familiar so far with the above mentioned, and De Tijd, De Volharding, Il Principe, and Facing Death (for sax qt). I really like his music a lot. Writing to Vermeer is next on my list to hear!
Just came upon this topic and couldn't resist posting. Louis Andriessen is possibly one of my favorite living composers. RE: The Hague Hacking, I posted a performance of the Dutch premiere on YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAum1WCgNfQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJZciP2kJ-I&feature=related
I also have many more videos of his music on my channel. Regarding the above performance, I think I preferred Salonen's conducting a bit more than Reinbert de Leeuw's, even though the latter is usually very good with Andriessen's music.
I was also at the recent US premiere of La Commedia, which was 2 weeks ago. It was performed much better than the premiere was (which I heard via radio), but that is to be expected, since world premiere performances can have variable quality. Here is a review:
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/culturemonster/2010/04/music-review-la-commedia-at-the-green-umbrella-concert-at-disney-hall.html
I have heard most of Andriessen's recorded discography and I certainly cannot get enough of it (I am a bit of a Dutch music geek in general, despite not being Dutch). I am looking forward to hearing his newest work "Life", which was written for Bang on a Can (I believe). The work I return to the most is De Materie, which I would say is one of the greatest works of the 20th century.
I just got this great little Attacca cd of Andriessen's SQ music as performed by the now defunct Schoenberg Quartet. I've somehow managed to consciously avoid LA's music, though, I don't know how ubiquitous his style is (have I heard it in a commercial). I thought he was supposed to be the pre-emminent European Minimalist, and so, I guess I assumed his style. But, either way, I still haven't heard any of his best known works (I will have to YouTube it).
So, I was particularly interested in trying out this quite famous name in my preferred setting.
Quartet in Two Movements (1957) sounds to me like the opening theme of Debussy's SQ as penned by Messiaen and Ohana (probably more the latter). Literally, the Debussy theme (the first two, famous bum bum) is treated to a sinuous, Pijper-type, integrated metamorphoses. I was really impressed by this 18 year old's effort. The thick, sensuous (sensual?) chords definitely remind me of Ohana's Messiaen-type Mediterraineanism (ha!).
However, LA's first real SQ comes 30 years later in the form of the one movement Facing Death (for 4 amplified strings; 1990), which, I thought, was going to bear typical hallmarks, or whatever, or, be some big Minimalist thing, but what it starts off as is a monophonic riffing based on Charlie Parker's Ornithology. There is a definite bop swing here, what one might expect from a Schuller Late Phase.
Perhaps the piece's title is a bit misleading. Facing Death is really a pretty sweet 20min bop SQ, believe it or not! I have heard no more satisfying example of what LA produces here, and there's nothing kitschy about it. This is a serious good time, very unique, and boldly entertaining in a very smooth, highbrow way. A true Jazz SQ, I would say. Bravo!
Next we have Garden of Eros (2002), which furthers the comparison to Ohana for me. A Feldmanesque melody is treated to a lush garden of plush harmonies. Nothing here says Minimalism to me, it's just very sophisticated and lovely music. The same goes for the next piece, ...miserere... (2006), which takes a different track, but with equally beautiful and relaxing results. Again, if LA is known as a Minimalist, I never would have pegged him as that from this cd. Perhaps the level of composition these days is such that composers can pretty much just do whatever they want, and do it with style (especially the vanguard).
The cd fills out with Bach's Prelude in b minor, from the WTC, "arranged for string quartet with the first six bars augmented with a viola part by Igor Stravinsky, now completed by Louis Andriessen" (2006). It's nice (Duh!), and I'm sure I'll enjoy comparing this to the Mozart transcriptions.
So, once again, if you're an LA fan, I don't know if this music is characteristic or not, but, it bespeaks the voice of a typically mature, Modern Composer. Perhaps there is a more urbane and worldly Norgard at work here? Either way, I think this disc is recommendable to a very wide range of tastes. Classy!
