A few years ago, after decades of indifference, I found myself enjoying swing jazz for the first time in my life. I started listening to Benny Goodman but quickly came to realise that what I most responded to were the pieces with a contribution from a female vocalist - most notably the incomparable swinging singing of Helen Ward. That led me to Helen Forrest; then Ivie Anderson, with Duke Ellington; early Peggy Lee, Dinah Washington, Billie Holiday, and the like - and above all Anita O'Day. I bought Anita O'Day CDs as if they were lollipops melting on a hot day and I had to rescue them all.
After that first flush of wild enthusiasm things settled down more quietly, but the whole thing resurfaced recently when I stumbled across the remarkable Annette Hanshaw, whose brief career spanned the end of the 1920s and the beginning of the 1930s. At first I thought she was just an attractive sort of flapper pop singer - and of course she is, partly, that. But she phrases the songs with wonderfully creative insight, often suggesting a fragile and vulnerable character hiding behind a veneer of cheerfulness. I've lost track of how many times I've listened to her rendition of 'Mean to Me':
http://www.youtube.com/v/q6s7-5IaMeM
There didn't seem to be a place where I could chat amiably about this sort of thing - it's a lot more specific than merely 'jazz', as you see - so I thought I'd create this new thread and see if there were any kindred spirits out there.
Interesting confluence of events. I am not the biggest expert in this area, though I know a little. But a friend of mine recently mentioned something about Mamie Smith (who may or may not be of interest to you). But that led me to do a little research and I came across this interesting list just a couple of days ago: http://www.lib.odu.edu/exhibits/womenshistorymonth/2003/vocal.htm (http://www.lib.odu.edu/exhibits/womenshistorymonth/2003/vocal.htm). You will surely recognize some of the names. Ethel Waters sang in some films and had a remarkable voice. One of my favorite songs has always been Stormy Weather, with which she is associated. She started with Blues.
Ella Fitzgerald wasn't on your list, but you will find plenty of her, so I'll skip her for now. Alberta Hunter is a very interesting character - she started as a singer, changed careers and became a nurse. She would have happily stayed a nurse to the end if not forced to retire. Mildred Bailey was known as the Queen of Swing and Mrs. Swing. Anyway, lots of names to explore if you like. Here's one with her: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7PjdY4YaQg&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7PjdY4YaQg&feature=related).
One person not on the list, and often credited with influencing Ella Fitzgerlad was Connee Boswell. She used a wheelchair her whole life. Here is something you will recognize: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZCi2WQ6rNg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZCi2WQ6rNg)
Although it came out in 1960 or so and doesn't technically fit in with your '20s-'50s thread, Abbey Lincoln's work on Max Roach's We Insist! Freedom Now Suite is excellent and among my favorite female jazz vocalist performances.
http://www.youtube.com/v/yTGUkQQkttg
Helen Merrill (sic?)
Quote from: mc ukrneal on July 13, 2012, 12:13:31 AM
Interesting confluence of events. I am not the biggest expert in this area, though I know a little. But a friend of mine recently mentioned something about Mamie Smith (who may or may not be of interest to you). But that led me to do a little research and I came across this interesting list just a couple of days ago: http://www.lib.odu.edu/exhibits/womenshistorymonth/2003/vocal.htm (http://www.lib.odu.edu/exhibits/womenshistorymonth/2003/vocal.htm). You will surely recognize some of the names. Ethel Waters sang in some films and had a remarkable voice. One of my favorite songs has always been Stormy Weather, with which she is associated. She started with Blues.
What has tended to happen is that when I find a singer that strikes a personal chord, so to speak, I explore that particular person's recordings for a while to the (temporary) exclusion of others. So I end up being quite familiar with a few select singers and hardly at all familiar with some often more famous ones. I've bumped into Ethel Waters and she's on my radar, but she hasn't had 'the treatment' yet.
I must say I agree with you about
Stormy Weather; it's a great favourite of mine too, along with
I Apologise,
Smoke gets in your eyes (I love Dinah Washington's versions of those three), and while I'm on a roll, how about
Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered, and
A Nightingale Sang in Berkeley Square (this last nailed forever by Anita O'Day).
QuoteElla Fitzgerald wasn't on your list, but you will find plenty of her, so I'll skip her for now.
I found her enormous back-catalogue altogether too daunting at the outset, but as it happens I've just recently ordered a collection of some of her best-known recordings.
QuoteAlberta Hunter is a very interesting character - she started as a singer, changed careers and became a nurse. She would have happily stayed a nurse to the end if not forced to retire. Mildred Bailey was known as the Queen of Swing and Mrs. Swing. Anyway, lots of names to explore if you like. Here's one with her: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7PjdY4YaQg&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7PjdY4YaQg&feature=related).
Hunter's new to me, but Mildred Bailey isn't - I have the 4 CD Proper Box collection of her stuff. I haven't exactly warmed to her yet, but I'm making new breakthroughs all the time, so I've no doubt I'll get to know her better.
QuoteOne person not on the list, and often credited with influencing Ella Fitzgerlad was Connee Boswell. She used a wheelchair her whole life. Here is something you will recognize: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZCi2WQ6rNg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZCi2WQ6rNg)
She's another singer on my radar but as yet unexplored. There are so many of them, almost all worth exploring, that it's bound to take a long time.
At the moment I'm obsessed with Annette Hanshaw, though, and have just discovered that one particular label has produced remastered recordings of unparalleled quality: it's the (incomplete) series of jazz and blues CDs on the Sensation label - volumes 5, 6 and 7 are devoted to Annette:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51kx5zzrskL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
I just bought volume 6 (above) and whoever cleaned these recordings up did a superb job. There really is no comparison between these and the various other collections of Hanshaw recordings that are available (just search on Amazon to see them). I simply have to get vols 5 and 7, now, and some of the purchases I've already made may become redundant.
As for Annette herself: there seems to be only one piece of film that has survived, and here it is. I find it endlessly watchable:
http://www.youtube.com/v/3I12Wwc9qo4
Good thread topic.
Not a lot of time right now but I will mention that Ella used to be my favorite until Sarah Vaughan came along.
And how about those Boswell Sisters? 0:)
i absolutely love this Manhattan made by Lee Wiley with Bobby Hackett
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AK3ZqLXxacs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AK3ZqLXxacs)
and another singer who started in the fifties i love is Lorez Alexandria.
Her rendition of Baltimore oriole is a classic, altough this one is the version she did in 1963 and not the one on This is Lorez in 1957
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKELUG2nQVE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKELUG2nQVE)
Quote from: escher on July 14, 2012, 12:09:54 AM
i absolutely love this Manhattan made by Lee Wiley with Bobby Hackett
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AK3ZqLXxacs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AK3ZqLXxacs)
Thanks for the tip-off for Lee Wiley, who's new to me - but clearly someone I should put on my list.
Doris Day!
That is all.
Well.... if Doris Day can be listed in a thread for Female Jazz singers then I hope you will accept:
Nancy Wilson, three standout songs, "Never let me go" and "Please send me someone to love" from the superb "Yesterday's Love Songs: Tomorrow's Blues" with the Gerald Wilson Orchestra, a stunning "Ode to Billie Joe" on "Welcome to my love". There's also the collaboration with Cannonball and Nat Adderley.
Dakota Staton and a jazz group, "The Late Late Show" with Jonah Jones on trumpet has one of the best "Summertime"s IMHO.
