Havergal Brian.

[Roasted Swan]

Brian was incredibly aware of musical heritage and repertoire both as a professional critic and a composer (remaining tuned-in to contemporary music throughout his entire life) and one of his great heroes was Berlioz, a similarly total maverick. I equate Brian in some ways with Rued Langgaard, writing his music to total indifference but still ploughing on and creating a unique sound-world...

I think part of my admiration for Brian the composer grew from reading these books....



which made me appreciate that although Brian was completely "up to date" with current musical styles and trends he was determined to write his own music very much in his own way.  His critical writing is insightful and astute.  I recommend both these books very strongly

[DaveF]

What might constitute an "essential" Havergal Brian library on CD if you had to restrict yourself to only ten recordings (including reissued compilations)?

Mine would (possibly) be:

The Vision of Cleopatra, Fantastic Variations, For Valour (Dutton)
The Tigers (Testament)
Symphony No.1, The Gothic (Hyperion)
Symphony Nos 3 and 17 (Heritage)
Symphonies Nos 5, 19 and 27, Festal Dance (Dutton)
Symphonies Nos 6 and 16 (Lyrita)
Symphonies Nos 7, 8, 9, 31 and The Tinker's Wedding (EMI)
Symphonies Nos 10 and 30, Concerto for Orchestra, English Suite No.3 (Dutton)
Faust (Dutton)
Symphonies Nos 22, 23 and 24, English Suite No.1 (Naxos)

I think it gives a fair view of early, middle and late Brian as well as showing off what he could do in vocal/ choral music and opera.

Certainly agree with you over the Brabbins Gothic, Fredman 6 and 16 and Groves 7-31.  I think a lot of people would include the Leicestershire Schools' no.10 in preference to Brabbins' - just more atmospheric and mysterious.  I personally find Brabbins' no.10 unlistenable because of an extraordinary misreading/bad edit/typo in the part in the 'cello theme at 2'10" - extraordinary to me, anyway, although no review I've seen remarks on it.  (The same passage, played correctly, is at 2'40" in the LSSO recording, timings which by themselves reveal a lot.)

I would also include, although aware it's not many listeners' favourite, the 1976 Siegeslied from Alexandra Palace.

[vandermolen]

What might constitute an "essential" Havergal Brian library on CD if you had to restrict yourself to only ten recordings (including reissued compilations)?

Mine would (possibly) be:

The Vision of Cleopatra, Fantastic Variations, For Valour (Dutton)
The Tigers (Testament)
Symphony No.1, The Gothic (Hyperion)
Symphony Nos 3 and 17 (Heritage)
Symphonies Nos 5, 19 and 27, Festal Dance (Dutton)
Symphonies Nos 6 and 16 (Lyrita)
Symphonies Nos 7, 8, 9, 31 and The Tinker's Wedding (EMI)
Symphonies Nos 10 and 30, Concerto for Orchestra, English Suite No.3 (Dutton)
Faust (Dutton)
Symphonies Nos 22, 23 and 24, English Suite No.1 (Naxos)

I think it gives a fair view of early, middle and late Brian as well as showing off what he could do in vocal/ choral music and opera.

Symphony 1 'Gothic'(Marco Polo)
Symphony 2 (Dutton/Naxos)
Symphony 3 (Hyperion)
Symphony 6 (Lyrita)
Symphony 7 (Mackerras although the Naxos is fine too)
Symphony 8 (Groves)
Symphony 10 (Unicorn - I prefer it to the professional recording)
Symphony 16 (Lyrita)
Symphony 22 (CBS/Heritage)
In Memoriam (Marco Polo)

[Albion]

Certainly agree with you over the Brabbins Gothic, Fredman 6 and 16 and Groves 7-31.  I think a lot of people would include the Leicestershire Schools' no.10 in preference to Brabbins' - just more atmospheric and mysterious.  I personally find Brabbins' no.10 unlistenable because of an extraordinary misreading/bad edit/typo in the part in the 'cello theme at 2'10" - extraordinary to me, anyway, although no review I've seen remarks on it.  (The same passage, played correctly, is at 2'40" in the LSSO recording, timings which by themselves reveal a lot.)

I would also include, although aware it's not many listeners' favourite, the 1976 Siegeslied from Alexandra Palace.

