GMG Classical Music Forum

x

too many to choose but here are a few
- palestrina pope marcellus mass
- cipriano de rore praeter rerum serium mass
- tallis spem in alium
- rachmaninov all-nite vigil

My Top Five:

Bach - Mass in B minor & St. Matthew Passion
Mozart - Great Mass in C minor.
Beethoven - Missa Solemnis.
Brahms - German Requiem.

That's about as mainstream as it gets.

LvB Missa Solemnis
Mozart Requiem
Bach St Matthew Passion
Bach Mass in B Minor
Brahms Ein Deutsches Requiem

LvB Missa Solemnis
LvB 9th
Mahler 8th
Mahler 2nd
Mozart Requiem in D minor

Rachamaninov: All-night Vigil

Brahms: A German Requiem

Faure: Requiem

Mozart: Requiem


... and I'm having THREE final choices, as they're so short they barely constitute ONE work. ;D


Stanford: The Blue Bird

Elgar: The Shower

Pearsall: Lay A Garland

Beethoven : Missa Solemnis
Brahms : German Requiem
Handel : Messiah
Liszt : Christus
Rachmaninov : Vespers

Rachmaninov "Les vêpres"op.37. Messe Chœur National de l'URSS/Alexandre Svechnikov

Beethoven Choral Fantasy Op. 80 Arnold Schoenberg Chor/Harnoncort/Aimard-Piano

Mozart Requiem Vienna State Opera Concert Choir/Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra /Bohm

Handel "Zadock the Priest"-"The King Shall Rejoice" Academy and Chorus of St. Martin-in-the-Fields/Marriner (and all the other Coronation Anthems by the same ensembles)

Haydn Missa Sancti Bernardi de Offida Chorale Franco-Allemande de Paris/Orchestre Jean-François Gonzales/Lallement*

*Yet to hear a Haydn mass that I did not enjoy.

Quote from: Bogey on July 08, 2007, 02:18:34 PM
Yet to hear a Haydn mass that I did not enjoy.

Amen to that.  At least 3 of my top 5 could easily be Haydn masses.  Restricting the choice to just 1 representative per composer gives something like :

Haydn : Paukenmesse
Schnittke : Requiem
Stravinsky : Symphony of Psalms
Bruckner : Fm Mass

plus - if I'm allowed a Bach cantata:

Bach : Ein' feste Burg ist unser Gott BWV80

and if I'm not:

Prokofiev : Alexander Nevsky

Haydn - The Creation (Karajan)
Haydn - The Seasons (Rene Jacobs)
Beethoven - Missa Solemnis (Bohm)
Verdi - Requiem (Riner)
Bach - Christmas Oratorio - (Rene Jacobs)

Quote from: Choo Choo on July 08, 2007, 02:36:51 PM
Amen to that.  At least 3 of my top 5 could easily be Haydn masses.  Restricting the choice to just 1 representative per composer gives something like :

Indeed.....I have shelved the masses I have from him for a few months and now it is time to enjoy them again.  

These three stand alone, I think.

Beethoven: Missa solemnis
Bach: Mass in B minor
Stravinsky: Symphonie des Psaumes

To throw in a couple of less conventional choices to fill it out:

Ockeghem: Missa prolationum
Gerhard: The Plague

Quote from: Mark on July 08, 2007, 01:41:45 PM

Stanford: The Blue Bird

That is a tiny ecstatic little masterpiece. I have a version with the Cambridge singers and the solo soprano line is beautifully taken.

My top five have almost all been mentioned above. The big guns really, though the Monteverdi Vespers of 1610 should not be left out. Such a rich tapestry of sound and texture. Handel's Theodora would have to be saved from any house fire, a long string of jaw-droppingly beautiful arias.

Mike

With questions like this, there is an unfortunate urge to make the most for my money, and therefore I skip a lot of small motets which I otherwise love, but...