Quote from: bhodges on July 02, 2007, 06:12:13 AM
Over the weekend I listened again to the Bang on a Can versions of Workers Union and Hoketus. While they both require virtuosity that is compelling on its own terms, I think Workers Union will perhaps get more play. Hoketus probably drives some listeners mad with its spare construction: for much of the piece the musicians are rocking back and forth on just two notes (i.e., based on the medieval hocket), making it perhaps for hardcore minimalists only. But Workers Union gets more interesting with each hearing.
--Bruce
Very interesting to revisit this old post, Bruce . . . as I now have this Bang on a Can recording. I actually want to go back and revisit the California EAR Unit recording, which I think I remember being a bit tighter, with a higher energy level. I'm still fonder of Hoketus, myself (but then, you know, I remember turning the pages of the score in the graduate composers' seminar led by Louis in Buffalo).
The background for this interview clip is from De staat, of course:http://www.youtube.com/v/77sojb1Fv1Q
I think the Bang on a Can recording of Hoketus is the best, for a number of reasons. It has far more bite to it, which is ultimately what Andriessen wants from the work. You can really hear the sharp attacks of the bass guitars, for example. The California EAR Unit recording is rather dull in comparison, and it doesn't seem to highlight the actual hocket effect as well (I tested it on my high end speakers).
Thanks for your thoughts.
Anyone know De Tijd?
IIRC, I was late to arrive at that week's seminar . . . I don't remember hearing any of the piece, but I think I remember some of the discussion of its structure . . . .
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 20, 2010, 04:56:30 AM
Anyone know De Tijd?
IIRC, I was late to arrive at that week's seminar . . . I don't remember hearing any of the piece, but I think I remember some of the discussion of its structure . . . .
De Tijd is definitely a different piece in Andriessen's work list. The whole piece seems to emanate out of that initial huge chord at the start of the piece. It ultimately seems like a slow, gradual procession that can be tough going through at first, but if one really concentrates on it, the payoff is huge. The integration of women's voices is sort of the glue that holds the piece together, in my opinion. Also, his use of percussion is worth noting, also.
I've ordered a Used - Very Good copy, so we shall see. Thanks!
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 20, 2010, 09:16:21 AM
I've ordered a Used - Very Good copy, so we shall see. Thanks!
Which recording? There is one on Nonesuch and there is another on Attacca. Both are with Reinbert de Leeuw conducting the ASKO-Schönberg Ensemble. Both are great, in any case, but there are slight differences of course.
That on Nonesuch.
What are the differences, would you say?
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 21, 2010, 08:18:51 AM
That on Nonesuch.
What are the differences, would you say?
Just mostly slight differences in the balance of the instruments. The Attacca recording is a bit brighter in sound and seems to have a bit more detail, and the Nonesuch recording has a bit of a mellower sound. This is to be expected, for the Attacca recording is live.
Quote from: lescamil on December 20, 2010, 09:14:51 AM
De Tijd is definitely a different piece in Andriessen's work list. The whole piece seems to emanate out of that initial huge chord at the start of the piece. It ultimately seems like a slow, gradual procession that can be tough going through at first, but if one really concentrates on it, the payoff is huge. The integration of women's voices is sort of the glue that holds the piece together, in my opinion. Also, his use of percussion is worth noting, also.
De tijd is fabulous! Best thing of Louis's that I've heard yet. Bits of it (favorably) reminded me of Svadebka and Et exspecto resurrectionem mortuorum, but the piece is all Louis's own, and a thoroughly enjoyable listen throughout its arc.
Not sure about the spoken bit in De stijl. Yes, the text is interesting enough, and it's only two and a half minutes (call it 10% of the piece's duration). My gut feels that it is something which will get tiresome with repeat visitations to the piece . . . and thus something of an albatross around the neck of an otherwise splendid piece.
