all i know is that he, Haydn, and Boccherini all all began writing str. qrts. around the same time, yet his key choices seem exciting to me (lots of minors, yes, i'm a minor key guy).
anyone familiar with his style?
All caps in the headers and all lower case in the posts? Interesting... :)
eye just kant win! :o
Quote from: snyprrr on March 12, 2009, 07:32:41 AM
all i know is that he, Haydn, and Boccherini all all began writing str. qrts. around the same time, yet his key choices seem exciting to me (lots of minors, yes, i'm a minor key guy).
anyone familiar with his style?
Happy late Galant-style. The "Authentic Quartet" on Hungaroton recorded some... but not well. The music is good, though, worthy discovering beyond the reasonably popular concertos for Jewish Harp that survive. His 200th death anniversary was 10 days ago.
Quote from: jlaurson on March 13, 2009, 02:57:17 PM
Happy late Galant-style. The "Authentic Quartet" on Hungaroton recorded some... but not well. The music is good, though, worthy discovering beyond the reasonably popular concertos for Jewish Harp that survive. His 200th death anniversary was 10 days ago.
I own the Authentic Quartet recording and for me, it sounds at least competent. For sure it could be better recorded, but I'm afraid that this kind of repertoire is not attractive for the best quartets.
I agree with your opinion on these works. I would describe them as
careful, in the best sense provided by this word. They are certainly not revolutionary or exhibiting a sense of clear originality, but they are excellently written. Beautiful ideas, beautiful part-writing, very clear and very elegant music.
I guess that further exploration in Albrechtsberger production could lead to discovery of fairly important works. Let's hope minor labels will be interested in this...
I'm curious about that Op.7 4-6 disc.
My old index states Op.7 (D, A, F, ?, ?, ?; circa 1782), yet I got new info stating 1787 as the date. When were these SQs found? Interesting how they were the ones recorded... so arbitrary?
Albrechtsberger wrote just as many SQs as Haydn, I believe, if not more. Unless there is another Albrechtsberger, he wrote his first in 1760. The first "Op.1" comes in 1780 and his last in 1808.
I'm sorry to hear the recording is off. This is music I really want to try. Hungaroton has a few interesting discs like this (Pleyel SQs).
Anyhow, Albrechtsberger would be my candidate for dark horse masterpiece writer. Keep in my that the cd in question contains only three, fairly early/mature SQs.
I would love to hear the b minor of 1807 or the c minor of 1808. Albrechtsberger probably wrote more minor key SQs than Boccherini. The only question is as to their depth.
I believe IF Albrechtsberger's SQ cycle were to see the light of day, it might just be something...Fantasy Box!!
I am just finishing my first listen to the Authentic Quartet/Hungaroton recording of Op.7 4-6:
I think we have reviews by AntoineM., Gabriel, SonicMan, and ChamberNut. I am to make this definitive!
Some of the reviewers commented on a bad recording, but I'm not finding it particular. Perhaps it is a bit dry, and perhaps the instruments themselves could use better placement, etc, but I find the recording serviceable. As to performance, I could have used a bit more tang out of the original instruments, but there are a few juicy moments.
One or two of the reviewers seemed completely taken with the music, whilst others seemed to compare them slightly below the very best. I'll go out on a limb and say they're as masterly as anything I've heard up to LvB Op.18 (7/6 especially). Considering AlbrechtsB wrote about as many SQs as Haydn, and these are the only three to go on, I think it's fair enough to say that we don't have the full picture. What if all we had from Haydn was the first three SQs of Op.64?
Anyhow, these SQs have a few baroque moments one doesn't hear in Pleyel and Dittersdorf, but that I heard in the Richter SQs. AlbrechtsB certainly has a conservative, yet robust, style.
I was disappointed by the notes.I thought they did a good job of talking about Vienna at the time, but didn't go into more depth about AlbrechtsB's SQs per se. My SQ Index lists these SQs as @1782, but the notes definitively state 1787 (Haydn Op.50); my Index also has question marks for 4-6, the same SQs on this recording, so I was curious if they had been discovered recently, or what. The notes say that 4-6 have remained in manuscript, whilst 1-3 were published in 1789 in Hungary (and they remain the first SQs published in Hungary!).