I absolutely LOVE the Loughran No.10, and Brabbins doesn't equal it in the central storm but the couplings are just so valuable on the Dutton disc. The LSSO were inspired and it's a classic. John Poole was such a brilliant Brian conductor (vide 3 and 17 on Heritage), as were Fredman and Pope, that I wish they'd all been given more studio opportunity. Even so, the broadcasts are now coming out in high quality transcriptions. Poole's Das Siegeslied knocks the socks off the Adrian Leaper (Naxos), and it has Felicity Palmer.

The recent Naxos recordings with the New Russia State SO are incredible: Alexander Walker never puts a foot wrong and the orchestra sound as though they've been playing this music for decades rather than ten minutes. The pacing of each performance is impeccable and the actual engineering is some of the best that Naxos has ever done with plenty of clarity and bass. There are four discs so far:

Symphony 22, Symphony 23, Symphony 24, English Suite No.1 (8.572833)

Symphony 6, Symphony 28, Symphony 29, Symphony 31 (8.573408)

Symphony 8, Symphony 21, Symphony 26 (8.573752)

Symphony 7, Symphony 16, The Tinker's Wedding (8.573959)

I'd really like to hear more from Walker, especially No. 9, but given the current situation I don't know if Naxos are recording anything in Russia...


 

[Albion]

Symphony 1 'Gothic'(Marco Polo)
Symphony 2 (Dutton/Naxos)
Symphony 3 (Hyperion)
Symphony 6 (Lyrita)
Symphony 7 (Mackerras although the Naxos is fine too)
Symphony 8 (Groves)
Symphony 10 (Unicorn - I prefer it to the professional recording)
Symphony 16 (Lyrita)
Symphony 22 (CBS/Heritage)
In Memoriam (Marco Polo)

Interesting that we've gone for different things! I prefer the Hyperion Gothic to the Naxos, partly because I was at the performance and the visceral thrill was incredible (several faults were subsequently corrected in editing). Dump the Hyperion No.3 in the nearest bin and get Stanley Pope: the performance is better and the sonics are better. As for No.2, Rowe's performance is just bloody dismal in what is already a pretty dismal work, meandering around dismal stuff that just goes nowhere (except in the scherzo). Brian seriously raised his game for No.3, dropped it for No.4 (which is fun if you want to annoy your neighbours), then picked it up again from Nos 5-11 before becoming formulaic (but always fascinating). No.16 is the highlight of the middle period (thank Dog for Fredman and Lyrita) and Nos 28-32 are endlessly intriguing. Virtually everything has now been recorded to a very high standard, barring The Cenci (due from Toccata), Prometheus Unbound (full score lost) and Agamemnon. I've been working on cleaning up the BBC broadcast of the last from a conflation of sources (a work in progress, until something better comes along)...

https://www.mediafire.com/file/32jwzsmnswmsx75/Brian_-_Agamemnon_%25281957%2529.mp3/file

[vandermolen]

Interesting that we've gone for different things! I prefer the Hyperion Gothic to the Naxos, partly because I was at the performance and the visceral thrill was incredible (several faults were subsequently corrected in editing). Dump the Hyperion No.3 in the nearest bin and get Stanley Pope: the performance is better and the sonics are better. As for No.2, Rowe's performance is just bloody dismal in what is already a pretty dismal work, meandering around dismal stuff that just goes nowhere (except in the scherzo). Brian seriously raised his game for No.3, dropped it for No.4 (which is fun if you want to annoy your neighbours), then picked it up again from Nos 5-11 before becoming formulaic (but always fascinating). No.16 is the highlight of the middle period (thank Dog for Fredman and Lyrita) and Nos 28-32 are endlessly intriguing. Virtually everything has now been recorded to a very high standard, barring The Cenci (due from Toccata), Prometheus Unbound (full score lost) and Agamemnon. I've been working on cleaning up the BBC broadcast of the last from a conflation of sources (a work in progress, until something better comes along)...

https://www.mediafire.com/file/32jwzsmnswmsx75/Brian_-_Agamemnon_%25281957%2529.mp3/file

I was at the Brabbins 'Gothic' as well, as were some others here (I was also at Ole Schmidt's performance many years ago). Both were great occasions.

[vandermolen]

This arrived yesterday:

[Albion]

This arrived yesterday:

Thanks. That's another one I have to get, if only to ensure that the pile of Brian CDs falls over like a game of Jenga. Fredman was always good with Brian...

 

[Maestro267]

Wonder why it's not on Spotify yet...

The other discs in that series are.

Also I defy you. The Hyperion 3 has been very very servicable for over 20 years and for that I shall be forever grateful.