Barbara McNair channels the Streisand sound on "The Livin' End" but has enough individuality to make it a great album nonetheless. "What are you afraid of? " was banned by at least one Broadcasting organisation ( too suggestive?). I know because I saw the organisation's library copy annotated with the ban.
www.cliveheathmusic.co.uk
Quote from: early grey on July 16, 2012, 11:27:25 AM
Well.... if Doris Day an be listed in a thread for Female Jazz singers ...
I too lifted an eyebrow at the idea of Doris Day as a jazz singer, but a moment's googling took me to these 1952's radio transcriptions, which surprised me:
http://www.amazon.com/Doris-Day-Complete-Standard-Transcriptions/dp/B000R02FJW (http://www.amazon.com/Doris-Day-Complete-Standard-Transcriptions/dp/B000R02FJW)
Her singing always comes over as too sugary for my taste, but it seems that she does have some something like jazz in her back-catalogue.
On a different topic: www.cliveheathmusic.co.uk - is this your website? If it is, then thank you very much indeed. Your site was largely responsible for my initiation into Benny Goodman a couple of years ago.
Replying to Elgarian: yes, it is my site and I'm delighted that find you found it rewarding. I came on today to launch my latest Ellingtonia (see the new thread) but my passion for this topic drew me in. Clive
Quote from: early grey on July 16, 2012, 03:05:56 PM
Replying to Elgarian: yes, it is my site and I'm delighted that find you found it rewarding. I came on today to launch my latest Ellingtonia (see the new thread) but my passion for this topic drew me in. Clive
Actually Clive, now I recall more carefully (and revisiting your website to refresh my memory), I also have you to thank for my first exposure to Helen Ward and Ivie Anderson - both having an enormous impact on me. The point is: I knew nothing at all at that stage. I knew so little that I didn't even know what questions to ask. In short, your website is perfectly geared to provide some starting points for someone like me.
I see now that there's a 'contact' button - I should have left an appreciative message back then, and apologise for not doing so. But I'm delighted to be able to say 'thank you' now. Really, you can have no idea what an unstoppable juggernaut you started!
Quote from: Elgarian on July 15, 2012, 11:58:07 AM
Thanks for the tip-off for Lee Wiley, who's new to me - but clearly someone I should put on my list.
i'm glad you like it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SYREijmrKQ&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SYREijmrKQ&feature=related)
This one of Lucy Reed is very different, so i don't know if it's what you are looking for, very slow interpretation but it's a great song with a great pianist too (a young bill evans).
I find Dinah Washington' s work varies a lot in quality, but the best stuff really impresses me. What really got my attention was her version of Back Water Blues her Bessie Smith album (which, unfortunately, is pretty weak overall- the arrangements are too silly for most of the songs on that album. )
http://www.youtube.com/v/HoB_EP6vFzM
Mercury has a good two disc overview of her career-- although I must admit that her move towards pop in that later 50s didn't do much from me. Her last album, Back to the Blues is quite strong.
Ella Fitzgerald has amazing range-- there are many good collections out there. On one compilation I have of hers is great cover of Angel Eyes with only a piano backing her, and it is haunting. Iv'e found many versions she's done of the song on YouTube, but not that one.
Ethel Waters is a fascinating character in her pre-"Cabin In the Sky" days.
I have an even greater fascination with the Boswell Sisters. Later groups like The Andrews Sisters and The Maguire Sisters may have intended to be latter-day follow-ups to the Bozzies, but no other group ever managed the super-tight harmonies and flexible rhythms of the Bozzies.
Lots of their stuff is available on CD, like "Shout, Sister, Shout" and "That's How Rhythm Was Born", and probably their biggest number "It's the Girl".
A far cry from Ella, Dinah and Sarah Vaughan, admittedly, but a really cool backwater to explore.
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 17, 2012, 10:48:00 AM
... a really cool backwater to explore.
I think this is what fascinates me: there are
so many cool backwaters to explore. Once you start digging, there seems no end to the good stuff.
Ella was a fan of Connie Boswell, by the way, and she and several others tried to model their approach to certain standards on Connie's.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connee_Boswell (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connee_Boswell)
I've never been a huge fan of Sarah Vaughan on the whole, but her versions of certain songs are classic and unique. "The Man I Love" is one that comes to mind immediately.
Kaye Starr's Lamplighter Sessions are my pick for the greatest collection of female jazz vocals ever.
Nice topic. I have very little expertise on the subject, but I went through a bit of a Billie Holliday phase a while back. My local library has a pretty large jazz selection, and out of curiosity I ripped a couple of her boxsets to itunes. Extremely glad I did, beautiful stuff...
Quote from: jwinter on July 17, 2012, 03:52:12 PM
Nice topic. I have very little expertise on the subject, but I went through a bit of a Billie Holliday phase a while back. My local library has a pretty large jazz selection, and out of curiosity I ripped a couple of her boxsets to itunes. Extremely glad I did, beautiful stuff...
Can't quibble with that! I have a fair selection of her recordings, but curiously I feel I've yet to become really familiar with them. I've yet, for example, to become completely besotted (in the way that Helen Ward, Annette Hanshaw and Anita O'Day have absorbed me). Speaking of which, I popped Anita into the player recently and here we go again - listening my way through my entire collection. I don't know what it is about her - something do to with her risk-taking, sometimes with every phrase; something to do with the apparent fact that her life only worked when she was actually singing; something about the immense range of mood she could conjure up. Her autobiography is one long sequence of reasons for despair, yet you'd never think so to listen to her or watch her.
I'll post some examples of her performing below, singing to tear-inducing perfection, every part of her engaged in the act, right down to the delicately balanced hand gestures and facial expressions. She often moves her hands as if it's part of the process of sculpturing the music from the air.
http://www.youtube.com/v/CGgWrv6BKJg
http://www.youtube.com/v/deUAjVlZXII
Nice to be reminded of Anita's unique style.
Listening to Anita O'Day reminds me of the fact that many jazz vocalists have at least one identifying trait that can enable you to pick them out of a crowd. I can't quite put into words what her's was, It has something to do with her peculiar enunciation, but it also seems to have something to do with the high preliminary grace notes she often inserts on stressed notes. Maybe somebody else can define it better.
Sometimes those peculiar traits are endearing, and sometimes they just kind of grate on me. Her's is more the former than the latter for me. Sarah Vaughan's low melisma bugs me, for some reason, most of the time.
Another often-overlooked vocalist was Keely Smith. She has been relegated by a lot of people to a comedy act (with Louis Prima), but on her own she has made several quality record albums, even down till fairly recent times. She had one trait, though, that got more and more pronounced through the years that somehow bothered me. Sinatra did this too, occasionally. But, Keely made a habit of it - promouncing her "i"s as "ah"s.
"Fly Me to the Moon" would become "Flah Me to the Moon", for example. It's a shame. I'd play her stuff a lot more if it weren't for that habit that just sets my teeth on edge after a while.
Quote from: Elgarian on July 18, 2012, 01:36:26 AM
http://www.youtube.com/v/CGgWrv6BKJg
Nice! I liked Bewitched a lot, but I prefer Night and Day slower. Stil, a remarkable talent.
I don't know whether anyone else does this much, but sometimes I start listening to the same song sung by different artists (especially on youtubem when you just cick from one to the next). For example, Here is I Can't Give You Anything But Love, Baby sung in all sorts of ways. Which one do you like?