Anyhow, back to the music: 2 SQs (C, Eb) in four mvmts, 1 (g minor) in three. Of course, I was curious about the g minor. The slow 1st mvmt sounds particularly baroque, reminding me of a stricter Haydn Op.55 f minor SQ: same melancoly flavor, two different approaches (Haydn is far ahead here in terms of construction). The final mvmt, 10mins long, is quite substantial, however, reminding me again of Richter, and Haydn Op.20 (slow mvmt of No.2, 1st mvmt of No.5).
No.4 in C major sounds like any number of minor Haydn SQs. This one will take a few more listens, though I really dig the plunking pizz in the Adagio. No.6 in Eb is the longest at 26mins, and, I think, the work on this album most able to take on any challengers as far as posterity is concerned. It's just as perfectly crafted as any Mozz or Haydn work. Perhaps we just take all these things for granted?
All snobs aside, and less-than-utopian sound notwithstanding, this album seems pretty important to me on different levels, and, I think, deserves your attention! If all you have is Mozz and Haydn and LvB SQs, then I think your next three should be Richter, Krommer, and AlbrechtsB (or: Pleyel, Dittersdorf, Boccherini,... for the lighter side (though, not really)).
At the bottom is quoted a post that I just left in the
listening thread concerning the 2 discs that I own of this composer, both of which I enjoy; regarding the
String Quartets, I'd have to agree w/
snyprrr on the quality and performances of this recording; these are well written works (better that Mozart or Haydn - no but quite good) - just to reinforce this opinion, I tried to search for reviews and few were available; immediately below is one quoted from the
All Music Guide - this recording is certainly worth exploring for those interested in another composer/teacher w/ dates similar to Haydn who was an important character in the classical music scene of the era! Dave :)
QuoteJohann Georg Albrechtsberger is primarily remembered today as a friend of Franz Joseph Haydn and Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart, and as Ludwig van Beethoven's teacher, as well as for composing a number of canons that periodically turn up as examples in theory classes. Beyond that, few know of Albrechtsberger's oeuvre, which includes over 600 works in most of the Classical forms, though precious few of these have ever been recorded. Fortunately, the Authentic Quartet has released this extraordinary album of three of Albrechtsberger's String Quartets, Op. 7/4-6, and connoisseurs of the genre may note with pleasure that he was a fine composer in his own right and fully deserving of the respect accorded him by Haydn, Mozart, and Beethoven. The outer quartets, No. 4 in C major and No. 6 in E flat major, are quite vivacious and witty in their repartée, and the intervening No. 5 in G minor is only slightly less lively for its melancholy first movement. As its name suggests, the Authentic Quartet plays period instruments, and it sounds marvelous with its bright, vibrato-less tone and deliciously resinous bowing, sonorities that are now expected in any historically informed Classical performance. Hungaroton's resonant reproduction also contributes to the luster of the album, and the music sounds as burnished as any string quartet could make it. If this disc signals a renascence of Albrechtsberger's music, then there's good reason to be excited, especially if this excellent ensemble leads the way with future recordings like this one. ~ Blair Sanderson, All Music Guide
QuoteAlbrechtsberger, Johann Georg (1736-1809) - String Trios w/ the Belvedere Trio Wien; famous Viennese teacher & composer (also includes a Trio by Sperger) - close friend of Haydn & Mozart, and teacher of so many, including Beethoven!