[calyptorhynchus]

Thanks for the Agamemnon link. It could certainly do with a modern recording. It's the most amazing work, and quite like an HB symphony in its energy and compression.
As to Brian other operas I think the Tigers is his best, the recently recorded Faust was magnificent, but I don't think I'll be listening to it very often. I'd like to hear a performance of Turandot, because the bits of orchestral music we have heard from it are interesting. The Cenci is a bit grim, and the subject matter is probably less acceptable to audiences these days than when it was written!

[vandermolen]

I greatly enjoyed this extract from the booklet notes (written by John Pickard) to the new Heritage CD of HB's symphonies 8,9, 22 'Brevis'and 24 conducted by Myer Fredman:

'Fredman met and corresponded with Brian when the composer was living in Shoreham-by-Sea towards the end of his life. Indeed, Brian accepted an invitation from Fredman to one of the performances he was conducting in 1969 at nearby Glyndebourne of Massenet's Werther. Fredman later reported that Brian greatly enjoyed the performance, even though he apparently confused Fredman's name with that of the comedian Marty Feldman!'

[Albion]

I greatly enjoyed this extract from the booklet notes (written by John Pickard) to the new Heritage CD of HB's symphonies 8,9, 22 'Brevis'and 24 conducted by Myer Fredman:

'Fredman met and corresponded with Brian when the composer was living in Shoreham-by-Sea towards the end of his life. Indeed, Brian accepted an invitation from Fredman to one of the performances he was conducting in 1969 at nearby Glyndebourne of Massenet's Werther. Fredman later reported that Brian greatly enjoyed the performance, even though he apparently confused Fredman's name with that of the comedian Marty Feldman!'

   

As the composer was 93, I think Fredman was dealing with Havergal Brain...

[calyptorhynchus]

I greatly enjoyed this extract from the booklet notes (written by John Pickard) to the new Heritage CD of HB's symphonies 8,9, 22 'Brevis'and 24 conducted by Myer Fredman:

'Fredman met and corresponded with Brian when the composer was living in Shoreham-by-Sea towards the end of his life. Indeed, Brian accepted an invitation from Fredman to one of the performances he was conducting in 1969 at nearby Glyndebourne of Massenet's Werther. Fredman later reported that Brian greatly enjoyed the performance, even though he apparently confused Fredman's name with that of the comedian Marty Feldman!'

Because he was born so far back in Victoria's reign I think we forget that lived on into the era of television. Funny to think of him watching 1960s BBC shows!

[krummholz]

Interesting that we've gone for different things! I prefer the Hyperion Gothic to the Naxos, partly because I was at the performance and the visceral thrill was incredible (several faults were subsequently corrected in editing). Dump the Hyperion No.3 in the nearest bin and get Stanley Pope: the performance is better and the sonics are better. As for No.2, Rowe's performance is just bloody dismal in what is already a pretty dismal work, meandering around dismal stuff that just goes nowhere (except in the scherzo). Brian seriously raised his game for No.3, dropped it for No.4 (which is fun if you want to annoy your neighbours), then picked it up again from Nos 5-11 before becoming formulaic (but always fascinating). No.16 is the highlight of the middle period (thank Dog for Fredman and Lyrita) and Nos 28-32 are endlessly intriguing. Virtually everything has now been recorded to a very high standard, barring The Cenci (due from Toccata), Prometheus Unbound (full score lost) and Agamemnon. I've been working on cleaning up the BBC broadcast of the last from a conflation of sources (a work in progress, until something better comes along)...

https://www.mediafire.com/file/32jwzsmnswmsx75/Brian_-_Agamemnon_%25281957%2529.mp3/file

I just finished listening again to the 2nd under Brabbins on Dutton and I'll have to disagree that it's a dismal work overall. There are glimmers of genius in the 1st movement, and the only movement that really goes nowhere for me is the second. Brabbins's scherzo is magnificent, and the concluding funeral march really shines under his baton. I never did like the work when I had only heard Rowe's recording, but Brabbins seems to know how to make it both coherent and moving.

Sure, the 3rd is a giant leap forward and shows Brian on his best footing - compared to it the 2nd pales. But I think, listened to on its own terms, the 2nd is still not a total failure. YMMV.

[relm1]

I really enjoyed this disc.  I didn't think No. 9 was as well performed as Sir Charles Groves album.  Timpani was way too passive and organ nonexistent.  But I found No. 24 to be gorgeous!  I liked hearing this set of interpretations because at the very least, it brought new insight of pieces I've known before but also introduced me to new music I hadn't yet heard and was very impressed with. 