Ethel Waters: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRtOqIU89d4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRtOqIU89d4) (starts at 0.45)
Connee Boswell: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZk3fOzKpQ4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZk3fOzKpQ4)
Ella Fitzgerald: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJmqOfcqVg0&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJmqOfcqVg0&feature=related) or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8va5HjZl1Nw&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8va5HjZl1Nw&feature=related)(note imitations)
Anita O'Day: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AGvuIP9834 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AGvuIP9834)
June Christy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpCKGAg9T-o (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpCKGAg9T-o)
Sarah Vaughan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NA9mxA9B0OQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NA9mxA9B0OQ)
Billie Holiday: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAR4aEtaH4c (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAR4aEtaH4c) (singing Starts at 1.25)
Dorris Day: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF3KaHImHu4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF3KaHImHu4)
Lena Horne: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUWXLUtiJNo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUWXLUtiJNo) (perhaps some remember this film...)
Peggy Lee: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyyrV3W9tEk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyyrV3W9tEk)
Annette Hanshaw: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufBLTay2cjs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufBLTay2cjs) (starts around 0.45)
Ethel Waters (Lena called her "the mother of us all") - I love Ethel. She was a peformer and a comedienne at heart.
Connie Boswell -Beautifully clear voice.
Ella - Inimitable. What a talent. Talk about a clear voice. And, her scatting talent and ability to imitate were unmatched.
Anita O'Day - Beautiful tone
June Christy - I've never been a June C fan
Sarah Vaughan - Nobody could match the richness of her voice, and when she shows a little restraint from all the melisma she's very enjoyable.
Billie Holiday - Absolutely fabulous.
Peggy Lee - Another one of the great swing/jazz vocalists. Technically phenomenal.
Annette Hanshaw - She's new to me.
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 18, 2012, 05:31:20 AM
Well, that was a lot of fun. (Although, toward the end I was having thoughts of "Jeeves and the Song of Songs", when multiple singers performed "Sonny Boy" back-to-back with rather explosive results ;)).
I noticed that only Doris Day turned "bracelets" into "cuff links". And, that's one problem I had with this song selection. It was easy to appreciate the different styles of singing, but it was really hard for any of them to sell the song lyrically. Only Billie Holliday (and maybe Ethel Waters) came close, IMHO.
Anyway, my thoughts:
Ethel Waters (Lena called her "the mother of us all") - I love Ethel. She was a peformer and a comedienne at heart, and you can sense it in this performance. She and Ella are the only ones who joke-up the song, Ethel doing an anonymous male vocal style, Ella doing Louis Armstrong. Lots of fun.
Connie Boswell - Connie doesn't joke the song, but she rags it at the end with her patented rhythmic variations. That's the only thing that saves this from being a straight standards performance and turns it into swing. Beautifully clear voice, though.
Ella - Inimitable. What a talent. Talk about a clear voice. And, her scatting talent and ability to imitate were unmatched.
Anita O'Day - Beautiful tone as well, but that stupid male dueter just absolutely ruins this performance.
June Christy - I've never been a June C fan, but I think this might be my favorite performance from her.
Sarah Vaughan - Nobody could match the richness of her voice, and when she shows a little restraint from all the melisma, as she does here, she's very enjoyable.
Billie Holiday - Absolutely fabulous.
Doris Day - Nice, and a good typical pre-syrupy song from her, but definitely closer to a straight standard performance than most of the others here. That's not necessarily a bad thing, thnough, especially with a song like this.
Lena Horne - Loved parts of it, didn't love other parts as much. Classy, but I'm not sure this song calls for class.
Peggy Lee - Another one of the great swing/jazz vocalists. Technically phenomenal.
Annette Hanshaw - She's new to me. For a late 20's recording, it's pretty remarkable. I'm not sure how I feel about it in comparison with some of the others, but on its own merits I'm happy with it.
My favorites for this song: Billie Holiday, Ella (1957), Ethel Waters, Sarah Vaughan, Peggy Lee.
But, I found things to like about all of them.
I'm anxious to hear other peoples' reactions.
I would agree with many of your comments. Ella is so good at all the different styles - I loved this range in her and you see it here nicely. Billie is great, but I love the whole style they chose here as it just suits this song so well. THis is why I liked the Doris Day version less, though she sings it well, because the style is more modern (and though modern could work, I think the things I like about the song are lost a bit). The second half of Boswell is fantastic. But again, this style just oozes when she sings it (good inflections, phrasing, etc.). Anita chose a simple approach (but the guy annoys me too). Sarah Vaughan adds some nice swing to it. But for me Ethel Waters captures a slice of history that gives me shivers. So I would pick her and Ella as my favorites. Connee Boswell would probably be next. But as you wrote, they all do something attractive.
I love it when Ethel Waters gets some recognition. :)
I am definitely going to play the excellent game of comparing versions of 'I can't give you anything but love', but first I need to spill something that happened this morning - arrived in the post, in fact, after a long voyage, from a Canadian bookseller.
Helen Forrest (one of the most well-known band singers of the 40s, who sang with Artie Shaw, Harry James and Benny Goodman) published an autobiography in 1982. It's not exactly a rare book, but not exactly a common one either. Signed copies, however, are very rare, and generally out of my financial reach. But, costing about the same as an 'ordinary' copy, here are scans of my recent purchase:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/Alan_/helenforrest001a.jpg) (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/Alan_/helenforrest002a.jpg)
I know nothing about Ann and Hal (initially mistaken for Sam, it seems), nor do I know why Helen was 'sorry', but bearing in mind how hard it is to find affordable memorabilia from the period, this will find a special place on my bookshelves.
Afterthought: I think the 'sorry' may be for getting Hal's name wrong, and making a mess crossing out 'Sam'. Ah, Hal and Ann - I wonder where, when, and how you met her?
Quote from: Elgarian on July 18, 2012, 11:25:27 AM
I am definitely going to play the excellent game of comparing versions of 'I can't give you anything but love', but first I need to spill something that happened this morning - arrived in the post, in fact, after a long voyage, from a Canadian bookseller.
I know nothing about Ann and Hal (initially mistaken for Sam, it seems), nor do I know why Helen was 'sorry', but bearing in mind how hard it is to find affordable memorabilia from the period, this will find a special place on my bookshelves.
Very nice. Enjoy! ;D
Reminds me of my "close encounter" with Louise Brooks through a book.....but, that's another story.
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 18, 2012, 12:41:57 PM
Reminds me of my "close encounter" with Louise Brooks through a book.....but, that's another story.
Tell it! We want to know!
Quote from: Elgarian on July 18, 2012, 12:45:01 PM
Tell it! We want to know!
Well, I hope it won't disappoint you, and some of it is pure speculation...but, it's like a little mystery I credit myself with solving.
Back in the early 1990's, I got very interested in silent films. In addition to watching a couple hundred videos, I read every book I could find on the subject. My travels once took me to the Allegheny (North Side) library in Pittsburgh where I took out a biography of the silent film star Miriam Cooper called "Dark Lady of the Silents".
As I was reading it, I was more than puzzled by marginal references written in pencil by someone who seemed to know Ms Cooper personally. (The references were by no means flattering, let me tell you, and even a bit scurrilous.) I was stumped by this until a year or so later I came across a reference somewhere to the fact that when Barry Paris, a Pittsburgh film critic, was writing his ground-breaking biography on Louise Brooks, he was given access to Louise Brooks' own book collection and, (and here I am hazy on what I read) somehow this collection of books, in whole or in part, came into the possession of either the University of Pittsburgh, or the public library of the same.