Tallis - Spem in Alium
Machaut - Messe de Notre-Dame
Poulenc - Laudes de Saint Antoine de Padoue
Bruckner - Helgoland
Palestrina - Laudate Pueri (motet)

Some ridiculous personal choices. To pick more normal ones:

Monteverdi - Vespro della Beata Vergine 1610
Berlioz - Requiem
Haydn - Theresienmesse (as others mentioned, it could be many)
Josquin - Missa Hercules Dux Ferrariae
Duruflé - Requiem

My five plus favorite performances (I am not considering symphonies that employ choruses or oratorios/masses that have a high ratio of solo to choral parts):

Bruckner - Te Deum  Celibidache/Munich Phil

Berlioz - Requiem  Davis/LSO

Bernstein - Chichester Psalms  Bernstein/NY Phil

Janáček - Glagolitic Mass  Mackerras/Czech Phil

I'm going to pull a Mark for my last pick. Three short works:

Fauré - Pavane  Barenboim/O de Paris

Tallis - Why fum'th in sight  Tallis Scholars (tune was used by RVW in his Tallis Fantasia)

Brahms - 13 Kanons Op.113 #13  Chamber Choir of Europe (a six-part canon for female choir, using Schubert's Leiermann melody, lyrics by Rückert)

Here's a 6mb mp3 file of the Brahms' Canon:

http://rapidshare.com/files/41832991/op.133_no13.mp3.html

Sarge

Bach: Magnificat

Brahms: German Requiem

Handel: Messiah

Mozart: Requiem

Prokofiev: Alexander Nevsky Cantata

Beethoven: Symphony No. 9--I know, it's only 12-13 minutes of choral singing but we did it recently and it was great fun once I practiced it enough to get all the high notes in my voice.

I haven't mentioned great works such as Bach's St. Matthew Passion and B minor Mass, Beethoven's Missa Solemnis, Rachmaninov's Vespers and Bells, and other works simply because they aren't my favorites.  it's no reflection on their quality.

The winners:

1. J.S. Bach, Matthäus-Passion (BWV 244), McCreesh '03
2. J.S. Bach, Gott der Herr ist Sonn und Schild (BWV 79), Gardiner '05
3. Gustav Mahler, Das klagende Lied, Boulez '70
4. Anton Bruckner, Te Deum, Von Karajan '60
5. Franz Schmidt, Das Buch mit sieben Siegeln, Welser-Möst '98

The honorable mentions:

Stravinsky, Symphonie des psaumes; Lili Boulanger, Psalm 130; Prokofiev, Alexander Nevsky

Note on Mahler:

I would, necessarily, list the 2nd and 8th way above Das klagende Lied, though I do like the cantata, but I'm not sure whether or not to consider those two symphonies "choral works" in the same way that Das klagende Lied clearly is.

DUFAY: Missa Ecce Ancilla Domini

BACH: Mass in B minor / St Matthew Passion

BEETHOVEN: Missa Solemnis

BRAHMS: Ein Deutsches Requiem

Quote from: knight on July 08, 2007, 03:19:43 PM
That is a tiny ecstatic little masterpiece. I have a version with the Cambridge singers and the solo soprano line is beautifully taken.

Indeed, Mike. I heard the young soprano, Eloise Irving, sing 'The Blue Bird' live with Oxford Camerata at St. Johns Smith Square two years ago, and her flawless projection of those solo lines was spellbinding. Shame she hasn't recorded it.

Many ones I love mentioned, Alexander Nevsky surely, St. Matthew's Passion, the LvB. Definitely the Mahler. Nice to see Chichester Psalms with a mention.

I'll go ahead and throw out:

Jean Sibelius - Kullervo
Gustav Holst - The Hymn of Jesus
Carl Orff - Carmina Burana (somebody had to  :D)
Francis Poulenc - Gloria
Eric Whitacre - Cloudburst (so clever!)