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 28, 2010, 06:36:19 AM
Not sure about the spoken bit in De stijl. Yes, the text is interesting enough, and it's only two and a half minutes (call it 10% of the piece's duration). My gut feels that it is something which will get tiresome with repeat visitations to the piece . . . and thus something of an albatross around the neck of an otherwise splendid piece.
If one listens to it within the entire piece De Materie, and if one hears it spoken by the great Beppie Blankert spoken in Dutch (as can be heard on an old Attacca CD and a live recording on the Radio4 website), it sounds all the more convincing and effective. Gertrude Thoma's English rendition gets a bit tiresome, I agree. I can't emphasize more it's place within De Materie, though. If one listens to it within the entire 2 hour work, one can hear its connection to the other three movements of the work, especially the movements that bookend it.
Happy Birthday, Louis Andriessen - he's 72 today.
Time for Workers Union! 8)
--Bruce
Hout!
Alright I must celebrate his b-day, my choices from streaming are:
[asin]B000CNFALO[/asin]
[asin]B000005J2T[/asin]
[asin]B000005J0K[/asin]
[asin]B00004SUVL[/asin]
So what should it be? :)
De staat, definitely!
De Staat it is! :)
Yes, I agree - of those, De Staat. :D
(Though you couldn't go wrong with any of the others.)
--Bruce
Coincidentally, I went a YouTubin' for Andriessen yesterday (before this Thread!). Five minutes later I was done. :(
Quote from: Brewski on June 06, 2011, 06:29:51 AM
Yes, I agree - of those, De Staat. :D
(Though you couldn't go wrong with any of the others.)
--Bruce
I thought Karl would say ALL OF THEM! :D But both of you seem to have a favorite amongst these works, so there you go this afternoon I will listen to De Staat. :)
De Staat is (perhaps) the work that really put him on the map. Second choice would be Writing to Vermeer, but you might not be in the mood for a complete opera!
--Bruce
Quote from: Brewski on June 06, 2011, 06:41:23 AM
De Staat is (perhaps) the work that really put him on the map. Second choice would be Writing to Vermeer, but you might not be in the mood for a complete opera!
--Bruce
I don't know that, a pivotal work that should be cool! :)
This is the only album I've heard before:
[asin]B000000R4I[/asin]
The last work, Worker's Union, is the best imo. :)
And I've not yet heard Zilver. I've been lucky to hear Workers Union live about 4 or 5 times in the last few years, including a great performance earlier this year, staged in the Park Avenue Armory, with about 35 musicians from Bang on a Can, eighth blackbird and others. And lo and behold, just looked on YouTube and someone uploaded part of the performance - appears to be the last 9 minutes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSsoqWfHW0M
Here is a bit about De Staat from Boosey & Hawkes. The piece was inspired by Plato's Republic.
http://www.boosey.com/cr/music/Louis-Andriessen-De-Staat/1425
--Bruce
I see Nonesuch is a big fan of pulling the plug on Andriessen recordings.
They just keep on pumping out John Adams recordings, though. They should really be spending more time on releasing new Andriessen disks! His wonderful film-opera La Commedia could use a release. Supposedly a DVD of the premiere was in the works, but I haven't heard anything about that for quite some time. I dare say that it is almost at the level of De Materie. I certainly like it more than Writing to Vermeer and about as much as Rosa.
Quote from: lescamil on June 06, 2011, 11:06:15 AM
They just keep on pumping out John Adams recordings, though.
Oh, don't get me started! ; )
Quote from: lescamil on June 06, 2011, 11:06:15 AM
They just keep on pumping out John Adams recordings, though. They should really be spending more time on releasing new Andriessen disks! His wonderful film-opera La Commedia could use a release. Supposedly a DVD of the premiere was in the works, but I haven't heard anything about that for quite some time. I dare say that it is almost at the level of De Materie. I certainly like it more than Writing to Vermeer and about as much as Rosa.
I like John Adams, so I don't mind them pumping them out, but what I don't like is them deleting recordings from their catalog that many people have not even had a chance to buy. Like me with Andriessen. All the recordings I want of his music are out-of-print. Ridiculous!