At any rate, I then became convinced that the marginal references were Ms Brooks' own. I could be wrong of course, but...
I always wanted to go back to see if that book was still there and if they'd be willing to sell it to me (but, then, I'm not sure I'd want anyone to think I had written some of those things myself if they found it in my collection. ;) )
Quote from: mc ukrneal on July 18, 2012, 03:21:57 AM
Ethel Waters: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRtOqIU89d4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRtOqIU89d4) (starts at 0.45)
Connee Boswell: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZk3fOzKpQ4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZk3fOzKpQ4)
Ella Fitzgerald: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJmqOfcqVg0&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJmqOfcqVg0&feature=related) or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8va5HjZl1Nw&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8va5HjZl1Nw&feature=related)(note imitations)
Anita O'Day: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AGvuIP9834 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AGvuIP9834)
June Christy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpCKGAg9T-o (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpCKGAg9T-o)
Sarah Vaughan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NA9mxA9B0OQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NA9mxA9B0OQ)
Billie Holiday: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAR4aEtaH4c (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAR4aEtaH4c) (singing Starts at 1.25)
Dorris Day: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF3KaHImHu4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF3KaHImHu4)
Lena Horne: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUWXLUtiJNo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUWXLUtiJNo) (perhaps some remember this film...)
Peggy Lee: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyyrV3W9tEk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyyrV3W9tEk)
Annette Hanshaw: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufBLTay2cjs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufBLTay2cjs) (starts around 0.45)
Gosh, what a very up and down experience it was, listening to these! For me there's an absolutely stand-out winner: Sarah Vaughan. This made me want to get out all my Sarah Vaughan records and listen to them all, and
buy some more - which is weird, because I'd never have described her as one of my tip-top favourites. Wonderful performer, yes, but not a
personal favourite. This has made me wonder if I've made a bit of progress in the last year or so.
Billie Holiday's surely is, similarly, a phenomenal performance - but there's still a bit of a wall between Billie and me. I know she's amazing - heck I can
hear she's doing amazing things - but my personal response is discomfitingly lukewarm.
I didn't enjoy the performances by Ella and Ethel at all. Not because they were in any sense poor, but because there's nothing so dull as a joke you don't find funny, and so these were both a non-event for me.
Connee Boswell - quite nice (sounds like damning with faint praise). Doris Day - far too much sweetening to be my cup of tea. Anita - OMG the sacrilege committed upon this recording by that man! And so on for the others, really - no one else made me want to go and listen to their other records. So Sarah takes the bouquet, for me.
[I should mention Annette. I just smiled my way through her version because I'm in love with her. I don't think it's particularly good - idiosyncratic, and very obviously
her, but this alone wouldn't send me back to my Hanshaw collection.]
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 18, 2012, 01:24:24 PM
Well, I hope it won't disappoint you, and some of it is pure speculation...but, it's like a little mystery I credit myself with solving.
Back in the early 1990's, I got very interested in silent films. In addition to watching a couple hundred videos, I read every book I could find on the subject. My travels once took me to the Allegheny (North Side) library in Pittsburgh where I took out a biography of the silent film star Miriam Cooper called "Dark Lady of the Silents".
As I was reading it, I was more than puzzled by marginal references written in pencil by someone who seemed to know Ms Cooper personally. (The references were by no means flattering, let me tell you, and even a bit scurrilous.) I was stumped by this until a year or so later I came across a reference somewhere to the fact that when Barry Paris, a Pittsburgh film critic, was writing his ground-breaking biography on Louise Brooks, he was given access to Louise Brooks' own book collection and, (and here I am hazy on what I read) somehow this collection of books, in whole or in part, came into the possession of either the University of Pittsburgh, or the public library of the same.
At any rate, I then became convinced that the marginal references were Ms Brooks' own. I could be wrong of course, but...
I always wanted to go back to see if that book was still there and if they'd be willing to sell it to me (but, then, I'm not sure I'd want anyone to think I had written some of those things myself if they found it in my collection. ;) )
Marvellous tale! It reminds me of the idea that in the best ghost stories the ghost never appears. So in your story the presence of Louise Brooks has to be deduced, or imagined, with no actual certainty available. Heck, I almost don't want to know for sure whether Brooks's collection truly did go to Pittsburgh library!
Delightful. Thank you!
Quote from: Elgarian on July 18, 2012, 01:26:53 PM
Gosh, what a very up and down experience it was, listening to these! For me there's an absolutely stand-out winner: Sarah Vaughan. This made me want to get out all my Sarah Vaughan records and listen to them all, and buy some more - which is weird, because I'd never have described her as one of my tip-top favourites. Wonderful performer, yes, but not a personal favourite. This has made me wonder if I've made a bit of progress in the last year or so.
Billie Holiday's surely is, similarly, a phenomenal performance - but there's still a bit of a wall between Billie and me. I know she's amazing - heck I can hear she's doing amazing things - but my personal response is discomfitingly lukewarm.
I didn't enjoy the performances by Ella and Ethel at all. Not because they were in any sense poor, but because there's nothing so dull as a joke you don't find funny, and so these were both a non-event for me.
Connee Boswell - quite nice (sounds like damning with faint praise). Doris Day - far too much sweetening to be my cup of tea. Anita - OMG the sacrilege committed upon this recording by that man! And so on for the others, really - no one else made me want to go and listen to their other records. So Sarah takes the bouquet, for me.
[I should mention Annette. I just smiled my way through her version because I'm in love with her. I don't think it's particularly good - idiosyncratic, and very obviously her, but this alone wouldn't send me back to my Hanshaw collection.]
Thanks for sharing your takes.
I do have a predilection toward Ethel Waters. I wish we could hear all these singers on an even playing field (sound-technology-wise). It would still be fascinating to hear someone like Ethel Waters or Annette Hanshaw in modern sound.
Quote from: Elgarian on July 16, 2012, 12:09:03 PMI too lifted an eyebrow at the idea of Doris Day as a jazz singer, but a moment's googling took me to these 1952's radio transcriptions, which surprised me:
http://www.amazon.com/Doris-Day-Complete-Standard-Transcriptions/dp/B000R02FJW (http://www.amazon.com/Doris-Day-Complete-Standard-Transcriptions/dp/B000R02FJW)
Her singing always comes over as too sugary for my taste, but it seems that she does have some something like jazz in her back-catalogue.
DD originally rose to renown as a singer with Les Brown (see what I did there?), and at her height as a screen star was recording a couple of albums a year. She had a warm sweet tone and great lungs, and deceptively simple style. I believe she cited Ella as her primary influence, but she's more flirtatious than I ever heard from Ella.
Perhaps Perhaps Perhaps is hella sexy!
Ethel Waters is v cool too.
Never been a great Billie fan - her sound is too weird for me.
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 18, 2012, 01:54:23 PM
It's probably not fair of me to do assessments like this based on a single hearing of each piece, and nothing I said is written in stone. I do have a predilection toward Ethel Waters, but I agree with you that the male-voice imitation part of her song isn't a 100% winner. I wish we could hear all these singers on an even playing field (sound-technology-wise). I can set aside the old sound (as I'm sure you can, since you've probably spent hundreds of hours listening to all those old Elgar-conducts-Elgar recordings), but it would still be fascinating to hear someone like Ethel Waters or Annette Hanshaw in modern sound.