John Rutter also worth a mention, his Requiem and Magnificat (City of London Sinfonia conducted by composer) my pick there.

1. Elgar - The Apostles, Op. 49
2. Elgar - The Kingdom, Op. 51
3. Elgar - The Dream of Gerontius, Op. 38
4. J. S. Bach - Mass in B minor, BWV 232
5. J. S. Bach - St. John Passion, BWV 245

Quote from: James on July 08, 2007, 01:17:28 PM
Stravinsky's Mass (The textures are so clear & clean and iconic ... I'm talking horizontal not vertical music..)

Great piece.

And, sure, it works vertically as well as horizontally  8)

Quote from: Greta on July 09, 2007, 01:02:42 AM
Gustav Holst - The Hymn of Jesus

Oh, I like you, Greta!  :D

My pick:

1. Beethoven - Missa Solemnis

The Mount Everest, to me. Then, after a very long pause:

2. Havergal Brian - Gothic Symphony (Te Deum)

3. Frederick Delius - Requiem OR A Mass of Life

4. Igor Stravinsky - Symphony of Psalms

5. Gabriel Fauré - Requiem

All these works seem smaller in scope (yes, even the Brian!) than the Missa Solemnis, which is really stupendous in its power and architecture.

(By way of explanation - I have difficulties in liking Bach's vocal works. Something in the way he writes for the human voice, I think. So - no Mass in B minor for me, yet...)

Quote from: Jezetha on July 09, 2007, 06:03:09 AM
(By way of explanation - I have difficulties in liking Bach's vocal works. Something in the way he writes for the human voice, I think. So - no Mass in B minor for me, yet...)

I am with you re the Missa Solemnis. Today on another thread I mentioned a different occasion where someone felt that Bach did not write well for the human voice. I know that is not what you are saying: but I would be interested if you can explain what your difficulties are with his writing for the voice.

Mike

My current favorites:

Britten: War Requiem
Bruckner: Te Deum
Sandström: The High Mass
          (http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/I/415F4FSKP8L._AA240_.jpg)
Ligeti: Lux Aeterna
Howells: Requiem

--Bruce

Among modern a cappela works (I make a distiction to orchestral works with chorus) I've always found this moving and profound:

(http://www.mdt.co.uk/public/pictures/products/standard/GLO5085.jpg)

Oh yes, yes, yes to the Krenek!  And thank you, too, for alerting me to another recording.  (There can't be many...)  The one I have is below, with Marcus Creed and the Berlin RIAS Chamber Choir.

(http://www.eauderose.net/Ma_discotheque/54.jpg)

--Bruce

In no particular order :

Berlioz : Romeo & Juliet
Haydn : The Seasons
            The creation
Handel : Messiah
Brahms : Ein Deutsche Requiem

They are many, James, and I won't be bound to a list of five.

These are the first five that came to mind, though:

Monteverdi, Vespro della Beata Vergine
Berlioz, Grande Messe des morts, Opus 5
Brahms, A German Requiem, Opus 45
Rakhmaninov, Vespers, Opus 37
Nielsen, Fynsk foraar, Opus 42

Quote from: knight on July 09, 2007, 08:56:45 AM
I am with you re the Missa Solemnis. Today on another thread I mentioned a different occasion where someone felt that Bach did not write well for the human voice. I know that is not what you are saying: but I would be interested if you can explain what your difficulties are with his writing for the voice.

Mike! I'll try to answer your question as succinctly as I can, but it's a vast subject.

Why I don't warm to vocal Bach (but not all vocal Bach, his chorales are wonderful) might of course be written off as a blind spot. But I know that I'm not deficient in the musical department, so that there must be a more 'interesting' reason for my dislike. And I think I know what it is.