I like John Adams too (nowhere near as much as Andriessen, though). I'm more angry about the fact that they don't pump out much Andriessen these days anymore. Which out of print disks are you looking for? I was able to buy most of mine when they were still in print, luckily, but I think you can find them on eBay, depending on what you are looking for.
Quote from: lescamil on June 06, 2011, 11:55:55 AM
I like John Adams too (nowhere near as much as Andriessen, though). I'm more angry about the fact that they don't pump out much Andriessen these days anymore. Which out of print disks are you looking for? I was able to buy most of mine when they were still in print, luckily, but I think you can find them on eBay, depending on what you are looking for.
Which Nonesuch discs am I looking for of Andriessen's music? All of them. :)
Have you tried Amazon Marketplace? I purchased some of my Andriessen disks through that. There are some sellers on there that have quite a treasure trove of out of print goodies.
Quote from: lescamil on June 06, 2011, 03:02:25 PM
Have you tried Amazon Marketplace? I purchased some of my Andriessen disks through that. There are some sellers on there that have quite a treasure trove of out of print goodies.
Yes and the Amazon Marketplace is where I do all of my business, but the problem is the two recordings I really want, which are these two are both out-of-print and way too expensive:
[asin]B000005J1M[/asin]
[asin]B000005J0K[/asin]
Wait and watch, MI. I was in much the same spot earlier; when I first looked around for these, there were only horribly overpriced items available. I waited, and in time affordable copies emerged. De tijd I managed to find for $7.25, De staat for $12.
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on June 06, 2011, 03:31:16 PM
Wait and watch, MI. I was in much the same spot earlier; when I first looked around for these, there were only horribly overpriced items available. I waited, and in time affordable copies emerged. De tijd I managed to find for $7.25, De staat for $12.
Yes, time is the key to this search.
Quote from: Mirror Image on June 06, 2011, 03:36:47 PM
Yes, time is the key to this search.
The lotus blooms at midnight, grasshopper. 8)
Quote from: snyprrr on June 06, 2011, 05:59:20 PM
The lotus blooms at midnight, grasshopper. 8)
Umm...okay? ???
Found a recording by Icebreaker of De snelheid, a piece which thus far I know only by name . . . .
Icebreaker plays James Poke's arrangement of De Snelheid, which is not a satisfying arrangement at all. If at all possible, look for a disk put out by BBC Music Magazine which contains mostly pieces by John Adams, with a lone Andriessen work, which is De Snelheid, with Oliver Knussen conducting the ASKO Ensemble. That is the best commercially available recording of De Snelheid (I have one on a long out of print LP that is better). I think it is a really powerful work when played by a larger ensemble (like it was meant). You can also hear it on YouTube here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68GxdpbSUJA&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4NzxpNnSe0&feature=related
Looking for a good intro to this composer, but recordings seem to be thin on the ground.
Who (or what) does he sound like, generally?
Quote from: Velimir on November 03, 2012, 09:07:44 AM
Looking for a good intro to this composer, but recordings seem to be thin on the ground.
I'm probably repeating myself... but I'd still go with
De staat and
Hoketus. Think Steve Reich, if he were more Stravinskyish.
Quote from: Velimir on November 03, 2012, 09:07:44 AM
Looking for a good intro to this composer, but recordings seem to be thin on the ground.
Who (or what) does he sound like, generally?
This should help you out immensely:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/tomserviceblog/2012/oct/15/louis-andriessen-classical-music-guide?intcmp=239
I'm a pretty big Andriessen fan and most of this is spot on in my opinion.
Thanks for that. The guide that it's part of (25 modern composers) looks quite interesting too.
Quote from: Velimir on November 03, 2012, 07:02:44 PM
Thanks for that. The guide that it's part of (25 modern composers) looks quite interesting too.
Yeah, they're quite good. Even the ones featuring composers I'm very familiar with have a lot of good stuff I wasn't aware of.