Oh gosh, yes to everything here. In my case, everything I say is written not in stone, but in plasticine - such is the rate of change of my responses to some of these singers. About the 'imitation' problem: Annette Hanshaw did quite a few of those, imitating Helen Kane, Ruth Etting etc, and while it was obviously 'the thing' back then, it seems pretty tiresome here and now.
You're right - the 'archaic' sound quality doesn't trouble me now. Actually, I'm far more troubled by some of the badly 'digitally restored' versions I've heard, where the cost of eliminating the shellac surface noise is to make the singer seem as if she's gargling under water. A bit of hiss is much easier to cope with than the sometimes grotesque artefacts that poor restoration produces.
Context also affects how we hear them. In the wonderful animated movie by Nina Paley called
Sita Sings the Blues, Hanshaw's recordings are used throughout, and (I find) in the context of using them to retell the
Ramayana there's no sense of them seeming 'old-fashioned' at all. Mind you, Paley uses (I think) the superb restorations by Sensation Records, which are among the very finest I've heard. They make most other Hanshaw recordings sound poor. This CD, for instance, is amazing in that respect:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51kx5zzrskL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Vol-6-1929-Annette-Hanshaw/dp/B00004SSY6/ref=sr_1_4?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1342671880&sr=1-4 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Vol-6-1929-Annette-Hanshaw/dp/B00004SSY6/ref=sr_1_4?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1342671880&sr=1-4)
And to illustrate my point about context (and the excellence of restoration), here's a clip from
Sita Sings the Blues (which, I appreciate, may well be a love-it-or-hate-it affair):
http://www.youtube.com/v/3kHU70c4tYY
Quote from: Elgarian on July 18, 2012, 08:37:25 PM
And to illustrate my point about context (and the excellence of restoration), here's a clip from Sita Sings the Blues (which, I appreciate, may well be a love-it-or-hate-it affair):
http://www.youtube.com/v/3kHU70c4tYY
So many posts since I went to bed last night, too many to comment about everything, so I'll start from the last. This is a strange video, but I like the singing. It captures the time period very well and I would never doubt the rough period when this was recorded. Isn't it strange that I am not bothered in the least by the old quality of the recording, but when I listen to classical, the same thing would drive me up the wall?
Back to Sarah Vaughan, I think she's pretty remarkable (even if it didn't seem that way in my comments). What I didn't like in the clip wasn't the singing (which I liked), but some of the stylistic choices they made (but I only make this comment for this one song/version, as I might like the next one). For example, I think she is pretty special in Misty (where I much prefer the slower speed, which is the way I often played it on the saxophone). Take a listen:
http://www.youtube.com/v/yJ-9IBZaydQ
Ella is also fantastic (here is one version she did):
http://www.youtube.com/v/rPOlakkBlj8
It's just so different in impact. Here are two versions I simply cannot choose between - they both draw something out of the music that I love. Ella has a certain simplicity and directness that is tremendous here. I had to listen to both to the end. Here is a song that I feel just doesn't work as well with a guy. Eckstine (well known for Misty) doesn't get to the heart of it all (nor does Sinatra, beautiful as the voice itself may be). Or try Lloyd Price, who distorts/changes the song entirely!!
And thank you both (Elgarian and Vesteralen) for sharing those stories. I love stuff like that!!
Quote from: mc ukrneal on July 19, 2012, 12:32:03 AM
Back to Sarah Vaughan, ... I think she is pretty special in Misty (where I much prefer the slower speed, which is the way I often played it on the saxophone). Take a listen:
http://www.youtube.com/v/yJ-9IBZaydQ
Ella is also fantastic (here is one version she did):
http://www.youtube.com/v/rPOlakkBlj8
It's just so different in impact. Here are two versions I simply cannot choose between - they both draw something out of the music that I love. Ella has a certain simplicity and directness that is tremendous here. I had to listen to both to the end
There were moments, listening to both of these supreme performances, when I got pretty misty myself. As you say - completely different in approach. I was particularly taken by the way in which Sarah managed to convey seriousness and joy in her own singing at the same time - as if there were two components to the performances: the expression of the song, and her delight in her own ability to do it so perfectly. But both these performances are beyond description.
About
Sita Sings the Blues: there's a big difference in impact between seeing the whole movie, and seeing mere snippets, like this, hacked out of the whole. There are four distinct styles of animation at work in the movie (only one seen here), pulling together various cultural modes in a way that completely hooked me despite my substantial reservations at the outset. I'll put a more comprehensive post together on
Sita at some point, I think.
Quote from: Elgarian on July 19, 2012, 02:50:43 AM
There were moments, listening to both of these supreme performances, when I got pretty misty myself. As you say - completely different in approach. I was particularly taken by the way in which Sarah managed to convey seriousness and joy in her own singing at the same time - as if there were two components to the performances: the expression of the song, and her delight in her own ability to do it so perfectly. But both these performances are beyond description.
About Sita Sings the Blues: there's a big difference in impact between seeing the whole movie, and seeing mere snippets, like this, hacked out of the whole. There are four distinct styles of animation at work in the movie (only one seen here), pulling together various cultural modes in a way that completely hooked me despite my substantial reservations at the outset. I'll put a more comprehensive post together on Sita at some point, I think.
I agree with you - she sings with a joy that is palpable (from within). I think the thing that blows me away about Sarah Vaughan here is that it is just so intimate. I almost feel like she is singing to me and only me. In any case, her vocal control is just amazing. I can't help watching again!
About Sita - I hadn't realized this was part of a movie. I watched it from GMG (when I went to youtube I saw all the other snippets). This is something I'm just not familiar with, so anything you have to add would be of interest.
Quote from: mc ukrneal on July 19, 2012, 03:02:49 AM
I agree with you - she sings with a joy that is palpable (from within). I think the thing that blows me away about Sarah Vaughan here is that it is just so intimate. I almost feel like she is singing to me and only me.
Yes you've expressed that perfectly. It feels like one-to-one even though I know it's not. As if she's saying: 'And by the way, I'll tell you this very personal thing about how I feel about singing this song...'
QuoteAbout Sita - I hadn't realized this was part of a movie. I watched it from GMG (when I went to youtube I saw all the other snippets). This is something I'm just not familiar with, so anything you have to add would be of interest.
I think under normal circumstances I'd be very dismissive of a 'cartoon' musical. Such a thing wouldn't interest me at all. So it's quite something to discover not just that it won me over, but that it's become one of my very favourite movies. Here's the story:
Sita Sings the BluesThe movie was created almost single-handedly by a graphic artist, Nina Paley. She'd had the grim experience of being rejected by her husband, and in the course of dealing with her misery she'd stumbled across two different art forms: the vulnerable (underlying the apparently cheerful) singing of Annette Hanshaw, and the ancient Indian legend of Rama and Sita recounted in the
Ramayana. She saw parallels between her own experience and both these art forms - each drawing on archetypal notions of injustice and loss - and she started to piece them together to make a composite art form, using four different styles of animation to bring a kind of creative visually dissonant energy to the whole. She tells the modern story of her own experience in one; she has three shadow narrators discussing the meaning of the Ramayana in another; the basic narrative of Rama and Sita is played out in another, reminiscent of Indian paintings; and finally Sita sings the songs of Annette Hanshaw in a fourth graphic style ( the one you've seen).