String Quartets, same composer w/ Authentic Quartet on 'period instruments' - this guy wrote a LOT of music but little is published; these two discs are quite enjoyable, just wished other CDs of his works might have been recorded - :-\
(http://giradman.smugmug.com/Other/Classical-Music/AlbrechtsbergerTrios/568263231_eLqdn-O.jpg) (http://giradman.smugmug.com/Other/Classical-Music/AlbrectsSQs/618085797_kYSsi-O.jpg)
Quote from: SonicMan on January 03, 2010, 04:32:55 PM
At the bottom is quoted a post that I just left in the listening thread concerning the 2 discs that I own of this composer, both of which I enjoy; regarding the String Quartets, I'd have to agree w/ snyprrr on the quality and performances of this recording; these are well written works (better that Mozart or Haydn - no but quite good) - just to reinforce this opinion, I tried to search for reviews and few were available; immediately below is one quoted from the All Music Guide - this recording is certainly worth exploring for those interested in another composer/teacher w/ dates similar to Haydn who was an important character in the classical music scene of the era! Dave :)
Both Eybler's and Albrechtsberger's sets are from 1787, and if we just put everything in context, these are two great examples of the great variety of art being produced at this pinnacle of High Classicism. I've been pairing them up with great results.
Albrechtsberger really has the catchy melody thing going on in the first mvmts. that make them pretty instantly appealing. The second mvmt. of
No.4, with the constant harmonic pizz, is really striking, and, was also taken up by Haydn in Op.64/4's equal mvmt.
If the Mosaiques had played these SQs, they would have won the Grammo-something! It is hard when this present group just seems to slightly fall short is all respects; however, I AM able to hear the Mosaiques in my head, so, trade-off.
I find these SQs relate best with Haydn's Opp. 9/17, and parts of Op.20.
Dave, can you gather from the booklet that these particular SQs were very unique in Albrechtsberger's output (at least up to 1790)? I'm thinking even these last three were more special than the first three, so, my point being, this may be the pinnacle of Albrechtsberger's thinking on this matter. I know he wrote a lot of SQs after this, but will we ever know the substance of these? Some of them do look interesting, in strange keys and all...
Quote from: snyprrr on January 07, 2010, 10:40:28 PM
Dave, can you gather from the booklet that these particular SQs were very unique in Albrechtsberger's output (at least up to 1790)? I'm thinking even these last three were more special than the first three, so, my point being, this may be the pinnacle of Albrechtsberger's thinking on this matter. I know he wrote a lot of SQs after this, but will we ever know the substance of these? Some of them do look interesting, in strange keys and all...
Hello
Snyprrr - I've been trying to find a decent listing of this guy's works on the web ever since my first purchase of the CDs that I own; just does not seem to be available! The liner notes from the SQs state that he wrote c. 284 church music works, 278 keyboard pieces, and 193 other works (assume chamber & orchestral?).
Of the SQs under question, they are listed as part of his Op. 7 output (Nos. 4-6); little is mentioned about the first 3 from that opus set, so not sure if Nos. 1-3 are earlier works and/or composed in a different manner? The statement is made that he wrote about 30 SQs, and the ones on the CD are from 1787 (as you stated) - but again not clear as to 'how many' of the others came before or after that date; appears that his most active time as a composer was between 1780-1790.
Also, I just checked Amazon & ArkivMusic under his name - just not much available - only a handful of discs w/ him as the sole composer - most of the rest has him w/ a work or so + other composers. So, appears that much needs to be published and discovered - I'm sure that plenty of his music is extant yet to be recorded! Dave :)
Quote from: SonicMan on January 08, 2010, 06:18:21 AM
Hello Snyprrr - I've been trying to find a decent listing of this guy's works on the web ever since my first purchase of the CDs that I own; just does not seem to be available! The liner notes from the SQs state that he wrote c. 284 church music works, 278 keyboard pieces, and 193 other works (assume chamber & orchestral?).
Of the SQs under question, they are listed as part of his Op. 7 output (Nos. 4-6); little is mentioned about the first 3 from that opus set, so not sure if Nos. 1-3 are earlier works and/or composed in a different manner? The statement is made that he wrote about 30 SQs, and the ones on the CD are from 1787 (as you stated) - but again not clear as to 'how many' of the others came before or after that date; appears that his most active time as a composer was between 1780-1790.