Bach, to me, is a sort of Über-Brahms without the softening romanticism. I like the instrumental Bach, the Bach of the organ works, I like the Wohltemperierte, because I think his genius is most at home there. Bach is theological and titanic. His competence is massive, but I don't think the musical language as an expression of the human has already evolved into what we start to hear ever more clearly in Haydn, Mozart, and above all, Beethoven. Do you know the three great Athenian tragedians, Aeschylus, Sophocles, Euripides? Bach reminds me of Aeschylus - vast, paternal, theological, intricate, but the human is only part of the great scheme of things. It's the gods that dominate. For me the same goes for Bach.

I don't think his music is sensuous or sensual, it's tremendous and monumental - I like that in instrumental music, but when the human voice comes in, I want humanity. I know, I know - 'What about Christ, in the St Matthew's Passion" I think it's the surrounding chorales with their wonderful harmonies that bring out the pathos, not the Christ part itself (I took singing lessons a long time ago, and I sung the part with my teacher accompanying me - perhaps it's down to me, but Christ didn't move me...)

Jez

Thanks Jes, I guess we sit at opposite ends of the spectrum here. I find I respond very readily to his vocal writing. There seems deep humanity in the contemplative arias that ponder faith, express doubt or grief, they can on occasion be ecstatic.

I can see that he is working in such a way as to exclude what might be thought of as every day human situations, no romantic love or expressions about personal relationships, but there seems a deep well of human emotion in many of his vocal works. We have now left the faceless white tone that infected many HIP performances and singers are now increasingly being given elbow room to again express in their singing the way some singers from the past did and to really communicate and dig into the meaning of the music and convey the words.

So, we can agree to disagree, but thanks for your explanation.

Mike

I envy you, Mike! It's sad when you have to miss out on a whole continent of superb music (yes, I do recognise quality when I hear it). I can hear the pain in Bach, though, and a great sadness. Although I'm not the kind of person to shy away from these emotions, there is something in the way Bach expresses them that doesn't appeal to me.

Ah well - one day my Bach will come, perhaps...

Jez

Nothing particularly abnormal or spectacular about my list, but here it is:

Brahms: Ein Deutsches Requiem
Bach: Mass in B Minor
Beethoven: Missa Solemnis
Haydn: Die Schöpfung
Händel: Messiah

Woo. Behold my originality.  :P

I'll stick to a capella works:

Ligeti: Lux Aeterna. This came to mind first, and I think it may indeed be my favorite choral work of all. Glad to see others mention it too.
Allegri: Miserere. A standard choice, still wonderful though so well known!
Martin: Mass for Double Choir. An incredibly beautiful piece, in a style that is vaguely renaissance in places yet very different.
Schnittke: Choir Concerto. An ancient-sounding modern work. The very moving lyrical second movement also exists in a Kronos SQ arrangement.
Pérotin: Viderunt omnes. When I read that Steve Reich was influenced by Perotin I can't help but think of this piece. It's hard to believe it is so ancient (13th century?).

Quote from: Jezetha on July 09, 2007, 06:03:09 AM
3. Frederick Delius - Requiem OR A Mass of Life

I need to acquaint myself with these .............................

QuoteI need to acquaint myself with these .............................

Do, and you won't be disappointed.

The Requiem should be available from EMI, Meredith Davies conducting. And I know A Mass of Life in a recording by the late Sir Charles Groves.

The Requiem is Delius's lament for the fallen of World War I, a beautifully spare work, that's not very popular because of its anti-religious stance (in a Requiem!) It manages to offend the three world religions in one movement - quite an achievement.  ;) But the work celebrates life and our earth in a typically Delian fashion, which is basically religion without a church, I would say...

The Mass of Life is Delius in his prime. An ebullient, masculine, yet dreamy work, that goes through many moods before ascending the heights of grandeur at the end.

Jez

Quote from: Jezetha on July 09, 2007, 03:24:22 PM
The Mass of Life is Delius in his prime. An ebullient, masculine, yet dreamy work, that goes through many moods before ascending the heights of grandeur at the end.

cool !