Having made the movie, over several years, she discovered that the copyright situation with respect to Hanshaw's recordings was far more complicated than she'd assumed. And rather than line the pockets of the lawyers, she decided to buy a licence ($50,000) which enabled her to give the movie away for free, and hope that by inviting donations and selling
Sita-related merchandise she'd recoup her losses. It turned out that she actually made more money by this method than she'd have made through more traditional methods.
The movie won lots of awards (and deserved to, in my opinion). She invites those interested not merely to download it or view it for free, but also to copy it and give copies away - on the grounds that copying is not stealing; it's an expression of love. Whether or not one agrees, the movie is available, and is (at least for me and many others) sheer delight. It haunts me. I've watched it several times over and love it more each time. And anything that enables me to listen to lots of Annette Hanshaw can't be bad.
Download link:
http://sitasingstheblues.com/wiki/index.php?title=SitaSites (http://sitasingstheblues.com/wiki/index.php?title=SitaSites)
Streaming link on Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8LvBnz7oRA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8LvBnz7oRA)
Merchandising site:
http://questioncopyright.com/index.html (http://questioncopyright.com/index.html)
Distribution ethos:
http://questioncopyright.org/sita_distribution (http://questioncopyright.org/sita_distribution)
I think I lean more toward Ella than you do. Part of it has to do with voice quality. I've always had a very difficult time with the richer, vibrato-filled voices (especially in opera). My bias is toward direct, clear singing - and Ella had that more that anyone...ever.
However, both Sarah and Ella were truly jazz singers, and not just pop singers singing songs some jazz musicians happened to also cover. I do think that's what sets both of them apart from most of the others of their generation who were sometimes labeled "jazz vocalists" (with a few obvious exceptions, like Anita O'Day and June Christy, of course).
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 19, 2012, 10:24:01 AM
However, both Sarah and Ella were truly jazz singers, and not just pop singers singing songs some jazz musicians happened to also cover. I do think that's what sets both of them apart from most of the others of their generation who were sometimes labeled "jazz vocalists" (with a few obvious exceptions, like Anita O'Day and June Christy, of course).
Warning! Warning! Can of Worms opening!No, not really - but this question of what a true jazz singer is ... can it be defined, actually? If the bottom line hangs on improvisation, then Bob Dylan is a jazz singer supreme, because no two performances are ever alike ... but we know immediately that he isn't. So mere improvisation isn't the magic factor. If it hangs on the question 'does (s)he swing?'then loads of people get included who never improvise at all. Alright then - does (s)he swing
and improvise? But what does 'swing' mean anyway?
If I abandon any attempt at definition and follow my gut feeling, I don't seem to have too much trouble. So Helen Ward is a jazz singer for sure (even though she was also a pop singer). So are Annette Hanshaw, Anita O'Day (though she'd describe herself as a 'song stylist'), and Sarah Vaughan, but there's no way I could justify how I know it.
Quote from: Elgarian on July 19, 2012, 01:32:21 PM
Warning! Warning! Can of Worms opening!
No, not really - but this question of what a true jazz singer is ... can it be defined, actually? If the bottom line hangs on improvisation, then Bob Dylan is a jazz singer supreme, because no two performances are ever alike ... but we know immediately that he isn't. So mere improvisation isn't the magic factor. If it hangs on the question 'does (s)he swing?'then loads of people get included who never improvise at all. Alright then - does (s)he swing and improvise? But what does 'swing' mean anyway?
If I abandon any attempt at definition and follow my gut feeling, I don't seem to have too much trouble. So Helen Ward is a jazz singer for sure (even though she was also a pop singer). So are Annette Hanshaw, Anita O'Day (though she'd describe herself as a 'song stylist'), and Sarah Vaughan, but there's no way I could justify how I know it.
Well, if we know what jazz is, don't we know what a jazz singer is?
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 19, 2012, 10:24:01 AM
Though several of these singers had their points of interest, particularly Harris and Morse, Annette Hanshaw really did stand out.
Do you know the incredibly useful book by Scott Yanow, called
The Jazz Singers? It's a kind of encyclopedia of over 500 jazz singers - enormously stimulating to dip into. Anyway, he sticks his neck out and compiles a list of those he thinks are the 30 greatest Jazz singers of all time. Just one man's view of course, but it's a very experienced man's view and makes for an interesting list. Much of it is predictable: Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughan, Billie Holiday, Anita O'Day, Dinah Washington, Peggy Lee, Ethel Waters, Mildred Bailey are all in there, naturally. But guess who else? Yep. Annette Hanshaw.
Quote from: MN Dave on July 19, 2012, 01:36:22 PM
Well, if we know what jazz is ...
[Elgarian sits quietly, waiting to be told....]
"If you have to ask, you'll never know." - Louis Armstrong
Not very helpful he. ???
Two of my favorite Boswellian things ever.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUB3ZR4F8vw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpZZig6ecEo
Quote from: Elgarian on July 19, 2012, 01:32:21 PM
Warning! Warning! Can of Worms opening!
No, not really - but this question of what a true jazz singer is ... can it be defined, actually? If the bottom line hangs on improvisation, then Bob Dylan is a jazz singer supreme, because no two performances are ever alike ... but we know immediately that he isn't. So mere improvisation isn't the magic factor. If it hangs on the question 'does (s)he swing?'then loads of people get included who never improvise at all. Alright then - does (s)he swing and improvise? But what does 'swing' mean anyway?
If I abandon any attempt at definition and follow my gut feeling, I don't seem to have too much trouble. So Helen Ward is a jazz singer for sure (even though she was also a pop singer). So are Annette Hanshaw, Anita O'Day (though she'd describe herself as a 'song stylist'), and Sarah Vaughan, but there's no way I could justify how I know it.
Yes, I admit my post was a bit controversial. I wan't trying to downplay standard singers as much as I was trying to show appreciation for the kinds of things people like Ella and Sarah Vaughan could do - improvise melodies, do sudden and unexpected key shifts, and in the case also of the Boswell Sisters, be rhythmically adventurous.
However, there are other singers, who, although known primarily as pop singers, could do a more than creditable job at jazz as well. Rosemary Clooney comes to mind - particularly her wonderful album with Duke Ellington. My special favorite on that one is "I'm Checkin' Out, Goombye". :)
Quote from: MN Dave on July 19, 2012, 01:55:12 PM
Two of my favorite Boswellian things ever.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUB3ZR4F8vw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpZZig6ecEo
Hadn't seen the second one before, but "Heebie Jeebies" is favorite of mine. :)
Quote from: MN Dave on July 19, 2012, 01:49:35 PM"If you have to ask, you'll never know." - Louis Armstrong
Not very helpful he. ???
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing.
Get hep.
Jazz singing advice:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/may/10/jazz-singing-advice
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 19, 2012, 02:15:13 PM
Yes, I admit my post was a bit controversial. I wan't trying to downplay standard singers as much as I was trying to show appreciation for the kinds of things people like Ella and Sarah Vaughan could do - improvise melodies, do sudden and unexpected key shifts, and in the case also of the Boswell Sisters, be rhythmically adventurous.