Also, I just checked Amazon & ArkivMusic under his name - just not much available - only a handful of discs w/ him as the sole composer - most of the rest has him w/ a work or so + other composers. So, appears that much needs to be published and discovered - I'm sure that plenty of his music is extant yet to be recorded! Dave :)
Check this out! ;)
@1760 (D, Bb, F), (A)
1764 (E)
1780 Op.1 (G, A, Bb, f, a, Eb)
1782 Op.2 (D, G, E, c, f, D)
@1782 Op.7 (D, A, F, ?, ?, ?)*
1786 Op.5 (Bb, g, d, F, A, e)
1792 Op.10 (d, F, a, e, C, Ab)
1797 Op.16 (A, d, G, c, F, Bb)
1798 Op.14 (G, Eb, C, F, D, Bb)
Op.18 (D, G, C, F, d, Bb)
Op.19 (A, A) haha, shades of boccherini! ;)
1800 Op.20 (G, Bb, Eb, F, C, d)
1805 Op.23 (C, Eb, Ab, F, d, A)
1807 Op.24 (C, Eb, Bb, G, b, A)
1808 Op.26 (Eb, c, Bb, D, e, C)
That's the way my index puts it. Notice the interesting discrepency, written as it is, with question marks, ha, it's the very same SQs on the cd that are missing! So, the notes date from 1787, whilst the index gives an @1782 date, though, I must say, this index can be strange with the "@" symbol sometimes. They certainly "sound" like from an earlier vintage, but, maybe he was just a throwback, as they say. Anyhow, I've had the index for a while, and I think it's older, perhaps early '80s research, so it's interesting how it seems to think of 4-6 as "lost", whereas, poof!, that's what we got here. I thought the notes said that these (4-6) were "still in manuscript form"? Anyhow, interesting little mystery.
Am I counting 79 SQs? Hmmm ::)...
I know the Harp concerto, an example of the period's musical mediocrity...
Snyprrr - interesting index you provided - I'm assuming that these are of his
String Quartets? And, if so you've provided over twice as many as quoted in the liner notes - just curious if you have any 'sources and/or references' to this composer's output? As stated previously, I've tried but failed to find any substantial listing of his works on the web! :-\
Quote from: Sean on January 09, 2010, 09:40:46 AM
I know the Harp concerto, an example of the period's musical mediocrity...
Sean - first, have you heard either of the two
Harp Concertos shown below? These are listed on Amazon but I cannot track down any reviews - if you have, I assume you were not thrilled?
Concerning your other opinion about 'the period's musical mediocrity', you certainly are entitled to an opinion; but
Albrechtsberger's dates mirror those of
Haydn, so for me much of the music composed in the latter half of the 18th & early 19th centuries is some of my favorite - I'm sure others share one or the other of our choices - Dave :D
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51MRICOMUcL._SL500_AA240_.jpg) (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41WNntch%2BcL._SL500_AA240_.jpg)
Quote from: SonicMan on January 09, 2010, 01:17:38 PM
Sean - first, have you heard either of the two Harp Concertos shown below? These are listed on Amazon but I cannot track down any reviews - if you have, I assume you were not thrilled?
Concerning your other opinion about 'the period's musical mediocrity', you certainly are entitled to an opinion; but Albrechtsberger's dates mirror those of Haydn, so for me much of the music composed in the latter half of the 18th & early 19th centuries is some of my favorite - I'm sure others share one or the other of our choices - Dave :D
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51MRICOMUcL._SL500_AA240_.jpg) (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41WNntch%2BcL._SL500_AA240_.jpg)
I remember I made a recording of some radio broadcast of this concerto and don't recall the details...
I didn't mean all the music of the period was mediocre by the way!
Quote from: Sean on January 09, 2010, 01:59:41 PM
I didn't mean all the music of the period was mediocre by the way!
Sean - thanks for the comments on the harp piece - maybe others will have an opinion?