To me, Andriessen sounds like the soundtrack for Logan's Run or something. I have the disc of his String Quartets, and I like their type of Impressionism very much, but the 'whole band' unisons still sound like prog rock soundtrack music to me. Help!
Quote from: snyprrr on November 04, 2012, 08:19:57 AM
To me, Andriessen sounds like the soundtrack for Logan's Run or something. I have the disc of his String Quartets, and I like their type of Impressionism very much, but the 'whole band' unisons still sound like prog rock soundtrack music to me. Help!
The string quartets aren't really the best place to start. That's more for after you already have gotten to know him. Do check out that link I posted. It's pretty comprehensive as to where you should start. Also, who says that repurposed prog rock is so bad? Sometimes he uses that sort of sound to great effect, without sounding cheesy.
Found the (probably) first vinyl recording of De Staat, released by Donemus in 1977.
Other works are Il Principe, Il Duce and Hoketus.
Performed by the Hoketus Ensemble, Nederlands Kamerkoor and the Dutch Radio Wind Ensemble.
Best known names are a.o. Adinda de Nijs, Roberta Alexander, Marjanne Kweksilber, Reinbert de Leeuw and Andriessen's late wife Jeannette Yanikian (bass guitar). Conductor is Lucas Vis.
Never re-released on compact disc, alas. :(
Not the best sound for modern ears, very harsh, but still: I hope you like it! :)
http://www.mediafire.com/?i45nc84fpyf57ml
That's a great LP. The performances of Lucas Vis (there are two) are my favorite recordings of De Staat. I love Reinbert de Leeuw for just about everything, but Vis outdoes him here. De Staat and Hoketus are both great pieces to get to know Andriessen. There's a great recording of Bang on a Can doing Hoketus that everyone should get that likes Andriessen.
Thank you, Karl!
A pleasure, Paul!
There will be a performance of De staat here at the Boston Conservatory (an institution distinct from the NEC, nota bene) in February.
Heck, yeah, I'm going!
Quote from: karlhenning on January 06, 2014, 04:16:19 PM
There will be a performance of De staat here at the Boston Conservatory (an institution distinct from the NEC, nota bene) in February.
Heck, yeah, I'm going!
Please report back here with a review!
Hopefully in April I'll be seeing a performance of De Materie at the LA Phil with Reinbert de Leeuw conducting. I've had this on my calendar for over a year. I saw La Commedia here a few years back and I expect the same caliber of performance!
Quote from: lescamil on January 06, 2014, 08:59:45 PM
Please report back here with a review!
Alas, I had a conflict. Hated like damn that it should be so, since Louis was here in town for the festivities himself.
Well, that is another reason why I am glad that I am no longer beholden to the museum gift shop!
Quote from: lescamil on October 28, 2014, 06:34:39 AM
I bought that disk years ago, and only for a performance of Louis Andriessen's De Snelheid, which is supposedly the piece John Adams was thinking of when he wrote Short Ride in a Fast Machine. It would make sense, given that they both have an incessant woodblock throughout the piece, and speed is a key element (de snelheid translates to "velocity"). The performance on this CD is a bit sloppy, but I've spoken with Andriessen before, and he says that this performance is just how he likes it. He says he prefers a rougher, more visceral performance of his works. Buuuuut, this thread isn't about Andriessen...
I am glad to know it (about the performance on this disc, which is on its way). I have
De snelheid on the Argo disc, but I seem to recall someone expressing reservations about it.
Quote from: lescamil on January 06, 2014, 08:59:45 PM
Hopefully in April I'll be seeing a performance of De Materie at the LA Phil with Reinbert de Leeuw conducting. I've had this on my calendar for over a year. I saw La Commedia here a few years back and I expect the same caliber of performance!