[vandermolen]

I really enjoyed this disc.  I didn't think No. 9 was as well performed as Sir Charles Groves album.  Timpani was way too passive and organ nonexistent.  But I found No. 24 to be gorgeous!  I liked hearing this set of interpretations because at the very least, it brought new insight of pieces I've known before but also introduced me to new music I hadn't yet heard and was very impressed with. 

8,9 and 22 are three of my favourites. That Groves album was very special however.

[vers la flamme]

I'm sure that I'm getting increasingly senile. I was just about to order 8, 21 and 26 (Naxos) and 3, 17 (Heritage) from Amazon, then went to the shelf and there they were already lurking. The Stanley Pope No.3 is the one to have, as it's just bloody gorgeous: chuck the Hyperion (dry as a corpse recording) out of the window or use it as a coaster. Alexander Walker's No.8 is a scorcher and better played than the Groves RLPO.

Prolific throughout an enormously long composing career, he is best known for the 32 numbered symphonies. Luckily we can now assemble good recordings of all of them, and there are some real crackers. Several of the BBC broadcasts have also been commercially released. For what it's worth, here are my top recommendations...

No.1, The Gothic - Brabbins, Hyperion CDA67971/2
No.2 - Brabbins, Dutton CDLX7330
No.3 - Pope, Heritage HTGCD153
No.4, Das Siegeslied - Leaper, Naxos 8.570308
No.5, Wine of Summer - Brabbins, Dutton CDLX7314
No.6, Sinfonia Tragica - Fredman, Lyrita SRCD295
No.7 - Mackerras, EMI 724357578226
No.8 - Walker, Naxos 8.573752
No.9 - Groves, EMI 724357578226
No.10 - Brabbins, Dutton CDLX7267
No.11 - Leaper, Naxos 8.572014
No.12 - Leaper, Naxos 8.570308
No.13 - Brabbins, Dutton CDLX7296
No.14 - Brabbins CDLX7330
No.15 - Rowe, Naxos 8.572014
No.16 - Fredman, Lyrita SRCD295
No.17 - Pope, Heritage HTGCD153
No.18 - Friend, Naxos 8.557775
No.19 - Brabbins, Dutton CDLX7314
No.20 - Penny, Naxos 8.572641
No.21 - Walker, Naxos 8.573752
No.22, Symphonia brevis - Walker, Naxos 8.572833
No.23 - Walker, Naxos 8.572833
No.24 - Walker, Naxos 8.572833
No.25 - Penny, Naxos 8.572641
No.26 - Walker, Naxos 8.573752
No.27 - Brabbins, Dutton CDLX7314
No.28 - Walker, Naxos 8.573408
No.29 - Walker, Naxos 8.573408
No.30 - Brabbins, Dutton CDLX7267
No.31 - Walker, Naxos 8.573408
No.32 - Leaper, Naxos 8.572020

 

Thanks for this, I don't know anything about this composer, but every time I see this 412 page thread in the Composer Discussion forum it reminds me that I should try figure out what his music is all about.

[relm1]

Thanks for this, I don't know anything about this composer, but every time I see this 412 page thread in the Composer Discussion forum it reminds me that I should try figure out what his music is all about.

That or a few of us are obsessed fans. 

[vers la flamme]

I picked this up (download) after seeing Roasted Swan talk about it a few pages back.



And I noticed Klassik Haus has a bunch of other Brian recordings on there, all downloadable. Which ones are worth picking up?

[Roasted Swan]

I picked this up (download) after seeing Roasted Swan talk about it a few pages back.



And I noticed Klassik Haus has a bunch of other Brian recordings on there, all downloadable. Which ones are worth picking up?

As you rightly worked out these are off-air radio broadcasts.  The same broadcasts that have been praised earlier in this thread in their "Heritage" releases.  I assume they have used different off-air recording sources unless they have had access to the BBC master tapes - someone here will know!

But of course there is quite a price difference between the Heritage and Klassichaus releases.  If you get into Brian then I'd say all of the Klassichaus/Heritage are worth hearing although - with a couple of exceptions - I prefer the better quality of the more modern studio verisons to allow the detail of Brian's often complex scoring to register.  Klassichaus also have some of the famous Leicestershire Schools Symphony Orchestra recordings of Brian which were literally ground-breaking at the time and in fact for a youth orchestra they play these pieces very well - there were a lot of young players there who went onto be top professionals (back in the day when the UK government and Local Education Authorities funded such things.... don't get me started......)