As to the above, that was my assumption; there were a 'hella of a lot' composers back then (pre-recorded music, TV, movies, etc. were non-existent!) and much 'average' music was certainly composed (and most hopefully lost - :D) - but the 'cream of the crop' (and those lurking just below) are certainly worthy - Dave :)
Quote from: SonicMan on January 09, 2010, 02:07:02 PM
Sean - thanks for the comments on the harp piece - maybe others will have an opinion?
As to the above, that was my assumption; there were a 'hella of a lot' composers back then (pre-recorded music, TV, movies, etc. were non-existent!) and much 'average' music was certainly composed (and most hopefully lost - :D) - but the 'cream of the crop' (and those lurking just below) are certainly worthy - Dave :)
Sure thing Dave. How's this lot for starters- all names some of whose music I've explored
1730
SACCHINI Antonio 1730-86 Italian
CANNABICH Christian 1731-98 German
BACH Johann Christoph Friedrich 1732-95 German
HAYDN Josef 1732-1809 Austrian
LINLEY Thomas 1733-95 England
GOSSEC Francois 1734-1829 Belgian
SCHOBERT Johann c1735-67 Silesian/ French
BACH Johann Christian 1735-82 German
ECKARD Johann Gottfried 1735-1809 German
ALBRECHTSBERGER Johann Georg 1736-1809 Austrian
MYSLIVECEK Josef 1737-81 Bohemian
HAYDN Michael 1737-1806 Austrian
HOFFMANN Leopold 1738-93 Austrian
HAYES Philip 1738-97 English
HERSCHEL William 1738-1822 German/ English
DITTERSDORF Karl Ditters von 1739-99 Austrian
VANHAL Johann 1739-1813 Bohemian/ Austrian
1740
ARNOLD Samuel 1740-1802 English
PAISIELLO Giovanni 1740-1816 Italian
NAUMANN Johann Gottlieb 1741-1801 German
GRETRY Andre Ernest 1741-1813 Belgian/ French
KRUMPHOLTZ Jean-Baptiste 1742-1790 Bohemian
STAMITZ Carl 1745-1801 German
DRUSCHETZKY Georg 1745-1819 Bohemian
PUNTO Giovanni 1746-1803 Bohemian
BOCCHERINI Luigi 1743-1805 Italian
HOOK James 1746-1827 English
NEEFE Christian Gottlob 1748-98 German
SHIELD William 1748-1829 English
CIMAROSA Domenico 1749-1801 Italian
1750
ROSETTI Antonio c1750-92 Bohemian
SALIERI Antonio 1750-1825 Italian
BORTNYANSKY Dimitry 1751-1825 Russian
LEBRUN Ludwig August 1752-90 German
REICHARDT Johann Friedrich 1752-1814 German
MARSH John 1752-1828 English
CLEMENTI Muzio 1752-1832 Italian/ English
HOFFMEISTER Franz Anton 1754-1812 German
FIORILLO Federigo 1755-c1823 Italian
VIOTTI Giovanni Battista 1755-1824 Italian
MOZART Wolfgang Amadeus 1756-91 Austrian
KRAUS Joseph Martin 1756-92 German/ Swedish
WRANITZKY Paul 1756-1808 Moravian
PLEYEL Ignaz 1757-1831 Austrian
ZELTER Carl Friedrich 1758-1832 German
KROMMER Franz 1759-1831 Moravian
1760
ZUMSTEEG Johann Rudolf 1760-1802 German
DUSSEK Jan Ladislav 1760-1812 Bohemian
CHERUBINI Luigi 1760-1842 Italian
TULINDBERG Erik 1761-1814 Finnish
KUNZEN Friedrich 1761-1817 German/ Danish
TAUSCH Franz 1762-1817 German
MEHUL Etienne-Nicolas 1763-1817 French
DANZI Franz 1763-1826 German
EYBLER Joseph Leopold 1765-1846 Austrian
SUSSMAYR Franz Xaver 1766-1803 Austrian
WESLEY Samuel 1766-1837 English
FODOR Carolus Antonius 1768-1846 Dutch
ELSNER Joseph Xaver 1769-1854 Polish