I did end up seeing this, and it was sadly not even close to the caliber of performance, and it was partly for a sad reason. A member of The Crossing, the vocal ensemble that performed in the work, collapsed and passed away during rehearsals, shocking everyone. As a tribute, they performed the work with an empty chair on stage. Sadly, the work did suffer as a result, since there was an obvious part missing (it calls for 8 solo voices), and the performance was far from polished. Can't blame them for trying to persevere and perform the work in his memory, though.
The mention of Knussen's recording of De Snelheid pushed me into revisiting a few of Andriessen's works today (De Snelheid, De Staat, and the Bang on a Can disc of Workers Union, Hoketus and Hout).
De Tijd, which I don't think I'd heard before, I found really fascinating. The slowed-down progress, the (rather Stravinskyan) bell-like sonorities, and the carefully judged dissonance builds something very distinctly different.
Cool! I need to revisit that 'un, too.
Did anybody hear the Nonesuch release of his opera "La Commedia". I've read reviews about it and would like to know what the forum members think about it.
[asin] B00K6Y5CJO[/asin]
That CD release is actually a release of a live recording from the 2008 Holland Festival, warts and all, with a few minor revisions of how some of the prerecorded tape material is handled, and it sounds like Cacciaguida's monologue at the end was totally redone. It's a fine performance, but there is another performance from 2014 with the Great Noise Ensemble that is much better. It was Q2's website last year (might still be there) and it sounds more polished, more confident, and is worthy of a similar release as this Holland Festival recording. Too bad it wasn't filmed. That was perhaps the most disappointing thing about the Nonesuch recording. The camera angles and off many times, there is some poor editing juxtaposing the film and live action, and there are no subtitles. There is a libretto in the booklet, but subtitles would have been infinitely more helpful.
Quote from: lescamil on February 07, 2015, 12:53:41 PM
That CD release is actually a release of a live recording from the 2008 Holland Festival, warts and all, with a few minor revisions of how some of the prerecorded tape material is handled, and it sounds like Cacciaguida's monologue at the end was totally redone. It's a fine performance, but there is another performance from 2014 with the Great Noise Ensemble that is much better. It was Q2's website last year (might still be there) and it sounds more polished, more confident, and is worthy of a similar release as this Holland Festival recording. Too bad it wasn't filmed. That was perhaps the most disappointing thing about the Nonesuch recording. The camera angles and off many times, there is some poor editing juxtaposing the film and live action, and there are no subtitles. There is a libretto in the booklet, but subtitles would have been infinitely more helpful.
Thanks for the answer. Just listened to parts of the recording on Q2. I agree, sounds really like a very good performance to me. Too bad there is no CD/DVD release of that.
The Holland Festival performance of his new work Theatre of the World is now available online. I haven't gotten through it all yet, but it sounds better than the world premiere performance in Los Angeles, which I attended.
http://www.radio4.nl/luister-concerten/concerten/6099/holland-festival-louis-andriessens-opera-theatre-of-the-world
After hearing this work a bit since the world premiere and this performance, I am still not sure what I think of it. It's a bit less organized and focused compared to Andriessen's other operas/music theater works, and it seems to relish that fact a bit more, considering that the subject of this opera, Kircher, was such a renaissance man. Hearing it switch between languages, musical styles, moods, etc at the drop of a hat can be disorienting, but there is much music in here to be enjoyed despite this. The main theme of the work is even, dare I say, quite catchy, and it stuck with me even after exiting Disney Hall after the world premiere. Give it a try.
Can anyone recommend something I can read about his philosophical or social ideas, and how they're reflected in his music? For example, is there any interesting connection between Der Staat and Plato?
This afternoon the Orchestra of the Eighteenth Century and the Cappela choir performed the premier of Louis Andriessen valedictory 'May', a 20 minute piece for period orchestra and choir, set on a Dutch poem from the nineteeneighties (Mei by Herman Gorter). It is a piece in memory of Frans Brüggen, which is why it's for this orchestra.
This is most likely Andriessen's last full composition, as he's been developing Alzheimer's and is in a carehome (playing the piano every day).