Just to clarify: I was just running with the ball you threw for a bit of fun, really. We all know broadly what we're talking about; but still, it's quite amusing that we'd all specify it in different ways. Far simpler to say 'listen to this* - that's jazz singing'. [*
this being a recording by Anita O'Day, Billie Holiday, Ella Fitzgerald, etc...) Maybe it's one of those things Wittgenstein maintained could only be shown, not said.
Reading through the guide to jazz singing Dave posted, I haven't done an exhaustive check, but a lot of that would fit Dylan pretty well. No one would call him a jazz singer though.
Enough. There's a bar of soap in the bath that needs catching.
When I first started exploring this stuff (not very long ago) I listened to a whole heap of Benny Goodman with Helen Ward singing, and assumed that everything I was hearing came from the thirties. I remember listening to 'Never say never again' over and over again, amazed by the way she sang just one word: 'I'll never say never again again, cause, here I am alone again...'. I couldn't figure how such a young and inexperienced singer could invest just one syllable with so much musical expression. It made the hair on my neck prickle. I thought of it almost as a definitive example of the best of swing, the joy of singing being caught just for a moment as it flies.
Well later of course I discovered that this particular track was recorded not in the thirties but in the fifties, when she returned from retirement to cut a few songs with BG. So it was, in fact, a much older Helen Ward who could invest that single word with so much. Out of all the musicians from that period, she's the one I'd most like to have a cup of tea and a chat with.
Here's that magic performance (she starts singing her all-too-brief bit at 1:40):
http://www.youtube.com/v/tsTjmgIKfrY
I like what Duke Ellington had to say on the matter of what is jazz, "It's all music."
You may remember that i posted several versions of I can't give you anything but love, baby a couple days ago. Well, I also wanted to include the original singer of that music, Adelaide Hall. But so far, no luck. Here is something else she sang. Most of what is on youtube seems to be poor quality, but this still gives you an idea of how she sang (another name worth investigating, and she has some interviews on youtube that are pretty interesting):
http://www.youtube.com/v/WujB4_gaGqw
Well, this thread has certainly blossomed, dearie, while I've been on the road.
Vesteralen has stolen my thunder re Keely Smith, who I first caught in the movie "Thunder Road" with Bob Mitchum. I have her LP with Billy May "Politely" which has a superb "Cocktails for Two". According to the invaluable Allmusicguide entry
http://www.allmusic.com/artist/keely-smith-mn0000495784
two more of her early albums are better as well as some very recent ones. Of these I have "I'm in love again" where she is accompanied by some top rank jazz musicians. Trained singers are encouraged to treat the vowel "I" as also in "fly" as a dipthong ah-ee because the ee sound is a closed tight sound whereas ah is open and can show off vocal quality better. "Ah hate to see??" "Ah loves ya Porgy??" It's a question of degree.
What surprised me about Ethel Walters version, recorded in 1932, of "I can't give....." on first hearing, is the fact that her second chorus is a Louis Armstrong take-off and I wondered how early in his career as a Jazz Singer other artists felt they could imitate/mock his individual vocal style.
Quote from: early grey on July 20, 2012, 09:23:36 AM
Of these I have "I'm in love again" where she is accompanied by some top rank jazz musicians. Trained singers are encouraged to treat the vowel "I" as also in "fly" as a dipthong ah-ee because the ee sound is a closed tight sound whereas ah is open and can show off vocal quality better. "Ah hate to see??" "Ah loves ya Porgy??" It's a question of degree.
By a curious semi-synchronicity, I happened to read this today in my
autographed copy of Helen Forrest's autobiography:
"I did a terrible job on it [the recording of 'I have eyes']. ... Without realising it, I had picked up a sort of southern accent. I sounded like I had just come from Alabama. 'Ah only have eyes ...' When I hear it, I get sick. Fortunately, I realised I had picked up an accent and dropped it fast.'
(just in case anyone notices, I'm probably going to be off-line for a week or so starting today. I wouldn't want anybody to think I've lost interest in this thread. I've enjoyed it a lot.)
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 21, 2012, 04:23:16 AM
(just in case anyone notices, I'm probably going to be off-line for a week or so starting today. I wouldn't want anybody to think I've lost interest in this thread. I've enjoyed it a lot.)
We're counting the minutes.
When I first stumbled across the music of this period, some of the most inspiring performances I encountered came from Dinah Washington, so I thought I'd plant a few here, for anyone who might be as susceptible as I was (and am).
First, Stormy Weather:
http://www.youtube.com/v/GrqY-JfEzbE
And Smoke gets in your eyes:
http://www.youtube.com/v/hY-bmBSK-u4
The recording I want most of all to post is her version of I Apologize, which is astounding, but I can't find one on you tube.
Quote from: Elgarian on July 24, 2012, 02:07:14 AM
When I first stumbled across the music of this period, some of the most inspiring performances I encountered came from Dinah Washington, so I thought I'd plant a few here, for anyone who might be as susceptible as I was (and am).
First, Stormy Weather:
http://www.youtube.com/v/GrqY-JfEzbE
And Smoke gets in your eyes:
http://www.youtube.com/v/hY-bmBSK-u4
The recording I want most of all to post is her version of I Apologize, which is astounding, but I can't find one on you tube.
Yes, wonderful stuff.
Helen Forrest
Thought I'd take a gentle ramble through some Helen Forrest CDs.
Broadly speaking I'm going to consider her career in two phases. Or four, depending on how you count.:
Phase 1
a. The period with Artie Shaw
b. The period with Benny Goodman
c. The period with Harry James
Phase 2
The period of 'going it alone'. Some folks might like to add the duets with Dick Haymes as a subgroup, but I won't consider those.
*******
My personal preference is emphatically for phase 1 (a, b, and c). The Artie Shaw period is well covered in these two CDs:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51mjmDm38FL._SL500_AA300_.jpg) (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51WCQdJvqFL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
They're available here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sweeter-as-Years-Helen-Forrest/dp/B00000DMHO/ref=sr_1_5?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-5 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sweeter-as-Years-Helen-Forrest/dp/B00000DMHO/ref=sr_1_5?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-5)
and here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Vol-Helen-Forrest-Artie-Orchestra/dp/B000031WE5/ref=sr_1_8?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-8 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Vol-Helen-Forrest-Artie-Orchestra/dp/B000031WE5/ref=sr_1_8?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-8)
Although she always thought of herself primarily as a singer of slow ballads, she swings wonderfully on these two CDs regardless of the tempo, and with Artie Shaw providing the clarinet parts everything has a musical lilt. One of the great highlights for me is 'All the things you are' on Sweet and Simple, introduced by a lovely bit of clarinet, and sung with exquisitely swinging delicacy by Helen. The blurb says that these two CDs together include all her recorded studio work with Shaw.
Of the Benny Goodman period I have only this CD:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/61UsDnVED9L._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
Available here:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Original-Recordings-1940s-Goodman-Forrest/dp/B000R9U3CO/ref=sr_1_16?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343246435&sr=1-16 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Original-Recordings-1940s-Goodman-Forrest/dp/B000R9U3CO/ref=sr_1_16?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343246435&sr=1-16)
She hated her time with BG (didn't like him at all) but they made some superb music together. I'm pretty sure this CD is only a selection - there seems to have been a box set of HF and BG, now out of print.