Rachmaninov - All-Night Vigil
Stravinsky - Symphony of Psalms
Schnittke - Choir Concerto
Kodaly - Psalmus Hungaricus
Leifs - Hafis

Drasko, Can you tell us about Leifs - Hafis? I have not heard of it.

Mike

Quote from: knight on July 09, 2007, 10:15:04 PM
Drasko, Can you tell us about Leifs - Hafis? I have not heard of it.

Mike

I can do better, here it is (35 MB, 256 kbps):

http://rapidshare.com/files/42089075/Hafis.mp3.html (http://rapidshare.com/files/42089075/Hafis.mp3.html)

Wow, Drasko! Thanks for sharing! I shall have a listen. (I own a few works by Jón Leifs - 1) Hekla and 2) the Saga Symphony, both volcanic works.)

Jez

Boo-Hoo I am on dial-up just now...waiting on AOL to provide broadband to my new address....So I tried the link and watched paint dry for a while.

Mike

Quote from: knight on July 10, 2007, 08:31:59 AM
Boo-Hoo I am on dial-up just now...waiting on AOL to provide broadband to my new address....So I tried the link and watched paint dry for a while.

You have my sympathy, Mike. But - you shall overcome.

Jez

Quote from: knight on July 10, 2007, 08:31:59 AM
...So I tried the link and watched paint dry for a while.

Hey, watching surfaces dry is High Art now, Mike:

(http://www.sculpture.org/documents/scmag03/june03/goldsworthy/images/Gol08-craclewall.jpg)

:)

Quote from: Jezetha on July 10, 2007, 08:35:55 AM
You have my sympathy, Mike. But - you shall overcome.

Jez

I think there may be a song in there somewhere.

Mike

Quote from: knight on July 10, 2007, 09:33:07 AM
I think there may be a song in there somewhere.

Someday, Mike.

Quote from: knight on July 10, 2007, 08:31:59 AM
Boo-Hoo I am on dial-up just now...waiting on AOL to provide broadband to my new address....So I tried the link and watched paint dry for a while.

Mike

Link should be active for the next 90 days, can AOL be that slow?

Perhaps Jezetha could give you his impressions of the piece in the meantime.

Quote from: Drasko on July 10, 2007, 09:38:28 AM
Perhaps Jezetha could give you his impressions of the piece in the meantime.

That would be good.

In passing, I am afraid it cannot just be five. As well as many of those above; I NEED the Bruckner Motets, Berlioz Te Deum, Bach Magnificat, RVW Serenade to Music, Handel's Belsazar and that Walton piece.

Mike

How about 55 rather than 5.

Quote from: knight on July 10, 2007, 10:05:07 AM
How about 55 rather than 5.

Sign me up!

Quote from: knight on July 10, 2007, 10:05:07 AM
...and that Walton piece.

Rats, forgot about Belshazzar's Feast...have to revise again...

--Bruce

My list is rather predictable. Also, I note with interest that the Bach passions and Magnificat are being considered as "choral" works - but I guess anything more than one singer makes a choir these days...  >:D

There seems to be much agreement in this thread. Odd.

So, the list:

Monteverdi / Vespers 1610 - being really sneaky, since this contains a whole bunch of excellent choral works as well as the dazzling Magnificat...

Bach / B Minor Mass & Matthew Passion - yes, yes.

Mozart / Requiem

Beethoven / Missa Solemnis

There is a lot of music by Victoria, Morales, Dufay, Buxtehude, Schutz, Mahler &c. that should be included but can't fit into a list of this format.  0:)

Quote from: Drasko on July 10, 2007, 09:38:28 AM
Link should be active for the next 90 days, can AOL be that slow?

You'd be surprised just how slow AOL can be  ;D

...amazing! Not a single honorable mention of a Schubert Mass. I believe it was the one in A-flat D.678 that Harnoncourt found hardly less great than Beethoven's Missa. It's not an opinion I would disagree with too much.