I'm not Andriessen expert, but it did sound a bit like his previous orchestra piece for the Concertgebouw 'Mysteries'.
Obviously the premier, in the Concertgebouw was sans audience, it was streamed by npo radio / tv, and hopefully one can find it there.
No audience, no applause, no composer, no nothing. Sad.
https://www.nporadio4.nl/ntrzaterdagmatinee/gemist
you have to move to min 50:00. There's a news broadcast first and a Mozart 40 and a short choir piece first.
The Andriessen is quite beautiful. It's interesting how the composer indulged in horizontal melodies more and more as he got older, and wrote for string orchestras more.
Quote from: Herman on December 06, 2020, 02:17:32 AM
https://www.nporadio4.nl/ntrzaterdagmatinee/gemist
you have to move to min 50:00. There's a news broadcast first and a Mozart 40 and a short choir piece first.
The Andriessen is quite beautiful. It's interesting how the composer indulged in horizontal melodies more and more as he got older, and wrote for string orchestras more.
It certainly has a different feel from his De Staat! I've only listened to the first 20 minutes or so so far. It's full of evocative and atmospheric melodies, but somehow there are enough unexpected contrasting instrumental moments, and indeed unexpected changes in the sung music, to make the music sound slightly precarious, fragile. I will finish it tomorrow.
What's it about?
(That looks like an excellent streaming site, by the way.)
Quote from: Mandryka on December 06, 2020, 12:19:34 PM
It certainly has a different feel from his De Staat! I've only listened to the first 20 minutes or so so far. It's full of evocative and atmospheric melodies, but somehow there are enough unexpected contrasting instrumental moments, and indeed unexpected changes in the sung music, to make the music sound slightly precarious, fragile. I will finish it tomorrow.
What's it about?
It's very tempting to say (à la George Balanchine) it's about 25 minutes long.
I'd say it about letting go, but my guess is as good as anyone's. It's about what you heard. His later work is much more horizontal than the Staat and Hoketus. There is even a Mahlerian whisp of a melody here.
The poem is a book Andriessen found in his dad's, Hendrik Andriessen's, book case. Oddly it's a poem about the wonders of spring, while this is, seriously, no spring music. I have a 1900 copy of this book, too.
The piece is dedicated to Frans Brüggen, who died a couple years ago. This is why it's written for period orchestra. I wonder how this is going to work when other orchestras want to play this piece. The recorder solo early on is on an instrument especially handmade for this piece, since there are no 330 Hz recorders apparently.
Quote from: Herman on December 07, 2020, 09:53:17 AM
here is even a Mahlerian whisp of a melody here.
Late Rihm too, who was in turn no stranger to Mahler's music. And more surprisingly I'd say, without being sure that I can back it up, some late Stockhausen - Klang -- also.
Quote from: Mandryka on December 06, 2020, 12:19:34 PM
It certainly has a different feel from his De Staat! I've only listened to the first 20 minutes or so so far. It's full of evocative and atmospheric melodies, but somehow there are enough unexpected contrasting instrumental moments, and indeed unexpected changes in the sung music, to make the music sound slightly precarious, fragile. I will finish it tomorrow.
What's it about?
(That looks like an excellent streaming site, by the way.)
Have you heard his older piece
De Tijd (1980-81)? That's also vocal music with a very different feel from
De Staat (and others).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm2PNQEvasc
Quote from: T. D. on December 07, 2020, 11:21:03 AM
Have you heard his older piece De Tijd (1980-81)? That's also vocal music with a very different feel from De Staat (and others).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm2PNQEvasc
Will do, thanks. After 5 minutes I can hear what you mean.
Quote from: Herman on December 07, 2020, 09:53:17 AM
It's very tempting to say (à la George Balanchine) it's about 25 minutes long.
Ha! I just assumed that it went on for the full 3 and a half hours of the stream! I thought you were making a deep and elusive witty comment.