With Harry James we get to her really Big Hit period, but in terms of recordings it was truncated by a musicians' strike that kept her out of the studio for the later part of her time with James. Tragic! She was on fire at this time, no doubt partly because she was in love with James. There is a CD containing all their recordings together but I've yet to find a cheap copy. So for now all I have is a (rather wonderful) compilation of her work with all three big bands:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51A29xeDUwL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Helen-Forrest-Voice-Big-Bands/dp/B0000017ED/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343247190&sr=1-1 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Helen-Forrest-Voice-Big-Bands/dp/B0000017ED/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343247190&sr=1-1)
The tracks with James are outstanding. Among them is her million-selling and brilliantly swinging 'I've heard that song before' [see below] which alone is enough to explain how at the time she was polling as top of the female jazz/pop singers. James gave her more singing time, instead of confining her just to one chorus, and he must have been thrilled by the results. I could safely say that if you just wanted a flavour of Helen Forrest, this CD would be an outstanding choice.
'I've heard that song before'
http://www.youtube.com/v/MA2hk_CIZeo
Phase 2 is another story. I recently bought this:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51Sw-mogTSL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Help-Yourself-Heart-Helen-Forrest/dp/B0000CNXNM/ref=sr_1_6?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-6 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Help-Yourself-Heart-Helen-Forrest/dp/B0000CNXNM/ref=sr_1_6?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1343245494&sr=1-6)
In due course James married Betty Grable, discarding Helen, and she left the band, striking out on her own. This CD offers some of the results, recorded in the later forties. My initial response is one of disappointment. Without the ingenuity of a Shaw, Goodman, or James behind her, she seemed to slip into a kind of smooth lifelessness. I listen and ache for the kind of rapport she had with the great bands. This is really just Helen with a pretty uninspired backing, and it all seems a bit dull. I'm not surprised that she never again attained the peak of popularity she'd enjoyed until then. This is still new to me, however, and I might hear more in it on further listening.
There's more, of course. My collection of her stuff isn't anything like complete. But the two Artie Shaw CDs, the Goodman CD, and the compilation of all three periods show her at her very best; and when she's at her best, I get goosebumps.
Helen Forrest footnote
I should mention a few more CDs I have. First there are the radio transcriptions from 1949/50 with Carmen Dragon and his orchestra, recorded specifically for broadcast. There are 3 CDs available of these, but be warned. The two Viper's Nest CDs are entirely duplicated on a single Swing Factory release. This is the Swing Factory disc:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51ndhNjpQZL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
Obviously better value (but perhaps harder to find, and offers much less information) than the two alternatives (Embraceable you and I wanna be loved) that cover the same ground:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41TM6CY3FTL._SL500_AA300_.jpg) (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/21V8DTFWT4L._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
Are they worth having? Well, the tracks are all very short, mostly about 2 minutes; and they are definitely the no-longer-big-band Helen (see previous post). Smooth, accomplished, but ultimately (for me) rather lifeless.
Another album that might come your way is one that she made in 1983 at about the time her autobiography was published. It's been issued on CD by Viper's Nest as Helen Forrest Studio Sessions (hard to find) but has also been issued paired up with a Chris Connor album:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31zTGDQw7zL.Image._.jpg)
It's a valiant attempt from an ageing Helen, and she clearly hadn't forgotten how to swing in 1983, but her voice shows obvious signs of strain - she has to glide into all the big notes, and I find listening to more than a couple of songs can become uncomfortable.
This should probably be on a separate thread, but I was wondering if anyone has developed an appreciation for female jazz vocalists since the 1960's?
Are there any current artists you would recommend?
Quote from: Vesteralen on July 31, 2012, 10:37:09 AM
This should probably be on a separate thread, but I was wondering if anyone has developed an appreciation for female jazz vocalists since the 1960's?
Are there any current artists you would recommend?
May I suggest (as you yourself suggested) a new thread for that? I could of course re-title the thread more broadly, as 'female jazz vocalists', but I wanted to create something more focused than that.
Having said that, I'll now proceed to discuss two DVDs of performances from 1963 and 1970!! However, they're of Anita O'Day, who was very much a child of the Swing period, even though she had an extended singing career. Here they are:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51tRw5nrnYL._SL500_AA300_.jpg) (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41m8NO2-zaL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
The Tokyo show from 1963 isn't great quality. The picture is a bit fuzzy, and the sound not of the best - acceptable, certainly, but not hifi. But the performances, oh my goodness. Two minutes in, and I simply stop noticing the technical limitations. There's a marvellous performance of 'Bewitched, bothered & bewildered' that I posted earlier (#20) - that youtube video will also give you an impression of the visual quality.
The other DVD in the Jazz icons series is far superior in quality, both visually and in sound, and we get to see two shows: one from Sweden in 1963, and the other with a 7-year older older Anita, from a Norwegian show of 1970. The performances include the exquisite version of 'Nightingale sang ...' posted in #20.
Both DVDs make for compelling viewing as well as listening. When she sings, she sings with
all of her, not just her voice: hands, body, face - everything is employed to fascinating effect. Also there are some fine examples of how she 'conducts' the other musicians, with a wave of the microphone, with a hand gesture, with a look. There's a story about how one musician complained that he didn't need her to tell him how to play. 'I'm not telling you how to play,' said Anita, 'I'm telling you
when to play.' Watching her relationship with the musicians is no less fascinating than watching her sing.
Who was the female vocalist who sang "I Left My Sugar In Salt Lake City" in JAM SESSION, 1944, Jan Garber's orchestra? First round of looking online didn't reveal anything. I couldn't catch the name, it was something like Helen Inglis or Helen English. Thanks.
Quote from: johnny on September 02, 2013, 10:20:17 AM
Who was the female vocalist who sang "I Left My Sugar In Salt Lake City" in JAM SESSION, 1944, Jan Garber's orchestra? First round of looking online didn't reveal anything. I couldn't catch the name, it was something like Helen Inglis or Helen English. Thanks.
I didn't know, but a little research came up with Helen Englert: http://archive.org/details/JanGarberOrchV-helenEnglert-ILostMySugarInSaltLakeCity1944 (http://archive.org/details/JanGarberOrchV-helenEnglert-ILostMySugarInSaltLakeCity1944)
Bessie Smith
Billie Holiday
Mahalia Jackson
Dinah Washington
Take out 'female,' 'jazz' and all the decades from the subject line and my answer would be unchanged (well, assuming just 'vocalists' implies favourites).
Helen Merrill????????
BOY, I'm shocked that I've not been a subscriber to this thread! Embarrassed - ::)
I've owned many of these gals on CDs for years - now Lee Wiley is a favorite and I love her later recordings (already addressed in this thread) - I knew about Annette Hanshaw but was surprised that I did not have any of her recordings; SO, just ordered the one below & am listening to it now - enjoying (don't like her 'Betty Boop' singing, though) it now and would like to know if her 'comeback' recordings (if they exist?) feature her wonderful voice better (I find that Lee Wiley was more enjoyable later in her life - likely just a change in style w/ these ladies from the 20-30s into the later decades) - Dave :)
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51kx5zzrskL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
Nothing much here since September, however Eydie Gormé died in August and although not a jazz singer as such she certainly knows how to put over a song. I recommend "Guess who I saw today" on you-tube for a taste of her quieter style and for her brassier side you can hear her with a big band conducted by Don Costa and recorded in the late 1950s here
http://www.cliveheathmusic.co.uk/vinyl2.php
where she is third on the list. For all her powerful delivery she has a tinge of pathos in her styling that can trap the unwary and you can find yourself besotted!!
R.I.P. Eydie Gormé