Mine are pretty common choices I'd guess:

Beethoven 9th
Mozart Requiem
Bach's Cantata #80
Beethoven Missa
Holst's Planets (can I count that because of the chorus in Neptune?)

QuoteHolst's Planets (can I count that because of the chorus in Neptune?)

I love Hornteacher. ;D

Quote from: Greta on July 11, 2007, 08:27:19 AM
I love Hornteacher. ;D

Love ya back, Greta!   ;)

Hello,

I am new to this board...choosing 5 works is, of course, impossible, but--

Janacek: Glagolitic Mass
Bliss: Morning Heroes 
Prokofiev: Seven, They Are Seven
Prokofiev: Cantata for the 20th Anniversary of the October Revolution
Klami: Psalmus
(or Honegger's Joan of Arc at the Stake)

These are obviously favorites, not the works I would necessary consider the "greatest" (though the Glagolitic Mass and Seven, They Are Seven could qualify).


andrew

Welcome, Andrew, and great list!

Quote from: jurajjak on July 11, 2007, 07:59:14 PM
Hello,

I am new to this board...choosing 5 works is, of course, impossible, but--


andrew

Welcome, Andrew!  :D

Hi,

Thanks for the welcome.

Bliss' Morning Heroes is a wonderful (if textually eccentric) work, which I suppose is performed more often in the UK than here in the US (which is to say, never).  Someone really needs to revive this--the first movement alone is one of the most gorgeous recitatives ever.

I'd be interested in peoples' suggestions for favorite choral works written after 1950 (or thereabouts)--I'm always looking for new/obscure stuff. 


thanks,
andrew

Quote from: jurajjak on July 13, 2007, 08:32:43 AM
I'd be interested in peoples' suggestions for favorite choral works written after 1950 (or thereabouts)--I'm always looking for new/obscure stuff. 

Well, Andrew, there are the obvious late Stravinsky works:

Canticum sacrum
Threni
Requiem Canticles

Of these, the first and third are unqualified favorites for me.  And the massive Threni, even if there are bits which I am still mulling over, has more than enough going for it that I call it a favorite, too.

An English composer living in Portugal, Ivan Moody, has a fine talent for Orthodox-infused choral writing;  I'd especially commend:

Passion & Resurrection
The Akáthistos Hymn

Three very different works, though I like them all very well, by Charles Wuorinen:

Genesis
Mass for the Restoration of St Luke in the Fields
Missa brevis

Not particularly like anything else you've heard a choir sing, is Rothko Chapel by Morton Feldman.

Hi,

Thanks for the recommendations.  Wuorinen is a composer I've been meaning to listen to, but don't know much about.

I recently came across Gubaidulina's early cantata "Night in Memphis" (on an odd German import CD)...I found it rather exciting.


andrew

The "natural" Top 5 (with a whole lot missing):

• Bach Mass in B Minor
• Beethoven Missa Solemnis
• Brahms German Requiem
• Mozart Requiem
• Stravinsky Symphony of Psalms

The off the beaten path set:

• Augustyn Bloch - Anenaiki
• Henryk Mikolaj Gorecki - Symphony No. 2 OR any of his works for choir a capella
• Eugeniusz Knapik - Introduction to a Mystery
• Penderecki - Stabat Mater from St Luke's Passion OR Agnus Dei from Polish Requiem OR Song of the Cherubim
• Pawel Szymanski - Viderunt omnes fines terrae

Thanks...I don't know the Bloch or Knapik...I'll have to check them out.

Schubert - Mass 6,  D 950
Brahms - German Requiem
Beethoven - Missa Solemnis
Haydn - The Creation
Mozart - Requiem


..........

I'd put Schubert at the top of my list in any almost genre, hence my avatar!

I used to like Handel's Messiah but the funny thing is that I've gone off it lately.  Same with Bach's Mass in B Minor. I'm not sure what exactly may have caused this.