Quote from: T. D. on December 07, 2020, 11:21:03 AM
Have you heard his older piece De Tijd (1980-81)? That's also vocal music with a very different feel from De Staat (and others).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm2PNQEvasc
It's different, it doesn't have the strange fragility that I hear from the changes in May. This strange music, which is full of melody, but doesn't have a melodic identity.
Quote from: Mandryka on December 08, 2020, 01:34:55 AM
It's different, it doesn't have the strange fragility that I hear from the changes in May. This strange music, which is full of melody, but doesn't have a melodic identity.
Yes, this is the beauty of 'May.' You could try and find Andriessen's 'Mysteries,' too. Another dad-related late work.
Quote from: Herman on December 08, 2020, 01:59:01 AM
Yes, this is the beauty of 'May.' You could try and find Andriessen's 'Mysteries,' too. Another dad-related late work.
It's on the Concertgebouw website, and I've heard the first two movements. Very atmospheric . . .
Quote from: Mandryka on December 09, 2020, 01:46:31 AM
It's on the Concertgebouw website, and I've heard the first two movements. Very atmospheric . . .
Yeah, Andriessen really changed in his late period, with a lot of horizontal melodies, rather than stacked chords.
A sad week, first losing Frederic Rzewski, and now Louis Andriessen:
https://www.npr.org/sections/deceptivecadence/2021/07/01/960923935/louis-andriessen-influential-iconoclastic-dutch-composer-dies-at-age-82
My first encounter with his music, and still a piece I love, was Workers Union (1975), "for any loud-sounding group of instruments." Bang on a Can has an excellent recorded version, and I also like this one from the 2011 Tune-In Festival, spearheaded by eighth blackbird:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEMxAcIf_iw
--Bruce
My feeling is that Andriessen kind of moved back as he got older towards his dad and his dad's religious orientation. In a long interview for his 80th birthday he mentions catholicism as one of his bases.
Of course it's already there in De Materie, with Hadewych.
Thanks for mentioning Hadewijch, which I'd never heard before and which I'm enjoying, indeed I'd never even heard of the mystic poet Hadewijch.
The whole work, De Materie, is amazing - though the neighbours may feel different.
Ostensibly the grand metaphor is ship building, but I can't help thinking it's always about the Creation of the World or Universe in Andriessen's music. This why Hadewych's love song to the Creator is in the right place.
Quote from: Herman on July 07, 2021, 04:46:45 AM
The whole work, De Materie, is amazing - though the neighbours may feel different.
Ostensibly the grand metaphor is ship building, but I can't help thinking it's always about the Creation of the World or Universe in Andriessen's music. This why Hadewych's love song to the Creator is in the right place.
I must revisit
De Materie soon.
I couldn't help but notice that the Guardian critic linked above, translated 'De Materie' as 'Material'. However, 'Matter' would be better.
Quote from: Herman on July 07, 2021, 04:46:45 AM
The whole work, De Materie, is amazing - though the neighbours may feel different.
Ostensibly the grand metaphor is ship building, but I can't help thinking it's always about the Creation of the World or Universe in Andriessen's music. This why Hadewych's love song to the Creator is in the right place.
I didn't realise it was one piece with two parts. De Materie has a wonderful opening!
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on July 07, 2021, 07:42:46 AM
I must revisit De Materie soon.
Nice and loud and make sure the neighbours are out.
Quote from: Herman on July 07, 2021, 04:46:45 AM
The whole work, De Materie, is amazing - though the neighbours may feel different.
Ostensibly the grand metaphor is ship building, but I can't help thinking it's always about the Creation of the World or Universe in Andriessen's music. This why Hadewych's love song to the Creator is in the right place.
Why do you think the third part is De Stijl?
Quote from: Mandryka on July 08, 2021, 12:13:07 AM
Why do you think the third part is De Stijl?
Unfortunately I find the De Stijl movement rather hard to take, with those eruptions of rock / pop music with the drummer doing a backbeat etc